On Sat, 24 Jun 2023 15:54:31 +0100, Bob Henson <bob.henson@outlook.com> wrote:

> The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>> I say 6 to 4 against, within one week.
>
> Either way, if Ukraine play their cards right, their odds should improve.

I see no losses happening to Russia, the war is being fought in the Ukraine, I only see the evil Ukraine being destroyed, and good riddance. The Ukraine started the war. They mistreated Russian people living in the Ukraine,and they asked Russia for help. Don't believe propaganda from US and UK governments.

The problem is whoever you believe, folk not interested in any of this are
suffering the results of the mess. If only they all could see that in the
end, there will have to be talks and some compromises on all sides and why
not do it now rather than later, its completely ridiculous.
Brian

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"Commander Kinsey" <CK1@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:op.2ahbe7a5mvhs6z@ryzen...
> On Sat, 24 Jun 2023 15:54:31 +0100, Bob Henson <bob.henson@outlook.com>
> wrote:
>
>> The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>
>>> I say 6 to 4 against, within one week.
>>
>> Either way, if Ukraine play their cards right, their odds should improve.
>
> I see no losses happening to Russia, the war is being fought in the
> Ukraine, I only see the evil Ukraine being destroyed, and good riddance.
> The Ukraine started the war. They mistreated Russian people living in the
> Ukraine,and they asked Russia for help. Don't believe propaganda from US
> and UK governments.

On 01 Sep 2023 at 10:24:48 BST, ""Brian Gaff"" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:

> The problem is whoever you believe, folk not interested in any of this are
> suffering the results of the mess. If only they all could see that in the
> end, there will have to be talks and some compromises on all sides ...

Why? I don't recall any compromises with Adolf.

--
The truth of the matter is that we Scots have always been more divided amongst ourselves than pitted against the English. Scottish history before the Union of Parliaments is a gloomy, violent tale of murders, feuds, and tribal revenge. Only after the Act of Union did Highlanders and Lowlanders, Picts and Celts, begin to recognise one another as fellow citizens.

Tam Dalyell

On 01/09/2023 10:30, Tim Streater wrote:
> On 01 Sep 2023 at 10:24:48 BST, ""Brian Gaff"" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> The problem is whoever you believe, folk not interested in any of this are
>> suffering the results of the mess. If only they all could see that in the
>> end, there will have to be talks and some compromises on all sides ...
>
> Why? I don't recall any compromises with Adolf.
>
You should read Le Crees autobiography. 97% of the Nazi party members in
the civil service stayed in power to rebuild the Germany of today, and
got their pensions, too.

A bit like all the Europhiles in the civil service here that stayed on
to fight brexit long after the vote was over.

--
Of what good are dead warriors? … Warriors are those who desire battle
more than peace. Those who seek battle despite peace. Those who thump
their spears on the ground and talk of honor. Those who leap high the
battle dance and dream of glory … The good of dead warriors, Mother, is
that they are dead.
Sheri S Tepper: The Awakeners.

Yes, we're suffering by having our taxes spent without permission on blowing stuff up. It's not our war. And no, in the end someone should surrender.

On Fri, 01 Sep 2023 10:24:48 +0100, Brian Gaff <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:

> The problem is whoever you believe, folk not interested in any of this are
> suffering the results of the mess. If only they all could see that in the
> end, there will have to be talks and some compromises on all sides and why
> not do it now rather than later, its completely ridiculous.
> Brian

On 02 Sep 2023 at 07:39:11 BST, "The Natural Philosopher"
<tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> On 01/09/2023 10:30, Tim Streater wrote:
>> On 01 Sep 2023 at 10:24:48 BST, ""Brian Gaff"" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> The problem is whoever you believe, folk not interested in any of this are
>>> suffering the results of the mess. If only they all could see that in the
>>> end, there will have to be talks and some compromises on all sides ...
>>
>> Why? I don't recall any compromises with Adolf.
>>
> You should read Le Crees autobiography. 97% of the Nazi party members in
> the civil service stayed in power to rebuild the Germany of today, and
> got their pensions, too.

But this is the conundrum, isn't it.

1) Who else knows how to run the country except those who have been doing it.
Look at Iraq, where after the invasion the US sacked all the Baath Party
members and the army and sent them home. So you had trained soldiers and
others sitting at home with no pay and nothing to do. Oddly enough they soon
got cheesed off.

2) Just because someone was in the Nazi Party during WW2, doesn't mean they
were a Nazi. As in other similar states, if you wanted a job and no trouble,
you joined the Party and kept your head down and your trap shut. Just like in
1984. And had a copy of Mein Kampf [1] prominently displayed at home. Again,
doesn't mean anyone ever read it.

3) Those who stepped out of line soon felt the cheese-wire noose around their
necks.

[1] Apparently MK became a standard wedding gift, according to Shirer.

--
"If you're not able to ask questions and deal with the answers without feeling that someone has called your intelligence or competence into question, don't ask questions on Usenet where the answers won't be carefully tailored to avoid tripping your hair-trigger insecurities."

D M Procida, UCSM

On 01/09/2023 10:30, Tim Streater wrote:
> On 01 Sep 2023 at 10:24:48 BST, ""Brian Gaff"" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> The problem is whoever you believe, folk not interested in any of this are
>> suffering the results of the mess. If only they all could see that in the
>> end, there will have to be talks and some compromises on all sides ...
>
> Why? I don't recall any compromises with Adolf.
>

and Russia are fighting the Nazis in Ukraine.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 03 Sep 2023 at 08:21:43 BST, "alan_m" <junk@admac.myzen.co.uk> wrote:

> On 01/09/2023 10:30, Tim Streater wrote:
>> On 01 Sep 2023 at 10:24:48 BST, ""Brian Gaff"" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> The problem is whoever you believe, folk not interested in any of this are
>>> suffering the results of the mess. If only they all could see that in the
>>> end, there will have to be talks and some compromises on all sides ...
>>
>> Why? I don't recall any compromises with Adolf.
>
> and Russia are fighting the Nazis in Ukraine.

is what they'd like you to believe.

--
"It is hard to imagine a more stupid decision or more dangerous way of making decisions than by putting those decisions in the hands of people who pay no price for being wrong." -- Thomas Sowell

On 03/09/2023 09:45, Tim Streater wrote:
> On 03 Sep 2023 at 08:21:43 BST, "alan_m" <junk@admac.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 01/09/2023 10:30, Tim Streater wrote:
>>> On 01 Sep 2023 at 10:24:48 BST, ""Brian Gaff"" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> The problem is whoever you believe, folk not interested in any of this are
>>>> suffering the results of the mess. If only they all could see that in the
>>>> end, there will have to be talks and some compromises on all sides ...
>>>
>>> Why? I don't recall any compromises with Adolf.
>>
>> and Russia are fighting the Nazis in Ukraine.
>
> is what they'd like you to believe.

Exactly. Putin knew that calling them Nazis would raise images of the
struggles and sufferings of WW2 and of heroes fighting on the side of
right and automatically make the Russian people more supportive of the
invasion.

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On 03/09/2023 09:45, Tim Streater wrote:
> On 03 Sep 2023 at 08:21:43 BST, "alan_m" <junk@admac.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 01/09/2023 10:30, Tim Streater wrote:
>>> On 01 Sep 2023 at 10:24:48 BST, ""Brian Gaff"" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> The problem is whoever you believe, folk not interested in any of this are
>>>> suffering the results of the mess. If only they all could see that in the
>>>> end, there will have to be talks and some compromises on all sides ...
>>>
>>> Why? I don't recall any compromises with Adolf.
>>
>> and Russia are fighting the Nazis in Ukraine.
>
> is what they'd like you to believe.
>
I think they gave up on that narrative a year ago.

Today they are fighting NATO to defend the motherland or some garbage or
other

--
“The urge to save humanity is almost always only a false face for the
urge to rule it.”
– H. L. Mencken