On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
<williamgwilliams@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
>> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
>> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
>> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
>> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
>> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
>> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
>> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
>> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
>> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
>> > > > > > like a baby.
>> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
>> > > > > > r
>> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
>> > > > > > wrote:
>> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
>> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
>> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
>> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
>> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
>> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
>> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
>> > > > >
>> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
>> > > > >
>> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
>> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
>> > > >
>> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
>> > > Hi Willie,
>> > >
>> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
>> > >
>> > > Marc
>> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
>moderated version of the group.
>> >
>> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
>> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
>So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
>
>I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.

Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
recording techniques.

On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
> On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail.com wrote:
> >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> >> > > > > > like a baby.
> >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> >> > > > > > r
> >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
> >> > > > > > wrote:
> >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened.. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> >> > > Hi Willie,
> >> > >
> >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through.. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> >> > >
> >> > > Marc
> >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> >moderated version of the group.
> >> >
> >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> >
> >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> recording techniques.
Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:

On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:37:36 AM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
> > On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> > <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail.com wrote:
> > >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > >> > > > > > r
> > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail..com>
> > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music..beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Marc
> > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > >moderated version of the group.
> > >> >
> > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > >
> > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > recording techniques.
> Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
>
> "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> as was 'Something'
>
> I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
>
> The piccolo trumpet story was great"
Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.

On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:07:30 AM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:37:36 AM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
> > > On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> > > <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail.com wrote:
> > > >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > > >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel....@gmail.com wrote:
> > > >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > >> > > > > > r
> > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
> > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> > > >> > > > >
> > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again....
> > > >> > > > >
> > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > >> > > > >
> > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > Marc
> > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > >
> > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > recording techniques.
> > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> >
> > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > as was 'Something'
> >
> > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> >
> > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
>
> I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
>
> One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."

On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 12:36:39 PM UTC-6, Pamela Brown wrote:
> On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:07:30 AM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:37:36 AM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
> > > > On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> > > > <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > > > >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel....@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> > > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > > >> > > > > > r
> > > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
> > > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite.. The edgy one.
> > > > >> > > > >
> > > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again....
> > > > >> > > > >
> > > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > > >> > > > >
> > > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> > > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > > >> > > >
> > > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > > >> > >
> > > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > > >> > >
> > > > >> > > Marc
> > > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > > >> >
> > > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> > > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series.. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K.. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > > >
> > > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > > recording techniques.
> > > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> > >
> > > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > > as was 'Something'
> > >
> > > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> > >
> > > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> > Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young.. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
> >
> > I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
> >
> > One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."
> This has become a fascinating thread. Thank you.
>
> I have just begun making a fool of myself on rmb, as I want to nail down the setlist of the last luncheon show from the Cavern Club which I watched on TV from Edinburgh. That was in Feb, 1963.
>
> My next release is un hommage to John called Imagined. It drops on New Year's Eve. I'll give you the link when it does...
rmb Cavern Club setlist post link:
https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/jfZYW2x7kDs

On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 1:39:14 PM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 12:36:39 PM UTC-6, Pamela Brown wrote:
> > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:07:30 AM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:37:36 AM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
> > > > > On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> > > > > <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail..com wrote:
> > > > > >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > > > > >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> > > > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > > > >> > > > > > r
> > > > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
> > > > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> > > > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec..music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> > > Marc
> > > > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> > > > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > > > >
> > > > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > > > recording techniques.
> > > > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> > > >
> > > > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > > > as was 'Something'
> > > >
> > > > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > > > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > > > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > > > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> > > >
> > > > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> > > Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
> > >
> > > I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
> > >
> > > One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."
> > This has become a fascinating thread. Thank you.
> >
> > I have just begun making a fool of myself on rmb, as I want to nail down the setlist of the last luncheon show from the Cavern Club which I watched on TV from Edinburgh. That was in Feb, 1963.
> >
> > My next release is un hommage to John called Imagined. It drops on New Year's Eve. I'll give you the link when it does...
> rmb Cavern Club setlist post link:
> https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/jfZYW2x7kDs
Did you see that they have a video from the show up there (though you have to click the "Watch on Facebook" link to see it)?

On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 4:59:22 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 1:39:14 PM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 12:36:39 PM UTC-6, Pamela Brown wrote:
> > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:07:30 AM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:37:36 AM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
> > > > > > On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> > > > > > <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > > > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > > > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > > > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > > > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > > > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > > > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > > > > >> > > > > > r
> > > > > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan....@gmail.com>
> > > > > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > > > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it.. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard....
> > > > > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > > > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > >> > > Marc
> > > > > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > > > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > > > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> > > > > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > > > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > > > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > > > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > > > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > > > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > > > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > > > > recording techniques.
> > > > > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> > > > >
> > > > > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > > > > as was 'Something'
> > > > >
> > > > > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > > > > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > > > > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > > > > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> > > > >
> > > > > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> > > > Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
> > > >
> > > > I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
> > > >
> > > > One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."
> > > This has become a fascinating thread. Thank you.
> > >
> > > I have just begun making a fool of myself on rmb, as I want to nail down the setlist of the last luncheon show from the Cavern Club which I watched on TV from Edinburgh. That was in Feb, 1963.
> > >
> > > My next release is un hommage to John called Imagined. It drops on New Year's Eve. I'll give you the link when it does...
> > rmb Cavern Club setlist post link:
> > https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/jfZYW2x7kDs
> Did you see that they have a video from the show up there (though you have to click the "Watch on Facebook" link to see it)?
Well, probably a different show, since I think that one is in 1962, while yours was Feb. '63.

On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 4:04:55 PM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 4:59:22 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 1:39:14 PM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 12:36:39 PM UTC-6, Pamela Brown wrote:
> > > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:07:30 AM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > > > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:37:36 AM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
> > > > > > > On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> > > > > > > <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > > >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > r
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > > > > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening.. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> > > > > > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > > > > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > >> > > Marc
> > > > > > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > > > > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > > > > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time..
> > > > > > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > > > > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > > > > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > > > > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > > > > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > > > > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > > > > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > > > > > recording techniques.
> > > > > > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > > > > > as was 'Something'
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > > > > > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > > > > > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > > > > > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> > > > > Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
> > > > >
> > > > > I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
> > > > >
> > > > > One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."
> > > > This has become a fascinating thread. Thank you.
> > > >
> > > > I have just begun making a fool of myself on rmb, as I want to nail down the setlist of the last luncheon show from the Cavern Club which I watched on TV from Edinburgh. That was in Feb, 1963.
> > > >
> > > > My next release is un hommage to John called Imagined. It drops on New Year's Eve. I'll give you the link when it does...
> > > rmb Cavern Club setlist post link:
> > > https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/jfZYW2x7kDs
> > Did you see that they have a video from the show up there (though you have to click the "Watch on Facebook" link to see it)?
> Well, probably a different show, since I think that one is in 1962, while yours was Feb. '63.
No setlist confirmations yet, but this is the show...
https://www.beatlesbible.com/1963/02/04/live-cavern-club-liverpool-277/

On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 2:36:30 PM UTC-6, Just Kidding wrote:
> On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail.com wrote:
> >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> >> > > > > > like a baby.
> >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> >> > > > > > r
> >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
> >> > > > > > wrote:
> >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened.. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> >> > > Hi Willie,
> >> > >
> >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through.. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> >> > >
> >> > > Marc
> >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> >moderated version of the group.
> >> >
> >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> >
> >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> recording techniques.
I just watched the trailer for this. It looks incredible. I may watch this before Get Back...

On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 12:36:39 PM UTC-6, Pamela Brown wrote:
> On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:07:30 AM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:37:36 AM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
> > > > On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> > > > <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > > > >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel....@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> > > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > > >> > > > > > r
> > > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
> > > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite.. The edgy one.
> > > > >> > > > >
> > > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again....
> > > > >> > > > >
> > > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > > >> > > > >
> > > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> > > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > > >> > > >
> > > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > > >> > >
> > > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > > >> > >
> > > > >> > > Marc
> > > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > > >> >
> > > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> > > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series.. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K.. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > > >
> > > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > > recording techniques.
> > > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> > >
> > > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > > as was 'Something'
> > >
> > > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> > >
> > > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> > Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young.. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
> >
> > I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
> >
> > One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."
> This has become a fascinating thread. Thank you.
>
> I have just begun making a fool of myself on rmb, as I want to nail down the setlist of the last luncheon show from the Cavern Club which I watched on TV from Edinburgh. That was in Feb, 1963.
>
> My next release is un hommage to John called Imagined. It drops on New Year's Eve. I'll give you the link when it does...

On Friday, December 31, 2021 at 1:56:58 PM UTC-6, Pamela Brown wrote:
> On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 12:36:39 PM UTC-6, Pamela Brown wrote:
> > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:07:30 AM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:37:36 AM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
> > > > > On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> > > > > <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail..com wrote:
> > > > > >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > > > > >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> > > > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > > > >> > > > > > r
> > > > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
> > > > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> > > > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec..music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> > > Marc
> > > > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> > > > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > > > >
> > > > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > > > recording techniques.
> > > > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> > > >
> > > > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > > > as was 'Something'
> > > >
> > > > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > > > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > > > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > > > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> > > >
> > > > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> > > Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
> > >
> > > I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
> > >
> > > One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."
> > This has become a fascinating thread. Thank you.
> >
> > I have just begun making a fool of myself on rmb, as I want to nail down the setlist of the last luncheon show from the Cavern Club which I watched on TV from Edinburgh. That was in Feb, 1963.
> >
> > My next release is un hommage to John called Imagined. It drops on New Year's Eve. I'll give you the link when it does...
> Imagined is live...
> https://music.apple.com/us/album/1602127134
Release post...
https://theothermozart.wordpress.com/2022/01/01/imagined-un-hommage-to-john-lennon/

On Friday, December 31, 2021 at 11:10:09 PM UTC-5, Pamela Brown wrote:
> > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:07:30 AM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:37:36 AM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
>
> > > > > > >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
>
> > > > > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > > > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > > > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > > > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > > > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > > > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > > > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > > > > >> > > > > > r
> > > > > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan....@gmail.com>
> > > > > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > > > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it.. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard....
> > > > > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > > > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > >> > > Marc
> > > > > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > > > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > > > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> > > > > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > > > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > > > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > > > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > > > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > > > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > > > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > > > > recording techniques.
> > > > > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> > > > >
> > > > > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > > > > as was 'Something'
> > > > >
> > > > > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > > > > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > > > > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > > > > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> > > > >
> > > > > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> > > > Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
> > > >
> > > > I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
> > > >
> > > > One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."
> > > This has become a fascinating thread. Thank you.
> > >
> > > I have just begun making a fool of myself on rmb, as I want to nail down the setlist of the last luncheon show from the Cavern Club which I watched on TV from Edinburgh. That was in Feb, 1963.
> > >
> > > My next release is un hommage to John called Imagined. It drops on New Year's Eve. I'll give you the link when it does...
> > Imagined is live...
> > https://music.apple.com/us/album/1602127134
> Release post...
> https://theothermozart.wordpress.com/2022/01/01/imagined-un-hommage-to-john-lennon/

On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 3:59:22 PM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 1:39:14 PM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 12:36:39 PM UTC-6, Pamela Brown wrote:
> > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:07:30 AM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:37:36 AM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
> > > > > > On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> > > > > > <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, marc....@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > > > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > > > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > > > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > > > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > > > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > > > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > > > > >> > > > > > r
> > > > > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan....@gmail.com>
> > > > > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > > > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > > > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it.. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard....
> > > > > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > > > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > >> > > Marc
> > > > > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > > > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > > > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> > > > > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > > > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > > > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > > > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > > > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > > > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > > > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > > > > recording techniques.
> > > > > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> > > > >
> > > > > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > > > > as was 'Something'
> > > > >
> > > > > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > > > > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > > > > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > > > > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> > > > >
> > > > > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> > > > Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
> > > >
> > > > I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
> > > >
> > > > One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."
> > > This has become a fascinating thread. Thank you.
> > >
> > > I have just begun making a fool of myself on rmb, as I want to nail down the setlist of the last luncheon show from the Cavern Club which I watched on TV from Edinburgh. That was in Feb, 1963.
> > >
> > > My next release is un hommage to John called Imagined. It drops on New Year's Eve. I'll give you the link when it does...
> > rmb Cavern Club setlist post link:
> > https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/jfZYW2x7kDs
> Did you see that they have a video from the show up there (though you have to click the "Watch on Facebook" link to see it)?

On Saturday, January 8, 2022 at 12:23:20 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 3:59:22 PM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 1:39:14 PM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 12:36:39 PM UTC-6, Pamela Brown wrote:
> > > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:07:30 AM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > > > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:37:36 AM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
> > > > > > > On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> > > > > > > <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > > > > > > >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > r
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > > > > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening.. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> > > > > > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > > > > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > >> > > Marc
> > > > > > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > > > > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > > > > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time..
> > > > > > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > > > > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > > > > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > > > > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > > > > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > > > > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > > > > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > > > > > recording techniques.
> > > > > > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > > > > > as was 'Something'
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > > > > > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > > > > > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > > > > > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> > > > > Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
> > > > >
> > > > > I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
> > > > >
> > > > > One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."
> > > > This has become a fascinating thread. Thank you.
> > > >
> > > > I have just begun making a fool of myself on rmb, as I want to nail down the setlist of the last luncheon show from the Cavern Club which I watched on TV from Edinburgh. That was in Feb, 1963.
> > > >
> > > > My next release is un hommage to John called Imagined. It drops on New Year's Eve. I'll give you the link when it does...
> > > rmb Cavern Club setlist post link:
> > > https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/jfZYW2x7kDs
> > Did you see that they have a video from the show up there (though you have to click the "Watch on Facebook" link to see it)?
> I'm still wading in slowly, but this I could not resist...
> https://tickets.imax.com/country/united-states

On Sunday, January 9, 2022 at 3:18:31 PM UTC-6, marc....@gmail.com wrote:
> On Saturday, January 8, 2022 at 12:23:20 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 3:59:22 PM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 1:39:14 PM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 12:36:39 PM UTC-6, Pamela Brown wrote:
> > > > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:07:30 AM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 10:37:36 AM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 at 3:36:30 PM UTC-5, Just Kidding wrote:
> > > > > > > > On Fri, 24 Dec 2021 18:19:47 -0800 (PST), Willie
> > > > > > > > <williamg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 8:17:36 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > > > > > > > >> On Friday, December 24, 2021 at 6:34:25 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > > > >> > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 10:39:18 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > > > > > > > >> > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 4:38:16 PM UTC-5, Willie wrote:
> > > > > > > > >> > > > On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 11:03:40 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > On Tuesday, December 20, 2005 at 11:06:17 AM UTC-6, roberta wrote:
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > r
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> > > > > > > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > > > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > > > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > > > > > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > > >> > > Marc
> > > > > > > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > > > > > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > > > > > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> > > > > > > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > > > > > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > > > > > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > > > > > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > > > > > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > > > > > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > > > > > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > > > > > > recording techniques.
> > > > > > > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > > > > > > as was 'Something'
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > > > > > > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > > > > > > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > > > > > > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> > > > > > Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs.. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."
> > > > > This has become a fascinating thread. Thank you.
> > > > >
> > > > > I have just begun making a fool of myself on rmb, as I want to nail down the setlist of the last luncheon show from the Cavern Club which I watched on TV from Edinburgh. That was in Feb, 1963.
> > > > >
> > > > > My next release is un hommage to John called Imagined. It drops on New Year's Eve. I'll give you the link when it does...
> > > > rmb Cavern Club setlist post link:
> > > > https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/jfZYW2x7kDs
> > > Did you see that they have a video from the show up there (though you have to click the "Watch on Facebook" link to see it)?
> > I'm still wading in slowly, but this I could not resist...
> > https://tickets.imax.com/country/united-states
> I would love to see the IMAX version of the Rooftop Concert, but alas...no IMAX theater near me.

On Saturday, January 8, 2022 at 12:23:20 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 3:59:22 PM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 1:39:14 PM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > r
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > > > > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening.. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> > > > > > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > > > > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > >> > > Marc
> > > > > > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > > > > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > > > > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time..
> > > > > > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > > > > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > > > > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > > > > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > > > > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > > > > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > > > > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > > > > > recording techniques.
> > > > > > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > > > > > as was 'Something'
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > > > > > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > > > > > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > > > > > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> > > > > Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
> > > > >
> > > > > I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
> > > > >
> > > > > One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."
> > > > This has become a fascinating thread. Thank you.
> > > >
> > > > I have just begun making a fool of myself on rmb, as I want to nail down the setlist of the last luncheon show from the Cavern Club which I watched on TV from Edinburgh. That was in Feb, 1963.
> > > >
> > > > My next release is un hommage to John called Imagined. It drops on New Year's Eve. I'll give you the link when it does...
> > > rmb Cavern Club setlist post link:
> > > https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/jfZYW2x7kDs
> > Did you see that they have a video from the show up there (though you have to click the "Watch on Facebook" link to see it)?
> I'm still wading in slowly, but this I could not resist...
> https://tickets.imax.com/country/united-states

On Thursday, January 13, 2022 at 6:36:16 PM UTC-6, Zod wrote:
> On Saturday, January 8, 2022 at 12:23:20 AM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 3:59:22 PM UTC-6, Willie wrote:
> > > On Monday, December 27, 2021 at 1:39:14 PM UTC-5, pamel...@gmail.com wrote:
> >
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > Not being a Beatles fan, I was surprised by my own reaction.
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > I woke up on the morning of December 8, 1980 and flipped on the TV
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > news as I always do. When I heard what had happened, I sat transfixed
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > on the end of the bed and cried. My girlfriend came over and without
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > saying a word, put her arm around me and hugged me close, rocking me
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > like a baby.
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > I'll never forget it.
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > r
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > On 8 Dec 2005 11:50:14 -0800, "Dylanstubs" <dylan...@gmail.com>
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >I think I was in 8th grade, and at the time frankly it didn't mean
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >anything to me whatsoever. It wasn't until years later,
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >post-psychedelics, that the enormous weight of that event hit me during
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >one of the anniversaries of his murder. Here's a guy just living his
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >life that was killed simply because some psycho decided he needed to
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > >shoot him. What a motherfucking waste.
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > I have been a lifelong Beatles fan. John was my favorite. The edgy one.
> > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > I first saw them on TV from Edinburgh...it was their last luncheon show at the Cavern Club. "Where did those chords come from?" I think was my first reaction. I knew rock music would never be the same again...
> > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > I was also in Edinburgh, walking up Arthur's Seat with a friend, when I heard Hey Jude for the first time. I sensed the end of the Beatles was near...
> > > > > > > > >> > > > >
> > > > > > > > >> > > > > When I heard the news about John's death I went into a state of shock that lasted almost a week. On my next trip to NYC I went to the Dakota and talked with a garage attendant who had been there when it. happened. He walked me through the events of that afternoon and evening. He pointed out their apartment and saw Yoko's car in the private courtyard...
> > > > > > > > >> > > > Hi Pamela. Do you frequent rec.music.beatles? I don't, unless some Beatles question occurs to me every few years. I just finished the "Get Back" series and found John most delightful. Impish, unsurprisingly clever, and a veritable fountain of musical ideas. One annoyance I had with "Get Back" was how, of the well over a hundred songs they started in it, NOT ONE was played to completion until they got to the roof. (And then, they played several songs repeatedly). I wish they had played the Drifters' "Up on the Roof," though I know they were doing the album. (Not sure if they have ever done "Up on the Roof" (gotta check out my Anthology albums. Googling that is hopeless, as all the hits are for the rooftop concert).
> > > > > > > > >> > > >
> > > > > > > > >> > > > Anyway, here's a link to a thread at rec.music.beatles where a learned fellow analyzes many of Lennon's musical contributions to the group's oeuvre, and his conclusion that John was a terrific musician, I think, is born out by the "Get Back" series: https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/Z2kOvv1amZk
> > > > > > > > >> > > Hi Willie,
> > > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > > >> > > I think the reason they didn't show some of the songs to completion was that the rehearsals were long, and would have been too repetitious. And, perhaps, those snippets were the best in the dozens of hours of film. I am loving this great, almost 8 hr, docu-series for the second time through. In fact, I am getting more from it the second time around than I did during the first viewing. I come away with the sense that these guys were dedicated, hard-working musicians. When the red "record" light came on, the fooling around ceased. I truly appreciate what they were going through in January 1969. They had just released the double-album "The Beatles" only two months earlier. It was a studio album with over dubs, recording separate tracks etc. And then they found themselves recording all new songs, LIVE, no studio tricks and so on. what a change. As you know, I've been a fan since 1964. The Beatles, over 50 years since their break-up, continue to impress me.
> > > > > > > > >> > >
> > > > > > > > >> > > Marc
> > > > > > > > >> > Doh! I thought, They released a double-album in '68 called "The Beatles"? I then learned, which I'm not sure I had ever apprecieated, that the "White Album" is actually "The Beatles." Weird, I thought, wasn't their first album called "The Beatles"? Then I checked and see their first album was called "Please Please Me." That, of course, was the English release. I checked my vinyl and see my first was called "Meet the Beatles" and says on the cover "The First Album by England's Phenomenal Pop Combo." It didn't even have "Please Please Me" on it. In fact, "Please Please Me" wasn't released here until the 1965 "The Early Beatles" album (which I never bought; wasn't even aware of it even though its cover looks SO familiar). (I would never post this to the Beatles group, lest I be ridiculed, though there seem to be moderated and unmoderated versions of rec.music.beatles). I wonder if they solved the problem RMD had (when everyone left for Expecting Rain or other places) by making a
> > > > > > > > >moderated version of the group.
> > > > > > > > >> >
> > > > > > > > >> > Here's the U.S. discography: https://www.beatlesbible.com/discography/united-states-of-america/
> > > > > > > > >> There was also a moderated version of rec.music.beatles many years ago, but the moderators closed shop , and the "regular" RMB continued as it always had. I last posted in RMB around 2017. It had become such a former shell of its great days with so many trolls and so much fighting that I decided it just wasn't worth it. And I discovered there were so many great Beatles groups on Facebook that I no longer needed the drama. I look at RMB every now and then, but it is quite disappointing to view how it has become the haven for gossip, quoting questionable books about The Beatles and Lennon, and sadly, people still bashing Yoko...yes, after all this time.
> > > > > > > > >So it sounds like RMB suffered the same fate as RMD (trolls drove people off). But from my quick trips over there, it seems pretty vibrant to me. That post by "paramucho" critiquing Lennon's musicianship was excellent. But I was surprised that it wasn't all abuzz about the "Get Back" series. I notice that Google reports it as having 183709 threads, compared to our 166981, so not much difference. But I don't know how far that goes back. K. could sleuth that out. It's interesting that the Beatles, who broke up so long ago, could have as active an Internet following as Bob, who I believe is still performing. Maybe it's just a resurgence because "Get Back" came out, and RMB had its quiet years too. I see Bruce (aka Bloomfield Buddy, among other monikers) is quite active on RMB, lambasting people for listening to White musicians. (I like Bruce a lot, and miss him.)
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >I didn't know what to make of Yoko in "Get Back." She hardly spoke (audibly) , but did seem (a strange) part of the family, though there were a few times when it seemed Paul hinted at exasperation about her. And I couldn't tell how comfortable she felt there. I'll be interested to learn what you think, Pamela.
> > > > > > > > Unless I missed it, doesn't seem like there's been any discussion of
> > > > > > > > the Hulu series "McCartney 3,2,1" which I thought was terrific. It's 6
> > > > > > > > half-hour episodes of Paul and the producer Rick Rubin hanging out in
> > > > > > > > a makeshift studio talking about a variety of Beatles related stuff in
> > > > > > > > a very informal, unscripted way. Some really fascinating info from
> > > > > > > > Paul about his (and John's) songwriting methods and the band's
> > > > > > > > recording techniques.
> > > > > > > Thank you, JK! I had not even heard of it. We watched (and enjoyed) the first episode last night. Yeah, not much about it (at least, that I find) at RMB. A few threads. One of them had these three intriguing comments, which I'm looking forward to in the series:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > "The deep dive into 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps' was awesome
> > > > > > > as was 'Something'
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I don't think I knew about the Chuck Berry/Come Together connection
> > > > > > > and that was a cool discussion of changing the groove to fix that
> > > > > > > sort of possible conflict. Wonder if George was thinking about
> > > > > > > that with 'My Sweet Lord'?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The piccolo trumpet story was great"
> > > > > > Also, I found Paul's comments in episode 1 about how his family life had been so loving and gentle, while John's had been tumultuous very interesting. I've not read much biographical material about The Beatles, and didn't know that (as Paul says) John's father was out of the picture (until John became rich and famous) and that his mother had died when he was very young. I've since discovered that this isn't quite accurate: His father, a merchant seaman of Irish descent, even tried to take him to New Zealand when he was six (glad that didn't work out) and his mother died (hit by a car) when he was 18.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I also didn't realize that John was a couple of years older than Paul, and Paul really looked up to him as the cool dude. It's certainly evident, I think, from both episode 1 of McCartney 3,2,1 and the Get Back series that those two loved each other dearly, despite the feelings toward the end. And that Paul really admired John's creativity and work ethic. He says, 3,2,1 that he would come up with an idea, and John would find ingenious extensions of the idea.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > One thing I was surprised by in the Get Back series was how little credit was given to George Martin. In 3,2,1 episode 1, Paul tells Rick Rubin, when describing their harmonies, that Martin guided those. (He even shows how Martin would go to the piano and pick out the harmonic line for each of them.) Oh, I didn't know, or have forgotten, that Martin died in 2016. From Martin's Wikipedia page, I just learned that Decca turned down The Beatles just before EMI Parlophone signed them. Loved this from that entry: "As 'Love Me Do' peaked at number 17 in the British charts, on 26 November 1962 Martin recorded 'Please Please Me', which he did only after Lennon and McCartney had almost begged him to record another of their original songs.. Martin's crucial contribution to the song was to tell them to speed up what was initially a slow ballad. After the recording Martin looked over the mixing desk and said, 'Gentlemen, you have just made your first number one record'."
> > > > > This has become a fascinating thread. Thank you.
> > > > >
> > > > > I have just begun making a fool of myself on rmb, as I want to nail down the setlist of the last luncheon show from the Cavern Club which I watched on TV from Edinburgh. That was in Feb, 1963.
> > > > >
> > > > > My next release is un hommage to John called Imagined. It drops on New Year's Eve. I'll give you the link when it does...
> > > > rmb Cavern Club setlist post link:
> > > > https://groups.google.com/g/rec.music.beatles/c/jfZYW2x7kDs
> > > Did you see that they have a video from the show up there (though you have to click the "Watch on Facebook" link to see it)?
> > I'm still wading in slowly, but this I could not resist...
> > https://tickets.imax.com/country/united-states
> Be careful out there...
What should I beware of more -- the intense cold, the Dylinquents, or the Beatlemaniacs? :-)