On 9/21/22 6:17 PM, Scott Dorsey wrote:

>> There's a carb-substitute filler material that is guaranteed to have
>> zero nutritional value. It is 100% artifical.
>
> Does it cause anal leakage?
> --scott

Back in ancient times a story of mine, "The Unfood," was published in
Analog. Very quick summary: A company offers "Nothing Munchies" as a
diet food. It's tasty but has no nutritional value. The FDA bans it
because rats will starve to death eating it, even preferring it to real
food. The manufacturer re-brands it as rat poison.

Good Omens by Pratchett and Gaiman describes a similar product, called
MEALS, and refers to it as "unfood." I'd like to think one of them had
read my story.

--
Gary McGath http://www.mcgath.com

djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) wrote in
news:rIKx6w.1n3z@kithrup.com:

> In article
> <917ae990-2774-4a44-85c1-9ffc670236b2n@googlegroups.com>, Kevrob
> <kevrob@my-deja.com> wrote:
>>On Wednesday, September 21, 2022 at 12:26:30 PM UTC-4, Dorothy J
>>Heydt wrote:
>>> In article <tgf9cq$1rfoi$1...@dont-email.me>,
>>> Gary McGath <ga...@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote:
>>> >On 9/20/22 8:58 PM, Gary McGath wrote:
>>> >
>>> >>> Since this is in the "weapons" section, I rather expect
>>> >>> they're "going with" a common-sense definition, rather
>>> >>> than some legal definition.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I could be wrong. But the Philcon rules are a lot looser
>>> >>> than the ones Gary generally rails at, so I expect this
>>> >>> one is also a loose, if badly-worded, rule.
>>> >>
>>> >> Exactly. But I would have expected people running a con to
>>> >> know that everything is made of chemicals.
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> >Now I'm wondering if there even is a "common-sense
>>> >definition" of chemical. If you call water dihydrogen
>>> >monoxide, does that make it a chemical?
>>> (Hal Heydt)
>>> One rather suspects that the "common sense" definition is
>>> something like a "name I'm not familiar with".
>>>
>>> It's rather like "organic food". I've yet to see anyone be
>>> able to point out any INorganic food.
>>
>>NaCl? Other necessary minerals?
>
> Making a meal of enough table salt for it to be the principle
> ingredient really wouldn't be good for you, so while it can be
> classed as a condiment, food would be a real stretch.
>
Unless, of course, one is a salt vampire from M-113.

--
Terry Austin

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote:
>On 9/21/22 6:17 PM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
>>> There's a carb-substitute filler material that is guaranteed to have
>>> zero nutritional value. It is 100% artifical.
>>
>> Does it cause anal leakage?
>
>Back in ancient times a story of mine, "The Unfood," was published in
>Analog. Very quick summary: A company offers "Nothing Munchies" as a
>diet food. It's tasty but has no nutritional value. The FDA bans it
>because rats will starve to death eating it, even preferring it to real
>food. The manufacturer re-brands it as rat poison.
>
>Good Omens by Pratchett and Gaiman describes a similar product, called
>MEALS, and refers to it as "unfood." I'd like to think one of them had
>read my story.

The problem with fiction that exaggerates reality is that reality is already
so extreme. This sounds VERY close to the story of Olestra, except that
after it was banned, people picketed the FDA demanding to be allowed it.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

On 9/21/22 7:43 PM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
> The problem with fiction that exaggerates reality is that reality is already
> so extreme. This sounds VERY close to the story of Olestra, except that
> after it was banned, people picketed the FDA demanding to be allowed it.
> --scott

The Wikipedia article doesn't say that Olestra was ever banned in the
US, though it was in Canada and the EU.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olestra

--
Gary McGath http://www.mcgath.com

On 9/21/22 12:08 PM, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>> Now I'm wondering if there even is a "common-sense definition" of
>> chemical. If you call water dihydrogen monoxide, does that make it a
>> chemical?
>
> (Hal Heydt)
> One rather suspects that the "common sense" definition is
> something like a "name I'm not familiar with".
>
> It's rather like "organic food". I've yet to see anyone be able
> to point out any INorganic food.

This year, I was in a German hotel where a sign in the bathroom said not
to put any "products" into the toilet except toilet paper. It said the
same in both English and German (Produkte), so it wasn't a translation
error.

--
Gary McGath http://www.mcgath.com

Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote in
news:tghms4$255jq$1@dont-email.me:

> On 9/21/22 7:43 PM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
>> The problem with fiction that exaggerates reality is that
>> reality is already so extreme. This sounds VERY close to the
>> story of Olestra, except that after it was banned, people
>> picketed the FDA demanding to be allowed it. --scott
>
> The Wikipedia article doesn't say that Olestra was ever banned
> in the US, though it was in Canada and the EU.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olestra
>
That does appear to be the case. Most of the side effects that
tarnished its reputation are either the result of serious
overconsumption, or just not supported by the evidence.

https://www.delightedcooking.com/what-is-olestra.htm

--
Terry Austin

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

On 9/21/2022 11:08 AM, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
> In article <tgf9cq$1rfoi$1@dont-email.me>,
> Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote:
>> On 9/20/22 8:58 PM, Gary McGath wrote:
>>
>>>> Since this is in the "weapons" section, I rather expect they're
>>>> "going with" a common-sense definition, rather than some legal
>>>> definition.
>>>>
>>>> I could be wrong. But the Philcon rules are a lot looser than the
>>>> ones Gary generally rails at, so I expect this one is also a loose,
>>>> if badly-worded, rule.
>>>
>>> Exactly. But I would have expected people running a con to know that
>>> everything is made of chemicals.
>>>
>>
>> Now I'm wondering if there even is a "common-sense definition" of
>> chemical. If you call water dihydrogen monoxide, does that make it a
>> chemical?
>
> (Hal Heydt)
> One rather suspects that the "common sense" definition is
> something like a "name I'm not familiar with".
>
> It's rather like "organic food". I've yet to see anyone be able
> to point out any INorganic food.

It is fun though to ask where the inorganic bananas are, just to see how
many employees get involved until someone calls you on it. Although the
last couple times I tried they just laughed. They either knew or had
been warned. My best was four.

On Thu, 22 Sep 2022 14:47:31 -0500, "Jay E. Morris"
<morrisj@epsilon3.comcon> wrote:

>On 9/21/2022 11:08 AM, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>> In article <tgf9cq$1rfoi$1@dont-email.me>,
>> Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote:
>>> On 9/20/22 8:58 PM, Gary McGath wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Since this is in the "weapons" section, I rather expect they're
>>>>> "going with" a common-sense definition, rather than some legal
>>>>> definition.
>>>>>
>>>>> I could be wrong. But the Philcon rules are a lot looser than the
>>>>> ones Gary generally rails at, so I expect this one is also a loose,
>>>>> if badly-worded, rule.
>>>>
>>>> Exactly. But I would have expected people running a con to know that
>>>> everything is made of chemicals.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Now I'm wondering if there even is a "common-sense definition" of
>>> chemical. If you call water dihydrogen monoxide, does that make it a
>>> chemical?
>>
>> (Hal Heydt)
>> One rather suspects that the "common sense" definition is
>> something like a "name I'm not familiar with".
>>
>> It's rather like "organic food". I've yet to see anyone be able
>> to point out any INorganic food.
>
>It is fun though to ask where the inorganic bananas are, just to see how
>many employees get involved until someone calls you on it. Although the
>last couple times I tried they just laughed. They either knew or had
>been warned. My best was four.

In the pet toy section? No, those are plastic, and as such, organic.

Maybe the Christmas decoration section, those are glass.
--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:
>That does appear to be the case. Most of the side effects that
>tarnished its reputation are either the result of serious
>overconsumption, or just not supported by the evidence.

The same can be said of the organic fats that it was intended to replace,
though. But people want a product they can overconsume!
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

On Wednesday, September 21, 2022 at 3:02:30 PM UTC-4, merri...@gmail.com wrote:
[snip]

> BTW water (for instance), properly, shouldn't contain any carbon.

Mighty fine filtration needed to avoid trace elements, if it
comes from a river or lake. Heck, even ground water will have
some microscopic organisms.

http://www.waterencyclopedia.com/La-Mi/Microbes-in-Groundwater.html

--
Kevin R

On Thu, 22 Sep 2022 21:09:14 -0700 (PDT), Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com>
wrote:

>On Wednesday, September 21, 2022 at 3:02:30 PM UTC-4, merri...@gmail.com wrote:
>[snip]
>
>
>> BTW water (for instance), properly, shouldn't contain any carbon.
>
>Mighty fine filtration needed to avoid trace elements, if it
>comes from a river or lake. Heck, even ground water will have
>some microscopic organisms.
>
>http://www.waterencyclopedia.com/La-Mi/Microbes-in-Groundwater.html

Not to mention any mineral carbon dissolved in the universal solvent.
--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

On 9/22/22 3:47 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:
> On 9/21/2022 11:08 AM, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>> In article <tgf9cq$1rfoi$1@dont-email.me>,

>>
>> (Hal Heydt)
>> One rather suspects that the "common sense" definition is
>> something like a "name I'm not familiar with".
>>
>> It's rather like "organic food".  I've yet to see anyone be able
>> to point out any INorganic food.
>
> It is fun though to ask where the inorganic bananas are, just to see how
> many employees get involved until someone calls you on it. Although the
> last couple times I tried they just laughed. They either knew or had
> been warned. My best was four.

In Europe they tend to call them "bio" foods. Same problem. There isn't
much food that isn't make from formerly (or in a few cases, currently)
living things.

--
Gary McGath http://www.mcgath.com

In article <0kcqihlf3ngf5b1l1cqo9o5c40cmcpkm42@4ax.com>,
Tim Merrigan <tppm@ca.rr.com> wrote:
>On Thu, 22 Sep 2022 21:09:14 -0700 (PDT), Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Wednesday, September 21, 2022 at 3:02:30 PM UTC-4, merri...@gmail.com wrote:
>>[snip]
>>
>>
>>> BTW water (for instance), properly, shouldn't contain any carbon.
>>
>>Mighty fine filtration needed to avoid trace elements, if it
>>comes from a river or lake. Heck, even ground water will have
>>some microscopic organisms.
>>
>>http://www.waterencyclopedia.com/La-Mi/Microbes-in-Groundwater.html
>
>Not to mention any mineral carbon dissolved in the universal solvent.

Or simply CO2 absorbed out of the air.

Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote in
news:tgk14k$2gjc5$1@dont-email.me:

> On 9/22/22 3:47 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:
>> On 9/21/2022 11:08 AM, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>>> In article <tgf9cq$1rfoi$1@dont-email.me>,
>
>>>
>>> (Hal Heydt)
>>> One rather suspects that the "common sense" definition is
>>> something like a "name I'm not familiar with".
>>>
>>> It's rather like "organic food".  I've yet to see anyone be
>>> able to point out any INorganic food.
>>
>> It is fun though to ask where the inorganic bananas are, just
>> to see how many employees get involved until someone calls you
>> on it. Although the last couple times I tried they just
>> laughed. They either knew or had been warned. My best was four.
>
> In Europe they tend to call them "bio" foods. Same problem.
> There isn't much food that isn't make from formerly (or in a few
> cases, currently) living things.
>
That is what happens when you have a marketing term with no legal
definition.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

In article <tgg2vb$1u0lt$1@dont-email.me>,
Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote:
>Back in ancient times a story of mine, "The Unfood," was published in
>Analog. Very quick summary: A company offers "Nothing Munchies" as a
>diet food. It's tasty but has no nutritional value. The FDA bans it
>because rats will starve to death eating it, even preferring it to real
>food. The manufacturer re-brands it as rat poison.

This reminds me of a William F. Buckley column back when cyclamates
were banned because when you surgically implant a pellet of
cyclamate in a rat's bladder, it has an increased risk of cancer.

He suggested they simply re-lable cyclamate as rat poison, so
"... us brave souls can put it in our tea, and those who want
to poison rats can make the bastards die *real* *slow*."

In article <54010112022a@mikevanpelt.com>,
Mike Van Pelt <usenet@mikevanpelt.com> wrote:
>In article <tgg2vb$1u0lt$1@dont-email.me>,
>Gary McGath <garym@REMOVEmcgathREMOVE.com> wrote:
>>Back in ancient times a story of mine, "The Unfood," was published in
>>Analog. Very quick summary: A company offers "Nothing Munchies" as a
>>diet food. It's tasty but has no nutritional value. The FDA bans it
>>because rats will starve to death eating it, even preferring it to real
>>food. The manufacturer re-brands it as rat poison.
>
>This reminds me of a William F. Buckley column back when cyclamates
>were banned because when you surgically implant a pellet of
>cyclamate in a rat's bladder, it has an increased risk of cancer.
>
>He suggested they simply re-lable cyclamate as rat poison, so
>"... us brave souls can put it in our tea, and those who want
>to poison rats can make the bastards die *real* *slow*."

(Hal Heydt)
Hmmm... Getting rid of rats...

There's the method my father described for getting rid of rats on
a ship.

1. Make sure there is NO source of drinking water the rats can get at.
2. Make sure--to the extent possible--that there is no food for
the rats.
3. Place containers of grain at places of your choosing.
4. Wait a couple of days.
5. Put out water in a place easy to clean.

Mike Van Pelt <usenet@mikevanpelt.com> wrote:
> This reminds me of a William F. Buckley column back when cyclamates
> were banned because when you surgically implant a pellet of
> cyclamate in a rat's bladder, it has an increased risk of cancer.

> He suggested they simply re-lable cyclamate as rat poison, so
> "... us brave souls can put it in our tea, and those who want to
> poison rats can make the bastards die *real* *slow*."

The most common rat poison, warfarin (aka Coumadin, aka Jantoven),
is also sold, for a much higher price, as a medicine for people with
clotting disorders. It's a vitamin K antagonist, so overdoses are
easily treated with that vitamin. Rats bleed internally, so they get
thirsty and leave the building in search of water and die outside,
rather than dying indoors and stinking up the building.

The downside of its use as a medicine is that the effective dose
depends on what you eat. If you switch to consuming a diet much
higher in vitamin K, your previous daily dose will be ineffective.
If you switch to consuming a diet much lower in vitamin K, your
previous daily dose may kill you.

(No, I've never used it. I'm ridiculously healthy for someone
my age.)
--
Keith F. Lynch - http://keithlynch.net/
Please see http://keithlynch.net/email.html before emailing me.

In article <ti59t1$b3e$1@reader2.panix.com>, kfl@KeithLynch.net (Keith F.
Lynch) wrote:

>
> The most common rat poison, warfarin (aka Coumadin, aka Jantoven),
> is also sold, for a much higher price, as a medicine for people with
> clotting disorders.

My father was on that, I recall. Following my operation last year they
put me instead on Clopidogrel.

Paul Dormer <prd@pauldormer.cix.co.uk> wrote:
>
>My father was on that, I recall. Following my operation last year they
>put me instead on Clopidogrel.

Clopidogrel sounds like the name of a centaur in a bad fantasy novel.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

In article <ti6m4g$6qn$1@panix2.panix.com>, kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:

>
> Clopidogrel sounds like the name of a centaur in a bad fantasy novel.
> --scott

Indeed. Other drugs I'm on include Lansoprazole, which is, I think, in
the Canary Islands, and Amiodarone, which I think I've had in an Italian
restaurant.

prd@pauldormer.cix.co.uk (Paul Dormer) wrote in
news:memo.20221012165110.11860A@pauldormer.cix.co.uk:

> In article <ti6m4g$6qn$1@panix2.panix.com>, kludge@panix.com
> (Scott Dorsey) wrote:
>
>>
>> Clopidogrel sounds like the name of a centaur in a bad fantasy
>> novel. --scott
>
> Indeed. Other drugs I'm on include Lansoprazole, which is, I
> think, in the Canary Islands, and Amiodarone, which I think I've
> had in an Italian restaurant.
>
Medications all have technical, scientific names that the
manufacturer don't use because they're difficult or impossible to
trademark. The trade names - the ones they *can* trademark - are, in
many cases, literally generated with random word programs.

--
Terry Austin

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

In article <memo.20221012121524.8652A@pauldormer.cix.co.uk>,
Paul Dormer <prd@pauldormer.cix.co.uk> wrote:
>In article <ti59t1$b3e$1@reader2.panix.com>, kfl@KeithLynch.net (Keith F.
>Lynch) wrote:
>
>>
>> The most common rat poison, warfarin (aka Coumadin, aka Jantoven),
>> is also sold, for a much higher price, as a medicine for people with
>> clotting disorders.
>
>My father was on that, I recall. Following my operation last year they
>put me instead on Clopidogrel.

(Hal Heydt)
OBSSF... David BRin made use of it _Sundiver_.

In article <ti6m4g$6qn$1@panix2.panix.com>,
Scott Dorsey <kludge@panix.com> wrote:
>Paul Dormer <prd@pauldormer.cix.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>My father was on that, I recall. Following my operation last year they
>>put me instead on Clopidogrel.
>
>Clopidogrel sounds like the name of a centaur in a bad fantasy novel.

(Hal Heydt)
Or just an equine that writes low grade poetry.