In article <134fce2b-61fd-44b4-8582-928cd35541f0n@googlegroups.com>,
RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:

> Ignominious.
>
>
> https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-depa
> rtment-jamal-khashoggi/index.html

You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
he's not head of state any longer.

On 11/18/22 4:57 AM, A Friend wrote:
> In article <134fce2b-61fd-44b4-8582-928cd35541f0n@googlegroups.com>,
> RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Ignominious.
>>
>>
>> https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-depa
>> rtment-jamal-khashoggi/index.html
>
>
> You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
> has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
> granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
> he's not head of state any longer.

Good explanation, but it still feels wrong. "Diplomatic immunity"
strikes me as bullshit in the first place, but retroactive immunity is
even more bullshitty. None of this would have been necessary if we had
been able to trade in our gas powered vehicles for electrics. I can't
believe we lend any credence to that murderous asshole because of oil.
I suppose that's irony: kowtowing to a greasy bastard for oil.

A Friend wrote:
>RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:

>>Ignominious.

>>https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-department-jamal-khashoggi/index.html

>You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
>has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
>granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
>he's not head of state any longer.

Head of government! His father is still head of state. When his father
is assasinated, he'll become head of state.

How exactly is he going to lose that immunity?

What I don't understand is how the United States courts had jurisdiction
for the lawsuit in the first place as the assasination took place within the
Saudi consulate in Istanbul.

In article <181120220557335263%nope@noway.com>,
A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:

> In article <134fce2b-61fd-44b4-8582-928cd35541f0n@googlegroups.com>,
> RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Ignominious.
> >
> > https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-de
> > partment-jamal-khashoggi/index.html
>
> You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
> has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
> granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
> he's not head of state any longer.

It's a monarchy. The only way he leaves office is to die of old age or
be overthrown.

In article <tl8aui$2vcp1$3@dont-email.me>,
"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> A Friend wrote:
> >RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>Ignominious.
>
> >>https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-de
> >>partment-jamal-khashoggi/index.html
>
> >You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
> >has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
> >granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
> >he's not head of state any longer.
>
> Head of government! His father is still head of state. When his father
> is assasinated, he'll become head of state.
>
> How exactly is he going to lose that immunity?
>
> What I don't understand is how the United States courts had jurisdiction
> for the lawsuit in the first place as the assasination took place within the
> Saudi consulate in Istanbul.

My experience is that America's courts seem to think they have
jurisdiction literally everywhere in the known universe.

BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>>RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:

>>>Ignominious.

>>>https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-department-jamal-khashoggi/index.html

>>You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
>>has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
>>granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
>>he's not head of state any longer.

>It's a monarchy. The only way he leaves office is to die of old age or
>be overthrown.

Has any Arab head of government or head of state ever left office
peacefully then died of old age? Who was overthrown without having
been assasinated first?

In article <tl8cm5$2vj7v$4@dont-email.me>,
"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
> >A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
> >>RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>>Ignominious.
>
> >>>https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-d
> >>>epartment-jamal-khashoggi/index.html
>
> >>You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
> >>has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
> >>granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
> >>he's not head of state any longer.
>
> >It's a monarchy. The only way he leaves office is to die of old age or
> >be overthrown.
>
> Has any Arab head of government or head of state ever left office
> peacefully then died of old age? Who was overthrown without having
> been assasinated first?

I consider assassination a flavor of overthrowing.

BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
> In article <181120220557335263%nope@noway.com>,
> A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>
>> In article <134fce2b-61fd-44b4-8582-928cd35541f0n@googlegroups.com>,
>> RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Ignominious.
>>>
>>> https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-de
>>> partment-jamal-khashoggi/index.html
>>
>> You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
>> has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
>> granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
>> he's not head of state any longer.
>
> It's a monarchy. The only way he leaves office is to die of old age or
> be overthrown.
>

Last night on (the adventures of) MERLIN, Prince Arthur was going to resign
as prince because he’s been cast into shame for kissing a handmaiden of
color and planned to exile himself and give up his right to succession and
then come back once his father was dead and claim the crown, unaware that
his secret half-sister figured she’d take the place over in the meantime as
the new legal heir.

I am not really sure how any of that works.

--
The last thing I want to do is hurt you, but it is still on my list.

On Friday, November 18, 2022 at 1:37:10 PM UTC-5, anim8rfsk wrote:
> BTR1701 <atr...@mac.com> wrote:
> > In article <181120220557335263%no...@noway.com>,
> > A Friend <no...@noway.com> wrote:
> >
> >> In article <134fce2b-61fd-44b4...@googlegroups.com>,
> >> RichA <rande...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Ignominious.
> >>>
> >>> https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-de
> >>> partment-jamal-khashoggi/index.html
> >>
> >> You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
> >> has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
> >> granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
> >> he's not head of state any longer.
> >
> > It's a monarchy. The only way he leaves office is to die of old age or
> > be overthrown.

> Last night on (the adventures of) MERLIN, Prince Arthur was going to resign
> as prince because he’s been cast into shame for kissing a handmaiden of
> color and planned to exile himself and give up his right to succession and
> then come back once his father was dead and claim the crown, unaware that
> his secret half-sister figured she’d take the place over in the meantime as
> the new legal heir.
>
> I am not really sure how any of that works.

"Six ways from Sunday" Chuck Schumer says, the real world doesn't work that way

https://twitter.com/johnbrennan/status/974978856997224448?lang=en

--------------

Eight Days a Week

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/312605-schumer-trump-being-really-dumb-by-going-after-intelligence-community/

BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>>BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>>>>RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:

>>>>>Ignominious.

>>>>>https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-department-jamal-khashoggi/index.html

>>>>You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
>>>>has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
>>>>granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
>>>>he's not head of state any longer.

>>>It's a monarchy. The only way he leaves office is to die of old age or
>>>be overthrown.

>>Has any Arab head of government or head of state ever left office
>>peacefully then died of old age? Who was overthrown without having
>>been assasinated first?

>I consider assassination a flavor of overthrowing.

Fine.

Still, I just can't think of anyone who wasn't overthrown who died of
natural causes.

On 11/18/22 10:36 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
> In article <181120220557335263%nope@noway.com>,
> A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>
>> In article <134fce2b-61fd-44b4-8582-928cd35541f0n@googlegroups.com>,
>> RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Ignominious.
>>>
>>> https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-de
>>> partment-jamal-khashoggi/index.html
>>
>> You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
>> has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
>> granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
>> he's not head of state any longer.
>
> It's a monarchy. The only way he leaves office is to die of old age or
> be overthrown.

Britain's a monarchy that has a Prime Minister also. Are you even
capable of using your grey matter anymore?

RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Friday, 18 November 2022 at 05:57:38 UTC-5, A Friend wrote:
>> In article <134fce2b-61fd-44b4...@googlegroups.com>,
>> RichA <rande...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Ignominious.
>>>
>>>
>>> https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-depa
>>> rtment-jamal-khashoggi/index.html
>>
>>
>> You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
>> has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
>> granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
>> he's not head of state any longer.
>
> Kings die on the throne though.
>

Example: Elvis.

--
The last thing I want to do is hurt you, but it is still on my list.

On 11/18/22 6:14 PM, RichA wrote:
> On Friday, 18 November 2022 at 05:57:38 UTC-5, A Friend wrote:
>> In article <134fce2b-61fd-44b4...@googlegroups.com>,
>> RichA <rande...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Ignominious.
>>>
>>>
>>> https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-depa
>>> rtment-jamal-khashoggi/index.html
>>
>>
>> You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
>> has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
>> granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
>> he's not head of state any longer.
>
> Kings die on the throne though.

That's certainly what's expected of Trump and his gold toilets.

Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>A Friend wrote:
>>RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:

>>>Ignominious.

>>>https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/17/politics/saudi-crown-prince-immunity-state-department-jamal-khashoggi/index.html

>>You're being stupid. The U.S. *had* to do this because the murderer
>>has become prime minister of Saudi Arabia. Also, the prince wasn't
>>granted "exoneration," but immunity. He will lose that immunity when
>>he's not head of state any longer.

>Head of government! His father is still head of state. When his father
>is assasinated, he'll become head of state.

>How exactly is he going to lose that immunity?

>What I don't understand is how the United States courts had jurisdiction
>for the lawsuit in the first place as the assasination took place within the
>Saudi consulate in Istanbul.

Two talking heads on PBS NewsHour 11/18/2022, both former State
Department legal advisors, had a bit of a disagreement about whether
immunity applied. One said it's international law (and I assume he had a
specific treaty in mind), with court rulings that a foreign head of
state couldn't be sued despite other US laws because it's international
law. He also mentioned that foreign heads of state, heads of government,
and chief ministers cannot be sued.

The other guy cited two US laws in which Congress said in a terrorist
state situation, there was no immunity from lawsuit and in a later
amendment, it didn't depend on whether the State Department had made the
terrorist state declaration. But he didn't explain how US law trumps a
treaty to which the United States is party to. Nor did he explain what
"terrorist state" means. Let's note tha Saudi Arabia, despite the number
of prominent people including members of the royal family, funded Bin
Laden, wasn't declared a terrorist state after 9/11 and I don't see how
the Khassoogie assination makes it a terrorist state.

Neither explained the issue of jurisdiction of United States courts.