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arts / rec.music.classical.guitar / Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat vii” Chord

SubjectAuthor
* Neapolitan-6 Chord and Tritone SubstitutionMatt Faunce
`* Neapolitan-6 Chord or “FlatMatt Faunce
 `* Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “FlatMatt Faunce
  `* Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “FlatMatt Faunce
   `* Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “FlatMatt Faunce
    `* Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “FlatMatt Faunce
     `- Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “FlatMatt Faunce

1
Neapolitan-6 Chord and Tritone Substitution

<sf9ao0$di4$1@dont-email.me>

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From: mattfau...@gmail.com (Matt Faunce)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical.guitar
Subject: Neapolitan-6 Chord and Tritone Substitution
Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2021 20:57:36 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Matt Faunce - Sat, 14 Aug 2021 20:57 UTC

Compare and contrast the Neapolitan-6 chord and the tritone substitution.

I came to think of the N6 as a iv (minor four-chord) with a sharped 5th
tone in root position. So, in my way of thinking of it, the N6 in the key
of C major is spelled (bass to treble) F Ab C#.

I think of the tritone substitution as a V7 chord with a flat 5, flat 9,
and an implied (or dropped) root. So, in the key of C major you have Db F
Ab B.

--
Matt

Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat vii” Chord

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From: mattfau...@gmail.com (Matt Faunce)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical.guitar
Subject: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat
vii” Chord
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 2021 02:55:28 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Matt Faunce - Fri, 22 Oct 2021 02:55 UTC

The Neapolitan-6 chord can precede the tonic chord. In these cases, instead
of the Neapolitan-6 chord I usually prefer to play a minor chord whose root
is the minor seventh above the tonic tone, e.g., in the key of C major,
I’ll play the Bb minor chord then the C major chord. This preserves most of
the feel that I want from the Neapolitan chord but because it has one tone
moving contrary to the others it’s richer than the Neapolitan chord.

However, I prefer the Neapolitan-6 chord when going to the dominant chord,
because this has contrary motion unlike the vii chord, on the “flat
seventh” scale degree, to the V chord.

Here’s a chart.

Richer:

A Neapolitan-6 chord to the V chord *has* contrary motion, e.g., Db major
to G major.

A vii chord, on the “flat seventh” scale degree, to a I chord *has*
contrary motion, e.g., Bb major to C major.

Blander:

A Neapolitan-6 chord to the I chord *does not have* contrary motion , e.g.,
Db major to C major.

A vii chord, on the “flat seventh” scale degree, to the V chord *does not
have* contrary motion, e.g., Bb major to G major.

Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat vii” Chord

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From: mattfau...@gmail.com (Matt Faunce)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical.guitar
Subject: Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat
vii” Chord
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 2021 03:02:09 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Matt Faunce - Fri, 22 Oct 2021 03:02 UTC

***In this post I corrected the chart. I meant Bb minor where I had written
Bb major.***

The Neapolitan-6 chord can precede the tonic chord. In these cases, instead
of the Neapolitan-6 chord I usually prefer to play a minor chord whose root
is the minor seventh above the tonic tone, e.g., in the key of C major,
I’ll play the Bb minor chord then the C major chord. This preserves most of
the feel that I want from the Neapolitan chord but because it has one tone
moving contrary to the others it’s richer than the Neapolitan chord.

However, I prefer the Neapolitan-6 chord when going to the dominant chord,
because this has contrary motion unlike the vii chord, on the “flat
seventh” scale degree, to the V chord.

Here’s a chart.

Richer:

A Neapolitan-6 chord to the V chord *has* contrary motion, e.g., Db major
to G major.

A vii chord, on the “flat seventh” scale degree, to a I chord *has*
contrary motion, e.g., Bb minor to C major.

Blander:

A Neapolitan-6 chord to the I chord *does not have* contrary motion , e.g.,
Db major to C major.

A vii chord, on the “flat seventh” scale degree, to the V chord *does not
have* contrary motion, e.g., Bb minor to G major.

--
Matt

Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat vii” Chord

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From: mattfau...@gmail.com (Matt Faunce)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical.guitar
Subject: Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat
vii” Chord
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 2021 20:10:43 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Matt Faunce - Fri, 22 Oct 2021 20:10 UTC

Matt Faunce <mattfaunce@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> ***In this post I corrected the chart. I meant Bb minor where I had written
> Bb major.***
>
> The Neapolitan-6 chord can precede the tonic chord. In these cases, instead
> of the Neapolitan-6 chord I usually prefer to play a minor chord whose root
> is the minor seventh above the tonic tone, e.g., in the key of C major,
> I’ll play the Bb minor chord then the C major chord. This preserves most of
> the feel that I want from the Neapolitan chord but because it has one tone
> moving contrary to the others it’s richer than the Neapolitan chord.
>
> However, I prefer the Neapolitan-6 chord when going to the dominant chord,
> because this has contrary motion unlike the vii chord, on the “flat
> seventh” scale degree, to the V chord.
>
> Here’s a chart.
>
> Richer:
>
> A Neapolitan-6 chord to the V chord *has* contrary motion, e.g., Db major
> to G major.
>
> A vii chord, on the “flat seventh” scale degree, to a I chord *has*
> contrary motion, e.g., Bb minor to C major.
>
> Blander:
>
> A Neapolitan-6 chord to the I chord *does not have* contrary motion , e.g.,
> Db major to C major.
>
> A vii chord, on the “flat seventh” scale degree, to the V chord *does not
> have* contrary motion, e.g., Bb minor to G major.
>

By the chord change having or not having contrary motion, I’m referring to
when the chords are in the close form and the voices move the most
economically. I think the effect in this situation carries over to the
effect of the chord change even when the chords are open and you purposely
cause a melody to move from a tone in one chord to a tone in the next chord
which is less economical.

--
Matt

Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat vii” Chord

<sl6t02$plc$1@dont-email.me>

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From: mattfau...@gmail.com (Matt Faunce)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical.guitar
Subject: Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat
vii” Chord
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 2021 18:28:18 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Matt Faunce - Mon, 25 Oct 2021 18:28 UTC

Matt Faunce <mattfaunce@gmail.com> wrote:
> Matt Faunce <mattfaunce@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> ***In this post I corrected the chart. I meant Bb minor where I had written
>> Bb major.***
>>
>> The Neapolitan-6 chord can precede the tonic chord. In these cases, instead
>> of the Neapolitan-6 chord I usually prefer to play a minor chord whose root
>> is the minor seventh above the tonic tone, e.g., in the key of C major,
>> I’ll play the Bb minor chord then the C major chord. This preserves most of
>> the feel that I want from the Neapolitan chord but because it has one tone
>> moving contrary to the others it’s richer than the Neapolitan chord.
>>
>> However, I prefer the Neapolitan-6 chord when going to the dominant chord,
>> because this has contrary motion unlike the vii chord, on the “flat
>> seventh” scale degree, to the V chord.
>>
>> Here’s a chart.
>>
>> Richer:
>>
>> A Neapolitan-6 chord to the V chord *has* contrary motion, e.g., Db major
>> to G major.
>>
>> A vii chord, on the “flat seventh” scale degree, to a I chord *has*
>> contrary motion, e.g., Bb minor to C major.
>>
>> Blander:
>>
>> A Neapolitan-6 chord to the I chord *does not have* contrary motion , e.g.,
>> Db major to C major.
>>
>> A vii chord, on the “flat seventh” scale degree, to the V chord *does not
>> have* contrary motion, e.g., Bb minor to G major.
>>
>
> By the chord change having or not having contrary motion, I’m referring to
> when the chords are in the close form and the voices move the most
> economically. I think the effect in this situation carries over to the
> effect of the chord change even when the chords are open and you purposely
> cause a melody to move from a tone in one chord to a tone in the next chord
> which is less economical.
>

Here are examples of the most economical, close form voice-leading of the
Borrowed iv, Neapolitan-6, “Flat vii”, and Tritone Substitution, each
leading to the tonic in the key of C major.

Borrowed iv to I
F minor to C major:

c → c
a♭ ➘ g
f ➘ e

Neapolitan-6 to I
Db major to C major:

d♭ ➘ c
a♭ ➘ g
f ➘ e

Neapolitan in root position to I
Db major to C major:

a♭ ➘ g
f ➘ e
d♭ ➘ c

Minor Flat vii to I
Bb minor to C major:

f ➘ e
d♭ ➘ c
b♭ ➚ c

Tritone Substitution to I (maj7)
Db major to C major(7):

c♭ ➚ c (c♭ → b)
a♭ ➘ g
f ➘ e
d♭ ➘ c

Here are examples of the most economical, close form voice-leading of the
Borrowed iv, Neapolitan-6, “Flat vii”, and Tritone Substitution, each
leading to the dominant in the key of C major.

Borrowed iv to V
F minor to G major:

c ➘ b
a♭ ➘ g
f ➚ g

Neapolitan-6 to V
Db major to G major:

d♭ ➚ d
a♭ ➘ g
f ➚ g

Neapolitan in root position to V
Db major to G major:

a♭ ➘ g
f ➚ g
d♭ ➚ d

Minor Flat vii to V
Bb minor to G major:

f ➚ g
d♭ ➚ d
b♭ ➚ b

Tritone Substitution to V (or V7)
Db major to G major (or G7):

c♭ → b
a♭ ➘ g
f ➚ g (f → f)
d♭ ➚ d

--
Matt

Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat vii” Chord

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From: mattfau...@gmail.com (Matt Faunce)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical.guitar
Subject: Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat
vii” Chord
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 2021 19:09:01 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Matt Faunce - Mon, 25 Oct 2021 19:09 UTC

Matt Faunce <mattfaunce@gmail.com> wrote:
> Matt Faunce <mattfaunce@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Matt Faunce <mattfaunce@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> ***In this post I corrected the chart. I meant Bb minor where I had written
>>> Bb major.***
>>>
>>> The Neapolitan-6 chord can precede the tonic chord. In these cases, instead
>>> of the Neapolitan-6 chord I usually prefer to play a minor chord whose root
>>> is the minor seventh above the tonic tone, e.g., in the key of C major,
>>> I’ll play the Bb minor chord then the C major chord. This preserves most of
>>> the feel that I want from the Neapolitan chord but because it has one tone
>>> moving contrary to the others it’s richer than the Neapolitan chord.
>>>
>>> However, I prefer the Neapolitan-6 chord when going to the dominant chord,
>>> because this has contrary motion unlike the vii chord, on the “flat
>>> seventh” scale degree, to the V chord.
>>>
>>> Here’s a chart.
>>>
>>> Richer:
>>>
>>> A Neapolitan-6 chord to the V chord *has* contrary motion, e.g., Db major
>>> to G major.
>>>
>>> A vii chord, on the “flat seventh” scale degree, to a I chord *has*
>>> contrary motion, e.g., Bb minor to C major.
>>>
>>> Blander:
>>>
>>> A Neapolitan-6 chord to the I chord *does not have* contrary motion , e.g.,
>>> Db major to C major.
>>>
>>> A vii chord, on the “flat seventh” scale degree, to the V chord *does not
>>> have* contrary motion, e.g., Bb minor to G major.
>>>
>>
>> By the chord change having or not having contrary motion, I’m referring to
>> when the chords are in the close form and the voices move the most
>> economically. I think the effect in this situation carries over to the
>> effect of the chord change even when the chords are open and you purposely
>> cause a melody to move from a tone in one chord to a tone in the next chord
>> which is less economical.
>>
>
>
> Here are examples of the most economical, close form voice-leading of the
> Borrowed iv, Neapolitan-6, “Flat vii”, and Tritone Substitution, each
> leading to the tonic in the key of C major.
>
> Borrowed iv to I
> F minor to C major:
>
> c → c
> a♭ ➘ g
> f ➘ e
>
> Neapolitan-6 to I
> Db major to C major:
>
> d♭ ➘ c
> a♭ ➘ g
> f ➘ e
>
> Neapolitan in root position to I
> Db major to C major:
>
> a♭ ➘ g
> f ➘ e
> d♭ ➘ c
>
> Minor Flat vii to I
> Bb minor to C major:
>
> f ➘ e
> d♭ ➘ c
> b♭ ➚ c
>
> Tritone Substitution to I (maj7)
> Db major to C major(7):
>
> c♭ ➚ c (c♭ → b)
> a♭ ➘ g
> f ➘ e
> d♭ ➘ c
>
>
> Here are examples of the most economical, close form voice-leading of the
> Borrowed iv, Neapolitan-6, “Flat vii”, and Tritone Substitution, each
> leading to the dominant in the key of C major.
>
> Borrowed iv to V
> F minor to G major:
>
> c ➘ b
> a♭ ➘ g
> f ➚ g
>
> Neapolitan-6 to V
> Db major to G major:
>
> d♭ ➚ d
> a♭ ➘ g
> f ➚ g
>
> Neapolitan in root position to V
> Db major to G major:
>
> a♭ ➘ g
> f ➚ g
> d♭ ➚ d
>
> Minor Flat vii to V
> Bb minor to G major:
>
> f ➚ g
> d♭ ➚ d
> b♭ ➚ b
>
> Tritone Substitution to V (or V7)
> Db major to G major (or G7):
>
> c♭ → b
> a♭ ➘ g
> f ➚ g (f → f)
> d♭ ➚ d
>
>

It’s unfortunate that Usenet ignored my double spaces. It’ll be easier for
you to read that if you copy it into your notepad and insert spaces so to
vertically align the arrows. That’s because it’s important to see which
cadences have contrary motion and which ones don’t.

Notice the similarities in function and differences in quality, of how the
first chord in each cadence relates to the second chord. For example, if
you take the Flat-vii chord, b♭, d♭, f, and raise the b♭ to b, then you
have a Tritone Substitution sans the fifth degree, b, d♭, f, which
respelled and re-voiced is d♭, f, c♭: play each one going to C, or G, and
listen.

--
Matt

Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat vii” Chord

<slan6d$a2$1@dont-email.me>

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From: mattfau...@gmail.com (Matt Faunce)
Newsgroups: rec.music.classical.guitar
Subject: Re: Neapolitan-6 Chord or “Flat
vii” Chord
Date: Wed, 27 Oct 2021 05:13:49 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Matt Faunce - Wed, 27 Oct 2021 05:13 UTC

>>> Matt Faunce <mattfaunce@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> ***In this post I corrected the chart. I meant Bb minor where I had written
>>>> Bb major.***
>>>>
>>>> The Neapolitan-6 chord can precede the tonic chord. In these cases, instead
>>>> of the Neapolitan-6 chord I usually prefer to play a minor chord whose root
>>>> is the minor seventh above the tonic tone, e.g., in the key of C major,
>>>> I’ll play the Bb minor chord then the C major chord. This preserves most of
>>>> the feel that I want from the Neapolitan chord but because it has one tone
>>>> moving contrary to the others it’s richer than the Neapolitan chord.
>>>>

Take a look at, and a listen to, the fifth stanza of Palestrina’s Stabat
Mater. Here’s a video showing the sheet music, with lyrics, with the Tallis
Scholars singing. Start at 3:42. https://youtu.be/Gz9o-wF7RoU

You can think of the first phrase (the first four measures) of this stanza
as being in the key of E major, the second phrase (also four measures long)
as being in A major, and the main key of D major starting the third phrase.

In this way of thinking, he ends the first two phrases with N, flat-vii,
I.* In the first phrase the cadence is F major, D minor, E major, which
goes with the lyrics, “fons amoris”; in the second phrase it’s Bb major, G
minor, A major, which goes with “vim doloris.”

The Neapolitan chord relates to the I chord similarly to how the VI chord
relates to the V chord. The flat-vii chord relates to the I chord similarly
to how the iv chord relates to the V chord. With this in mind, consider
this alternative analysis of Palestrina’s stanza:

If you think of the whole piece being in the key of D major, the second
phrase is in dominant harmony and the first phrase is in secondary-dominant
(V/V) harmony. In this way of thinking, the second phrase ends with, not N
vii I, but VI iv V. Then that V leads you to the I chord that finally
appears in the 9th measure, singing “Fac.” The first phrase ends with VI/V
iv/V V/V.

After the D major at the start of the 9th measure, Palestrina quickly takes
you back to dominant harmony, then to secondary-dominant harmony, back to
dominant harmony until the final chord in the tonic of D major. All the way
through he borrows a lot from the parallel minor…

*Note:

N = Neapolitan chord in root position.

flat-vii = the minor chord built on the minor-seventh above the tonic tone.

I = major tonic chord.

--
Matt

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