Aadaab:
There have been numerous mistakes during copying verses from different sources. I have three couplets here - two by Sael and one by Dagh. I would appreciate if someone would confirm that there are no mistakes in it:
1. Tahajjud ko huee chori, dar-e-maikhana chopaT hai
Mere ToTe huay sheeshay faqat jhoTe pyale hain
2. GumaN kis par kareN maikash idhar waiz udhar sufi
Mahalle meiN Khuda rakkhe sabhbhi Allah wale hain
3. ZakhmuN ko mere dekh kar hairanN hoN na aap
Yeh gul hazoor hi ke khilaye huay tu hain

Thanks.
Best wishes.
Khalid

On 4/29/2021 8:46 AM, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:

> Aadaab:

> There have been numerous mistakes during copying verses from different sources. I have three couplets here - two by Sael and one by Dagh. I would appreciate if someone would confirm that there are no mistakes in it:
> 1. Tahajjud ko huee chori, dar-e-maikhana chopaT hai
> Mere ToTe huay sheeshay faqat jhoTe pyale hain
> 2. GumaN kis par kareN maikash idhar waiz udhar sufi
> Mahalle meiN Khuda rakkhe sabhbhi Allah wale hain
> 3. ZakhmuN ko mere dekh kar hairanN hoN na aap
> Yeh gul hazoor hi ke khilaye huay tu hain
>
> Thanks.

> Best wishes.

> Khalid

K. S. Saheb,

I don't think there are any errors here......

However, as you might have noticed, I follow a somewhat
different system with respect to Roman......

So, I would transcribe these ash'aar as follows :

Tahajjud ko huwee chori, dar-e-mai'KHaana chaupaT hai
Mire TooTe huwe sheeshe faqat jhooTe piyaale haiN

GumaaN kis par kareN Maikash, idhar waa'iz, udhar soofi
MoHalle men KHuda rakkhe, sabhi Allah~waale haiN

ZaKHmoN ko mire dekh kar Hairaan na hoN aap
Yeh gul Huzoor hi ke khilaae huwe to haiN

In the second sher above, I presume "Maikash" is the taKHallus of the
poet. I believe he hailed from Agra, i.e. Maikash Akbarabadi.

Afzal

On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 11:50:15 AM UTC-5, Afzal A. Khan wrote:

> GumaaN kis par kareN Maikash, idhar waa'iz, udhar soofi
> MoHalle men KHuda rakkhe, sabhi Allah~waale haiN
> In the second sher above, I presume "Maikash" is the taKHallus of the
> poet. I believe he hailed from Agra, i.e. Maikash Akbarabadi.

> Afzal

Afzal sahib/Khalid sahib,

aadaab,

This is another one of those asha'ar my late ustaad S M Azhar sahib used to quote often, exactly as Khalid sahib has typed it.

I have also heard slightly different versions of the first misra', without the word 'maikash' in it.

Either way, I don't think this she'r is by Maikash Akbarabadi, here the word 'maikash' is used in its literal sense.

It is one of those days I wish I could pick up the phone and call Azhar sahib. Some losses create a permanent vacuum.

Maybe some other group members will be able to verify this.

Regards,

_______Zoya

On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 12:50:15 PM UTC-4, Afzal A. Khan wrote:
> On 4/29/2021 8:46 AM, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
>
>
> > Aadaab:
>
> > There have been numerous mistakes during copying verses from different sources. I have three couplets here - two by Sael and one by Dagh. I would appreciate if someone would confirm that there are no mistakes in it:
> > 1. Tahajjud ko huee chori, dar-e-maikhana chopaT hai
> > Mere ToTe huay sheeshay faqat jhoTe pyale hain
> > 2. GumaN kis par kareN maikash idhar waiz udhar sufi
> > Mahalle meiN Khuda rakkhe sabhbhi Allah wale hain
> > 3. ZakhmuN ko mere dekh kar hairanN hoN na aap
> > Yeh gul hazoor hi ke khilaye huay tu hain
> >
> > Thanks.
>
> > Best wishes.
>
> > Khalid
> K. S. Saheb,
>
> I don't think there are any errors here......
>
> However, as you might have noticed, I follow a somewhat
> different system with respect to Roman......
>
> So, I would transcribe these ash'aar as follows :
>
> Tahajjud ko huwee chori, dar-e-mai'KHaana chaupaT hai
> Mire TooTe huwe sheeshe faqat jhooTe piyaale haiN
>
>
> GumaaN kis par kareN Maikash, idhar waa'iz, udhar soofi
> MoHalle men KHuda rakkhe, sabhi Allah~waale haiN
>
>
> ZaKHmoN ko mire dekh kar Hairaan na hoN aap
> Yeh gul Huzoor hi ke khilaae huwe to haiN
>
>
>
> In the second sher above, I presume "Maikash" is the taKHallus of the
> poet. I believe he hailed from Agra, i.e. Maikash Akbarabadi.
>
>
>
> Afzal
Aadaab:
Thank you very much.
Maikash is not taKhallus. It is used in its literal meaning for the occupiers of the bar.
The poet is Nawab Sirajuddin Sael. Sael is the taKhallus.
Best wishes.
Khalid

On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 12:45:17 PM UTC-5, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:

> > GumaaN kis par kareN Maikash, idhar waa'iz, udhar soofi
> > MoHalle men KHuda rakkhe, sabhi Allah~waale haiN

> Maikash is not taKhallus. It is used in its literal meaning for the occupiers of the bar.
> The poet is Nawab Sirajuddin Sael. Sael is the taKhallus.
> Best wishes.
> Khalid

aadaab Khalid sahib,

is she'r ko dekh kar mujhe besaaKhta Haider Ali Atish ka ek she'r yaad aayaa thaa jise Azhar sahib aksar sunaaya karte the. yaqiinan aap ne yeh she'r sun rakhkhaa ho gaa, magar phir bhii sochaa k zehn meN hai to sunaati chaluuN:

fasl-e-bahaar aayi, piyo suufiyo sharaab
bas ho chukii namaaz, musalla uThhaaiye!

Regards,

_______Zoya

On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 5:57:02 PM UTC-4, Zoya wrote:
> On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 12:45:17 PM UTC-5, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
>
> > > GumaaN kis par kareN Maikash, idhar waa'iz, udhar soofi
> > > MoHalle men KHuda rakkhe, sabhi Allah~waale haiN
> > Maikash is not taKhallus. It is used in its literal meaning for the occupiers of the bar.
> > The poet is Nawab Sirajuddin Sael. Sael is the taKhallus.
> > Best wishes.
> > Khalid
> aadaab Khalid sahib,
>
> is she'r ko dekh kar mujhe besaaKhta Haider Ali Atish ka ek she'r yaad aayaa thaa jise Azhar sahib aksar sunaaya karte the. yaqiinan aap ne yeh she'r sun rakhkhaa ho gaa, magar phir bhii sochaa k zehn meN hai to sunaati chaluuN:
>
> fasl-e-bahaar aayi, piyo suufiyo sharaab
> bas ho chukii namaaz, musalla uThhaaiye!
>
> Regards,
>
> _______Zoya
Aadaab:
Thanks.
No I had not heard this before. Very nice. BTW, where was this Azhar sahib located? Was he a poet or a professor or both?
Best wishes.
Khalid

On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 2:57:02 PM UTC-7, Zoya wrote:
> On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 12:45:17 PM UTC-5, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
>
> > > GumaaN kis par kareN Maikash, idhar waa'iz, udhar soofi
> > > MoHalle men KHuda rakkhe, sabhi Allah~waale haiN
> > Maikash is not taKhallus. It is used in its literal meaning for the occupiers of the bar.
> > The poet is Nawab Sirajuddin Sael. Sael is the taKhallus.
> > Best wishes.
> > Khalid
> aadaab Khalid sahib,
>
> is she'r ko dekh kar mujhe besaaKhta Haider Ali Atish ka ek she'r yaad aayaa thaa jise Azhar sahib aksar sunaaya karte the. yaqiinan aap ne yeh she'r sun rakhkhaa ho gaa, magar phir bhii sochaa k zehn meN hai to sunaati chaluuN:
>
> fasl-e-bahaar aayi, piyo suufiyo sharaab
> bas ho chukii namaaz, musalla uThhaaiye!
>
> Regards,
>
> _______Zoya

***Three points:

(i) If Maikash is not the taKhallus of the poet, then why write it with a capital M?

In fact, why write the first letter of each misr'a in the capital, for this is not an English poem. Since, in our transliteration we distinguish between small letters and capital letters ---- such as 'n' and 'N', 't' and 'T', 'gh' and 'Gh' 'kh' and 'Kh', etc., we better start each misr'a with a small letter unless the transliteration requires a capital one.

(ii) The taKhallus of the shaa'ir, as written above (Sael), will not be read correctly by some people; it better be written as Saa'il (with emphasis on the long vowel 'a' and on the 'hamza').

(iii) This important point should have been mentioned by Zoya sahiba. :-(

With the word Allah, as written here, the misr'a in question will not be in meter. It better be written as Allaah (and also spoken accordingly) --- only then will the misr'a be in meter. As an example, look at this proverbial misr'a

Allaah ki laaThii meN aavaaz nahiiN hotii (please note the preponderance of 'aa' and 'ii' in this misr'a).

du'aa-go, Raj Kumar***

On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 6:07:27 PM UTC-5, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:

> Thanks.
> No I had not heard this before. Very nice.

You are most welcome Khalid sahib.

BTW, where was this Azhar sahib located? Was he a poet or a professor or both?

> Best wishes.
> Khalid

Neither, actually Azhar sahib was a professional chef! But his life long passion was Urdu poetry and he would quote a she'r in every other sentence. He was an amazing story teller and had a tremendous sense of humor. He also had a huge personal collection of poetry books which was donated to a local library after he passed on.

I believe Azhar sahib's family was originally from U P. He spent his early years in Hyderabad Deccan, moved to Karachi after partition, lived in Turkey for a while and eventually settled down in Texas. He spoke several languages including Persian and Turkish.

He always nurtured my love for Urdu poetry and was one of my mentors. I learned a lot just by listening to him. They don't make 'em like Azhar sahib anymore. I am fortunate that my path in this life crossed with his.

The other three gentlemen who have also always nurtured me and command the same respect and love in my heart are all related to this group: Sarwar Alam Raz sahib, Raj Kumar Qais sahib, and Irfan Abid sahib. I feel truly blessed. :-)

_______Zoya

On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 6:25:38 PM UTC-5, Raj Kumar wrote:

> ***Three points:

> (iii) This important point should have been mentioned by Zoya sahiba. :-(
>
> With the word Allah, as written here, the misr'a in question will not be in meter. It better be written as Allaah (and also spoken accordingly) --- only then will the misr'a be in meter. As an example, look at this proverbial misr'a

Prof RK,

You have to believe me that the reason I did not say anything about the vazn here is because I did not want to take the liberty with how 'Allah' is generally written. I just assumed that anyone reading the word out loud would put the right stress as required in this misr'a.

> Allaah ki laaThii meN aavaaz nahiiN hotii (please note the preponderance of 'aa' and 'ii' in this misr'a).

Duly noted. :)
You must have noticed that lately I have been extra cautious with my aa/ii/uu when posting asha'ar. Will you consider raising my 'star' rating to *4.9* now? :-)

> du'aa-go, Raj Kumar***

Your *4.89999 --> 4.9* pupil,

______Zoya

On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 6:48:12 PM UTC-7, Zoya wrote:
> On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 6:25:38 PM UTC-5, Raj Kumar wrote:
>
> > ***Three points:
> > (iii) This important point should have been mentioned by Zoya sahiba. :-(
> >
> > With the word Allah, as written here, the misr'a in question will not be in meter. It better be written as Allaah (and also spoken accordingly) --- only then will the misr'a be in meter. As an example, look at this proverbial misr'a

> Prof RK,
>
> You have to believe me that the reason I did not say anything about the vazn here is because I did not want to take the liberty with how 'Allah' is generally written. I just assumed that anyone reading the word out loud would put the right stress as required in this misr'a.
>
***ZS, I can readily understand your hesitation to comment on the transliteration of this word because of its religious connotation but here the question of pertinent importance is as to how this word should be written and spoken so that the misr'a in question be in meter. That is all.

To illustrate this point further, I'll give you two examples one of which almost everyone knows and the other which hardly anyone knows! :-)

(i) Suufii Ghulam Mustafa Tabassum's famous Ghazal

voh mujh se huye ham-kalaam Allah Allah
kahaaN maiN, kahaaN yeh maqaam Allah Allah

Here, Allaah would be wrong.

(ii) A rubaa'ii by Josh MaliiHaabaadi, which I heard from horse's mouth at one of the mushaa'iras in Delhi. At present I remember only the last two lines (which happen to be enough to illustrate my point)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
ma'ashuuq lage kahne, "aap haiN mere buzurg"
Allaah, mujhe voh din na dikhaanaa hargiz!

Here, Allah would be wrong.

> You must have noticed that lately I have been extra cautious with my aa/ii/uu when posting asha'ar. Will you consider raising my
> 'star' rating to *4.9* now?

Yes, I'll definitely consider it ------ magar voh kyaa she'r hai

naala hai, bulbul-e-SHOREEDA, tiraa Khaam abhii
apne seene meN ise aur zaraa thaam abhii LOL

aap ka shubh-chintak, Raj uncle***

On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 11:17:20 PM UTC-5, Raj Kumar wrote:

> ***ZS, I can readily understand your hesitation to comment on the transliteration of this word because of its religious connotation but here the question of pertinent importance is as to how this word should be written and spoken so that the misr'a in question be in meter. That is all.

I see your point Prof RK. In fact now that you got me thinking about it, we write 'Bhagwan /Bhagwaan' in bhajans all the time, depending on the meter requirements. Also, when we do simran with the sangat in a gurdwara, initially the meditation is fast paced, 'waheguru, waheguru', but towards the end it slows down considerably to 'waaheguru, waaheguru'.

Seems like the poetic meter is omnipresent. :-)
> To illustrate this point further, I'll give you two examples one of which almost everyone knows and the other which hardly anyone knows! :-)
>
> (i) Suufii Ghulam Mustafa Tabassum's famous Ghazal
>
> voh mujh se huye ham-kalaam Allah Allah
> kahaaN maiN, kahaaN yeh maqaam Allah Allah
>
> Here, Allaah would be wrong.

Yes. One of my favorite vocal ghazals, it is as much Farida Khannum's as Sufi Tabassum's.

> (ii) A rubaa'ii by Josh MaliiHaabaadi, which I heard from horse's mouth at one of the mushaa'iras in Delhi. At present I remember only the last two lines (which happen to be enough to illustrate my point)

> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> ma'ashuuq lage kahne, "aap haiN mere buzurg"
> Allaah, mujhe voh din na dikhaanaa hargiz!
>
> Here, Allah would be wrong.

Of course. And aameen. :)

Now I am suddenly reminded of a misra'a from a favorite Faraz she'r. For years, I have been using this as a du'a for one of our mutual, dear friends. He has been talking about dying probably since the day he was born, and I have been forever saying:

"ai mirii jaan ke dushman, tujhe Allaah rakhe!" :-))

From now on, I'll be sure to type it with 'aa'.

> > You must have noticed that lately I have been extra cautious with my aa/ii/uu when posting asha'ar. Will you consider raising my
> > 'star' rating to *4.9* now?
> Yes, I'll definitely consider it ------ magar voh kyaa she'r hai
>
> naala hai, bulbul-e-SHOREEDA, tiraa Khaam abhii
> apne seene meN ise aur zaraa thaam abhii LOL

No rush Raj uncle. Whenever you feel like I am worthy of it.
Meantime, please be sure to assign some challenging exercises for me. You know what I did for fun yesterday -- I attended a webinar by theoretical physicist Brian Greene. I sat mesmerized for an hour listening to him talk about String theory, mind and matter. And then I ordered his latest book!

Theoretical Physics and Urdu poetry, pure heaven. I wouldn't mind being a lifelong student in either subject.

> aap ka shubh-chintak, Raj uncle***

aap kii aagya-kaari shishya,

_______Zoya

On Friday, April 30, 2021 at 6:11:19 PM UTC-5, Zoya wrote:

> "ai mirii jaan ke dushman, tujhe Allaah rakhe!"

A quick follow up:

Q: Prof RK, I realize that the 'kh' in 'rakhe' has extra verbal stress, I had debated how to type it, should I have written 'rakhkhe', would that have been better?

On Friday, April 30, 2021 at 4:37:14 PM UTC-7, Zoya wrote:
> On Friday, April 30, 2021 at 6:11:19 PM UTC-5, Zoya wrote:
>
> > "ai mirii jaan ke dushman, tujhe Allaah rakhe!"
> A quick follow up:
>
> Q: Prof RK, I realize that the 'kh' in 'rakhe' has extra verbal stress, I had debated how to type it, should I have written 'rakhkhe', would that have been better?

***It is not a question of better or worse, ZS; it is a question of correct or incorrect!

I have no doubt that the correct misr'a is --- ai mirii jaan ke dushman, tujhe Allah rakkhe!

Remember that A.R.Rahman stands for Allah Rakkhaa Rahmaan.
And Khushtar Giraamii was Raam Rakkhaa Mall.

We never say Allah rakhaa or Allaah rakhaa --- it is always "Allah rakkha".

Zoya ji, abhi to aap 4.9 tak pahuNchne ke pher meN haiN, zaraa sochiye k 4.9 se 5.0 tak pahuNchte pahuNchte kyaa Haal hoga?
kisi ne Theek hi to kahaa hai:

bahut kaThin hai Dagar panghaT kii
kaise bhar laa'uuN maiN Jamuna se maTkii :-)

du'aa-go, Raj uncle***

On Friday, April 30, 2021 at 7:41:33 PM UTC-5, Raj Kumar wrote:
>
> I have no doubt that the correct misr'a is --- ai mirii jaan ke dushman, tujhe Allah rakkhe!

Yes Prof RK. So I had been right all those years! Dah.
Zoya, stop over analyzing. Chill.

> Remember that A.R.Rahman stands for Allah Rakkhaa Rahmaan.

Yes, who doesn't remember A R Rehman? :)

> And Khushtar Giraamii was Raam Rakkhaa Mall.

Now who's that?? Never heard of him.

> We never say Allah rakhaa or Allaah rakhaa --- it is always "Allah rakkha".

Never ever---Yes always.

> Zoya ji, abhi to aap 4.9 tak pahuNchne ke pher meN haiN, zaraa sochiye k 4.9 se 5.0 tak pahuNchte pahuNchte kyaa Haal hoga?
> kisi ne Theek hi to kahaa hai:

> bahut kaThin hai Dagar panghaT kii
> kaise bhar laa'uuN maiN Jamuna se maTkii :-)

Actually 4.8999 doesn't sound that bad right now. Still a shining star. After all an A is an A is an A. :-)

> du'aa-go, Raj uncle***

Thank you Raj uncle. What would I do without you?!
Nag Irfan sahib some more, of course! :-))

du'aa-talab,

_______Zoya

On Thursday, April 29, 2021 at 12:50:15 PM UTC-4, Afzal A. Khan wrote:
> On 4/29/2021 8:46 AM, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
>
>
> > Aadaab:
>
> > There have been numerous mistakes during copying verses from different sources. I have three couplets here - two by Sael and one by Dagh. I would appreciate if someone would confirm that there are no mistakes in it:
> > 1. Tahajjud ko huee chori, dar-e-maikhana chopaT hai
> > Mere ToTe huay sheeshay faqat jhoTe pyale hain
> > 2. GumaN kis par kareN maikash idhar waiz udhar sufi
> > Mahalle meiN Khuda rakkhe sabhbhi Allah wale hain
> > 3. ZakhmuN ko mere dekh kar hairanN hoN na aap
> > Yeh gul hazoor hi ke khilaye huay tu hain
> >
> > Thanks.
>
> > Best wishes.
>
> > Khalid
> K. S. Saheb,
>
> I don't think there are any errors here......
>
> However, as you might have noticed, I follow a somewhat
> different system with respect to Roman......
>
> So, I would transcribe these ash'aar as follows :
>
> Tahajjud ko huwee chori, dar-e-mai'KHaana chaupaT hai
> Mire TooTe huwe sheeshe faqat jhooTe piyaale haiN
>
>
> GumaaN kis par kareN Maikash, idhar waa'iz, udhar soofi
> MoHalle men KHuda rakkhe, sabhi Allah~waale haiN
>
>
> ZaKHmoN ko mire dekh kar Hairaan na hoN aap
> Yeh gul Huzoor hi ke khilaae huwe to haiN
>
>
>
> In the second sher above, I presume "Maikash" is the taKHallus of the
> poet. I believe he hailed from Agra, i.e. Maikash Akbarabadi.
>
>
>
> Afzal
Aadaab:
Actually the second line of the first verse should be:
nire TooTe huwe sheeshe faqat jooThe piyaale haiN

It is not mire but nire. jhooTe means liars; jooThe means contaminated. In Urdu these will be written asنرے and جوٹھے.
Best wishes.
Khalid

On Thursday, 29 April 2021 at 14:46:51 UTC+1, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
> Aadaab:
> There have been numerous mistakes during copying verses from different sources. I have three couplets here - two by Sael and one by Dagh. I would appreciate if someone would confirm that there are no mistakes in it:
> 1. Tahajjud ko huee chori, dar-e-maikhana chopaT hai
> Mere ToTe huay sheeshay faqat jhoTe pyale hain
> 2. GumaN kis par kareN maikash idhar waiz udhar sufi
> Mahalle meiN Khuda rakkhe sabhbhi Allah wale hain
> 3. ZakhmuN ko mere dekh kar hairanN hoN na aap
> Yeh gul hazoor hi ke khilaye huay tu hain
>
> Thanks.
> Best wishes.
> Khalid

aadaab Khalid SaaHib.

For 2.

gumaaN kis par kareN, suufii idhar hai us taraf vaa3iz
xudaa rakkhe muHalle meN sabhii Allah vaale haiN

Navvaab Sirajuddin Ahmed Khan Saa'il Dihlavii

.................................................................................

Naseer

On Saturday, May 1, 2021 at 5:49:34 PM UTC-4, Naseer wrote:
> On Thursday, 29 April 2021 at 14:46:51 UTC+1, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
> > Aadaab:
> > There have been numerous mistakes during copying verses from different sources. I have three couplets here - two by Sael and one by Dagh. I would appreciate if someone would confirm that there are no mistakes in it:
> > 1. Tahajjud ko huee chori, dar-e-maikhana chopaT hai
> > Mere ToTe huay sheeshay faqat jhoTe pyale hain
> > 2. GumaN kis par kareN maikash idhar waiz udhar sufi
> > Mahalle meiN Khuda rakkhe sabhbhi Allah wale hain
> > 3. ZakhmuN ko mere dekh kar hairanN hoN na aap
> > Yeh gul hazoor hi ke khilaye huay tu hain
> >
> > Thanks.
> > Best wishes.
> > Khalid
> aadaab Khalid SaaHib.
>
> For 2.
>
> gumaaN kis par kareN, suufii idhar hai us taraf vaa3iz
> xudaa rakkhe muHalle meN sabhii Allah vaale haiN
>
> Navvaab Sirajuddin Ahmed Khan Saa'il Dihlavii
>
> ................................................................................
>
> Naseer
Aadaab:
What is your source or reference? Does Mr. Saa'il have a diwan?
Best wishes.
Khalid

On Sunday, 2 May 2021 at 03:11:06 UTC+1, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
> On Saturday, May 1, 2021 at 5:49:34 PM UTC-4, Naseer wrote:
> > On Thursday, 29 April 2021 at 14:46:51 UTC+1, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
> > > Aadaab:
> > > There have been numerous mistakes during copying verses from different sources. I have three couplets here - two by Sael and one by Dagh. I would appreciate if someone would confirm that there are no mistakes in it:
> > > 1. Tahajjud ko huee chori, dar-e-maikhana chopaT hai
> > > Mere ToTe huay sheeshay faqat jhoTe pyale hain
> > > 2. GumaN kis par kareN maikash idhar waiz udhar sufi
> > > Mahalle meiN Khuda rakkhe sabhbhi Allah wale hain
> > > 3. ZakhmuN ko mere dekh kar hairanN hoN na aap
> > > Yeh gul hazoor hi ke khilaye huay tu hain
> > >
> > > Thanks.
> > > Best wishes.
> > > Khalid
> > aadaab Khalid SaaHib.
> >
> > For 2.
> >
> > gumaaN kis par kareN, suufii idhar hai us taraf vaa3iz
> > xudaa rakkhe muHalle meN sabhii Allah vaale haiN
> >
> > Navvaab Sirajuddin Ahmed Khan Saa'il Dihlavii
> >
> > ................................................................................
> >
> > Naseer
> Aadaab:
> What is your source or reference? Does Mr. Saa'il have a diwan?
> Best wishes.
> Khalid

aadaab.

A1. Just searching the net which I sometimes wishfully call "taHqiiq"!:-)

A2. No, to the best of my knowledge.

Naseer

On Sunday, May 2, 2021 at 11:35:47 AM UTC-4, Naseer wrote:
> On Sunday, 2 May 2021 at 03:11:06 UTC+1, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
> > On Saturday, May 1, 2021 at 5:49:34 PM UTC-4, Naseer wrote:
> > > On Thursday, 29 April 2021 at 14:46:51 UTC+1, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
> > > > Aadaab:
> > > > There have been numerous mistakes during copying verses from different sources. I have three couplets here - two by Sael and one by Dagh. I would appreciate if someone would confirm that there are no mistakes in it:
> > > > 1. Tahajjud ko huee chori, dar-e-maikhana chopaT hai
> > > > Mere ToTe huay sheeshay faqat jhoTe pyale hain
> > > > 2. GumaN kis par kareN maikash idhar waiz udhar sufi
> > > > Mahalle meiN Khuda rakkhe sabhbhi Allah wale hain
> > > > 3. ZakhmuN ko mere dekh kar hairanN hoN na aap
> > > > Yeh gul hazoor hi ke khilaye huay tu hain
> > > >
> > > > Thanks.
> > > > Best wishes.
> > > > Khalid
> > > aadaab Khalid SaaHib.
> > >
> > > For 2.
> > >
> > > gumaaN kis par kareN, suufii idhar hai us taraf vaa3iz
> > > xudaa rakkhe muHalle meN sabhii Allah vaale haiN
> > >
> > > Navvaab Sirajuddin Ahmed Khan Saa'il Dihlavii
> > >
> > > ................................................................................
> > >
> > > Naseer
> > Aadaab:
> > What is your source or reference? Does Mr. Saa'il have a diwan?
> > Best wishes.
> > Khalid
> aadaab.
>
> A1. Just searching the net which I sometimes wishfully call "taHqiiq"!:-)
>
> A2. No, to the best of my knowledge.
>
> Naseer
Aadaab:
A2. According to my friend Dr. Sohail Maqbool, Saa'il does have a diwan but he doesn't own one. He, however, has many other hand-written manuscripts that he would look into. His references are always based on books. I will let you know what he finds out.
Best wishes.
Khalid

On Friday, April 30, 2021 at 7:41:30 PM UTC-7, Zoya wrote:
> On Friday, April 30, 2021 at 7:41:33 PM UTC-5, Raj Kumar wrote:
> >
> > And Khushtar Giraamii was Raam Rakkhaa Mall.

> Now who's that?? Never heard of him.

***ZS, Khushtar Giraamii was the founding editor of the well known Urdu magazine "BiiswiiN Sadii". He held this position from 1937 till 1977, when the magazine was bought over by Rahman Nayyar who became the next editor.

I published about eight of my initial Ghazals in that magazine between the years 1976 and 1980, so I had close contact with both these gentlemen. As I have said before, I discontinued writing poetry in 1980 and resumed it in 1993 (5 years before my retirement).

R.K.***

On Saturday, May 1, 2021 at 2:49:34 PM UTC-7, Naseer wrote:
>
> gumaaN kis par kareN, suufii idhar hai us taraf vaa3iz
> xudaa rakkhe muHalle meN sabhii Allah vaale haiN
>
> Navvaab Sirajuddin Ahmed Khan Saa'il Dihlavii
>
***janaab-e-man, is she'r ke pahle misr'e ki tasHiiH ke liye aap ka bahut bahut shukriya.
albatta, is ke duusre misr'e meN, baHr/vazn ko dhyaan meN rakhte huye, agar aap 'Allah' ki bajaaye 'Allaah' likkheN to Bhagwaan aap ka bhalaa kareN ge! :-)

R.K.***

On Sunday, 2 May 2021 at 19:54:28 UTC+1, Raj Kumar wrote:
> On Friday, April 30, 2021 at 7:41:30 PM UTC-7, Zoya wrote:
> > On Friday, April 30, 2021 at 7:41:33 PM UTC-5, Raj Kumar wrote:
> > >
> > > And Khushtar Giraamii was Raam Rakkhaa Mall.
>
> > Now who's that?? Never heard of him.
> ***ZS, Khushtar Giraamii was the founding editor of the well known Urdu magazine "BiiswiiN Sadii". He held this position from 1937 till 1977, when the magazine was bought over by Rahman Nayyar who became the next editor.
>
> I published about eight of my initial Ghazals in that magazine between the years 1976 and 1980, so I had close contact with both these gentlemen. As I have said before, I discontinued writing poetry in 1980 and resumed it in 1993 (5 years before my retirement).
>
> R.K.***

I have heard of "career breaks" Raj Kumar SaaHib but not "poetry breaks"!:-) May I ask why you took this break or is it a long story?

Naseer

On Sunday, 2 May 2021 at 20:15:30 UTC+1, Raj Kumar wrote:
> On Saturday, May 1, 2021 at 2:49:34 PM UTC-7, Naseer wrote:
> >
> > gumaaN kis par kareN, suufii idhar hai us taraf vaa3iz
> > xudaa rakkhe muHalle meN sabhii Allah vaale haiN
> >
> > Navvaab Sirajuddin Ahmed Khan Saa'il Dihlavii
> >
> ***janaab-e-man, is she'r ke pahle misr'e ki tasHiiH ke liye aap ka bahut bahut shukriya.
> albatta, is ke duusre misr'e meN, baHr/vazn ko dhyaan meN rakhte huye, agar aap 'Allah' ki bajaaye 'Allaah' likkheN to Bhagwaan aap ka bhalaa kareN ge! :-)
>
> R.K.***

I think both Allah and Bhagwaan will forgive me because they know I am an ignorant kind of person. They take to task only those people who are in the know and therefore ought to know better!:-)

(You might be interested to know that your recent lecture on the word Allah was in my mind! I knew if I write it as Allaah, I will have made the wrong choice! So, I decided to leave the word for the discernable reader to read it correctly, just like when I read your name "Kumar", I read it as "Kumaar"!:-)

Naseer

On Sunday, 2 May 2021 at 18:02:40 UTC+1, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
> On Sunday, May 2, 2021 at 11:35:47 AM UTC-4, Naseer wrote:
> > On Sunday, 2 May 2021 at 03:11:06 UTC+1, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
> > > On Saturday, May 1, 2021 at 5:49:34 PM UTC-4, Naseer wrote:
> > > > On Thursday, 29 April 2021 at 14:46:51 UTC+1, Khalid Siddiqui wrote:
> > > > > Aadaab:
> > > > > There have been numerous mistakes during copying verses from different sources. I have three couplets here - two by Sael and one by Dagh. I would appreciate if someone would confirm that there are no mistakes in it:
> > > > > 1. Tahajjud ko huee chori, dar-e-maikhana chopaT hai
> > > > > Mere ToTe huay sheeshay faqat jhoTe pyale hain
> > > > > 2. GumaN kis par kareN maikash idhar waiz udhar sufi
> > > > > Mahalle meiN Khuda rakkhe sabhbhi Allah wale hain
> > > > > 3. ZakhmuN ko mere dekh kar hairanN hoN na aap
> > > > > Yeh gul hazoor hi ke khilaye huay tu hain
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks.
> > > > > Best wishes.
> > > > > Khalid
> > > > aadaab Khalid SaaHib.
> > > >
> > > > For 2.
> > > >
> > > > gumaaN kis par kareN, suufii idhar hai us taraf vaa3iz
> > > > xudaa rakkhe muHalle meN sabhii Allah vaale haiN
> > > >
> > > > Navvaab Sirajuddin Ahmed Khan Saa'il Dihlavii
> > > >
> > > > .................................................................................
> > > >
> > > > Naseer
> > > Aadaab:
> > > What is your source or reference? Does Mr. Saa'il have a diwan?
> > > Best wishes.
> > > Khalid
> > aadaab.
> >
> > A1. Just searching the net which I sometimes wishfully call "taHqiiq"!:-)
> >
> > A2. No, to the best of my knowledge.
> >
> > Naseer
> Aadaab:
> A2. According to my friend Dr. Sohail Maqbool, Saa'il does have a diwan but he doesn't own one. He, however, has many other hand-written manuscripts that he would look into. His references are always based on books. I will let you know what he finds out.
> Best wishes.
> Khalid

Thank you. I will look forward to your findings. As you know, the internet is also a great source for books and my information is based on a book too.

Naseer

On Sunday, May 2, 2021 at 12:17:17 PM UTC-7, Naseer wrote:
> On Sunday, 2 May 2021 at 19:54:28 UTC+1, Raj Kumar wrote:
> > On Friday, April 30, 2021 at 7:41:30 PM UTC-7, Zoya wrote:
> > > On Friday, April 30, 2021 at 7:41:33 PM UTC-5, Raj Kumar wrote:
> > > >
> > > > And Khushtar Giraamii was Raam Rakkhaa Mall.
> >
> > > Now who's that?? Never heard of him.
> > ***ZS, Khushtar Giraamii was the founding editor of the well known Urdu magazine "BiiswiiN Sadii". He held this position from 1937 till 1977, when the magazine was bought over by Rahman Nayyar who became the next editor.
> >
> > I published about eight of my initial Ghazals in that magazine between the years 1976 and 1980, so I had close contact with both these gentlemen. As I have said before, I discontinued writing poetry in 1980 and resumed it in 1993 (5 years before my retirement).
> >
> > R.K.***
> I have heard of "career breaks" Raj Kumar SaaHib but not "poetry breaks"!:-) May I ask why you took this break or is it a long story?
>
> Naseer

***It is not a long story at all, Naseer sahib, --- it can be described in much shorter a space than your average post takes! :-)

During the period 1976-80, I wrote about 20 Ghazals, eight of which were published in BS --- sorry, I better say "BiisviiN Sadii".
I was so conscious of making my compositions a model of precision, as expected of one steeped in the tradition of mathematical physics, that this task became quite time-consuming. I felt that this was beginning to impact negatively on my efficiency in doing my professional research work. So I decided to close this chapter for the time being and get back to it after my retirement.

Around 1993, when my retirement was a bare five years away, I thought I had done enough of physics by now, there is no pressure to produce more, then why wait for retirement, why not take up Urdu poetry right now? So, in those last five years, I pursued a happy blend of these two activities whereas, since 1998, Theoretical Physics has been on the back burner and Urdu poetry up front.

Well, this is my story, Naseer sahib. I don't think Seemab's famous she'r can apply to it:

kahaanii apni ruudaad-e-jahaaN ma'aluum hotii hai
jo suntaa hai, usii kii daastaaN ma'aluum hotii hai

Can it? :-)

Raj Kumar***