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arts / rec.arts.comics.creative / Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

SubjectAuthor
* LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-onsArthur Spitzer
+* Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-onsMartin Phipps
|+* Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-onsAmabel Holland
||`* Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-onsMartin Phipps
|| `* Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-onsAmabel Holland
||  `- Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-onsMartin Phipps
|+- Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and someScott Eiler
|+* Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and someDrew Nilium
||+* Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and someDrew Nilium
|||`- Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-onsMartin Phipps
||`* Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-onsMartin Phipps
|| `- Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-onsDave Van Domelen
|`- Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and someJeanne Morningstar
+- Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and someDrew Nilium
`* Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and someJeanne Morningstar
 +* Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-onsAmabel Holland
 |+- Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and someDrew Nilium
 |`- Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and someJeanne Morningstar
 `- Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and someDrew Nilium

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LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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Subject: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons
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 by: Arthur Spitzer - Sun, 19 Dec 2021 21:30 UTC

For the Martin Phipps #51 and Jeanne Morningstar #51 add-on to that issue
click this link:
https://lnh.diamond-age.net/wiki/Legion_of_Net.Heroes_Volume_2
There are footnotes which will take you to those issues.

Okay. And here are the final two issues of the Martin Phipps' Burns All
His Bridges Trilogy.

First we have the Lalo Martins version of LNH vII #51. And some add-ons by
Jeanne Morningstar and Drew Nilium. Will this issue lead to some kumbaya
moment that will cause all the LNH Writers to hold hands and sing 'Kumbaya'?
And will World Peace follow?

Next we have Saxon Brenton on #52 -- Will this issue lead to another flame
way? (Yes!) And will all those rumors of Saxon Brenton's demise turn out
to be false?

Find out in...

_
| | Classic
| | =
| | ____ ____ _ ____ ___
| |__ | [] | | [] | | | | [] | | _ \

|____| \__] \__ | |_| \__/ |_|\_\
||
|_| OF NET.HEROES

ADVENTURES #226

=====================
LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons
=====================

https://lnh.diamond-age.net/wiki/Legion_of_Net.Heroes_Volume_2

From: Lalo Martins lalo.martins at gmail.com
Date: Wed Jun 20 07:34:13 PDT 2012

"The New 51"

Kid Enthusiastic burst into the cafeteria.

"Guys, we have a problem!"

"What is it?", asked WikiBoy.

"I have no idea."

"Then", asked Sister State-The-Obvious, "how can you be so sure?"

"It was just a feeling. Like, I don't know. Reality being rewritten, or a flamewar collapsing somewhere, stories dying, or a lot of characters blinking out of... well, if not existence, at least general usability."

Masterplan Lad shrugged. "Maybe it's for the best?"

"I'd rather not risk it", said Kid E.

Weirdness Magnet finished his mousse and let out a long sigh. "We could ask Fourth Wall Lass or somebody like that."

"Haven't seen her in a while", said Sister State-The-Obvious.

"Wikiboy", Masterplan Lad said, "you have the ability figure out what happened."

"All right." He blinked and immediately blushed. "Yeah. I think we'd better just leave it alone. It seems to be over, in any case. Plus, I'm not a frog. Which is good."

~~~~~

Kid Enthusiastic is Andrew Perron's.
Wikiboy is Tom Russel's.
Sister State-The-Obvious is wReam's.
Masterplan Lad is Adrian J. McClure's.
Weirdness Magnet is Lalo Martins'.

-- Lalo "Mother Mary" Martins

From: Adrian J. McClure mrfantastic7 at gmail.com
Date: Wed Jun 20 07:39:52 PDT 2012

Legion of Net.Heroes v2 #51 add-on, by Adrian J. McClure

Sarcastic Lad walked into the cafeteria. "Hey WikiBoy, you're a frog!"

WikiBoy tried to sight, but all he could do was croak.

TO BE CONTINUED IN LNH V2 #52: JENNY EVERYWHERE AND THE LEGION OF
NET.HEROES!

From: Andrew Perron pwerdna at gmail.com
Date: Wed Jun 20 08:10:28 PDT 2012

"By the way," said Kid Enthusiastic, "have you guys met my friend, Fairy
Princess Lad?"

He stepped to the side to reveal a twelve-year-old boy wearing a pink
leotard, a tutu, and a domino mask, holding a sparkly magic wand. He had
iridescent dragonfly wings growing out of his back, and looked distinctly
ill-at-ease. "Er, hi..."

"Oh, hey," said Weirdness Magnet.

"Nice to meet you!" said Sister State-The-Obvious.

"Hello," said Masterplan Lad.

"Croak," said WikiBoy.

"He wanted to join up, but, I dunno, he thought somebody would have a
problem or something?" Kid E shrugged!

"We certainly don't have anyone like you!" said Sister State-The-Obvious.
"If your powers can beat a test in the Peril Room, you'll be able to join!"

"Well, I can fly, and I have this fairy dust that calms people down..."

Sarcastic Lad, expression gleeful, opened his mouth. "What a--"

Masterplan Lad levitated him out the window and into the recycling bins.

Andrew "NO .SIG MAN" "Juan" Perron, just a tidbit

From: Saxon Brenton saxonbrenton at hotmail.com
Date: Wed Oct 31 16:47:51 PDT 2012

[LNH/HCC] Legion of Net.Heroes Vol.2 #52 HCC32

___ ___________________________
| |-| \
| |-| [] / #52
| | | [] egion of \ 'The Rumours Of My Demise...'
| | | []__ [] [] [] [] / (Part of High Concept Challenge #32)
| | | [___][ \[]et.[]__[]eroes \
| | | []\ ] [ __ ] / written by and copyright 2012
| |-| [] [] [] [] \ Saxon Brenton
| |-|___________________________/ (or *is* it?)
| |
| |
| |
| | The cover shows Kid Enthusiastic and Fairy Princess Lad bouncing up
| | and down in excitement while older Legionnaires look on, bemused.
| |
| |
| |
|_|


[A Silver Age-style roster of characters in the form of a series of mug
shots in little circles runs down the side of the title page:]

Roll call for this issue:
o Anal-Retentive Archive Kid II!
o Cynical Lass!
o Fairy Princess Lad!
o Kid Enthusiastic!
o Masterplan Lad!
o You're-Not-Hitting-Me-Hard-Enough Lad!

These are just some of the super-powered do-gooders who belong to an
organisation that thinks that running around with your underwear on
the outside is acceptable as a fashion statement. They are: the
Legion of Net.Heroes!

@%%%%%%%%%%@

A teenaged boy in a gaudy costume entered the foyer of the Legion
of Net.Heroes headquarters. He glanced around, but quickly spotted the
reception desk and approached it.
"Hi. I'm here to join the Legion," he said.
Fred nodded and passed over the application paperwork. As the
newcomer took out a pacer pencil to fill in the forms, the receptionist
asked, "What code name do you go by?"
"No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead! Lad."
And in response Fred thought .oO( That's going to cause trouble. )

@%%%%%%%%%%@

Meanwhile, in the cafeteria:
"But isn't the word 'kids' gender neutral?" asked Fairy Princess Lad.
"Mmmm," went Kid Enthusiastic, sounding doubtful. "Maybe in the
sense that 'man' was supposed to be a gender neutral, but now everyone
realises that that's just handwaving."
" 'Kid' is also the description for all young goats, male or female,"
suggested Fairy Princess Lad.
"I'm not a goat!" exclaimed Kid Enthusiastic. He pointed at Anal-
Retentive Archive Kid II, who was sitting at the other end of the table,
"And he's not a goat!"
Anal-Retentive Archive Kid II looked up from the statistical
analysis of recent crimes that he was processing for Innovative Offense
Lad. "What's the problem?" he asked the two pre-teens.
"We're trying to figure out what you Anal-Retentive Archive Kids
should be called. As a group, I mean," explained Fairy Princess Lad.
The orc put down his computer pad. "I would have thought 'Anal-
Retentive Archive Kids' would have been good enough. And that's
assuming we need a group name at all. There's only two of us, and
that's a lot less than all the Nope Lads and Lasses who joined as a
result of Hex Luthor's Net.Hero Registration Act."
"The Nope-I'm-Not-Training-To-Be-A-Net.Hero members weren't
planning on staying around, so they didn't see a need to form a properly
named sub-group," pointed out Kid Enthusiastic.
"Well I'm not either," pointed out ARAK II. "Summer job, remember?"
"You're planning on staying around long enough to actually work for
the Legion, not just train under them," countered Fairy Princess Lad.
"And go on missions, and everything!"
"And at some point there's going to be an Anal-Retentive Archive
Kid who's a girl," said Kid Enthusiastic. "And you'll have to be ready
for that, otherwise it'll be like with the Hyphenated Eaters Corps all
over again."
Anal-Retentive Archive Kid II nodded. He remembered that. Well,
not directly, because it had been a bit before his time, but he'd heard
accounts of the kerfuffle when Spicy-Mexican-Food-Eater Lass had found
out what the male members of their group had wanted to register the name
of their team as. [_Legion of Net.Heroes Volume 2_ #27 - Footnote Girl]
"Ooo! Ooo!" went Kid Enthusiastic, bouncing up and down in his seat
as he suddenly got an idea. "The word 'kinder' means 'children', and
that's gender neutral. ARA Kinder!" he speculated in rather sloppy
German.
"Ooo! Ooo!" went Fairy Princess Lad, echoing his friend. "And that
can be turned into an internet pun: ARA Kindles!" The two boys high
fived each other.
ARAK II looked at them with bemusement. "I've never understood the
need to make internet puns out of everything," he said.
"Oh, it's because our stories are distributed over the internet,"
said Kid Enthusiastic matter-of-factly.
Well, yes, they were. But the Legion's licensed merchandise was
also dual published in hard copy - the so-called dead tree format - and
had been for a long time. And then there were all the TV adaptation and
direct-to-video productions. Like he'd just said, ARAK II didn't quite
get the emphasis on the internet distribution. He spotted Cynical
Lass's expression. She was sitting a table over from them, and had a
look on her face which he completely misinterpreted as, 'They're
children. Let them play their games while they've still got the
energy.' Actually what she was thinking was, 'You poor schmuck. If
you think I'm going to explain to you that we're all fictional
characters in an imaginary world then you've got another thing coming.'
The new applicant wandered into the cafeteria. The still exuberant
Kid Enthusiastic saw him, motioned for him to sit down, and then said,
"Hi there. Who are you?"
"I'm No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead! Lad."
A hush fell across the cafeteria as various LNHers just *stared* at
N!ICBSB!HD!Lad.
Except for Cynical Lass, who face palmed as it occurred to her that
it wasn't just saying things out loud that counted as tempting fate.
Some days that you just couldn't risk an ironic thought even in the
privacy of your own head.
And except for Anal-Retentive Archive Kid II, who asked, "Who's
Saxon Brenton?"
You could practically hear all the eyeballs squeak as they
swivelled from No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead! Lad to Anal-
Retentive Archive Kid II.
"He's a Writer," said Kid Enthusiastic.
"Yes, I got that," said ARAK II. "Between So-Lame-Even-Saxon-
Brenton-Wouldn't-Use-Him-In-A-Story Lad and Joyce Carol Oates Lass, it's
obvious that some people codename themselves after writers." He had
long since finished eating his lunch, so he absently stacked the cutlery
on his empty plate before standing up and placing the plate at an
adjacent collection point. "I just don't know who he *is*. I've never
seen a library catalog entry for anything he's written. What does he
write? Science fiction? Romance? Neo-Edwardian comedies of manners?"
"Superhero parody," said Masterplan Lad. "We're in one of them at
the moment."
"Oh yeah," said You're-Not-Hitting-Me-Hard-Enough Lad, glancing
upwards towards the from: line among the headers at the start of the
posting. "I hadn't noticed the email address."
"Forged address," said No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead!
Lad with a grim earnestness. "Someone's pretending to be him. Identity
theft of a dead man. Pretty ghoulish, really."
Anal-Retentive Archive Kid II sighed. "Cut the comedy, people.
This is no time for those Church of the Fourth Walls gags."
Sister-State-The-Obvious looked surprised. "You don't know that
you're fictional?"
"I'm not. We're not. Which is good, because if we were then the
master's degree I've been slaving at for the past few years would be
useless."
You're-Not-Hitting-Me-Hard-Enough Lad turned to Masterplan Lad and
said, "You'd better bring him up to speed."
Masterplan Lad had been considering No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-
He's-Dead! Lad's words, but now he arched an eyebrow. Was it
cluelessness that made YNHMHELad completely miss the nuance of what the
orc had just said? Callousness? Or a ruthless commitment to the truth
at any cost?" The latter, at least, was a respectable reason to
Masterplan Lad's way of thinking. He shrugged, then walked over to
ARAK II, and for maybe a minute had an serious conversation with him in
lowered tones.
The look on ARAK's face went from irritation, to surprise, then on
to utter horror. The turn around time in convincing the young orc of
the truthfulness of their claims was astonishingly quick, but Masterplan
Lad was one of the Knights Temporal, and there were few other LNHers who
were as familiar with continuity and fictionality as he was. In any
case, within less than sixty seconds he had ARAK II accepting the
notion. At which point Anal-Retentive Archive Kid burst into angry
tears.
Masterplan Lad was so startled by this that he reflexively took a
step backwards and half raised his umbrella. "I... What...?" he
stammered, uncharacteristically taken aback.
"All the research work I've done for the past six years is pretty
much pointless now," ARAK snarled. "And the worst thing is that it
isn't a problem I can deal with by punching it!"
You're-Not-Hitting-Me-Hard-Enough Lad gave him a particularly
intense look. He always seemed to pay more attention when there a
chance of punching involved. "And you're not gonna just hit someone
else instead?"
"What, and play kill-the-messenger? I'm not stupid, Hard Enough,"
ARAK said dismissively. He wiped his sleeve across his snout in a quick
angry gesture to deal with his sniffles. "Honest advice is too valuable
to waste just because you don't like what you hear."
Cynical Lass invaded ARAK's personal space, stood right in front
of him and pointedly got in-his-face to demand, "So what's the big deal
with research, then? After all, didn't you once say that it was
basically just politics?"
He frowned at her. "It's an overview of the mechanics of a multi-
species society, based on how all the mutants and aliens have integrated
here in Net.ropolis. Going by how other groups have developed, at
*some* point in the next few centuries my people," and here he thumped a
fist on his chest for emphasis, "are probably going to start giving up
tribalism and move towards settled urban living. If I can produce a
working blueprint then the chances of conflict, and especially of them
being slaughtered by a technologically superior civilisation, will be
reduced." He started pacing about in a small circle. "But if this
world is fictional, then that all goes out the window. I shouldn't be
worrying about politics and social dynamics, because those aren't the
elements that will ensure their survival. Convincing everyone else that
orcs are interesting characters who they'll want to have around is what
I'll need to do, which means I'd do better by taking a creative writing
course and churning out bestseller potboilers aimed at the mass market."
He rounded on Cynical Lass and pointed an accusing finger at her. "And
you..." - and he paused as his brain caught up with his mouth - "...have
just tricked me into brainstorming a solution to my own problem."
"Yes. Obviously," said Cynical Lass, straight faced.
"Thank you," said ARAK II. He reached into his pockets and brought
out three brightly coloured rubber balls and began to juggle. It seemed
to be so that he had something to do with his hands, since he continued
to pace about and hardly paid any attention to the spheres that he had
whizzing about. Only Masterplan Lad noticed that although they were all
the same size they seemed to have different weights, making ARAK's
almost absent minded juggling feat all the more impressive.
Meanwhile, Fairy Princess Lad was agog. "You worked out all that
in two minutes flat, from the standing start of a nasty surprise?"
Masterplan Lad spoke up in ARAK II's stead: "To be fair, it's a
rather obvious conclusion when you stop to consider the evidence." Then
to ARAK II he said, "However, there's another piece of information that
could modify your conclusions."
Anal-Retentive Archive Kid II glanced curiously at Masterplan Lad.
"Really? Okay then, let's hear it."
"There's at least one of the Legion Writers who takes absolute
delight in exploring the nature of a multi-species society in a
superhuman world," said Masterplan Lad, pedantically.
"Well, that sounds great," said ARAK. "Who is it?"
"Your Writer."
"Ah," breathed ARAK, knowingly. "Ask not for divine intervention,
lest you discover that you yourself are the instrument that enacts that
intervention. How very C.S. Lewis." Then he recognised the rather
strange looks that the others were giving him, and the last piece of the
puzzle fell into place. "But there's the small drawback that that
Writer was Saxon Brenton, right?"
"Yes."
"Huh. I guess that brings us back to you, then," ARAK said to No!-
It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead! Lad. "What are the circumstances
he died in? Maybe there's something in his writing I can use, or
salvage from his legacy, or whatever."
No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead! Lad shrugged. "Sometime
after he got back to Australia in July after RACC-Con, he died. After
all, he hasn't been putting out any editions of the _End Of Month
Review_ recently."
"There were really long periods when he wasn't putting out the _End
Of Month Review_ last year, either," pointed out You're-Not-Hitting-Me-
Hard-Enough Lad.
"Plus," said N!ICBSB!HD!Lad, raising a finger to stave off further
protests. "The cheque hasn't been cashed."
"What cheque?" asked Cynical lass.
"During RACC-Con Arthur Spitzer stayed in the same hotel room with
Saxon Brenton," explain N!ICBSB!HD!Lad. "When Arthur went home he wrote
a cheque to cover the cost of the days he was sharing. That cheque
still hasn't been cashed. That's not what you'd expect from someone who
has to cover costs from an overseas vacation."
Masterplan Lad had been listening carefully to this, and now he
identified what had been troubling him. "No," he said. "That is
factually incorrect. On the evening Arthur arrived at the Benicia Best
Western Saxon hadn't made proper preparations with the front desk for
him to check in while the others were at the barbeque at Rob Roger's
household, and Arthur had had to book into another room for one night
- a room booking that was only covered by Scott Eiler's blanket offer to
subsidise RACC-Con attendees. The cheque has gone uncashed not because
of inability, but because of a sense of guilt!"
No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead! Lad gave Masterplan Lad a
deadly glare and took a threatening step forward. His eyes glowed red.
Fairy Princess Lad exclaimed, "Now just calm down," and sprinkled
some of his sparkly magic dust in the N!ICBSB!HD!Lad's direction.
However it seemed to have no effect.
You're-Not-Hitting-Me-Hard-Enough Lad leapt forward with his battle
cry, "No, you villain! Hit *me*!" (Finally, some action after all that
exposition.) Unfortunately No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead!
Lad used an aikido-like move on him, taking the boisterous net.hero's
own momentum and using it against him - grabbing YNHMHELad and throwing
him out through the ceiling of the LNH-HQ, such that he would land about
two miles away. So, sure, YNHMHELad will have absorbed an impressive
amount of kinetic energy to boost his strength, but it will take him a
while to get back to the fight.
Anal-Retentive Archive Kid II threw one of the balls at him. The
blue one. The one with the solid steel centre under the thin rubber
outer covering. It hit No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead! Lad
square in the face, where it made a 'bonnggg!' sound effect of metal on
metal. "Killer robot!" ARAK yelled, and then had to dive for cover when
N!ICBSB!HD!Lad blasted out a laser beam death ray from his frickin'
eyeballs.
The other Legionnaires were manoeuvring for their own counter-
attacks. The first, perhaps surprisingly, was Fairy Princess Lad, who
promptly went Sailor Moon on N!ICBSB!HD!Lad. He glowed and sparkled and
yelled, "Villain! In the name of Queen Titania and Lord Oberon, I will
punish you!"
And then Fairy Princess Lad unleashed a power blast from his hands
that slammed N!ICBSB!HD!Lad back across the cafeteria and through a wall
of solid strongstuffium with an enormous WHHAMMM!!!, pulverising the
trouble-making robot and leaving a large hole in its wake.
The Legionnaires all stared at the hole in the wall. The only
sound was the occasional light 'ping' as the metal started to cool.
"Huh," went Anal-Retentive Archive Kid II.
"I didn't know he could do that," said Kid Enthusiastic.
"Always a useful power to have, though," pointed out Cynical Lass.
"Not the type of ability I would have expected from someone
channelling the Powers That Be of Dom Daniel," observed Masterplan Lad.
Fairy Princess Lad came over to ARAK II and gave him a big hug.
ARAK looked at him. "What was that for?"
Fairy Princess Lad gave him a serious expression and said, "Big
scary orcs who are secure enough with themselves that they don't need to
take it out on others when they're upset deserve hugs."
"Really? I don't remember that rule. Did I miss a memo?"
"I just made it up."
"Ah. Well, that explains it then," said ARAK II, patting Fairy
Princess Lad on the back. "Okay then. Thanks. Now, I suppose we
should collect the remains of that robot."
Cynical Lass rolled her eyes. "Oh please. How are we supposed to
get recurring villains if you go around acting responsibly, securing
defeated bad guys and tidying up dangerous messes?"
And the scary thing was, ARAK II didn't have enough experience with
the whole 'recognising the cliches of a superhero parody story' to tell
whether her protest was serious or not.


=====

Character credits:
Anal-Retentive Archive Kid II and
No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead! Lad created by Saxon Brenton.
Cynical Lass created by Rob Rogers.
Fairy Princess Lad and Kid Enthusiastic created by Andrew Perron.
Masterplan Lad created by Adrian J. McClure.
Sister-State-The-Obvious created by wReam (Ray Bingham).
You're-Not-Hitting-Me-Hard-Enough Lad create by Arthur Spitzer.


Author's notes:
Written for the 32nd High Concept Challenge: "I'm Late!"
Reading back through this now that it's written, this is easily one
of the most meta and self-referential stories I've written in years.
Notwithstanding all the confusion about numbering in this series
- ranging from the fact that I have yet to finish the second half of
LNHv.2 #48, that the Writers collectively have yet to finish the
LNHv.2 #50 roundtable story, or the disagreements about LNHv.2 #51
- I'm reasonably sure that the issue number of 52 hasn't been claimed
yet... What's that? A phone call from DC Comics complaining that
they've copyrighted the number 52? Awww, man...


-----
Saxon Brenton University of Technology, city library, Sydney Australia
saxon.brenton at uts.edu.au saxonbrenton at hotmail.com
"These 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex
world of jet-powered apes and time-travel." - Superman, JLA Classified #3


==========
Next Week: Probably doing some Holiday stuff. So see you in 2022!
==========


Click here to read the complete article
Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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From: imeldaph...@gmail.com (Martin Phipps)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.creative
Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons
Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2021 22:53:52 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Martin Phipps - Sun, 19 Dec 2021 22:53 UTC

On Monday, December 20, 2021 at 5:30:36 AM UTC+8, Arthur Spitzer wrote:
> For the Martin Phipps #51 and Jeanne Morningstar #51 add-on to that issue
> click this link:
> https://lnh.diamond-age.net/wiki/Legion_of_Net.Heroes_Volume_2
> There are footnotes which will take you to those issues.
>
> Okay. And here are the final two issues of the Martin Phipps' Burns All
> His Bridges Trilogy.

Yes. It is good that it is somehow still available.

People at the time could not handle gay people being in the LNH. It was 2012. You would have thought people would have been more enlightened.

Martin

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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 by: Amabel Holland - Mon, 20 Dec 2021 01:27 UTC

On Sunday, December 19, 2021 at 5:53:53 PM UTC-5, imelda...@gmail.com wrote:

> People at the time could not handle gay people being in the LNH. It was 2012. You would have thought people would have been more enlightened.

I really shouldn't wade into this, and pretty much everyone who is here to read this today was there when it happened, but: that's not at all accurate, Martin.

It wasn't the presence of gay characters, but your handling of them, that folks objected to - many of the folks who raised those objections were themselves LGBTQ+, and were speaking from a place of experience.

I hope you can reflect on that, and better understand the concerns that were raised at this time. Hope at least springs eternal.

With kindness,

Amabel

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some
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 by: Scott Eiler - Mon, 20 Dec 2021 02:41 UTC

On 2021-12-19 14:53, Martin Phipps wrote:

> People at the time could not handle gay people being in the LNH. It
> was 2012. You would have thought people would have been more enlightened.

For my own part, I do not care who's in the LNH, and I made my peace
with gay people around 1981. University taught me things other than in
classrooms.

--
-- (signed) Scott Eiler 8{D> ------ http://www.eilertech.com/ -------

"Your Royal Highness, instead of devoting yourself exclusively
to Minerva, should, instead, rather offer sacrifice at the altars
of Bacchus, Orpheus, Venus, and Morpheus."

- Advice to Prince Duarte of Portugal. From "The golden age of
Prince Henry the Navigator", by Joaquim Pedro Oliveira Martins.
Coming soon to Project Gutenberg.

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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 by: Drew Nilium - Mon, 20 Dec 2021 04:51 UTC

Oh hi! Blocked!

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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 by: Jeanne Morningstar - Mon, 20 Dec 2021 04:58 UTC

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MdaeCpIqmA

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some
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 by: Drew Nilium - Mon, 20 Dec 2021 05:05 UTC

On 12/19/21 11:51 PM, Drew Nilium wrote:
> Oh hi! Blocked!

I'd definitely recommend everyone else block him as well. <3

Drew "don't feed the trolls amirite" Nilium

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons
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 by: Martin Phipps - Mon, 20 Dec 2021 11:32 UTC

On Monday, December 20, 2021 at 12:52:00 PM UTC+8, Drew Perron wrote:
> Oh hi! Blocked!

This childishness is not unexpected.

Martin

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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From: imeldaph...@gmail.com (Martin Phipps)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.creative
Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons
Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2021 11:34:35 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Martin Phipps - Mon, 20 Dec 2021 11:34 UTC

On Monday, December 20, 2021 at 1:05:55 PM UTC+8, Drew Perron wrote:
> On 12/19/21 11:51 PM, Drew Nilium wrote:
> > Oh hi! Blocked!
>
> I'd definitely recommend everyone else block him as well. <3
>
> Drew "don't feed the trolls amirite" Nilium

You have not been missed.

Martin

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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From: imeldaph...@gmail.com (Martin Phipps)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.creative
Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons
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 by: Martin Phipps - Mon, 20 Dec 2021 11:34 UTC

On Monday, December 20, 2021 at 9:27:37 AM UTC+8, holland...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> It wasn't the presence of gay characters, but your handling of them, that folks objected to - many of the folks who raised those objections were themselves LGBTQ+, and were speaking from a place of experience.

My description was accurate. It's like saying that a person could not write Flatulence Lad unless he farted a lot. People at the time were missing the whole point of the LNH. We too ordinary characteristics like sleeplessness or apathy and we described them as superpowers. Why could we not do the same thing with homosexuality? Do I have to be gay to create homosexual characters? Do I have to be a woman to create female characters? Do I have to be black to create black characters? This is why comics characters in the 60s were mostly white, male and straight. I hope people can understand this. If people from back then are still around then I would appreciate a sincere apology from every single one of them.

Martin

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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From: hollands...@gmail.com (Amabel Holland)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.creative
Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons
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 by: Amabel Holland - Mon, 20 Dec 2021 13:13 UTC

That's a straw man argument. You don't need to experience something to write about it, but you do need to listen to others who have experienced that thing when they tell you your depiction is hurtful.

Like I said, I shouldn't have waded into this -- I have this strange defect where I think if I keep trying and I can find just the right words, that I'll get through, that you'll think, even for just a moment, that maybe you're wrong and everyone else is right instead of vice-versa. But that never worked in the past, so why would it work now?

Anyway, you won't get any such apology from me. I truly wish you well, but won't be engaging any further.

Best,

Amabel

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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From: imeldaph...@gmail.com (Martin Phipps)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.creative
Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons
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 by: Martin Phipps - Tue, 21 Dec 2021 01:14 UTC

On Monday, December 20, 2021 at 9:13:06 PM UTC+8, holland...@gmail.com wrote:
> You don't need to experience something to write about it,

Thank you for confirming that I did absolutely nothing wrong and that I therefore deserve my apologies.

Martin

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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From: pwer...@gmail.com (Drew Nilium)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.creative
Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some
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 by: Drew Nilium - Tue, 21 Dec 2021 04:19 UTC

On 12/19/21 4:30 PM, Arthur Spitzer wrote:
<snip>
> Okay. And here are the final two issues of the Martin Phipps' Burns All
> His Bridges Trilogy.

And then we never had to deal with him again! <3 And I plan to continue that streak.

> Next we have Saxon Brenton on #52 -- Will this issue lead to another flame
> way? (Yes!)

Oh yeah, I vaguely remember that. X3 God, what nonsense. I'd love to see a
follow-up on this someday, tho. <3

> Kid Enthusiastic burst into the cafeteria.
>
> "Guys, we have a problem!"
>
> "What is it?", asked WikiBoy.
>
> "I have no idea."

This was great. X3

> "It was just a feeling. Like, I don't know. Reality being rewritten, or a flamewar collapsing
> somewhere, stories dying, or a lot of characters blinking out of... well, if not existence, at
> least general usability."

I love what we did with that! :>

> "Wikiboy", Masterplan Lad said, "you have the ability figure out what happened."
>
> "All right." He blinked and immediately blushed. "Yeah. I think we'd better just leave it alone.
> It seems to be over, in any case. Plus, I'm not a frog. Which is good."

Accurate. X3 <3

> Sarcastic Lad walked into the cafeteria. "Hey WikiBoy, you're a frog!"
>
> WikiBoy tried to sight, but all he could do was croak.
>
> TO BE CONTINUED IN LNH V2 #52: JENNY EVERYWHERE AND THE LEGION OF
> NET.HEROES!

I love this gag. X3

> "By the way," said Kid Enthusiastic, "have you guys met my friend, Fairy
> Princess Lad?"
>
> He stepped to the side to reveal a twelve-year-old boy wearing a pink
> leotard, a tutu, and a domino mask, holding a sparkly magic wand. He had
> iridescent dragonfly wings growing out of his back, and looked distinctly
> ill-at-ease. "Er, hi..."

FUCK YEAH. One of my first *really* gender-nonconforming characters. :3

> "Well, I can fly, and I have this fairy dust that calms people down..."
>
> Sarcastic Lad, expression gleeful, opened his mouth. "What a--"
>
> Masterplan Lad levitated him out the window and into the recycling bins.

Love it. X3

> | | The cover shows Kid Enthusiastic and Fairy Princess Lad bouncing up
> | | and down in excitement while older Legionnaires look on, bemused.

I'm so happy Saxon took my new character and immediately ran with him. :3

> Roll call for this issue:
> o Anal-Retentive Archive Kid II!
> o Cynical Lass!
> o Fairy Princess Lad!
> o Kid Enthusiastic!
> o Masterplan Lad!
> o You're-Not-Hitting-Me-Hard-Enough Lad!

I really enjoy this period where the "core LNH" was defined by #50 and included
Masterplan Lad. X3 He's the kind of character that has a lot of crossover appeal.

> These are just some of the super-powered do-gooders who belong to an
> organisation that thinks that running around with your underwear on
> the outside is acceptable as a fashion statement. They are: the
> Legion of Net.Heroes!

I also love this summary Saxon came up with.

> "No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead! Lad."
> And in response Fred thought .oO( That's going to cause trouble. )

Heeheehee

> "But isn't the word 'kids' gender neutral?" asked Fairy Princess Lad.
> "Mmmm," went Kid Enthusiastic, sounding doubtful. "Maybe in the
> sense that 'man' was supposed to be a gender neutral, but now everyone
> realises that that's just handwaving."

Now, personally, I super disagree, "Kid" is super gender neutral in my book.
However, I also enjoy what this leads to. n.n

> " 'Kid' is also the description for all young goats, male or female,"
> suggested Fairy Princess Lad.
> "I'm not a goat!" exclaimed Kid Enthusiastic. He pointed at Anal-
> Retentive Archive Kid II, who was sitting at the other end of the table,
> "And he's not a goat!"

I love this X3 <3

> "Ooo! Ooo!" went Kid Enthusiastic, bouncing up and down in his seat
> as he suddenly got an idea. "The word 'kinder' means 'children', and
> that's gender neutral. ARA Kinder!" he speculated in rather sloppy
> German.
> "Ooo! Ooo!" went Fairy Princess Lad, echoing his friend. "And that
> can be turned into an internet pun: ARA Kindles!" The two boys high
> fived each other.

See? Super cute!
= > She was sitting a table over from them, and had a
> look on her face which he completely misinterpreted as, 'They're
> children. Let them play their games while they've still got the
> energy.' Actually what she was thinking was, 'You poor schmuck. If
> you think I'm going to explain to you that we're all fictional
> characters in an imaginary world then you've got another thing coming.'

X3

> "I'm No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead! Lad."
> A hush fell across the cafeteria as various LNHers just *stared* at
> N!ICBSB!HD!Lad.
> Except for Cynical Lass, who face palmed as it occurred to her that
> it wasn't just saying things out loud that counted as tempting fate.
> Some days that you just couldn't risk an ironic thought even in the
> privacy of your own head.

X3 X3 X3

> You could practically hear all the eyeballs squeak

Love it

> "I just don't know who he *is*. I've never
> seen a library catalog entry for anything he's written. What does he
> write? Science fiction? Romance? Neo-Edwardian comedies of manners?"
> "Superhero parody," said Masterplan Lad. "We're in one of them at
> the moment."
> "Oh yeah," said You're-Not-Hitting-Me-Hard-Enough Lad, glancing
> upwards towards the from: line among the headers at the start of the
> posting. "I hadn't noticed the email address."
> "Forged address," said No!-It-Can't-Be-Saxon-Brenton!-He's-Dead!
> Lad with a grim earnestness. "Someone's pretending to be him. Identity
> theft of a dead man. Pretty ghoulish, really."

Astounding. X3

> The look on ARAK's face went from irritation, to surprise, then on
> to utter horror. The turn around time in convincing the young orc of
> the truthfulness of their claims was astonishingly quick, but Masterplan
> Lad was one of the Knights Temporal, and there were few other LNHers who
> were as familiar with continuity and fictionality as he was. In any
> case, within less than sixty seconds he had ARAK II accepting the
> notion. At which point Anal-Retentive Archive Kid burst into angry
> tears.

Aw bby. ;.;

> He frowned at her. "It's an overview of the mechanics of a multi-
> species society, based on how all the mutants and aliens have integrated
> here in Net.ropolis. Going by how other groups have developed, at
> *some* point in the next few centuries my people," and here he thumped a
> fist on his chest for emphasis, "are probably going to start giving up
> tribalism and move towards settled urban living. If I can produce a
> working blueprint then the chances of conflict, and especially of them
> being slaughtered by a technologically superior civilisation, will be
> reduced." He started pacing about in a small circle. "But if this
> world is fictional, then that all goes out the window. I shouldn't be
> worrying about politics and social dynamics, because those aren't the
> elements that will ensure their survival. Convincing everyone else that
> orcs are interesting characters who they'll want to have around is what
> I'll need to do,

Ah, a newbie to fictionality who doesn't realize that, if you're doing something
like that, it's because your writer, at least, thinks it's interesting, and
probably has an audience who does too. o3o

> "There's at least one of the Legion Writers who takes absolute
> delight in exploring the nature of a multi-species society in a
> superhuman world," said Masterplan Lad, pedantically.
> "Well, that sounds great," said ARAK. "Who is it?"
> "Your Writer."
> "Ah," breathed ARAK, knowingly. "Ask not for divine intervention,
> lest you discover that you yourself are the instrument that enacts that
> intervention. How very C.S. Lewis."

But that's such an amazing way to respond to that revelation. X3

> "Plus," said N!ICBSB!HD!Lad, raising a finger to stave off further
> protests. "The cheque hasn't been cashed."
> "What cheque?" asked Cynical lass.
> "During RACC-Con Arthur Spitzer stayed in the same hotel room with
> Saxon Brenton," explain N!ICBSB!HD!Lad. "When Arthur went home he wrote
> a cheque to cover the cost of the days he was sharing. That cheque
> still hasn't been cashed. That's not what you'd expect from someone who
> has to cover costs from an overseas vacation."
> Masterplan Lad had been listening carefully to this, and now he
> identified what had been troubling him. "No," he said. "That is
> factually incorrect. On the evening Arthur arrived at the Benicia Best
> Western Saxon hadn't made proper preparations with the front desk for
> him to check in while the others were at the barbeque at Rob Roger's
> household, and Arthur had had to book into another room for one night
> - a room booking that was only covered by Scott Eiler's blanket offer to
> subsidise RACC-Con attendees. The cheque has gone uncashed not because
> of inability, but because of a sense of guilt!"


Click here to read the complete article
Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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From: dvan...@eyrie.org (Dave Van Domelen)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.creative
Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons
Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2021 18:54:50 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Dave Van Domelen - Tue, 21 Dec 2021 18:54 UTC

In article <5f066187-004b-4708-9290-9de40186d868n@googlegroups.com>,
Martin Phipps <imeldaphipps2@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Monday, December 20, 2021 at 12:52:00 PM UTC+8, Drew Perron wrote:
>> Oh hi! Blocked!
>
>This childishness is not unexpected.

It is also well-earned. You may think of yourself as the only Real
Adult In The Room, but that would be self-delusion. You're a petty troll,
pretty much always have been, certain that your way is the only true way and
everyone else should follow your lead or get out of the way. You've been
shown the door before, you know where it is.

Dave Van Domelen, "Plonk"

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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From: mrfantas...@gmail.com (Jeanne Morningstar)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.creative
Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some
add-ons
Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2021 20:20:45 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Jeanne Morningstar - Tue, 21 Dec 2021 20:20 UTC

Sigh. Looking at this post, I'm catapulted right back to one of the most
difficult times in my life. I got back into LNH after a series of big
life events that completely demolished my sense of self. I had just
finished my master's thesis--this was around the time the movie of
Breaking Dawn came out, so I compared the experience to giving birth to
a vampire baby. (In retrospect that was one of those big hmm, maybe not
so cis in retrospect moments.) I'd also just had a huge traumatic
breakup of an intensely emotional and confusing semi-romantic
friendship. We were both intensely spiritual people and a lot of our
relationship was built around talking about Christian spirituality, so
this was the first domino that led to me effectively leaving the
Catholic Church and becoming queer and trans.

The whole incident with You Know Who was another domino. I definitely
reacted extremely at the time, but it's pretty clear now why I did. Back
then, I didn't think the homophobia was something that affected me
personally, I was just angry because of the sense of injustice. And this
was ultimately the last straw that led to me leaving the Catholic
Church, because I didn't want to be on the same side as the bullies.

There was a long, painful period where I hadn't really figured out who I
was and what I was doing, and this led to my writing falling off for a
while. I had really invested a lot in LNH, using that to recover from
everything I'd been through coming into 2012, so having that collapse
under me was hard.

I knew I had to build something to replace the things that hadn't worked
out, so I tried a lot of ideas that didn't work. The Jenny Everywhere
story that's hinted at here is one of them. I had the vague idea that
Jenny Everywhere in the LNH universe had been a hero in the Victorian
period and she'd been their inspiration, their equivalent to Superboy.
This was a potentially neat idea but, once I had it, I had no idea what
to do with it and dropped the whole thing.

I didn't write a lot in 2013 apart from the unfinished Looniverse Y #13.
By then, though, I'd started posting on tumblr and gotten back into
Marvel Comics in a major way, through series like the KSD Captain Marvel
and Fraction/Aja Hawkeye, and getting to know other queer people. All
this helped me figure out new ways of writing and being, and in 2014 I'd
help synthesize a new take on the LNH based on that in my parts of Just
Another Cascade.

But that's a story for another post.

For now, I'll just say that even with everything that's going on in
2021, I'm much better off now than I was then.

Jeanne Morningstar

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons
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 by: Amabel Holland - Tue, 21 Dec 2021 21:39 UTC

Jeanne, I just wanted to say that I'm so glad you found yourself. It's a wonderful thing, isn't it? Painful, yes, and there's also so much about the "before time" that becomes painfully clear in retrospect. I regret that it took me so long to see myself - especially as, as you and others have pointed out, the clues have been there in my writing all along - but I am so delighted to at long last be comfortable in my own skin.

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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From: pwer...@gmail.com (Drew Nilium)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.creative
Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some
add-ons
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 by: Drew Nilium - Wed, 22 Dec 2021 03:48 UTC

On 12/21/21 3:20 PM, Jeanne Morningstar wrote:
<snip>
> The whole incident with You Know Who was another domino. I definitely reacted
> extremely at the time, but it's pretty clear now why I did. Back then, I didn't
> think the homophobia was something that affected me personally, I was just angry
> because of the sense of injustice.

Yeah, that absolutely scans, dear. <3

> And this was ultimately the last straw that
> led to me leaving the Catholic Church, because I didn't want to be on the same
> side as the bullies.

:> <3

> I had
> really invested a lot in LNH, using that to recover from everything I'd been
> through coming into 2012, so having that collapse under me was hard.

Reasonably.

> This was a potentially neat idea but,
> once I had it, I had no idea what to do with it and dropped the whole thing.

Yeah, I know that one. X3; "What do I actually do with this idea" dogged me for
a long time.

> All this helped me figure out
> new ways of writing and being, and in 2014 I'd help synthesize a new take on the
> LNH based on that in my parts of Just Another Cascade.
>
> But that's a story for another post.

Heck yes. :> JAC feels very much like the follow-up to this. Uh, even tho this
was finally released during JAC. X3;

> For now, I'll just say that even with everything that's going on in 2021, I'm
> much better off now than I was then.

Same. <3

Drew "pretty happy" Nilium

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some
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 by: Drew Nilium - Wed, 22 Dec 2021 03:49 UTC

On 12/21/21 4:39 PM, Amabel Holland wrote:
> I regret that it took me so long to see myself - especially as, as you and others have pointed
> out, the clues have been there in my writing all along - but I am so delighted to at long last be
> comfortable in my own skin.

And I'm glad you are too! :D <3 <3 <3

Drew "happiness radiates!!" Nilium

Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some add-ons

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From: mrfantas...@gmail.com (Jeanne Morningstar)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.comics.creative
Subject: Re: LNH: Classic LNH Adventures #226: LNH vII #51, 52, and some
add-ons
Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2021 21:28:07 -0000 (UTC)
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X-Original-Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2021 15:27:08 -0600
 by: Jeanne Morningstar - Wed, 22 Dec 2021 21:28 UTC

On 12/21/21 3:39 PM, Amabel Holland wrote:
> Jeanne, I just wanted to say that I'm so glad you found yourself. It's a wonderful thing, isn't it? Painful, yes, and there's also so much about the "before time" that becomes painfully clear in retrospect. I regret that it took me so long to see myself - especially as, as you and others have pointed out, the clues have been there in my writing all along - but I am so delighted to at long last be comfortable in my own skin.

That's good to hear. The way that we've variously evolved and grown as
people, in terms of gender and otherwise, and worked through that in our
writing is one of the things I really love about RACC/LNH.

Jeanne Morningstar

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