On 09/08/2022 12:00, Stephen Packer wrote:
> On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 11:50:48 UTC+1, Champ wrote:
>> On Sun, 07 Aug 2022 11:27:00 +0100, Pipl <plus...@live.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>> Yeah, our son is a <Technical> Architect and he says all homes should be
>>>> timber framed and built with those passive wall insulating things.
>>
>>> Will nobody think of the trees?
>> Trees are almost the ultimate renewable resource
>>
>> It really annoys me when people say things like "'don't print that
>> (onto paper) - save a tree". The paper industry is one of the most
>> sustainable you can think of, and paper itself is massively recyclable
>
> Sure... but a significant amount of energy and water goes into producing
> paper and I'm sure the recycling rate isn't as high as it could be. Plus trees
> only really work as carbon capture when they're alive, once rotting or worse
> being burnt the CO2 is released back into the atmosphere.
>
> Also, let's not forget the ink involved in printing.
>
> I used to fucking hate turning up to meetings of twenty people or so to see close
> to 100 pages per person of presentations sat on the desk so we had something to
> follow the projected presentation on.
>
> Frankly I'm quite happy to leave the trees growing and not waste them on pointless
> paper production and printing of emails.
>
> I think you need more tolerance (hah!)

I agree with you completely except for one small aside which is that if
you only have a choice between burning and rotting, then choose burning
every time. It is better for the atmosphere by a factor of well over
twenty. That is actually a huge difference but explains why swamps etc
are so bad for the climate.

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_warming_potential*

HTH Chris
(Retired Atmospheric Scientist & Trucker)
In my day we talked about ozone depletion potential (ODP) but that has
been replaced by GWP which gives a better overall picture.

--
The Deuchars BBB#40 COFF#14
Yamaha XV750SE & Suzuki GS550t
http://www.Deuchars.org.uk

On 8/9/2022 4:56 AM, geoffC wrote:
> > Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
>

Bidets are the bomb.

(Besides, walking out of a loo trailing TP is uncool.)

--
The erstwhile Thomas
FJR1300, R1200GS & ST1100 (in memoriam)

On Tuesday, August 9, 2022 at 1:05:13 PM UTC+1, stephen...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 12:56:55 UTC+1, geoffC wrote:
> <snip>
> > Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
> Only buy recycled.

<YTC Mode>

How do they get the shit off?

</Mode>

--
WUN

On 09/08/2022 17:02, Turby wrote:
>On 8/9/2022 4:56 AM, geoffC wrote:
>> > Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
>>
>
>Bidets are the bomb.
>
Butt blasters in Thailand get my vote.

>(Besides, walking out of a loo trailing TP is uncool.)

Indeed, as is using TP in pig toilets, eg. in Goa.

--
Geoff
NTV 650

On 09/08/2022 12:56, geoffC wrote:
> On 09/08/2022 13:00, Stephen Packer wrote:
>> On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 11:50:48 UTC+1, Champ wrote:
>>> On Sun, 07 Aug 2022 11:27:00 +0100, Pipl <plus...@live.co.uk> wrote:
>>> >>Yeah, our son is a <Technical> Architect and he says all homes
>>> should be >>timber framed and built with those passive wall
>>> insulating things.
>>> >Will nobody think of the trees?
>>> Trees are almost the ultimate renewable resource
>>> It really annoys me when people say things like "'don't print that
>>> (onto paper) - save a tree". The paper industry is one of the most
>>> sustainable you can think of, and paper itself is massively recyclable
>>
>> Sure... but a significant amount of energy and water goes into
>> producing paper and I'm sure the recycling rate isn't as high as it
>> could be.  Plus trees
>> only really work as carbon capture when they're alive, once rotting or
>> worse being burnt the CO2 is released back into the atmosphere.
>>
>> Also, let's not forget the ink involved in printing.
>>
>> I used to fucking hate turning up to meetings of twenty people or so
>> to see close
>> to 100 pages per person of presentations sat on the desk so we had
>> something to
>> follow the projected presentation on.
>> Frankly I'm quite happy to leave the trees growing and not waste them
>> on pointless
>> paper production and printing of emails.
>>
>> I think you need more tolerance (hah!)
>
> Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
>

If you stand on it you are doing something wrong

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

On 09/08/2022 14:03, geoffC wrote:
> On 09/08/2022 14:05, Stephen Packer wrote:
>> On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 12:56:55 UTC+1, geoffC wrote:
>> <snip>
>>
>>> Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
>>
>> Only buy recycled.  But I'm not sure what the relevance is to avoiding
>> waste; there are plenty of legitimate uses of paper that result in
>> recycling
>> printing of emails/attachments probably not one of them IMO.
>
> I read somewhere that about 25-30% of the world uses toilet paper. If they
> all learned to clean their bums with water instead of dry paper (like the
> other 70-75%) the paper savings would knock the email printing abstinence
> into a cocked hat.
> And their bums would be cleaner too.
>
>

If you saw how my shit splatters the pan, you'd want to use paper 1st as
well!

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

On 09/08/2022 21:03 geoffC penned these words:
> On 09/08/2022 14:05, Stephen Packer wrote:
>> On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 12:56:55 UTC+1, geoffC wrote:
>> <snip>
>>
>>> Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
>>
>> Only buy recycled. But I'm not sure what the relevance is to avoiding
>> waste; there are plenty of legitimate uses of paper that result in recycling
>> printing of emails/attachments probably not one of them IMO.
>
> I read somewhere that about 25-30% of the world uses toilet paper. If they
> all learned to clean their bums with water instead of dry paper (like the
> other 70-75%) the paper savings would knock the email printing abstinence
> into a cocked hat.
> And their bums would be cleaner too.
>
>
For sure if I end up back in in the UK or anywhere without I'll be fitting a bum
gun next time works far better.

--
Ian

"Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of
the last priest"

On 09/08/2022 17:10, WUN wrote:
>On Tuesday, August 9, 2022 at 1:05:13 PM UTC+1, stephen...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 12:56:55 UTC+1, geoffC wrote:
>> <snip>
>> > Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
>> Only buy recycled.
>
><YTC Mode>
>
>How do they get the shit off?
>
></Mode>

"Worst job I ever 'ad."

--
Geoff
NTV 650

On Wed, 10 Aug 2022 05:36:18 -0000 (UTC), geoffC <me@home.nl> wrote:

>On 09/08/2022 17:10, WUN wrote:
>>On Tuesday, August 9, 2022 at 1:05:13 PM UTC+1, stephen...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 12:56:55 UTC+1, geoffC wrote:
>>> <snip>
>>> > Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
>>> Only buy recycled.
>>
>><YTC Mode>
>>
>>How do they get the shit off?
>>
>></Mode>

>"Worst job I ever 'ad."

LOL!
--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old

On Tue, 9 Aug 2022 04:00:51 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
<stephen.packer@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 11:50:48 UTC+1, Champ wrote:

>> >Will nobody think of the trees?

>> Trees are almost the ultimate renewable resource
>>
>> It really annoys me when people say things like "'don't print that
>> (onto paper) - save a tree". The paper industry is one of the most
>> sustainable you can think of, and paper itself is massively recyclable

>Sure... but a significant amount of energy and water goes into producing
>paper
Probably

>trees only really work as carbon capture when they're alive, once rotting or worse
>being burnt the CO2 is released back into the atmosphere.

I'm not talking about carbon capture. I'm talking about the 'save a
tree' claim. The trees used for paper are farmed like a crop -
they're grown, cut down, and new ones planted, and so on. There is no
tree to save.

>I used to fucking hate turning up to meetings of twenty people or so to see close
>to 100 pages per person of presentations sat on the desk so we had something to
>follow the projected presentation on.

I never worked anywhere that people did that anyway.

>Frankly I'm quite happy to leave the trees growing and not waste them on pointless
>paper production and printing of emails.
>
>I think you need more tolerance (hah!)

Hah indeed. I'm just trying to point out that, in the scheme of
things, not printing an email is the tiniest of small beer when it
comes to conservation. It's really not worth any consideration at
all, as there are easily a thousand more significant things one can
do.
--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old

8On 10/08/2022 02:12, Boots wrote:
>On 09/08/2022 21:03 geoffC penned these words:
>> On 09/08/2022 14:05, Stephen Packer wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 12:56:55 UTC+1, geoffC wrote:
>>> <snip>
>>>
>>>> Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
>>>
>>> Only buy recycled. But I'm not sure what the relevance is to avoiding
>>> waste; there are plenty of legitimate uses of paper that result in recycling
>>> printing of emails/attachments probably not one of them IMO.
>>
>> I read somewhere that about 25-30% of the world uses toilet paper. If they
>> all learned to clean their bums with water instead of dry paper (like the
>> other 70-75%) the paper savings would knock the email printing abstinence
>> into a cocked hat.
>> And their bums would be cleaner too.
>>
>>
>For sure if I end up back in in the UK or anywhere without I'll be fitting a bum
>gun next time works far better.
>
With the addition of warm water for those icy cold mornings I might
suggest.

--
Geoff
NTV 650

On 8/10/2022 5:07 AM, geoffC wrote:
> 8On 10/08/2022 02:12, Boots wrote:
>>
>>>
>> For sure if I end up back in in the UK or anywhere without I'll be
>> fitting a bum
>> gun next time works far better.
>>
> With the addition of warm water for those icy cold mornings I might
> suggest.
>
My Toto Washlet has adjustments for temperature, as well as front/rear
and pressure.

--
The erstwhile Thomas
FJR1300, R1200GS & ST1100 (in memoriam)

On Wednesday, August 10, 2022 at 2:29:55 PM UTC-4, Turby wrote:

> My Toto Washlet has adjustments for temperature, as well as front/rear
> and pressure.

Have just ordered one of those for our master bathroom remodel.

On 11/08/2022 20:42, Ben Blaney wrote:
>On Wednesday, August 10, 2022 at 2:29:55 PM UTC-4, Turby wrote:
>
>> My Toto Washlet has adjustments for temperature, as well as front/rear
>> and pressure.
>
>Have just ordered one of those for our master bathroom remodel.

Yes, it does look to be the dog's bollocks don't it.
On first reading, I missed the 'and' preceding 'pressure'. That certainly
got my imagination racing.

--
Geoff
NTV 650

On 10/08/2022 09:59, Champ wrote:
> The trees used for paper are farmed like a crop -
> they're grown, cut down, and new ones planted, and so on. There is no
> tree to save.

Worse than that; when the recycling thing started it made pulp from
virgin timber in UK not worth doing, so the two southern paper mills
closed and as pulp was the tops of the trees that weren't good for much
else (except chipboard, mdf) the tops became uneconomic to cut, extract
and transport so stuff 5" and down just got left to rot.

Since then biomass has taken up some of the slack.

On Tue, 9 Aug 2022 13:03:45 -0000 (UTC), geoffC <me@home.nl> wrote:

>On 09/08/2022 14:05, Stephen Packer wrote:
>>On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 12:56:55 UTC+1, geoffC wrote:
>><snip>
>>
>>> Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
>>
>>Only buy recycled. But I'm not sure what the relevance is to avoiding
>>waste; there are plenty of legitimate uses of paper that result in recycling
>>printing of emails/attachments probably not one of them IMO.
>
>I read somewhere that about 25-30% of the world uses toilet paper. If they
> all learned to clean their bums with water instead of dry paper (like the
> other 70-75%) the paper savings would knock the email printing abstinence
> into a cocked hat.
>And their bums would be cleaner too.

But wetter when you put your skiddies back on? How does that work, or
do you just have to fart a lot?

--

-Pip

On 14/08/2022 14:15, Pipl wrote:
>On Tue, 9 Aug 2022 13:03:45 -0000 (UTC), geoffC <me@home.nl> wrote:
>
>>On 09/08/2022 14:05, Stephen Packer wrote:
>>>On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 12:56:55 UTC+1, geoffC wrote:
>>><snip>
>>>
>>>> Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
>>>
>>>Only buy recycled. But I'm not sure what the relevance is to avoiding
>>>waste; there are plenty of legitimate uses of paper that result in recycling
>>>printing of emails/attachments probably not one of them IMO.
>>
>>I read somewhere that about 25-30% of the world uses toilet paper. If they
>> all learned to clean their bums with water instead of dry paper (like the
>> other 70-75%) the paper savings would knock the email printing abstinence
>> into a cocked hat.
>>And their bums would be cleaner too.
>
>But wetter when you put your skiddies back on? How does that work, or
>do you just have to fart a lot?

Good point. There is not a lot of water involved and I believe the better
appliances have a warm air blast to do the drying for you. I just sit
--
Geoff
NTV 650

On 14/08/2022 15:33, geoffC wrote:
>On 14/08/2022 14:15, Pipl wrote:
>>On Tue, 9 Aug 2022 13:03:45 -0000 (UTC), geoffC <me@home.nl> wrote:
>>
>>>On 09/08/2022 14:05, Stephen Packer wrote:
>>>>On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 12:56:55 UTC+1, geoffC wrote:
>>>><snip>
>>>>
>>>>> Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
>>>>
>>>>Only buy recycled. But I'm not sure what the relevance is to avoiding
>>>>waste; there are plenty of legitimate uses of paper that result in recycling
>>>>printing of emails/attachments probably not one of them IMO.
>>>
>>>I read somewhere that about 25-30% of the world uses toilet paper. If they
>>> all learned to clean their bums with water instead of dry paper (like the
>>> other 70-75%) the paper savings would knock the email printing abstinence
>>> into a cocked hat.
>>>And their bums would be cleaner too.
>>
>>But wetter when you put your skiddies back on? How does that work, or
>>do you just have to fart a lot?
>
>Good point. There is not a lot of water involved and I believe the better
> appliances have a warm air blast to do the drying for you. I just sit
on a warm radiator for five minutes
--
Geoff
NTV 650

On 8/9/2022 6:03 AM, geoffC wrote:
> >
> I read somewhere that about 25-30% of the world uses toilet paper. If they
> all learned to clean their bums with water instead of dry paper (like the
> other 70-75%) the paper savings would knock the email printing abstinence
> into a cocked hat.
> And their bums would be cleaner too.
>
I'll never forget riding a train in India. Coming into Varanasi in the
morning, on the outskirts of town, seeing so many people walking through
the fields on their way to work. Lots of people were squatting in the
fields taking dumps. They didn't have toilet paper or water. Their bums
weren't clean.

--
The erstwhile Thomas
FJR1300, R1200GS & ST1100 (in memoriam)

Pipl <pluscher@live.co.uk> wrote:
> On Tue, 9 Aug 2022 13:03:45 -0000 (UTC), geoffC <me@home.nl> wrote:

>>I read somewhere that about 25-30% of the world uses toilet paper. If they
>> all learned to clean their bums with water instead of dry paper (like the
>> other 70-75%) the paper savings would knock the email printing abstinence
>> into a cocked hat.
>>And their bums would be cleaner too.
>
> But wetter when you put your skiddies back on? How does that work, or
> do you just have to fart a lot?

I have had this exact problem when having to use the facilities in
the ME from time to time. No paper, so do as the natives do, but I'm
not wearing Arab dress.

Why do you think the thobe / sirwal combination is so popular? And
I'm not 100% convinced that a good number of them aren't simply going
"commando". Nice cooling breeze from the evaporation, what's not
to like?

--
FJR1300A, GL1000, KLR650A6F, EX250J9A, DR200SE, Vespa Ciao

On 14/08/2022 17:08, Mark Olson wrote:
>Pipl <pluscher@live.co.uk> wrote:
>> On Tue, 9 Aug 2022 13:03:45 -0000 (UTC), geoffC <me@home.nl> wrote:
>
>>>I read somewhere that about 25-30% of the world uses toilet paper. If they
>>> all learned to clean their bums with water instead of dry paper (like the
>>> other 70-75%) the paper savings would knock the email printing abstinence
>>> into a cocked hat.
>>>And their bums would be cleaner too.
>>
>> But wetter when you put your skiddies back on? How does that work, or
>> do you just have to fart a lot?
>
>I have had this exact problem when having to use the facilities in
>the ME from time to time. No paper, so do as the natives do, but I'm
>not wearing Arab dress.
>
>Why do you think the thobe / sirwal combination is so popular? And
>I'm not 100% convinced that a good number of them aren't simply going
>"commando". Nice cooling breeze from the evaporation, what's not
>to like?

And it keeps the flies away from your watermelon too.

--
Geoff
NTV 650

On 14/08/2022 20:15 Pipl penned these words:
> On Tue, 9 Aug 2022 13:03:45 -0000 (UTC), geoffC <me@home.nl> wrote:
>
>> On 09/08/2022 14:05, Stephen Packer wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, 9 August 2022 at 12:56:55 UTC+1, geoffC wrote:
>>> <snip>
>>>
>>>> Where do you stand on toilet paper ?
>>>
>>> Only buy recycled. But I'm not sure what the relevance is to avoiding
>>> waste; there are plenty of legitimate uses of paper that result in recycling
>>> printing of emails/attachments probably not one of them IMO.
>>
>> I read somewhere that about 25-30% of the world uses toilet paper. If they
>> all learned to clean their bums with water instead of dry paper (like the
>> other 70-75%) the paper savings would knock the email printing abstinence
>> into a cocked hat.
>> And their bums would be cleaner too.
>
> But wetter when you put your skiddies back on? How does that work, or
> do you just have to fart a lot?
>
A minimal amount of arsewipe to pat the shiny ring dry.

--
Ian

"Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of
the last priest"