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arts / rec.arts.sf.written / Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

SubjectAuthor
* Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDavid Brown
+* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedMichael F. Stemper
|`* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDorothy J Heydt
| +* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDimensional Traveler
| |`- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDorothy J Heydt
| +- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJack Bohn
| `- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedBice
+* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedWolffan
|+* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJay E. Morris
||+* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|||+* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedpete...@gmail.com
||||+* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|||||`- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDimensional Traveler
||||`- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedKevrob
|||`- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJohn Halpenny
||`* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedWolffan
|| `- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|`* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedLeif Roar Moldskred
| `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedQuadibloc
|  `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJ. Clarke
|   +* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   |+* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedMichael F. Stemper
|   ||`- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedRobert Carnegie
|   |+* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDorothy J Heydt
|   ||+* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
|   |||`- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDorothy J Heydt
|   ||+* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedMichael F. Stemper
|   |||+- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedRobert Carnegie
|   |||`- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   ||`* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedScott Lurndal
|   || +- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   || `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedThe Horny Goat
|   ||  +- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedpete...@gmail.com
|   ||  `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedRobert Woodward
|   ||   `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDimensional Traveler
|   ||    `- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedRobert Woodward
|   |+- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJ. Clarke
|   |`* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedThe Horny Goat
|   | +* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDimensional Traveler
|   | |+* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedpete...@gmail.com
|   | ||`* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDimensional Traveler
|   | || `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   | ||  `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedLynn McGuire
|   | ||   +- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedpete...@gmail.com
|   | ||   `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJ. Clarke
|   | ||    `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedLynn McGuire
|   | ||     +- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJ. Clarke
|   | ||     `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDimensional Traveler
|   | ||      `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJ. Clarke
|   | ||       `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedMichael F. Stemper
|   | ||        +* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedTony Nance
|   | ||        |`- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedMichael F. Stemper
|   | ||        `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedThe Horny Goat
|   | ||         `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedMichael F. Stemper
|   | ||          `- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   | |+* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   | ||`* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDimensional Traveler
|   | || `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   | ||  `- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedpete...@gmail.com
|   | |`- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedThe Horny Goat
|   | +* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJ. Clarke
|   | |`- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedThe Horny Goat
|   | `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   |  +* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJames Nicoll
|   |  |+- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedWolffan
|   |  |`* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   |  | `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDimensional Traveler
|   |  |  `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   |  |   +* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDimensional Traveler
|   |  |   |+- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJ. Clarke
|   |  |   |`* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   |  |   | `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedChris Buckley
|   |  |   |  `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   |  |   |   `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedChris Buckley
|   |  |   |    `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedpete...@gmail.com
|   |  |   |     +* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedScott Lurndal
|   |  |   |     |`* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   |  |   |     | `* War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movieScott Lurndal
|   |  |   |     |  `* Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mScott Lurndal
|   |  |   |     |   +- Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mjdnicoll
|   |  |   |     |   +- Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mThe Horny Goat
|   |  |   |     |   `* Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mPaul S Person
|   |  |   |     |    +* Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mJ. Clarke
|   |  |   |     |    |`* Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mThe Horny Goat
|   |  |   |     |    | `* Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mJ. Clarke
|   |  |   |     |    |  `- Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: ListRoss Presser
|   |  |   |     |    +- Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mJibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
|   |  |   |     |    +* Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mThe Horny Goat
|   |  |   |     |    |+* Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mJ. Clarke
|   |  |   |     |    ||`* Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mThe Horny Goat
|   |  |   |     |    || `* Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mJ. Clarke
|   |  |   |     |    ||  `* Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mThe Horny Goat
|   |  |   |     |    ||   `- Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mJ. Clarke
|   |  |   |     |    |`* Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews:Christian Weisgerber
|   |  |   |     |    | `- Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst mNinapenda Jibini
|   |  |   |     |    `- Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: ListDimensional Traveler
|   |  |   |     +* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDimensional Traveler
|   |  |   |     |`* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedpete...@gmail.com
|   |  |   |     | `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDimensional Traveler
|   |  |   |     |  +* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedJ. Clarke
|   |  |   |     |  |`- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   |  |   |     |  `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedpete...@gmail.com
|   |  |   |     `- Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedPaul S Person
|   |  |   `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedpete...@gmail.com
|   |  `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedRobert Carnegie
|   `* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedThe Horny Goat
`* Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewedDudley Brooks

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Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed

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https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article-flat.php?id=73221&group=rec.arts.sf.written#73221

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From: jclarke....@gmail.com (J. Clarke)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed
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 by: J. Clarke - Tue, 10 May 2022 22:25 UTC

On Tue, 10 May 2022 13:00:01 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
<dtravel@sonic.net> wrote:

>On 5/10/2022 7:53 AM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 7:17:34 AM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
>>> On 5/9/2022 9:21 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley wrote:
>>>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
>>>>>>>>> I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks on targets inside
>>>>>>>>> Russia. Any such attacks are almost certainly being conducted by ground
>>>>>>>>> forces, aka "boots on the ground", simply because they are much harder
>>>>>>>>> to confirm.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But no nukes were used.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a link?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more accurately,
>>>>>> the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy, which appears to have a
>>>>>> policy of never showing a story you have read and want to find again.
>>>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the article.
>>>>> There have been no confirmed air attacks on Russian territory.
>>>>>>> Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks inside Russia.
>>>>>>> But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_ was emphasized.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That they complained is enough.
>>>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a confirmed attack).
>>>>> You trust Russian propaganda?
>>>>
>>>> This was all over the news a month ago.
>>>>
>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
>>>>
>>> "Reuters has not yet been able to verify the images."
>>
>> This is one of those cases where 'everyone knows, but no one will admit.'
>>
>> Just what other groups might have helicopters firing missiles into a
>> fuel storage facility 30 miles from the border?
>>
>What proof is there that missiles were fired into the storage facility?

Well, let's see, the helicopters fired missiles and the storage
facility blew up and the Russians aren't whining about it being an
orphanage or some such, so apparently nothing else was hit.

Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed

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Subject: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed
From: petert...@gmail.com (pete...@gmail.com)
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 by: pete...@gmail.com - Wed, 11 May 2022 00:49 UTC

On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 1:00:04 PM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
> On 5/10/2022 7:53 AM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 7:17:34 AM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
> >> On 5/9/2022 9:21 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>> On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley wrote:
> >>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
> >>>>> On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
> >>>>>>>> I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks on targets inside
> >>>>>>>> Russia. Any such attacks are almost certainly being conducted by ground
> >>>>>>>> forces, aka "boots on the ground", simply because they are much harder
> >>>>>>>> to confirm.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> But no nukes were used.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a link?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more accurately,
> >>>>> the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy, which appears to have a
> >>>>> policy of never showing a story you have read and want to find again.
> >>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the article.
> >>>> There have been no confirmed air attacks on Russian territory.
> >>>>>> Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks inside Russia.
> >>>>>> But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_ was emphasized.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> That they complained is enough.
> >>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a confirmed attack).
> >>>> You trust Russian propaganda?
> >>>
> >>> This was all over the news a month ago.
> >>>
> >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
> >>>
> >> "Reuters has not yet been able to verify the images."
> >
> > This is one of those cases where 'everyone knows, but no one will admit.'
> >
> > Just what other groups might have helicopters firing missiles into a
> > fuel storage facility 30 miles from the border?
> >
> What proof is there that missiles were fired into the storage facility?

Did you watch the video? There are more of the same event, also.

Pt

Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed

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From: dtra...@sonic.net (Dimensional Traveler)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed
Date: Tue, 10 May 2022 17:58:47 -0700
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Dimensional Traveler - Wed, 11 May 2022 00:58 UTC

On 5/10/2022 5:49 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 1:00:04 PM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
>> On 5/10/2022 7:53 AM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 7:17:34 AM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
>>>> On 5/9/2022 9:21 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley wrote:
>>>>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
>>>>>>>>>> I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks on targets inside
>>>>>>>>>> Russia. Any such attacks are almost certainly being conducted by ground
>>>>>>>>>> forces, aka "boots on the ground", simply because they are much harder
>>>>>>>>>> to confirm.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But no nukes were used.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a link?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more accurately,
>>>>>>> the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy, which appears to have a
>>>>>>> policy of never showing a story you have read and want to find again.
>>>>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the article.
>>>>>> There have been no confirmed air attacks on Russian territory.
>>>>>>>> Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks inside Russia.
>>>>>>>> But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_ was emphasized.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That they complained is enough.
>>>>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a confirmed attack).
>>>>>> You trust Russian propaganda?
>>>>>
>>>>> This was all over the news a month ago.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
>>>>>
>>>> "Reuters has not yet been able to verify the images."
>>>
>>> This is one of those cases where 'everyone knows, but no one will admit.'
>>>
>>> Just what other groups might have helicopters firing missiles into a
>>> fuel storage facility 30 miles from the border?
>>>
>> What proof is there that missiles were fired into the storage facility?
>
> Did you watch the video? There are more of the same event, also.
>
A YouTube video isn't evidence of anything.

--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed

<22349336-5853-4579-a923-b8963f510d62n@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed
From: rja.carn...@excite.com (Robert Carnegie)
Injection-Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 03:04:57 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
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 by: Robert Carnegie - Wed, 11 May 2022 03:04 UTC

On Wednesday, 11 May 2022 at 01:58:48 UTC+1, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
> On 5/10/2022 5:49 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 1:00:04 PM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
> >> On 5/10/2022 7:53 AM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>> On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 7:17:34 AM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
> >>>> On 5/9/2022 9:21 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>>>> On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley wrote:
> >>>>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
> >>>>>>> On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
> >>>>>>>>>> I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks on targets inside
> >>>>>>>>>> Russia. Any such attacks are almost certainly being conducted by ground
> >>>>>>>>>> forces, aka "boots on the ground", simply because they are much harder
> >>>>>>>>>> to confirm.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> But no nukes were used.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a link?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more accurately,
> >>>>>>> the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy, which appears to have a
> >>>>>>> policy of never showing a story you have read and want to find again.
> >>>>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the article.
> >>>>>> There have been no confirmed air attacks on Russian territory.
> >>>>>>>> Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks inside Russia.
> >>>>>>>> But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_ was emphasized.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> That they complained is enough.
> >>>>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a confirmed attack).
> >>>>>> You trust Russian propaganda?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> This was all over the news a month ago.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
> >>>>>
> >>>> "Reuters has not yet been able to verify the images."
> >>>
> >>> This is one of those cases where 'everyone knows, but no one will admit.'
> >>>
> >>> Just what other groups might have helicopters firing missiles into a
> >>> fuel storage facility 30 miles from the border?
> >>>
> >> What proof is there that missiles were fired into the storage facility?
> >
> > Did you watch the video? There are more of the same event, also.
> >
> A YouTube video isn't evidence of anything.

Snopes says a lot of the war film is from video games
with names like "Call of Booty" or whatever. And this
isn't the first time that happened. It's bonus points
I guess if television news - or Fox - broadcasts that as
the real thing, when it isn't.

Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed

<t5fdbs$fn1$2@dont-email.me>

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https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article-flat.php?id=73247&group=rec.arts.sf.written#73247

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From: dtra...@sonic.net (Dimensional Traveler)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed
Date: Tue, 10 May 2022 21:17:03 -0700
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Dimensional Traveler - Wed, 11 May 2022 04:17 UTC

On 5/10/2022 8:04 PM, Robert Carnegie wrote:
> On Wednesday, 11 May 2022 at 01:58:48 UTC+1, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
>> On 5/10/2022 5:49 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 1:00:04 PM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
>>>> On 5/10/2022 7:53 AM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 7:17:34 AM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
>>>>>> On 5/9/2022 9:21 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>> On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks on targets inside
>>>>>>>>>>>> Russia. Any such attacks are almost certainly being conducted by ground
>>>>>>>>>>>> forces, aka "boots on the ground", simply because they are much harder
>>>>>>>>>>>> to confirm.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> But no nukes were used.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a link?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more accurately,
>>>>>>>>> the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy, which appears to have a
>>>>>>>>> policy of never showing a story you have read and want to find again.
>>>>>>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the article.
>>>>>>>> There have been no confirmed air attacks on Russian territory.
>>>>>>>>>> Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks inside Russia.
>>>>>>>>>> But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_ was emphasized.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> That they complained is enough.
>>>>>>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a confirmed attack).
>>>>>>>> You trust Russian propaganda?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This was all over the news a month ago.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Reuters has not yet been able to verify the images."
>>>>>
>>>>> This is one of those cases where 'everyone knows, but no one will admit.'
>>>>>
>>>>> Just what other groups might have helicopters firing missiles into a
>>>>> fuel storage facility 30 miles from the border?
>>>>>
>>>> What proof is there that missiles were fired into the storage facility?
>>>
>>> Did you watch the video? There are more of the same event, also.
>>>
>> A YouTube video isn't evidence of anything.
>
> Snopes says a lot of the war film is from video games
> with names like "Call of Booty" or whatever. And this
> isn't the first time that happened. It's bonus points
> I guess if television news - or Fox - broadcasts that as
> the real thing, when it isn't.

Call of Duty, a very popular first person shooter series of games.

--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed

<c748c7dc-6f2a-40ca-9947-2f2faac5e00an@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed
From: petert...@gmail.com (pete...@gmail.com)
Injection-Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 04:34:25 +0000
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 by: pete...@gmail.com - Wed, 11 May 2022 04:34 UTC

On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 5:58:48 PM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
> On 5/10/2022 5:49 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 1:00:04 PM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
> >> On 5/10/2022 7:53 AM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>> On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 7:17:34 AM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
> >>>> On 5/9/2022 9:21 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>>>> On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley wrote:
> >>>>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
> >>>>>>> On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
> >>>>>>>>>> I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks on targets inside
> >>>>>>>>>> Russia. Any such attacks are almost certainly being conducted by ground
> >>>>>>>>>> forces, aka "boots on the ground", simply because they are much harder
> >>>>>>>>>> to confirm.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> But no nukes were used.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a link?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more accurately,
> >>>>>>> the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy, which appears to have a
> >>>>>>> policy of never showing a story you have read and want to find again.
> >>>>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the article.
> >>>>>> There have been no confirmed air attacks on Russian territory.
> >>>>>>>> Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks inside Russia.
> >>>>>>>> But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_ was emphasized.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> That they complained is enough.
> >>>>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a confirmed attack).
> >>>>>> You trust Russian propaganda?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> This was all over the news a month ago.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
> >>>>>
> >>>> "Reuters has not yet been able to verify the images."
> >>>
> >>> This is one of those cases where 'everyone knows, but no one will admit.'
> >>>
> >>> Just what other groups might have helicopters firing missiles into a
> >>> fuel storage facility 30 miles from the border?
> >>>
> >> What proof is there that missiles were fired into the storage facility?
> >
> > Did you watch the video? There are more of the same event, also.
> >
> A YouTube video isn't evidence of anything.

In a situation where it is not in the interests of anyone who could definitively
confirm or deny the event to do so, this is the best evidence available.

There has been an unusual number of fires and other accidents at Russian
war related facilities in the past few weeks.

Pt

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

<rbqm7htc69b8kaipeqhbcqjhrnopj3d74d@4ax.com>

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https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article-flat.php?id=73255&group=rec.arts.sf.written#73255

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From: lcra...@home.ca (The Horny Goat)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
Message-ID: <rbqm7htc69b8kaipeqhbcqjhrnopj3d74d@4ax.com>
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 by: The Horny Goat - Wed, 11 May 2022 07:46 UTC

On Tue, 10 May 2022 16:55:34 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) writes:
>>Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> writes:
>>>On Tue, 10 May 2022 13:52:07 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>"pete...@gmail.com" <petertrei@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley wrote:
>>>>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> > On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >>On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> >>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
>>>>>> >>>>I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks on targets inside
>>>>>> >>>>Russia. Any such attacks are almost certainly being conducted by ground
>>>>>> >>>>forces, aka "boots on the ground", simply because they are much harder
>>>>>> >>>>to confirm.
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> But no nukes were used.
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a link?
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more accurately,
>>>>>> > the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy, which appears to have a
>>>>>> > policy of never showing a story you have read and want to find again.
>>>>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the article.
>>>>>> There have been no confirmed air attacks on Russian territory.
>>>>>> >>Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks inside Russia.
>>>>>> >>But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_ was emphasized.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > That they complained is enough.
>>>>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a confirmed attack).
>>>>>> You trust Russian propaganda?
>>>>>
>>>>>This was all over the news a month ago.
>>>>>
>>>>>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
>>>>
>>>>Wasn't it _Red Storm Rising_ that started with the Russians
>>>>complaining about an attack on an oil refinery within
>>>>Russia (maskirovka)?

Wasn't RSR primarily about the naval battle in the Atlantic in that
scenario? (I'm NOT thinking of the Search for the Red October which
was in the same "universe" but not the same book at all)

I'm pretty sure there were no nukes used in that book.

>>>>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_military_deception
>>>
>>>I don't recall -- it's been a long time since I read it.
>>>I remember enjoying it, though.
>>>
>>>You do realize that, by citing a fictional instance where maskirovka
>>>produced nuclear war, you are /weakening/ your position, since a
>>>maskirovka cannot be confirmed?
>>
>>You are confused. I don't have a position on this particular topic,
>>just noting a curious possible juxtaposition of current events with a fictional
>>depiction.
>
>And, since it has apparently been quite a while since you read it,
>there's no nuclear war in RsR; rather it was the current Ukraine conflict
>writ large.
>
>(You may be conflating with _Sum of all Fears_, but, while the
>superbowl game was disrupted in SoaF, there wasn't nuclear war).

Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed

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From: ala...@sabir.com (Chris Buckley)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed
Date: 11 May 2022 13:02:10 GMT
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 by: Chris Buckley - Wed, 11 May 2022 13:02 UTC

On 2022-05-11, pete...@gmail.com <petertrei@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 5:58:48 PM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
>> On 5/10/2022 5:49 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
>> > On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 1:00:04 PM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
>> >> On 5/10/2022 7:53 AM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >>> On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 7:17:34 AM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
>> >>>> On 5/9/2022 9:21 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >>>>> On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley wrote:
>> >>>>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>> >>>>>>> On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>> >>>>>>>>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
>> >>>>>>>>>> I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks on targets inside
>> >>>>>>>>>> Russia. Any such attacks are almost certainly being conducted by ground
>> >>>>>>>>>> forces, aka "boots on the ground", simply because they are much harder
>> >>>>>>>>>> to confirm.
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> But no nukes were used.
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a link?
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more accurately,
>> >>>>>>> the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy, which appears to have a
>> >>>>>>> policy of never showing a story you have read and want to find again.
>> >>>>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the article.
>> >>>>>> There have been no confirmed air attacks on Russian territory.
>> >>>>>>>> Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks inside Russia.
>> >>>>>>>> But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_ was emphasized.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> That they complained is enough.
>> >>>>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a confirmed attack).
>> >>>>>> You trust Russian propaganda?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> This was all over the news a month ago.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
>> >>>>>
>> >>>> "Reuters has not yet been able to verify the images."
>> >>>
>> >>> This is one of those cases where 'everyone knows, but no one will admit.'
>> >>>
>> >>> Just what other groups might have helicopters firing missiles into a
>> >>> fuel storage facility 30 miles from the border?
>> >>>
>> >> What proof is there that missiles were fired into the storage facility?
>> >
>> > Did you watch the video? There are more of the same event, also.
>> >
>> A YouTube video isn't evidence of anything.
>
> In a situation where it is not in the interests of anyone who could definitively
> confirm or deny the event to do so, this is the best evidence available.
>
> There has been an unusual number of fires and other accidents at Russian
> war related facilities in the past few weeks.
>
> Pt

Yes, I agree. That was why when Paul insisted he had a _confirmed_
case of a Ukraine attack on Russia territory I was so surprised.
It would be a very major political statement if such a case existed.

Chris

Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed

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Subject: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed
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 by: Paul S Person - Wed, 11 May 2022 15:39 UTC

On Tue, 10 May 2022 18:25:13 -0400, J. Clarke
<jclarke.873638@gmail.com > wrote:

>On Tue, 10 May 2022 13:00:01 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
><dtravel@sonic.net> wrote:
>
>>On 5/10/2022 7:53 AM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 7:17:34 AM UTC-7, Dimensional Traveler wrote:
>>>> On 5/9/2022 9:21 PM, pete...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley wrote:
>>>>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
>>>>>>>>>> I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks on targets inside
>>>>>>>>>> Russia. Any such attacks are almost certainly being conducted by ground
>>>>>>>>>> forces, aka "boots on the ground", simply because they are much harder
>>>>>>>>>> to confirm.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But no nukes were used.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a link?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more accurately,
>>>>>>> the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy, which appears to have a
>>>>>>> policy of never showing a story you have read and want to find again.
>>>>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the article.
>>>>>> There have been no confirmed air attacks on Russian territory.
>>>>>>>> Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks inside Russia.
>>>>>>>> But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_ was emphasized.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That they complained is enough.
>>>>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a confirmed attack).
>>>>>> You trust Russian propaganda?
>>>>>
>>>>> This was all over the news a month ago.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
>>>>>
>>>> "Reuters has not yet been able to verify the images."
>>>
>>> This is one of those cases where 'everyone knows, but no one will admit.'
>>>
>>> Just what other groups might have helicopters firing missiles into a
>>> fuel storage facility 30 miles from the border?
>>>
>>What proof is there that missiles were fired into the storage facility?
>
>Well, let's see, the helicopters fired missiles and the storage
>facility blew up and the Russians aren't whining about it being an
>orphanage or some such, so apparently nothing else was hit.

Sadly, we appear to be dealing with either a Russian bot or a Friend
of Putin.

Who, so far, hasn't actually responded to you. Perhaps he can't think
of an evasion for your point.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

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From: psper...@old.netcom.invalid (Paul S Person)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 09:33:30 -0700
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 by: Paul S Person - Wed, 11 May 2022 16:33 UTC

On Tue, 10 May 2022 16:55:34 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) writes:
>>Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> writes:
>>>On Tue, 10 May 2022 13:52:07 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>"pete...@gmail.com" <petertrei@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley wrote:
>>>>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> > On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >>On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>> >>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
>>>>>> >>>>I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks on targets inside
>>>>>> >>>>Russia. Any such attacks are almost certainly being conducted by ground
>>>>>> >>>>forces, aka "boots on the ground", simply because they are much harder
>>>>>> >>>>to confirm.
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> But no nukes were used.
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a link?
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more accurately,
>>>>>> > the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy, which appears to have a
>>>>>> > policy of never showing a story you have read and want to find again.
>>>>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the article.
>>>>>> There have been no confirmed air attacks on Russian territory.
>>>>>> >>Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks inside Russia.
>>>>>> >>But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_ was emphasized.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > That they complained is enough.
>>>>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a confirmed attack).
>>>>>> You trust Russian propaganda?
>>>>>
>>>>>This was all over the news a month ago.
>>>>>
>>>>>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
>>>>
>>>>Wasn't it _Red Storm Rising_ that started with the Russians
>>>>complaining about an attack on an oil refinery within
>>>>Russia (maskirovka)?
>>>>
>>>>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_military_deception
>>>
>>>I don't recall -- it's been a long time since I read it.
>>>I remember enjoying it, though.
>>>
>>>You do realize that, by citing a fictional instance where maskirovka
>>>produced nuclear war, you are /weakening/ your position, since a
>>>maskirovka cannot be confirmed?
>>
>>You are confused. I don't have a position on this particular topic,
>>just noting a curious possible juxtaposition of current events with a fictional
>>depiction.
>
>And, since it has apparently been quite a while since you read it,
>there's no nuclear war in RsR; rather it was the current Ukraine conflict
>writ large.

So, the Soviets claim to be attacked and do /not/ use nukes?

And Putin appears to have done the same (no maskirovka involved).

So, to return to the point:

No, Ukraine attacking Russia does /not/ guarantee a nuclear war.

At least, from the air. As I noted, boots and the ground might be
different, particularly if they threatened Moscow. This would arguably
be an "existential threat", after all.

But trying to pretend that Putin's sabre-rattling should keep us from
supply Ukraine with appropriate non-nuclear weapons is to behave as a
lackey of Putin.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

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Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
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 by: J. Clarke - Wed, 11 May 2022 17:27 UTC

On Wed, 11 May 2022 09:33:30 -0700, Paul S Person
<psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:

>On Tue, 10 May 2022 16:55:34 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
>wrote:
>
>>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) writes:
>>>Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> writes:
>>>>On Tue, 10 May 2022 13:52:07 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>"pete...@gmail.com" <petertrei@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>>On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>> > On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >>On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>> >>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
>>>>>>> >>>>I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks on targets inside
>>>>>>> >>>>Russia. Any such attacks are almost certainly being conducted by ground
>>>>>>> >>>>forces, aka "boots on the ground", simply because they are much harder
>>>>>>> >>>>to confirm.
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>> But no nukes were used.
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >>I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a link?
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more accurately,
>>>>>>> > the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy, which appears to have a
>>>>>>> > policy of never showing a story you have read and want to find again.
>>>>>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the article.
>>>>>>> There have been no confirmed air attacks on Russian territory.
>>>>>>> >>Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks inside Russia.
>>>>>>> >>But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >>Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_ was emphasized.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > That they complained is enough.
>>>>>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a confirmed attack).
>>>>>>> You trust Russian propaganda?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>This was all over the news a month ago.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
>>>>>
>>>>>Wasn't it _Red Storm Rising_ that started with the Russians
>>>>>complaining about an attack on an oil refinery within
>>>>>Russia (maskirovka)?
>>>>>
>>>>>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_military_deception
>>>>
>>>>I don't recall -- it's been a long time since I read it.
>>>>I remember enjoying it, though.
>>>>
>>>>You do realize that, by citing a fictional instance where maskirovka
>>>>produced nuclear war, you are /weakening/ your position, since a
>>>>maskirovka cannot be confirmed?
>>>
>>>You are confused. I don't have a position on this particular topic,
>>>just noting a curious possible juxtaposition of current events with a fictional
>>>depiction.
>>
>>And, since it has apparently been quite a while since you read it,
>>there's no nuclear war in RsR; rather it was the current Ukraine conflict
>>writ large.
>
>So, the Soviets claim to be attacked and do /not/ use nukes?
>
>And Putin appears to have done the same (no maskirovka involved).
>
>So, to return to the point:
>
>No, Ukraine attacking Russia does /not/ guarantee a nuclear war.
>
>At least, from the air. As I noted, boots and the ground might be
>different, particularly if they threatened Moscow. This would arguably
>be an "existential threat", after all.
>
>But trying to pretend that Putin's sabre-rattling should keep us from
>supply Ukraine with appropriate non-nuclear weapons is to behave as a
>lackey of Putin.

I've said it before, eventually the world is going to have to figure
out a way to take down tinpot dictators with nuclear weapons. If NATO
decides eventually to take the hit and disarm Russia that would be a
very worthwhile object lesson for, for example, the North Koreans. It
would be costly but in the long run the world might be better off.

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

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Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
From: tausti...@gmail.com (Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha)
References: <t53pht$rof$1@dont-email.me> <713d7h9vd99vig3iv0ugfs2jnhcgsag0ak@4ax.com> <t569c7$2rm$1@dont-email.me> <mjpf7hdfgk9o1s4is42e2tcbn9a9jht760@4ax.com> <jdqicrFtih0U1@mid.individual.net> <khci7h10dbvi7ou66puk5mri04ddqljp19@4ax.com> <jdu3hvFk0iaU1@mid.individual.net> <49eeb7c4-4971-4df9-8d2f-e67d7c439102n@googlegroups.com> <b6ueK.18524$7%M9.6363@fx12.iad> <lp1l7hhqrcd6fvq2flpbcfch8lphlqmrr5@4ax.com> <jpweK.10180$bTp1.556@fx44.iad> <aOweK.5438$Xh%d.2826@fx98.iad> <j4pn7hdvgu15rdvdp3iu8jcjjtf9sv016g@4ax.com>
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 by: Jibini Kula Tumbili - Wed, 11 May 2022 17:42 UTC

Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote in
news:j4pn7hdvgu15rdvdp3iu8jcjjtf9sv016g@4ax.com:

> On Tue, 10 May 2022 16:55:34 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott
> Lurndal) wrote:
>
>>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) writes:
>>>Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> writes:
>>>>On Tue, 10 May 2022 13:52:07 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott
>>>>Lurndal) wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>"pete...@gmail.com" <petertrei@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>>On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley
>>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> > On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley
>>>>>>> > <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >>On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person
>>>>>>> >><pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>> >>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional
>>>>>>> >>> Traveler
>>>>>>> >>>>I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks
>>>>>>> >>>>on targets inside Russia. Any such attacks are almost
>>>>>>> >>>>certainly being conducted by ground forces, aka "boots
>>>>>>> >>>>on the ground", simply because they are much harder
>>>>>>> >>>>to confirm.
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>> But no nukes were used.
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >>I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a
>>>>>>> >>link?
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more
>>>>>>> > accurately, the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy,
>>>>>>> > which appears to have a policy of never showing a story
>>>>>>> > you have read and want to find again.
>>>>>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the
>>>>>>> article. There have been no confirmed air attacks on
>>>>>>> Russian territory.
>>>>>>> >>Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks
>>>>>>> >>inside Russia. But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >>Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_
>>>>>>> >>was emphasized.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > That they complained is enough.
>>>>>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a
>>>>>>> confirmed attack). You trust Russian propaganda?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>This was all over the news a month ago.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
>>>>>
>>>>>Wasn't it _Red Storm Rising_ that started with the Russians
>>>>>complaining about an attack on an oil refinery within
>>>>>Russia (maskirovka)?
>>>>>
>>>>>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_military_deception
>>>>
>>>>I don't recall -- it's been a long time since I read it.
>>>>I remember enjoying it, though.
>>>>
>>>>You do realize that, by citing a fictional instance where
>>>>maskirovka produced nuclear war, you are /weakening/ your
>>>>position, since a maskirovka cannot be confirmed?
>>>
>>>You are confused. I don't have a position on this particular
>>>topic, just noting a curious possible juxtaposition of current
>>>events with a fictional depiction.
>>
>>And, since it has apparently been quite a while since you read
>>it, there's no nuclear war in RsR; rather it was the current
>>Ukraine conflict writ large.
>
> So, the Soviets claim to be attacked and do /not/ use nukes?
>
> And Putin appears to have done the same (no maskirovka
> involved).
>
> So, to return to the point:
>
> No, Ukraine attacking Russia does /not/ guarantee a nuclear war.
>
> At least, from the air. As I noted, boots and the ground might
> be different, particularly if they threatened Moscow. This would
> arguably be an "existential threat", after all.
>
> But trying to pretend that Putin's sabre-rattling should keep us
> from supply Ukraine with appropriate non-nuclear weapons is to
> behave as a lackey of Putin.

So is denying that one is doing so.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

<qlvn7hd7hoie6j6ckg769dbuelova8le33@4ax.com>

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From: lcra...@home.ca (The Horny Goat)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
Message-ID: <qlvn7hd7hoie6j6ckg769dbuelova8le33@4ax.com>
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 by: The Horny Goat - Wed, 11 May 2022 18:24 UTC

On Wed, 11 May 2022 09:33:30 -0700, Paul S Person
<psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:

>And Putin appears to have done the same (no maskirovka involved).
>
>So, to return to the point:
>
>No, Ukraine attacking Russia does /not/ guarantee a nuclear war.
>
>At least, from the air. As I noted, boots and the ground might be
>different, particularly if they threatened Moscow. This would arguably
>be an "existential threat", after all.
>
>But trying to pretend that Putin's sabre-rattling should keep us from
>supply Ukraine with appropriate non-nuclear weapons is to behave as a
>lackey of Putin.

Since when have the Ukrainians expressed any interest in Moscow?

No question they'd like eastern Ukraine and Crimea back (and anything
else Putin might have conquered in 2014) but I've never heard anything
about a northern thrust towards Moscow even in the wildest Ukrainian
fantasy.

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

<nsvn7hptadr4rjok3atst4n489nf59i1t6@4ax.com>

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https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article-flat.php?id=73295&group=rec.arts.sf.written#73295

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From: lcra...@home.ca (The Horny Goat)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
Message-ID: <nsvn7hptadr4rjok3atst4n489nf59i1t6@4ax.com>
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 by: The Horny Goat - Wed, 11 May 2022 18:26 UTC

On Wed, 11 May 2022 13:27:01 -0400, J. Clarke
<jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:

>I've said it before, eventually the world is going to have to figure
>out a way to take down tinpot dictators with nuclear weapons. If NATO
>decides eventually to take the hit and disarm Russia that would be a
>very worthwhile object lesson for, for example, the North Koreans. It
>would be costly but in the long run the world might be better off.

Not sure if that would be such a great idea - wouldn't that pretty
much deliver all of the former Soviet Union east of the Urals into
Chinese hands?

How THAT would be good for the world is not clear to me at all.

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

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From: dtra...@sonic.net (Dimensional Traveler)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List
of worst movies reviewed)
Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 12:37:51 -0700
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 by: Dimensional Traveler - Wed, 11 May 2022 19:37 UTC

On 5/11/2022 9:33 AM, Paul S Person wrote:
> On Tue, 10 May 2022 16:55:34 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
> wrote:
>
>> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) writes:
>>> Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> writes:
>>>> On Tue, 10 May 2022 13:52:07 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> "pete...@gmail.com" <petertrei@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>> On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 8:13:09 PM UTC-7, Chris Buckley wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2022-05-09, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 8 May 2022 19:01:47 GMT, Chris Buckley <al...@sabir.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 2022-05-08, Paul S Person <pspe...@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 7 May 2022 10:13:43 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not aware of any _confirmed_ Ukrainian air attacks on targets inside
>>>>>>>>>>> Russia. Any such attacks are almost certainly being conducted by ground
>>>>>>>>>>> forces, aka "boots on the ground", simply because they are much harder
>>>>>>>>>>> to confirm.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm sorry you missed the article.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The /Russians/ were upset by it. And said so.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> But no nukes were used.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I missed "the article", also. Could you please post a link?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sadly, no. It is lost in the whirlwind of time. Or, more accurately,
>>>>>>>> the confusion of the Microsoft News thingy, which appears to have a
>>>>>>>> policy of never showing a story you have read and want to find again.
>>>>>>> I'll be more blunt - I think you are misremembering the article.
>>>>>>> There have been no confirmed air attacks on Russian territory.
>>>>>>>>> Certainly the Russians have complained about air attacks inside Russia.
>>>>>>>>> But I'm unaware of any confirmed attacks.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Attacks very possibly exist. But the word _confirmed_ was emphasized.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That they complained is enough.
>>>>>>> Not enough for what you claimed (that there was a confirmed attack).
>>>>>>> You trust Russian propaganda?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This was all over the news a month ago.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66XrGQcKnJc
>>>>>
>>>>> Wasn't it _Red Storm Rising_ that started with the Russians
>>>>> complaining about an attack on an oil refinery within
>>>>> Russia (maskirovka)?
>>>>>
>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_military_deception
>>>>
>>>> I don't recall -- it's been a long time since I read it.
>>>> I remember enjoying it, though.
>>>>
>>>> You do realize that, by citing a fictional instance where maskirovka
>>>> produced nuclear war, you are /weakening/ your position, since a
>>>> maskirovka cannot be confirmed?
>>>
>>> You are confused. I don't have a position on this particular topic,
>>> just noting a curious possible juxtaposition of current events with a fictional
>>> depiction.
>>
>> And, since it has apparently been quite a while since you read it,
>> there's no nuclear war in RsR; rather it was the current Ukraine conflict
>> writ large.
>
> So, the Soviets claim to be attacked and do /not/ use nukes?
>
> And Putin appears to have done the same (no maskirovka involved).
>
> So, to return to the point:
>
> No, Ukraine attacking Russia does /not/ guarantee a nuclear war.
>
> At least, from the air. As I noted, boots and the ground might be
> different, particularly if they threatened Moscow. This would arguably
> be an "existential threat", after all.
>
> But trying to pretend that Putin's sabre-rattling should keep us from
> supply Ukraine with appropriate non-nuclear weapons is to behave as a
> lackey of Putin.

Just for clarification, I am not advocating stopping supplying Ukraine
with weapons. I am just noting the possibility is one of the reasons
people in power to make those decisions may be deciding to not supply
Ukraine.

--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

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From: jclarke....@gmail.com (J. Clarke)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
Message-ID: <dbao7hp00bo0jkjh3ibppf80abork62hcu@4ax.com>
References: <jdqicrFtih0U1@mid.individual.net> <khci7h10dbvi7ou66puk5mri04ddqljp19@4ax.com> <jdu3hvFk0iaU1@mid.individual.net> <49eeb7c4-4971-4df9-8d2f-e67d7c439102n@googlegroups.com> <b6ueK.18524$7%M9.6363@fx12.iad> <lp1l7hhqrcd6fvq2flpbcfch8lphlqmrr5@4ax.com> <jpweK.10180$bTp1.556@fx44.iad> <aOweK.5438$Xh%d.2826@fx98.iad> <j4pn7hdvgu15rdvdp3iu8jcjjtf9sv016g@4ax.com> <hbsn7h91dga7mlt8a0grcdk12l88jtcr12@4ax.com> <nsvn7hptadr4rjok3atst4n489nf59i1t6@4ax.com>
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 by: J. Clarke - Wed, 11 May 2022 21:25 UTC

On Wed, 11 May 2022 11:26:52 -0700, The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca>
wrote:

>On Wed, 11 May 2022 13:27:01 -0400, J. Clarke
><jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>I've said it before, eventually the world is going to have to figure
>>out a way to take down tinpot dictators with nuclear weapons. If NATO
>>decides eventually to take the hit and disarm Russia that would be a
>>very worthwhile object lesson for, for example, the North Koreans. It
>>would be costly but in the long run the world might be better off.
>
>Not sure if that would be such a great idea - wouldn't that pretty
>much deliver all of the former Soviet Union east of the Urals into
>Chinese hands?
>
>How THAT would be good for the world is not clear to me at all.

That depends on how it went down.

However if China consumed Russia I suspect they would have enough
indigestion to keep them out of trouble for a good long time.

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

<reao7hhhvjatvq1vgj4srtgmuvlt7vbrat@4ax.com>

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From: jclarke....@gmail.com (J. Clarke)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
Message-ID: <reao7hhhvjatvq1vgj4srtgmuvlt7vbrat@4ax.com>
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 by: J. Clarke - Wed, 11 May 2022 21:26 UTC

On Wed, 11 May 2022 11:24:43 -0700, The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca>
wrote:

>On Wed, 11 May 2022 09:33:30 -0700, Paul S Person
><psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>
>>And Putin appears to have done the same (no maskirovka involved).
>>
>>So, to return to the point:
>>
>>No, Ukraine attacking Russia does /not/ guarantee a nuclear war.
>>
>>At least, from the air. As I noted, boots and the ground might be
>>different, particularly if they threatened Moscow. This would arguably
>>be an "existential threat", after all.
>>
>>But trying to pretend that Putin's sabre-rattling should keep us from
>>supply Ukraine with appropriate non-nuclear weapons is to behave as a
>>lackey of Putin.
>
>Since when have the Ukrainians expressed any interest in Moscow?
>
>No question they'd like eastern Ukraine and Crimea back (and anything
>else Putin might have conquered in 2014) but I've never heard anything
>about a northern thrust towards Moscow even in the wildest Ukrainian
>fantasy.

But if they get an offensive rolling it might not be all that easy to
stop.

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

<4c5a9878-8140-464f-8a67-669bb7903d00n@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List
of worst movies reviewed)
From: rpres...@gmail.com (Ross Presser)
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 by: Ross Presser - Thu, 12 May 2022 14:23 UTC

On Wednesday, May 11, 2022 at 5:25:30 PM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:

> However if China consumed Russia I suspect they would have enough
> indigestion to keep them out of trouble for a good long time.

More ObSF: "Sixth Column" by Robert A. Heinlein. (Trigger warning: racism)

] The proponents of the measure had maintained that China was a big bite
] even for Soviet Russia to digest and that the United States need fear
] no war while the digesting was taking place. They had been correct as
] far as they went -- but as a result of the Nonintercourse Act we had
] our backs turned when *China* digested Russia ... leaving America to
] face a system even stranger to western ways of thinking than had been
] the Soviet system it displaced.

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

<cab18h1eq2iodpdr8us7hl3dl9gte6d71l@4ax.com>

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From: lcra...@home.ca (The Horny Goat)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
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 by: The Horny Goat - Sun, 15 May 2022 07:40 UTC

On Wed, 11 May 2022 17:26:10 -0400, J. Clarke
<jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:

>>>But trying to pretend that Putin's sabre-rattling should keep us from
>>>supply Ukraine with appropriate non-nuclear weapons is to behave as a
>>>lackey of Putin.
>>
>>Since when have the Ukrainians expressed any interest in Moscow?
>>
>>No question they'd like eastern Ukraine and Crimea back (and anything
>>else Putin might have conquered in 2014) but I've never heard anything
>>about a northern thrust towards Moscow even in the wildest Ukrainian
>>fantasy.
>
>But if they get an offensive rolling it might not be all that easy to
>stop.

If long shot upon long shot the Ukrainians got to do to one or more
Russian cities what the Russians have done to Mariupol I doubt few
westerners would share tears even though most of us probably wouldn't
advise it.

Putin resorting to nukes would be the mother of all blunders since it
would be pretty much the one thing that would unite NATO militarily
against him.

Hopefully he actually does know that.

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

<s8728h52111ituo0nnjsia5i73absc2b3k@4ax.com>

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From: jclarke....@gmail.com (J. Clarke)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
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 by: J. Clarke - Sun, 15 May 2022 15:33 UTC

On Sun, 15 May 2022 00:40:12 -0700, The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca>
wrote:

>On Wed, 11 May 2022 17:26:10 -0400, J. Clarke
><jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>>>But trying to pretend that Putin's sabre-rattling should keep us from
>>>>supply Ukraine with appropriate non-nuclear weapons is to behave as a
>>>>lackey of Putin.
>>>
>>>Since when have the Ukrainians expressed any interest in Moscow?
>>>
>>>No question they'd like eastern Ukraine and Crimea back (and anything
>>>else Putin might have conquered in 2014) but I've never heard anything
>>>about a northern thrust towards Moscow even in the wildest Ukrainian
>>>fantasy.
>>
>>But if they get an offensive rolling it might not be all that easy to
>>stop.
>
>If long shot upon long shot the Ukrainians got to do to one or more
>Russian cities what the Russians have done to Mariupol I doubt few
>westerners would share tears even though most of us probably wouldn't
>advise it.
>
>Putin resorting to nukes would be the mother of all blunders since it
>would be pretty much the one thing that would unite NATO militarily
>against him.
>
>Hopefully he actually does know that.

NATO is already united militarily against him. That's why it exists.
He just hasn't pushed them to the "release the Kraken" point.

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

<slrnt82gjv.1epi.naddy@lorvorc.mips.inka.de>

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From: nad...@mips.inka.de (Christian Weisgerber)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews:
List of worst movies reviewed)
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 18:12:15 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Christian Weisgerber - Sun, 15 May 2022 18:12 UTC

On 2022-05-11, The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca> wrote:

> No question they'd like eastern Ukraine and Crimea back (and anything
> else Putin might have conquered in 2014) but I've never heard anything
> about a northern thrust towards Moscow even in the wildest Ukrainian
> fantasy.

Indeed, who cares about Moscow.

"Moscow as a centre of Rus' will disappear - the imperialism was a
consequence of the Mongol invasion, and Rus' went the wrong way for
centuries. This imperialism is now dying, we won't recognise Eastern
Europe in ten years. Power is coming back to Kyiv."
https://twitter.com/mdmitri91/status/1525573233516417026

They're gettin' uppity there in Kyiv.

--
Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

<XnsAE988F21CF849taustincagmailcom@85.12.62.245>

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Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
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Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 21:04:13 GMT
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 by: Ninapenda Jibini - Sun, 15 May 2022 21:04 UTC

Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> wrote in
news:slrnt82gjv.1epi.naddy@lorvorc.mips.inka.de:

> On 2022-05-11, The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca> wrote:
>
>> No question they'd like eastern Ukraine and Crimea back (and
>> anything else Putin might have conquered in 2014) but I've
>> never heard anything about a northern thrust towards Moscow
>> even in the wildest Ukrainian fantasy.
>
> Indeed, who cares about Moscow.
>
> "Moscow as a centre of Rus' will disappear - the imperialism was
> a consequence of the Mongol invasion, and Rus' went the wrong
> way for centuries. This imperialism is now dying, we won't
> recognise Eastern Europe in ten years. Power is coming back to
> Kyiv." https://twitter.com/mdmitri91/status/1525573233516417026
>
> They're gettin' uppity there in Kyiv.
>
All things considered, I'd say they're justified in getting a little
uppity.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

<efj38hhtole9380adeaeegu9sfk85jluo3@4ax.com>

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From: lcra...@home.ca (The Horny Goat)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
Message-ID: <efj38hhtole9380adeaeegu9sfk85jluo3@4ax.com>
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 by: The Horny Goat - Mon, 16 May 2022 04:11 UTC

On Sun, 15 May 2022 11:33:39 -0400, J. Clarke
<jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:

>>If long shot upon long shot the Ukrainians got to do to one or more
>>Russian cities what the Russians have done to Mariupol I doubt few
>>westerners would share tears even though most of us probably wouldn't
>>advise it.
>>
>>Putin resorting to nukes would be the mother of all blunders since it
>>would be pretty much the one thing that would unite NATO militarily
>>against him.
>>
>>Hopefully he actually does know that.
>
>NATO is already united militarily against him. That's why it exists.
>He just hasn't pushed them to the "release the Kraken" point.

My comment was about NATO actively taking part in the fighting.

That's why I prefaced my comments of Putin using nukes in Ukraine as
the "mother of all blunders". I'm sorry I apparently wasn't
sufficiently clear but I was suggesting that would be the SINGLE thing
I could envision that would bring the entire NATO alliance to war.

Given Russia currently has a GNP slightly larger than Canada (which of
course is smaller than either the US, UK or EU never mind all three
taken together) this would mean either a quick Russian surrender
(either under Putin or a successor) or large parts of Europe and
Russia glowing in the dark.

Neither option is my idea of a 'win for the good guys'

Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)

<voi48h1i0tf8nsqggmbbdm48mlbkr63m17@4ax.com>

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From: jclarke....@gmail.com (J. Clarke)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: War in Ukraine (a long time ago began as: Re: Movie reviews: List of worst movies reviewed)
Message-ID: <voi48h1i0tf8nsqggmbbdm48mlbkr63m17@4ax.com>
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 by: J. Clarke - Mon, 16 May 2022 13:04 UTC

On Sun, 15 May 2022 21:11:04 -0700, The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca>
wrote:

>On Sun, 15 May 2022 11:33:39 -0400, J. Clarke
><jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>>If long shot upon long shot the Ukrainians got to do to one or more
>>>Russian cities what the Russians have done to Mariupol I doubt few
>>>westerners would share tears even though most of us probably wouldn't
>>>advise it.
>>>
>>>Putin resorting to nukes would be the mother of all blunders since it
>>>would be pretty much the one thing that would unite NATO militarily
>>>against him.
>>>
>>>Hopefully he actually does know that.
>>
>>NATO is already united militarily against him. That's why it exists.
>>He just hasn't pushed them to the "release the Kraken" point.
>
>My comment was about NATO actively taking part in the fighting.
>
>That's why I prefaced my comments of Putin using nukes in Ukraine as
>the "mother of all blunders". I'm sorry I apparently wasn't
>sufficiently clear but I was suggesting that would be the SINGLE thing
>I could envision that would bring the entire NATO alliance to war.
>
>Given Russia currently has a GNP slightly larger than Canada (which of
>course is smaller than either the US, UK or EU never mind all three
>taken together) this would mean either a quick Russian surrender
>(either under Putin or a successor) or large parts of Europe and
>Russia glowing in the dark.
>
>Neither option is my idea of a 'win for the good guys'

Nonetheless, sooner or later "the good guys" are going to have to take
down a nuclear-armed opponent. And a quick Russian surrender most
assuredly would be a "win for the good guys". Just don't fuck up the
subsequent regime change.

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server_pubkey.txt

rocksolid light 0.9.7
clearnet tor