You can sift through the racc list archive
https://lists.eyrie.org/pipermail/racc/
or you can try google groups racc for the whole issue of LNH vII #50.

And this is part one of the Big Mega Multi-Writer Issue of LNH vII #50.
There were Eight LNH Writers involved in the writing of this and they
are as follow: Jeanne Morningstar, Rob Rogers, Scott Eiler,
Dave Van Domelen, Arthur Spitzer (me), Drew Nilium, Martin Phipps, and
Saxon Brenton.

Way back in May of 2012, Jeanne Morningstar had just won High Concept
Challenge #29 and decided to make LNH v2 #50 the new challenge -- with
a due date a month from then. Here's that post from May 16th, 2012:

From: Adrian J. McClure mrfantastic7 at gmail.com
Date: Wed May 16 21:59:41 PDT 2012

In honor of the LNH's 20th anniversary, and the fact that with all the
other things we're doing on and off RACC we'd never get it done any
other way, I declare LNH v2 #50 the next High-Concept Challenge. The
due date is a month from now, unless it somehow gets finished earlier.

I've written about the basic ideas I have in mind for this on the
author's group; if you haven't joined yet just send me an email.
Martin and Scott have already written scenes but it's still in the
opening stages so a lot is still up in the air.

AJM (ready for the big anniversary celebration--I'll probably have one
heck of a hangover)

It took a bit longer than that. Two years in fact (it would finally get
posted on Nov 2nd, 2014). Now quite a bit of the writing was done in that
first month or so, but there were various writer disputes and apathy and
other real life concerns that caused it to be delayed and delayed.

I remember there was talk back in RACCCon 2012 among some of the
people there about possibly finishing the issue. I was the one that
vetoed that idea -- so you can probably blame me for it not being
finished back in 2012. And part of the reason I didn't really want to
tackle it back then was due to the big writer flame war that had just
happened around that time.

LNH vII #50 is (perhaps) the last story of the Martin Phipps era of the
LNH. Martin was kind of the John Byrne of the LNH. As John Byrne was
an important force in history of superhero comics -- Marin was an
important force in the LNH Imprint. He certainly helped define the LNH
style and influenced a bunch of other LNH writers like Ken Schmidt and
Jeff McCoskey who in turn influenced others (like myself). But like
John Byrne, he also had a habit of getting into all kinds of feuds with
the various other LNH writers. Look at any big flamewar from RACC and
alt.comics.lnh's past -- and most likely you'll see Martin as a big player
with in them.

Back in 2011 around the time people were making the LNH20 Imprint,
Martin had written some distortion of the truth that caused me to
blow up at him, which caused a big flamewar with the end result being
me not really wanting to deal with Martin anymore and me boycotting
writing his characters (and me essentially giving him the silent treatment
for the most part).

This made writing for LNH v2 #50 a kind of awkward experience for me since
Martin was a heavy part of this (as well as his character, Master Blaster)
so that was one of the reasons why I didn't really want to deal with
finishing this issue back at RACCCon 2012. And during the writing of #50,
there was this dispute between Martin and Drew involving Kid Enthusiastic's
characterization (Kid E being a Drew character -- so probably the person
that understands the character the most -- you'd think -- if you were some
person other than Martin). So, while everyone is still working on #50 --
Martin decides to write issue #51 and posts it. #51 seems to have been
written just to troll Drew -- and of course there's another big flame war
and Martin pretty much burned every last bridge he had with the LNH and he
quit RACC for good (granted he did wind up making a sock puppet account
(April White -- was that the name?) so he could write some stuff for the
LNHY Imprint.)

And all that sort of killed whatever momentum there was for finishing #50.
But Drew eventually (maybe with some help from Jean -- can't quite remember)
did finish the whole thing and edit it into something coherent and posted it
in 2014.

There was some dated stuff that was rewritten (I remember making a
reference to Kony 2012 meme). So, with all that said -- here is the first
part.

We begin in the LNH Cafeteria -- all of the LNH'rs are abuzz about the 20th
Anniversary party that Catalyst Lass is planning. And on the menu is
Taco Salad Cheesecake (and perhaps even worse things than that).

And now...

_
| | Classic
| | =
| | ____ ____ _ ____ ___
| |__ | [] | | [] | | | | [] | | _ \

|____| \__] \__ | |_| \__/ |_|\_\
||
|_| OF NET.HEROES

ADVENTURES #221

=====================
LNH vII #50 Part One
=====================

From: Andrew Perron pwerdna at gmail.com
Date: Sun Nov 2 16:20:29 PST 2014

LEGION OF NET.HEROES

:NN:
:NNNN:
:NNNNNN:
:NNNNNNNN:
:LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
:LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
:LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
:LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
:LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNNhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh:
:LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh:
:LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh:
:LLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
:LLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
:LLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
:NNNNNNN:
:NNNNN:
:NNN:
:N:

|--------------*-------------------*------------------*--------------|
|LNHLNHLNHLNHLN| VOLUME TWO |LNHLNHLNHLNHLN|
|HLNHLNHLNHLNHL| ISSUE FIFTY |HLNHLNHLNHLNHL|
|NHLNHLNHLNHLNH| "The Challenge From Before" |NHLNHLNHLNHLNH|
|LNHLNHLNHLNHLN| written by and copyright 2012-2014 |LNHLNHLNHLNHLN|
|HLNHLNHLNHLNHL| SAXON BRENTON * SCOTT EILER |HLNHLNHLNHLNHL|
|NHLNHLNHLNHLNH| ADRIAN J. MCCLURE * ANDREW PERRON |NHLNHLNHLNHLNH|
|LNHLNHLNHLNHLN| MARTIN PHIPPS * ARTHUR SPITZER |LNHLNHLNHLNHLN|
|HLNHLNHLNHLNHL| ROB ROGERS * DAVE VAN DOMELEN |HLNHLNHLNHLNHL|
|--------------*-------------------*------------------*--------------|

[ The cover is an homage to Justice League of America #100, showing a
number of present-day LNHers (Seyfert, Anal-Retentive Archive Kid II,
Irony Man II, Cynical Lass, You're-Not-Hitting-Me-Hard-Enough Lad,
Master Blaster, Masterplan Lad and Poignant Death Lass) standing before
a monument, with the ghostly images of founding LNHers (Comics-Snob Boy,
Mainstream Man, Catalyst Lass, Irony Man I, Lurking Girl and Mood Arrow)
looming above it. On the monument is written, "HERE LIES THE UNKNOWN
LNHER." Below is a plaque reading, "The greatest gathering of super-
stars ever recorded! The 20th anniversary adventure of the LEGION OF
NET.HEROES... in search of THE LNH'S TRUE ORIGIN!" ]

PREVIOUSLY:

* In LNH THE EARLY YEARS #3: Irony Man (Toony Stork) related the origin
of the LNH. The LNH was founded many years ago when Rick Smith of the
Toon Brigade summoned Irony Man, Lurking Girl, Loquacious Lad, Kid
Yesterdaze, and Marvel Zombie Lad to defeat an impending threat. It
turned out there wasn't any; it was simply a practical joke. But the
five heroes decided to get together to found the Legion of Net.Heroes
should a real threat emerge. Or at least that's the official story...

* In BEIGE MIDNIGHT and LNH VOLUME 2: Irony Man betrayed the LNH in a
devil's bargain to save the world. Disgraced, he threw himself into a
final battle - but ended up praised for a save that wasn't his. He has
retired and appointed a successor, the mysterious Irony Man II...

* In STAY DEAD!, DON'T STAY DEAD!, and NOT DEAD!: On their very first
mission for the Legion of Net.Heroes, against a threat known as Beige
Midnight, Horrible Name Lad and Poignant Death Lass died. Ensign
Bodybag welcomed them to the Afterlife. They saw Don't Stay Dead Man
come for one of their teammates and give him True Death, but when the
higher powers decided that they were more interesting than he was,
they returned to the Looniverse -- just in time for Taco Salad
Cheesecake...

On 11/7/21 3:23 PM, Arthur Spitzer wrote:

>
> Way back in May of 2012, Jeanne Morningstar had just won High Concept
> Challenge #29 and decided to make LNH v2 #50 the new challenge -- with
> a due date a month from then. Here's that post from May 16th, 2012:
>

That's almost ten years ago now. I'm turning to dust...

> And all that sort of killed whatever momentum there was for finishing #50.
> But Drew eventually (maybe with some help from Jean -- can't quite remember)
> did finish the whole thing and edit it into something coherent and posted it
> in 2014.

I bear some of the blame for dragging it out--Drew pushed through when
no one else wanted (they're good at that) and wrote out the climax, and
I wanted to write some epilogue scenes which would help sort out various
plot/character threads I wanted to play with. My ability to write tends
to run very hot and cold (though that's a pretty common struggle here),
so I delayed on that a long time. Still, I'm happy in the end with how
it all turned out.

It was a frustrating experience in a lot of ways, but there were
definitely things I enjoyed. The most fun part was working with Rob
Rogers, who besides being a really funny writer was as generous and
thoughtful a collaborator as that other guy wasn't. He did a remarkable
job of "yes-anding" everyone's ideas. I had the idea there'd be one
central character for every active writer, and introduced a new
character, Painful Pun Person, as mine, but then decided to go with
bringing Masterplan Lad as well--but Rob threw her in anyway and made
her a joy to read about. Drew added more layers to the character later,
and that really turned out to be an example of the LNH's creative
collaboration at its best. Rob also helped keep the plot on track, as
seen at the end of this post, bringing back my whole "secret origin"
conceit after it had fallen off the radar. It was really remarkable how
he pulled together all those ideas in a way that was not only coherent
but also funny.

I'll also say that the experience of writing this issue weirdly helped
me grow a lot as a person. The original #51 was blatantly homophobic,
and being angry at that knocked over the first domino that got me
thinking about whether I was queer, and that led to everything I'd been
and done since. As much as there've been a lot of frustrations along the
way, I'm really proud of this community and how much everyone in it has
grown.

Jeanne Morningstar

On 11/7/21 4:23 PM, Arthur Spitzer wrote:
<snip>
> And this is part one of the Big Mega Multi-Writer Issue of LNH vII #50.

WOOOOO! I've probably read thru this half a dozen times or more since I posted
it. Everyone put so much good energy into it.

> It took a bit longer than that. Two years in fact (it would finally get
> posted on Nov 2nd, 2014).

Heck yeah @.@v

> I remember there was talk back in RACCCon 2012 among some of the
> people there about possibly finishing the issue. I was the one that
> vetoed that idea -- so you can probably blame me for it not being
> finished back in 2012. And part of the reason I didn't really want to
> tackle it back then was due to the big writer flame war that had just
> happened around that time.

Completely understandable, and TBH, The Cat With Glasses was very much worth it. :>

> LNH vII #50 is (perhaps) the last story of the Martin Phipps era of the
> LNH.

Yeah. @.@

> Martin was kind of the John Byrne of the LNH. As John Byrne was
> an important force in history of superhero comics -- Marin was an
> important force in the LNH Imprint. He certainly helped define the LNH
> style and influenced a bunch of other LNH writers like Ken Schmidt and
> Jeff McCoskey who in turn influenced others (like myself). But like
> John Byrne, he also had a habit of getting into all kinds of feuds with
> the various other LNH writers. Look at any big flamewar from RACC and
> alt.comics.lnh's past -- and most likely you'll see Martin as a big player
> with in them.

That's a good comparison, yeah.

> Back in 2011 around the time people were making the LNH20 Imprint,
> Martin had written some distortion of the truth that caused me to
> blow up at him, which caused a big flamewar with the end result being
> me not really wanting to deal with Martin anymore and me boycotting
> writing his characters (and me essentially giving him the silent treatment
> for the most part).

Oh god, I remember that bullshit. LNH20 barely got off the ground because of him.

> This made writing for LNH v2 #50 a kind of awkward experience for me since
> Martin was a heavy part of this (as well as his character, Master Blaster)
> so that was one of the reasons why I didn't really want to deal with
> finishing this issue back at RACCCon 2012.

Incredibly understandable. I feel like you, me, and Jeanne all felt individually
responsible for the post-Martingeddon slump, but really, it's nobody's fault but
his. (And, you know, all the other forces that keep us from writing, internal
and external.)

> And during the writing of #50,
> there was this dispute between Martin and Drew involving Kid Enthusiastic's
> characterization (Kid E being a Drew character -- so probably the person
> that understands the character the most -- you'd think -- if you were some
> person other than Martin).

You'd think, right? And it was really a small thing, and it seemed like we had
resolved it amicably and then--

> So, while everyone is still working on #50 --
> Martin decides to write issue #51 and posts it.

YEP.

> #51 seems to have been
> written just to troll Drew --

That was part of it, and it was also justifying horrifying takes on queer
characters *and* Master Blaster tormenting WikiBoy[*] and also started with a
summary of #50 that ended with "There. Now you don't have to read it." or
something. @@

[*]Also weirdly John Byrne-esque, actually, comparable to his Fantastic Four run
saying that Galactus's existence is cosmically necessary And That Is That. I'm
not sure if I'm Chris Claremont in that situation or Jeanne is. X3

> and of course there's another big flame war
> and Martin pretty much burned every last bridge he had with the LNH and he
> quit RACC for good (granted he did wind up making a sock puppet account
> (April White -- was that the name?) so he could write some stuff for the
> LNHY Imprint.)

That was the name, yeah. He wrote a few more of his extremely flat movie
parodies, which everyone ignored, and then he disappeared for good.

> And all that sort of killed whatever momentum there was for finishing #50.
> But Drew eventually (maybe with some help from Jean -- can't quite remember)
> did finish the whole thing and edit it into something coherent and posted it
> in 2014.

:> Jeanne definitely helped, including just keeping my writing energy up in
general. X3

> There was some dated stuff that was rewritten (I remember making a
> reference to Kony 2012 meme).

Yep yep. X3 God 2012 was weird. Tho not as weird, I admit, as 2021.

> We begin in the LNH Cafeteria -- all of the LNH'rs are abuzz about the 20th
> Anniversary party that Catalyst Lass is planning. And on the menu is
> Taco Salad Cheesecake (and perhaps even worse things than that).

:D :D :D

> :NN:
> :NNNN:
> :NNNNNN:
> :NNNNNNNN:
> :LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
> :LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
> :LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
> :LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
> :LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNNhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh:
> :LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh:
> :LLLLLLL: :NNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh:
> :LLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
> :LLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
> :LLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLNNNNNNNN: :NNNNNNNNN: :hhhhhhh:
> :NNNNNNN:
> :NNNNN:
> :NNN:
> :N:

Who was it that put this logo together originally? It's great. <3

> |--------------*-------------------*------------------*--------------|
> |LNHLNHLNHLNHLN| VOLUME TWO |LNHLNHLNHLNHLN|
> |HLNHLNHLNHLNHL| ISSUE FIFTY |HLNHLNHLNHLNHL|
> |NHLNHLNHLNHLNH| "The Challenge From Before" |NHLNHLNHLNHLNH|
> |LNHLNHLNHLNHLN| written by and copyright 2012-2014 |LNHLNHLNHLNHLN|
> |HLNHLNHLNHLNHL| SAXON BRENTON * SCOTT EILER |HLNHLNHLNHLNHL|
> |NHLNHLNHLNHLNH| ADRIAN J. MCCLURE * ANDREW PERRON |NHLNHLNHLNHLNH|
> |LNHLNHLNHLNHLN| MARTIN PHIPPS * ARTHUR SPITZER |LNHLNHLNHLNHLN|
> |HLNHLNHLNHLNHL| ROB ROGERS * DAVE VAN DOMELEN |HLNHLNHLNHLNHL|
> |--------------*-------------------*------------------*--------------|

I had fun putting together all this front/back matter. X3

> * In LNH THE EARLY YEARS #3: Irony Man (Toony Stork) related the origin
> of the LNH. The LNH was founded many years ago when Rick Smith of the
> Toon Brigade summoned Irony Man, Lurking Girl, Loquacious Lad, Kid
> Yesterdaze, and Marvel Zombie Lad to defeat an impending threat. It
> turned out there wasn't any; it was simply a practical joke. But the
> five heroes decided to get together to found the Legion of Net.Heroes
> should a real threat emerge. Or at least that's the official story...

gaaaaad Martin's origins. Can't wait for Retcon Year.

> * In BEIGE MIDNIGHT and LNH VOLUME 2: Irony Man betrayed the LNH in a
> devil's bargain to save the world. Disgraced, he threw himself into a
> final battle - but ended up praised for a save that wasn't his. He has
> retired and appointed a successor, the mysterious Irony Man II...

:3 This turned out so fun.

> * In STAY DEAD!, DON'T STAY DEAD!, and NOT DEAD!: On their very first
> mission for the Legion of Net.Heroes, against a threat known as Beige
> Midnight, Horrible Name Lad and Poignant Death Lass died. Ensign
> Bodybag welcomed them to the Afterlife. They saw Don't Stay Dead Man
> come for one of their teammates and give him True Death, but when the
> higher powers decided that they were more interesting than he was,
> they returned to the Looniverse -- just in time for Taco Salad
> Cheesecake...

I love that this-all tied in so nicely. :D

> Ubiquitous Boy Lad Jr. [The sidekick of Ubiquitous Boy's sidekick
> Ubiquitous Lad (or is it the other way around?) -- Footnote Girl]

Ubiquitous Boy and Ubiquitous Lad are both Rob's characters, but I'm not sure if
they've ever actually shown up in a story (ironically). X3

> My god! Look at what's happening to the world!
> People are suffering! Tyrants are brutalizing their citizens! Children
> being forced into armies in Africa!
I remember specifically trying to keep the spirit of the Kony reference.

> "Oh," said WikiBoy, with a slightly shameful look on his face.
> "That's, uh, that's my beaver tail."
>
> "Why in the world do you have a beaver tail?"
>
> "Oh, well, Master Blaster said I had one, so... now I have one."

On 11/7/21 5:40 PM, Jeanne Morningstar wrote:
> On 11/7/21 3:23 PM, Arthur Spitzer wrote:
<snip>
>> And all that sort of killed whatever momentum there was for finishing #50.
>> But Drew eventually (maybe with some help from Jean -- can't quite remember)
>> did finish the whole thing and edit it into something coherent and posted it
>> in 2014.
>
> I bear some of the blame for dragging it out--

Like I said, we all feel responsible. X3

> Drew pushed through when no one
> else wanted (they're good at that)

Aw thank you. :>

> The most fun part was working with Rob Rogers, who besides
> being a really funny writer was as generous and thoughtful a collaborator as
> that other guy wasn't. He did a remarkable job of "yes-anding" everyone's ideas.

Yes agreed. <3

> Rob also helped keep the plot on track, as seen at the end of this post,
> bringing back my whole "secret origin" conceit after it had fallen off the
> radar. It was really remarkable how he pulled together all those ideas in a way
> that was not only coherent but also funny.

Right???

> The original #51 was blatantly homophobic, and being angry at
> that knocked over the first domino that got me thinking about whether I was
> queer, and that led to everything I'd been and done since. As much as there've
> been a lot of frustrations along the way, I'm really proud of this community and
> how much everyone in it has grown.

:> Hell yeah. <3 <3 <3

Drew "the good times!!" Nilium

On 11/8/21 11:25 PM, Drew Nilium wrote:

> WOOOOO! I've probably read thru this half a dozen times or more since I
> posted it. Everyone put so much good energy into it.

I've been rereading 52, and this issue reminds me a lot of that in terms
of being the work of a group of creators with very distinct,
well-defined voices but also feeling like a cohesive whole. Thankfully,
we don't have a superhero murdering an entire country in this one.

>
> Completely understandable, and TBH, The Cat With Glasses was very much
> worth it. :>

It's wild how much influence that story had in the long term, with the
Brad Pitt thing being a central part of WikiLull.

>
> Incredibly understandable. I feel like you, me, and Jeanne all felt
> individually responsible for the post-Martingeddon slump, but really,
> it's nobody's fault but his. (And, you know, all the other forces that
> keep us from writing, internal and external.)

I feel like it took us a really long time to gain a sense of closure
after All That, which was part of why it was hard for me to write for
LNH sometime. (And yeah, the impact it had on LNH20, something I put a
lot of myself into, was a big part of it.) Both personally and in terms
of our collective narrative movement--the whole last decade was kind of
about trying to resolve what the LNH was after Martin's
characters--especially Master Blaster, who'd kind of been a central part
of the LNH in the 2000s--were gone. I don't think I fully resolved that
for myself until LNH v3 #3. We got some amazing writing and ideas out of
working through that, though.

> That was part of it, and it was also justifying horrifying takes on
> queer characters *and* Master Blaster tormenting WikiBoy[*] and also
> started with a summary of #50 that ended with "There. Now you don't have
> to read it." or something. @@

I no longer even remember how queer characters ended up being a part of
that argument, and that's probably for the best.

>
> [*]Also weirdly John Byrne-esque, actually, comparable to his Fantastic
> Four run saying that Galactus's existence is cosmically necessary And
> That Is That. I'm not sure if I'm Chris Claremont in that situation or
> Jeanne is. X3

I feel like I'm usually Chris Claremont in most cases, both in the "long
running subplot" sense and the "making everything gay" sense.

I guess Drew is Louise Simonson, if only because Power Pack is an
extremely Drew-like concept.

> :> Jeanne definitely helped, including just keeping my writing energy up
> in general. X3
<3

> gaaaaad Martin's origins. Can't wait for Retcon Year.

*looks around nervously*

>
>>       "Do you see what's happening here?" said
>> You're-Not-Hitting-Me-Hard-
>> Enough Lad, turning to his friends. "How can the LNH fight the evil and
>> injustices in the world -- when it takes a blind eye to the evil and
>> injustice within its own halls?
>
> This is a theme I've been coming back to. <3 It's extremely relevant
> nowadays. @-@

This issue was really the one that cemented a lot of the core ideas and
themes of the post-Beige era of LNH, and that's one of the big ones.

> This climax is Martin's and it's also pretty funny. X3
>
>>       "It's an alien! A Dorf! A Dorfian shapeshifter!" said Ubiquitous
>> Boy
>> Lad Jr., voice filled with horror and relief.
>
> DUN DUN DUNNNNN!

It's interestng how the Dorfs basically take on the properties of
diffrent kind of aliens in pop culture--they started out as a Borg riff,
became the Klingons and this issue borrows heavily from Secret Invasion
(but it works much better, just as Beige Midnight's version of President
Luthor, the Registration Act and Project Everyman did).

>
>>       Right on cue, as if from thin air, Doctor Stomper appeared.
>>
>>       "Gah!" said Ubiquitous Boy Lad Jr.
>
> Due to the piecemeal writing process, a *lot* of characters just kind of
> popped up out of nowhere in this story, and I tried to smooth those
> transitions as best I could. I'd be better at it now. X3

That's a real Old LNH kind of humor though.

> So, after Jeanne put Masterplan Lad in this, other writers kept using
> him in new LNH v2 stories. This, of course, is rad, but also, there had
> never been a story written where he actually joined the LNH - he'd only
> ever appeared as an ally of Ultimate Mercenary as they journeyed thru
> various alternate timelines. Jeanne tied that up in Just Another
> Cascade, around the time I was working toward finishing this, and I took
> the opportunity to do a little continuity-finagling via time travel. Not
> that you need to know that, because...

I do like how MPL was part of the Core LNH for a bit and basically had
the same trajectory of early Writer Characters like Sig.Lad, becoming
part of the LNH's central narrative and then diverging again.

>
>>        Heaving a sigh of frustration, he passed through the double doors
>> and saw a Japanese woman sitting behind the desk, hurriedly struggling
>> to get some paperwork done. This must be Kyoko Ishikawa.
>
> Jeanne and I use her a lot! :D

I really like the idea of her being a meaningful narrative presence
having her own life outside the LNH. Like the occasional human
supporting characters such as Stevie Hunter in 80s X-Men (Claremont
again). I feel like losing normal human supporting casts around the
90s/00s has been a big problem for suerphero comics.

>
>>        "No, I'm already a member of the team, though I haven't been
>> around
>> very much. I'm Masterplan Lad." He hoped she wouldn't remember who he
>> was, not to mention the fact that he'd accidentally destroyed the LNHQ.
>> [In one of the Infinite Leadership Crisis issues that Adrian swears he's
>> going to write someday -- Footnote Girl]
>>
>>        "Wait, didn't you destroy the LNHQ?"
>
> Heeheeheehee

At this point, I've decided it would be funnier if I never actually
wrote those issues.

>
>>        "And the number one reason List Lad won't be attending tonight's
>> party," Pulls-Paper-Out-of-Hats Lad continued. "Because of what Toony
>> Stork did to me and the woman we both loved during the LNH's very first
>> mission."
>
> An excellent cliffhanger to leave off on. :D
>
> Drew "DUN DUN DUNNNN" Nilium

On 2021-11-08 21:25, Drew Nilium wrote:
>> and of course there's another big flame war and Martin pretty much
>> burned every last bridge he had with the LNH and he quit RACC for
>> good (granted he did wind up making a sock puppet account (April
>> White -- was that the name?) so he could write some stuff for the
>> LNHY Imprint.)
>
> That was the name, yeah. He wrote a few more of his extremely flat
> movie parodies, which everyone ignored, and then he disappeared for
> good.
I recall April's Legion of Jesus-Friends or whatever. Me arguing with
April about whether Mohammad ought to be teaming up with Satan, was a
lot like Martin arguing with me about whether the Powernaut's world
needed Fractal Time. But I still think I was right both times. 8{D>

--
-- (signed) Scott Eiler 8{D> ------ http://www.eilertech.com/ -------

"Your Royal Highness, instead of devoting yourself exclusively
to Minerva, should, instead, rather offer sacrifice at the altars
of Bacchus, Orpheus, Venus, and Morpheus."

- Advice to Prince Duarte of Portugal. From "The golden age of
Prince Henry the Navigator", by Joaquim Pedro Oliveira Martins.
Coming soon to Project Gutenberg.

On 11/9/21 10:01 AM, Jeanne Morningstar wrote:
> On 11/8/21 11:25 PM, Drew Nilium wrote:
>
> > WOOOOO! I've probably read thru this half a dozen times or more since I
> > posted it. Everyone put so much good energy into it.
>
> I've been rereading 52, and this issue reminds me a lot of that in terms of
> being the work of a group of creators with very distinct, well-defined voices
> but also feeling like a cohesive whole.

That's an excellent point! :>

> Thankfully, we don't have a superhero
> murdering an entire country in this one.

aaaaaaaaaaargh indeed @@ raaaaaaaaage

>> Completely understandable, and TBH, The Cat With Glasses was very much worth
>> it. :>
>
> It's wild how much influence that story had in the long term, with the Brad Pitt
> thing being a central part of WikiLull.

Yessssss. <3

>> Incredibly understandable. I feel like you, me, and Jeanne all felt
>> individually responsible for the post-Martingeddon slump, but really, it's
>> nobody's fault but his. (And, you know, all the other forces that keep us from
>> writing, internal and external.)
>
> I feel like it took us a really long time to gain a sense of closure after All
> That, which was part of why it was hard for me to write for LNH sometime. (And
> yeah, the impact it had on LNH20, something I put a lot of myself into, was a
> big part of it.) Both personally and in terms of our collective narrative
> movement--the whole last decade was kind of about trying to resolve what the LNH
> was after Martin's characters--especially Master Blaster, who'd kind of been a
> central part of the LNH in the 2000s--were gone. I don't think I fully resolved
> that for myself until LNH v3 #3. We got some amazing writing and ideas out of
> working through that, though.

Yeah, I feel like I've been juggling around bits and pieces of the setting and
figuring out where they should go, and now most of them are in place. <3

>> That was part of it, and it was also justifying horrifying takes on queer
>> characters *and* Master Blaster tormenting WikiBoy[*] and also started with a
>> summary of #50 that ended with "There. Now you don't have to read it." or
>> something. @@
>
> I no longer even remember how queer characters ended up being a part of that
> argument, and that's probably for the best.

It probably is. X3

>> [*]Also weirdly John Byrne-esque, actually, comparable to his Fantastic Four
>> run saying that Galactus's existence is cosmically necessary And That Is That.
>> I'm not sure if I'm Chris Claremont in that situation or Jeanne is. X3
>
> I feel like I'm usually Chris Claremont in most cases, both in the "long running
> subplot" sense and the "making everything gay" sense.

IT'S TRUE.

> I guess Drew is Louise Simonson, if only because Power Pack is an extremely
> Drew-like concept.

Ahh, so that's why you're so into the Crossover Queen. :3

>>>       "Do you see what's happening here?" said You're-Not-Hitting-Me-Hard-
>>> Enough Lad, turning to his friends. "How can the LNH fight the evil and
>>> injustices in the world -- when it takes a blind eye to the evil and
>>> injustice within its own halls?
>>
>> This is a theme I've been coming back to. <3 It's extremely relevant nowadays.
>> @-@
>
> This issue was really the one that cemented a lot of the core ideas and themes
> of the post-Beige era of LNH, and that's one of the big ones.

It's true!! <3

>>>       "It's an alien! A Dorf! A Dorfian shapeshifter!" said Ubiquitous Boy
>>> Lad Jr., voice filled with horror and relief.
>>
>> DUN DUN DUNNNNN!
>
> It's interestng how the Dorfs basically take on the properties of diffrent kind
> of aliens in pop culture--they started out as a Borg riff, became the Klingons
> and this issue borrows heavily from Secret Invasion (but it works much better,
> just as Beige Midnight's version of President Luthor, the Registration Act and
> Project Everyman did).

BM really did a better version of a whole bunch of big crossover storylines.

>>>       Right on cue, as if from thin air, Doctor Stomper appeared.
>>>
>>>       "Gah!" said Ubiquitous Boy Lad Jr.
>>
>> Due to the piecemeal writing process, a *lot* of characters just kind of
>> popped up out of nowhere in this story, and I tried to smooth those
>> transitions as best I could. I'd be better at it now. X3
>
> That's a real Old LNH kind of humor though.

It's true! :3

>> So, after Jeanne put Masterplan Lad in this, other writers kept using him in
>> new LNH v2 stories. This, of course, is rad, but also, there had never been a
>> story written where he actually joined the LNH - he'd only ever appeared as an
>> ally of Ultimate Mercenary as they journeyed thru various alternate timelines.
>> Jeanne tied that up in Just Another Cascade, around the time I was working
>> toward finishing this, and I took the opportunity to do a little
>> continuity-finagling via time travel. Not that you need to know that, because...
>
> I do like how MPL was part of the Core LNH for a bit and basically had the same
> trajectory of early Writer Characters like Sig.Lad, becoming part of the LNH's
> central narrative and then diverging again.

That's an excellent point! :>

>>>        Heaving a sigh of frustration, he passed through the double doors
>>> and saw a Japanese woman sitting behind the desk, hurriedly struggling
>>> to get some paperwork done. This must be Kyoko Ishikawa.
>>
>> Jeanne and I use her a lot! :D
>
> I really like the idea of her being a meaningful narrative presence having her
> own life outside the LNH. Like the occasional human supporting characters such
> as Stevie Hunter in 80s X-Men (Claremont again). I feel like losing normal human
> supporting casts around the 90s/00s has been a big problem for suerphero comics.

Yes agreed. <3 Ongoing supporting casts are so important!!

>>>        "No, I'm already a member of the team, though I haven't been around
>>> very much. I'm Masterplan Lad." He hoped she wouldn't remember who he
>>> was, not to mention the fact that he'd accidentally destroyed the LNHQ.
>>> [In one of the Infinite Leadership Crisis issues that Adrian swears he's
>>> going to write someday -- Footnote Girl]
>>>
>>>        "Wait, didn't you destroy the LNHQ?"
>>
>> Heeheeheehee
>
> At this point, I've decided it would be funnier if I never actually wrote those
> issues.

Curses. X3

Drew "still gonna write my characters eventually" Nilium

On 11/9/21 8:00 PM, Scott Eiler wrote:
> On 2021-11-08 21:25, Drew Nilium wrote:
>>> and of course there's another big flame war and Martin pretty much
>>> burned every last bridge he had with the LNH and he quit RACC for
>>> good (granted he did wind up making a sock puppet account (April
>>> White -- was that the name?) so he could write some stuff for the LNHY Imprint.)
>>
>> That was the name, yeah. He wrote a few more of his extremely flat
>> movie parodies, which everyone ignored, and then he disappeared for
>> good.
> I recall April's Legion of Jesus-Friends or whatever.  Me arguing with April
> about whether Mohammad ought to be teaming up with Satan, was a lot like Martin
> arguing with me about whether the Powernaut's world needed Fractal Time.  But I
> still think I was right both times.  8{D>

Oh god, I forgot that had happened too. X3 And you definitely were.

Drew "Martin was always so bad at understanding neat setting concepts" Nilium

On Monday, November 8, 2021 at 10:25:58 PM UTC-7, Drew Perron wrote:
> On 11/7/21 4:23 PM, Arthur Spitzer wrote:
> <snip>
> > Ubiquitous Boy Lad Jr. [The sidekick of Ubiquitous Boy's sidekick
> > Ubiquitous Lad (or is it the other way around?) -- Footnote Girl]
> Ubiquitous Boy and Ubiquitous Lad are both Rob's characters, but I'm not sure if
> they've ever actually shown up in a story (ironically). X3

I remember them from this EDM Lite/Continuity Champ story that was
an elsewhirl (I think in the archives its called an EDM Special under
the EDM series).

Doing a google group search of alt.comics.lnh it looks like the first appearance
of both those characters was EDM #15.

Arthur "Googling.." Spitzer

On 11/14/21 4:17 PM, Arthur Spitzer wrote:
> On Monday, November 8, 2021 at 10:25:58 PM UTC-7, Drew Perron wrote:
>> On 11/7/21 4:23 PM, Arthur Spitzer wrote:
>> <snip>
>>> Ubiquitous Boy Lad Jr. [The sidekick of Ubiquitous Boy's sidekick
>>> Ubiquitous Lad (or is it the other way around?) -- Footnote Girl]
>> Ubiquitous Boy and Ubiquitous Lad are both Rob's characters, but I'm not sure if
>> they've ever actually shown up in a story (ironically). X3
>
> I remember them from this EDM Lite/Continuity Champ story that was
> an elsewhirl (I think in the archives its called an EDM Special under
> the EDM series).

Oh *that* one. That's right. :D

> Doing a google group search of alt.comics.lnh it looks like the first appearance
> of both those characters was EDM #15.

I'll have to go and look after I read... oh god, all this other stuff X3

Drew "why have you created me? just to suffer?" Nilium