Nick Odell said:
> On Sat, 30 Apr 2022 12:40:14 -0500, Richard Robinson
><richardR@privacy.net> wrote:
>
>>Nick Odell said:
>>>
>>> What really cvffrf zr bss is the
>>> creeping requirement to be a smartphone user in order to access public
>>> services - highlighted recently through the retreat into their
>>> fortresses of some medical, local authority and government services.
>>
>>Yes.
>
> That was March 10. This is April 30. Has something just happened?

Just an outbreak of Shed Time, I think.

--
Richard Robinson
"The whole plan hinged upon the natural curiosity of potatoes" - S. Lem

My email address is at http://qualmograph.org.uk/contact.html

Tone said:
> On 30/04/2022 20:15, maus wrote:
>> On 2022-04-30, Richard Robinson <richardR@privacy.net> wrote:
>>> Nick Odell said:
>>>>
>>>> What really cvffrf zr bss is the
>>>> creeping requirement to be a smartphone user in order to access public
>>>> services - highlighted recently through the retreat into their
>>>> fortresses of some medical, local authority and government services.
>>>
>>> Yes.
>>>
>> I have reverted from smartphone to a more Nokiash model. Smartphones
>> are getting too powerful in our lives. My daughter needs hers on her
>> person to get into her apartment in Dublin.
>
> Refuse to do smartphones.
>
> 'Puters are fine.
>
> Only just got my head around mobile phones.
>
> Mine does phone calls, texts, and it is a torch.

Clock is handy, too.

--
Richard Robinson
"The whole plan hinged upon the natural curiosity of potatoes" - S. Lem

My email address is at http://qualmograph.org.uk/contact.html

In article <Sp-dnTiUZuo4AfD_nZ2dnUU7-U2dnZ2d@brightview.co.uk>, Richard
Robinson <richardR@privacy.net> on Sat, 30 Apr 2022 at 15:31:33 awoke
Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote
>Nick Odell said:
>> On Sat, 30 Apr 2022 12:40:14 -0500, Richard Robinson
>><richardR@privacy.net> wrote:
>>
>>>Nick Odell said:
>>>>
>>>> What really cvffrf zr bss is the
>>>> creeping requirement to be a smartphone user in order to access public
>>>> services - highlighted recently through the retreat into their
>>>> fortresses of some medical, local authority and government services.
>>>
>>>Yes.
>>
>> That was March 10. This is April 30. Has something just happened?
>
>Just an outbreak of Shed Time, I think.
>
1913 Maybe?
--
0sterc@tcher -

"Où sont les neiges d'antan?"

On 30/04/2022 20:15, maus wrote:
> On 2022-04-30, Richard Robinson <richardR@privacy.net> wrote:
>> Nick Odell said:
>>>
>>> What really cvffrf zr bss is the
>>> creeping requirement to be a smartphone user in order to access public
>>> services - highlighted recently through the retreat into their
>>> fortresses of some medical, local authority and government services.
>>
>> Yes.
>>
> I have reverted from smartphone to a more Nokiash model. Smartphones
> are getting too powerful in our lives. My daughter needs hers on her
> person to get into her apartment in Dublin.

While I'm all in favour of smartphones, I agree that is a step too far.

There's no reason that smartphones shouldn't be used to make things
easier, but the corollary to that is that not having a smartphone
shouldn't make things more difficult. For instance, just because I can
send my doctor pictures of bits of me[1] doesn't mean that it should be
more difficult for me to see her in person (although the reduction in GP
numbers, increasing number of ailments, and Covid do). But there should
be access to similar functions via computer to those available by
smartphone, albeit maybe by a clunkier interface.

[1] For diagnostic purposes, not recreational

On 30 Apr 2022 19:15:53 GMT, maus <maus@dmaus.org> wrote:

>On 2022-04-30, Richard Robinson <richardR@privacy.net> wrote:
>> Nick Odell said:
>>>
>>> What really cvffrf zr bss is the
>>> creeping requirement to be a smartphone user in order to access public
>>> services - highlighted recently through the retreat into their
>>> fortresses of some medical, local authority and government services.
>>
>> Yes.
>>
> I have reverted from smartphone to a more Nokiash model. Smartphones
> are getting too powerful in our lives. My daughter needs hers on her
> person to get into her apartment in Dublin.

And what, I wonder, is the failsafe condition for when (not if, when)
there is a system failure? Is there a manual override? Do all the
locks fly open? Is everybody locked in, locked in and everybody locked
out, locked out?

Nick

On 02/05/2022 14:33, Nick Odell wrote:

> And what, I wonder, is the failsafe condition for when (not if, when)
> there is a system failure? Is there a manual override? Do all the
> locks fly open? Is everybody locked in, locked in and everybody locked
> out, locked out?
>
> Nick
>
Normal design is for a manual override on the inside so occupants can
get out. There is also a supervisor's key operated lock, usually hidden
by a decorative panel, which normal occupants are not told about.

Non-lockable emergency exits (Which include the front door) are a legal
requirement in the UK.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

In article <78nv6h5ik52f2nsb7pqc2cs3e3qdehur2h@4ax.com>, Nick Odell
<nick@themusicworkshop.plus.com> on Mon, 2 May 2022 at 14:33:19 awoke
Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote
>On 30 Apr 2022 19:15:53 GMT, maus <maus@dmaus.org> wrote:
>
>>On 2022-04-30, Richard Robinson <richardR@privacy.net> wrote:
>>> Nick Odell said:
>>>>
>>>> What really cvffrf zr bss is the
>>>> creeping requirement to be a smartphone user in order to access public
>>>> services - highlighted recently through the retreat into their
>>>> fortresses of some medical, local authority and government services.
>>>
>>> Yes.
>>>
>> I have reverted from smartphone to a more Nokiash model. Smartphones
>> are getting too powerful in our lives. My daughter needs hers on her
>> person to get into her apartment in Dublin.
>
>And what, I wonder, is the failsafe condition for when (not if, when)
>there is a system failure? Is there a manual override? Do all the
>locks fly open? Is everybody locked in, locked in and everybody locked
>out, locked out?
>
I have been pondering a similar problem. We are being directed towards
all 'landline' telephones using VOIP as the country becomes fibred up.
At the moment my DECT phone will not work if there is a power cut,
however I have an old-fashioned cabled phone especially for that
purpose. Even in the case of a power failure to the local exchange they
(Openreach?) have a back up power supply that means the telephone
network does not fail.

If the power supply fails to a property how do we phone if the phones
are all using VOIP?
--
0sterc@tcher -

"Où sont les neiges d'antan?"

In article <jda6mlFqb6kU1@mid.individual.net>, John Williamson
<johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> on Mon, 2 May 2022 at 15:04:02 awoke
Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote
>On 02/05/2022 14:33, Nick Odell wrote:
>
>> And what, I wonder, is the failsafe condition for when (not if, when)
>> there is a system failure? Is there a manual override? Do all the
>> locks fly open? Is everybody locked in, locked in and everybody locked
>> out, locked out?
>>
>> Nick
>>
>Normal design is for a manual override on the inside so occupants can
>get out. There is also a supervisor's key operated lock, usually hidden
>by a decorative panel, which normal occupants are not told about.
>
>Non-lockable emergency exits (Which include the front door) are a legal
>requirement in the UK.
>

Are we talking about houses or blocks of flats?

Supervisors for houses, WOW.

Supervisor for a block of flats? Do you mean a concierge? Either way
unauthorised access to homes becomes a real worry.

--
0sterc@tcher -

"Où sont les neiges d'antan?"

On 02/05/2022 15:17, Nicholas D. Richards wrote:

> I have been pondering a similar problem. We are being directed towards
> all 'landline' telephones using VOIP as the country becomes fibred up.
> At the moment my DECT phone will not work if there is a power cut,
> however I have an old-fashioned cabled phone especially for that
> purpose. Even in the case of a power failure to the local exchange they
> (Openreach?) have a back up power supply that means the telephone
> network does not fail.
>
> If the power supply fails to a property how do we phone if the phones
> are all using VOIP?
>
Use cellphones, and hope the base station backup supply has kicked in?

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On 02/05/2022 14:33, Nick Odell wrote:
> On 30 Apr 2022 19:15:53 GMT, maus <maus@dmaus.org> wrote:
>
>> On 2022-04-30, Richard Robinson <richardR@privacy.net> wrote:
>>> Nick Odell said:
>>>>
>>>> What really cvffrf zr bss is the
>>>> creeping requirement to be a smartphone user in order to access public
>>>> services - highlighted recently through the retreat into their
>>>> fortresses of some medical, local authority and government services.
>>>
>>> Yes.
>>>
>> I have reverted from smartphone to a more Nokiash model. Smartphones
>> are getting too powerful in our lives. My daughter needs hers on her
>> person to get into her apartment in Dublin.
>
> And what, I wonder, is the failsafe condition for when (not if, when)
> there is a system failure? Is there a manual override? Do all the
> locks fly open? Is everybody locked in, locked in and everybody locked
> out, locked out?
>
> Nick

I was amused last night, watching a TV show on The Yesterday Channel,
Bangers & Cash, an amusing documentary about the Matthewson family in
North Yorkshire who run clasic vehicle auctions. It's where I sold my
Hymer and bought my caravan.

There was a fitter with his head under a bonnet (hood).

"Problem is I'm lost on these old things," he remarked. "Normally I plug
in the computer and it tells me what to do!"

How ironic.

Tone

On 02/05/2022 15:25, Nicholas D. Richards wrote:
> In article <jda6mlFqb6kU1@mid.individual.net>, John Williamson
> <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> on Mon, 2 May 2022 at 15:04:02 awoke
> Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote
>> On 02/05/2022 14:33, Nick Odell wrote:
>>
>>> And what, I wonder, is the failsafe condition for when (not if, when)
>>> there is a system failure? Is there a manual override? Do all the
>>> locks fly open? Is everybody locked in, locked in and everybody locked
>>> out, locked out?
>>>
>>> Nick
>>>
>> Normal design is for a manual override on the inside so occupants can
>> get out. There is also a supervisor's key operated lock, usually hidden
>> by a decorative panel, which normal occupants are not told about.
>>
>> Non-lockable emergency exits (Which include the front door) are a legal
>> requirement in the UK.
>>
>
> Are we talking about houses or blocks of flats?
>
Nick's daughter apparently needs hers to get into her apartment, so a
block of flats, not a house.

> Supervisors for houses, WOW.
>
One family member has a master key and can lock individuals out? It
could easily be set up to require two authentication codes.

> Supervisor for a block of flats? Do you mean a concierge? Either way
> unauthorised access to homes becomes a real worry.
>
I was generalising, but concierges can often access individual
residences in the block for cleaning and such.

"Supervisor" to me is just shorthand for someone having permission and
the means to access all areas.

My security concern with using an app to control access is related to
hacking of the account or server, in the same way that many modern cars
can be stolen by a script kiddie with a black box. To steal my car, you
need a transporter, or access to the wiring or a precisely shaped piece
of metal and a hard coded electronic key. Or physical access and the
knowledge of how to bypass the security. Good luck sniffing that system
from outside the house door.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

In message <UW4qN6Aqf+biFAYL@salmiron.com>, Nicholas D. Richards
<nicholas@salmiron.com> writes
>If the power supply fails to a property how do we phone if the phones
>are all using VOIP?

By having an UPS (which apparently exist, but appear to be about as
common as hen's teeth) connected to the fibre/copper adapter and your
router. The UPSs supposed last about an hour, so if it a longer outage
(such as those during the winter storms), you are stuffed.

Adrian
--
To Reply :
replace "bulleid" with "adrian" - all mail to bulleid is rejected
Sorry for the rigmarole, If I want spam, I'll go to the shops
Every time someone says "I don't believe in trolls", another one dies.

On 02-May-22 14:33, Nick Odell wrote:
> On 30 Apr 2022 19:15:53 GMT, maus <maus@dmaus.org> wrote:

>> I have reverted from smartphone to a more Nokiash model. Smartphones
>> are getting too powerful in our lives. My daughter needs hers on her
>> person to get into her apartment in Dublin.
>
> And what, I wonder, is the failsafe condition for when (not if, when)
> there is a system failure? Is there a manual override? Do all the
> locks fly open? Is everybody locked in, locked in and everybody locked
> out, locked out?

Some years back I jbexed in a place which had security locks on many
sections of the building, with the idea that people would only have
access to areas where they needed to be.

The place also housed a range of highly dangerous gases, & had a highly
sensitive alarm system - in addition to the fire alarm system.

We had lots of safety drills covering all types of emergency.

During these drills I discovered that, if you didn't have your swipe
card to hand[1] (or if your shortest route to safety (outside) happened
to be through a door that you were not (usually) given access to - you
could be trapped with no escape route, since those doors did _not_
default to 'unlocked'.

I raised this with the safety officer, expecting her to jump on this
major hazard.
Nope.
I got back an email saying they 'should' open.
I replied that they didn't - and hadn't done so on the last x drills.
It never did get sorted out whilst I was there.

[1] Some areas were clean rooms & others were semi-clean rooms & you had
to get dressed & undressed in various gear on entry/egress, so it's easy
to mislay a swipe card while you're doing this.

--
Sam Plusnet