Over the weekend, a very mediocre British musician by the name of Sam Smith
attempted to generate controversy by dancing in satanic garb while performing
at the Grammy Awards. Smith, who has declared himself non-binary, sang a song
named "Unholy" along with trans performer Kim Petras while dancers in satanic
horns, leather lingerie, and whips surrounded the duo on stage.

If you were unaware that the Grammys were broadcast, or that they even exist,
you're in good company. No one cares about these self-congratulatory media
spectacles any more, and Smith's performance was obviously designed as a
desperate bid for relevance. In the past, transgression has been an easy way
to generate outrage and gain attention for America's degenerate cultural
elites, but the only remarkable thing about Smith's antics was how lazy,
safe, and banal they really were.

The left is a coalition of those who stand to gain from deconstructing
Western civilization, and Christianity is one of their favorite targets.
Progressives generate political power by deconstructing the nation's
heritage, its families, and its values, but they seem most gleeful when they
get the opportunity to attack its dominant religion.

They don't want you to see this ... Big Tech does its best to limit what news
you see. Make sure you see our stories daily -- directly to your inbox.
Rather than build something of substance by venerating the good, beautiful,
and true, the vast majority of leftists' art and culture for many decades has
been built entirely on subversion. At first these television shows, movies,
and songs had interesting things to say. There were, of course, many
instances of hypocrisy and contradictions that early works of this type could
examine. But when a cultural movement's only trick is the deconstruction of
the culture that came before it, that movement is living on borrowed time.

Smith's performance would like to recreate the shocked indignation of old,
the kind of scandal that caused outraged parents to rail against the sexually
charged performances of Madonna or inspired Tipper Gore to lead a campaign of
censorship targeting bands like Motley Crue and Twisted Sister. But those
days are far in the rearview mirror. Hollywood, the music industry, academia,
and every other major cultural force in America have done nothing but
challenge, deconstruct, and transgress these boundaries while building
nothing of their own, and frankly, it has become a bloodless and depressing
affair.

Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and empty the
revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a name for herself with
highly sexualized videos that mocked religion, made a presentation at the
awards show honoring those who had picked up her torch of rebellion. The real
question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna championed has now
been accepted by corporate America; every attitude about sexuality or
religion has been adopted by the public school system. Madonna's face is
almost unrecognizable. A weird collection of plastic surgery procedures,
undergone in an attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist
looking like a caricature. A musician who once relied on youth, beauty, and
subversion now desperately tries to stay relevant and edgy by pushing a
revolution that became mainstream and boring many decades ago: a perfect
reflection of the pop culture complex in its entirety.

Far from challenging power or the established cultural norms, Smith's cartoon
satanism and LGBTQ politics embrace the mainstream narrative pushed by every
major institution in the United States. The singer has the same politics and
cultural beliefs espoused by Citibank, Google, Goldman Sachs, and Walmart.
There was never any danger of real consequences or cancellation. It was the
safest performance imaginable.

If Smith were really interested in causing controversy, he could have mocked
Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, or any other religion, but he chose Christianity
because he understood that it is the one target for which he will receive
zero pushback. It would have been equally tasteless, but at least it would
have showed willingness to challenge the popular narrative.

If Smith were really interested in challenging established power, he could
have questioned the trans movement, abortion, or the corporate leviathan that
seems so obsessed with destroying the American family, but he is a coward
masquerading as a rebel, so he simply parrots the positions of the powerful.
After the pop star's performance, an advertisement aired proudly proclaiming
that the celebration of satanic imagery had been brought to the viewer by
Pfizer, the same pharmaceutical giant responsible for the dubious COVID-19
vaccine. Good to know that the Lord still has a sense of humor.

Progressivism is a cultural vampire feeding on the bones of a once-great
Christian culture, but as it cleans the last bit of marrow from those bones,
it becomes desperate. How do you keep a coalition together that was organized
around the deconstruction of traditional American culture once you have
consumed that culture entirely? The hedonism and social atomization the left
offers do little to create a new and dynamic cultural force. There is no
substance on which progressives can create a foundation. If your cultural
movement is built entirely on deconstruction, once you exhaust the energy
generated by outrage, the only thing left to do is make the deconstruction of
the ritual a ritual unto itself.

Progressives have created sacraments for themselves like transition,
abortion, and coming out, but these rituals lose all of their animating
energy when the forces they were aimed at no longer hold cultural sway. The
left can parade around "The Handmaid's Tale" or any other delusional
boogieman of Christianity it would like, but it is becoming increasingly
difficult for anyone to pretend these straw men pose any real threat to
progressive hegemony. While the left is committed to all kinds of horrible
atrocities, it may be that the response progressives fear most to their tired
and stale brand of corporate rebellion is a bored yawn.

--
Let's go Brandon!

In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>, weberm@polaris.net wrote:

>Over the weekend, a very mediocre British musician by the name of Sam Smith
>attempted to generate controversy by dancing in satanic garb while performing
>at the Grammy Awards. Smith, who has declared himself non-binary, sang a song
>named "Unholy" along with trans performer Kim Petras while dancers in satanic
>horns, leather lingerie, and whips surrounded the duo on stage.
>
>If you were unaware that the Grammys were broadcast, or that they even exist,
>you're in good company. No one cares about these self-congratulatory media
>spectacles any more, and Smith's performance was obviously designed as a
>desperate bid for relevance. In the past, transgression has been an easy way
>to generate outrage and gain attention for America's degenerate cultural
>elites, but the only remarkable thing about Smith's antics was how lazy,
>safe, and banal they really were.
>
>The left is a coalition of those who stand to gain from deconstructing
>Western civilization, and Christianity is one of their favorite targets.
>Progressives generate political power by deconstructing the nation's
>heritage, its families, and its values, but they seem most gleeful when they
>get the opportunity to attack its dominant religion.
>
>They don't want you to see this ... Big Tech does its best to limit what
>news you see. Make sure you see our stories daily -- directly to your inbox.
>Rather than build something of substance by venerating the good, beautiful,
>and true, the vast majority of leftists' art and culture for many decades
>has been built entirely on subversion. At first these television shows,
>movies, and songs had interesting things to say. There were, of course, many
>instances of hypocrisy and contradictions that early works of this type could
>examine. But when a cultural movement's only trick is the deconstruction of
>the culture that came before it, that movement is living on borrowed time.
>
>Smith's performance would like to recreate the shocked indignation of old,
>the kind of scandal that caused outraged parents to rail against the sexually
>charged performances of Madonna or inspired Tipper Gore to lead a campaign of
>censorship targeting bands like Motley Crue and Twisted Sister. But those
>days are far in the rearview mirror. Hollywood, the music industry, academia,
>and every other major cultural force in America have done nothing but
>challenge, deconstruct, and transgress these boundaries while building
>nothing of their own, and frankly, it has become a bloodless and depressing
>affair.
>
>Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and empty the
>revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a name for herself with
>highly sexualized videos that mocked religion, made a presentation at the
>awards show honoring those who had picked up her torch of rebellion. The
>real question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna championed has
>now been accepted by corporate America; every attitude about sexuality or
>religion has been adopted by the public school system. Madonna's face is
>almost unrecognizable. A weird collection of plastic surgery procedures,
>undergone in an attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist
>looking like a caricature. A musician who once relied on youth, beauty, and
>subversion now desperately tries to stay relevant and edgy by pushing a
>revolution that became mainstream and boring many decades ago: a perfect
>reflection of the pop culture complex in its entirety.
>
>Far from challenging power or the established cultural norms, Smith's cartoon
>satanism and LGBTQ politics embrace the mainstream narrative pushed by every
>major institution in the United States. The singer has the same politics and
>cultural beliefs espoused by Citibank, Google, Goldman Sachs, and Walmart.
>There was never any danger of real consequences or cancellation. It was the
>safest performance imaginable.
>
>If Smith were really interested in causing controversy, he could have mocked
>Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, or any other religion, but he chose Christianity
>because he understood that it is the one target for which he will receive
>zero pushback. It would have been equally tasteless, but at least it would
>have showed willingness to challenge the popular narrative.
>
>If Smith were really interested in challenging established power, he could
>have questioned the trans movement, abortion, or the corporate leviathan
>that seems so obsessed with destroying the American family, but he is a
>coward masquerading as a rebel, so he simply parrots the positions of the
>powerful. After the pop star's performance, an advertisement aired proudly
>proclaiming that the celebration of satanic imagery had been brought to the
>viewer by Pfizer, the same pharmaceutical giant responsible for the dubious
>COVID-19 vaccine. Good to know that the Lord still has a sense of humor.
>
>Progressivism is a cultural vampire feeding on the bones of a once-great
>Christian culture, but as it cleans the last bit of marrow from those bones,
>it becomes desperate. How do you keep a coalition together that was organized
>around the deconstruction of traditional American culture once you have
>consumed that culture entirely? The hedonism and social atomization the left
>offers do little to create a new and dynamic cultural force. There is no
>substance on which progressives can create a foundation. If your cultural
>movement is built entirely on deconstruction, once you exhaust the energy
>generated by outrage, the only thing left to do is make the deconstruction
>of the ritual a ritual unto itself.
>
>Progressives have created sacraments for themselves like transition,
>abortion, and coming out, but these rituals lose all of their animating
>energy when the forces they were aimed at no longer hold cultural sway. The
>left can parade around "The Handmaid's Tale" or any other delusional
>boogieman of Christianity it would like, but it is becoming increasingly
>difficult for anyone to pretend these straw men pose any real threat to
>progressive hegemony. While the left is committed to all kinds of horrible
>atrocities, it may be that the response progressives fear most to their
>tired and stale brand of corporate rebellion is a bored yawn.
>
>--
>Let's go Brandon!

Damn this was some powerful writing from Auron MacIntyre.

Some of his best lines:

"Progressivism is a cultural vampire feeding on the bones of a once-great
Christian culture, but as it cleans the last bit of marrow from those bones,
it becomes desperate."

"If your cultural movement is built entirely on deconstruction, once you
exhaust the energy generated by outrage, the only thing left to do is make the
deconstruction of the ritual a ritual unto itself.

Progressives have created sacraments for themselves like transition, abortion,
and coming out, but these rituals lose all of their animating energy when the
forces they were aimed at no longer hold cultural sway."

Well done

In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:

> Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and empty the
> revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a name for herself with
> highly sexualized videos that mocked religion, made a presentation at the
> awards show honoring those who had picked up her torch of rebellion. The real
> question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna championed has now
> been accepted by corporate America; every attitude about sexuality or
> religion has been adopted by the public school system. Madonna's face is
> almost unrecognizable. A weird collection of plastic surgery procedures,
> undergone in an attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist
> looking like a caricature.

I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on the
make-up FX.

> If Smith were really interested in causing controversy, he could have mocked
> Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, or any other religion, but he chose Christianity
> because he understood that it is the one target for which he will receive
> zero pushback. It would have been equally tasteless, but at least it would
> have showed willingness to challenge the popular narrative.

Yep, it's de rigeur with TV, music, and movie people to consider
themselves "brave" and "daring" when their work is controversial,
especially when it involves religion, when real bravery would be doing a
performance like this where the consequences aren't just a few outraged
press releases, but rather being assassinated on your way to work some
morning. Just ask film director Theo Van Gogh about it. Oh, wait, you
can't. He had his throat slit in the street in front of his house for
offending Islamists with his work.

In article <20230208094848.6F805EFBFA7D4A1F@gmail.com>,
Barr. Mark Cohen <barrmarkcohen@gmail.com> wrote:

> along with trans performer Kim Petras

Beavis: "Is that a woman?"

Butt-head: "She better be a woman, I'm getting a woodie."

In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
<atropos@mac.com> wrote:

> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>
> > Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and empty the
> > revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a name for herself with
> > highly sexualized videos that mocked religion, made a presentation at the
> > awards show honoring those who had picked up her torch of rebellion. The
> > real
> > question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna championed has now
> > been accepted by corporate America; every attitude about sexuality or
> > religion has been adopted by the public school system. Madonna's face is
> > almost unrecognizable. A weird collection of plastic surgery procedures,
> > undergone in an attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist
> > looking like a caricature.
>
> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on the
> make-up FX.

I knew Madonna a little bit back around 1977. She was one of the
Second Avenue people in Manhattan, and she was friends with my
girlfriend of the time. I thought Madonna was kinda exotic because
she'd posed nude for pictures. (We lived shallow lives back then.)
She was nice.

> > If Smith were really interested in causing controversy, he could have
> > mocked
> > Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, or any other religion, but he chose Christianity
> > because he understood that it is the one target for which he will receive
> > zero pushback. It would have been equally tasteless, but at least it would
> > have showed willingness to challenge the popular narrative.
>
> Yep, it's de rigeur with TV, music, and movie people to consider
> themselves "brave" and "daring" when their work is controversial,
> especially when it involves religion, when real bravery would be doing a
> performance like this where the consequences aren't just a few outraged
> press releases, but rather being assassinated on your way to work some
> morning. Just ask film director Theo Van Gogh about it. Oh, wait, you
> can't. He had his throat slit in the street in front of his house for
> offending Islamists with his work.

On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:

> In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>
>> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>>
>> > Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and empty the
>> > revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a name for herself
>>> with
>> > highly sexualized videos that mocked religion, made a presentation at the
>> > awards show honoring those who had picked up her torch of rebellion. The
>> > real
>> > question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna championed has
>>> now
>> > been accepted by corporate America; every attitude about sexuality or
>> > religion has been adopted by the public school system. Madonna's face is
>> > almost unrecognizable. A weird collection of plastic surgery procedures,
>> > undergone in an attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist
>> > looking like a caricature.
>>
>> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
>> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
>> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on the
>> make-up FX.
>
>
> I knew Madonna a little bit back around 1977. She was one of the
> Second Avenue people in Manhattan, and she was friends with my
> girlfriend of the time. I thought Madonna was kinda exotic because
> she'd posed nude for pictures. (We lived shallow lives back then.)
> She was nice.

Yes, back around 2005 or so, I was working a protective detail for a foreign
head of state at the U.N. Assembly in NYC. The MTV Video Awards were going on
the same week. Our guy had half the hotel floor and Madonna and her entourage
had the other half.

One of the nights, she and her crew came back from wherever they'd been
partying and as they came off the elevators, she saw us standing in the
hallway in front of the prime minister's door. She asked if we had to do that
all night and when we said yes, she asked how we got anything to eat. We said
we typically bring energy bars and other snacks with us to eat during our
shift. She just kind of frowned and walked away. We thought it was kind of
weird but didn't think anything of it until about an hour later when the hotel
people brought up an entire buffet of food for us-- sandwiches, pasta, pizza,
the whole works-- and said it was compliments of Madonna.

I've always had a favorable impression of her, which is why it's such a shame
to see what she's done to herself with plastic surgery.

On 2/8/23 12:57 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>
>> Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and empty the
>> revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a name for herself with
>> highly sexualized videos that mocked religion, made a presentation at the
>> awards show honoring those who had picked up her torch of rebellion. The real
>> question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna championed has now
>> been accepted by corporate America; every attitude about sexuality or
>> religion has been adopted by the public school system. Madonna's face is
>> almost unrecognizable. A weird collection of plastic surgery procedures,
>> undergone in an attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist
>> looking like a caricature.
>
> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on the
> make-up FX.
>
>> If Smith were really interested in causing controversy, he could have mocked
>> Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, or any other religion, but he chose Christianity
>> because he understood that it is the one target for which he will receive
>> zero pushback. It would have been equally tasteless, but at least it would
>> have showed willingness to challenge the popular narrative.
>
> Yep, it's de rigeur with TV, music, and movie people to consider
> themselves "brave" and "daring" when their work is controversial,
> especially when it involves religion, when real bravery would be doing a
> performance like this where the consequences aren't just a few outraged
> press releases, but rather being assassinated on your way to work some
> morning. Just ask film director Theo Van Gogh about it. Oh, wait, you
> can't. He had his throat slit in the street in front of his house for
> offending Islamists with his work.

Well Oath Keeper'd and shitposted.

On 2/8/23 1:59 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>
>> In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
>> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>
>>> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
>>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> > Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and empty the
>>> > revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a name for herself
>>>> with
>>> > highly sexualized videos that mocked religion, made a presentation at the
>>> > awards show honoring those who had picked up her torch of rebellion. The
>>> > real
>>> > question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna championed has
>>>> now
>>> > been accepted by corporate America; every attitude about sexuality or
>>> > religion has been adopted by the public school system. Madonna's face is
>>> > almost unrecognizable. A weird collection of plastic surgery procedures,
>>> > undergone in an attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist
>>> > looking like a caricature.
>>>
>>> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
>>> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
>>> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on the
>>> make-up FX.
>>
>>
>> I knew Madonna a little bit back around 1977. She was one of the
>> Second Avenue people in Manhattan, and she was friends with my
>> girlfriend of the time. I thought Madonna was kinda exotic because
>> she'd posed nude for pictures. (We lived shallow lives back then.)
>> She was nice.
>
> Yes, back around 2005 or so, I was working a protective detail for a foreign
> head of state at the U.N. Assembly in NYC. The MTV Video Awards were going on
> the same week. Our guy had half the hotel floor and Madonna and her entourage
> had the other half.
>
> One of the nights, she and her crew came back from wherever they'd been
> partying and as they came off the elevators, she saw us standing in the
> hallway in front of the prime minister's door. She asked if we had to do that
> all night and when we said yes, she asked how we got anything to eat. We said
> we typically bring energy bars and other snacks with us to eat during our
> shift. She just kind of frowned and walked away. We thought it was kind of
> weird but didn't think anything of it until about an hour later when the hotel
> people brought up an entire buffet of food for us-- sandwiches, pasta, pizza,
> the whole works-- and said it was compliments of Madonna.
>
> I've always had a favorable impression of her, which is why it's such a shame
> to see what she's done to herself with plastic surgery.

Yeah, and to think she has a song called "Express Yourself." That bitch.

Ubi's crosspost to nonexistent newsgroup cut

BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:

>>>. . .

>>I knew Madonna a little bit back around 1977. She was one of the
>>Second Avenue people in Manhattan, and she was friends with my
>>girlfriend of the time. I thought Madonna was kinda exotic because
>>she'd posed nude for pictures. (We lived shallow lives back then.)
>>She was nice.

I'm glad to hear that.

>Yes, back around 2005 or so, I was working a protective detail for a foreign
>head of state at the U.N. Assembly in NYC. The MTV Video Awards were going on
>the same week. Our guy had half the hotel floor and Madonna and her entourage
>had the other half.

>One of the nights, she and her crew came back from wherever they'd been
>partying and as they came off the elevators, she saw us standing in the
>hallway in front of the prime minister's door. She asked if we had to do that
>all night and when we said yes, she asked how we got anything to eat. We said
>we typically bring energy bars and other snacks with us to eat during our
>shift. She just kind of frowned and walked away. We thought it was kind of
>weird but didn't think anything of it until about an hour later when the hotel
>people brought up an entire buffet of food for us-- sandwiches, pasta, pizza,
>the whole works-- and said it was compliments of Madonna.

What a delightful story

>I've always had a favorable impression of her, which is why it's such a shame
>to see what she's done to herself with plastic surgery.

In article <080220231419033696%nope@noway.com>,
A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:

> I knew Madonna a little bit back around 1977. She was one of the
> Second Avenue people in Manhattan, and she was friends with my
> girlfriend of the time. I thought Madonna was kinda exotic because
> she'd posed nude for pictures. (We lived shallow lives back then.)
> She was nice.

I remember watching a documentary about her one time. One of her
pre-fame dance class friends said she liked to stand up and go "I'm
gonna conquer the world some day!"

"Sure Madonna," the friend said. "Sit down."

On 2/8/23 10:22 PM, RichA wrote:
> There are non "non-binaries." They are all just garden-variety left-wing homosexuals.

Typical MAGA "non-intellect."

On Wed, 08 Feb 2023 19:59:05 +0000, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:

>On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>
>> In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
>> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>
>>> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
>>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> > Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and empty the
>>> > revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a name for herself
>>>> with
>>> > highly sexualized videos that mocked religion, made a presentation at the
>>> > awards show honoring those who had picked up her torch of rebellion. The
>>> > real
>>> > question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna championed has
>>>> now
>>> > been accepted by corporate America; every attitude about sexuality or
>>> > religion has been adopted by the public school system. Madonna's face is
>>> > almost unrecognizable. A weird collection of plastic surgery procedures,
>>> > undergone in an attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist
>>> > looking like a caricature.
>>>
>>> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
>>> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
>>> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on the
>>> make-up FX.

Wow, I looked up her pics from the Grammy's and I see what you are
saying. At first I thought this was some sort of digital altered image
of Madonna and not a live image, but it was her on the stage. She
really has taken the idea of not aging too far. I get that no one
wants to see themselves changing too much as they age but there's such
a thing as going way too far.
https://nypost.com/2023/02/06/unrecognizable-madonna-out-to-look-like-2000s-copy-of-self/

>>
>> I knew Madonna a little bit back around 1977. She was one of the
>> Second Avenue people in Manhattan, and she was friends with my
>> girlfriend of the time. I thought Madonna was kinda exotic because
>> she'd posed nude for pictures. (We lived shallow lives back then.)
>> She was nice.
>
>Yes, back around 2005 or so, I was working a protective detail for a foreign
>head of state at the U.N. Assembly in NYC. The MTV Video Awards were going on
>the same week. Our guy had half the hotel floor and Madonna and her entourage
>had the other half.
>
>One of the nights, she and her crew came back from wherever they'd been
>partying and as they came off the elevators, she saw us standing in the
>hallway in front of the prime minister's door. She asked if we had to do that
>all night and when we said yes, she asked how we got anything to eat. We said
>we typically bring energy bars and other snacks with us to eat during our
>shift. She just kind of frowned and walked away. We thought it was kind of
>weird but didn't think anything of it until about an hour later when the hotel
>people brought up an entire buffet of food for us-- sandwiches, pasta, pizza,
>the whole works-- and said it was compliments of Madonna.
>
>I've always had a favorable impression of her, which is why it's such a shame
>to see what she's done to herself with plastic surgery.
>

There's a strange mix of good people and a-holes among the celebs and
I'm not sure what makes for the difference. Always glad to hear when
they do something nice just for the sake of being nice and not for the
publicity.

atropos@mac.com wrote:
> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:

>> Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and empty the
>> revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a name for herself with
>> highly sexualized videos that mocked religion, made a presentation at the
>> awards show honoring those who had picked up her torch of rebellion. The real
>> question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna championed has now
>> been accepted by corporate America; every attitude about sexuality or
>> religion has been adopted by the public school system. Madonna's face is
>> almost unrecognizable. A weird collection of plastic surgery procedures,
>> undergone in an attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist
>> looking like a caricature.
>
>I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
>punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
>like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on the
>make-up FX.

She reminds me of Marylin Manson.

--
Let's go Brandon!

In article <4vh9uhto1echns0hcomnmk7h22acbkfn3g@4ax.com>,
shawn <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:

> On Wed, 08 Feb 2023 19:59:05 +0000, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>
> >On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:
> >
> >> In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
> >> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
> >>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
> >>>
>>>>> Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and
>>>>> empty the revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a
>>>>> name for herself with highly sexualized videos that mocked
>>>>> religion, made a presentation at the awards show honoring those
>>>>> who had picked up her torch of rebellion.

>>>>> The real question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna
>>>>> championed has now been accepted by corporate America; every
>>>>> attitude about sexuality or religion has been adopted by the
>>>>> public school system. Madonna's face is almost unrecognizable. A
>>>>> weird collection of plastic surgery procedures, undergone in an
>>>>> attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist looking
>>>>> like a caricature.
> >>>
> >>> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
> >>> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
> >>> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on the
> >>> make-up FX.
>
> Wow, I looked up her pics from the Grammy's and I see what you are
> saying. At first I thought this was some sort of digital altered image
> of Madonna and not a live image, but it was her on the stage. She
> really has taken the idea of not aging too far. I get that no one
> wants to see themselves changing too much as they age but there's such
> a thing as going way too far.

Aging the way nature intended is always the preferable route to go. No
matter who you are, there's going to come time when you're no longer the
hot smokeshow you once were. It's just a question of whether you're
going to age with dignity or look like a freak show.

I would point to Hellen Mirren and Faith Hill on the YELLOWSTONE
spin-offs as examples of women who were hotties in their prime and are
now aging naturally without stretching their faces into rubber bands and
they look just fine.

> >> I knew Madonna a little bit back around 1977. She was one of the
> >> Second Avenue people in Manhattan, and she was friends with my
> >> girlfriend of the time. I thought Madonna was kinda exotic because
> >> she'd posed nude for pictures. (We lived shallow lives back then.)
> >> She was nice.
> >
> > Yes, back around 2005 or so, I was working a protective detail for a
> > foreign head of state at the U.N. Assembly in NYC. The MTV Video Awards
> > were going on the same week. Our guy had half the hotel floor and Madonna
> > and her entourage had the other half.
> >
> > One of the nights, she and her crew came back from wherever they'd been
> > partying and as they came off the elevators, she saw us standing in the
> > hallway in front of the prime minister's door. She asked if we had to do
> > that all night and when we said yes, she asked how we got anything to eat.
> > We said we typically bring energy bars and other snacks with us to eat
> > during our shift. She just kind of frowned and walked away. We thought it
> > was kind of weird but didn't think anything of it until about an hour
> > later when the hotel people brought up an entire buffet of food for us--
> > sandwiches, pasta, pizza, the whole works-- and said it was compliments
> > of Madonna.
> >
> > I've always had a favorable impression of her, which is why it's such a
> > shame to see what she's done to herself with plastic surgery.
> >
> There's a strange mix of good people and a-holes among the celebs and
> I'm not sure what makes for the difference. Always glad to hear when
> they do something nice just for the sake of being nice and not for the
> publicity.

On Thu, 09 Feb 2023 10:28:42 -0800, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:

>In article <4vh9uhto1echns0hcomnmk7h22acbkfn3g@4ax.com>,
> shawn <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 08 Feb 2023 19:59:05 +0000, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>
>> >On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
>> >> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
>> >>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>> >>>
>>>>>> Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and
>>>>>> empty the revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a
>>>>>> name for herself with highly sexualized videos that mocked
>>>>>> religion, made a presentation at the awards show honoring those
>>>>>> who had picked up her torch of rebellion.
>
>>>>>> The real question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna
>>>>>> championed has now been accepted by corporate America; every
>>>>>> attitude about sexuality or religion has been adopted by the
>>>>>> public school system. Madonna's face is almost unrecognizable. A
>>>>>> weird collection of plastic surgery procedures, undergone in an
>>>>>> attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist looking
>>>>>> like a caricature.
>> >>>
>> >>> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
>> >>> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
>> >>> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on the
>> >>> make-up FX.
>>
>> Wow, I looked up her pics from the Grammy's and I see what you are
>> saying. At first I thought this was some sort of digital altered image
>> of Madonna and not a live image, but it was her on the stage. She
>> really has taken the idea of not aging too far. I get that no one
>> wants to see themselves changing too much as they age but there's such
>> a thing as going way too far.
>
>Aging the way nature intended is always the preferable route to go. No
>matter who you are, there's going to come time when you're no longer the
>hot smokeshow you once were. It's just a question of whether you're
>going to age with dignity or look like a freak show.

Agreed. I would point to her having makeup people on her permanent
staff as one approach that I could understand for someone in her
position. Someone to see to her skin routine and keep abreast of any
new products that might be more useful. Not constantly getting botox
or fillers to try and repair what aging does to us all.
>I would point to Hellen Mirren and Faith Hill on the YELLOWSTONE
>spin-offs as examples of women who were hotties in their prime and are
>now aging naturally without stretching their faces into rubber bands and
>they look just fine.
>
>> >> I knew Madonna a little bit back around 1977. She was one of the
>> >> Second Avenue people in Manhattan, and she was friends with my
>> >> girlfriend of the time. I thought Madonna was kinda exotic because
>> >> she'd posed nude for pictures. (We lived shallow lives back then.)
>> >> She was nice.
>> >
>> > Yes, back around 2005 or so, I was working a protective detail for a
>> > foreign head of state at the U.N. Assembly in NYC. The MTV Video Awards
>> > were going on the same week. Our guy had half the hotel floor and Madonna
>> > and her entourage had the other half.
>> >
>> > One of the nights, she and her crew came back from wherever they'd been
>> > partying and as they came off the elevators, she saw us standing in the
>> > hallway in front of the prime minister's door. She asked if we had to do
>> > that all night and when we said yes, she asked how we got anything to eat.
>> > We said we typically bring energy bars and other snacks with us to eat
>> > during our shift. She just kind of frowned and walked away. We thought it
>> > was kind of weird but didn't think anything of it until about an hour
>> > later when the hotel people brought up an entire buffet of food for us--
>> > sandwiches, pasta, pizza, the whole works-- and said it was compliments
>> > of Madonna.
>> >
>> > I've always had a favorable impression of her, which is why it's such a
>> > shame to see what she's done to herself with plastic surgery.
>> >
>> There's a strange mix of good people and a-holes among the celebs and
>> I'm not sure what makes for the difference. Always glad to hear when
>> they do something nice just for the sake of being nice and not for the
>> publicity.

On Feb 9, 2023 at 11:29:45 AM PST, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com>
wrote:

> On Thu, 09 Feb 2023 10:28:42 -0800, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>
>> In article <4vh9uhto1echns0hcomnmk7h22acbkfn3g@4ax.com>,
>> shawn <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, 08 Feb 2023 19:59:05 +0000, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> >On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
>>> >> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >>> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
>>> >>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>>> >>>
>>>>>>> Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and
>>>>>>> empty the revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a
>>>>>>> name for herself with highly sexualized videos that mocked
>>>>>>> religion, made a presentation at the awards show honoring those
>>>>>>> who had picked up her torch of rebellion.
>>
>>>>>>> The real question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna
>>>>>>> championed has now been accepted by corporate America; every
>>>>>>> attitude about sexuality or religion has been adopted by the
>>>>>>> public school system. Madonna's face is almost unrecognizable. A
>>>>>>> weird collection of plastic surgery procedures, undergone in an
>>>>>>> attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist looking
>>>>>>> like a caricature.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
>>> >>> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
>>> >>> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on the
>>> >>> make-up FX.
>>>
>>> Wow, I looked up her pics from the Grammy's and I see what you are
>>> saying. At first I thought this was some sort of digital altered image
>>> of Madonna and not a live image, but it was her on the stage. She
>>> really has taken the idea of not aging too far. I get that no one
>>> wants to see themselves changing too much as they age but there's such
>>> a thing as going way too far.
>>
>> Aging the way nature intended is always the preferable route to go. No
>> matter who you are, there's going to come time when you're no longer the
>> hot smokeshow you once were. It's just a question of whether you're
>> going to age with dignity or look like a freak show.
>
> Agreed. I would point to her having makeup people on her permanent
> staff as one approach that I could understand for someone in her
> position. Someone to see to her skin routine and keep abreast of any
> new products that might be more useful. Not constantly getting botox
> or fillers to try and repair what aging does to us all.

Susanna Hoffs of the Bangles is 64 years old, the same age as Madonna, and she
looks like this:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/sosp6kxx1b6hgp8/Bangles.png?dl=0

That's the way to do it.

In article <XY-cnWSP8a42N3j-nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@giganews.com>, BTR1701
<atropos@mac.com> wrote:

> On Feb 9, 2023 at 11:29:45 AM PST, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com>
> wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 09 Feb 2023 10:28:42 -0800, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
> >
> >> In article <4vh9uhto1echns0hcomnmk7h22acbkfn3g@4ax.com>,
> >> shawn <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Wed, 08 Feb 2023 19:59:05 +0000, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> >On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> >> In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
> >>> >> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
> >>> >>
> >>> >>> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
> >>> >>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
> >>> >>>
> >>>>>>> Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and
> >>>>>>> empty the revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a
> >>>>>>> name for herself with highly sexualized videos that mocked
> >>>>>>> religion, made a presentation at the awards show honoring those
> >>>>>>> who had picked up her torch of rebellion.
> >>
> >>>>>>> The real question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna
> >>>>>>> championed has now been accepted by corporate America; every
> >>>>>>> attitude about sexuality or religion has been adopted by the
> >>>>>>> public school system. Madonna's face is almost unrecognizable. A
> >>>>>>> weird collection of plastic surgery procedures, undergone in an
> >>>>>>> attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist looking
> >>>>>>> like a caricature.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
> >>> >>> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her.
> >>> >>> Looked
> >>> >>> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on
> >>> >>> the
> >>> >>> make-up FX.
> >>>
> >>> Wow, I looked up her pics from the Grammy's and I see what you are
> >>> saying. At first I thought this was some sort of digital altered image
> >>> of Madonna and not a live image, but it was her on the stage. She
> >>> really has taken the idea of not aging too far. I get that no one
> >>> wants to see themselves changing too much as they age but there's such
> >>> a thing as going way too far.
> >>
> >> Aging the way nature intended is always the preferable route to go. No
> >> matter who you are, there's going to come time when you're no longer the
> >> hot smokeshow you once were. It's just a question of whether you're
> >> going to age with dignity or look like a freak show.
> >
> > Agreed. I would point to her having makeup people on her permanent
> > staff as one approach that I could understand for someone in her
> > position. Someone to see to her skin routine and keep abreast of any
> > new products that might be more useful. Not constantly getting botox
> > or fillers to try and repair what aging does to us all.
>
> Susanna Hoffs of the Bangles is 64 years old, the same age as Madonna, and she
> looks like this:
>
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/sosp6kxx1b6hgp8/Bangles.png?dl=0
>
> That's the way to do it.

She always was a goddess.

BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>On Feb 9, 2023 at 11:29:45 AM PST, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com>
>wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 09 Feb 2023 10:28:42 -0800, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>
>>> In article <4vh9uhto1echns0hcomnmk7h22acbkfn3g@4ax.com>,
>>> shawn <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Wed, 08 Feb 2023 19:59:05 +0000, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> >On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
>>>> >> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
>>>> >>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and
>>>>>>>> empty the revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a
>>>>>>>> name for herself with highly sexualized videos that mocked
>>>>>>>> religion, made a presentation at the awards show honoring those
>>>>>>>> who had picked up her torch of rebellion.
>>>
>>>>>>>> The real question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna
>>>>>>>> championed has now been accepted by corporate America; every
>>>>>>>> attitude about sexuality or religion has been adopted by the
>>>>>>>> public school system. Madonna's face is almost unrecognizable. A
>>>>>>>> weird collection of plastic surgery procedures, undergone in an
>>>>>>>> attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist looking
>>>>>>>> like a caricature.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
>>>> >>> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
>>>> >>> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go
>cheap on the
>>>> >>> make-up FX.
>>>>
>>>> Wow, I looked up her pics from the Grammy's and I see what you are
>>>> saying. At first I thought this was some sort of digital altered image
>>>> of Madonna and not a live image, but it was her on the stage. She
>>>> really has taken the idea of not aging too far. I get that no one
>>>> wants to see themselves changing too much as they age but there's such
>>>> a thing as going way too far.
>>>
>>> Aging the way nature intended is always the preferable route to go. No
>>> matter who you are, there's going to come time when you're no longer the
>>> hot smokeshow you once were. It's just a question of whether you're
>>> going to age with dignity or look like a freak show.
>>
>> Agreed. I would point to her having makeup people on her permanent
>> staff as one approach that I could understand for someone in her
>> position. Someone to see to her skin routine and keep abreast of any
>> new products that might be more useful. Not constantly getting botox
>> or fillers to try and repair what aging does to us all.
>
>Susanna Hoffs of the Bangles is 64 years old, the same age as Madonna, and she
>looks like this:
>
>https://www.dropbox.com/s/sosp6kxx1b6hgp8/Bangles.png?dl=0
>
>That's the way to do it.

Picture of Dorian Grey?

On Fri, 10 Feb 2023 02:23:39 +0000, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:

>On Feb 9, 2023 at 11:29:45 AM PST, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com>
>wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 09 Feb 2023 10:28:42 -0800, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>
>>> In article <4vh9uhto1echns0hcomnmk7h22acbkfn3g@4ax.com>,
>>> shawn <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Wed, 08 Feb 2023 19:59:05 +0000, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> >On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
>>>> >> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
>>>> >>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and
>>>>>>>> empty the revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a
>>>>>>>> name for herself with highly sexualized videos that mocked
>>>>>>>> religion, made a presentation at the awards show honoring those
>>>>>>>> who had picked up her torch of rebellion.
>>>
>>>>>>>> The real question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna
>>>>>>>> championed has now been accepted by corporate America; every
>>>>>>>> attitude about sexuality or religion has been adopted by the
>>>>>>>> public school system. Madonna's face is almost unrecognizable. A
>>>>>>>> weird collection of plastic surgery procedures, undergone in an
>>>>>>>> attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist looking
>>>>>>>> like a caricature.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
>>>> >>> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
>>>> >>> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on the
>>>> >>> make-up FX.
>>>>
>>>> Wow, I looked up her pics from the Grammy's and I see what you are
>>>> saying. At first I thought this was some sort of digital altered image
>>>> of Madonna and not a live image, but it was her on the stage. She
>>>> really has taken the idea of not aging too far. I get that no one
>>>> wants to see themselves changing too much as they age but there's such
>>>> a thing as going way too far.
>>>
>>> Aging the way nature intended is always the preferable route to go. No
>>> matter who you are, there's going to come time when you're no longer the
>>> hot smokeshow you once were. It's just a question of whether you're
>>> going to age with dignity or look like a freak show.
>>
>> Agreed. I would point to her having makeup people on her permanent
>> staff as one approach that I could understand for someone in her
>> position. Someone to see to her skin routine and keep abreast of any
>> new products that might be more useful. Not constantly getting botox
>> or fillers to try and repair what aging does to us all.
>
>Susanna Hoffs of the Bangles is 64 years old, the same age as Madonna, and she
>looks like this:
>
>https://www.dropbox.com/s/sosp6kxx1b6hgp8/Bangles.png?dl=0
>
>That's the way to do it.
>

I know. I saw her and Aimee Mann in a music video from a year ago. She
was looking great then. Not quite the same as when she was originally
with the Bangles but still quite the lovely woman.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBmhCgaZ8m8

The thing with Madonna is that she wasn't a bad looking woman before
hand and with her money she could be looking much more like her old
self without all that filler and plastic surgery. Which was apparently
her goal, to look like her twenty something self. Instead she looks
like some sort of plastic doll that was supposed to resemble Madonna.

Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>> On Feb 9, 2023 at 11:29:45 AM PST, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, 09 Feb 2023 10:28:42 -0800, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In article <4vh9uhto1echns0hcomnmk7h22acbkfn3g@4ax.com>,
>>>> shawn <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, 08 Feb 2023 19:59:05 +0000, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
>>>>>>> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
>>>>>>>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and
>>>>>>>>> empty the revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a
>>>>>>>>> name for herself with highly sexualized videos that mocked
>>>>>>>>> religion, made a presentation at the awards show honoring those
>>>>>>>>> who had picked up her torch of rebellion.
>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The real question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna
>>>>>>>>> championed has now been accepted by corporate America; every
>>>>>>>>> attitude about sexuality or religion has been adopted by the
>>>>>>>>> public school system. Madonna's face is almost unrecognizable. A
>>>>>>>>> weird collection of plastic surgery procedures, undergone in an
>>>>>>>>> attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist looking
>>>>>>>>> like a caricature.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
>>>>>>>> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
>>>>>>>> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go
>> cheap on the
>>>>>>>> make-up FX.
>>>>>
>>>>> Wow, I looked up her pics from the Grammy's and I see what you are
>>>>> saying. At first I thought this was some sort of digital altered image
>>>>> of Madonna and not a live image, but it was her on the stage. She
>>>>> really has taken the idea of not aging too far. I get that no one
>>>>> wants to see themselves changing too much as they age but there's such
>>>>> a thing as going way too far.
>>>>
>>>> Aging the way nature intended is always the preferable route to go. No
>>>> matter who you are, there's going to come time when you're no longer the
>>>> hot smokeshow you once were. It's just a question of whether you're
>>>> going to age with dignity or look like a freak show.
>>>
>>> Agreed. I would point to her having makeup people on her permanent
>>> staff as one approach that I could understand for someone in her
>>> position. Someone to see to her skin routine and keep abreast of any
>>> new products that might be more useful. Not constantly getting botox
>>> or fillers to try and repair what aging does to us all.
>>
>> Susanna Hoffs of the Bangles is 64 years old, the same age as Madonna, and she
>> looks like this:
>>
>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/sosp6kxx1b6hgp8/Bangles.png?dl=0
>>
>> That's the way to do it.
>
> Picture of Dorian Grey?
>

Shania Twain has one of those as well.

--
The last thing I want to do is hurt you, but it is still on my list.

On 2/9/23 8:23 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> On Feb 9, 2023 at 11:29:45 AM PST, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 09 Feb 2023 10:28:42 -0800, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>
>>> In article <4vh9uhto1echns0hcomnmk7h22acbkfn3g@4ax.com>,
>>> shawn <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Wed, 08 Feb 2023 19:59:05 +0000, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> >On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
>>>> >> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
>>>> >>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and
>>>>>>>> empty the revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a
>>>>>>>> name for herself with highly sexualized videos that mocked
>>>>>>>> religion, made a presentation at the awards show honoring those
>>>>>>>> who had picked up her torch of rebellion.
>>>
>>>>>>>> The real question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna
>>>>>>>> championed has now been accepted by corporate America; every
>>>>>>>> attitude about sexuality or religion has been adopted by the
>>>>>>>> public school system. Madonna's face is almost unrecognizable. A
>>>>>>>> weird collection of plastic surgery procedures, undergone in an
>>>>>>>> attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist looking
>>>>>>>> like a caricature.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
>>>> >>> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her. Looked
>>>> >>> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on the
>>>> >>> make-up FX.
>>>>
>>>> Wow, I looked up her pics from the Grammy's and I see what you are
>>>> saying. At first I thought this was some sort of digital altered image
>>>> of Madonna and not a live image, but it was her on the stage. She
>>>> really has taken the idea of not aging too far. I get that no one
>>>> wants to see themselves changing too much as they age but there's such
>>>> a thing as going way too far.
>>>
>>> Aging the way nature intended is always the preferable route to go. No
>>> matter who you are, there's going to come time when you're no longer the
>>> hot smokeshow you once were. It's just a question of whether you're
>>> going to age with dignity or look like a freak show.
>>
>> Agreed. I would point to her having makeup people on her permanent
>> staff as one approach that I could understand for someone in her
>> position. Someone to see to her skin routine and keep abreast of any
>> new products that might be more useful. Not constantly getting botox
>> or fillers to try and repair what aging does to us all.
>
> Susanna Hoffs of the Bangles is 64 years old, the same age as Madonna, and she
> looks like this:
>
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/sosp6kxx1b6hgp8/Bangles.png?dl=0
>
> That's the way to do it.

Well anonyshitted.

On 2/9/23 9:29 PM, A Friend wrote:
> In article <XY-cnWSP8a42N3j-nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@giganews.com>, BTR1701
> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>
>> On Feb 9, 2023 at 11:29:45 AM PST, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, 09 Feb 2023 10:28:42 -0800, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In article <4vh9uhto1echns0hcomnmk7h22acbkfn3g@4ax.com>,
>>>> shawn <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, 08 Feb 2023 19:59:05 +0000, BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> >On Feb 8, 2023 at 11:19:03 AM PST, "A Friend" <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>>>>> >
>>>>> >> In article <atropos-B3AE04.10571008022023@news.giganews.com>, BTR1701
>>>>> >> <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>> In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>,
>>>>> >>> Ubiquitous <weberm@polaris.net> wrote:
>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>> Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and
>>>>>>>>> empty the revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a
>>>>>>>>> name for herself with highly sexualized videos that mocked
>>>>>>>>> religion, made a presentation at the awards show honoring those
>>>>>>>>> who had picked up her torch of rebellion.
>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The real question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna
>>>>>>>>> championed has now been accepted by corporate America; every
>>>>>>>>> attitude about sexuality or religion has been adopted by the
>>>>>>>>> public school system. Madonna's face is almost unrecognizable. A
>>>>>>>>> weird collection of plastic surgery procedures, undergone in an
>>>>>>>>> attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist looking
>>>>>>>>> like a caricature.
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>> I saw some pictures of her at the Grammy's and I thought I was being
>>>>> >>> punked. No way that's Madonna, I said. Looks nothing like her.
>>>>> >>> Looked
>>>>> >>> like the villain in low-budget horror movie that had to go cheap on
>>>>> >>> the
>>>>> >>> make-up FX.
>>>>>
>>>>> Wow, I looked up her pics from the Grammy's and I see what you are
>>>>> saying. At first I thought this was some sort of digital altered image
>>>>> of Madonna and not a live image, but it was her on the stage. She
>>>>> really has taken the idea of not aging too far. I get that no one
>>>>> wants to see themselves changing too much as they age but there's such
>>>>> a thing as going way too far.
>>>>
>>>> Aging the way nature intended is always the preferable route to go. No
>>>> matter who you are, there's going to come time when you're no longer the
>>>> hot smokeshow you once were. It's just a question of whether you're
>>>> going to age with dignity or look like a freak show.
>>>
>>> Agreed. I would point to her having makeup people on her permanent
>>> staff as one approach that I could understand for someone in her
>>> position. Someone to see to her skin routine and keep abreast of any
>>> new products that might be more useful. Not constantly getting botox
>>> or fillers to try and repair what aging does to us all.
>>
>> Susanna Hoffs of the Bangles is 64 years old, the same age as Madonna, and she
>> looks like this:
>>
>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/sosp6kxx1b6hgp8/Bangles.png?dl=0
>>
>> That's the way to do it.
>
>
> She always was a goddess.

Some women age better than others. Sophia Loren was still gorgeous at 80.

"Barr. Mark Cohen" wrote in message
news:20230208094848.6F805EFBFA7D4A1F@gmail.com...
>In article <ts04dv$5mor$4@dont-email.me>, weberm@polaris.net wrote:
>
>>Over the weekend, a very mediocre British musician by the name of Sam Smith
>>attempted to generate controversy by dancing in satanic garb while performing
>>at the Grammy Awards. Smith, who has declared himself non-binary, sang a song
>>named "Unholy" along with trans performer Kim Petras while dancers in satanic
>>horns, leather lingerie, and whips surrounded the duo on stage.
>>
>>If you were unaware that the Grammys were broadcast, or that they even exist,
>>you're in good company. No one cares about these self-congratulatory media
>>spectacles any more, and Smith's performance was obviously designed as a
>>desperate bid for relevance. In the past, transgression has been an easy way
>>to generate outrage and gain attention for America's degenerate cultural
>>elites, but the only remarkable thing about Smith's antics was how lazy,
>>safe, and banal they really were.
>>
>>The left is a coalition of those who stand to gain from deconstructing
>>Western civilization, and Christianity is one of their favorite targets.
>>Progressives generate political power by deconstructing the nation's
>>heritage, its families, and its values, but they seem most gleeful when they
>>get the opportunity to attack its dominant religion.
>>
>>They don't want you to see this ... Big Tech does its best to limit what
>>news you see. Make sure you see our stories daily -- directly to your inbox.
>>Rather than build something of substance by venerating the good, beautiful,
>>and true, the vast majority of leftists' art and culture for many decades
>>has been built entirely on subversion. At first these television shows,
>>movies, and songs had interesting things to say. There were, of course, many
>>instances of hypocrisy and contradictions that early works of this type could
>>examine. But when a cultural movement's only trick is the deconstruction of
>>the culture that came before it, that movement is living on borrowed time.
>>
>>Smith's performance would like to recreate the shocked indignation of old,
>>the kind of scandal that caused outraged parents to rail against the sexually
>>charged performances of Madonna or inspired Tipper Gore to lead a campaign of
>>censorship targeting bands like Motley Crue and Twisted Sister. But those
>>days are far in the rearview mirror. Hollywood, the music industry, academia,
>>and every other major cultural force in America have done nothing but
>>challenge, deconstruct, and transgress these boundaries while building
>>nothing of their own, and frankly, it has become a bloodless and depressing
>>affair.
>>
>>Madonna herself may have been the poster child for how sad and empty the
>>revolution has become. The aging pop star, who made a name for herself with
>>highly sexualized videos that mocked religion, made a presentation at the
>>awards show honoring those who had picked up her torch of rebellion. The
>>real question is: Rebellion against what? Every cause Madonna championed has
>>now been accepted by corporate America; every attitude about sexuality or
>>religion has been adopted by the public school system. Madonna's face is
>>almost unrecognizable. A weird collection of plastic surgery procedures,
>>undergone in an attempt to stay young and relevant, have left the artist
>>looking like a caricature. A musician who once relied on youth, beauty, and
>>subversion now desperately tries to stay relevant and edgy by pushing a
>>revolution that became mainstream and boring many decades ago: a perfect
>>reflection of the pop culture complex in its entirety.
>>
>>Far from challenging power or the established cultural norms, Smith's cartoon
>>satanism and LGBTQ politics embrace the mainstream narrative pushed by every
>>major institution in the United States. The singer has the same politics and
>>cultural beliefs espoused by Citibank, Google, Goldman Sachs, and Walmart.
>>There was never any danger of real consequences or cancellation. It was the
>>safest performance imaginable.
>>
>>If Smith were really interested in causing controversy, he could have mocked
>>Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, or any other religion, but he chose Christianity
>>because he understood that it is the one target for which he will receive
>>zero pushback. It would have been equally tasteless, but at least it would
>>have showed willingness to challenge the popular narrative.
>>
>>If Smith were really interested in challenging established power, he could
>>have questioned the trans movement, abortion, or the corporate leviathan
>>that seems so obsessed with destroying the American family, but he is a
>>coward masquerading as a rebel, so he simply parrots the positions of the
>>powerful. After the pop star's performance, an advertisement aired proudly
>>proclaiming that the celebration of satanic imagery had been brought to the
>>viewer by Pfizer, the same pharmaceutical giant responsible for the dubious
>>COVID-19 vaccine. Good to know that the Lord still has a sense of humor.
>>
>>Progressivism is a cultural vampire feeding on the bones of a once-great
>>Christian culture, but as it cleans the last bit of marrow from those bones,
>>it becomes desperate. How do you keep a coalition together that was organized
>>around the deconstruction of traditional American culture once you have
>>consumed that culture entirely? The hedonism and social atomization the left
>>offers do little to create a new and dynamic cultural force. There is no
>>substance on which progressives can create a foundation. If your cultural
>>movement is built entirely on deconstruction, once you exhaust the energy
>>generated by outrage, the only thing left to do is make the deconstruction
>>of the ritual a ritual unto itself.
>>
>>Progressives have created sacraments for themselves like transition,
>>abortion, and coming out, but these rituals lose all of their animating
>>energy when the forces they were aimed at no longer hold cultural sway. The
>>left can parade around "The Handmaid's Tale" or any other delusional
>>boogieman of Christianity it would like, but it is becoming increasingly
>>difficult for anyone to pretend these straw men pose any real threat to
>>progressive hegemony. While the left is committed to all kinds of horrible
>>atrocities, it may be that the response progressives fear most to their
>>tired and stale brand of corporate rebellion is a bored yawn.
>>
>>--
>>Let's go Brandon!
>
>Damn this was some powerful writing from Auron MacIntyre.
>
>Some of his best lines:
>
>"Progressivism is a cultural vampire feeding on the bones of a once-great
>Christian culture, but as it cleans the last bit of marrow from those bones,
>it becomes desperate."
>
>"If your cultural movement is built entirely on deconstruction, once you
>exhaust the energy generated by outrage, the only thing left to do is make the
>deconstruction of the ritual a ritual unto itself.
>
>Progressives have created sacraments for themselves like transition, abortion,
>and coming out, but these rituals lose all of their animating energy when the
>forces they were aimed at no longer hold cultural sway."
>
>Well done

It is for this reason that our culture has become so boring.

Reboots, remakes, remixes, sequels, prequels, attacking the same cultural
pillars...
nothing new is being created because they’re utterly bereft of any creativity.

They’ve only been taught that everything is ugly, they don’t understand beauty.

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

On Thu, 09 Feb 2023 23:02:06 -0500, shawn
<nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:

>The thing with Madonna is that she wasn't a bad looking woman before
>hand and with her money she could be looking much more like her old
>self without all that filler and plastic surgery. Which was apparently
>her goal, to look like her twenty something self. Instead she looks
>like some sort of plastic doll that was supposed to resemble Madonna.

So the female Dorian Gray?

On Fri, 10 Feb 2023 16:16:04 -0800, The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca>
wrote:

>On Thu, 09 Feb 2023 23:02:06 -0500, shawn
><nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:
>
>>The thing with Madonna is that she wasn't a bad looking woman before
>>hand and with her money she could be looking much more like her old
>>self without all that filler and plastic surgery. Which was apparently
>>her goal, to look like her twenty something self. Instead she looks
>>like some sort of plastic doll that was supposed to resemble Madonna.
>
>So the female Dorian Gray?

If you assume that she is both Dorian Gray and the painting. So she's
some sort of bizarre combination of the two.