On Tuesday, January 16, 2024 at 3:35:47 PM UTC-5, Zoya wrote:

> Oh dear. In future I should double-double check within Rekhta, or perhaps stick with more reliable sources, e.g. Platts.

Zoya sahiba, or more accurately, saahibah, you must exercise extreme precision and caution when posting here. I suggest you use your research skills before composing a note and then spend time to make sure it is all good and valid.

Friends,

I have a suggestion. Since this thread is already getting quite busy, after this google group actually goes defunct, it may not be easy for currently inactive old members or potential new members to find out our new address(es).

Once the dust settles down, will one of you please create a new thread, with an appropriate title, listing the three active options that we seem to have agreed on. So, basically a summarized list of the new sites with embedded links to access them. The future visitors will then be able to find us easily on the alternate sites where we might be hanging out.

I guess I could assign this task to myself, but I believe UVR/Amit/ Naseer sahibaan will be able to do a better job with it.

Meantime, let us continue in the thread. Such fun! :-))

Thank you.

________Zoya

On Tuesday, January 16, 2024 at 2:47:44 PM UTC-6, Shoaib Tanvir wrote:

> > Oh dear. In future I should double-double check within Rekhta, or perhaps stick with more reliable sources, e.g. Platts.

> Zoya sahiba, or more accurately, saahibah, you must exercise extreme precision and caution when posting here. I suggest you use your research skills before composing a note and then spend time to make sure it is all good and valid.

Oh dear dear!! You too?? :)

But I already work so hard to proof read my posts. I'm telling you, if I weren't so 'seasoned', you guys would scare me off this site. But I'm not going anywhere, or better still I'm going where y'all are going! :-))

________Zoya

On Tuesday 16 January 2024 at 21:03:57 UTC, Zoya wrote:
> On Tuesday, January 16, 2024 at 2:47:44 PM UTC-6, Shoaib Tanvir wrote:
>
> > > Oh dear. In future I should double-double check within Rekhta, or perhaps stick with more reliable sources, e.g. Platts.
>
> > Zoya sahiba, or more accurately, saahibah, you must exercise extreme precision and caution when posting here. I suggest you use your research skills before composing a note and then spend time to make sure it is all good and valid.
> Oh dear dear!! You too?? :)
>
> But I already work so hard to proof read my posts. I'm telling you, if I weren't so 'seasoned', you guys would scare me off this site. But I'm not going anywhere, or better still I'm going where y'all are going! :-))
>
> ________Zoya
Zoya SaaHibah, aadaab.

I suspect Shu3aib SaaHib is being a touch sarcastic, if I am not mistaken. You appear to be already aware of this. Naseer

On Tuesday, January 16, 2024 at 4:23:56 PM UTC-5, Naseer wrote:
> On Tuesday 16 January 2024 at 21:03:57 UTC, Zoya wrote:
> > On Tuesday, January 16, 2024 at 2:47:44 PM UTC-6, Shoaib Tanvir wrote:
> >
> > > > Oh dear. In future I should double-double check within Rekhta, or perhaps stick with more reliable sources, e.g. Platts.
> >
> > > Zoya sahiba, or more accurately, saahibah, you must exercise extreme precision and caution when posting here. I suggest you use your research skills before composing a note and then spend time to make sure it is all good and valid.
> > Oh dear dear!! You too?? :)
> >
> > But I already work so hard to proof read my posts. I'm telling you, if I weren't so 'seasoned', you guys would scare me off this site. But I'm not going anywhere, or better still I'm going where y'all are going! :-))
> >
> > ________Zoya
> Zoya SaaHibah, aadaab.
>
> I suspect Shu3aib SaaHib is being a touch sarcastic, if I am not mistaken.. You appear to be already aware of this. Naseer

Not sarcastic. I wouldn't dare! I am just being playful. :)

With best regards,

Shoaib Tanvir
---
Do. Or do not. There is no try.

On Tuesday, January 16, 2024 at 3:25:47 PM UTC-6, Shoaib Tanvir wrote:

> Not sarcastic. I wouldn't dare! I am just being playful. :)

> Shoaib Tanvir

Yup. Not sarcastic. Not with me. Never.
But......... :-))

On Tuesday, January 16, 2024 at 12:52:33 PM UTC-8, Zoya wrote:
> Friends,
>
> I have a suggestion. Since this thread is already getting quite busy, after this google group actually goes defunct, it may not be easy for currently inactive old members or potential new members to find out our new address(es).
>
> Once the dust settles down, will one of you please create a new thread, with an appropriate title, listing the three active options that we seem to have agreed on. So, basically a summarized list of the new sites with embedded links to access them. The future visitors will then be able to find us easily on the alternate sites where we might be hanging out.
>
> I guess I could assign this task to myself, but I believe UVR/Amit/ Naseer sahibaan will be able to do a better job with it.
>
> Meantime, let us continue in the thread. Such fun! :-))
>
> Thank you.
>
> ________Zoya

It's a good idea to keep posting the locations of the proposed alternate digs frequently -- I will do so on Sundays until Feb 18, and then on Feb 19, 20 and 21. Unless, of course, by then a clear "winner" has emerged amongst the options before then, in which case I will only post about that one option. There's no wisdom, is there, in telling someone they can have "fries, chips, or fruit" when they've already chosen the fruit option!

-UVR.

On Monday, January 15, 2024 at 9:19:56 PM UTC-8, Zoya wrote:
> Hello dear friends,
>
> Choices! I like that, feel much better already, the gloom is lifting. Thank you gentlemen. :-)
>
> Amit, I have already joined the 'Discord Alup'. I am new to that format, may get into some initiation hiccups, hopefully will be able to figure out the mechanics soon.
>
> UVR sahib, I have sent a request to join the 'other' Google Alup, Option 2 in your initial post in this thread. I can view it already, will post there once an official member.
>
> I am planning to join the FB Alup also. I had created an FB account a while back, never used it. I was trying to reactivate it yesterday, and guess what. My niece sent me a text today asking if I had sent her a friend request on FB! I was like 'what'??? Of course I did not! Maybe my never used FB account has been compromised? I have to figure out what is going on before doing anything further.
>
> Thanks to the combined efforts of Alup fans, it seems to be getting a new lease of life. Otherwise, in my mind I could hear Alup singing this Qateel Shifai she'r:
>
> "aakhrii hichkii tire zaanuuN pe aaye
> maut bhii maiN sha'iraanaa chaahtaa huuN!"
>
> _________Zoya
>
> P.S. In case anyone is wondering why I say Alup and not ALUP, it is because I have been using it as a verb also. I mean, all of us have been 'aluping' for a long while now. If Google and Xerox can be verbs, why not our friend Alup? Agree? :)

I do hope you are able to figure out the deal with your unexpected "friending" of your niece and can also join us over on the FB ALUP. There are a few members there already, as Naseer saahib posted the other day. (Is it possible that in the course of your reactivation attempts, once you had gained access to your then dormant account, you had visited her profile and inadvertently clicked on the bright blue "Add friend" button? You can confirm whether this is what happened: go back to your account and visit her profile again, and you should be presented with a bright blue "Cancel request" button this time.)

-UVR.

>
> But I already work so hard to proof read my posts. I'm telling you, if I weren't so 'seasoned', you guys would scare me off this site. But I'm not going anywhere, or better still I'm going where y'all are going! :-))

aapke "I'm not going anywhere" se ek sh'er yaad aa gaya jo kal hi paDha tha:

hui us gali meiN faziihat bahut
magar maiN vahaaN se Talaa hi nahiiN. - JE

On Tuesday, January 16, 2024 at 6:27:06 PM UTC-6, UVR wrote:

> I do hope you are able to figure out the deal with your unexpected "friending" of your niece and can also join us over on the FB ALUP. There are a few members there already, as Naseer saahib posted the other day. (Is it possible that in the course of your reactivation attempts, once you had gained access to your then dormant account, you had visited her profile and inadvertently clicked on the bright blue "Add friend" button? You can confirm whether this is what happened: go back to your account and visit her profile again, and you should be presented with a bright blue "Cancel request" button this time.)
>
> -UVR.

Thanks UVR sahib. I may have clicked on some button inadvertently. My niece declined that request anyway, so all good. :)
I have to tell you though how annoying I find all those auto friend suggestions on FB. Really Meta? Please! No!!
I changed some settings today and have joined the FB Alup. Looking forward to future interactions with all of you there too.

_________Zoya

On Tuesday, January 16, 2024 at 8:53:24 PM UTC-6, Amit Malhotra wrote:

> aapke "I'm not going anywhere" se ek sh'er yaad aa gaya jo kal hi paDha tha:
> hui us gali meiN faziihat bahut
> magar maiN vahaaN se Talaa hi nahiiN. - JE

Nice! My most obvious response to this would be Daagh's oft-quoted "aap to jam jaate haiN".
But right now I'm going with another JE she'r that I have been thinking about for the last few days and was planning to post in 'aaj kaa she'r' thread, maybe I'll do that too. But here and now:

hai bikharne to yeh mehfil-e-rang-buu, tum kahaaN jaayoge ham kahaaN jaayeNge
har taraf ho rahii hai yahii guftguu, tum kahaaN jaayoge ham kahaaN jaayeNge

Wow! Isn't this a perfect fit in the context of this thread?

__________Zoya

On Tuesday 16 January 2024 at 20:52:33 UTC, Zoya wrote:
> Friends,
>
> I have a suggestion. Since this thread is already getting quite busy, after this google group actually goes defunct, it may not be easy for currently inactive old members or potential new members to find out our new address(es).
>
> Once the dust settles down, will one of you please create a new thread, with an appropriate title, listing the three active options that we seem to have agreed on. So, basically a summarized list of the new sites with embedded links to access them. The future visitors will then be able to find us easily on the alternate sites where we might be hanging out.
>
> I guess I could assign this task to myself, but I believe UVR/Amit/ Naseer sahibaan will be able to do a better job with it.
>
> Meantime, let us continue in the thread. Such fun! :-))
>
> Thank you.
>
> ________Zoya

Zoya SaaHib, aadaab.

I have started a new thread, as per your suggestion.

Naseer

On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 9:07:42 AM UTC-6, Naseer wrote:
> Zoya SaaHib, aadaab.
>
> I have started a new thread, as per your suggestion.
>
> Naseer

aadaab Naseer sahib,

Thank you.

As UVR sahib mentioned earlier in this thread, he is going to post weekly reminders about the alternate site(s) as we get closer to the move out date.

I have registered under all three: the 'other' google Alup, FB Alup and Discord Alup, and have started posting some messages on all of them. Personally, I can live with any of the three options, whatever most of the active members choose is fine with me. I am just grateful that it is not the end of an era, that would have made me very sad.

Meantime, let us cherish this space while it lasts.

huuN is kuuche ke har zarre se aagah
yahaaN maiN muddatoN aayaa gayaa huuN!

_________Zoya

On Friday 19 January 2024 at 21:44:53 UTC, Zoya wrote:
> On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 9:07:42 AM UTC-6, Naseer wrote:
> > Zoya SaaHib, aadaab.
> >
> > I have started a new thread, as per your suggestion.
> >
> > Naseer
> aadaab Naseer sahib,
>
> Thank you.
>
> As UVR sahib mentioned earlier in this thread, he is going to post weekly reminders about the alternate site(s) as we get closer to the move out date.
>
> I have registered under all three: the 'other' google Alup, FB Alup and Discord Alup, and have started posting some messages on all of them. Personally, I can live with any of the three options, whatever most of the active members choose is fine with me. I am just grateful that it is not the end of an era, that would have made me very sad.
>
> Meantime, let us cherish this space while it lasts.
>
> huuN is kuuche ke har zarre se aagah
> yahaaN maiN muddatoN aayaa gayaa huuN!
>
> _________Zoya
Thank you Zoya SaaHibah. I must have missed UVR SaaHib's comment.
The shi3r you have quoted is:
huuN us kuuche ke har zarre se vaaqif
udhar muddatoN aayaa gayaa guuN
Shad Azimabadi

Naseer

On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 5:13:06 PM UTC-6, Naseer wrote:

> The shi3r you have quoted is:

> huuN us kuuche ke har zarre se vaaqif
> udhar muddatoN aayaa gayaa guuN

Naseer sahib, I remember this she'r from my childhood, a ghazal singer singing 'khilone de ke behlaayaa gayaa huuN' on AIR Urdu service, my dream radio station. I do not have Shaad Azeemabadi kuliyaat to double check, but I am pretty sure I always heard 'aagah'. However, could be 'vaaqif , originally or in a modified version. Either one fits. And is/us is negotiable.

But more importantly, the second misra as you have written is out of meter. I think we should be just as careful with vazn/bahr as with other details. Yes? :)

> Shad Azimabadi
>
> Naseer

On Friday 19 January 2024 at 23:30:21 UTC, Zoya wrote:
> On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 5:13:06 PM UTC-6, Naseer wrote:
>
> > The shi3r you have quoted is:
>
> > huuN us kuuche ke har zarre se vaaqif
> > udhar muddatoN aayaa gayaa guuN
> Naseer sahib, I remember this she'r from my childhood, a ghazal singer singing 'khilone de ke behlaayaa gayaa huuN' on AIR Urdu service, my dream radio station. I do not have Shaad Azeemabadi kuliyaat to double check, but I am pretty sure I always heard 'aagah'. However, could be 'vaaqif , originally or in a modified version. Either one fits. And is/us is negotiable.
>
> But more importantly, the second misra as you have written is out of meter. I think we should be just as careful with vazn/bahr as with other details. Yes? :)
>
> > Shad Azimabadi
> >
> > Naseer
Zoya SaaHibah aadaab.
You are right vazn is indeed important but I will have to confess to complete ignorance of this. Whether you accept this as a valid explanation, that is another matter. Yes, aagaah and vaaqif are possibilities but if we have "udhar" in the second misra3, we must have "us" in the first. "muddatoN" has an alternative "3umr-bhar". The shi3r I have quoted is as per Shaad Azimabadi's diivaan published in 1975 by Bihar Urdu Academy. (By the way, one of the reasonf for the misquote is that for some reason I can only see part of what I am typing. Anyway, here is the full shi3r with "se" inserted to balance the "weight". huuN us kuuche ke har zarre se vaaqif
udhar se muddatoN aayaa gayaa huuN
Naseer

On Saturday, January 20, 2024 at 3:42:49 AM UTC-6, Naseer wrote:

> Zoya SaaHibah aadaab.

> You are right vazn is indeed important but I will have to confess to complete ignorance of this. Whether you accept this as a valid explanation, that is another matter.

aadaab Naseer sahib,

Of course, I accept it. Just as I accept my own and other members' occasional transliteration 'errors'. :)

Yes, aagaah and vaaqif are possibilities but if we have "udhar" in the second misra3, we must have "us" in the first.

That goes without saying, is/idhar, us/udhar. Basic. Period.

I think the i/u confusion arises primarily because of the common practice of omitting zer/zabar etc in printed Urdu. I believe this has been previously discussed in detail on Alup. In prose or even in nazms, it should be fairly easy to decide whether it is i or u. However, it is a bigger issue in stand alone asha'ar which would make perfect sense either way. I personally encountered this recently while posting the Majaaz she'r "us mehfil-e-kaif-o-masti meN......." in "aaj kaa she'r" thread. Had to pause, think, and confirm.

"muddatoN" has an alternative "3umr-bhar".

Yes, that would fit. mud-dat-oN as 2-2-1, and um-r-bha-r broken as 2-(1-1)-1 will work here.

he shi3r I have quoted is as per Shaad Azimabadi's diivaan published in 1975 by Bihar Urdu Academy.

That is an authentic source. I concede to 'vaaqif'.

(By the way, one of the reasonf for the misquote is that for some reason I can only see part of what I am typing. Anyway, here is the full shi3r with "se" inserted to balance the "weight". huuN us kuuche ke har zarre se vaaqif
> udhar se muddatoN aayaa gayaa huuN

I have encountered the same issue while typing on Alup recently. For longer posts, I sometimes type in word now, and then copy/paste. Perhaps these problems are due to Alup support being phased out before the final nail.

> Naseer

___________Zoya