Watched a recording of the Go Between shown recently on BBC4. What on earth made
the BBC show a poor remake rather the original 1971 Palme d'Or winning version?
Why remake a near perfect film?
--

Martin in Zuid Holland

On 14/08/2021 11:09 am, Martin wrote:

> Watched a recording of the Go Between shown recently on BBC4. What on earth made
> the BBC show a poor remake rather the original 1971 Palme d'Or winning version?
> Why remake a near perfect film?

Was it remade by the BBC?

If not, the question becomes "Why show a poor remake rather than the
award-winning 1971 original?".

And there could be several answers to that, many of them to do with
money. It could cost less to show the remake as a one-off deal. Or the
remake could be one of a batch of films bought for an inclusive price,
with the Beeb (or any broadcaster, really) just wanting to get their
money's worth.

"Martin" <me@address.invalid> wrote in message
news:pb5fhg5u4fjupcvfc2jotgf3s1u6aa1jrb@4ax.com...
> Watched a recording of the Go Between shown recently on BBC4. What on
> earth made
> the BBC show a poor remake rather the original 1971 Palme d'Or winning
> version?

because it was the one made by the BBC, so they didn't have to pay for the
rights.

> Why remake a near perfect film?

such a question can be asked about many remakes

In article <pb5fhg5u4fjupcvfc2jotgf3s1u6aa1jrb@4ax.com>, Martin
<me@address.invalid> writes
>Watched a recording of the Go Between shown recently on BBC4. What on
>earth made the BBC show a poor remake rather the original 1971 Palme
>d'Or winning version? Why remake a near perfect film?

It is done often, All Creatures Great and Small, War of the Worlds,
HHGttG, the original Swedish Wallander, Total Recall, Omega Man, the
list is endless.

The only thing I can remember being re-made that was better than the
original was the Jason Bourne series over the Richard Chamberlain mini
TV series.

Mike

--
Michael Swift We do not regard Englishmen as foreigners.
Kirkheaton We look on them only as rather mad Norwegians.
Yorkshire Halvard Lange

In article <inpm14F8jkuU1@mid.individual.net>, JNugent
<jennings&co@fastmail.fm> writes
>> Watched a recording of the Go Between shown recently on BBC4. What on earth
>made
>> the BBC show a poor remake rather the original 1971 Palme d'Or winning
>version?
>> Why remake a near perfect film?
>
>Was it remade by the BBC?
>
>If not, the question becomes "Why show a poor remake rather than the
>award-winning 1971 original?".
>
>And there could be several answers to that, many of them to do with money.
>It could cost less to show the remake as a one-off deal. Or the remake could
>be one of a batch of films bought for an inclusive price, with the Beeb (or
>any broadcaster, really) just wanting to get their money's worth.

Fair point.

I have found some good old stuff on Talking Pictures TV, my current
favourite from my youth is One Step Beyond.

Mike

--
Michael Swift We do not regard Englishmen as foreigners.
Kirkheaton We look on them only as rather mad Norwegians.
Yorkshire Halvard Lange

On 15/08/2021 02:07 am, Mike Swift wrote:
> In article <pb5fhg5u4fjupcvfc2jotgf3s1u6aa1jrb@4ax.com>, Martin
> <me@address.invalid> writes
>> Watched a recording of the Go Between shown recently on BBC4. What on
>> earth made the BBC show a poor remake rather the original 1971 Palme
>> d'Or  winning version? Why remake a near perfect film?
>
> It is done often, All Creatures Great and Small, War of the Worlds,
> HHGttG, the original Swedish Wallander, Total Recall, Omega Man, the
> list is endless.
>
> The only thing I can remember being re-made that was better than the
> original was the Jason Bourne series over the Richard Chamberlain mini
> TV series.
>
The recent remake of "All Creatures Great And Small" may not totally
satisfy those with a nostalgia for the "old days", but in sheer
production values, it was some way above the 1970s BBC Television Centre
with-filmed-exterior sequences original.

On 15/08/2021 02:10 am, Mike Swift wrote:

> JNugent <jennings&co@fastmail.fm> writes:

>>> Watched a recording of the Go Between shown recently on BBC4. What on
>>> earth made the BBC show a poor remake rather the original 1971 Palm
>>> d'Or  winning version?
>>> Why remake a near perfect film?
>
>> Was it remade by the BBC?
>
>> If not, the question becomes "Why show a poor remake rather than the
>> award-winning 1971 original?".
>
>> And there could be several answers to that, many of them to do with
>> money. It could cost less to show the remake as a one-off deal. Or
>> the remake could be one of a batch of films bought for an inclusive
>> price, with the Beeb (or any broadcaster, really) just wanting to get
>> their money's worth.
>
> Fair point.
>
> I have found some good old stuff on Talking Pictures TV, my current
> favourite from my youth is One Step Beyond.

Yes, TPTV, whilst not being a channel you could watch all evening,
certainly does have an engaging roster of vintage stuff (including "One
Step Beyond").

"JNugent" <jennings&co@fastmail.fm> wrote in message
news:insmqaFre8nU3@mid.individual.net...
> On 15/08/2021 02:07 am, Mike Swift wrote:
>> In article <pb5fhg5u4fjupcvfc2jotgf3s1u6aa1jrb@4ax.com>, Martin
>> <me@address.invalid> writes
>>> Watched a recording of the Go Between shown recently on BBC4. What on
>>> earth made the BBC show a poor remake rather the original 1971 Palme
>>> d'Or winning version? Why remake a near perfect film?
>>
>> It is done often, All Creatures Great and Small, War of the Worlds,
>> HHGttG, the original Swedish Wallander, Total Recall, Omega Man, the list
>> is endless.
>>
>> The only thing I can remember being re-made that was better than the
>> original was the Jason Bourne series over the Richard Chamberlain mini TV
>> series.
>>
> The recent remake of "All Creatures Great And Small" may not totally
> satisfy those with a nostalgia for the "old days", but in sheer production
> values, it was some way above the 1970s BBC Television Centre
> with-filmed-exterior sequences original.

ACGAS does seem to be a poor example

unless he meant that the TV series was poorer than the films, which I cannot
agree with.

I couldn't fathom Omega Man.

I cannot find a remake except that the wiki item for the 1971 film says that
was a remake, but gives no link to the original. IMDB shows no older film
with the same title

In article <insmqaFre8nU3@mid.individual.net>, JNugent
<jennings&co@fastmail.fm> writes
>> The only thing I can remember being re-made that was better than the
>> original was the Jason Bourne series over the Richard Chamberlain mini
>> TV series.
>>
>The recent remake of "All Creatures Great And Small" may not totally satisfy
>those with a nostalgia for the "old days", but in sheer production values, it
>was some way above the 1970s BBC Television Centre with-filmed-exterior
>sequences original.

That may be so but the one episode I did watch reminded me of a poorly
made soap opera, my wife liked it so I assume the demographic they were
aiming at worked, she also liked the Midwife thing and Downton Abbey,
nuff sed.

Mike

--
Michael Swift We do not regard Englishmen as foreigners.
Kirkheaton We look on them only as rather mad Norwegians.
Yorkshire Halvard Lange

In article <sfbgn0$ob3$1@dont-email.me>, tim... <timsnews99@gmail.com>
writes
>I couldn't fathom Omega Man.
>
>I cannot find a remake except that the wiki item for the 1971 film says that
>was a remake, but gives no link to the original. IMDB shows no older film
>with the same title

Will Smith's I am Legend (2007) based on the original novel was first
filmed as the The Omega Man (1971) staring Charlton Heston, a far
superior film.

Mike

--
Michael Swift We do not regard Englishmen as foreigners.
Kirkheaton We look on them only as rather mad Norwegians.
Yorkshire Halvard Lange

On Sun, 15 Aug 2021 15:31:40 +0100, JNugent <jennings&co@fastmail.fm> wrote:

>On 15/08/2021 02:07 am, Mike Swift wrote:
>> In article <pb5fhg5u4fjupcvfc2jotgf3s1u6aa1jrb@4ax.com>, Martin
>> <me@address.invalid> writes
>>> Watched a recording of the Go Between shown recently on BBC4. What on
>>> earth made the BBC show a poor remake rather the original 1971 Palme
>>> d'Or  winning version? Why remake a near perfect film?
>>
>> It is done often, All Creatures Great and Small, War of the Worlds,
>> HHGttG, the original Swedish Wallander, Total Recall, Omega Man, the
>> list is endless.
>>
>> The only thing I can remember being re-made that was better than the
>> original was the Jason Bourne series over the Richard Chamberlain mini
>> TV series.
>>
>The recent remake of "All Creatures Great And Small" may not totally
>satisfy those with a nostalgia for the "old days", but in sheer
>production values, it was some way above the 1970s BBC Television Centre
>with-filmed-exterior sequences original.

Some of the original cast were better than the current ones.
--

Martin in Zuid Holland

"Martin" <me@address.invalid> wrote in message
news:0u8khg9ujbsfor6tq709ji56srpjillfb3@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 15 Aug 2021 15:31:40 +0100, JNugent <jennings&co@fastmail.fm>
> wrote:
>
>>On 15/08/2021 02:07 am, Mike Swift wrote:
>>> In article <pb5fhg5u4fjupcvfc2jotgf3s1u6aa1jrb@4ax.com>, Martin
>>> <me@address.invalid> writes
>>>> Watched a recording of the Go Between shown recently on BBC4. What on
>>>> earth made the BBC show a poor remake rather the original 1971 Palme
>>>> d'Or winning version? Why remake a near perfect film?
>>>
>>> It is done often, All Creatures Great and Small, War of the Worlds,
>>> HHGttG, the original Swedish Wallander, Total Recall, Omega Man, the
>>> list is endless.
>>>
>>> The only thing I can remember being re-made that was better than the
>>> original was the Jason Bourne series over the Richard Chamberlain mini
>>> TV series.
>>>
>>The recent remake of "All Creatures Great And Small" may not totally
>>satisfy those with a nostalgia for the "old days", but in sheer
>>production values, it was some way above the 1970s BBC Television Centre
>>with-filmed-exterior sequences original.
>
> Some of the original cast were better than the current ones.

Christopher Timothy never really "worked" for me as James Herriot. The real
James Herriot / Alf Wight had a lovely soft Scottish accent. Apparently
Christopher Timothy tried to emulate this at rehearsals and was told "no,
use your native accent - don't you dare attempt a Scottish one" ;-)

Robert Hardy could have done with turning down his level of bluster and
irascibility just a little bit. Apparently when Herriot's books were
published (and maybe when the TV series was made) people said "Have you
exaggerated his personality a bit" and Herriot replied, "No, I've toned it
down a lot".

The supporting cast - the farmers and other locals - were a bit of a
let-down, because they chose actors with vaguely northern accents which were
not very authentic: you got farmers with Lancashire or West Riding of
Yorkshire accents which are probably close enough for most people, but they
didn't really have the musical lilt (think of Hannah Hauxwell) of the Upper
Dales accent.

The production values were typical of their time: grainy, de-saturated,
muddy 16mm film for the location shots and garish studio shots of the inside
of Skeldale House and for some farmers' barns etc. The change between the
two was a bit obvious.

My parents have a holiday cottage in a tiny village near Leyburn and an
episode was filmed on the hill behind our back garden about sheep with
magnesium deficiency (I think) giving birth in the snow. Apparently the
local farmers were contacted beforehand to ask "will anyone have a flock of
this breed of sheep that will be lambing at around this time". There was an
article in the local paper about the filming because the farmer who supplied
the sheep was well-known in the area: she had been widowed about ten years
earlier in a tractor accident and had to bring up 8 children and run the
farm on her own (though some of the older children were old enough to help
by the time her husband was killed).

On Mon, 16 Aug 2021 10:23:19 +0100, "NY" <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:

>"Martin" <me@address.invalid> wrote in message
>news:0u8khg9ujbsfor6tq709ji56srpjillfb3@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 15 Aug 2021 15:31:40 +0100, JNugent <jennings&co@fastmail.fm>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>On 15/08/2021 02:07 am, Mike Swift wrote:
>>>> In article <pb5fhg5u4fjupcvfc2jotgf3s1u6aa1jrb@4ax.com>, Martin
>>>> <me@address.invalid> writes
>>>>> Watched a recording of the Go Between shown recently on BBC4. What on
>>>>> earth made the BBC show a poor remake rather the original 1971 Palme
>>>>> d'Or winning version? Why remake a near perfect film?
>>>>
>>>> It is done often, All Creatures Great and Small, War of the Worlds,
>>>> HHGttG, the original Swedish Wallander, Total Recall, Omega Man, the
>>>> list is endless.
>>>>
>>>> The only thing I can remember being re-made that was better than the
>>>> original was the Jason Bourne series over the Richard Chamberlain mini
>>>> TV series.
>>>>
>>>The recent remake of "All Creatures Great And Small" may not totally
>>>satisfy those with a nostalgia for the "old days", but in sheer
>>>production values, it was some way above the 1970s BBC Television Centre
>>>with-filmed-exterior sequences original.
>>
>> Some of the original cast were better than the current ones.
>
>Christopher Timothy never really "worked" for me as James Herriot. The real
>James Herriot / Alf Wight had a lovely soft Scottish accent. Apparently
>Christopher Timothy tried to emulate this at rehearsals and was told "no,
>use your native accent - don't you dare attempt a Scottish one" ;-)
>
>Robert Hardy could have done with turning down his level of bluster and
>irascibility just a little bit. Apparently when Herriot's books were
>published (and maybe when the TV series was made) people said "Have you
>exaggerated his personality a bit" and Herriot replied, "No, I've toned it
>down a lot".

The book was awful. You have to read the book to appreciate how good the TV
version was.

>
>The supporting cast - the farmers and other locals - were a bit of a
>let-down, because they chose actors with vaguely northern accents which were
>not very authentic: you got farmers with Lancashire or West Riding of
>Yorkshire accents which are probably close enough for most people, but they
>didn't really have the musical lilt (think of Hannah Hauxwell) of the Upper
>Dales accent.
>
>The production values were typical of their time: grainy, de-saturated,
>muddy 16mm film for the location shots and garish studio shots of the inside
>of Skeldale House and for some farmers' barns etc. The change between the
>two was a bit obvious.
>
>My parents have a holiday cottage in a tiny village near Leyburn and an
>episode was filmed on the hill behind our back garden about sheep with
>magnesium deficiency (I think) giving birth in the snow. Apparently the
>local farmers were contacted beforehand to ask "will anyone have a flock of
>this breed of sheep that will be lambing at around this time". There was an
>article in the local paper about the filming because the farmer who supplied
>the sheep was well-known in the area: she had been widowed about ten years
>earlier in a tractor accident and had to bring up 8 children and run the
>farm on her own (though some of the older children were old enough to help
>by the time her husband was killed).
--

Martin in Zuid Holland

"Martin" <me@address.invalid> wrote in message
news:35smhg9ufledroe6b1emjc8scuj72p9iue@4ax.com...
>>Robert Hardy could have done with turning down his level of bluster and
>>irascibility just a little bit. Apparently when Herriot's books were
>>published (and maybe when the TV series was made) people said "Have you
>>exaggerated his personality a bit" and Herriot replied, "No, I've toned it
>>down a lot".
>
> The book was awful. You have to read the book to appreciate how good the
> TV
> version was.

I thought the books were fairly well written and told their stories in an
entertaining way.

Apparently Peter Walker ("Nicholas Rhea", author the Heartbeat books) met
Alf Wight ("James Herriot") at a time when Walker had been writing for a
while and Wight was just starting, and passed on some useful tips about how
to tell a good story. However Walker didn't practice what he preached: I'd
say that his Heartbeat books are a bit dull and ponderous compared with the
TV series, though not as bad as Alan Hunter's George Gently books and W J
Burley's Wycliffe books which are both a bit of a chore to read; all three
sets of books were improved for the respective TV versions.

In article <0u8khg9ujbsfor6tq709ji56srpjillfb3@4ax.com>, Martin
<me@address.invalid> writes
>>> It is done often, All Creatures Great and Small, War of the Worlds,
>>> HHGttG, the original Swedish Wallander, Total Recall, Omega Man, the
>>> list is endless.
>>>
>>> The only thing I can remember being re-made that was better than the
>>> original was the Jason Bourne series over the Richard Chamberlain mini
>>> TV series.
>>>
>>The recent remake of "All Creatures Great And Small" may not totally
>>satisfy those with a nostalgia for the "old days", but in sheer
>>production values, it was some way above the 1970s BBC Television Centre
>>with-filmed-exterior sequences original.
>
>Some of the original cast were better than the current ones.

I see from next week's Radio Times that they are at it again.

Remakes of The Darling Buds of May and Dalgliesh, what could possibly go
wrong.

Mike

--
Michael Swift We do not regard Englishmen as foreigners.
Kirkheaton We look on them only as rather mad Norwegians.
Yorkshire Halvard Lange

"Mike Swift" <mike.swift@yeton.co.uk> wrote in message
news:zXL8gLAZS6GhFwpQ@ntlworld.com...
> In article <0u8khg9ujbsfor6tq709ji56srpjillfb3@4ax.com>, Martin
> <me@address.invalid> writes
>>>> It is done often, All Creatures Great and Small, War of the Worlds,
>>>> HHGttG, the original Swedish Wallander, Total Recall, Omega Man, the
>>>> list is endless.
>>>>
>>>> The only thing I can remember being re-made that was better than the
>>>> original was the Jason Bourne series over the Richard Chamberlain mini
>>>> TV series.
>>>>
>>>The recent remake of "All Creatures Great And Small" may not totally
>>>satisfy those with a nostalgia for the "old days", but in sheer
>>>production values, it was some way above the 1970s BBC Television Centre
>>>with-filmed-exterior sequences original.
>>
>>Some of the original cast were better than the current ones.
>
> I see from next week's Radio Times that they are at it again.
>
> Remakes of The Darling Buds of May and Dalgliesh, what could possibly go
> wrong.

Joanna Scanlan as Ma Larkin in The Darling Buds of May looks uncannily like
Pam Ferris who played her in the earlier version. I can imagine her and
Bradley Walsh doing well. But will the actress who replaces Catherine Zeta
Zones as Mariette be as good? And will they find an actor to play the
hapless Charley as well as Philip Franks did?

Dalgliesh. Hmmm. I never liked Roy Marsden as Dalgliesh (*), even if he was
played more as the cold, aloof, distant, peremptory (**) character that P D
James wrote. I *much* preferred Martin Shaw who was still fairly faithful to
the way James wrote him, but managed to inject a bit more compassion and
tenderness, especially in his relationship with Emma Lavenham (Janie Dee). P
D James was great on plots, but never managed to create characters (police,
victim or suspect) that you could really warm to and sympathise with. I
wonder whether the new version will cover some of James's more recent books
such as The Lighthouse and The Private Patient which were never filmed with
Martin Shaw. I wonder whether there were plans to and Shaw decided not to
continue.

(*) That may partly be Roy Marsden - he was a cocky, surly sod in Airline; I
much preferred his Scottish engineer Jock McEvoy. And Terence Rigby stole
the show as Ernie Cade the Brummie spiv.

(**) Rather like my grandpa when he was putting on his headmaster act which
occasionally carried over into his "other life" as a grandpa - but in his
case I knew it was all an act.

On Tue, 17 Aug 2021 12:59:21 +0100, Mike Swift <mike.swift@yeton.co.uk> wrote:

>In article <0u8khg9ujbsfor6tq709ji56srpjillfb3@4ax.com>, Martin
><me@address.invalid> writes
>>>> It is done often, All Creatures Great and Small, War of the Worlds,
>>>> HHGttG, the original Swedish Wallander, Total Recall, Omega Man, the
>>>> list is endless.
>>>>
>>>> The only thing I can remember being re-made that was better than the
>>>> original was the Jason Bourne series over the Richard Chamberlain mini
>>>> TV series.
>>>>
>>>The recent remake of "All Creatures Great And Small" may not totally
>>>satisfy those with a nostalgia for the "old days", but in sheer
>>>production values, it was some way above the 1970s BBC Television Centre
>>>with-filmed-exterior sequences original.
>>
>>Some of the original cast were better than the current ones.
>
>I see from next week's Radio Times that they are at it again.
>
>Remakes of The Darling Buds of May and Dalgliesh, what could possibly go
>wrong.

No doubt they are searching for other successes from the past to remake. Touch
of Frost, Wickers World, In Town Tonight, Muffin the Mule, ... who knows? :-)
--

Martin in Zuid Holland

"Martin" <me@address.invalid> wrote in message
news:qniphg99b6mpajob083hkuhkn1ora6o75q@4ax.com...
> No doubt they are searching for other successes from the past to remake.
> Touch
> of Frost, Wickers World, In Town Tonight, Muffin the Mule, ... who knows?
> :-)

What you do to your mule is entirely up to you, as long as you do it in
private and the mule has given her permission ;-)

It is hard to imagine anyone playing Inspector "Jack" Frost as brilliantly
and irreverently as David Jason. That's one remake that almost certainly
could never be better than the original. It's a shame they never made any of
the "Henry James" (pastiche of R D Wingfield) Frost novels into TV episodes.
Those novels are as good if not better than Wingfield's originals. ("Henry
James" is a pseudonym for a collaboration of two authors IIRC).

On Tuesday, August 17, 2021 at 8:07:49 AM UTC-5, NY wrote:

[ ... ]

> > Remakes of The Darling Buds of May and Dalgliesh, what could possibly go
> > wrong.

> Joanna Scanlan as Ma Larkin in The Darling Buds of May looks uncannily like
> Pam Ferris who played her in the earlier version. I can imagine her and
> Bradley Walsh doing well. But will the actress who replaces Catherine Zeta
> Zones as Mariette be as good? And will they find an actor to play the
> hapless Charley as well as Philip Franks did?

Well, we now know the answer to that last question...