Hi all
slightly dumb question here ... I currently run my home internet/network via ADSL and a Draytek dual band router (2860... something IIRC, I'm away from home ATM) with ADsL Modem.

The latter is getting a bit long in the tooth and I would quite like to be running something like OpenWRT rather than Draytek's custom firmware. The 'obvious' choice for a new router would be the LinkSys WRT3200ACN... except that it does not have an ADSL modem in it.

my Q is simply: is there much difference for my purposes between any of the DSL Modems out there that I could buy cheaply (eBay etc.) and connect between my broadband socket and the WRT3200 router? Do I just need to find one that is ADSL2+ compatible, or is there more to it than that?

Thanks a lot, Jon N

jkn <jkn_gg@nicorp.f9.co.uk> wrote:
> Hi all
> slightly dumb question here ... I currently run my home internet/network via ADSL and a Draytek dual band router (2860... something IIRC, I'm away from home ATM) with ADsL Modem.
>
> The latter is getting a bit long in the tooth and I would quite like to be
> running something like OpenWRT rather than Draytek's custom firmware. The
> 'obvious' choice for a new router would be the LinkSys WRT3200ACN...
> except that it does not have an ADSL modem in it.
>
> my Q is simply: is there much difference for my purposes between any of
> the DSL Modems out there that I could buy cheaply (eBay etc.) and connect
> between my broadband socket and the WRT3200 router? Do I just need to
> find one that is ADSL2+ compatible, or is there more to it than that?

Are you definitely on ADSL and not VDSL (FTTC)?

You could look at the BT Homehub 5a, which are cheap on ebay, have internal
ADSL/VDSL modem, and OpenWRT can be installed natively. There are people on
ebay who sell them preinstalled (search 'homehub openwrt') for about £20.

You can either configure that as an ADSL modem and add your own router, or
an ADSL router and if needs be add an access point or mesh for better wifi
(they have 802.11ac aka Wifi 5 but not Wifi 6)

Somebody has done a super-detailed PDF guide about this - see the installation
guide in the downloads section here:
https://openwrt.org/toh/bt/homehub_v5a

If you just want an ADSL2+ modem, I think any should do. Although there
aren't a whole lot of dedicated modems to choose from - most on ebay are
really modem+routers (anything with wifi is a router). Draytek Vigor have
some (eg Vigor 130, a bit pricey). Originally BT supplied standalone ADSL
modems as part of their engineer installs of ADSL in the early days, but
those are old enough not to be ADSL2 (if they aren't all USB) and I wouldn't
touch them.

Theo

Theo wrote:

> You could look at the BT Homehub 5a, which are cheap on ebay, have internal
> ADSL/VDSL modem, and OpenWRT can be installed natively.

That's what I use, you need to be able to solder tiny wires where tiny
wires aren't intended to be soldered, and have a 3V TTL to serial
dongle, instructions are "simple" but follow them absolutely to the letter.

Unfortunately I'm finding the latest v21.x betas are not working out
well on the HH5a and no response to bug reports, so stick with v19.x

+1 for HH5a on VDSL using OpenWrt 19.07

On 29/07/2021 00:22, Theo wrote:
> jkn <jkn_gg@nicorp.f9.co.uk> wrote:
>> Hi all
>> slightly dumb question here ... I currently run my home internet/network via ADSL and a Draytek dual band router (2860... something IIRC, I'm away from home ATM) with ADsL Modem.
>>

> You could look at the BT Homehub 5a, which are cheap on ebay, have internal
> ADSL/VDSL modem, and OpenWRT can be installed natively. There are people on
> ebay who sell them preinstalled (search 'homehub openwrt') for about £20.
>
> You can either configure that as an ADSL modem and add your own router, or
> an ADSL router and if needs be add an access point or mesh for better wifi
> (they have 802.11ac aka Wifi 5 but not Wifi 6)
>
> Somebody has done a super-detailed PDF guide about this - see the installation
> guide in the downloads section here:
> https://openwrt.org/toh/bt/homehub_v5a
>

> Theo
>

Hi Theo
Thanks, all very useful...

On Thursday, July 29, 2021 at 12:22:15 AM UTC+1, Theo wrote:
> jkn <jkn...@nicorp.f9.co.uk> wrote:
> > Hi all
> > slightly dumb question here ... I currently run my home internet/network via ADSL and a Draytek dual band router (2860... something IIRC, I'm away from home ATM) with ADsL Modem.
> >
> > The latter is getting a bit long in the tooth and I would quite like to be
> > running something like OpenWRT rather than Draytek's custom firmware. The
> > 'obvious' choice for a new router would be the LinkSys WRT3200ACN...
> > except that it does not have an ADSL modem in it.
> >
> > my Q is simply: is there much difference for my purposes between any of
> > the DSL Modems out there that I could buy cheaply (eBay etc.) and connect
> > between my broadband socket and the WRT3200 router? Do I just need to
> > find one that is ADSL2+ compatible, or is there more to it than that?
> Are you definitely on ADSL and not VDSL (FTTC)?

Hmm - good point. I think I am on ADSL (the modem is set to 'auto ADSL/VDSL',
and is using ADSL), but I am a bit unsure about what my line is capable of.
I will check that out a bit further...

>
> You could look at the BT Homehub 5a, which are cheap on ebay, have internal
> ADSL/VDSL modem, and OpenWRT can be installed natively. There are people on
> ebay who sell them preinstalled (search 'homehub openwrt') for about £20.
>

Ha - you have reminded me that I started to go down that route a few years ago,
before I bought the Draytek (it's a 2860ac) and was contemplating an upgrade
from an earlier Draytek.

I did the OpenWRT update OK (I have no problem with that kind of work), but can't
remember why I still went for another Draytek. It might have been as simple as
me wanting six ethernet ports on the front, something like that.

Annoyingly I seem to have cleared out the HH5A (I think it was one of those)
in a foolish more recent mini-purge. As you have reminded me though,
they are easy and cheap to come across.

> You can either configure that as an ADSL modem and add your own router, or
> an ADSL router and if needs be add an access point or mesh for better wifi
> (they have 802.11ac aka Wifi 5 but not Wifi 6)
>
> Somebody has done a super-detailed PDF guide about this - see the installation
> guide in the downloads section here:
> https://openwrt.org/toh/bt/homehub_v5a

Thanks for the pointers. I imagine it was a significantly earlier version of F/W
that I experimented with.
>
> If you just want an ADSL2+ modem, I think any should do. Although there
> aren't a whole lot of dedicated modems to choose from - most on ebay are
> really modem+routers (anything with wifi is a router). Draytek Vigor have
> some (eg Vigor 130, a bit pricey). Originally BT supplied standalone ADSL
> modems as part of their engineer installs of ADSL in the early days, but
> those are old enough not to be ADSL2 (if they aren't all USB) and I wouldn't
> touch them.
>

That's all useful, thanks. I probably should read up a bit more on the OpenWRT
F/ware to check functionality in the areas I am interested in... but if
I am likely to stay on ADSL, and any modem will do, then as you say they
are cheap to pick up. The HH5A reminder is very helpful, thanks a lot

J^n

On Friday, July 30, 2021 at 2:10:53 PM UTC+1, jkn wrote:
> Hi Theo
> Thanks, all very useful...
> On Thursday, July 29, 2021 at 12:22:15 AM UTC+1, Theo wrote:
> > jkn <jkn...@nicorp.f9.co.uk> wrote:
> > > Hi all
> > > slightly dumb question here ... I currently run my home internet/network via ADSL and a Draytek dual band router (2860... something IIRC, I'm away from home ATM) with ADsL Modem.
> > >
> > > The latter is getting a bit long in the tooth and I would quite like to be
> > > running something like OpenWRT rather than Draytek's custom firmware. The
> > > 'obvious' choice for a new router would be the LinkSys WRT3200ACN...
> > > except that it does not have an ADSL modem in it.
> > >
> > > my Q is simply: is there much difference for my purposes between any of
> > > the DSL Modems out there that I could buy cheaply (eBay etc.) and connect
> > > between my broadband socket and the WRT3200 router? Do I just need to
> > > find one that is ADSL2+ compatible, or is there more to it than that?
> > Are you definitely on ADSL and not VDSL (FTTC)?
> Hmm - good point. I think I am on ADSL (the modem is set to 'auto ADSL/VDSL',
> and is using ADSL), but I am a bit unsure about what my line is capable of.
> I will check that out a bit further...
> >
> > You could look at the BT Homehub 5a, which are cheap on ebay, have internal
> > ADSL/VDSL modem, and OpenWRT can be installed natively. There are people on
> > ebay who sell them preinstalled (search 'homehub openwrt') for about £20.
> >
> Ha - you have reminded me that I started to go down that route a few years ago,
> before I bought the Draytek (it's a 2860ac) and was contemplating an upgrade
> from an earlier Draytek.
>
> I did the OpenWRT update OK (I have no problem with that kind of work), but can't
> remember why I still went for another Draytek. It might have been as simple as
> me wanting six ethernet ports on the front, something like that.
>
> Annoyingly I seem to have cleared out the HH5A (I think it was one of those)
> in a foolish more recent mini-purge. As you have reminded me though,
> they are easy and cheap to come across.
> > You can either configure that as an ADSL modem and add your own router, or
> > an ADSL router and if needs be add an access point or mesh for better wifi
> > (they have 802.11ac aka Wifi 5 but not Wifi 6)
> >
> > Somebody has done a super-detailed PDF guide about this - see the installation
> > guide in the downloads section here:
> > https://openwrt.org/toh/bt/homehub_v5a
> Thanks for the pointers. I imagine it was a significantly earlier version of F/W
> that I experimented with.
> >
> > If you just want an ADSL2+ modem, I think any should do. Although there
> > aren't a whole lot of dedicated modems to choose from - most on ebay are
> > really modem+routers (anything with wifi is a router). Draytek Vigor have
> > some (eg Vigor 130, a bit pricey). Originally BT supplied standalone ADSL
> > modems as part of their engineer installs of ADSL in the early days, but
> > those are old enough not to be ADSL2 (if they aren't all USB) and I wouldn't
> > touch them.
> >
> That's all useful, thanks. I probably should read up a bit more on the OpenWRT
> F/ware to check functionality in the areas I am interested in... but if
> I am likely to stay on ADSL, and any modem will do, then as you say they
> are cheap to pick up. The HH5A reminder is very helpful, thanks a lot
>
> J^n

Slightly OT followup to my own posting...

- OK, I can see that I do indeed only have ADSL rather than VDSL, although
it looks like my exchange has VDSL. I'm not particularly in a rush to pay more
for this at the moment. However...

- what with my modem mutterings, I was thinking about the quality of the
connection from the master socket to the modem (or modem/router etc.). I
currently have telephone cable wiring from the NTE5 to an extension
socket, and then a standard 'modem cable' from there with an RJ-11 plug
to go into the Draytek.

It would be easy to replace this with some proper twisted pair (eg. CAT5e)
going straight from the NTE5 to an RJ-11 plug, into either the Draytek or
HH5A or Modem etc. I don't have any great issue with speeds at the moment,
but is there likely to be much mileage in doing this, perhaps while I'm
faffing around with other things...?

Cheers, J^n

jkn <jkn_gg@nicorp.f9.co.uk> wrote:
> It would be easy to replace this with some proper twisted pair (eg. CAT5e)
> going straight from the NTE5 to an RJ-11 plug, into either the Draytek or
> HH5A or Modem etc. I don't have any great issue with speeds at the moment,
> but is there likely to be much mileage in doing this, perhaps while I'm
> faffing around with other things...?

It depends on how grotty your wiring is and what kind of speed you're
getting - ADSL theoretically goes up to 24Mbps but many people get more like
17 if the line isn't too long. But it couldn't hurt to do this, and might
also improve your reliability to other sources of electrical noise.

You could do a test by plugging your router directly into the test socket
that's revealed by unscrewing the faceplate on the NTE5 - that causes your
wiring to be disconnected. If that test socket improves things, you should
see similar using your cat5.

Theo

On Sunday, August 1, 2021 at 10:40:14 AM UTC+1, Theo wrote:
> jkn <jkn...@nicorp.f9.co.uk> wrote:
> > It would be easy to replace this with some proper twisted pair (eg. CAT5e)
> > going straight from the NTE5 to an RJ-11 plug, into either the Draytek or
> > HH5A or Modem etc. I don't have any great issue with speeds at the moment,
> > but is there likely to be much mileage in doing this, perhaps while I'm
> > faffing around with other things...?
> It depends on how grotty your wiring is and what kind of speed you're
> getting - ADSL theoretically goes up to 24Mbps but many people get more like
> 17 if the line isn't too long. But it couldn't hurt to do this, and might
> also improve your reliability to other sources of electrical noise.
>
> You could do a test by plugging your router directly into the test socket
> that's revealed by unscrewing the faceplate on the NTE5 - that causes your
> wiring to be disconnected. If that test socket improves things, you should
> see similar using your cat5.
>
> Theo

Hi Theo
yeah, that's a plan... I get something like 5 to 8Mbps on ADSL2+, I actually
thought that was about standard, but on checking I see that is for ADSL, hmm.

I will check with my ISP to see if I am actually connected to ADSL2+ capable
equipment and whether I should be getting higher speeds. I can't quite remember
who installed my NTE5 (whistle...) but I am sure they made an excellent job.

This is all a bit tangential to my original query but still useful stuff ... thanks

J^n