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aus+uk / uk.transport.london / Re: ULEZ hypocrisy

SubjectAuthor
* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
+* ULEZ hypocrisyGraeme Wall
|`- ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
`* ULEZ hypocrisyD A Stocks
 +* ULEZ hypocrisyRoland Perry
 |`* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 | `* ULEZ hypocrisyRoland Perry
 |  `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |   +* ULEZ hypocrisyD A Stocks
 |   |`* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |   | `* ULEZ hypocrisyGraeme Wall
 |   |  `- ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |   `* ULEZ hypocrisyRoland Perry
 |    `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     +* ULEZ hypocrisyGraeme Wall
 |     |`* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     | `* ULEZ hypocrisyGraeme Wall
 |     |  `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     |   `* ULEZ hypocrisyTheo
 |     |    `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     |     +- ULEZ hypocrisyGraeme Wall
 |     |     +- ULEZ hypocrisyRoland Perry
 |     |     `* ULEZ hypocrisyRecliner
 |     |      `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     |       `* ULEZ hypocrisyTheo
 |     |        `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     |         +* ULEZ hypocrisyRecliner
 |     |         |`* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     |         | `* ULEZ hypocrisyGraeme Wall
 |     |         |  `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     |         |   +* ULEZ hypocrisyGraeme Wall
 |     |         |   |`* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     |         |   | `* ULEZ hypocrisyGraeme Wall
 |     |         |   |  `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     |         |   |   `* ULEZ hypocrisyGraeme Wall
 |     |         |   |    +- ULEZ hypocrisyRecliner
 |     |         |   |    `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     |         |   |     `* ULEZ hypocrisyGraeme Wall
 |     |         |   |      `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     |         |   |       `* ULEZ hypocrisyRecliner
 |     |         |   |        `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     |         |   |         +* ULEZ hypocrisyRecliner
 |     |         |   |         |`* ULEZ hypocrisyAndy Burns
 |     |         |   |         | `- ULEZ hypocrisyRecliner
 |     |         |   |         `* ULEZ hypocrisyTheo
 |     |         |   |          `* ULEZ hypocrisyRecliner
 |     |         |   |           `- ULEZ hypocrisyAndy Burns
 |     |         |   `- ULEZ hypocrisyRecliner
 |     |         `* ULEZ hypocrisyTheo
 |     |          `- ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |     `* ULEZ hypocrisyRoland Perry
 |      `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |       `* ULEZ hypocrisyRoland Perry
 |        `* ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley
 |         `- ULEZ hypocrisyRoland Perry
 `- ULEZ hypocrisyMuttley

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Re: ULEZ hypocrisy

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Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2024 12:10:56 GMT
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 by: Recliner - Tue, 2 Jan 2024 12:10 UTC

<Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 02 Jan 2024 10:55:40 GMT
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> <Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>>> Scrapping nearly new cars is not only enviromentally criminal but is also
>>> penalising people who followed the Labour governments "buy diesel to help
>>> the enviroment" mantra.
>>
>> Nobody would be scrapping nearly-new cars — their resale value would be
>> much higher than the scrappage allowance.
>
> Possibly.
>
>>> Then suddenly 15 years later its "diesel is bad
>>> for the enviroment". If you need any kind of example of why people have such
>>> disdain for politicians this is a good one.
>>
>> Diesels are bad for local air quality, but better for global warming. In
>> big cities, poor air quality is the bigger issue. For local air quality,
>
> The poor air quality in inner london is mostly down to buses and taxis.
> The amount of empty black cabs driving around looking for fares is ridiculous.

Most buses and taxis in inner London are now hybrids, PHEVs or BEVs.

>
>>> them, enviromental destruction in mining the batteries minerals) as the
>>> latest enviromental saviour. But guess what - now all the first adopters
>>> have blown their cash on them their percent of the market is dropping.
>>> I wonder why.
>>
>> They are still more expensive to buy than ICE cars, though the gap is
>> falling. It's the tax incentives that make them affordable, and those have
>> been falling for private buyers. They still exist for company cars.
>
> More political genius. The rate of EV takeup is dropping so reduce the
> incentives that make people consider buying them. *sigh*

The politicians are smarter and better-informed than you. Have you never
heard of the ZEV Mandate?

Re: ULEZ hypocrisy

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From: use...@andyburns.uk (Andy Burns)
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: ULEZ hypocrisy
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2024 12:27:59 +0000
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In-Reply-To: <k3TkN.30302$N2w8.23833@fx07.ams1>
 by: Andy Burns - Tue, 2 Jan 2024 12:27 UTC

Recliner wrote:

> Have you never heard of the ZEV Mandate?

Sounds like a cosy way for Tesla (who only sell EVs) to make some extra
by "selling" their 22% ICE quota to other manufacturers for something
lower than the £15k compliance payment?

Same number of Teslas get sold, same number of ICE cars get sold, HMG
doesn't rake-in any "fines" ... brilliant.

Re: ULEZ hypocrisy

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 by: Recliner - Tue, 2 Jan 2024 12:45 UTC

Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:
> Recliner wrote:
>
>> Have you never heard of the ZEV Mandate?
>
> Sounds like a cosy way for Tesla (who only sell EVs) to make some extra
> by "selling" their 22% ICE quota to other manufacturers for something
> lower than the £15k compliance payment?
>
> Same number of Teslas get sold, same number of ICE cars get sold, HMG
> doesn't rake-in any "fines" ... brilliant.
>

That's been going on for years. When Tesla first started to make a profit,
it was entirely from the sales of regulatory credits; they made up for the
losses on its other businesses.

https://stockdividendscreener.com/auto-manufacturers/teslas-regulatory-credits-revenue/

Of course, there are now many BEV makers who will be happy to sell BEV
credits to manufacturers slow to switch, such as JLR. In effect, there
will be a cross-subsidy from ICE to BEV vehicles. It saves the government
from having to subsidise BEVs, and accelerates the move from ICE to BEV
vehicles.

The Chinese will be the initial winners, as they were much quicker to
invest in BEV components and vehicles.

Re: ULEZ hypocrisy

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From: theom+n...@chiark.greenend.org.uk (Theo)
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: ULEZ hypocrisy
Date: 02 Jan 2024 13:04:56 +0000 (GMT)
Organization: University of Cambridge, England
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 by: Theo - Tue, 2 Jan 2024 13:04 UTC

Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
> On Tue, 02 Jan 2024 10:55:40 GMT
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> ><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
> >> Scrapping nearly new cars is not only enviromentally criminal but is also
> >> penalising people who followed the Labour governments "buy diesel to help
> >> the enviroment" mantra.
> >
> >Nobody would be scrapping nearly-new cars â?? their resale value would be
> >much higher than the scrappage allowance.
>
> Possibly.

The cars eligible for scrapping are all pre-2016, so 8 or more years old.
That hardly counts as nearly new.

If the car is older but worth more than scrappage will pay, sell it to
somebody outside London. National dealers like Carwow, WBAC, Cazoo and
others would be worth a try - they shift stock around the country so not so
affected by what happens in London. You could also contact smaller dealers
further afield, if you are prepared to drive there for an
assessment/dropoff.

Theo

Re: ULEZ hypocrisy

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: ULEZ hypocrisy
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 by: Recliner - Tue, 2 Jan 2024 13:32 UTC

On 02 Jan 2024 13:04:56 +0000 (GMT), Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:

>Muttley@dastardlyhq.com wrote:
>> On Tue, 02 Jan 2024 10:55:40 GMT
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> ><Muttley@dastardlyhq.com> wrote:
>> >> Scrapping nearly new cars is not only enviromentally criminal but is also
>> >> penalising people who followed the Labour governments "buy diesel to help
>> >> the enviroment" mantra.
>> >
>> >Nobody would be scrapping nearly-new cars â?? their resale value would be
>> >much higher than the scrappage allowance.
>>
>> Possibly.
>
>The cars eligible for scrapping are all pre-2016, so 8 or more years old.
>That hardly counts as nearly new.
>
>If the car is older but worth more than scrappage will pay, sell it to
>somebody outside London. National dealers like Carwow, WBAC, Cazoo and
>others would be worth a try - they shift stock around the country so not so
>affected by what happens in London. You could also contact smaller dealers
>further afield, if you are prepared to drive there for an
>assessment/dropoff.

I sold my non-compliant Jaguar to WeBuyAnyCar.com, which is owned by BCA. I gather that all the cars they buy go
straight to BCA, and could end up anywhere. I think it now lives in Scotland.

Re: ULEZ hypocrisy

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From: use...@andyburns.uk (Andy Burns)
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: ULEZ hypocrisy
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2024 13:51:26 +0000
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In-Reply-To: <dp38pitkhrh9gd3m10t5btvrb1fg9100vv@4ax.com>
 by: Andy Burns - Tue, 2 Jan 2024 13:51 UTC

Recliner wrote:

> I sold my non-compliant Jaguar to WeBuyAnyCar.com, which is owned by
> BCA. I gather that all the cars they buy go straight to BCA, and
> could end up anywhere. I think it now lives in Scotland.
They could be sold straight back to the public via BCA's Cinch subsiduary.


aus+uk / uk.transport.london / Re: ULEZ hypocrisy

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