On Sun, 5 Mar 2023 15:32:07 +0000, grinch <grinch@sommewhere.com>
wrote:

>On 04/03/2023 13:47, grinch wrote:
>> On 03/03/2023 12:18, Theo wrote:
>>> Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> Zen offer a Fritzbox 7530 router to support their VoIP product.  Does
>>>> anybody here know whether the protocol they use is proprietary?
>>>>
>>>> Further, has anybody here any experience with using their "Digital
>>>> Voice" product with an ordinary router and a standard VoIP phone (such
>>>> as the SNOM300) ?
>>>
>>> I think the conclusion from posts here was that it's SIP, but it's a
>>> rebrand
>>> of a service from BT, and they won't tell you the credentials to use your
>>> own VOIP hardware.  So it's their router or no voice.
>>>
>>
>> You are correct, but its trivially simple to get the information you
>> need. From the fritzbox http://192.168.178.1/#sip_edit for the
>> user/server details and the password can be found from the telephony
>> tech part of your personal account login on the Zen website.
>>
>
>You can no longer get you VoIP password from the new Zen logon so what
>I have said will not work.

Presumably if you're not happy with Zen you could ask them for a MAC
code and migrate everything to another ISP? Wouldn't that migrate the
phone service too?

Rod.

On 06/03/2023 08:38, Roderick Stewart wrote:
> On Sun, 5 Mar 2023 15:32:07 +0000, grinch <grinch@sommewhere.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 04/03/2023 13:47, grinch wrote:
>>> On 03/03/2023 12:18, Theo wrote:
>>>> Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> Zen offer a Fritzbox 7530 router to support their VoIP product.  Does
>>>>> anybody here know whether the protocol they use is proprietary?
>>>>>
>>>>> Further, has anybody here any experience with using their "Digital
>>>>> Voice" product with an ordinary router and a standard VoIP phone (such
>>>>> as the SNOM300) ?
>>>> I think the conclusion from posts here was that it's SIP, but it's a
>>>> rebrand
>>>> of a service from BT, and they won't tell you the credentials to use your
>>>> own VOIP hardware.  So it's their router or no voice.
>>>>
>>> You are correct, but its trivially simple to get the information you
>>> need. From the fritzbox http://192.168.178.1/#sip_edit for the
>>> user/server details and the password can be found from the telephony
>>> tech part of your personal account login on the Zen website.
>>>
>> You can no longer get you VoIP password from the new Zen logon so what
>> I have said will not work.
> Presumably if you're not happy with Zen you could ask them for a MAC
> code and migrate everything to another ISP? Wouldn't that migrate the
> phone service too?
>

Yes, but often to another propriety VoIP service

On 06/03/2023 08:38, Roderick Stewart wrote:
> On Sun, 5 Mar 2023 15:32:07 +0000, grinch <grinch@sommewhere.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 04/03/2023 13:47, grinch wrote:
>>> On 03/03/2023 12:18, Theo wrote:
>>>> Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> Zen offer a Fritzbox 7530 router to support their VoIP product.  Does
>>>>> anybody here know whether the protocol they use is proprietary?
>>>>>
>>>>> Further, has anybody here any experience with using their "Digital
>>>>> Voice" product with an ordinary router and a standard VoIP phone (such
>>>>> as the SNOM300) ?
>>>>
>>>> I think the conclusion from posts here was that it's SIP, but it's a
>>>> rebrand
>>>> of a service from BT, and they won't tell you the credentials to use your
>>>> own VOIP hardware.  So it's their router or no voice.
>>>>
>>>
>>> You are correct, but its trivially simple to get the information you
>>> need. From the fritzbox http://192.168.178.1/#sip_edit for the
>>> user/server details and the password can be found from the telephony
>>> tech part of your personal account login on the Zen website.
>>>
>>
>> You can no longer get you VoIP password from the new Zen logon so what
>> I have said will not work.
>
> Presumably if you're not happy with Zen you could ask them for a MAC
> code and migrate everything to another ISP? Wouldn't that migrate the
> phone service too?
>
> Rod.
I am personally happy with Zen but I presume you are right.

I was going to use sipgate but as the only reason we kept our landline
was to prevent certain people getting our mobile numbers. The VoIP
service is incoming only really.

The answering machine is a good way of screening calls.

On Mon, 6 Mar 2023 08:43:07 +0000, Mark Carver
<mark.carver@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>On 06/03/2023 08:38, Roderick Stewart wrote:
>> On Sun, 5 Mar 2023 15:32:07 +0000, grinch <grinch@sommewhere.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 04/03/2023 13:47, grinch wrote:
>>>> On 03/03/2023 12:18, Theo wrote:
>>>>> Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> Zen offer a Fritzbox 7530 router to support their VoIP product.  Does
>>>>>> anybody here know whether the protocol they use is proprietary?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Further, has anybody here any experience with using their "Digital
>>>>>> Voice" product with an ordinary router and a standard VoIP phone (such
>>>>>> as the SNOM300) ?
>>>>> I think the conclusion from posts here was that it's SIP, but it's a
>>>>> rebrand
>>>>> of a service from BT, and they won't tell you the credentials to use your
>>>>> own VOIP hardware.  So it's their router or no voice.
>>>>>
>>>> You are correct, but its trivially simple to get the information you
>>>> need. From the fritzbox http://192.168.178.1/#sip_edit for the
>>>> user/server details and the password can be found from the telephony
>>>> tech part of your personal account login on the Zen website.
>>>>
>>> You can no longer get you VoIP password from the new Zen logon so what
>>> I have said will not work.
>> Presumably if you're not happy with Zen you could ask them for a MAC
>> code and migrate everything to another ISP? Wouldn't that migrate the
>> phone service too?
>>
>
>Yes, but often to another propriety VoIP service

Who cares, as long as it works?

Rod.

On 06/03/2023 13:22, Roderick Stewart wrote:
> On Mon, 6 Mar 2023 08:43:07 +0000, Mark Carver
> <mark.carver@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On 06/03/2023 08:38, Roderick Stewart wrote:
>>> On Sun, 5 Mar 2023 15:32:07 +0000, grinch <grinch@sommewhere.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 04/03/2023 13:47, grinch wrote:
>>>>> On 03/03/2023 12:18, Theo wrote:
>>>>>> Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> Zen offer a Fritzbox 7530 router to support their VoIP product.  Does
>>>>>>> anybody here know whether the protocol they use is proprietary?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Further, has anybody here any experience with using their "Digital
>>>>>>> Voice" product with an ordinary router and a standard VoIP phone (such
>>>>>>> as the SNOM300) ?
>>>>>> I think the conclusion from posts here was that it's SIP, but it's a
>>>>>> rebrand
>>>>>> of a service from BT, and they won't tell you the credentials to use your
>>>>>> own VOIP hardware.  So it's their router or no voice.
>>>>>>
>>>>> You are correct, but its trivially simple to get the information you
>>>>> need. From the fritzbox http://192.168.178.1/#sip_edit for the
>>>>> user/server details and the password can be found from the telephony
>>>>> tech part of your personal account login on the Zen website.
>>>>>
>>>> You can no longer get you VoIP password from the new Zen logon so what
>>>> I have said will not work.
>>> Presumably if you're not happy with Zen you could ask them for a MAC
>>> code and migrate everything to another ISP? Wouldn't that migrate the
>>> phone service too?
>>>
>> Yes, but often to another propriety VoIP service
> Who cares, as long as it works?
Well, this sub thread is all about the ability to use your own hardware
rather than ISP supplied, or perhaps one of us has mis understood ?

On Mon, 6 Mar 2023 13:29:29 +0000, Mark Carver
<mark.carver@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>On 06/03/2023 13:22, Roderick Stewart wrote:
>> On Mon, 6 Mar 2023 08:43:07 +0000, Mark Carver
>> <mark.carver@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> On 06/03/2023 08:38, Roderick Stewart wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 5 Mar 2023 15:32:07 +0000, grinch <grinch@sommewhere.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 04/03/2023 13:47, grinch wrote:
>>>>>> On 03/03/2023 12:18, Theo wrote:
>>>>>>> Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Zen offer a Fritzbox 7530 router to support their VoIP product.  Does
>>>>>>>> anybody here know whether the protocol they use is proprietary?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Further, has anybody here any experience with using their "Digital
>>>>>>>> Voice" product with an ordinary router and a standard VoIP phone (such
>>>>>>>> as the SNOM300) ?
>>>>>>> I think the conclusion from posts here was that it's SIP, but it's a
>>>>>>> rebrand
>>>>>>> of a service from BT, and they won't tell you the credentials to use your
>>>>>>> own VOIP hardware.  So it's their router or no voice.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> You are correct, but its trivially simple to get the information you
>>>>>> need. From the fritzbox http://192.168.178.1/#sip_edit for the
>>>>>> user/server details and the password can be found from the telephony
>>>>>> tech part of your personal account login on the Zen website.
>>>>>>
>>>>> You can no longer get you VoIP password from the new Zen logon so what
>>>>> I have said will not work.
>>>> Presumably if you're not happy with Zen you could ask them for a MAC
>>>> code and migrate everything to another ISP? Wouldn't that migrate the
>>>> phone service too?
>>>>
>>> Yes, but often to another propriety VoIP service
>> Who cares, as long as it works?
>Well, this sub thread is all about the ability to use your own hardware
>rather than ISP supplied, or perhaps one of us has mis understood ?

I understand that, but what puzzles me is why anyone wouldn't want to
use the hardware supplied by the ISP if it does the job. It would make
sense to use something else if the supplied hardware was deficient in
some way, but what sort of deficiency are we considering here -
reliability? wi-fi coverage? or lack of some special feature that you
absolutely cannot manage without? Most people will just want the
ability to do the usual things like browse web pages and stream TV
programmes, in which case it would surely be easiest to use the kit
provided by the ISP, as it'll have been tested on their system, and
detailed help will be readily available if there are any problems.

Rod.

In article <ic8c0i1jlm37r8s5nslm2jnl5b10ki58vs@4ax.com>,
Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:

> I understand that, but what puzzles me is why anyone wouldn't want
> to use the hardware supplied by the ISP if it does the job. It
> would make sense to use something else if the supplied hardware was
> deficient in some way, but what sort of deficiency are we
> considering here - reliability? wi-fi coverage? or lack of some
> special feature that you absolutely cannot manage without?

I'm sure for "most people" you are correct.

Myself, I use a few slightly less usual features like;
DHCP MAC address reservations.
Multiple Guest account Wi-Fi.
Mac filtering on Wi-Fi (yes, I know....)

Essential? No but I'd not be happy without them.
Then there is how well a router does things like DHCP reservations.

On my ISP router yes you can do it but it's very cumbersome and
quirky. You can only add a pairing for devices the normal router DHCP
has no record of. So if you connect something and then later wish to
set or change the ip address allocation you first have to get the
router to forget the device. That means disconnecting the device and
re-booting the router and doing that is painfully slow.

Similarly, my isp router does not give you the ability to decide if
the guest wi-fi accounts can "see" the main Lan items or not and the
guest accounts cannot be set to use IP addresses on a different
scheme to the main LAN. My own router can.

I don't consider any of those features unreasonable to expect from a
decent router but I agree, they're not common.

Bob.

On 06/03/2023 19:55, Bob Latham wrote:
> In article <ic8c0i1jlm37r8s5nslm2jnl5b10ki58vs@4ax.com>,
> Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> I understand that, but what puzzles me is why anyone wouldn't want
>> to use the hardware supplied by the ISP if it does the job. It
>> would make sense to use something else if the supplied hardware was
>> deficient in some way, but what sort of deficiency are we
>> considering here - reliability? wi-fi coverage? or lack of some
>> special feature that you absolutely cannot manage without?
> I'm sure for "most people" you are correct.
>
> Myself, I use a few slightly less usual features like;
> DHCP MAC address reservations.
> Multiple Guest account Wi-Fi.
> Mac filtering on Wi-Fi (yes, I know....)
>
> Essential? No but I'd not be happy without them.
> Then there is how well a router does things like DHCP reservations.
>
> On my ISP router yes you can do it but it's very cumbersome and
> quirky. You can only add a pairing for devices the normal router DHCP
> has no record of. So if you connect something and then later wish to
> set or change the ip address allocation you first have to get the
> router to forget the device. That means disconnecting the device and
> re-booting the router and doing that is painfully slow.
>
> Similarly, my isp router does not give you the ability to decide if
> the guest wi-fi accounts can "see" the main Lan items or not and the
> guest accounts cannot be set to use IP addresses on a different
> scheme to the main LAN. My own router can.
>
> I don't consider any of those features unreasonable to expect from a
> decent router but I agree, they're not common.
>
There's also the inability of some ISP supplied routers to set
alternative DNS servers.

Our lad is on Sky, there are a couple of websites (nothing dodgy either)
that Sky's DNS servers can't 'see', impossible to change the default
(other than setting it client side).

On Mon, 06 Mar 2023 19:55:10 +0000 (GMT), Bob Latham
<bob@sick-of-spam.invalid> wrote:

>> I understand that, but what puzzles me is why anyone wouldn't want
>> to use the hardware supplied by the ISP if it does the job. It
>> would make sense to use something else if the supplied hardware was
>> deficient in some way, but what sort of deficiency are we
>> considering here - reliability? wi-fi coverage? or lack of some
>> special feature that you absolutely cannot manage without?
>
>I'm sure for "most people" you are correct.
>
>Myself, I use a few slightly less usual features like;
>DHCP MAC address reservations.
>Multiple Guest account Wi-Fi.
>Mac filtering on Wi-Fi (yes, I know....)
>
>Essential? No but I'd not be happy without them.
>Then there is how well a router does things like DHCP reservations.

Fair enough. You do whatever works for you. I haven't investigated
everything the Zen Fritzbox can do but I think it can manage a few
extras. The most customisation I've done is to change the local IP
address range and the SSID to what I had been using with the previous
router, deciding it would be less bother than changing all my
connected devices. I also like to use a fixed range of local addresses
for things that are actually fixed, such as the main desktop, TV
streamers etc, and allow DHCP to do its thing with laptops and phones
and everything else, and the Fritzbox can do this easily, so I'm happy
with that too.

When the internet was new, it was all fun and exciting and
interesting, so I read about it and experimented and tinkered about
with settings that should perhaps really be left alone, as I expect we
all do with new stuff, but eventually it has become a basic utility,
and all I want is something that just works. Maybe this means I'm
becoming more sensible, or maybe it's just a feature of old age.

Rod.

Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> Fair enough. You do whatever works for you. I haven't investigated
> everything the Zen Fritzbox can do but I think it can manage a few
> extras. The most customisation I've done is to change the local IP
> address range and the SSID to what I had been using with the previous
> router, deciding it would be less bother than changing all my
> connected devices. I also like to use a fixed range of local addresses
> for things that are actually fixed, such as the main desktop, TV
> streamers etc, and allow DHCP to do its thing with laptops and phones
> and everything else, and the Fritzbox can do this easily, so I'm happy
> with that too.

It may be that Zen's Fritzbox is fairly configurable as these things go, so
a lot of what people might want to do is possible.

But a lot of ISP routers are built to be cheap and have minimal
configuration options. That's my experience of Sky, BT and Plusnet's, for
example. Often they're developed in house and not even made by a recognised
brand.

The problem with VOIP causing a lockin is that you aren't then free to
switch them out for a more capable router to suit your requirements - even
the same Fritzbox you got from Zen might be a good upgrade compared with the
kind of junky cheap Technicolor router you used to get from Plusnet.

But if you do that you lose voice calls, which may make that a nonstarter.
At the end of the day you should not need to change ISP to get a better
router.

> When the internet was new, it was all fun and exciting and
> interesting, so I read about it and experimented and tinkered about
> with settings that should perhaps really be left alone, as I expect we
> all do with new stuff, but eventually it has become a basic utility,
> and all I want is something that just works. Maybe this means I'm
> becoming more sensible, or maybe it's just a feature of old age.

Which is fine, and probably the majority view, but not everyone is the same.

Theo

On Tue 07/03/2023 09:24, Roderick Stewart wrote:
> On Mon, 06 Mar 2023 19:55:10 +0000 (GMT), Bob Latham
> <bob@sick-of-spam.invalid> wrote:
>
>>> I understand that, but what puzzles me is why anyone wouldn't want
>>> to use the hardware supplied by the ISP if it does the job. It
>>> would make sense to use something else if the supplied hardware was
>>> deficient in some way, but what sort of deficiency are we
>>> considering here - reliability? wi-fi coverage? or lack of some
>>> special feature that you absolutely cannot manage without?
>>
>> I'm sure for "most people" you are correct.
>>
>> Myself, I use a few slightly less usual features like;
>> DHCP MAC address reservations.
>> Multiple Guest account Wi-Fi.
>> Mac filtering on Wi-Fi (yes, I know....)
>>
>> Essential? No but I'd not be happy without them.
>> Then there is how well a router does things like DHCP reservations.
>
> Fair enough. You do whatever works for you. I haven't investigated
> everything the Zen Fritzbox can do but I think it can manage a few
> extras. The most customisation I've done is to change the local IP
> address range and the SSID to what I had been using with the previous
> router, deciding it would be less bother than changing all my
> connected devices. I also like to use a fixed range of local addresses
> for things that are actually fixed, such as the main desktop, TV
> streamers etc, and allow DHCP to do its thing with laptops and phones
> and everything else, and the Fritzbox can do this easily, so I'm happy
> with that too.
>
> When the internet was new, it was all fun and exciting and
> interesting, so I read about it and experimented and tinkered about
> with settings that should perhaps really be left alone, as I expect we
> all do with new stuff, but eventually it has become a basic utility,
> and all I want is something that just works. Maybe this means I'm
> becoming more sensible, or maybe it's just a feature of old age.
>

Does it allow you to set your own domestic network encryption password?

On Tue 07/03/2023 10:27, Theo wrote:
> Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>> Fair enough. You do whatever works for you. I haven't investigated
>> everything the Zen Fritzbox can do but I think it can manage a few
>> extras. The most customisation I've done is to change the local IP
>> address range and the SSID to what I had been using with the previous
>> router, deciding it would be less bother than changing all my
>> connected devices. I also like to use a fixed range of local addresses
>> for things that are actually fixed, such as the main desktop, TV
>> streamers etc, and allow DHCP to do its thing with laptops and phones
>> and everything else, and the Fritzbox can do this easily, so I'm happy
>> with that too.
>
> It may be that Zen's Fritzbox is fairly configurable as these things go, so
> a lot of what people might want to do is possible.
>
> But a lot of ISP routers are built to be cheap and have minimal
> configuration options. That's my experience of Sky, BT and Plusnet's, for
> example. Often they're developed in house and not even made by a recognised
> brand.
>
> The problem with VOIP causing a lockin is that you aren't then free to
> switch them out for a more capable router to suit your requirements - even
> the same Fritzbox you got from Zen might be a good upgrade compared with the
> kind of junky cheap Technicolor router you used to get from Plusnet.
>
> But if you do that you lose voice calls, which may make that a nonstarter.
> At the end of the day you should not need to change ISP to get a better
> router.
>
>> When the internet was new, it was all fun and exciting and
>> interesting, so I read about it and experimented and tinkered about
>> with settings that should perhaps really be left alone, as I expect we
>> all do with new stuff, but eventually it has become a basic utility,
>> and all I want is something that just works. Maybe this means I'm
>> becoming more sensible, or maybe it's just a feature of old age.
>
> Which is fine, and probably the majority view, but not everyone is the same.
>

IIRC Sky is a Huawei, and the BT range were or are made by Sagem. THe BT
units are doctored though as you can only select three predetermined
channels for wifi!

On 07/03/2023 12:11, Woody wrote:
> On Tue 07/03/2023 09:24, Roderick Stewart wrote:
>> On Mon, 06 Mar 2023 19:55:10 +0000 (GMT), Bob Latham
>> <bob@sick-of-spam.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>> I understand that, but what puzzles me is why anyone wouldn't want
>>>> to use the hardware supplied by the ISP if it does the job. It
>>>> would make sense to use something else if the supplied hardware was
>>>> deficient in some way, but what sort of deficiency are we
>>>> considering here - reliability? wi-fi coverage? or lack of some
>>>> special feature that you absolutely cannot manage without?
>>>
>>> I'm sure for "most people" you are correct.
>>>
>>> Myself, I use a few slightly less usual features like;
>>> DHCP MAC address reservations.
>>> Multiple Guest account Wi-Fi.
>>> Mac filtering on Wi-Fi (yes, I know....)
>>>
>>> Essential? No but I'd not be happy without them.
>>> Then there is how well a router does things like DHCP reservations.
>>
>> Fair enough. You do whatever works for you. I haven't investigated
>> everything the Zen Fritzbox can do but I think it can manage a few
>> extras. The most customisation I've done is to change the local IP
>> address range and the SSID to what I had been using with the previous
>> router, deciding it would be less bother than changing all my
>> connected devices. I also like to use a fixed range of local addresses
>> for things that are actually fixed, such as the main desktop, TV
>> streamers etc, and allow DHCP to do its thing with laptops and phones
>> and everything else, and the Fritzbox can do this easily, so I'm happy
>> with that too.
>>
>> When the internet was new, it was all fun and exciting and
>> interesting, so I read about it and experimented and tinkered about
>> with settings that should perhaps really be left alone, as I expect we
>> all do with new stuff, but eventually it has become a basic utility,
>> and all I want is something that just works. Maybe this means I'm
>> becoming more sensible, or maybe it's just a feature of old age.
>>
>
> Does it allow you to set your own domestic network encryption password?

I've never come across even a cheap and nasty ISP router that at least
doesn't allow that.
Have you then ?

Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> On Tue 07/03/2023 10:27, Theo wrote:
>> Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>>> Fair enough. You do whatever works for you. I haven't investigated
>>> everything the Zen Fritzbox can do but I think it can manage a few
>>> extras. The most customisation I've done is to change the local IP
>>> address range and the SSID to what I had been using with the previous
>>> router, deciding it would be less bother than changing all my
>>> connected devices. I also like to use a fixed range of local addresses
>>> for things that are actually fixed, such as the main desktop, TV
>>> streamers etc, and allow DHCP to do its thing with laptops and phones
>>> and everything else, and the Fritzbox can do this easily, so I'm happy
>>> with that too.
>>
>> It may be that Zen's Fritzbox is fairly configurable as these things go, so
>> a lot of what people might want to do is possible.
>>
>> But a lot of ISP routers are built to be cheap and have minimal
>> configuration options. That's my experience of Sky, BT and Plusnet's, for
>> example. Often they're developed in house and not even made by a recognised
>> brand.
>>
>> The problem with VOIP causing a lockin is that you aren't then free to
>> switch them out for a more capable router to suit your requirements - even
>> the same Fritzbox you got from Zen might be a good upgrade compared with the
>> kind of junky cheap Technicolor router you used to get from Plusnet.
>>
>> But if you do that you lose voice calls, which may make that a nonstarter.
>> At the end of the day you should not need to change ISP to get a better
>> router.
>>
>>> When the internet was new, it was all fun and exciting and
>>> interesting, so I read about it and experimented and tinkered about
>>> with settings that should perhaps really be left alone, as I expect we
>>> all do with new stuff, but eventually it has become a basic utility,
>>> and all I want is something that just works. Maybe this means I'm
>>> becoming more sensible, or maybe it's just a feature of old age.
>>
>> Which is fine, and probably the majority view, but not everyone is the same.
>>
>
>
> IIRC Sky is a Huawei, and the BT range were or are made by Sagem. THe BT
> units are doctored though as you can only select three predetermined
> channels for wifi!
>
>
>
For 2.4 GHz there are only 3 non overlapping channels, namely 1, 6 and 11.
BT are probably saving users from themselves.

On Tue, 7 Mar 2023 12:11:36 +0000, Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com>
wrote:

[re Zen Fritzbox]
>Does it allow you to set your own domestic network encryption password?

Assuming you mean the wi-fi encryption password, then yes of course.

Rod.

On 6 Mar 2023 19:55, Bob Latham wrote:
> In article <ic8c0i1jlm37r8s5nslm2jnl5b10ki58vs@4ax.com>,
> Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> I understand that, but what puzzles me is why anyone wouldn't want
>> to use the hardware supplied by the ISP if it does the job. It
>> would make sense to use something else if the supplied hardware was
>> deficient in some way, but what sort of deficiency are we
>> considering here - reliability? wi-fi coverage? or lack of some
>> special feature that you absolutely cannot manage without?
>
> I'm sure for "most people" you are correct.
>
> Myself, I use a few slightly less usual features like;
> DHCP MAC address reservations.
> Multiple Guest account Wi-Fi.
> Mac filtering on Wi-Fi (yes, I know....)
>
> Essential? No but I'd not be happy without them.
> Then there is how well a router does things like DHCP reservations.
>
> On my ISP router yes you can do it but it's very cumbersome and
> quirky. You can only add a pairing for devices the normal router DHCP
> has no record of. So if you connect something and then later wish to
> set or change the ip address allocation you first have to get the
> router to forget the device. That means disconnecting the device and
> re-booting the router and doing that is painfully slow.
>
> Similarly, my isp router does not give you the ability to decide if
> the guest wi-fi accounts can "see" the main Lan items or not and the
> guest accounts cannot be set to use IP addresses on a different
> scheme to the main LAN. My own router can.
>
> I don't consider any of those features unreasonable to expect from a
> decent router but I agree, they're not common.

I wouldn't bother trying to find a router to do all that.
I use a Cisco "business switch" and a mesh Wi-Fi system.
The switch provides DHCP and DNS and also L3 routing between VLANs and
the mesh system offers multiple SSIDs and the switch then controls
routing between them.

The standard ISP router has DHCP switched off and hangs off the switch.

Rupert Moss-Eccardt wrote:
> On 6 Mar 2023 19:55, Bob Latham wrote:
>> In article <ic8c0i1jlm37r8s5nslm2jnl5b10ki58vs@4ax.com>,
>> Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:

[snip]

Are you Marlen's son?

--
Graham J