Here's .something different, a post on a reissue of a 1962 Marx Moonship I recently acquired. It seems to be based on space plane concepts that led to the space shuttle. It also is a tailless aircraft, which was advanced in itself for the 1960s. Anyone recall running across any similar pre-1980s examples, in toys, fiction or real life?
https://trendytroodon.blogspot.com/2022/09/mystery-monday-marx-moonship.html
Also, a link for a demo of a story based on the Marx Tom Corbett/ Rex Mars/ Space Patrol collection I accumulated during the pandemic. I envision it as a further tribute to Ray Harryhausen and Stanley Weinbaum. Feedback and suggestions are welcome.
https://trendytroodon.blogspot.com/2022/09/fiction-space-guys-adventure-demo.html
David N. Brown
Mesa, Arizona

On Wednesday, September 28, 2022 at 10:53:14 PM UTC-4, David Brown wrote:
> Here's .something different, a post on a reissue of a 1962 Marx Moonship I recently acquired. It seems to be based on space plane concepts that led to the space shuttle. It also is a tailless aircraft, which was advanced in itself for the 1960s. Anyone recall running across any similar pre-1980s examples, in toys, fiction or real life?
> https://trendytroodon.blogspot.com/2022/09/mystery-monday-marx-moonship.html

I had the Major Matt Mason XRG-1 reentry glider, of similar shape. It glided, too, or at least could be thrown; the flaps on the back could be set to turn it to the left or right. It was thinner plastic than most of his other vehicles, possibly vacuum formed? But it could carry an astronaut figure, in fact, one was necessary for balance, and the box showed how a kid without one could stuff the cockpit with clay.

I know a lot of early rocket designs had large fins, I wonder if the inability to get proper scale-thinness in rubber or soft plastic lead to them becoming airfoil wings.

Some thoughts on another page you link to, about a space station toy and a strange "tower." This tower immediately put me in mind of a '50s lunar lander (or, as they said in those days "Moon Ship") model:
http://www.ninfinger.org/models/boxtops/lindbergHL602-12.jpg

This in not just a simplification of the von Braun Moonlander:
http://www.ninfinger.org/models/boxtops/pegasus9109.jpg
(The above box art is artistic license: the four large spheres along the side are the fuel for the trip to the Moon from the orbit of the space station where the ship was assembled, they and their support frame would have been jettisoned on the way. The blue cylinders (there's a pair on the opposite side) are the landing fuel, and will litter the moon before take off. (I forget which color is the take off tanks, but rest assured they will be dropped before using the last tanks to return to the station.))
but --and I didn't realize this until I saw a kit build without the landing gear and their framework-- von Braun's earlier lunar surveyor vehicle.
http://www.ninfinger.org/models/vault/von%20Braun%20Lunar%20Spacecraft/vb%20lunar%2002.jpg
(The directory has this guy's study plans for converting the kit.)
So, could that building and tower be a spaceship and "launch complex"? This despite the ship in question not being designed to be launched from or land on any body of significant gravity.

P.S. Perry Rhodan fans may find the top of the model Moon Ship similar to a ship appearing in the movie of "Mission Stardust." The special effects were done by Antonio Margheriti, whose own films "Assignment: Outer Space," "Battle of the Worlds," and the Gamma One Quadrilogy of four films for the budget of one, all featured ships inspired by the Collier's Space Symposium series, the series of von Braun books that followed, the Disneyland "Man in Space" episodes, and the Lindberg Line of models. If, as I think, he loaned his filming minatures for set dressing on Federico Fellini's "8 1/2," they were of a more substantial size, so he can be spared the accusation of just building the kits to feature in his films.

--
-Jack

On Friday, September 30, 2022 at 7:29:43 AM UTC-7, jack....@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, September 28, 2022 at 10:53:14 PM UTC-4, David Brown wrote:
> > Here's .something different, a post on a reissue of a 1962 Marx Moonship I recently acquired. It seems to be based on space plane concepts that led to the space shuttle. It also is a tailless aircraft, which was advanced in itself for the 1960s. Anyone recall running across any similar pre-1980s examples, in toys, fiction or real life?
> > https://trendytroodon.blogspot.com/2022/09/mystery-monday-marx-moonship..html
> I had the Major Matt Mason XRG-1 reentry glider, of similar shape. It glided, too, or at least could be thrown; the flaps on the back could be set to turn it to the left or right. It was thinner plastic than most of his other vehicles, possibly vacuum formed? But it could carry an astronaut figure, in fact, one was necessary for balance, and the box showed how a kid without one could stuff the cockpit with clay.
>
> I know a lot of early rocket designs had large fins, I wonder if the inability to get proper scale-thinness in rubber or soft plastic lead to them becoming airfoil wings.
>
> Some thoughts on another page you link to, about a space station toy and a strange "tower." This tower immediately put me in mind of a '50s lunar lander (or, as they said in those days "Moon Ship") model:
> http://www.ninfinger.org/models/boxtops/lindbergHL602-12.jpg
>
> This in not just a simplification of the von Braun Moonlander:
> http://www.ninfinger.org/models/boxtops/pegasus9109.jpg
> (The above box art is artistic license: the four large spheres along the side are the fuel for the trip to the Moon from the orbit of the space station where the ship was assembled, they and their support frame would have been jettisoned on the way. The blue cylinders (there's a pair on the opposite side) are the landing fuel, and will litter the moon before take off. (I forget which color is the take off tanks, but rest assured they will be dropped before using the last tanks to return to the station.))
> but --and I didn't realize this until I saw a kit build without the landing gear and their framework-- von Braun's earlier lunar surveyor vehicle.
> http://www.ninfinger.org/models/vault/von%20Braun%20Lunar%20Spacecraft/vb%20lunar%2002.jpg
> (The directory has this guy's study plans for converting the kit.)
> So, could that building and tower be a spaceship and "launch complex"? This despite the ship in question not being designed to be launched from or land on any body of significant gravity.
>
> P.S. Perry Rhodan fans may find the top of the model Moon Ship similar to a ship appearing in the movie of "Mission Stardust." The special effects were done by Antonio Margheriti, whose own films "Assignment: Outer Space," "Battle of the Worlds," and the Gamma One Quadrilogy of four films for the budget of one, all featured ships inspired by the Collier's Space Symposium series, the series of von Braun books that followed, the Disneyland "Man in Space" episodes, and the Lindberg Line of models. If, as I think, he loaned his filming minatures for set dressing on Federico Fellini's "8 1/2," they were of a more substantial size, so he can be spared the accusation of just building the kits to feature in his films.
>
> --
> -Jack
Now that you mention it, I had seen at least one of the designs you mention and noted the similarity to the Marx tower. It doesn't seem likely the resemblance could be coincidence. I still find it unusually fanciful for the Marx space playsets. It would be more understandable if it was an older concept the Marx designers didn't fully understand. There were frequent issues with things they designed getting separated from their intended function and scale. Even the space station was sometimes shown in box art on the ground and in scale with the astronaut figures.

On Friday, September 30, 2022 at 8:29:43 AM UTC-6, jack....@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, September 28, 2022 at 10:53:14 PM UTC-4, David Brown wrote:

> > Here's .something different, a post on a reissue of a 1962 Marx Moonship I recently acquired.
> > It seems to be based on space plane concepts that led to the space shuttle. It also is a tailless
> > aircraft, which was advanced in itself for the 1960s. Anyone recall running across any similar
> > pre-1980s examples, in toys, fiction or real life?

> > https://trendytroodon.blogspot.com/2022/09/mystery-monday-marx-moonship.html

> I had the Major Matt Mason XRG-1 reentry glider, of similar shape. It glided, too, or at least
> could be thrown; the flaps on the back could be set to turn it to the left or right. It was thinner
> plastic than most of his other vehicles, possibly vacuum formed? But it could carry an
> astronaut figure, in fact, one was necessary for balance, and the box showed how a kid
> without one could stuff the cockpit with clay.

If we're going to talk about a space plane that preceded the Space Shuttle in real life, of
course one well-known example comes to mind: the Dyna-Soar. And there was a series
of novels about a hero by the name of Mike Mars who flew one.

John Savard

In article <9ac1cdc5-4b5d-4320-b85f-4c3ebf3477c1n@googlegroups.com>,
Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:
>On Friday, September 30, 2022 at 8:29:43 AM UTC-6, jack....@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Wednesday, September 28, 2022 at 10:53:14 PM UTC-4, David Brown wrote:
>
>> > Here's .something different, a post on a reissue of a 1962 Marx
>Moonship I recently acquired.
>> > It seems to be based on space plane concepts that led to the space
>shuttle. It also is a tailless
>> > aircraft, which was advanced in itself for the 1960s. Anyone recall
>running across any similar
>> > pre-1980s examples, in toys, fiction or real life?
>
>> > https://trendytroodon.blogspot.com/2022/09/mystery-monday-marx-moonship.html
>
>> I had the Major Matt Mason XRG-1 reentry glider, of similar shape. It
>glided, too, or at least
>> could be thrown; the flaps on the back could be set to turn it to the
>left or right. It was thinner
>> plastic than most of his other vehicles, possibly vacuum formed? But
>it could carry an
>> astronaut figure, in fact, one was necessary for balance, and the box
>showed how a kid
>> without one could stuff the cockpit with clay.
>
>If we're going to talk about a space plane that preceded the Space
>Shuttle in real life, of
>course one well-known example comes to mind: the Dyna-Soar. And there
>was a series
>of novels about a hero by the name of Mike Mars who flew one.

In his 1956 book, _Rocket Power and Space Flight_, G. Harry Stine
has illustrations for a proposed orbital vehicle based developing
from the X-15. And, indeed, the X-15 itself was eventually flown
high enough to gain the pilots astronaut rating.