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arts / rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1950s / Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit

SubjectAuthor
* Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hitBruce
`* Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hitDean F.
 `* Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hitBruce
  +- Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hitRoger Ford
  `* Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hitMark D.
   `* Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hitBruce
    `* Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hitMark D.
     `* Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hitBruce
      `- Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hitMark D.

1
Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit

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Subject: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit
From: Savo...@aol.com (Bruce)
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 by: Bruce - Mon, 12 Sep 2022 06:11 UTC

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMbF3cGkQRk

Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit

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Subject: Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit
From: soulexpr...@gmail.com (Dean F.)
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 by: Dean F. - Mon, 12 Sep 2022 08:20 UTC

You are one sadistic son of a bitch, Bruce.

Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit

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Subject: Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit
From: Savo...@aol.com (Bruce)
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 by: Bruce - Mon, 12 Sep 2022 13:29 UTC

On Monday, September 12, 2022 at 4:20:19 AM UTC-4, Dean F. wrote:

> You are one sadistic son of a bitch, Bruce.

No, I'm just amazed at how these cover acts almost never could grasp the feel of these songs.

Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit

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From: maria...@bblueyonder.co.uk (Roger Ford)
Newsgroups: rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1950s
Subject: Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2022 14:27:14 GMT
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 by: Roger Ford - Mon, 12 Sep 2022 14:27 UTC

On Mon, 12 Sep 2022 06:29:55 -0700 (PDT), Bruce <SavoyBG@aol.com>
wrote:

>On Monday, September 12, 2022 at 4:20:19 AM UTC-4, Dean F. wrote:
>
>> You are one sadistic son of a bitch, Bruce.
>
>No, I'm just amazed at how these cover acts almost never could grasp the feel of these songs.

From memory the flip of this was real dire too----a feeble "Why Baby
Why" lifted from George Jones

ROGER FORD
-----------------------

"Spam Free Zone" - to combat unwanted automatic spamming I have added
an extra "b" in my e-mail address (mariabus@bblueyonder.co.uk) Please
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Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit

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From: mdintenf...@xxnew.rr.com (Mark D.)
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Subject: Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit
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 by: Mark D. - Mon, 12 Sep 2022 14:54 UTC

On Sep 12, 2022 at 8:29:55 AM CDT, "Bruce" <SavoyBG@aol.com> wrote:

> On Monday, September 12, 2022 at 4:20:19 AM UTC-4, Dean F. wrote:
>
>> You are one sadistic son of a bitch, Bruce.
>
> No, I'm just amazed at how these cover acts almost never could grasp the feel
> of these songs.

I'm amazed you're amazed. The whole point of the cover record was to take a
take a rising song with a particular ethnic sound (in the 50s that meant
mostly black or country) and do it in the style of mainstream pop (in the 50s
that meant white). They set out NOT to capture the "feel" of the original, but
to throw it in the garbage. For a while it worked very well as a money maker.
In the early 50s almost all of Hank Williams' famous songs were remade into
big pop hits by white pop singers like Jo Stafford and Tony Bennett, and in
the middle 50s, as you know, Pat Boone and Georgia Gibbs, to name just two,
managed to have a brief run of hits by covering Little Richard and Lavern
Baker. I knew a lot of teenagers, mostly those who lived in much nicer houses
than I did, who preferred the covers to the originals. A few of their ilk even
showed up in the early years of this group, and they were often quite nasty
because history had declared their pop tastes to be very short-sighted. Since
this is all familiar stuff, I have to think you're not really amazed at the
crappy covers, and maybe Dean nailed your motive for your now daily invitation
to click blind links that leads to horrible records.

--md

remove "xx" for email

Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit

<002206bc-498e-4f4c-97ae-814bd3f0de54n@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit
From: Savo...@aol.com (Bruce)
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 by: Bruce - Mon, 12 Sep 2022 15:07 UTC

On Monday, September 12, 2022 at 10:54:37 AM UTC-4, Mark D. wrote:
> On Sep 12, 2022 at 8:29:55 AM CDT, "Bruce" <Sav...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > On Monday, September 12, 2022 at 4:20:19 AM UTC-4, Dean F. wrote:
> >
> >> You are one sadistic son of a bitch, Bruce.
> >
> > No, I'm just amazed at how these cover acts almost never could grasp the feel
> > of these songs.
> I'm amazed you're amazed. The whole point of the cover record was to take a
> take a rising song with a particular ethnic sound (in the 50s that meant
> mostly black or country) and do it in the style of mainstream pop (in the 50s
> that meant white). They set out NOT to capture the "feel" of the original, but
> to throw it in the garbage. For a while it worked very well as a money maker.
> In the early 50s almost all of Hank Williams' famous songs were remade into
> big pop hits by white pop singers like Jo Stafford and Tony Bennett, and in
> the middle 50s, as you know, Pat Boone and Georgia Gibbs, to name just two,
> managed to have a brief run of hits by covering Little Richard and Lavern
> Baker. I knew a lot of teenagers, mostly those who lived in much nicer houses
> than I did, who preferred the covers to the originals. A few of their ilk even
> showed up in the early years of this group, and they were often quite nasty
> because history had declared their pop tastes to be very short-sighted. Since
> this is all familiar stuff, I have to think you're not really amazed at the
> crappy covers, and maybe Dean nailed your motive for your now daily invitation
> to click blind links that leads to horrible records.

I guess I am more amazed that some people actually thought that things like this were better than the real records. I'm amazed that they would bother covering "Steamboat" if they were gonna take the gospely soul out of it. The words and notes as written are nothing that would indicate a hit by themselves. I guess the producers and A&R men who were picking songs to cover did not "get" why the original versions were becoming hits in the first place.. They perplexing thought that it was the songs, rather then the styles and performances.

But there are some covers where the act did get the feel of things, like "Little Darlin'" by the Diamonds, although the group themselves laughed at the song when they were presented with the Gladiolas version to learn, and considered it a novelty goof.

Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit

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From: mdintenf...@xxnew.rr.com (Mark D.)
Newsgroups: rec.music.rock-pop-r+b.1950s
Subject: Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit
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 by: Mark D. - Mon, 12 Sep 2022 18:30 UTC

On Sep 12, 2022 at 10:07:39 AM CDT, "Bruce" <SavoyBG@aol.com> wrote:

> I guess I am more amazed that some people actually thought that things like
> this were better than the real records. I'm amazed that they would bother
> covering "Steamboat" if they were gonna take the gospely soul out of it. The
> words and notes as written are nothing that would indicate a hit by
> themselves. I guess the producers and A&R men who were picking songs to cover
> did not "get" why the original versions were becoming hits in the first place.
> They perplexing thought that it was the songs, rather then the styles and
> performances.

Maybe you'll understand covers better if you understand that the practice of
covering is rooted in the way music was mostly sold before radio and
phonographs took over, when the main artists were generally the songwriters
and their most important market was for sheet music. (Radio barely existed
before the 1930s, and phonograph records sounded pretty awful on the wind-up
machines that were standard until well into the 1920s, and which most people
couldn't afford anyway.) Thus, the music business norm was mostly selling the
songs, in paper form, not any particular performance of them. Businesses being
what they are, that mentality lingered for a long time even when it had become
outmoded (firstly, by jazz in which the performance is the thing, and secondly
by recordings replacing sheet music during the 1930s). In other words, having
multiple recordings by different singers in different musical (and ethnic)
styles was simply business as usual for the music companies even into the
early 50s. (Which, as an example, is why King issued different versions of
"Bloodshot Eyes" for the country and r&b markets.) So Pat Boone covering
Little Richard would have seemed like business as usual to the guys who ran
the the big labels, who were too old and set in their ways to realize that
lots of young people in the mid-50s found "ghetto music" much more fun than
bland pop music, and many of them were aware that a civil rights movement was
starting up which made the notion of a separate market for each race seem
pernicious.

--md

remove "xx" for email

Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit

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Subject: Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit
From: Savo...@aol.com (Bruce)
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 by: Bruce - Mon, 12 Sep 2022 18:42 UTC

On Monday, September 12, 2022 at 2:30:18 PM UTC-4, Mark D. wrote:
> On Sep 12, 2022 at 10:07:39 AM CDT, "Bruce" <Sav...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > I guess I am more amazed that some people actually thought that things like
> > this were better than the real records. I'm amazed that they would bother
> > covering "Steamboat" if they were gonna take the gospely soul out of it.. The
> > words and notes as written are nothing that would indicate a hit by
> > themselves. I guess the producers and A&R men who were picking songs to cover
> > did not "get" why the original versions were becoming hits in the first place.
> > They perplexing thought that it was the songs, rather then the styles and
> > performances.
> Maybe you'll understand covers better if you understand that the practice of
> covering is rooted in the way music was mostly sold before radio and
> phonographs took over, when the main artists were generally the songwriters
> and their most important market was for sheet music. (Radio barely existed
> before the 1930s, and phonograph records sounded pretty awful on the wind-up
> machines that were standard until well into the 1920s, and which most people
> couldn't afford anyway.) Thus, the music business norm was mostly selling the
> songs, in paper form, not any particular performance of them. Businesses being
> what they are, that mentality lingered for a long time even when it had become
> outmoded (firstly, by jazz in which the performance is the thing, and secondly
> by recordings replacing sheet music during the 1930s). In other words, having
> multiple recordings by different singers in different musical (and ethnic)
> styles was simply business as usual for the music companies even into the
> early 50s. (Which, as an example, is why King issued different versions of
> "Bloodshot Eyes" for the country and r&b markets.) So Pat Boone covering
> Little Richard would have seemed like business as usual to the guys who ran
> the the big labels, who were too old and set in their ways to realize that
> lots of young people in the mid-50s found "ghetto music" much more fun than
> bland pop music, and many of them were aware that a civil rights movement was
> starting up which made the notion of a separate market for each race seem
> pernicious.

I understand all of that, but I still find it amazing that there's ANYBODY out there who would like this version of "Steamboat" better than the Drifters version. Maybe nobody did, which is why this record is so obscure. I find it even more amazing that the bosses would think that this was a reasonable item to release to compete with the Drifters version. But I guess there were people back then who were just totally turned of by the "blackness" of these records. Hell, even now some of us are turned off by the blackness of some records, based on the ballots in the tournaments.

Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit

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From: mdintenf...@xxnew.rr.com (Mark D.)
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Subject: Re: Holy Smokes, listen to this cover of a Drifters hit
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 by: Mark D. - Mon, 12 Sep 2022 18:54 UTC

On Sep 12, 2022 at 1:42:32 PM CDT, "Bruce" <SavoyBG@aol.com> wrote:

> On Monday, September 12, 2022 at 2:30:18 PM UTC-4, Mark D. wrote:
>> On Sep 12, 2022 at 10:07:39 AM CDT, "Bruce" <Sav...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I guess I am more amazed that some people actually thought that things like
>>> this were better than the real records. I'm amazed that they would bother
>>> covering "Steamboat" if they were gonna take the gospely soul out of it. The
>>> words and notes as written are nothing that would indicate a hit by
>>> themselves. I guess the producers and A&R men who were picking songs to cover
>>> did not "get" why the original versions were becoming hits in the first place.
>>> They perplexing thought that it was the songs, rather then the styles and
>>> performances.
>> Maybe you'll understand covers better if you understand that the practice of
>> covering is rooted in the way music was mostly sold before radio and
>> phonographs took over, when the main artists were generally the songwriters
>> and their most important market was for sheet music. (Radio barely existed
>> before the 1930s, and phonograph records sounded pretty awful on the wind-up
>> machines that were standard until well into the 1920s, and which most people
>> couldn't afford anyway.) Thus, the music business norm was mostly selling the
>> songs, in paper form, not any particular performance of them. Businesses being
>> what they are, that mentality lingered for a long time even when it had become
>> outmoded (firstly, by jazz in which the performance is the thing, and secondly
>> by recordings replacing sheet music during the 1930s). In other words, having
>> multiple recordings by different singers in different musical (and ethnic)
>> styles was simply business as usual for the music companies even into the
>> early 50s. (Which, as an example, is why King issued different versions of
>> "Bloodshot Eyes" for the country and r&b markets.) So Pat Boone covering
>> Little Richard would have seemed like business as usual to the guys who ran
>> the the big labels, who were too old and set in their ways to realize that
>> lots of young people in the mid-50s found "ghetto music" much more fun than
>> bland pop music, and many of them were aware that a civil rights movement was
>> starting up which made the notion of a separate market for each race seem
>> pernicious.
>
> I understand all of that, but I still find it amazing that there's ANYBODY out
> there who would like this version of "Steamboat" better than the Drifters
> version. Maybe nobody did, which is why this record is so obscure. I find it
> even more amazing that the bosses would think that this was a reasonable item
> to release to compete with the Drifters version. But I guess there were people
> back then who were just totally turned of by the "blackness" of these records.
> Hell, even now some of us are turned off by the blackness of some records,
> based on the ballots in the tournaments.

Amen.

--md

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