So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.

On Thursday, June 16, 2022 at 11:32:28 AM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.
>

How do you know how much poetry I've read from the 1980s-1990s, Donkey?

From the mid-1980s through the early 2000s, I used to hang out at Barnes & Noble, drinking coffee and reading the current literary magazines.

I also published three magazines during that period (Excalibur, Penny Dreadful, Songs of Innocence & Experience), and received/read 100s of poetry submissions each week.

As to the alleged influence of Hip Hop, Rap and Slam, their status as both music and poetry is still being argued. Their influence on today's poetry is negligible.

"(A) line of demarcation persists between rap and poetry, born of outmoded assumptions about both forms: that poetry only exists on the page and rap only lives in the music, that poetry is refined and rap is raw, that poetry is art and rap is entertainment."

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/04/t-magazine/rap-hip-hop-poetry.html

Michael Pendragon wrote:

> On Thursday, June 16, 2022 at 11:32:28 AM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
>
>> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.
>>

>

>

> As to the alleged influence of Hip Hop, Rap and Slam, their status as both music and poetry is still being argued. Their influence on today's poetry is negligible.

Depends on who you ask.

> "(A) line of demarcation persists between rap and poetry, born of outmoded assumptions
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

about both forms: that poetry only exists on the page and rap only lives in the music, that poetry is refined and rap is raw, that poetry is art and rap is entertainment."

> https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/04/t-magazine/rap-hip-hop-poetry.html

"Outmoded assumptions"

On Thursday, June 16, 2022 at 12:40:18 PM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>
> > On Thursday, June 16, 2022 at 11:32:28 AM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
> >
> >> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.
> >>
>
> >
>
> >
> > As to the alleged influence of Hip Hop, Rap and Slam, their status as both music and poetry is still being argued. Their influence on today's poetry is negligible.
> Depends on who you ask.

That is precisely what "still being argued" means, Donkey.

Your reading comprehension skills are (or, rather, should be) embarrassing.

> > "(A) line of demarcation persists between rap and poetry, born of outmoded assumptions
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> about both forms: that poetry only exists on the page and rap only lives in the music, that poetry is refined and rap is raw, that poetry is art and rap is entertainment."
>
> > https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/04/t-magazine/rap-hip-hop-poetry.html
> "Outmoded assumptions"

The fact that the speaker finds them "outmoded" doesn't mean that they are. In fact, *it is clear from the context* that many people still adhere to said assumptions (in which case, they are not out-moded, but current).

Again, your lack of reading skills is embarrassing.

Michael Pendragon wrote:

> On Thursday, June 16, 2022 at 12:40:18 PM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
>> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>>
>> > On Thursday, June 16, 2022 at 11:32:28 AM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
>> >
>> >> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.
>> >>
>>
>> >
>>
>> >
>> > As to the alleged influence of Hip Hop, Rap and Slam, their status as both music and poetry is still being argued. Their influence on today's poetry is negligible.
>> Depends on who you ask.

> That is precisely what "still being argued" means, Donkey.

> Your reading comprehension skills are (or, rather, should be) embarrassing.

>> > "(A) line of demarcation persists between rap and poetry, born of outmoded assumptions
>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> about both forms: that poetry only exists on the page and rap only lives in the music, that poetry is refined and rap is raw, that poetry is art and rap is entertainment."
>>
>> > https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/04/t-magazine/rap-hip-hop-poetry.html
>> "Outmoded assumptions"

> The fact that the speaker finds them "outmoded" doesn't mean that they are. In fact, *it is clear from the context* that many people still adhere to said assumptions (in which case, they are not out-moded, but current).

Sure, many people discount Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry, yourself included but obviously your narrow minded ignorance will not make it go away.

HTH and HAND.

On Thursday, June 16, 2022 at 1:40:17 PM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
> Michael Pendragon wrote:
>
> > On Thursday, June 16, 2022 at 12:40:18 PM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> Michael Pendragon wrote:
> >>
> >> > On Thursday, June 16, 2022 at 11:32:28 AM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.
> >> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >>
> >> >
> >> > As to the alleged influence of Hip Hop, Rap and Slam, their status as both music and poetry is still being argued. Their influence on today's poetry is negligible.
> >> Depends on who you ask.
>
> > That is precisely what "still being argued" means, Donkey.
>
> > Your reading comprehension skills are (or, rather, should be) embarrassing.
>
> >> > "(A) line of demarcation persists between rap and poetry, born of outmoded assumptions
> >> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> >> about both forms: that poetry only exists on the page and rap only lives in the music, that poetry is refined and rap is raw, that poetry is art and rap is entertainment."
> >>
> >> > https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/04/t-magazine/rap-hip-hop-poetry.html
> >> "Outmoded assumptions"
>
> > The fact that the speaker finds them "outmoded" doesn't mean that they are. In fact, *it is clear from the context* that many people still adhere to said assumptions (in which case, they are not out-moded, but current).
> Sure, many people discount Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry, yourself included but obviously your narrow minded ignorance will not make it go away.
>

You are using "ignorance" incorrectly... again.

Will Dockery wrote:
>
> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hip_hop_(culture)

************* Hip hop or hip-hop is a culture and art movement that was created by African Americans, Latino Americans and Caribbean Americans in the Bronx, New York City. The origin of the name is often disputed. It is also argued as to whether hip hop started in the South or West Bronx.[1][2][3][4][5] While the term hip hop is often used to refer exclusively to hip hop music (including rap),[6] hip hop is characterized by four key elements: "rapping" (also called MCing or emceeing), a rhythmic vocal rhyming style (orality); DJing (and turntablism), which is the practice of making music with record players and DJ mixers (aural/sound and music creation); b-boying/b-girling/breakdancing (movement/dance); and graffiti.[7][2][8][9][10]

Other elements are: hip hop culture and historical knowledge of the movement (intellectual/philosophical); beatboxing, a percussive vocal style; street entrepreneurship; hip hop language; and hip hop fashion and style, among others.[11][12][13] The fifth element, although debated, is commonly considered either street knowledge, hip hop fashion, or beatboxing.[2][7]

The Bronx hip hop scene emerged in the mid-1970s *************************************

Victor H. wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:
>>
>> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hip_hop_(culture)

> ************* Hip hop or hip-hop is a culture and art movement that was created by African Americans, Latino Americans and Caribbean Americans in the Bronx, New York City. The origin of the name is often disputed. It is also argued as to whether hip hop started in the South or West Bronx.[1][2][3][4][5] While the term hip hop is often used to refer exclusively to hip hop music (including rap),[6] hip hop is characterized by four key elements: "rapping" (also called MCing or emceeing), a rhythmic vocal rhyming style (orality); DJing (and turntablism), which is the practice of making music with record players and DJ mixers (aural/sound and music creation); b-boying/b-girling/breakdancing (movement/dance); and graffiti.[7][2][8][9][10]

> Other elements are: hip hop culture and historical knowledge of the movement (intellectual/philosophical); beatboxing, a percussive vocal style; street entrepreneurship; hip hop language; and hip hop fashion and style, among others.[11][12][13] The fifth element, although debated, is commonly considered either street knowledge, hip hop fashion, or beatboxing.[2][7]

> The Bronx hip hop scene emerged in the mid-1970s *************************************

You nailed it, Victor.

Michael Pendragon wrote:

> On Thursday, June 16, 2022 at 11:32:28 AM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
>
>> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.
>>

> How do you know how much poetry I've read from the 1980s-1990s

Very little, from what you seem to know about that era of poetry.

Will Dockery wrote:
>
> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.

That is indeed apparently true....

General-Zod wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:
>>
>> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.

> That is indeed apparently true....

Pendragon misses a lot since he's constantly looking to the distant past for poetry.

Will Dockery wrote:
>
> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.

The emergence of rap changed history...

Victor H. wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:
>>
>> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.

> The emergence of rap changed history...

Hip Hop brought back both rhyme and popularity to poetry.

And so it goes.

Victor H. wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:
>>
>> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hip_hop_(culture)

> ************* Hip hop or hip-hop is a culture and art movement that was created by African Americans, Latino Americans and Caribbean Americans in the Bronx, New York City. The origin of the name is often disputed. It is also argued as to whether hip hop started in the South or West Bronx.[1][2][3][4][5] While the term hip hop is often used to refer exclusively to hip hop music (including rap),[6] hip hop is characterized by four key elements: "rapping" (also called MCing or emceeing), a rhythmic vocal rhyming style (orality); DJing (and turntablism), which is the practice of making music with record players and DJ mixers (aural/sound and music creation); b-boying/b-girling/breakdancing (movement/dance); and graffiti.[7][2][8][9][10]

> Other elements are: hip hop culture and historical knowledge of the movement (intellectual/philosophical); beatboxing, a percussive vocal style; street entrepreneurship; hip hop language; and hip hop fashion and style, among others.[11][12][13] The fifth element, although debated, is commonly considered either street knowledge, hip hop fashion, or beatboxing.[2][7]

> The Bronx hip hop scene emerged in the mid-1970s *************************************

Good find.

Will Dockery wrote:
>
> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.

Yep...!

General-Zod wrote:

> Will Dockery wrote:
>>
>> So, you don't like my writing style, that still doesn't justify your ignorance of poetry in the 1980s-1990s, and the changes to poetry brought by Hip Hop, Rap and spoken word slam poetry.

> That is indeed apparently true....

Good morning, agreed.