On 3/31/2022 12:56 PM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
> Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> writes:
>> On 3/31/2022 10:25 AM, Chris Buckley wrote:
>>> On 2022-03-31, Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> wrote:
>>>> On Wednesday, 30 March 2022 at 23:49:26 UTC+1, Chris Buckley wrote:
>>>>> On 2022-03-30, Quadibloc <jsa...@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> You are correct in saying that statistical significance does not imply
>>>>> there is an important difference - that's the point of the comic.
>>>>> Correctly scientifically saying that the risk increases with a case
>>>>> does not imply that the science says we must avoid that case.
>>>>
>>>> <https://www.explainxkcd.com/wiki/index.php/2599:_Spacecraft_Debris_Odds_Ratio>
>>>> points out that from the description, this is not
>>>> real data about spaceship debris head trauma
>>>> but a product of a mathematical model.
>>>> Actual statistics about space crash casualties
>>>> on the ground are a bit thin.
>>>>
>>>> I commented that I can't tell if going out is
>>>> really meant to be much more dangerous than
>>>> staying in. Won't space debris punch straight
>>>> through your house anyway?
>>>
>>> Just google "meteorite hits house" and you'll get the tale of a meteorite
>>> punching a hole through the roof and landing on the pillow of a
>>> sleeping Canadian.
>>>
>>> It obviously depends on the mass of the space debris. The vast majority
>>> of them have mass much less than the mass of this meteorite.
>>>
>> Depends more on the speed.
>>
>
> F=ma
>
> https://bigthink.com/starts-with-a-bang/most-important-equation-physics/

Kinetic Energy = Mass * Speed(squared)

--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

On 2022-03-31, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:

>>Dude, "Dead Like Me" rocks ! I watched the first two episodes last
>>night on IMDB.
>>
>>I cannot believe it went only two seasons. Something must have gone
>>wrong very fast.
>
> The corporate weenies started interfering and the showrunner gave up
> and bailed.

Bryan Fuller appears to suffer consistently from this, which I think
legitimately raises the question whether Fuller himself might be
part of the problem.

From what I've seen of his shows, he has an impressive artistic
vision, but I find his fetish for death to be grotesque and very
tiresome. He was involved in the creation of _Star Trek: Discovery_
before he was let go there too, and you can immediately see his
fingerprint on the early episodes with that Klingon ship of the
dead. Because death.

--
Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de

On Thu, 31 Mar 2022 15:02:52 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
<dtravel@sonic.net> wrote:

>On 3/31/2022 12:56 PM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>> Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> writes:
>>> On 3/31/2022 10:25 AM, Chris Buckley wrote:
>>>> On 2022-03-31, Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Wednesday, 30 March 2022 at 23:49:26 UTC+1, Chris Buckley wrote:
>>>>>> On 2022-03-30, Quadibloc <jsa...@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You are correct in saying that statistical significance does not imply
>>>>>> there is an important difference - that's the point of the comic.
>>>>>> Correctly scientifically saying that the risk increases with a case
>>>>>> does not imply that the science says we must avoid that case.
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www.explainxkcd.com/wiki/index.php/2599:_Spacecraft_Debris_Odds_Ratio>
>>>>> points out that from the description, this is not
>>>>> real data about spaceship debris head trauma
>>>>> but a product of a mathematical model.
>>>>> Actual statistics about space crash casualties
>>>>> on the ground are a bit thin.
>>>>>
>>>>> I commented that I can't tell if going out is
>>>>> really meant to be much more dangerous than
>>>>> staying in. Won't space debris punch straight
>>>>> through your house anyway?
>>>>
>>>> Just google "meteorite hits house" and you'll get the tale of a meteorite
>>>> punching a hole through the roof and landing on the pillow of a
>>>> sleeping Canadian.
>>>>
>>>> It obviously depends on the mass of the space debris. The vast majority
>>>> of them have mass much less than the mass of this meteorite.
>>>>
>>> Depends more on the speed.
>>>
>>
>> F=ma
>>
>> https://bigthink.com/starts-with-a-bang/most-important-equation-physics/
>
>Kinetic Energy = Mass * Speed(squared)

Some of which is expended displacing air and some of which is expended
heating the object. When the object gets hot enough it melts and
loses cohesion. The droplets continue to heat until they vaporize.

In some cases gas pockets or pockets of low-boiling point substances
heat to boiling and then superheat, which causes the object to
explode, then, again, the pieces continue to heat.

Newtonian mechanics applied to meteors only tells part of the
story--it assumes that they have infinite capacity to absorb heat.

On Thursday, March 31, 2022 at 6:38:57 PM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
> On Thu, 31 Mar 2022 15:02:52 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
> <dtr...@sonic.net> wrote:
>
> >On 3/31/2022 12:56 PM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
> >> Dimensional Traveler <dtr...@sonic.net> writes:
> >>> On 3/31/2022 10:25 AM, Chris Buckley wrote:
> >>>> On 2022-03-31, Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com> wrote:
> >>>>> On Wednesday, 30 March 2022 at 23:49:26 UTC+1, Chris Buckley wrote:
> >>>>>> On 2022-03-30, Quadibloc <jsa...@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> You are correct in saying that statistical significance does not imply
> >>>>>> there is an important difference - that's the point of the comic.
> >>>>>> Correctly scientifically saying that the risk increases with a case
> >>>>>> does not imply that the science says we must avoid that case.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> <https://www.explainxkcd.com/wiki/index.php/2599:_Spacecraft_Debris_Odds_Ratio>
> >>>>> points out that from the description, this is not
> >>>>> real data about spaceship debris head trauma
> >>>>> but a product of a mathematical model.
> >>>>> Actual statistics about space crash casualties
> >>>>> on the ground are a bit thin.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I commented that I can't tell if going out is
> >>>>> really meant to be much more dangerous than
> >>>>> staying in. Won't space debris punch straight
> >>>>> through your house anyway?
> >>>>
> >>>> Just google "meteorite hits house" and you'll get the tale of a meteorite
> >>>> punching a hole through the roof and landing on the pillow of a
> >>>> sleeping Canadian.
> >>>>
> >>>> It obviously depends on the mass of the space debris. The vast majority
> >>>> of them have mass much less than the mass of this meteorite.
> >>>>
> >>> Depends more on the speed.
> >>>
> >>
> >> F=ma
> >>
> >> https://bigthink.com/starts-with-a-bang/most-important-equation-physics/
> >
> >Kinetic Energy = Mass * Speed(squared)
> Some of which is expended displacing air and some of which is expended
> heating the object. When the object gets hot enough it melts and
> loses cohesion. The droplets continue to heat until they vaporize.
>
> In some cases gas pockets or pockets of low-boiling point substances
> heat to boiling and then superheat, which causes the object to
> explode, then, again, the pieces continue to heat.
>
> Newtonian mechanics applied to meteors only tells part of the
> story--it assumes that they have infinite capacity to absorb heat.

This page is the best collection of landed space junk I've found.

https://eclipsetours.com/paul-maley/space-debris/space-debris-1981-2003/

A lot of the junk is fuel tanks, many of which seem close to intact. A hollow
tank will slow down pretty fast while falling.

Pt

On Friday, April 1, 2022 at 4:25:41 AM UTC+11, Chris Buckley wrote:
> On 2022-03-31, Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com> wrote:
> > On Wednesday, 30 March 2022 at 23:49:26 UTC+1, Chris Buckley wrote:
> >> On 2022-03-30, Quadibloc <jsa...@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:
> >>
> >> You are correct in saying that statistical significance does not imply
> >> there is an important difference - that's the point of the comic.
> >> Correctly scientifically saying that the risk increases with a case
> >> does not imply that the science says we must avoid that case.
> >
> ><https://www.explainxkcd.com/wiki/index.php/2599:_Spacecraft_Debris_Odds_Ratio>
> > points out that from the description, this is not
> > real data about spaceship debris head trauma
> > but a product of a mathematical model.
> > Actual statistics about space crash casualties
> > on the ground are a bit thin.
> >
> > I commented that I can't tell if going out is
> > really meant to be much more dangerous than
> > staying in. Won't space debris punch straight
> > through your house anyway?
> Just google "meteorite hits house" and you'll get the tale of a meteorite
> punching a hole through the roof and landing on the pillow of a
> sleeping Canadian.

Then there was the asteroid that hit (*) Iceland recently that was reported to be "Half the Size of a Giraffe". (I suspect Randall Monroe would approve of the giraffe scale.)

https://www.sciencetimes.com/articles/36593/20220314/asteroid-half-size-giraffe-hits-iceland-2-hours-astronomers-spotted.htm

(*) For values of "hit" that include "did not actually hit, but was spotted somewhere in the vicinity of".

-Moriarty

On Wednesday, March 30, 2022 at 4:49:26 PM UTC-6, Chris Buckley wrote:

> You are correct in saying that statistical significance

I wasn't talking about statistical significance. The word "significant"
has other meanings in the English language.

While I remember that one person had been injured by being hit
by a _meteorite_ on its way down, I'm not aware that *anyone*
has *ever* been hit by a part of a falling satellite (despite the
opportunity when Skylab fell in Australia), hence, no, that wasn't
a real graph with real error bars.

John Savard

On Thursday, March 31, 2022 at 8:18:23 PM UTC-4, Quadibloc wrote:
> On Wednesday, March 30, 2022 at 4:49:26 PM UTC-6, Chris Buckley wrote:
>
> > You are correct in saying that statistical significance
> I wasn't talking about statistical significance. The word "significant"
> has other meanings in the English language.
>
> While I remember that one person had been injured by being hit
> by a _meteorite_ on its way down, I'm not aware that *anyone*
> has *ever* been hit by a part of a falling satellite (despite the
> opportunity when Skylab fell in Australia), hence, no, that wasn't
> a real graph with real error bars.

John, do you ever think to check? You'd get more respect.

Meteors:
https://astronomy.com/news/2020/05/death-from-above-7-unlucky-tales-of-people-killed-by-meteorites
That list skips the event you're probably thinking of:
https://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sylacauga_(meteorite)

Hit by space junk
https://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_debris#On_Earth
1969: Injuries
2002: Hit, but not injured
2009: Fatality.

Pt

On Thursday, March 31, 2022 at 8:44:08 PM UTC-4, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Thursday, March 31, 2022 at 8:18:23 PM UTC-4, Quadibloc wrote:
> > On Wednesday, March 30, 2022 at 4:49:26 PM UTC-6, Chris Buckley wrote:
> >
> > > You are correct in saying that statistical significance
> > I wasn't talking about statistical significance. The word "significant"
> > has other meanings in the English language.
> >
> > While I remember that one person had been injured by being hit
> > by a _meteorite_ on its way down, I'm not aware that *anyone*
> > has *ever* been hit by a part of a falling satellite (despite the
> > opportunity when Skylab fell in Australia), hence, no, that wasn't
> > a real graph with real error bars.
> John, do you ever think to check? You'd get more respect.
>
> Meteors:
> https://astronomy.com/news/2020/05/death-from-above-7-unlucky-tales-of-people-killed-by-meteorites
> That list skips the event you're probably thinking of:
> https://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sylacauga_(meteorite)
>
> Hit by space junk
> https://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_debris#On_Earth
> 1969: Injuries
> 2002: Hit, but not injured
> 2009: Fatality.

Mis-read that.

1997: Hit but not injured.
2002: Injured, but not fatally.

Pt

On 1/04/22 12:10, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
snip
>
> This page is the best collection of landed space junk I've found.
>
> https://eclipsetours.com/paul-maley/space-debris/space-debris-1981-2003/
>
> A lot of the junk is fuel tanks, many of which seem close to intact. A hollow
> tank will slow down pretty fast while falling.
>
> Pt

I would never consider space debris as something to look for on line but
enjoyed speed reading your reference and the following one to the
present year which included a hoax in New Zealand and also the following
error:
"Weight of the sphere was found to be 16 lb (7.3 kg) and the
circumference was 43.25 inches (17.02 cm), diameter 13.75 inches (5.41cm)."
Or, as Fourbricks would swear, the aliens are skilled at making their
space debris appear to be of human origin but their intent is clear with
imperialism substituted for metrication.