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arts / rec.arts.sf.written / [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

SubjectAuthor
* [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be ForgottenJames Nicoll
+* Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to BeLynn McGuire
|`- Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to BeJames Nicoll
+- Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be ForgottenAndrew McDowell
+- Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be ForgottenMoriarty
+- Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be ForgottenDon
+* Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be ForgottenRobert Woodward
|`* Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be ForgottenJames Nicoll
| `* Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be ForgottenDorothy J Heydt
|  `* Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to BeLynn McGuire
|   `- Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to BeDorothy J Heydt
+- Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be ForgottenWolffan
`* Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be ForgottenTony Nance
 `* John Boyd (was: Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to BeMichael F. Stemper
  `* Re: John Boyd (was: Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten)William Hyde
   `- Re: John BoydGary R. Schmidt

1
[tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

<tjrmp6$f1l$1@reader2.panix.com>

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From: jdnic...@panix.com (James Nicoll)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2022 17:59:02 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: Public Access Networks Corp.
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 by: James Nicoll - Tue, 1 Nov 2022 17:59 UTC

Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be-forgotten

What it says on the tin.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll

Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

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From: lynnmcgu...@gmail.com (Lynn McGuire)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be
Forgotten
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 by: Lynn McGuire - Tue, 1 Nov 2022 20:06 UTC

On 11/1/2022 12:59 PM, James Nicoll wrote:
> Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
> https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be-forgotten
>
> What it says on the tin.

Zero for five here.

Yup, I suspect that we are WAY past peak Heinlein now.

Lynn

Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

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From: jdnic...@panix.com (James Nicoll)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be
Forgotten
Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2022 20:11:43 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: Public Access Networks Corp.
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 by: James Nicoll - Tue, 1 Nov 2022 20:11 UTC

In article <tjru82$rgc6$1@dont-email.me>,
Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> wrote:
>On 11/1/2022 12:59 PM, James Nicoll wrote:
>> Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
>>
>https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be-forgotten
>>
>> What it says on the tin.
>
>Zero for five here.
>
>Yup, I suspect that we are WAY past peak Heinlein now.

When I was a kid, RAH was sold as cheap, disposable MMPB. Now
his books are flogged to what looks like an older, richer,
far less numerous market.

Decades ago, a friend got a full run of 1stE juvies for
nothing, because the library was clearing out books no
longer read by patrons.

--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll

Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

<fc258ad9-796d-4978-9112-4e018f3678b4n@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
From: mcdowell...@sky.com (Andrew McDowell)
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 by: Andrew McDowell - Tue, 1 Nov 2022 20:52 UTC

On Tuesday, November 1, 2022 at 5:59:06 PM UTC, James Nicoll wrote:
> Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
> https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be-forgotten
>
> What it says on the tin.
> --
> My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
> My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
> My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
> My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
Just the title of this is uplifting, in these days when no culture is more targetted than our own past. I am happy to be able to confirm that "Doorways In The sand" is a very enjoyable read (assuming you can get past yet another Zelazny hero who smokes :-)).

Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

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Subject: Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
From: blue...@ivillage.com (Moriarty)
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 by: Moriarty - Tue, 1 Nov 2022 21:52 UTC

On Wednesday, November 2, 2022 at 4:59:06 AM UTC+11, James Nicoll wrote:
> Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
> https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be-forgotten
>
> What it says on the tin.

The only one I've read is McIntyre's "The Exile Waiting", although I really should get around to reading "Doorways in the Sand" one of these years. Zelazny is an author whose oeuvre I'd eventually like to complete.

I was very underwhelmed by TEW. I remember very little about it except a girl trying to get away from Uncle Fagin and the old trope of mutants living underground.

-Moriarty

Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

<20221101a@crcomp.net>

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From: g...@crcomp.net (Don)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
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 by: Don - Tue, 1 Nov 2022 22:43 UTC

James Nicoll wrote:
> Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
> https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-b
e-forgotten
>
> What it says on the tin.

_Doorways in the Sand_'s Rhennius Machine creates chiral copies of
whatever it inputs. In organic chemistry chirality concocts lessor
poisons, commonly called "cures," from greater poisons.

Danke,

--
Don.......My cat's )\._.,--....,'``. https://crcomp.net/reviews.php
telltale tall tail /, _.. \ _\ (`._ ,. Walk humbly with thy God.
tells tall tales.. `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.' Make 1984 fiction again.

Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

<robertaw-459510.22100801112022@news.individual.net>

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From: rober...@drizzle.com (Robert Woodward)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
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 by: Robert Woodward - Wed, 2 Nov 2022 05:10 UTC

In article <tjrmp6$f1l$1@reader2.panix.com>,
jdnicoll@panix.com (James Nicoll) wrote:

> Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
> https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be
> -forgotten
>
> What it says on the tin.

Your idea of "Vintage" is a couple of decades younger than mine. OTOH,
this is a rare case where I have read all 5* of your selections (though
I don't remember much about the Zelazny title and I fear some of what I
think I remember might be from a different Zelazny novel).

*The E-book version of _The Doppelganger Gambit_ was "updated" when it
was released several years ago (I suspect that the same was done for the
2nd title in that series - the 3rd book was definitely rewritten and
given a different title).

--
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_.
�-----------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward robertaw@drizzle.com

Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

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From: jdnic...@panix.com (James Nicoll)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
Date: Wed, 2 Nov 2022 13:18:05 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: Public Access Networks Corp.
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 by: James Nicoll - Wed, 2 Nov 2022 13:18 UTC

In article <robertaw-459510.22100801112022@news.individual.net>,
Robert Woodward <robertaw@drizzle.com> wrote:
>In article <tjrmp6$f1l$1@reader2.panix.com>,
> jdnicoll@panix.com (James Nicoll) wrote:
>
>> Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
>>
>https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be
>> -forgotten
>>
>> What it says on the tin.
>
>Your idea of "Vintage" is a couple of decades younger than mine.

All are older than the median human.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll

Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

<rKs5BK.1Iy8@kithrup.com>

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From: djhe...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt)
Subject: Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
Message-ID: <rKs5BK.1Iy8@kithrup.com>
Date: Thu, 3 Nov 2022 16:18:56 GMT
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 by: Dorothy J Heydt - Thu, 3 Nov 2022 16:18 UTC

In article <tjtqmc$ggu$1@reader2.panix.com>,
James Nicoll <jdnicoll@panix.com> wrote:
>In article <robertaw-459510.22100801112022@news.individual.net>,
>Robert Woodward <robertaw@drizzle.com> wrote:
>>In article <tjrmp6$f1l$1@reader2.panix.com>,
>> jdnicoll@panix.com (James Nicoll) wrote:
>>
>>> Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
>>>
>>https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be
>>> -forgotten
>>>
>>> What it says on the tin.
>>
>>Your idea of "Vintage" is a couple of decades younger than mine.
>
>All are older than the median human.

(Hal Heydt)
Meh. I'm pretty sure that *I'm* older than the median human,
what with being 73.

Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

<tk13hp$1h5hb$3@dont-email.me>

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From: lynnmcgu...@gmail.com (Lynn McGuire)
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be
Forgotten
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 by: Lynn McGuire - Thu, 3 Nov 2022 19:07 UTC

On 11/3/2022 11:18 AM, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
> In article <tjtqmc$ggu$1@reader2.panix.com>,
> James Nicoll <jdnicoll@panix.com> wrote:
>> In article <robertaw-459510.22100801112022@news.individual.net>,
>> Robert Woodward <robertaw@drizzle.com> wrote:
>>> In article <tjrmp6$f1l$1@reader2.panix.com>,
>>> jdnicoll@panix.com (James Nicoll) wrote:
>>>
>>>> Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
>>>>
>>> https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be
>>>> -forgotten
>>>>
>>>> What it says on the tin.
>>>
>>> Your idea of "Vintage" is a couple of decades younger than mine.
>>
>> All are older than the median human.
>
> (Hal Heydt)
> Meh. I'm pretty sure that *I'm* older than the median human,
> what with being 73.

For some reason I thought that you were almost 20 years younger than
Dorothy. So you are 7 or 8 years younger than Dorothy.

I am 2.3 years younger than my wife. We got married 40 years ago in the
time period before her birthday and after my birthday so that she was
only 2 years older than me. We went to eat lunch after church one day
with one of my groomsmen and his girlfriend, ages were mentioned, and he
went nuts about how my wife was older than me. His girlfriend kept on
kicking him under the table, he kept on yelling ouch, and asking her to
stop. She flat out told him to shut up, it was hilarious.

Lynn

Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

<rKuvEy.19Kw@kithrup.com>

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From: djhe...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt)
Subject: Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be
Forgotten
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Date: Sat, 5 Nov 2022 03:37:46 GMT
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 by: Dorothy J Heydt - Sat, 5 Nov 2022 03:37 UTC

In article <tk13hp$1h5hb$3@dont-email.me>,
Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> wrote:
>On 11/3/2022 11:18 AM, Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>> In article <tjtqmc$ggu$1@reader2.panix.com>,
>> James Nicoll <jdnicoll@panix.com> wrote:
>>> In article <robertaw-459510.22100801112022@news.individual.net>,
>>> Robert Woodward <robertaw@drizzle.com> wrote:
>>>> In article <tjrmp6$f1l$1@reader2.panix.com>,
>>>> jdnicoll@panix.com (James Nicoll) wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
>>>>>
>>>>
>https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be
>>>>> -forgotten
>>>>>
>>>>> What it says on the tin.
>>>>
>>>> Your idea of "Vintage" is a couple of decades younger than mine.
>>>
>>> All are older than the median human.
>>
>> (Hal Heydt)
>> Meh. I'm pretty sure that *I'm* older than the median human,
>> what with being 73.
>
>For some reason I thought that you were almost 20 years younger than
>Dorothy. So you are 7 or 8 years younger than Dorothy.
>
>I am 2.3 years younger than my wife. We got married 40 years ago in the
>time period before her birthday and after my birthday so that she was
>only 2 years older than me. We went to eat lunch after church one day
>with one of my groomsmen and his girlfriend, ages were mentioned, and he
>went nuts about how my wife was older than me. His girlfriend kept on
>kicking him under the table, he kept on yelling ouch, and asking her to
>stop. She flat out told him to shut up, it was hilarious.

(Hal Heydt)
I was born in March 1949. Dorothy in June 1942. We were married
in May 1971. We set the date for the weekend after West Kingdom
Beltane Coronation. Fewer events in those days, so that weekend
was clear.

Side note... Charles III is about 4 months and a week older than
I am.

Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

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 by: Wolffan - Sat, 5 Nov 2022 16:11 UTC

On 01 Nov 2022, James Nicoll wrote
(in article <tjrmp6$f1l$1@reader2.panix.com>):

> Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
> https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be
> -forgotten
>
> What it says on the tin.

ok... I have three: Doorways, Outcasts, and Gambit. I’m currently
re-reading Outcast. Either I never heard of the other two at all or I just
don’t remember them, and they’re not in The Pile with my other
books from the 60s, 70s, and 80s.

On the other hand, the expedition to The Pile which this post inspired did
reveal several other Vinge and Killough books. My to-read list just expanded.

Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten

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Subject: Re: [tor dot com] Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
From: tonynanc...@gmail.com (Tony Nance)
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 by: Tony Nance - Wed, 9 Nov 2022 03:12 UTC

On Tuesday, November 1, 2022 at 1:59:06 PM UTC-4, James Nicoll wrote:
> Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten
> https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be-forgotten
>
> What it says on the tin.
>

Thanks for the tip on the Killough - I've moved it onto the short TBR pile.

Adding to the list of suggestions -- I was kinda shocked when
I recently realized Hughart's Bridge of Birds was written in 1984.
- Tony

John Boyd (was: Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten)

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Subject: John Boyd (was: Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be
Forgotten)
Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2022 10:23:48 -0600
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 by: Michael F. Stemper - Wed, 9 Nov 2022 16:23 UTC

In comment 43 at
<https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be-forgotten/>
somebody refers to _The Last Starship From Earth_, _The Rakehells
of Heaven_, and _The Pollinators of Eden_ as a "trilogy". I've read
the latter two within the last five(ish) years, but don't recall
anything thematically connecting them. (To be honest, I don't recall
much of anything about them.)

Are these really related works? The ISFDB doesn't make any note of
them being so:
<https://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/ea.cgi?439>

--
Michael F. Stemper
Economists have correctly predicted seven of the last three recessions.

Re: John Boyd (was: Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten)

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Subject: Re: John Boyd (was: Five Vintage SFF Novels That Are Too Good to Be Forgotten)
From: wthyde1...@gmail.com (William Hyde)
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 by: William Hyde - Wed, 9 Nov 2022 19:10 UTC

On Wednesday, November 9, 2022 at 11:23:53 AM UTC-5, Michael F. Stemper wrote:
> In comment 43 at
> <https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be-forgotten/>
> somebody refers to _The Last Starship From Earth_, _The Rakehells
> of Heaven_, and _The Pollinators of Eden_ as a "trilogy". I've read
> the latter two within the last five(ish) years, but don't recall
> anything thematically connecting them. (To be honest, I don't recall
> much of anything about them.)

They may be set in the same future, though I am unsure of that. I certainly didn't think
they were a trilogy when I read them.

William Hyde

Re: John Boyd

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 by: Gary R. Schmidt - Thu, 10 Nov 2022 02:45 UTC

On 10/11/2022 06:10, William Hyde wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 9, 2022 at 11:23:53 AM UTC-5, Michael F. Stemper wrote:
>> In comment 43 at
>> <https://www.tor.com/2022/11/01/five-vintage-sff-novels-that-are-too-good-to-be-forgotten/>
>> somebody refers to _The Last Starship From Earth_, _The Rakehells
>> of Heaven_, and _The Pollinators of Eden_ as a "trilogy". I've read
>> the latter two within the last five(ish) years, but don't recall
>> anything thematically connecting them. (To be honest, I don't recall
>> much of anything about them.)
>
> They may be set in the same future, though I am unsure of that. I certainly didn't think
> they were a trilogy when I read them.
>
I don't see them as all being in the same future. Okay, the other two
could be subsequent to, "The Last Starship from Earth", but they don't
read the same to me. YMMV.

Cheers,
Gary B-)

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