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aus+uk / uk.transport.london / Next Stop Arnos Grove

SubjectAuthor
* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
+* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|`* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
| `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|  +- Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|  `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMarland
|   +* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|   |+* Next Stop Arnos GroveGraeme Wall
|   ||`- Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|   |`- Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|   `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|    `* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|     `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|      `* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|       `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|        `* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|         `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|          `* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|           `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|            `* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|             `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|              `* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|               `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|                `* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|                 `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|                  `* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|                   `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|                    `* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|                     `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|                      `* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|                       `* Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|                        `* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|                         +- Next Stop Arnos GroveMuttley
|                         `* Next Stop Arnos GroveGraeme Wall
|                          `* Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
|                           `- Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner
`* Next Stop Arnos GroveBlueshirt
 `- Next Stop Arnos GroveRecliner

Pages:12
Next Stop Arnos Grove

<R%H5N.40379$bGkf.6507@fx12.ams1>

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 by: Recliner - Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20 UTC

Video of the 24TS on a test run

https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN44ZQ

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

<uj7j9m$2pdke$1@dont-email.me>

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From: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com - Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37 UTC

On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>Video of the 24TS on a test run
>
>https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN44Z
>Q
>

Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

<himeli5a9mv23pmlpqmjpfeah74e5f7bsu@4ax.com>

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Message-ID: <himeli5a9mv23pmlpqmjpfeah74e5f7bsu@4ax.com>
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 by: Recliner - Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:20 UTC

On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:

>On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
>Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>
>>https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN44Z
>>Q
>>
>
>Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.

The earlier shots of the first test train being delivered seemed to have some missing panels, which have now been
fitted.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

<uj83ae$2s3vj$1@dont-email.me>

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From: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2023 16:10:54 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com - Fri, 17 Nov 2023 16:10 UTC

On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:20:21 +0000
Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
>>Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>>
>>>https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN4
>4Z
>>>Q
>>>
>>
>>Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.
>
>The earlier shots of the first test train being delivered seemed to have some
>missing panels, which have now been
>fitted.

Could be that. I'm still not convinced those small windows are a good idea,
could make the interior claustrophic but I guess we'll find out soon enough.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

<xn0o9ge5jenyobh000@news.eternal-september.org>

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From: bluesh...@indigo.news (Blueshirt)
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2023 22:37:35 +0000
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 by: Blueshirt - Fri, 17 Nov 2023 22:37 UTC

Recliner wrote:

> Video of the 24TS on a test run
>
>
https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN44ZQ

The Evening Standard have a video up on YouTube about the new
Piccadilly Line trains too...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgDoUIRAGw0

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

<19S5N.40388$bGkf.15710@fx12.ams1>

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 by: Recliner - Fri, 17 Nov 2023 22:52 UTC

Blueshirt <blueshirt@indigo.news> wrote:
> Recliner wrote:
>
>> Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>
>>
> https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN44ZQ
>
> The Evening Standard have a video up on YouTube about the new
> Piccadilly Line trains too...
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgDoUIRAGw0

The reporter thinks the Jubilee Line trains are the most recent Tube trains
in London!

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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 by: Recliner - Fri, 17 Nov 2023 23:15 UTC

<Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:20:21 +0000
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>>>
>>>> https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN4
>> 4Z
>>>> Q
>>>>
>>>
>>> Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.
>>
>> The earlier shots of the first test train being delivered seemed to have some
>> missing panels, which have now been
>> fitted.
>
> Could be that. I'm still not convinced those small windows are a good idea,
> could make the interior claustrophic but I guess we'll find out soon enough.

They remind me of Shinkansen windows.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

<krsop1F412oU1@mid.individual.net>

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From: gemeha...@btinternet.co.uk (Marland)
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Date: 18 Nov 2023 21:31:13 GMT
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 by: Marland - Sat, 18 Nov 2023 21:31 UTC

<Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:20:21 +0000
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>>>
>>>> https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN4
>> 4Z
>>>> Q
>>>>
>>>
>>> Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.
>>
>> The earlier shots of the first test train being delivered seemed to have some
>> missing panels, which have now been
>> fitted.
>
> Could be that. I'm still not convinced those small windows are a good idea,
> could make the interior claustrophic but I guess we'll find out soon enough.
>
>

Lets them have a bigger area for adverts ,maps and notices .OTOH many
passengers will be looking at electronic devices rather than out of the
windows and I suppose on the open sections solar gain will be less on a hot
sunny day,
GH

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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 by: Recliner - Sat, 18 Nov 2023 21:57 UTC

Marland <gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> wrote:
> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:20:21 +0000
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>>>>
>>>>> https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN4
>>> 4Z
>>>>> Q
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.
>>>
>>> The earlier shots of the first test train being delivered seemed to have some
>>> missing panels, which have now been
>>> fitted.
>>
>> Could be that. I'm still not convinced those small windows are a good idea,
>> could make the interior claustrophic but I guess we'll find out soon enough.
>>
>>
>
> Lets them have a bigger area for adverts ,maps and notices .OTOH many
> passengers will be looking at electronic devices rather than out of the
> windows and I suppose on the open sections solar gain will be less on a hot
> sunny day,

Yes, and it helps reduce the train's weight. There may also be cool air
ducts hidden in some of those frames.

Of course, with modern trains it's less necessary to be able to see station
names through the windows, as internal displays and automated announcements
perform that function.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

<ujbcaf$3frct$1@dont-email.me>

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From: rai...@greywall.demon.co.uk (Graeme Wall)
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:02:55 +0000
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 by: Graeme Wall - Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:02 UTC

On 18/11/2023 21:57, Recliner wrote:
> Marland <gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> wrote:
>> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:20:21 +0000
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN4
>>>> 4Z
>>>>>> Q
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.
>>>>
>>>> The earlier shots of the first test train being delivered seemed to have some
>>>> missing panels, which have now been
>>>> fitted.
>>>
>>> Could be that. I'm still not convinced those small windows are a good idea,
>>> could make the interior claustrophic but I guess we'll find out soon enough.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Lets them have a bigger area for adverts ,maps and notices .OTOH many
>> passengers will be looking at electronic devices rather than out of the
>> windows and I suppose on the open sections solar gain will be less on a hot
>> sunny day,
>
> Yes, and it helps reduce the train's weight. There may also be cool air
> ducts hidden in some of those frames.
>
> Of course, with modern trains it's less necessary to be able to see station
> names through the windows, as internal displays and automated announcements
> perform that function.
>

Back where we started with the padded cell cars on the Northern Line and
conductors calling out the names of the stations.
--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Message-ID: <uj3klipbsmjinf2rpltko4gdfgjpoe03nj@4ax.com>
References: <R%H5N.40379$bGkf.6507@fx12.ams1> <uj7j9m$2pdke$1@dont-email.me> <himeli5a9mv23pmlpqmjpfeah74e5f7bsu@4ax.com> <uj83ae$2s3vj$1@dont-email.me> <krsop1F412oU1@mid.individual.net> <era6N.20849$cBSb.12166@fx15.ams1> <ujbcaf$3frct$1@dont-email.me>
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 by: Recliner - Sun, 19 Nov 2023 13:33 UTC

On Sat, 18 Nov 2023 22:02:55 +0000, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:

>On 18/11/2023 21:57, Recliner wrote:
>> Marland <gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> wrote:
>>> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:20:21 +0000
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN4
>>>>> 4Z
>>>>>>> Q
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.
>>>>>
>>>>> The earlier shots of the first test train being delivered seemed to have some
>>>>> missing panels, which have now been
>>>>> fitted.
>>>>
>>>> Could be that. I'm still not convinced those small windows are a good idea,
>>>> could make the interior claustrophic but I guess we'll find out soon enough.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Lets them have a bigger area for adverts ,maps and notices .OTOH many
>>> passengers will be looking at electronic devices rather than out of the
>>> windows and I suppose on the open sections solar gain will be less on a hot
>>> sunny day,
>>
>> Yes, and it helps reduce the train's weight. There may also be cool air
>> ducts hidden in some of those frames.
>>
>> Of course, with modern trains it's less necessary to be able to see station
>> names through the windows, as internal displays and automated announcements
>> perform that function.
>>
>
>Back where we started with the padded cell cars on the Northern Line and
>conductors calling out the names of the stations.

Yes, and all the passengers sitting facing each other.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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From: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2023 09:35:38 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com - Mon, 20 Nov 2023 09:35 UTC

On 18 Nov 2023 21:31:13 GMT
Marland <gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> wrote:
><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:20:21 +0000
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>>>>
>>>>>
>https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN4
>>> 4Z
>>>>> Q
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.
>>>
>>> The earlier shots of the first test train being delivered seemed to have
>some
>>> missing panels, which have now been
>>> fitted.
>>
>> Could be that. I'm still not convinced those small windows are a good idea,
>> could make the interior claustrophic but I guess we'll find out soon enough.
>>
>>
>
>Lets them have a bigger area for adverts ,maps and notices .OTOH many
>passengers will be looking at electronic devices rather than out of the
>windows and I suppose on the open sections solar gain will be less on a hot
>sunny day,
>GH

You could use the same argument for mainline trains but I doubt tiny windows
would go down too well. It might be fine on the "&C for example but the vast
majority of the picc is above ground.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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From: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2023 09:36:09 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com - Mon, 20 Nov 2023 09:36 UTC

On Sat, 18 Nov 2023 21:57:30 GMT
Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>Marland <gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> wrote:
>> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:20:21 +0000
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN4
>>>> 4Z
>>>>>> Q
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.
>>>>
>>>> The earlier shots of the first test train being delivered seemed to have
>some
>>>> missing panels, which have now been
>>>> fitted.
>>>
>>> Could be that. I'm still not convinced those small windows are a good idea,
>>> could make the interior claustrophic but I guess we'll find out soon enough.
>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Lets them have a bigger area for adverts ,maps and notices .OTOH many
>> passengers will be looking at electronic devices rather than out of the
>> windows and I suppose on the open sections solar gain will be less on a hot
>> sunny day,
>
>Yes, and it helps reduce the train's weight. There may also be cool air
>ducts hidden in some of those frames.
>
>Of course, with modern trains it's less necessary to be able to see station
>names through the windows, as internal displays and automated announcements
>perform that function.

Until they inevitably go wrong.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Message-ID: <k5nmli1lg09eg74eb1q1njjr8dr6jlqel6@4ax.com>
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Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2023 13:20:23 +0000
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 by: Recliner - Mon, 20 Nov 2023 13:20 UTC

On Mon, 20 Nov 2023 09:35:38 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:

>On 18 Nov 2023 21:31:13 GMT
>Marland <gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> wrote:
>><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:20:21 +0000
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN4
>>>> 4Z
>>>>>> Q
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.
>>>>
>>>> The earlier shots of the first test train being delivered seemed to have
>>some
>>>> missing panels, which have now been
>>>> fitted.
>>>
>>> Could be that. I'm still not convinced those small windows are a good idea,
>>> could make the interior claustrophic but I guess we'll find out soon enough.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>Lets them have a bigger area for adverts ,maps and notices .OTOH many
>>passengers will be looking at electronic devices rather than out of the
>>windows and I suppose on the open sections solar gain will be less on a hot
>>sunny day,
>>GH
>
>You could use the same argument for mainline trains but I doubt tiny windows
>would go down too well. It might be fine on the "&C for example but the vast
>majority of the picc is above ground.

The Pendos have pretty small windows.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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From: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2023 16:59:36 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com - Mon, 20 Nov 2023 16:59 UTC

On Mon, 20 Nov 2023 13:20:23 +0000
Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Mon, 20 Nov 2023 09:35:38 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>
>>On 18 Nov 2023 21:31:13 GMT
>>Marland <gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> wrote:
>>><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:20:21 +0000
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN4
>
>>>>> 4Z
>>>>>>> Q
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.
>>>>>
>>>>> The earlier shots of the first test train being delivered seemed to have
>>>some
>>>>> missing panels, which have now been
>>>>> fitted.
>>>>
>>>> Could be that. I'm still not convinced those small windows are a good idea,
>
>>>> could make the interior claustrophic but I guess we'll find out soon
>enough.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>Lets them have a bigger area for adverts ,maps and notices .OTOH many
>>>passengers will be looking at electronic devices rather than out of the
>>>windows and I suppose on the open sections solar gain will be less on a hot
>>>sunny day,
>>>GH
>>
>>You could use the same argument for mainline trains but I doubt tiny windows
>>would go down too well. It might be fine on the "&C for example but the vast
>>majority of the picc is above ground.
>
>The Pendos have pretty small windows.

Not that small. Plus you're sitting alongside them and can turn your head to
look out. You're not straining to see outside across a crowded carraige.
I suppose you could do a 180 and look behind you but not east in a crowded
tube.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Message-ID: <mucplil79uevg97hlahmdupuoapolur059@4ax.com>
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 by: Recliner - Tue, 21 Nov 2023 13:51 UTC

On Mon, 20 Nov 2023 16:59:36 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:

>On Mon, 20 Nov 2023 13:20:23 +0000
>Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>On Mon, 20 Nov 2023 09:35:38 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>
>>>On 18 Nov 2023 21:31:13 GMT
>>>Marland <gemehabal@btinternet.co.uk> wrote:
>>>><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:20:21 +0000
>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:37:26 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 11:20:17 GMT
>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Video of the 24TS on a test run
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>https://x.com/ianvisits/status/1725454796411351084?s=61&t=hpa_q__1jHKBKNmXnN4
>>
>>>>>> 4Z
>>>>>>>> Q
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Looks better in the flesh than in the publicity mockups.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The earlier shots of the first test train being delivered seemed to have
>>>>some
>>>>>> missing panels, which have now been
>>>>>> fitted.
>>>>>
>>>>> Could be that. I'm still not convinced those small windows are a good idea,
>>
>>>>> could make the interior claustrophic but I guess we'll find out soon
>>enough.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Lets them have a bigger area for adverts ,maps and notices .OTOH many
>>>>passengers will be looking at electronic devices rather than out of the
>>>>windows and I suppose on the open sections solar gain will be less on a hot
>>>>sunny day,
>>>>GH
>>>
>>>You could use the same argument for mainline trains but I doubt tiny windows
>>>would go down too well. It might be fine on the "&C for example but the vast
>>>majority of the picc is above ground.
>>
>>The Pendos have pretty small windows.
>
>Not that small. Plus you're sitting alongside them and can turn your head to
>look out. You're not straining to see outside across a crowded carraige.
>I suppose you could do a 180 and look behind you but not east in a crowded
>tube.

Sure, but that's no different to the 73TS. I don't think the 24TS windows are shallower, but they do have more vertical
pillars (three smaller windows separated by wide pillars, rather than two longer windows). It could be that those
pillars are behind seats (ie, passengers' heads), so they may not actually reduce external visibility. As far as I can
tell, that is indeed the layout.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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From: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2023 16:19:31 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com - Tue, 21 Nov 2023 16:19 UTC

On Tue, 21 Nov 2023 13:51:08 +0000
Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>longer windows). It could be that those
>pillars are behind seats (ie, passengers' heads), so they may not actually
>reduce external visibility. As far as I can
>tell, that is indeed the layout.

Maybe. I still don't see the logic of having these windows though. Its going
backwards to the 1962 TS. Every stock since then has had large windows - even
the 83 TS in comparison - for good reasons and those reasons haven't gone
away. They don't even look good.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

<NR47N.3$N8H9.0@fx13.ams1>

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 by: Recliner - Tue, 21 Nov 2023 16:25 UTC

<Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 21 Nov 2023 13:51:08 +0000
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> longer windows). It could be that those
>> pillars are behind seats (ie, passengers' heads), so they may not actually
>> reduce external visibility. As far as I can
>> tell, that is indeed the layout.
>
> Maybe. I still don't see the logic of having these windows though. Its going
> backwards to the 1962 TS. Every stock since then has had large windows - even
> the 83 TS in comparison - for good reasons and those reasons haven't gone
> away. They don't even look good.

Are they shallower than the 73TS? Or just narrower?

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
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 by: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com - Tue, 21 Nov 2023 17:11 UTC

On Tue, 21 Nov 2023 16:25:17 GMT
Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 21 Nov 2023 13:51:08 +0000
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> longer windows). It could be that those
>>> pillars are behind seats (ie, passengers' heads), so they may not actually
>>> reduce external visibility. As far as I can
>>> tell, that is indeed the layout.
>>
>> Maybe. I still don't see the logic of having these windows though. Its going
>> backwards to the 1962 TS. Every stock since then has had large windows - even
>
>> the 83 TS in comparison - for good reasons and those reasons haven't gone
>> away. They don't even look good.
>
>Are they shallower than the 73TS? Or just narrower?

Look both to me but its hard to tell without seeing them next to each other.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2023 17:39:19 GMT
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 by: Recliner - Tue, 21 Nov 2023 17:39 UTC

<Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 21 Nov 2023 16:25:17 GMT
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 21 Nov 2023 13:51:08 +0000
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> longer windows). It could be that those
>>>> pillars are behind seats (ie, passengers' heads), so they may not actually
>>>> reduce external visibility. As far as I can
>>>> tell, that is indeed the layout.
>>>
>>> Maybe. I still don't see the logic of having these windows though. Its going
>>> backwards to the 1962 TS. Every stock since then has had large windows - even
>>
>>> the 83 TS in comparison - for good reasons and those reasons haven't gone
>>> away. They don't even look good.
>>
>> Are they shallower than the 73TS? Or just narrower?
>
> Look both to me but its hard to tell without seeing them next to each other.

As far as I can tell from the pictures, in both cases the windows start
just above the seat backs, and end at the point when the body starts to
curve inwards. So the heights will be about the same. But the new windows
are framed by thick, square pillars that look structural and carry cables
and cool air ducts from the aircon units under the seats.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

<ujkgqt$198o6$1@dont-email.me>

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From: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com
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Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
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 by: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com - Wed, 22 Nov 2023 09:15 UTC

On Tue, 21 Nov 2023 17:39:19 GMT
Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>As far as I can tell from the pictures, in both cases the windows start
>just above the seat backs, and end at the point when the body starts to
>curve inwards. So the heights will be about the same. But the new windows
>are framed by thick, square pillars that look structural and carry cables
>and cool air ducts from the aircon units under the seats.

Geoff Marshal has done a good video about the train. Even he questions the
size of the windows but in the comments someone says like you that the pillars
are for aircon ducts. I'm surprised thats the best solution they could some
up with for ducting but there we go.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlP9cJOHEEc

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2023 10:06:37 GMT
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 by: Recliner - Wed, 22 Nov 2023 10:06 UTC

<Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 21 Nov 2023 17:39:19 GMT
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> As far as I can tell from the pictures, in both cases the windows start
>> just above the seat backs, and end at the point when the body starts to
>> curve inwards. So the heights will be about the same. But the new windows
>> are framed by thick, square pillars that look structural and carry cables
>> and cool air ducts from the aircon units under the seats.
>
> Geoff Marshal has done a good video about the train. Even he questions the
> size of the windows but in the comments someone says like you that the pillars
> are for aircon ducts. I'm surprised thats the best solution they could some
> up with for ducting but there we go.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlP9cJOHEEc

How else would you get cooled air from below the seats to the vents in the
ceiling?

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

<ujkkan$19pjh$1@dont-email.me>

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From: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com
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Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
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 by: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com - Wed, 22 Nov 2023 10:14 UTC

On Wed, 22 Nov 2023 10:06:37 GMT
Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 21 Nov 2023 17:39:19 GMT
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> As far as I can tell from the pictures, in both cases the windows start
>>> just above the seat backs, and end at the point when the body starts to
>>> curve inwards. So the heights will be about the same. But the new windows
>>> are framed by thick, square pillars that look structural and carry cables
>>> and cool air ducts from the aircon units under the seats.
>>
>> Geoff Marshal has done a good video about the train. Even he questions the
>> size of the windows but in the comments someone says like you that the
>pillars
>> are for aircon ducts. I'm surprised thats the best solution they could some
>> up with for ducting but there we go.
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlP9cJOHEEc
>
>How else would you get cooled air from below the seats to the vents in the
>ceiling?

You have one fat duct going up where the border between the windows is in the
73 stock and then split it above. Simple.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
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Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Message-ID: <nanrlillspem0v4vmgqve5avvnh5kae0cc@4ax.com>
References: <himeli5a9mv23pmlpqmjpfeah74e5f7bsu@4ax.com> <uj83ae$2s3vj$1@dont-email.me> <krsop1F412oU1@mid.individual.net> <ujf99a$8tao$1@dont-email.me> <k5nmli1lg09eg74eb1q1njjr8dr6jlqel6@4ax.com> <ujg39o$cv6o$1@dont-email.me> <mucplil79uevg97hlahmdupuoapolur059@4ax.com> <ujilai$t44k$1@dont-email.me> <NR47N.3$N8H9.0@fx13.ams1> <ujioct$tl7a$1@dont-email.me> <bX57N.417$aqP3.22@fx14.ams1> <ujkgqt$198o6$1@dont-email.me> <Nok7N.357$OAC8.327@fx09.ams1> <ujkkan$19pjh$1@dont-email.me>
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 by: Recliner - Wed, 22 Nov 2023 10:52 UTC

On Wed, 22 Nov 2023 10:14:47 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:

>On Wed, 22 Nov 2023 10:06:37 GMT
>Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 21 Nov 2023 17:39:19 GMT
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> As far as I can tell from the pictures, in both cases the windows start
>>>> just above the seat backs, and end at the point when the body starts to
>>>> curve inwards. So the heights will be about the same. But the new windows
>>>> are framed by thick, square pillars that look structural and carry cables
>>>> and cool air ducts from the aircon units under the seats.
>>>
>>> Geoff Marshal has done a good video about the train. Even he questions the
>>> size of the windows but in the comments someone says like you that the
>>pillars
>>> are for aircon ducts. I'm surprised thats the best solution they could some
>>> up with for ducting but there we go.
>>>
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlP9cJOHEEc
>>
>>How else would you get cooled air from below the seats to the vents in the
>>ceiling?
>
>You have one fat duct going up where the border between the windows is in the
>73 stock and then split it above. Simple.

You'd then need more ducting along the ceiling. Better to have two smaller ducts.

Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove

<ujl9eo$1d4ii$1@dont-email.me>

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From: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: Next Stop Arnos Grove
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2023 16:15:20 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Mutt...@dastardlyhq.com - Wed, 22 Nov 2023 16:15 UTC

On Wed, 22 Nov 2023 10:52:46 +0000
Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Wed, 22 Nov 2023 10:14:47 -0000 (UTC), Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 22 Nov 2023 10:06:37 GMT
>>Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 21 Nov 2023 17:39:19 GMT
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> As far as I can tell from the pictures, in both cases the windows start
>>>>> just above the seat backs, and end at the point when the body starts to
>>>>> curve inwards. So the heights will be about the same. But the new windows
>>>>> are framed by thick, square pillars that look structural and carry cables
>>>>> and cool air ducts from the aircon units under the seats.
>>>>
>>>> Geoff Marshal has done a good video about the train. Even he questions the
>>>> size of the windows but in the comments someone says like you that the
>>>pillars
>>>> are for aircon ducts. I'm surprised thats the best solution they could
>some
>>>> up with for ducting but there we go.
>>>>
>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlP9cJOHEEc
>>>
>>>How else would you get cooled air from below the seats to the vents in the
>>>ceiling?
>>
>>You have one fat duct going up where the border between the windows is in the
>>73 stock and then split it above. Simple.
>
>You'd then need more ducting along the ceiling. Better to have two smaller
>ducts.

Better for whom? Not the passengers who'll have to squint out of small
portholes. Their solution gives the impression of cheap rather than necessary.


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