ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) wrote in
news:jtctllFddjjU2@mid.individual.net:

> In article <XnsAF4E67ABA8F77taustincagmailcom@85.12.62.232>,
> Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:
>>Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote in
>>news:2692nh5sqaeh4ib95csfmcie379ponq5tg@4ax.com:
>>
>>> On Sat, 12 Nov 2022 09:48:23 -0800, pyotr filipivich
>>> <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) on Sat, 12 Nov 2022
>>>>16:57:44 GMT typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>>>>>Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote in
>>>>>>news:l9PbL.74464$1449.32517@fx14.iad:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For the most part, a nothingburger. However, there are
>>>>>>> likely lots of small embedded 32-bit processors in devices
>>>>>>> like routers which may exhibit issues, if they're still
>>>>>>> running 16 years from now.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>You sound just like the doom criers ("Give me money or
>>>>>>you'll DIE!!!") in the run up to y2k.
>>>>>
>>>>>I said "if they're still running 16 years from now", which is
>>>>>quite unlikely. However, cheap-ass manufacturers may
>>>>>continue to use the same software in newer devices, sadly.
>>>>
>>>> It is possible. As the cliche was "back in my day" - most
>>>> of the
>>>>current batch of programmers have no idea that there are COBOL
>>>>programs still running which were compiled before they were
>>>>born.
>>>>
>>>> The question is, how many people / organizations have a
>>>> system
>>>>which has been running, is running, will be running, with
>>>>little or no reason to replace it with a New And Improved
>>>>Hardware?
>>>
>>> Raises hand.
>>>
>>> (I tend to use my equipment until it literally dies. OK, the
>>> DSL modem/router was an exception, but only because the ISP
>>> pulled the plug.)
>>
>>And how often do you have inexpensive appliance devices last 16
>>years? How many do you have right now that were bought in 2006?
>>
>>--
>
> Well, I post to Usenet from a 1997 desktop,

Which, of course, caught on fire, exploded, and killed your dog at
midnight on December 31, 1999, because these things are unsolvable
catatrophes that will end human civilization.

This entire converstaion is an hallucination during your death
throes at the hands of cannibals.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

In article <XnsAF4EC623A8BC0taustincagmailcom@85.12.62.232>,
Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:
>ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) wrote in
>news:jtctllFddjjU2@mid.individual.net:
>
>> In article <XnsAF4E67ABA8F77taustincagmailcom@85.12.62.232>,
>> Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote in
>>>news:2692nh5sqaeh4ib95csfmcie379ponq5tg@4ax.com:
>>>
>>>> On Sat, 12 Nov 2022 09:48:23 -0800, pyotr filipivich
>>>> <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) on Sat, 12 Nov 2022
>>>>>16:57:44 GMT typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>>>>>>Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>>>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote in
>>>>>>>news:l9PbL.74464$1449.32517@fx14.iad:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> For the most part, a nothingburger. However, there are
>>>>>>>> likely lots of small embedded 32-bit processors in devices
>>>>>>>> like routers which may exhibit issues, if they're still
>>>>>>>> running 16 years from now.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>You sound just like the doom criers ("Give me money or
>>>>>>>you'll DIE!!!") in the run up to y2k.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I said "if they're still running 16 years from now", which is
>>>>>>quite unlikely. However, cheap-ass manufacturers may
>>>>>>continue to use the same software in newer devices, sadly.
>>>>>
>>>>> It is possible. As the cliche was "back in my day" - most
>>>>> of the
>>>>>current batch of programmers have no idea that there are COBOL
>>>>>programs still running which were compiled before they were
>>>>>born.
>>>>>
>>>>> The question is, how many people / organizations have a
>>>>> system
>>>>>which has been running, is running, will be running, with
>>>>>little or no reason to replace it with a New And Improved
>>>>>Hardware?
>>>>
>>>> Raises hand.
>>>>
>>>> (I tend to use my equipment until it literally dies. OK, the
>>>> DSL modem/router was an exception, but only because the ISP
>>>> pulled the plug.)
>>>
>>>And how often do you have inexpensive appliance devices last 16
>>>years? How many do you have right now that were bought in 2006?
>>>
>>>--
>>
>> Well, I post to Usenet from a 1997 desktop,
>
>Which, of course, caught on fire, exploded, and killed your dog at
>midnight on December 31, 1999, because these things are unsolvable
>catatrophes that will end human civilization.
>
>This entire converstaion is an hallucination during your death
>throes at the hands of cannibals.
>

Nah, I perished when the end of Net Neutrality destroyed the world.

(O the embarassment..)
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..

On 11/13/2022 8:28 PM, Robert Carnegie wrote:
> Incidentally, there may be trouble again around
> the year 9999.

There is a very high probability of that. I won't have to worry about it.

Lynn

On 2022-11-13 19:12:14 +0000, Alan said:
> On 2022-11-13 10:11, Ninapenda Jibini wrote:
>> Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote in
>> news:2692nh5sqaeh4ib95csfmcie379ponq5tg@4ax.com:
>>
>>> On Sat, 12 Nov 2022 09:48:23 -0800, pyotr filipivich
>>> <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) on Sat, 12 Nov 2022 16:57:44
>>>> GMT typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>>>>> Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote in
>>>>>> news:l9PbL.74464$1449.32517@fx14.iad:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For the most part, a nothingburger. However, there are
>>>>>>> likely lots of small embedded 32-bit processors in devices
>>>>>>> like routers which may exhibit issues, if they're still
>>>>>>> running 16 years from now.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You sound just like the doom criers ("Give me money or you'll
>>>>>> DIE!!!") in the run up to y2k.
>>>>>
>>>>> I said "if they're still running 16 years from now", which is
>>>>> quite unlikely. However, cheap-ass manufacturers may continue
>>>>> to use the same software in newer devices, sadly.
>>>>
>>>> It is possible. As the cliche was "back in my day" - most
>>>> of the current batch of programmers have no idea that there are COBOL
>>>> programs still running which were compiled before they were
>>>> born.
>>>>
>>>> The question is, how many people / organizations have a
>>>> system which has been running, is running, will be running, with little
>>>> or no reason to replace it with a New And Improved Hardware?
>>>
>>> Raises hand.
>>>
>>> (I tend to use my equipment until it literally dies. OK, the DSL
>>> modem/router was an exception, but only because the ISP pulled
>>> the plug.)
>>
>> And how often do you have inexpensive appliance devices last 16
>> years? How many do you have right now that were bought in 2006?
>
> My Braun coffee maker dates from well before 1994...
>
> ...because I got it from my Dad when I bought my condo in 1994...
>
> ...and he'd had it for ages when I got it.
>
> It's probably more than 40 years old.

There's a UK show called "The Repair Shop" where people bring all sorts
of old things in to be repaired by experts. A few episodes ago there
was one woman with her mother's old electric food mixer, which was at
least 50 years old. After the expert took it apart to fully clean it,
it was working again like new. Another woman wrote in to the local TV
GUide magazine to say she had the same model of food mixer that was
also still going well.

Our clothes tumble dryer is probably about that old too and has never
had any problems. Our dishwasher on the other hand is about 20 years
old, but we rarely use it, so has probably only been turned on about
half a dozen times over those yeras, yet the control panel is still
broken (it's a now-known fault because they stupidly used cheap plastic
which gets ruined by teh water and heat).

Things these days simply aren't made to last, and in many cases they're
difficult or impossible to even fix. :-(

On 2022-11-13 14:42:51 +0000, rkshullat@rosettacondot.com said:
> Your Name <YourName@yourisp.com> wrote:
>> On 11/11/2022 5:39 PM, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>>> Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> wrote in
>>> news:tkmbd3$uc0u$2@dont-email.me:
>>>>
>>>> xkcd: Y2K and 2038
>>>> https://xkcd.com/2697/
>>>>
>>>> It shouldn't cost more than a trillion dollars or two to
>>>> investigate this.
>>>
>>> I'll start doing so as soon as the check clears.
>>>
>>> Or it could end up being as big a nothingburger as y2k was, because
>>> the people who run such systems aren't idiots.
>>
>> Y2K was massively over-hyped - largely by the media, as usual. There
>> was never going to be huge issues with with things like traffic lights
>> and elevators suddenly not working. There were also a lot of tech
>> people who jumped on this scaremongering bandwagon to greedily increase
>> their own pay-packets.
>
> Well, I'll admit that I got a very nice boost for the holiday by volunteering
> (at 8x times my normal pay) to sit at work rather than stay home with the
> family on New Year's Eve.
> There were a LOT of function-breaking bugs fixed in significant bits of
> infrastructure leading up to Y2K. Other than generating a whole lot of sales
> to preppers, the hype did one really important thing...it got the bean
> counters listening to what the the engineers had been saying for years.
> Which was, essentially, that the bean counters were going to regret their
> inaction when the lawsuits started rolling in. Even if the failures weren't
> of the "All die. Oh the embarrassment." type, customers tend to frown on things
> like, for example, discovering that the service they were charging by the
> minute for stopped recording usage on January 1st.
> It was never a matter of not knowing that there was a problem, it was a
> matter of prioritizing remediation over new features and other bugs.
> Even with the effort put in, we still saw plenty of unpatched (mostly
> cosmetic) issues. The most common was probably seeing dates displayed as
> "1-1-19100".

There were some Y2K issues, but they were relatively few. The vast
majority of it was at inconvenient at worst, if not simply over-hyped
nonsense.

The date battery on my old Mac computer stoped working a few times over
the 20 years I had it, but it was never really anything other than a
cosmetic problem ... newly saved files would be dated as 1969 (or
whatever the default date was). Otherwise it still worked perfectly
well until I got around to replacing the battery.

Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> on Sun, 13 Nov 2022
09:10:30 -0800 typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>
>>>>You sound just like the doom criers ("Give me money or you'll
>>>>DIE!!!") in the run up to y2k.
>>>
>>>I said "if they're still running 16 years from now", which is
>>>quite unlikely. However, cheap-ass manufacturers may continue
>>>to use the same software in newer devices, sadly.
>>
>> It is possible. As the cliche was "back in my day" - most of the
>>current batch of programmers have no idea that there are COBOL
>>programs still running which were compiled before they were born.
>>
>> The question is, how many people / organizations have a system
>>which has been running, is running, will be running, with little or no
>>reason to replace it with a New And Improved Hardware?
>
>Raises hand.
>
>(I tend to use my equipment until it literally dies. OK, the DSL
>modem/router was an exception, but only because the ISP pulled the
>plug.)

"it was ... a mercy killing." B-)
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Woke(tm) as to serve as the new Them(tm)

Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> on Mon, 14 Nov 2022 16:50:19 +1300
typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>
>Things these days simply aren't made to last, and in many cases they're
>difficult or impossible to even fix. :-(

Things are designed with (at best) ease of assembly / installation
in mind. Remember the Manza 2+2 which had access to one of the spark
plugs blocked by an engine mount?
>
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Woke(tm) as to serve as the new Them(tm)

Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> on Sun, 13 Nov 2022 11:12:14 -0800 typed in
rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>
>>> (I tend to use my equipment until it literally dies. OK, the DSL
>>> modem/router was an exception, but only because the ISP pulled
>>> the plug.)
>>
>> And how often do you have inexpensive appliance devices last 16
>> years? How many do you have right now that were bought in 2006?
>
>My Braun coffee maker dates from well before 1994...
>
>...because I got it from my Dad when I bought my condo in 1994...
>
>...and he'd had it for ages when I got it.
>
>It's probably more than 40 years old.

I've had mine for twenty years. How long Mom had it before then,
I have no idea.

But then again, it doesn't have any electronics involved. One
switch - on / off.
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Woke(tm) as to serve as the new Them(tm)

On 2022-11-12 17:48:23 +0000, pyotr filipivich said:

> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) on Sat, 12 Nov 2022 16:57:44 GMT
> typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>> Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> writes:
>>> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote in
>>> news:l9PbL.74464$1449.32517@fx14.iad:
>>>
>>>> For the most part, a nothingburger. However, there are likely
>>>> lots of small embedded 32-bit processors in devices like routers
>>>> which may exhibit issues, if they're still running 16 years from
>>>> now.
>>>>
>>> You sound just like the doom criers ("Give me money or you'll
>>> DIE!!!") in the run up to y2k.
>>
>> I said "if they're still running 16 years from now", which is
>> quite unlikely. However, cheap-ass manufacturers may continue
>> to use the same software in newer devices, sadly.
>
> It is possible. As the cliche was "back in my day" - most of the
> current batch of programmers have no idea that there are COBOL
> programs still running which were compiled before they were born.
>
> The question is, how many people / organizations have a system
> which has been running, is running, will be running, with little or no
> reason to replace it with a New And Improved Hardware?

I used my Apple PowerMac G3 computer for just over 20 years before I
had to replace it due to it irrepairably breaking down. It was used for
both leisure time and for running my own work-from-home IT business.
For all that time it was also connected to the internet via a dial-up
modem. It was only when I was forced to get the newer replacement
computer that I also had to upgrade the internet connection to a home
4G modem-router instead.

I've never owned a mobile phone and just used the standard copper
landline, until this year when they dropped the copper services, so the
landline is now also bundled through the 4G modem-router. Not sure how
long we've had the landline phone wireless handsets, but quite a few
years.

My car is 28 years old, and I've had it for 24 of those years. :-)

As in another post, our clothes tumble dryer is around 50 years old. My
mother's bed would be about the same vintage (she doesn't want to
replace it).

Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote in
news:tksdtr$13hk$1@gioia.aioe.org:

> On 2022-11-13 19:12:14 +0000, Alan said:
>> On 2022-11-13 10:11, Ninapenda Jibini wrote:
>>> Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote in
>>> news:2692nh5sqaeh4ib95csfmcie379ponq5tg@4ax.com:
>>>
>>>> On Sat, 12 Nov 2022 09:48:23 -0800, pyotr filipivich
>>>> <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) on Sat, 12 Nov 2022
>>>>> 16:57:44 GMT typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>>>>>> Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>>> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote in
>>>>>>> news:l9PbL.74464$1449.32517@fx14.iad:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> For the most part, a nothingburger. However, there are
>>>>>>>> likely lots of small embedded 32-bit processors in
>>>>>>>> devices like routers which may exhibit issues, if they're
>>>>>>>> still running 16 years from now.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You sound just like the doom criers ("Give me money or
>>>>>>> you'll DIE!!!") in the run up to y2k.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I said "if they're still running 16 years from now", which
>>>>>> is quite unlikely. However, cheap-ass manufacturers may
>>>>>> continue to use the same software in newer devices, sadly.
>>>>>
>>>>> It is possible. As the cliche was "back in my day" - most
>>>>> of the current batch of programmers have no idea that there
>>>>> are COBOL programs still running which were compiled before
>>>>> they were born.
>>>>>
>>>>> The question is, how many people / organizations have a
>>>>> system which has been running, is running, will be running,
>>>>> with little or no reason to replace it with a New And
>>>>> Improved Hardware?
>>>>
>>>> Raises hand.
>>>>
>>>> (I tend to use my equipment until it literally dies. OK, the
>>>> DSL modem/router was an exception, but only because the ISP
>>>> pulled the plug.)
>>>
>>> And how often do you have inexpensive appliance devices last
>>> 16 years? How many do you have right now that were bought in
>>> 2006?
>>
>> My Braun coffee maker dates from well before 1994...
>>
>> ...because I got it from my Dad when I bought my condo in
>> 1994...
>>
>> ...and he'd had it for ages when I got it.
>>
>> It's probably more than 40 years old.
>
> There's a UK show called "The Repair Shop" where people bring
> all sorts of old things in to be repaired by experts. A few
> episodes ago there was one woman with her mother's old electric
> food mixer, which was at least 50 years old. After the expert
> took it apart to fully clean it, it was working again like new.
> Another woman wrote in to the local TV GUide magazine to say she
> had the same model of food mixer that was also still going well.
>
> Our clothes tumble dryer is probably about that old too and has
> never had any problems. Our dishwasher on the other hand is
> about 20 years old, but we rarely use it, so has probably only
> been turned on about half a dozen times over those yeras, yet
> the control panel is still broken (it's a now-known fault
> because they stupidly used cheap plastic which gets ruined by
> teh water and heat).
>
> Things these days simply aren't made to last, and in many cases
> they're difficult or impossible to even fix. :-(
>
That's a nice list of appliances that don't have computer chips in
them, or if they don't, don't keep track of the date, or if they
do, don't give a shit (and can't tell) if it's set to 50 years ago.
(And that all survived Y2K without an issue, obviously.)

Which is to say, you're supporting my position.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote in
news:tksm5h$18d7$1@gioia.aioe.org:

> On 2022-11-12 17:48:23 +0000, pyotr filipivich said:
>
>> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) on Sat, 12 Nov 2022
>> 16:57:44 GMT typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>>> Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> writes:
>>>> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote in
>>>> news:l9PbL.74464$1449.32517@fx14.iad:
>>>>
>>>>> For the most part, a nothingburger. However, there are
>>>>> likely lots of small embedded 32-bit processors in devices
>>>>> like routers which may exhibit issues, if they're still
>>>>> running 16 years from now.
>>>>>
>>>> You sound just like the doom criers ("Give me money or you'll
>>>> DIE!!!") in the run up to y2k.
>>>
>>> I said "if they're still running 16 years from now", which is
>>> quite unlikely. However, cheap-ass manufacturers may continue
>>> to use the same software in newer devices, sadly.
>>
>> It is possible. As the cliche was "back in my day" - most
>> of the
>> current batch of programmers have no idea that there are COBOL
>> programs still running which were compiled before they were
>> born.
>>
>> The question is, how many people / organizations have a
>> system
>> which has been running, is running, will be running, with
>> little or no reason to replace it with a New And Improved
>> Hardware?
>
> I used my Apple PowerMac G3 computer for just over 20 years
> before I had to replace it due to it irrepairably breaking down.

Precisely my point.

> My car is 28 years old, and I've had it for 24 of those years.

My car is a lot newer than that, and is completely unaware of what
the date is. So I'm pretty sure it won't care about 2038, either.

> As in another post, our clothes tumble dryer is around 50 years
> old. My mother's bed would be about the same vintage (she
> doesn't want to replace it).
>
And?

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

On Sun, 13 Nov 2022 18:12:29 GMT, Ninapenda Jibini
<taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:

>Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote in
>news:1a92nh1b4c0gnnf2tsq61at0iokjlhie59@4ax.com:
>
>> It got fixed real fast.
>
>But according to the predictions, that's impossible, because
>civilization has ended, and cannibals living in caves lack the
>ability to fix complicated electronics.

Fortunately, this was a rare occurrence, not the new normal.
--
"In this connexion, unquestionably the most significant
development was the disintegration, under Christian
influence, of classical conceptions of the family and
of family right."

Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote in
news:scs4nhphhs64b5ip08vaen6u6nq3eg0n20@4ax.com:

> On Sun, 13 Nov 2022 18:12:29 GMT, Ninapenda Jibini
> <taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote in
>>news:1a92nh1b4c0gnnf2tsq61at0iokjlhie59@4ax.com:
>>
>>> It got fixed real fast.
>>
>>But according to the predictions, that's impossible, because
>>civilization has ended, and cannibals living in caves lack the
>>ability to fix complicated electronics.
>
> Fortunately, this was a rare occurrence, not the new normal.

Doomcriers doing their Chicken Little impersonantion is, indeed, and
old, old phenomenon. Old enough to have a fable about it, in fact.

--
Terry Austin

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

pyotr filipivich <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote in
news:51g3nh1d7ovl4ae65869ugav22sbeoqhp8@4ax.com:

> Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> on Mon, 14 Nov 2022 16:50:19
> +1300 typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>>
>>Things these days simply aren't made to last, and in many cases
>>they're difficult or impossible to even fix. :-(
>
> Things are designed with (at best) ease of assembly /
> installation
> in mind. Remember the Manza 2+2 which had access to one of the
> spark plugs blocked by an engine mount?

Wasn't there a Cadillac that required lifting the block off the motor
mounts to access the spark plugs?

--
Terry Austin

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

On Sun, 13 Nov 2022 18:11:28 GMT, Ninapenda Jibini
<taustinca@gmail.com> wrote:

>Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote in
>news:2692nh5sqaeh4ib95csfmcie379ponq5tg@4ax.com:
>
>> On Sat, 12 Nov 2022 09:48:23 -0800, pyotr filipivich
>> <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:
>>
>>>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) on Sat, 12 Nov 2022 16:57:44
>>>GMT typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>>>>Ninapenda Jibini <taustinca@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote in
>>>>>news:l9PbL.74464$1449.32517@fx14.iad:
>>>>>
>>>>>> For the most part, a nothingburger. However, there are
>>>>>> likely lots of small embedded 32-bit processors in devices
>>>>>> like routers which may exhibit issues, if they're still
>>>>>> running 16 years from now.
>>>>>>
>>>>>You sound just like the doom criers ("Give me money or you'll
>>>>>DIE!!!") in the run up to y2k.
>>>>
>>>>I said "if they're still running 16 years from now", which is
>>>>quite unlikely. However, cheap-ass manufacturers may continue
>>>>to use the same software in newer devices, sadly.
>>>
>>> It is possible. As the cliche was "back in my day" - most
>>> of the
>>>current batch of programmers have no idea that there are COBOL
>>>programs still running which were compiled before they were
>>>born.
>>>
>>> The question is, how many people / organizations have a
>>> system
>>>which has been running, is running, will be running, with little
>>>or no reason to replace it with a New And Improved Hardware?
>>
>> Raises hand.
>>
>> (I tend to use my equipment until it literally dies. OK, the DSL
>> modem/router was an exception, but only because the ISP pulled
>> the plug.)
>
>And how often do you have inexpensive appliance devices last 16
>years? How many do you have right now that were bought in 2006?

The Belkin DSL Line Filter I bought to replace the el-cheapo that came
with the first DSL modem and which was preventing my phone from
picking up on incoming calls was working right up to the point it
became redundant because my ISP pulled the plug on DSL. That was last
January.

My other "inexpensive appliance devices" were purchased more recently,
but /not last week or even last year/. My HP Envy was purchased in
2014, the HP Mini in 2010, and the HP Pavillion in 2015.

The older of the two Kindles and the Squeezebox Touch would have been
purchased after/concurrent with the HP Mini and my first 11n router to
test WiFi.

The HP Mini was an experimental purchase, to see what a small laptop
might be used for. It is what was called a "Netbook", and apparently
was run out of the market by tablets. The HP Pavillion was purchased
because a laptop had turned out to have its uses, and I needed one
with more disk space. The HP Envy was purchased when the motherboard
in my XP computer died. Well, either that or both hard drives and
other attachments all got flaky at the same time.

My faithful Nova Electronic L.E.D. Alarm Clock, BTW, was purchased in
1999 and is still going strong. But whether that qualifies as an
"inexpensive appliance device" or not is a good question.
--
"In this connexion, unquestionably the most significant
development was the disintegration, under Christian
influence, of classical conceptions of the family and
of family right."

On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 3:12:15 AM UTC-5, Ninapenda Jibini wrote:
> Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> wrote in
> news:tksm5h$18d7$1...@gioia.aioe.org:

> > My car is 28 years old, and I've had it for 24 of those years.
> My car is a lot newer than that, and is completely unaware of what
> the date is. So I'm pretty sure it won't care about 2038, either.

It's always struck me as funny how the non-networked clocks in cars don't even care if it's AM or PM. Even after they'd switched to digital... I can't imagine they are getting customized circuits that run only twelve-hour cycle, maybe they just don't care to display it. I had to change my Mom's car, the controls are such that instead of being able to fall back an hour I had to spring forward 11; well, at least it wasn't 23. I might attribute it to having convenient access to windows to see if it is day or night, but we are coming on a time when it will be equally dark at both sixes and sevenses. More likely the psychological fact that most folk will have a rough idea of the time of day before getting in the car -- indeed, that is often the impetus for them to get in the car to go somewhere.

--
-Jack

On Sun, 13 Nov 2022 20:24:50 -0800, pyotr filipivich
<phamp@mindspring.com> wrote:

>Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> on Sun, 13 Nov 2022
>09:10:30 -0800 typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>>
>>>>>You sound just like the doom criers ("Give me money or you'll
>>>>>DIE!!!") in the run up to y2k.
>>>>
>>>>I said "if they're still running 16 years from now", which is
>>>>quite unlikely. However, cheap-ass manufacturers may continue
>>>>to use the same software in newer devices, sadly.
>>>
>>> It is possible. As the cliche was "back in my day" - most of the
>>>current batch of programmers have no idea that there are COBOL
>>>programs still running which were compiled before they were born.
>>>
>>> The question is, how many people / organizations have a system
>>>which has been running, is running, will be running, with little or no
>>>reason to replace it with a New And Improved Hardware?
>>
>>Raises hand.
>>
>>(I tend to use my equipment until it literally dies. OK, the DSL
>>modem/router was an exception, but only because the ISP pulled the
>>plug.)
>
> "it was ... a mercy killing." B-)

Considering that I am now paying a different ISP less per month than I
was for DSL (granted, after a $20/mo discount for being a long-term
customer) for optic fibre, as opposed to paying the same amount plus
$10 for "equipment rental" and a 10Mb/s limit (what I have is "up to"
900+Mb/s and the equipment and installation were free), you may have a
point.

But the DSL worked well for me. I doubt that I would /ever/ have
changed, left to my own devices (so to speak).
--
"In this connexion, unquestionably the most significant
development was the disintegration, under Christian
influence, of classical conceptions of the family and
of family right."

Jack Bohn <jack.bohn64@gmail.com> wrote in
news:25df8a4d-397b-4801-8f6c-2a6a6e0ed733n@googlegroups.com:

> On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 3:12:15 AM UTC-5, Ninapenda
> Jibini wrote:
>> Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> wrote in
>> news:tksm5h$18d7$1...@gioia.aioe.org:
>
>> > My car is 28 years old, and I've had it for 24 of those
>> > years.
>> My car is a lot newer than that, and is completely unaware of
>> what the date is. So I'm pretty sure it won't care about 2038,
>> either.
>
> It's always struck me as funny how the non-networked clocks in
> cars don't even care if it's AM or PM. Even after they'd
> switched to digital... I can't imagine they are getting
> customized circuits that run only twelve-hour cycle, maybe they
> just don't care to display it. I had to change my Mom's car,
> the controls are such that instead of being able to fall back an
> hour I had to spring forward 11; well, at least it wasn't 23. I
> might attribute it to having convenient access to windows to see
> if it is day or night, but we are coming on a time when it will
> be equally dark at both sixes and sevenses. More likely the
> psychological fact that most folk will have a rough idea of the
> time of day before getting in the car -- indeed, that is often
> the impetus for them to get in the car to go somewhere.
>
There are a lot of cars these days that do know the date, and it
can matter greatly if it crashes. Any car that updates itself
automatically (like Teslas) could easily have problems if not
updated before 2038, for instance. On the other hand, there's 16
more years to go, and even if it crashes, it might be any worse
than any other day for a Tesla owner.

(The entertainment center in my Corolla *might* know the date, but
if it does, it's picking it up from the phone that it syncs to,
which most certainly will *not* still be around in 16 years.)

--
Terry Austin

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 1:15:51 PM UTC-5, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
> Jack Bohn <jack....@gmail.com> wrote in
> news:25df8a4d-397b-4801...@googlegroups.com:
> > On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 3:12:15 AM UTC-5, Ninapenda
> > Jibini wrote:
> >> Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> wrote in
> >> news:tksm5h$18d7$1...@gioia.aioe.org:
> >
> >> > My car is 28 years old, and I've had it for 24 of those
> >> > years.
> >> My car is a lot newer than that, and is completely unaware of
> >> what the date is. So I'm pretty sure it won't care about 2038,
> >> either.
> >
> > It's always struck me as funny how the non-networked clocks in
> > cars don't even care if it's AM or PM. Even after they'd
> > switched to digital... I can't imagine they are getting
> > customized circuits that run only twelve-hour cycle, maybe they
> > just don't care to display it. I had to change my Mom's car,
> > the controls are such that instead of being able to fall back an
> > hour I had to spring forward 11; well, at least it wasn't 23. I
> > might attribute it to having convenient access to windows to see
> > if it is day or night, but we are coming on a time when it will
> > be equally dark at both sixes and sevenses. More likely the
> > psychological fact that most folk will have a rough idea of the
> > time of day before getting in the car -- indeed, that is often
> > the impetus for them to get in the car to go somewhere.
> >
> There are a lot of cars these days that do know the date, and it
> can matter greatly if it crashes. Any car that updates itself
> automatically (like Teslas) could easily have problems if not
> updated before 2038, for instance. On the other hand, there's 16
> more years to go, and even if it crashes, it might be any worse
> than any other day for a Tesla owner.
>
> (The entertainment center in my Corolla *might* know the date, but
> if it does, it's picking it up from the phone that it syncs to,
> which most certainly will *not* still be around in 16 years.)

Yeah, mine did the Daylight Savings change itself. I think it might even change the clock based on time zones connected to the GPS.

--
-Jack

In article <df03564e-81fe-4508-8408-564ae9136f3cn@googlegroups.com>,
Jack Bohn <jack.bohn64@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 1:15:51 PM UTC-5, Jibini Kula Tumbili
>Kujisalimisha wrote:
>> Jack Bohn <jack....@gmail.com> wrote in
>> news:25df8a4d-397b-4801...@googlegroups.com:
>> > On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 3:12:15 AM UTC-5, Ninapenda
>> > Jibini wrote:
>> >> Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> wrote in
>> >> news:tksm5h$18d7$1...@gioia.aioe.org:
>> >
>> >> > My car is 28 years old, and I've had it for 24 of those
>> >> > years.
>> >> My car is a lot newer than that, and is completely unaware of
>> >> what the date is. So I'm pretty sure it won't care about 2038,
>> >> either.
>> >
>> > It's always struck me as funny how the non-networked clocks in
>> > cars don't even care if it's AM or PM. Even after they'd
>> > switched to digital... I can't imagine they are getting
>> > customized circuits that run only twelve-hour cycle, maybe they
>> > just don't care to display it. I had to change my Mom's car,
>> > the controls are such that instead of being able to fall back an
>> > hour I had to spring forward 11; well, at least it wasn't 23. I
>> > might attribute it to having convenient access to windows to see
>> > if it is day or night, but we are coming on a time when it will
>> > be equally dark at both sixes and sevenses. More likely the
>> > psychological fact that most folk will have a rough idea of the
>> > time of day before getting in the car -- indeed, that is often
>> > the impetus for them to get in the car to go somewhere.
>> >
>> There are a lot of cars these days that do know the date, and it
>> can matter greatly if it crashes. Any car that updates itself
>> automatically (like Teslas) could easily have problems if not
>> updated before 2038, for instance. On the other hand, there's 16
>> more years to go, and even if it crashes, it might be any worse
>> than any other day for a Tesla owner.
>>
>> (The entertainment center in my Corolla *might* know the date, but
>> if it does, it's picking it up from the phone that it syncs to,
>> which most certainly will *not* still be around in 16 years.)
>
>Yeah, mine did the Daylight Savings change itself. I think it might
>even change the clock based on time zones connected to the GPS.
>

The rectifier diode in my '80 Corolla blew a year or so ago. My undestanding
from the name of the thing is that meant that the altenator was sending
actual AC current into the electrical system instead of pulsating DC.

If there were any actual electroncs in the system, I think that would
have fried them. Fortunately there aren't (the radio blew decades ago,
and there is no clock..)
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..

On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 12:15:51 PM UTC-6, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
> Jack Bohn <jack....@gmail.com> wrote in
> news:25df8a4d-397b-4801...@googlegroups.com:
> > On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 3:12:15 AM UTC-5, Ninapenda
> > Jibini wrote:
> >> Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> wrote in
> >> news:tksm5h$18d7$1...@gioia.aioe.org:
> >
> >> > My car is 28 years old, and I've had it for 24 of those
> >> > years.
> >> My car is a lot newer than that, and is completely unaware of
> >> what the date is. So I'm pretty sure it won't care about 2038,
> >> either.
> >
> > It's always struck me as funny how the non-networked clocks in
> > cars don't even care if it's AM or PM. Even after they'd
> > switched to digital... I can't imagine they are getting
> > customized circuits that run only twelve-hour cycle, maybe they
> > just don't care to display it. I had to change my Mom's car,
> > the controls are such that instead of being able to fall back an
> > hour I had to spring forward 11; well, at least it wasn't 23. I
> > might attribute it to having convenient access to windows to see
> > if it is day or night, but we are coming on a time when it will
> > be equally dark at both sixes and sevenses. More likely the
> > psychological fact that most folk will have a rough idea of the
> > time of day before getting in the car -- indeed, that is often
> > the impetus for them to get in the car to go somewhere.
> >
> There are a lot of cars these days that do know the date, and it
> can matter greatly if it crashes. Any car that updates itself
> automatically (like Teslas) could easily have problems if not
> updated before 2038, for instance. On the other hand, there's 16
> more years to go, and even if it crashes, it might be any worse
> than any other day for a Tesla owner.
>
In this context, when you refer to a car "crashing" does this mean some
sort of computer glitch, or do you mean an actual crash, i.e. collision of
the car with some physical object such as another vehicle?

Peter Wezeman
anti-social Darwinist

"peterwezeman@hotmail.com" <peterwezeman@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:0028fa96-3ae9-414a-8b39-ba662b1b2ae3n@googlegroups.com:

> On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 12:15:51 PM UTC-6, Jibini Kula
> Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>> Jack Bohn <jack....@gmail.com> wrote in
>> news:25df8a4d-397b-4801...@googlegroups.com:
>> > On Monday, November 14, 2022 at 3:12:15 AM UTC-5, Ninapenda
>> > Jibini wrote:
>> >> Your Name <Your...@YourISP.com> wrote in
>> >> news:tksm5h$18d7$1...@gioia.aioe.org:
>> >
>> >> > My car is 28 years old, and I've had it for 24 of those
>> >> > years.
>> >> My car is a lot newer than that, and is completely unaware
>> >> of what the date is. So I'm pretty sure it won't care about
>> >> 2038, either.
>> >
>> > It's always struck me as funny how the non-networked clocks
>> > in cars don't even care if it's AM or PM. Even after they'd
>> > switched to digital... I can't imagine they are getting
>> > customized circuits that run only twelve-hour cycle, maybe
>> > they just don't care to display it. I had to change my Mom's
>> > car, the controls are such that instead of being able to fall
>> > back an hour I had to spring forward 11; well, at least it
>> > wasn't 23. I might attribute it to having convenient access
>> > to windows to see if it is day or night, but we are coming on
>> > a time when it will be equally dark at both sixes and
>> > sevenses. More likely the psychological fact that most folk
>> > will have a rough idea of the time of day before getting in
>> > the car -- indeed, that is often the impetus for them to get
>> > in the car to go somewhere.
>> >
>> There are a lot of cars these days that do know the date, and
>> it can matter greatly if it crashes. Any car that updates
>> itself automatically (like Teslas) could easily have problems
>> if not updated before 2038, for instance. On the other hand,
>> there's 16 more years to go, and even if it crashes, it might
>> be any worse than any other day for a Tesla owner.
>>
> In this context, when you refer to a car "crashing" does this
> mean some sort of computer glitch, or do you mean an actual
> crash, i.e. collision of the car with some physical object such
> as another vehicle?
>
Either, really, given Tesla's history of mistaking children for
plastic bags and plastic bags for children, but the former seems
*far* more likely.

--
Terry Austin

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

On 11/14/2022 10:02 AM, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
> pyotr filipivich <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote in
> news:51g3nh1d7ovl4ae65869ugav22sbeoqhp8@4ax.com:
>
>> Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> on Mon, 14 Nov 2022 16:50:19
>> +1300 typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>>>
>>> Things these days simply aren't made to last, and in many cases
>>> they're difficult or impossible to even fix. :-(
>>
>> Things are designed with (at best) ease of assembly /
>> installation
>> in mind. Remember the Manza 2+2 which had access to one of the
>> spark plugs blocked by an engine mount?
>
> Wasn't there a Cadillac that required lifting the block off the motor
> mounts to access the spark plugs?

My Dad's 1977 Ford F-350 required laying on top of the air cleaner to
get to the back two plugs in the 460 in3 V8. When I changed the plugs
at 30,000+ miles, it was obvious that the back two plugs had never been
changed as the electrodes were totally burnt off.

Lynn

On 2022-11-14 15:04, Lynn McGuire wrote:
> On 11/14/2022 10:02 AM, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>> pyotr filipivich <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote in
>> news:51g3nh1d7ovl4ae65869ugav22sbeoqhp8@4ax.com:
>>
>>> Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> on Mon, 14 Nov 2022 16:50:19
>>> +1300 typed in rec.arts.sf.written  the following:
>>>>
>>>> Things these days simply aren't made to last, and in many cases
>>>> they're difficult or impossible to even fix.  :-(
>>>
>>>       Things are designed with (at best) ease of assembly /
>>>       installation
>>> in mind.  Remember the Manza 2+2 which had access to one of the
>>> spark plugs blocked by an engine mount?
>>
>> Wasn't there a Cadillac that required lifting the block off the motor
>> mounts to access the spark plugs?
>
> My Dad's 1977 Ford F-350 required laying on top of the air cleaner to
> get to the back two plugs in the 460 in3 V8.  When I changed the plugs
> at 30,000+ miles, it was obvious that the back two plugs had never been
> changed as the electrodes were totally burnt off.

A buddy of mine was working on Ford pickup for his son to replace some
broken exhaust manifold studs...

(A KNOWN problem with this particular truck)

....because the official Ford repair procedure involved...

....REMOVING THE ENTIRE CAB!

Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> wrote in
news:tkuhik$1rt0u$2@dont-email.me:

> On 11/14/2022 10:02 AM, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>> pyotr filipivich <phamp@mindspring.com> wrote in
>> news:51g3nh1d7ovl4ae65869ugav22sbeoqhp8@4ax.com:
>>
>>> Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> on Mon, 14 Nov 2022 16:50:19
>>> +1300 typed in rec.arts.sf.written the following:
>>>>
>>>> Things these days simply aren't made to last, and in many
>>>> cases they're difficult or impossible to even fix. :-(
>>>
>>> Things are designed with (at best) ease of assembly /
>>> installation
>>> in mind. Remember the Manza 2+2 which had access to one of
>>> the spark plugs blocked by an engine mount?
>>
>> Wasn't there a Cadillac that required lifting the block off the
>> motor mounts to access the spark plugs?
>
> My Dad's 1977 Ford F-350 required laying on top of the air
> cleaner to get to the back two plugs in the 460 in3 V8. When I
> changed the plugs at 30,000+ miles, it was obvious that the back
> two plugs had never been changed as the electrodes were totally
> burnt off.
>
I had an Oldsmobile that would run OK on six cylinders, provided it
was the *right* six (the #1 plug would foul with oil within a hundred
miles due to a leaky valve guide). Got pretty rough, though, at five.
(#1 wasn't the only valve guide that leaked, just the worst.)

--
Terry Austin

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.