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arts / rec.arts.sf.fandom / Re: A con chair actually apologizes

SubjectAuthor
* A con chair actually apologizesGary McGath
+- Re: A con chair actually apologizesSomeone Else
+- Re: A con chair actually apologizesJibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
+* Re: A con chair actually apologizesSomeone Else
|`- Re: A con chair actually apologizesNinapenda Jibini
`* Re: A con chair actually apologizesKeith F. Lynch
 `- Re: A con chair actually apologizesGary McGath

1
A con chair actually apologizes

<t72622$34cab$1@dont-email.me>

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From: gar...@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com (Gary McGath)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.fandom
Subject: A con chair actually apologizes
Date: Mon, 30 May 2022 06:25:04 -0400
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 by: Gary McGath - Mon, 30 May 2022 10:25 UTC

Does anyone know more about the treatment of Stephanie Burke at
Balticon? The con chair actually apologized for how she was treated,
which is virtually unprecedented. All I have right now is one article:

https://file770.com/balticon-chair-apologizes-after-author-stephanie-burke-removed-from-panels/

I am utterly heartbroken at how events have played out
at Balticon this year with our panelist, Stephanie Burke.
Ms. Burke has been a long-time panelist and we have
invited her back year after year because of her engaging
commentary and insightful additions to our programming.

An incident was reported to us regarding Ms. Burke. The
plan was to quietly ask her to step down from her panels
for the weekend while we had a chance to investigate.
However, an overzealous volunteer decided to remove her
from an ongoing panel in a way that caused her
embarrassment. This is inexcusable and we deeply
apologize.

The more usual statement from con chairs is, "This person said something
which is so utterly offensive that I can't tell you what it was, so I
expect you to believe me without evidence. This irredeemably evil person
is henceforth banned from participating in our activities, mentioning
us, or thinking about us. The same applies to anyone who disputes this
fatwa."

SFWA took a lot of heat for its treatment of Mercedes Lackey. Is it
possible things are just starting to move away from the situation where
SF organizations can declare people pariahs and go unchallenged?

As I said, I know nothing about the particulars of this case, but the
apology is extraordinary.

--
Gary McGath http://www.mcgath.com

Re: A con chair actually apologizes

<r0u99h579p9l7do9f06a0culc7i7m4de5b@4ax.com>

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From: someone....@example.com.invalid (Someone Else)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.fandom
Subject: Re: A con chair actually apologizes
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 by: Someone Else - Mon, 30 May 2022 17:04 UTC

In Message-ID:<t72622$34cab$1@dont-email.me>,
Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote:

>As I said, I know nothing about the particulars of this case, but the
>apology is extraordinary.

Check File770 again. It may have been updated since you saw it. It
has a statement from Stephanie Burke, where she says that without
proof and without a way to disprove it, she's been "accused of saying
some hurtful insensitive transphobic, racist, damaging things".

Re: A con chair actually apologizes

<XnsAEA766EA45E5taustingmail@85.12.62.245>

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Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.fandom
Subject: Re: A con chair actually apologizes
From: tausti...@gmail.com (Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha)
References: <t72622$34cab$1@dont-email.me>
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 by: Jibini Kula Tumbili - Mon, 30 May 2022 17:07 UTC

Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote in
news:t72622$34cab$1@dont-email.me:

> SFWA took a lot of heat for its treatment of Mercedes Lackey. Is
> it possible things are just starting to move away from the
> situation where SF organizations can declare people pariahs and
> go unchallenged?
>
We have reached the point where the people the woke left actually
disagree with have realized there's really no reason to give a shit
about what they're yammering over. Since the "canceling" isn't about
the person being attacked, or anything they've said or done, but
rather, it's about the attacker feeling important, if the target
doesn't react, there's no enjoyment. (Yes, that's *exactly* how all
bullies work. Ignore them, and they do, eventually, go away.)

Since they are addicted to their outrage, they *have* to have
*someone* to attack (and get a reaction from), and when the
ideological "other side" won't play, they're starting to feed on
their own.

The smart ones are figuring it out.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Re: A con chair actually apologizes

<dmra9h5bqvpkftjak42a1mo3h0g1c5917m@4ax.com>

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Subject: Re: A con chair actually apologizes
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 by: Someone Else - Tue, 31 May 2022 01:34 UTC

In Message-ID:<t72622$34cab$1@dont-email.me>,
Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote:

> An incident was reported to us regarding Ms. Burke. The
> plan was to quietly ask her to step down from her panels
> for the weekend while we had a chance to investigate.
> However, an overzealous volunteer decided to remove her
> from an ongoing panel in a way that caused her
> embarrassment. This is inexcusable and we deeply
> apologize.

They were going to, in effect, ban her from her future panels
*before* investigating. They have actual evidence of harm from the
"overzealous volunteer". Are there going to be official repercussions
for that volunteer? And what about the person (Lisa) who, per Burke's
statement, made false, disparaging remarks to others about Burke
during the con?

Re: A con chair actually apologizes

<XnsAEA7E261721DCtaustincagmailcom@85.12.62.245>

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Subject: Re: A con chair actually apologizes
From: tausti...@gmail.com (Ninapenda Jibini)
References: <t72622$34cab$1@dont-email.me> <dmra9h5bqvpkftjak42a1mo3h0g1c5917m@4ax.com>
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Date: Tue, 31 May 2022 05:15:15 GMT
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 by: Ninapenda Jibini - Tue, 31 May 2022 05:15 UTC

Someone Else <someone.else@example.com.invalid> wrote in
news:dmra9h5bqvpkftjak42a1mo3h0g1c5917m@4ax.com:

> In Message-ID:<t72622$34cab$1@dont-email.me>,
> Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote:
>
>> An incident was reported to us regarding Ms. Burke. The
>> plan was to quietly ask her to step down from her panels
>> for the weekend while we had a chance to investigate.
>> However, an overzealous volunteer decided to remove her
>> from an ongoing panel in a way that caused her
>> embarrassment. This is inexcusable and we deeply
>> apologize.
>
> They were going to, in effect, ban her from her future panels
> *before* investigating. They have actual evidence of harm from
> the "overzealous volunteer". Are there going to be official
> repercussions for that volunteer? And what about the person
> (Lisa) who, per Burke's statement, made false, disparaging
> remarks to others about Burke during the con?
>
Until there's a proper investigation, the claim that her statements
were false and disparaging are exactly as credible as the statements
themselves, you know.

It's not a good look to jump to conclusions and take sides over
someone jumping to conclusions and taking sides.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

Re: A con chair actually apologizes

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From: kfl...@KeithLynch.net (Keith F. Lynch)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.fandom
Subject: Re: A con chair actually apologizes
Date: Wed, 1 Jun 2022 02:15:44 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: United Individualist
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 by: Keith F. Lynch - Wed, 1 Jun 2022 02:15 UTC

Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote:
> Does anyone know more about the treatment of Stephanie Burke at
> Balticon?

I wasn't at that panel, nor have I talked to anyone who was. But I do
have knowledge of BSFS/Balticon management. It greatly changed, for
the worse, around 2019, and I no longer recommend Balticon to anyone.
I do not plan to attend next year.

So I'm inclined to believe Ms. Burke and disbelieve what Balticon says.

> The con chair actually apologized for how she was treated, which is
> virtually unprecedented.

The con chair apologized only for how the poor unlucky volunteer who
was caught in the middle behaved. Not for Ms. Burke being condemned
without a trial.

In other cheerful Balticon news, they informed everyone by email that
two attending members reported testing positive for covid. One was
anonymous, the other was Harold Feld. Not mentioned by email or in
the newsletter, there was a fatal shooting right outside the hotel on
Saturday evening. This was at 7:30 pm, i.e. during daylight. See
https://wtop.com/baltimore/2022/05/police-2-shot-in-chest-in-baltimores-inner-harbor-district/
--
Keith F. Lynch - http://keithlynch.net/
Please see http://keithlynch.net/email.html before emailing me.

Re: A con chair actually apologizes

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From: gar...@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com (Gary McGath)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.fandom
Subject: Re: A con chair actually apologizes
Date: Sat, 4 Jun 2022 06:24:53 -0400
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 by: Gary McGath - Sat, 4 Jun 2022 10:24 UTC

On 5/31/22 10:15 PM, Keith F. Lynch wrote:
> Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote:

>> The con chair actually apologized for how she was treated, which is
>> virtually unprecedented.
>
> The con chair apologized only for how the poor unlucky volunteer who
> was caught in the middle behaved. Not for Ms. Burke being condemned
> without a trial.

The latest news is that the con chair will lead an investigation into
what the con did. Clearly they've picked up some tips from police
departments that "investigate" crimes committed by their own cops.

--
Gary McGath http://www.mcgath.com

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