Police responded to a report of a person with a gunshot wound.

A man had shot himself in the leg. He was bleeding profusely; a
tourniquet was applied. (You'd think it would have occurred to him to
apply a tourniquet himself before bleeding to death.)

The victim stated that he had dreamed that there was an intruder. He
retrieved his gun, then shot at the intruder.

But he had shot himself in the leg, then woke up from the dream.

He's been charged with two felonies, possession Class 3 as his Firearm
Owner Identification Card had been revoked for reasons not stated,
and reckless discharge Class 4.

The guy was sleeping. Wouldn't the reckless discharge felony charge
violate mens rea?

https://www.facebook.com/LakeCoILSheriff/posts/648037367368163

On 2023-06-14 5:27 PM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
> Police responded to a report of a person with a gunshot wound.
>
> A man had shot himself in the leg. He was bleeding profusely; a
> tourniquet was applied. (You'd think it would have occurred to him to
> apply a tourniquet himself before bleeding to death.)
>
> The victim stated that he had dreamed that there was an intruder. He
> retrieved his gun, then shot at the intruder.
>
> But he had shot himself in the leg, then woke up from the dream.
>
> He's been charged with two felonies, possession Class 3 as his Firearm
> Owner Identification Card had been revoked for reasons not stated,
> and reckless discharge Class 4.
>
> The guy was sleeping. Wouldn't the reckless discharge felony charge
> violate mens rea?
>
Good point!

> https://www.facebook.com/LakeCoILSheriff/posts/648037367368163

I read about a similar case once, cited in a news article apparently
gathered by a Chicago journalist named Mike Royco, but in the case I'm
thinking about, the guy shot his own penis off. I suppose that was the
very last reckless discharge he ever had! (Sorry I couldn't help myself:
the double entendre could not be denied.)

--
Rhino

In article <u6dbcq$4d2r$1@dont-email.me>,
"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> Police responded to a report of a person with a gunshot wound.
>
> A man had shot himself in the leg. He was bleeding profusely; a
> tourniquet was applied. (You'd think it would have occurred to him to
> apply a tourniquet himself before bleeding to death.)
>
> The victim stated that he had dreamed that there was an intruder. He
> retrieved his gun, then shot at the intruder.
>
> But he had shot himself in the leg, then woke up from the dream.
>
> He's been charged with two felonies, possession Class 3 as his Firearm
> Owner Identification Card had been revoked for reasons not stated,
> and reckless discharge Class 4.
>
> The guy was sleeping. Wouldn't the reckless discharge felony charge
> violate mens rea?

I'm pretty sure they don't believe he was actually sleeping. They think
he's lying.

On 6/14/2023 5:47 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> In article <u6dbcq$4d2r$1@dont-email.me>,
> "Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>
>> Police responded to a report of a person with a gunshot wound.
>>
>> A man had shot himself in the leg. He was bleeding profusely; a
>> tourniquet was applied. (You'd think it would have occurred to him to
>> apply a tourniquet himself before bleeding to death.)
>>
>> The victim stated that he had dreamed that there was an intruder. He
>> retrieved his gun, then shot at the intruder.
>>
>> But he had shot himself in the leg, then woke up from the dream.
>>
>> He's been charged with two felonies, possession Class 3 as his Firearm
>> Owner Identification Card had been revoked for reasons not stated,
>> and reckless discharge Class 4.
>>
>> The guy was sleeping. Wouldn't the reckless discharge felony charge
>> violate mens rea?
>
> I'm pretty sure they don't believe he was actually sleeping. They think
> he's lying.

Maybe his carelessness before going to bed is what allowed the gun to be
discharged, the same as if a kid had wandered in and fired it.

On Wednesday, June 14, 2023 at 5:27:59 PM UTC-4, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
> Police responded to a report of a person

> But he had shot himself in the leg, then woke up from the dream.

Don't ya just hate when that happens?

BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

>>Police responded to a report of a person with a gunshot wound.

>>A man had shot himself in the leg. He was bleeding profusely; a
>>tourniquet was applied. (You'd think it would have occurred to him to
>>apply a tourniquet himself before bleeding to death.)

>>The victim stated that he had dreamed that there was an intruder. He
>>retrieved his gun, then shot at the intruder.

>>But he had shot himself in the leg, then woke up from the dream.

>>He's been charged with two felonies, possession Class 3 as his Firearm
>>Owner Identification Card had been revoked for reasons not stated,
>>and reckless discharge Class 4.

>>The guy was sleeping. Wouldn't the reckless discharge felony charge
>>violate mens rea?

>I'm pretty sure they don't believe he was actually sleeping. They think
>he's lying.

What, someone else was there and he got shot in a struggle for the gun?

In article <u6de3i$4mpv$1@dont-email.me>,
"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
> >"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>
> >>Police responded to a report of a person with a gunshot wound.
>
> >>A man had shot himself in the leg. He was bleeding profusely; a
> >>tourniquet was applied. (You'd think it would have occurred to him to
> >>apply a tourniquet himself before bleeding to death.)
>
> >>The victim stated that he had dreamed that there was an intruder. He
> >>retrieved his gun, then shot at the intruder.
>
> >>But he had shot himself in the leg, then woke up from the dream.
>
> >>He's been charged with two felonies, possession Class 3 as his Firearm
> >>Owner Identification Card had been revoked for reasons not stated,
> >>and reckless discharge Class 4.
>
> >>The guy was sleeping. Wouldn't the reckless discharge felony charge
> >>violate mens rea?
>
> >I'm pretty sure they don't believe he was actually sleeping. They think
> >he's lying.
>
> What, someone else was there and he got shot in a struggle for the gun?

Or he was just fucking around with it like an idiot and discharged it
and is trying to use the "I was asleep" as a defense against the
recklessness charge.

BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>In article <u6de3i$4mpv$1@dont-email.me>,
> "Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>
>> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>> >"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>>
>> >>Police responded to a report of a person with a gunshot wound.
>>
>> >>A man had shot himself in the leg. He was bleeding profusely; a
>> >>tourniquet was applied. (You'd think it would have occurred to him to
>> >>apply a tourniquet himself before bleeding to death.)
>>
>> >>The victim stated that he had dreamed that there was an intruder. He
>> >>retrieved his gun, then shot at the intruder.
>>
>> >>But he had shot himself in the leg, then woke up from the dream.
>>
>> >>He's been charged with two felonies, possession Class 3 as his Firearm
>> >>Owner Identification Card had been revoked for reasons not stated,
>> >>and reckless discharge Class 4.
>>
>> >>The guy was sleeping. Wouldn't the reckless discharge felony charge
>> >>violate mens rea?
>>
>> >I'm pretty sure they don't believe he was actually sleeping. They think
>> >he's lying.
>>
>> What, someone else was there and he got shot in a struggle for the gun?
>
>Or he was just fucking around with it like an idiot and discharged it
>and is trying to use the "I was asleep" as a defense against the
>recklessness charge.

Fair enough. It's still mean to charge him with a felony for injuring
himself.

In article <u6dnh8$5i4g$2@dont-email.me>, Adam H. Kerman
<ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
> >In article <u6de3i$4mpv$1@dont-email.me>,
> > "Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
> >
> >> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
> >> >"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> >>Police responded to a report of a person with a gunshot wound.
> >>
> >> >>A man had shot himself in the leg. He was bleeding profusely; a
> >> >>tourniquet was applied. (You'd think it would have occurred to him to
> >> >>apply a tourniquet himself before bleeding to death.)
> >>
> >> >>The victim stated that he had dreamed that there was an intruder. He
> >> >>retrieved his gun, then shot at the intruder.
> >>
> >> >>But he had shot himself in the leg, then woke up from the dream.
> >>
> >> >>He's been charged with two felonies, possession Class 3 as his Firearm
> >> >>Owner Identification Card had been revoked for reasons not stated,
> >> >>and reckless discharge Class 4.
> >>
> >> >>The guy was sleeping. Wouldn't the reckless discharge felony charge
> >> >>violate mens rea?
> >>
> >> >I'm pretty sure they don't believe he was actually sleeping. They think
> >> >he's lying.
> >>
> >> What, someone else was there and he got shot in a struggle for the gun?
> >
> >Or he was just fucking around with it like an idiot and discharged it
> >and is trying to use the "I was asleep" as a defense against the
> >recklessness charge.
>
> Fair enough. It's still mean to charge him with a felony for injuring
> himself.

They pretty much have to, or else they'd be accused of favoritism. The
charge will likely be dropped before long.

In <140620232233233305%nope@noway.com> A Friend <nope@noway.com> writes:

>In article <u6dnh8$5i4g$2@dont-email.me>, Adam H. Kerman
><ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

[snip]

>> Fair enough. It's still mean to charge him with a felony for injuring
>> himself.

>They pretty much have to, or else they'd be accused of favoritism. The
>charge will likely be dropped before long.

https://www.espn.com/blog/new-york-giants/post/_/id/58206/ten-years-later-how-plaxico-burress-shooting-unraveled-nfls-best-team

--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
dannyb@panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]

On Wed, 14 Jun 2023 21:27:54 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
<ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

>Police responded to a report of a person with a gunshot wound.
>
>A man had shot himself in the leg. He was bleeding profusely; a
>tourniquet was applied. (You'd think it would have occurred to him to
>apply a tourniquet himself before bleeding to death.)
>
>The victim stated that he had dreamed that there was an intruder. He
>retrieved his gun, then shot at the intruder.
>
>But he had shot himself in the leg, then woke up from the dream.
>
>He's been charged with two felonies, possession Class 3 as his Firearm
>Owner Identification Card had been revoked for reasons not stated,
>and reckless discharge Class 4.
>
>The guy was sleeping. Wouldn't the reckless discharge felony charge
>violate mens rea?
>
>https://www.facebook.com/LakeCoILSheriff/posts/648037367368163

He wasn't sleeping when he pulled the trigger .... nor when he got up,
presumably got dressed and fetched his gun.

On Thu, 15 Jun 2023 00:55:04 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
<ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

>BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>In article <u6de3i$4mpv$1@dont-email.me>,
>> "Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>>Or he was just fucking around with it like an idiot and discharged it
>>and is trying to use the "I was asleep" as a defense against the
>>recklessness charge.
>
>Fair enough. It's still mean to charge him with a felony for injuring
>himself.

I heard about one such case where the judge found him guilty of
reckless endangerment then suspended the sentence saying that the
accused had already given himself a far higher sentence than he the
judge ever would have!

The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca> wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Jun 2023 21:27:54 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
> <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>
>> Police responded to a report of a person with a gunshot wound.
>>
>> A man had shot himself in the leg. He was bleeding profusely; a
>> tourniquet was applied. (You'd think it would have occurred to him to
>> apply a tourniquet himself before bleeding to death.)
>>
>> The victim stated that he had dreamed that there was an intruder. He
>> retrieved his gun, then shot at the intruder.
>>
>> But he had shot himself in the leg, then woke up from the dream.
>>
>> He's been charged with two felonies, possession Class 3 as his Firearm
>> Owner Identification Card had been revoked for reasons not stated,
>> and reckless discharge Class 4.
>>
>> The guy was sleeping. Wouldn't the reckless discharge felony charge
>> violate mens rea?
>>
>> https://www.facebook.com/LakeCoILSheriff/posts/648037367368163
>
> He wasn't sleeping when he pulled the trigger .... nor when he got up,
> presumably got dressed and fetched his gun.
>

Might have been sleepwalking :-)

--
The last thing I want to do is hurt you, but it is still on my list.