Two dorm directors at a Christian college were fired for stating
pronouns in email messages. Now, these two people are not transgender,
it's just that they don't have first names in which gender is known.

The man was named Shua and the woman Raegan.

The college ordered no gender identifier lines in email; these two
refused to follow the order.

Using 'he/him,' 'she/her' in emails got 2 dorm directors fired at small
New York Christian college
By BOBBY CAINA CALVAN
AP
May 21, 2023
https://apnews.com/article/houghton-university-gender-pronouns-firings-03bdb3f62a95ac2921c31202d6520ae4

On 2023-05-21 3:08 PM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
> Two dorm directors at a Christian college were fired for stating
> pronouns in email messages. Now, these two people are not transgender,
> it's just that they don't have first names in which gender is known.
>
> The man was named Shua and the woman Raegan.
>
> The college ordered no gender identifier lines in email; these two
> refused to follow the order.
>
> Using 'he/him,' 'she/her' in emails got 2 dorm directors fired at small
> New York Christian college
> By BOBBY CAINA CALVAN
> AP
> May 21, 2023
> https://apnews.com/article/houghton-university-gender-pronouns-firings-03bdb3f62a95ac2921c31202d6520ae4

Nobody has ever asked me to put my pronouns in my email sig and I will
never do so voluntarily. (If someone guesses wrong, I will be bemused,
not furious.) That said, firing people whose names are not obviously
male or female who merely used pronouns to make it clear to people they
were communicating with seems ludicrous.

Then again, I can see why that could cause problems. After all, anyone
from the alphabet Mafia could simply declare that they were doing the
same thing: making it easier for people to know how to address them. Of
course that would be deceptive since the alphabet people mostly use
pronouns and genders that they have only just invented and bear no
relation to actual human biology. Also, the alphabet people bear extreme
malice towards anyone that doesn't use their chosen pronouns whereas I
rather expect that the two dorm directors were just trying to be helpful
for people that might have wondered if they were male or female and
wouldn't have lost their shit if someone who hadn't seen their sigs
"mis-gendered" them.

I was "mis-gendered" once, back around 1980 before "mis-gendering" was
"a thing". I was working in a record store in a mall and one day, I was
sorting out some 45s while sitting on the floor in front of where we
displayed them. A young person approached and said "Miss? Miss?". Based
on his proximity, I realized this customer must have been wanting to
talk to a staff member and since none of my female colleagues were on
duty, I turned to see what his question was. He looked embarrassed when
he saw that I was male but I ignored that and dealt with his question. I
was not traumatized and I doubt he was either. The long hair I had at
the time led him to make an honest mistake when all he could see was the
back of my head. Big whoop! Make that same mistake today and I would
expect much more serious consequences if the "mis-gendered" person was a
member of the alphabet Mafia....

--
Rhino

Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
> Two dorm directors at a Christian college were fired for stating
> pronouns in email messages. Now, these two people are not transgender,
> it's just that they don't have first names in which gender is known.
>
> The man was named Shua and the woman Raegan.
>
> The college ordered no gender identifier lines in email; these two
> refused to follow the order.
>
> Using 'he/him,' 'she/her' in emails got 2 dorm directors fired at small
> New York Christian college
> By BOBBY CAINA CALVAN
> AP
> May 21, 2023
> https://apnews.com/article/houghton-university-gender-pronouns-firings-03bdb3f62a95ac2921c31202d6520ae4
>

Good. They deserved to be fired.

“Here are the rules. Follow them or be fired.“

“we don’t have to follow your rules because we have stupid names“

“you’re fired“

That’s fairly straightforward.

And they’re complaining that following the rules won’t allow people to
gender them. Are we supposed to be able to gender them?

It’s not like this is one rule that just came out of nowhere picking on
them. The college makes them use only certain fonts and colors in their
email for branding purposes!?

I want to see somebody get fired for sending pink email in courier italic.

I did a search on this and found that both of these idiots had already quit
their jobs and then started sending out emails that broke the rules just to
cause trouble and now they’re all upset because they caused trouble.

Here’s the letter firing her:

https://64.media.tumblr.com/df94b73f448643eed9a319d73671c244/c72cedab4a9d6fb4-3f/s540x810/c66a757f01fb05a5d12af18cae27c485430f0adc.jpg

She can only get food to go now! That’ll teach the bitch!

He’s on Facebook, asking for donations to sponsor him on a mission to South
America to subvert their native beliefs.

--
The last thing I want to do is hurt you, but it is still on my list.

Rhino <no_offline_contact@example.com> wrote:
> On 2023-05-21 3:08 PM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>> Two dorm directors at a Christian college were fired for stating
>> pronouns in email messages. Now, these two people are not transgender,
>> it's just that they don't have first names in which gender is known.
>>
>> The man was named Shua and the woman Raegan.
>>
>> The college ordered no gender identifier lines in email; these two
>> refused to follow the order.
>>
>> Using 'he/him,' 'she/her' in emails got 2 dorm directors fired at small
>> New York Christian college
>> By BOBBY CAINA CALVAN
>> AP
>> May 21, 2023
>> https://apnews.com/article/houghton-university-gender-pronouns-firings-03bdb3f62a95ac2921c31202d6520ae4
>
> Nobody has ever asked me to put my pronouns in my email sig and I will
> never do so voluntarily. (If someone guesses wrong, I will be bemused,
> not furious.) That said, firing people whose names are not obviously
> male or female who merely used pronouns to make it clear to people they
> were communicating with seems ludicrous.

See my other reply. Both of these people had already given notice that they
were leaving by September and just started sending out emails with their
pronouns to break the rules and cause trouble. The college responded by
telling them to get out by the end of the month instead of the end of the
summer. I see nothing ludicrous about it.

>
> Then again, I can see why that could cause problems. After all, anyone
> from the alphabet Mafia could simply declare that they were doing the
> same thing: making it easier for people to know how to address them. Of
> course that would be deceptive since the alphabet people mostly use
> pronouns and genders that they have only just invented and bear no
> relation to actual human biology. Also, the alphabet people bear extreme
> malice towards anyone that doesn't use their chosen pronouns whereas I
> rather expect that the two dorm directors were just trying to be helpful
> for people that might have wondered if they were male or female and
> wouldn't have lost their shit if someone who hadn't seen their sigs
> "mis-gendered" them.
>
> I was "mis-gendered" once, back around 1980 before "mis-gendering" was
> "a thing". I was working in a record store in a mall and one day, I was
> sorting out some 45s while sitting on the floor in front of where we
> displayed them. A young person approached and said "Miss? Miss?". Based
> on his proximity, I realized this customer must have been wanting to
> talk to a staff member and since none of my female colleagues were on
> duty, I turned to see what his question was. He looked embarrassed when
> he saw that I was male but I ignored that and dealt with his question. I
> was not traumatized and I doubt he was either. The long hair I had at
> the time led him to make an honest mistake when all he could see was the
> back of my head. Big whoop! Make that same mistake today and I would
> expect much more serious consequences if the "mis-gendered" person was a
> member of the alphabet Mafia....
>

--
The last thing I want to do is hurt you, but it is still on my list.

anim8rfsk <anim8rfsk@cox.net> wrote:
>Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

>>Two dorm directors at a Christian college were fired for stating
>>pronouns in email messages. Now, these two people are not transgender,
>>it's just that they don't have first names in which gender is known.

>>The man was named Shua and the woman Raegan.

>>The college ordered no gender identifier lines in email; these two
>>refused to follow the order.

>>Using 'he/him,' 'she/her' in emails got 2 dorm directors fired at small
>>New York Christian college
>>By BOBBY CAINA CALVAN
>>AP
>>May 21, 2023
>>https://apnews.com/article/houghton-university-gender-pronouns-firings-03bdb3f62a95ac2921c31202d6520ae4

>Good. They deserved to be fired.

>"Here are the rules. Follow them or be fired."

>"we don't have to follow your rules because we have stupid names"

>"you're fired"

>That's fairly straightforward.

>And they're complaining that following the rules won't allow people to
>gender them. Are we supposed to be able to gender them?

I object to using "gender" as a verb. I failed to snark.

>It's not like this is one rule that just came out of nowhere picking on
>them. The college makes them use only certain fonts and colors in their
>email for branding purposes!?

I failed to snark about that as well. When I send email messages, it's
plain text, no font choices and no colors at all. That's how Jesus would
have sent email messages.

>I want to see somebody get fired for sending pink email in courier italic.

.. . . on a mauve background.

>I did a search on this and found that both of these idiots had already quit
>their jobs and then started sending out emails that broke the rules just to
>cause trouble and now they're all upset because they caused trouble.

The article said she had already found another job.

>Here's the letter firing her:

>https://64.media.tumblr.com/df94b73f448643eed9a319d73671c244/c72cedab4a9d6fb4-3f/s540x810/c66a757f01fb05a5d12af18cae27c485430f0adc.jpg

They seem pissed.

>She can only get food to go now! That'll teach the bitch!

Heh

>He's on Facebook, asking for donations to sponsor him on a mission to South
>America to subvert their native beliefs.

The Man Who Would Be King?

In article
<1867336128.706398846.372295.anim8rfsk-cox.net@news.easynews.com>,
anim8rfsk <anim8rfsk@cox.net> wrote:

> Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
> > Two dorm directors at a Christian college were fired for stating
> > pronouns in email messages. Now, these two people are not transgender,
> > it's just that they don't have first names in which gender is known.
> >
> > The man was named Shua and the woman Raegan.
> >
> > The college ordered no gender identifier lines in email; these two
> > refused to follow the order.
> >
> > Using 'he/him,' 'she/her' in emails got 2 dorm directors fired at small
> > New York Christian college
> > By BOBBY CAINA CALVAN
> > AP
> > May 21, 2023
> >
> > https://apnews.com/article/houghton-university-gender-pronouns-firings-03bdb
> > 3f62a95ac2921c31202d6520ae4
> >
>
> Good. They deserved to be fired.
>
> ³Here are the rules. Follow them or be fired.³
>
> ³we don¹t have to follow your rules because we have stupid names³
>
> ³you¹re fired³
>
> That¹s fairly straightforward.
>
> And they¹re complaining that following the rules won¹t allow people to
> gender them. Are we supposed to be able to gender them?

Serious question: Would there have been a problem is they'd simply
signed off as Mr. Shua Smith and Ms. Raegan Jones?

A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
> In article
> <1867336128.706398846.372295.anim8rfsk-cox.net@news.easynews.com>,
> anim8rfsk <anim8rfsk@cox.net> wrote:
>
>> Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>>> Two dorm directors at a Christian college were fired for stating
>>> pronouns in email messages. Now, these two people are not transgender,
>>> it's just that they don't have first names in which gender is known.
>>>
>>> The man was named Shua and the woman Raegan.
>>>
>>> The college ordered no gender identifier lines in email; these two
>>> refused to follow the order.
>>>
>>> Using 'he/him,' 'she/her' in emails got 2 dorm directors fired at small
>>> New York Christian college
>>> By BOBBY CAINA CALVAN
>>> AP
>>> May 21, 2023
>>>
>>> https://apnews.com/article/houghton-university-gender-pronouns-firings-03bdb
>>> 3f62a95ac2921c31202d6520ae4
>>>
>>
>> Good. They deserved to be fired.
>>
>> ³Here are the rules. Follow them or be fired.³
>>
>> ³we don¹t have to follow your rules because we have stupid names³
>>
>> ³you¹re fired³
>>
>> That¹s fairly straightforward.
>>
>> And they¹re complaining that following the rules won¹t allow people to
>> gender them. Are we supposed to be able to gender them?
>
>
> Serious question: Would there have been a problem is they'd simply
> signed off as Mr. Shua Smith and Ms. Raegan Jones?
>

Good question. I’d have to see the rules and exactly what they said.
Everything I’ve read, said you weren’t allowed to specify pronouns among
other things, in what seems to be the equivalent of a signature line. If
that’s literally the rule, I would think your workaround would’ve been
fine.

--
The last thing I want to do is hurt you, but it is still on my list.

Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
> anim8rfsk <anim8rfsk@cox.net> wrote:
>> Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>
>>> Two dorm directors at a Christian college were fired for stating
>>> pronouns in email messages. Now, these two people are not transgender,
>>> it's just that they don't have first names in which gender is known.
>
>>> The man was named Shua and the woman Raegan.
>
>>> The college ordered no gender identifier lines in email; these two
>>> refused to follow the order.
>
>>> Using 'he/him,' 'she/her' in emails got 2 dorm directors fired at small
>>> New York Christian college
>>> By BOBBY CAINA CALVAN

I have no idea how to gender the author of this article.

>>> AP
>>> May 21, 2023
>>> https://apnews.com/article/houghton-university-gender-pronouns-firings-03bdb3f62a95ac2921c31202d6520ae4
>
>> Good. They deserved to be fired.
>
>> "Here are the rules. Follow them or be fired."
>
>> "we don't have to follow your rules because we have stupid names"
>
>> "you're fired"
>
>> That's fairly straightforward.
>
>> And they're complaining that following the rules won't allow people to
>> gender them. Are we supposed to be able to gender them?
>
> I object to using "gender" as a verb. I failed to snark.

As do I. So I did it twice. Trying to be as obnoxious as they were. I
didn’t even come close.

>
>> It's not like this is one rule that just came out of nowhere picking on
>> them. The college makes them use only certain fonts and colors in their
>> email for branding purposes!?
>
> I failed to snark about that as well. When I send email messages, it's
> plain text, no font choices and no colors at all. That's how Jesus would
> have sent email messages.

My business emails go out no frills plain text black-and-white.

My personal emails use colors because the default in Apple Mail uses
different colors as separators in quoted sections. Mostly that comes into
play when I send stuff from here to Robin and Ob Veeus.

>
>> I want to see somebody get fired for sending pink email in courier italic.
>
> . . . on a mauve background.

I’d like to see the style sheet. The JPEG of an official letter that I
posted an URL for here looked pretty plain Jane.

>
>> I did a search on this and found that both of these idiots had already quit
>> their jobs and then started sending out emails that broke the rules just to
>> cause trouble and now they're all upset because they caused trouble.
>
> The article said she had already found another job.
>
>> Here's the letter firing her:
>
>> https://64.media.tumblr.com/df94b73f448643eed9a319d73671c244/c72cedab4a9d6fb4-3f/s540x810/c66a757f01fb05a5d12af18cae27c485430f0adc.jpg
>
> They seem pissed.

I don’t blame them. Who the hell wants to take the time to deal with jerks
like this who are going to be gone soon anyway?

>
>> She can only get food to go now! That'll teach the bitch!
>
> Heh
>
>> He's on Facebook, asking for donations to sponsor him on a mission to South
>> America to subvert their native beliefs.
>
> The Man Who Would Be King?

I would be interested in knowing if these clowns were born with those clown
names, or if they changed their names to be obnoxious and cause trouble.

--
The last thing I want to do is hurt you, but it is still on my list.

On Sun, 21 May 2023 15:34:16 -0400, Rhino
<no_offline_contact@example.com> wrote:

>I was "mis-gendered" once, back around 1980 before "mis-gendering" was
>"a thing". I was working in a record store in a mall and one day, I was
>sorting out some 45s while sitting on the floor in front of where we
>displayed them. A young person approached and said "Miss? Miss?". Based
>on his proximity, I realized this customer must have been wanting to
>talk to a staff member and since none of my female colleagues were on
>duty, I turned to see what his question was. He looked embarrassed when
>he saw that I was male but I ignored that and dealt with his question. I
>was not traumatized and I doubt he was either. The long hair I had at
>the time led him to make an honest mistake when all he could see was the
>back of my head. Big whoop! Make that same mistake today and I would
>expect much more serious consequences if the "mis-gendered" person was a
>member of the alphabet Mafia....

So have I and they immediately corrected as soon as I said "how can I
help you today?"

Though even at my longest my hair was never longer than George
Harrison or Ringo Star.

As for 'the alphabet brigade' I'm willing to play ball on pronouns so
long as they're actual pronouns and not randomly composed "words".
After all if someone can specify 'laird' I can specify 'grandmaster'
or 'arbiter' (one of those titles I've earned the other not)

https://arbiters.fide.com/wp-content/uploads/Database/List_of_Arbiters.pdf

On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 1:00:47 AM UTC-4, The Horny Goat wrote:
> On Sun, 21 May 2023 15:34:16 -0400, Rhino
> <no_offlin...@example.com> wrote:
>
> >I was "mis-gendered" once, back around 1980 before "mis-gendering" was
> >"a thing". I was working in a record store in a mall and one day, I was
> >sorting out some 45s while sitting on the floor in front of where we
> >displayed them. A young person approached and said "Miss? Miss?". Based
> >on his proximity, I realized this customer must have been wanting to
> >talk to a staff member and since none of my female colleagues were on
> >duty, I turned to see what his question was. He looked embarrassed when
> >he saw that I was male but I ignored that and dealt with his question. I
> >was not traumatized and I doubt he was either. The long hair I had at
> >the time led him to make an honest mistake when all he could see was the
> >back of my head. Big whoop! Make that same mistake today and I would
> >expect much more serious consequences if the "mis-gendered" person was a
> >member of the alphabet Mafia....
> So have I and they immediately corrected as soon as I said "how can I
> help you today?"
>
> Though even at my longest my hair was never longer than George
> Harrison or Ringo Star.
>
> As for 'the alphabet brigade' I'm willing to play ball on pronouns so
> long as they're actual pronouns and not randomly composed "words".
> After all if someone can specify 'laird' I can specify 'grandmaster'
> or 'arbiter' (one of those titles I've earned the other not)
>
> https://arbiters.fide.com/wp-content/uploads/Database/List_of_Arbiters.pdf

I've seen some "pronouns" that do a fine job of making a mockery of something that badly needs mocking. Personally, I would choose something in the same vein if I were to play along with the pronoun game. Something like "the City of New Orleans" or "1952 Fender Stratocaster".