Will Dockery wrote:

> On Friday, December 22, 2017 at 9:18:47 AM UTC-5, ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>> as pathological

> Ignorant idiots...

Exactly...!

ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>
> as pathological

As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

Will Dockery wrote:

> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>>
>> as pathological

> As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

sad but true...!

General-Zod wrote:

>
> On Friday, December 22, 2017 at 9:18:47 AM UTC-5, ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>> as pathological

>
> Ignorant idiots...
>
> Exactly...!

Poetry is in decline, anyone can see that.

On Thursday, June 2, 2022 at 11:15:15 PM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
> General-Zod wrote:
>
> >
> > On Friday, December 22, 2017 at 9:18:47 AM UTC-5, ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>>
> >>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
> >>> as pathological
>
> >
> > Ignorant idiots...
> >
> > Exactly...!
> Poetry is in decline, anyone can see that.

In decline from what? In decline from when?

When over the course of the past 50 years, has poetry been a major artistic, cultural, literary, or popular force?

-- Michael Pendragon
Die Stink, die.
Stop stinking up the place
Cover your ugly face
With sod so foul that only brambles dare
Take root atop its filth. Your grizzled hair
Long home to ticks and fleas
Shall be the straw where graveworms make their bed;
The earth repels you like some rank disease
The sun shines brighter knowing that you're dead
And songbird choirs echo "Die Stink, die."

Will Dockery wrote:

> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>>
>> as pathological

> As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

Good thing that Hip Hop and Rap poetry are thriving now....

Rocky Stoneberg wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:

>> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>>>
>>> as pathological

>> As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

> Good thing that Hip Hop and Rap poetry are thriving now....

Part of the big changes in poetry of the 1980s and 1990s.

🙂

Will Dockery wrote:

> Rocky Stoneberg wrote:

>> Will Dockery wrote:

>>> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>>>>
>>>> as pathological

>>> As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

>> Good thing that Hip Hop and Rap poetry are thriving now....

> Part of the big changes in poetry of the 1980s and 1990s.

> 🙂

Indeed so...!

General-Zod wrote:

> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>> as pathological

>> Ignorant idiots... Exactly...!

Yes, Ilya nailed it.

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 4:25:17 PM UTC-4, Zod wrote:
> Will Dockery wrote:
>
> > On Friday, December 22, 2017 at 9:18:47 AM UTC-5, ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>
> >> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
> >> as pathological
>
> > Ignorant idiots...
> Exactly...!

Unfortunately.

Michael Pendragon wrote:

>
> When over the course of the past 50 years, has poetry been a major artistic, cultural, literary, or popular force?

Hip Hop, rap and spoken word slam poetry, for starters.

On Saturday, June 25, 2022 at 5:40:20 PM UTC-4, Rocky Stoneberg wrote:
> Will Dockery wrote:
>
> > On Monday, June 20, 2022 at 5:20:18 PM UTC-4, Rocky Stoneberg wrote:
> >> Michael Pendragon wrote:
> >>
> >> > On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 12:43:20 PM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> You've yet to show any pedophile imagery in the poem, Pendragon.
> >>
> >> > Why does the speaker address his sexual partner as "Master,"
> >> Look it up........:
> >>
> >> ***********************************************************************
> >>
> >> https://www.beatdom.com/many-loves/

"Neal Cassady often took on a larger than life persona in much of the Beat literature. ‘Please Master’ is one of the most graphically written works by Ginsberg about his relationship with Neal Cassady. Ginsberg portrays sadomasochistic sexuality precisely as a symbolic relationship, with language, too, that is ironic in its erotic affirmation of the master’s dominance and slave’s submission. In ‘Please Master’ Cassady seems self-evidently the controlling master having his way with a submissive Ginsberg. However a closer reading of the poem dramatizes sexual activity that, of course, would not occur without the person in the slave subject position initiating intercourse..."

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

For those who missed this the first time, such as Michael Pendragon.

HTH and HAND.

Will Dockery wrote:
> On Monday, June 20, 2022 at 5:20:18 PM UTC-4, Rocky Stoneberg wrote:
>> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>> > On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 12:43:20 PM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
>
>> >> >> You've yet to show any pedophile imagery in the poem, Pendragon.
>> >>
>> >> > Why does the speaker address his sexual partner as "Master,"
>> >> Look it up........:
>> >>
>> >> ***********************************************************************
>> >>
>> >> https://www.beatdom.com/many-loves/

> "Neal Cassady often took on a larger than life persona in much of the Beat literature. ‘Please Master’ is one of the most graphically written works by Ginsberg about his relationship with Neal Cassady. Ginsberg portrays sadomasochistic sexuality precisely as a symbolic relationship, with language, too, that is ironic in its erotic affirmation of the master’s dominance and slave’s submission. In ‘Please Master’ Cassady seems self-evidently the controlling master having his way with a submissive Ginsberg. However a closer reading of the poem dramatizes sexual activity that, of course, would not occur without the person in the slave subject position initiating intercourse..."

> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

> For those who missed this the first time, such as Michael Pendragon.

> HTH and HAND.

Yep... the final word I suspect......

Victor H. wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:
>> On Monday, June 20, 2022 at 5:20:18 PM UTC-4, Rocky Stoneberg wrote:
>>> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>>> > On Wednesday, June 1, 2022 at 12:43:20 PM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
>
>>> >> >> You've yet to show any pedophile imagery in the poem, Pendragon.
>>> >>
>>> >> > Why does the speaker address his sexual partner as "Master,"
>>> >> Look it up........:
>>> >>
>>> >> ***********************************************************************
>>> >>
>>> >> https://www.beatdom.com/many-loves/

>> "Neal Cassady often took on a larger than life persona in much of the Beat literature. ‘Please Master’ is one of the most graphically written works by Ginsberg about his relationship with Neal Cassady. Ginsberg portrays sadomasochistic sexuality precisely as a symbolic relationship, with language, too, that is ironic in its erotic affirmation of the master’s dominance and slave’s submission. In ‘Please Master’ Cassady seems self-evidently the controlling master having his way with a submissive Ginsberg. However a closer reading of the poem dramatizes sexual activity that, of course, would not occur without the person in the slave subject position initiating intercourse..."

>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
> Yep... the final word I suspect......

Yes, it's generally agreed by most Allen Ginsberg readers that the poem was written for a grown man, Neal Cassady.

Victor H. wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:
>> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>>>>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>>>>>
>>>>> as pathological

>>>> As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

>>> Good thing that Hip Hop and Rap poetry are thriving now....

>> Part of the big changes in poetry of the 1980s and 1990s.

>>

> Indeed so...!

As has been well established here by now.

Will Dockery wrote:

> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>>
>> as pathological

> As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

Sadly enough...

Zod wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:
>> Zod wrote:
>>> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>>> > Will Dockery wrote:
>>
>>> >> >> You've yet to show any pedophile imagery in the poem, Pendragon.
>>> >>
>>> >> > Why does the speaker address his sexual partner as "Master,"
>>> >> Look it up........:
>>> >>
>>> >> ***********************************************************************
>>> >>
>>> >> https://www.beatdom.com/many-loves/

>> "Neal Cassady often took on a larger than life persona in much of the Beat literature. ‘Please Master’ is one of the most graphically written works by Ginsberg about his relationship with Neal Cassady. Ginsberg portrays sadomasochistic sexuality precisely as a symbolic relationship, with language, too, that is ironic in its erotic affirmation of the master’s dominance and slave’s submission. In ‘Please Master’ Cassady seems self-evidently the controlling master having his way with a submissive Ginsberg. However a closer reading of the poem dramatizes sexual activity that, of course, would not occur without the person in the slave subject position initiating intercourse..."

>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

>> For those who missed this the first time, such as Michael Pendragon.

>> HTH and HAND.

> Yep... the final word I suspect......

I think it finally is.

🙂

General-Zod wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:

>> On Friday, December 22, 2017 at 9:18:47 AM UTC-5, ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>> as pathological

>> Ignorant idiots...

> Exactly...!

And so it goes.

🙂

Zod wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:

>> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>>>
>>> as pathological

>> As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

> Good thing that Hip Hop and Rap poetry are thriving now....

Although Pendragon didn't seem to notice.

🙂

Will Dockery wrote:

> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>>
>> as pathological

> As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

Sadly true....

General-Zod wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:

>> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>>>
>>> as pathological

>> As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

> Sadly true....

Really, Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry are what's keeping poetry alive in modern times.

And so it goes.

General-Zod wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:

>> On Friday, December 22, 2017 at 9:18:47 AM UTC-5, ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>> as pathological

>> Ignorant idiots...

> Exactly...!

Although the previously discussed Drake is reviving interest among younger readers.

Zod wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:

>> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>>>
>>> as pathological

>> As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

> Good thing that Hip Hop and Rap poetry are thriving now....

Definitely has helped resurrect poetry.

Will Dockery wrote:

> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>>
>> as pathological

> As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

Yet spoken word poetry is actually thriving and up and coming...

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=spoken+word+poetry+

Zod wrote:
> Will Dockery wrote:

>> ibsh...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>> There are many people who have no value for poetry, even some who see it
>>>>
>>> as pathological

>> As poetry drifts in obscurity in these modern times.

> Yet spoken word poetry is actually thriving and up and coming...

> https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=spoken+word+poetry+

True, and obvious to those who are paying attention, as I've said.

HTH and HAND.