I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where nothing
else would grow. The results were spectacular but have declined badly over
the years.
When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of digging the
existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job easier.
Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and kill the new wild
flowers?

Thanks

Steve

On Tue, 29 Jun 2021 01:25:50 +0100, "Mr Pounder Esquire"
<MrPounder@RationalThought.com> wrote:

>I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where nothing
>else would grow. The results were spectacular but have declined badly over
>the years.
>When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
>I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of digging the
>existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
>I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job easier.
>Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and kill the new wild
>flowers?
>
>Thanks
>
>Steve
>
There are several types of Resolva -
https://www.gardenhealth.com/our-brands/resolva
The Xpress and Path-and-Drive say they are glyphosate-free, while the
Pro-Xtra contains glyphosate. They should all be OK as any weedkiller
in them will degrade in the soil after a few weeks, possibly faster.
But I'd avoid the Weed Preventer.

If you treat with a weedkiller, you could then just leave the plants
to die down and rot away naturally, but that would look rather messy
for quite a while. Alternatively, let them die down and dig them in,
thus returning some goodness to the soil.

If you're going to dig the bed over, it would be worth getting some
compost from a garden centre (or even your local recycling depot if
they recycle garden waste), and spreading that over the bed, first, to
improve the soil's fertility and replace what has been lost over the
last few years.

Having said that, I believe truly wild flowers do best in rather poor
soil. People wishing to establish a wild flower meadow, for example,
are encouraged to strip off the top couple of inches of soil, first,
as it's often too rich, and other plants will outgrow and swamp the
wild flowers. But from what you're saying, that doesn't seem to be the
case here.

--
Chris

Gardening in West Cornwall, very mild, sheltered
from the West, but open to the North and East.

On 29/06/2021 01:25, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
> I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where nothing
> else would grow. The results were spectacular but have declined badly over
> the years.
> When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
> I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of digging the
> existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
> I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job easier.
> Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and kill the new wild
> flowers?
>
Glyphosate only will not poison the soil - it breaks down on contact with it

BUT

I have been clearing out utterly neglected beds and really having the
weed tops to yank on means I can get (most of) the roots out.

Killing the plants first simply means you have dead roots in the soil

I reckon a square meter an hour if the weeds are well settled in among
plants

> Thanks
>
> Steve
>
>

--
“But what a weak barrier is truth when it stands in the way of an
hypothesis!”

Mary Wollstonecraft

On 29/06/2021 07:10, Chris Hogg wrote:
> On Tue, 29 Jun 2021 01:25:50 +0100, "Mr Pounder Esquire"
> <MrPounder@RationalThought.com> wrote:
>
>> I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where nothing
>> else would grow. The results were spectacular but have declined badly over
>> the years.
>> When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
>> I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of digging the
>> existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
>> I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job easier.
>> Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and kill the new wild
>> flowers?
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Steve
>>
> There are several types of Resolva -
> https://www.gardenhealth.com/our-brands/resolva
> The Xpress and Path-and-Drive say they are glyphosate-free, while the
> Pro-Xtra contains glyphosate. They should all be OK as any weedkiller
> in them will degrade in the soil after a few weeks, possibly faster.
> But I'd avoid the Weed Preventer.

Avoid any that claim to be for paths since they tend to include a
persistent component and/or a germination inhibitor. Though modern
formulations are nowhere near as effective as they used to be. Simazine
would last all season with one application. It has now been banned.
>
> If you treat with a weedkiller, you could then just leave the plants
> to die down and rot away naturally, but that would look rather messy
> for quite a while. Alternatively, let them die down and dig them in,
> thus returning some goodness to the soil.

Glyphosate is the method of choice for clearing land. It deactivates by
adsorbtion onto clay almost immediately and kills any green plants it
touches (apart from holly and ivy seedlings and IME buttercup).

You can wait until it is tinder dry at this time of year and then make a
fire break around it and flash burn it to get a second kill for free.
Green shoots are much easier to see against scorched earth. Any holly
and ivy that survived the chemical attack doesn't survive in a fire!

Buttercup is the one thing that I never quite see off this way. The
others are ground elder, horsetail and bindweed.
>
> If you're going to dig the bed over, it would be worth getting some
> compost from a garden centre (or even your local recycling depot if
> they recycle garden waste), and spreading that over the bed, first, to
> improve the soil's fertility and replace what has been lost over the
> last few years.

Wildflowers thrive in depleted soil. If you make it too fertile then
they will be overrun by other more vigorous plants and weeds.

> Having said that, I believe truly wild flowers do best in rather poor
> soil. People wishing to establish a wild flower meadow, for example,
> are encouraged to strip off the top couple of inches of soil, first,
> as it's often too rich, and other plants will outgrow and swamp the
> wild flowers. But from what you're saying, that doesn't seem to be the
> case here.

It would help to know why the wild flowers declined. Overrun by couch
grass or some other invasive weed or no longer self replacing. Once
established they tend to set enough seed to keep on recurring.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
> I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where
> nothing else would grow. The results were spectacular but have
> declined badly over the years.
> When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
> I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of
> digging the existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
> I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job
> easier. Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and
> kill the new wild flowers?
>
> Thanks
>
> Steve

Thanks for the replies, I now know what to do.

On Tue, 29 Jun 2021 11:39:37 +0100, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

> Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
>> I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where
>> nothing else would grow. The results were spectacular but have
>> declined badly over the years.
>> When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
>> I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of
>> digging the existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
>> I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job
>> easier. Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and
>> kill the new wild flowers?
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Steve
>
> Thanks for the replies, I now know what to do.

Depends in size and time span, but you could cover in carpet or black
plastic. Even with that or the methods already suggested, then the weed
seeds will germinate.
--
Jim S

On 29/06/2021 13:12, Jim S wrote:
> On Tue, 29 Jun 2021 11:39:37 +0100, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
>
>> Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
>>> I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where
>>> nothing else would grow. The results were spectacular but have
>>> declined badly over the years.
>>> When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
>>> I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of
>>> digging the existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
>>> I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job
>>> easier. Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and
>>> kill the new wild flowers?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> Steve
>>
>> Thanks for the replies, I now know what to do.
>
> Depends in size and time span, but you could cover in carpet or black
> plastic. Even with that or the methods already suggested, then the weed
> seeds will germinate.
>
WHY?
I'd have thought that if you leave them to seed them pull them out, or
even mow them off close and scarify the soil after adding some more wild
flower seede then you should get the result you want. After all in
nature they just reseed themselves without weedkiller

On 29/06/2021 15:31, David Hill wrote:
> On 29/06/2021 13:12, Jim S wrote:
>> On Tue, 29 Jun 2021 11:39:37 +0100, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
>>
>>> Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
>>>> I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where
>>>> nothing else would grow. The results were spectacular but have
>>>> declined badly over the years.
>>>> When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
>>>> I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of
>>>> digging the existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
>>>> I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job
>>>> easier. Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and
>>>> kill the new wild flowers?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks
>>>>
>>>> Steve
>>>
>>> Thanks for the replies, I now know what to do.
>>
>> Depends in size and time span, but you could cover in carpet or black
>> plastic. Even with that or the methods already suggested, then the weed
>> seeds will germinate.
>>
> WHY?
> I'd have thought that if you leave them to seed them pull them out, or
> even mow them off close and scarify the soil after adding some more wild
> flower seede then you should get the result you want. After all in
> nature they just reseed themselves without weedkiller

It depends a lot what other weeds are competing for light. Nettles and
Himalayan balsam can swamp everything else out in fairly short order.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On 29/06/2021 16:00, Martin Brown wrote:
> On 29/06/2021 15:31, David Hill wrote:
>> On 29/06/2021 13:12, Jim S wrote:
>>> On Tue, 29 Jun 2021 11:39:37 +0100, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
>>>
>>>> Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
>>>>> I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where
>>>>> nothing else would grow. The results were spectacular but have
>>>>> declined badly over the years.
>>>>> When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
>>>>> I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of
>>>>> digging the existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
>>>>> I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job
>>>>> easier. Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and
>>>>> kill the new wild flowers?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>
>>>>> Steve
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for the replies, I now know what to do.
>>>
>>> Depends in size and time span, but you could cover in carpet or black
>>> plastic. Even with that or the methods already suggested, then the weed
>>> seeds will germinate.
>>>
>> WHY?
>> I'd have thought that if you leave them to seed them pull them out, or
>> even mow them off close and scarify the soil after adding some more
>> wild flower seede then you should get the result you want. After all
>> in nature they just reseed themselves without weedkiller
>
> It depends a lot what other weeds are competing for light. Nettles and
> Himalayan balsam can swamp everything else out in fairly short order.
>
but the OP said that it was a beads where nothing would grow, and now
his first sowintg is now declining.

On 29/06/2021 20:46, David Hill wrote:
> On 29/06/2021 16:00, Martin Brown wrote:
>> On 29/06/2021 15:31, David Hill wrote:
>>> On 29/06/2021 13:12, Jim S wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 29 Jun 2021 11:39:37 +0100, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
>>>>>> I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where
>>>>>> nothing else would grow. The results were spectacular but have
>>>>>> declined badly over the years.
>>>>>> When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
>>>>>> I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of
>>>>>> digging the existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
>>>>>> I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job
>>>>>> easier. Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and
>>>>>> kill the new wild flowers?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Steve
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks for the replies, I now know what to do.
>>>>
>>>> Depends in size and time span, but you could cover in carpet or black
>>>> plastic. Even with that or the methods already suggested, then the weed
>>>> seeds will germinate.
>>>>
>>> WHY?
>>> I'd have thought that if you leave them to seed them pull them out,
>>> or even mow them off close and scarify the soil after adding some
>>> more wild flower seede then you should get the result you want. After
>>> all in nature they just reseed themselves without weedkiller
>>
>> It depends a lot what other weeds are competing for light. Nettles and
>> Himalayan balsam can swamp everything else out in fairly short order.
>>
> but the OP said that it was a beads where nothing would grow, and now
> his first sowintg is now declining.

Yes, more detail on exactly what that meant would be helpful.

If it's not growing well why does it need clearing?

--
"Corbyn talks about equality, justice, opportunity, health care, peace,
community, compassion, investment, security, housing...."
"What kind of person is not interested in those things?"

"Jeremy Corbyn?"

On 30/06/2021 08:42, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 29/06/2021 20:46, David Hill wrote:
>> On 29/06/2021 16:00, Martin Brown wrote:
>>> On 29/06/2021 15:31, David Hill wrote:

>>>> I'd have thought that if you leave them to seed them pull them out,
>>>> or even mow them off close and scarify the soil after adding some
>>>> more wild flower seede then you should get the result you want.
>>>> After all in nature they just reseed themselves without weedkiller
>>>
>>> It depends a lot what other weeds are competing for light. Nettles
>>> and Himalayan balsam can swamp everything else out in fairly short
>>> order.
>>>
>> but the OP said that it was a beads where nothing would grow, and now
>> his first sowintg is now declining.
>
> Yes, more detail on exactly what that meant would be helpful.
>
> If it's not growing well why does it need clearing?

Probably because something else is growing very well instead! Brambles
tend to take over any land that isn't maintained for a long period here.

It is a question that only the OP can answer. Adding some yellow rattle
can be quite effective to weaken the grass for a wildflower meadow.

https://wildseed.co.uk/page/using-yellow-rattle-to-increase-species-diversity

Not convinced that anything really suppresses couch grass effectively
short of digging the blasted stuff out at every opportunity.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On 01/07/2021 09:48, Martin Brown wrote:
> Probably because something else is growing very well instead! Brambles
> tend to take over any land that isn't maintained for a long period here.
>
> It is a question that only the OP can answer. Adding some yellow rattle
> can be quite effective to weaken the grass for a wildflower meadow.
>
> https://wildseed.co.uk/page/using-yellow-rattle-to-increase-species-diversity
>
>
> Not convinced that anything really suppresses couch grass effectively
> short of digging the blasted stuff out at every opportunity.

Yellow rattle is great.

I bought some mixed seed for a quarter of our land. We're on fairly
fertile but often damp clay; the grass on our boundary (we back onto
farmland) is 4ft high. In the wildflower patch it's sparse and 2ft.

All I did was mow it short, then scarify before seeding.

Last autumn I cut the lot off at the roots and let it dry, hay style,
before raking it up. (I must get a scythe, it's a bit much with shears).
I then ran the lawnmower over it to make it short, collecting as I went.

This is it's second summer and I'm really pleased.

Andy

On Tue, 29 Jun 2021 01:25:50 +0100, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

> I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where
> nothing else would grow. The results were spectacular but have declined
> badly over the years.
> When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
> I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of digging
> the existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
> I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job
> easier. Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and kill
> the new wild flowers?
>
> Thanks
>
> Steve

Just a thought.

As it is a "once in several years" thing could you get someone in to
prepare the bed for you?

Cheers

Dave R

--
Dell Latitude 7280 with Full HD and Thunderbolt (woo hoo)

On 02/07/2021 11:15, David wrote:
> On Tue, 29 Jun 2021 01:25:50 +0100, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
>
>> I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where
>> nothing else would grow. The results were spectacular but have declined
>> badly over the years.
>> When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
>> I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of digging
>> the existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
>> I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job
>> easier. Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and kill
>> the new wild flowers?
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Steve
>
> Just a thought.
>
> As it is a "once in several years" thing could you get someone in to
> prepare the bed for you?
>
Also, depending on what flavour of 'not so good' you have, hand digging
with a fork and a pair of gloves is light aerobic exercise that is
pretty suitable for us old crocks.

> Cheers
>
>
> Dave R
>
>

--
“when things get difficult you just have to lie”

― Jean Claud Jüncker

On Tue, 29 Jun 2021 13:12:57 +0100, Jim S wrote:

> On Tue, 29 Jun 2021 11:39:37 +0100, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
>
>> Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
>>> I planted some wild flower seed in a flower bed a few years where
>>> nothing else would grow. The results were spectacular but have
>>> declined badly over the years.
>>> When the time is right I intend to plant more seeds for next year.
>>> I've not been too good and don't really relish the prospect of
>>> digging the existing flowers up this year. But I will have to do it.
>>> I've thought about using Resova weed killer first to make the job
>>> easier. Question is, if I use Resolva will it poison the soil and
>>> kill the new wild flowers?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> Steve
>>
>> Thanks for the replies, I now know what to do.
>
> Depends in size and time span, but you could cover in carpet or black
> plastic. Even with that or the methods already suggested, then the weed
> seeds will germinate.

Having had a chance to let Resolva without Glyphosate have a go - don't
bother. It made no impression on ivy (which the old version did well) and
even has little effect to most common weeds - and it's expensive.
--
Jim S