Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the British
masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died at the age of
81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know it today.

Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of Britain
in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of British computing
through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and its iconic Spectrum
product line.

Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour output, a
rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982. Launched in April that
year, just as another conflict (the Falklands) seared its way into the
British national consciousness, Sir Clive's crowning glory brought not
only the simple fun of gaming but coding, programming, and the building
blocks of computer science to thousands upon thousands of eager young minds.

The son of a mechanical engineer, Sir Clive's early days in computing
began with A levels in physics, pure maths, and applied maths at school
in Weybridge. A design for a programmable calculator that ran punch-card
programs led him, inexorably, to the mysteries of the electronic circuit.

In 1958, a remarkably precocious young Sinclair had not only sketched
out a design for a personal radio receiver but had also drawn up a bill
of materials weighing in at 9s 11d, and he began submitting articles to
Practical Wireless magazine, helping him secure a job as the mag's
editorial assistant. A series of helpful coincidences (an editorial
retirement followed by the deputy editor's collapse from nervous strain)
meant 18-year-old Clive ended up running the title, leading to an early
career in electronics journalism.

That early focus on costs of materials carried over from the Swinging
Sixties' Sinclair Radionics and its personal calculators to Clive's most
famous company, Sinclair Research Ltd. SRL's former chief design
engineer David Karlin told The Register: "The thing about Clive I
remember really clearly was this massive focus on component cost. He was
able to just make you do things you didn't think you would be able to do."

Sinclair's vision was to get a computer into every home in the country,
a tall order in the early 1980s when computers were synonymous with
room-sized beasts in academic institutions. Taking bets on talented and
enthusiastic young hires was part of the culture at SRL; what we would
now call an agile scale-up.

Karlin was hired by Clive himself after answering an ad for "a
completely different role" after which the recruiter said: "I think you
should meet Clive Sinclair." Following "a very quick interview," Clive
appointed him on the spot, Karlin recounting: "I discovered only later
that he had actually advertised for 'the best computer designer in the
world' and that this was the job he had just given me. A source of great
hilarity to many of my friends! I was 23 or something at the time."

Rupert Goodwins, scribe of this parish, remembered:

Clive Sinclair hired the 19-year-old me after a drunken Mensa dinner
party in Chiswick! I'd been on the Six O'Clock News in silhouette
talking about my part in the Prestel hack, and he recognised my voice.
He didn't say what he wanted me to do, just put me in a room in the
London office, which was just him and his secretary, gave me a One Per
Desk and left me to it.

The palatial Sinclair residence at Stone House, Cambridge ("the nice bit
of West Cambridge," observed Karlin), became a locus for Clive's parties
– and his generosity, though that could on occasion be a little too
revealing. Goodwins recalled that Clive put him up in the loft of the
house while he found permanent digs in town; upon opening the room's
wardrobe, Goodwins found it "had been painted as a Garden of Eden
landscape, with large figures of Clive and his first wife eating apples.
Naked. What a way to get to know the boss."

Chaos inevitably reigned as a result of the hiring policy, with Goodwins
recalling oddballs who wore fluorescent (and odd) socks, decisions being
made and remade "far too close to launch" and lots of "clever people
convinced of their own genius" pitching in willy-nilly.

Pile 'em high, sell 'em cheap
At its launch the ZX Spectrum was keenly priced at £125, complete with
16kB of RAM. The pricing was no accident. Long-time Sinclair admirer
Paul Andrews observed of Sinclair's early business practices: "The penny
dropped to them that the way for a company to expand is, if you can have
a computer in everyone's house, everyone's got one mass market. That's
the real profit margin, as opposed to just business."

Clive Sinclair unveils 'X-1' battery pedalo bubble-bike
The Speccie sold far and wide, competing with the Commodore 64 and
bringing the magic of early home computing to the masses – and
profitably, too. Unfortunately, Clive's keen eye for the bill of
materials meant just a few too many corners were cut in production, with
Karlin remembering that the numbers of irate customers awaiting warranty
repairs eventually outweighed the number of happy consumers.

Clive's next memorable venture, the C5 electric buggy, has been sliced
and diced elsewhere at great length. It was a flop; from a safety point
of view the go-kart-sized electric vehicle was simply too small in a
world of growing cars, while their lack of reliability became a national
joke.

Ever the pragmatist, with the C5 trashing SRL's reputation and finances
alike, Clive sold the Sinclair brand name and product lines to Amstrad
(under Alan Sugar) in 1986, keeping SRL for himself as an R&D vehicle.

Away from the relentless commercialism of the office, Clive's personal
life raised a few eyebrows. His early taste for partying continued into
adulthood ("phenomenal events," said Karlin), with detailed
recollections of those events discreetly muted by time.

El Reg's Goodwins shed a little light, though, saying that by the mid
'80s "there were still funds to build an office bar and fit it out as a
pub [in R&D HQ at Milton Keynes], but in the finest Sinclair fashion
nobody had thought to apply for a licence, so the beer had to be given
away."

He continued: "The company did like a drink, and there was a certain
truth in the myth that we had to close down because we'd run out of
Cambridge colleges to have our Christmas parties at – we were never
allowed back a second time."

Clive's first marriage to Ann Trevor-Briscoe brought the birth of three
children, though the Daily Mail (who else?) published an eye-catching
article in 2017 naming one Elaine Millar as an "unofficial wife" of 25
years.

The inventor's decade-long engagement (and Las Vegas marriage) to model
Angie Bowness, who he met at infamous gentlemen's entertainment venue
Stringfellow's in the mid-1990s, prompted a round of Establishment
pearl-clutching; at the time of their 2010 nuptials, Angie was 33 and
Clive was a not-so-sprightly 69 years of age. They divorced seven years
later.

On the whole Sir Clive kickstarted the British tech scene as we know it
today. Countless industry veterans owe their careers and their passions
to playing with Spectrums in their formative years. The British home
computing industry, indeed, owes its fortunes to Sinclair creating the
market for affordable general-purpose home devices.

Was he a man before his time? It is easy to think so. The C5, mocked and
derided back in the 1980s, might have been a shoo-in these days, or at
least the concept of it, as electric scooters whiz around British
cities. Clive's later invention of a portable TV was also a flop, but
today everyone carries a device capable of receiving, if not TV
transmissions per se, live audio-visual broadcasts.

Karlin, designer of the ill-fated Sinclair QL's electronics, observed:
"It's tragic because I think we could have been the British Apple. Apple
started out as a sort of similarly hobbyist kind of company, I think
Steve Wozniak was an old tech head of the old school. Apple understood
manufacturing and manufacturing quality in a way that Sinclair never did.

"That's why we have Apple now and why Sinclair is a footnote."

That 1958 bill of materials might have been prudent for one so young,
but in its very far-sightedness it also foretold Clive's downfall.

Sir Clive Marles Sinclair, 30 July 1940 – 16 September 2021

>"That's why we have Apple now and why Sinclair is a footnote."
> That 1958 bill of materials might have been prudent for one so>
> young, but in its very far-sightedness it also foretold Clive's
> downfall.

wut.

The fact the Sir Clive did hobbyist-spec kits and products, and scored
a Knighthood at practically inventing the British computer industry
was the only reason Sinclair the company didn't go the way of the
"quality" attempts like Acorn/BBC/ARM (ARM might be big now--but only
as a IP house), Apricot, Tangerine, Tatung.. which all had their
lunchs eaten up by American companies like Apple and Commodore.

--
Chris

On 18/09/2021 4:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the British
> masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died at the age of
> 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know it today.
>
> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of Britain
> in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of British computing
> through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and its iconic Spectrum
> product line.
>
> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour output, a
> rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982. Launched in April that
> year, just as another conflict (the Falklands) seared its way into the
> British national consciousness, Sir Clive's crowning glory brought not
> only the simple fun of gaming but coding, programming, and the building
> blocks of computer science to thousands upon thousands of eager young
> minds.
>
> The son of a mechanical engineer, Sir Clive's early days in computing
> began with A levels in physics, pure maths, and applied maths at school
> in Weybridge. A design for a programmable calculator that ran punch-card
> programs led him, inexorably, to the mysteries of the electronic circuit.
>
> In 1958, a remarkably precocious young Sinclair had not only sketched
> out a design for a personal radio receiver but had also drawn up a bill
> of materials weighing in at 9s 11d, and he began submitting articles to
> Practical Wireless magazine, helping him secure a job as the mag's
> editorial assistant. A series of helpful coincidences (an editorial
> retirement followed by the deputy editor's collapse from nervous strain)
> meant 18-year-old Clive ended up running the title, leading to an early
> career in electronics journalism.
>
> That early focus on costs of materials carried over from the Swinging
> Sixties' Sinclair Radionics and its personal calculators to Clive's most
> famous company, Sinclair Research Ltd. SRL's former chief design
> engineer David Karlin told The Register: "The thing about Clive I
> remember really clearly was this massive focus on component cost. He was
> able to just make you do things you didn't think you would be able to do."
>
> Sinclair's vision was to get a computer into every home in the country,
> a tall order in the early 1980s when computers were synonymous with
> room-sized beasts in academic institutions. Taking bets on talented and
> enthusiastic young hires was part of the culture at SRL; what we would
> now call an agile scale-up.
>
> Karlin was hired by Clive himself after answering an ad for "a
> completely different role" after which the recruiter said: "I think you
> should meet Clive Sinclair." Following "a very quick interview," Clive
> appointed him on the spot, Karlin recounting: "I discovered only later
> that he had actually advertised for 'the best computer designer in the
> world' and that this was the job he had just given me. A source of great
> hilarity to many of my friends! I was 23 or something at the time."
>
> Rupert Goodwins, scribe of this parish, remembered:
>
> Clive Sinclair hired the 19-year-old me after a drunken Mensa dinner
> party in Chiswick! I'd been on the Six O'Clock News in silhouette
> talking about my part in the Prestel hack, and he recognised my voice.
> He didn't say what he wanted me to do, just put me in a room in the
> London office, which was just him and his secretary, gave me a One Per
> Desk and left me to it.
>
> The palatial Sinclair residence at Stone House, Cambridge ("the nice bit
> of West Cambridge," observed Karlin), became a locus for Clive's parties
> – and his generosity, though that could on occasion be a little too
> revealing. Goodwins recalled that Clive put him up in the loft of the
> house while he found permanent digs in town; upon opening the room's
> wardrobe, Goodwins found it "had been painted as a Garden of Eden
> landscape, with large figures of Clive and his first wife eating apples.
> Naked. What a way to get to know the boss."
>
> Chaos inevitably reigned as a result of the hiring policy, with Goodwins
> recalling oddballs who wore fluorescent (and odd) socks, decisions being
> made and remade "far too close to launch" and lots of "clever people
> convinced of their own genius" pitching in willy-nilly.
>
> Pile 'em high, sell 'em cheap
> At its launch the ZX Spectrum was keenly priced at £125, complete with
> 16kB of RAM. The pricing was no accident. Long-time Sinclair admirer
> Paul Andrews observed of Sinclair's early business practices: "The penny
> dropped to them that the way for a company to expand is, if you can have
> a computer in everyone's house, everyone's got one mass market. That's
> the real profit margin, as opposed to just business."
>
> Clive Sinclair unveils 'X-1' battery pedalo bubble-bike
> The Speccie sold far and wide, competing with the Commodore 64 and
> bringing the magic of early home computing to the masses – and
> profitably, too. Unfortunately, Clive's keen eye for the bill of
> materials meant just a few too many corners were cut in production, with
> Karlin remembering that the numbers of irate customers awaiting warranty
> repairs eventually outweighed the number of happy consumers.
>
> Clive's next memorable venture, the C5 electric buggy, has been sliced
> and diced elsewhere at great length. It was a flop; from a safety point
> of view the go-kart-sized electric vehicle was simply too small in a
> world of growing cars, while their lack of reliability became a national
> joke.
>
> Ever the pragmatist, with the C5 trashing SRL's reputation and finances
> alike, Clive sold the Sinclair brand name and product lines to Amstrad
> (under Alan Sugar) in 1986, keeping SRL for himself as an R&D vehicle.
>
> Away from the relentless commercialism of the office, Clive's personal
> life raised a few eyebrows. His early taste for partying continued into
> adulthood ("phenomenal events," said Karlin), with detailed
> recollections of those events discreetly muted by time.
>
> El Reg's Goodwins shed a little light, though, saying that by the mid
> '80s "there were still funds to build an office bar and fit it out as a
> pub [in R&D HQ at Milton Keynes], but in the finest Sinclair fashion
> nobody had thought to apply for a licence, so the beer had to be given
> away."
>
> He continued: "The company did like a drink, and there was a certain
> truth in the myth that we had to close down because we'd run out of
> Cambridge colleges to have our Christmas parties at – we were never
> allowed back a second time."
>
> Clive's first marriage to Ann Trevor-Briscoe brought the birth of three
> children, though the Daily Mail (who else?) published an eye-catching
> article in 2017 naming one Elaine Millar as an "unofficial wife" of 25
> years.
>
> The inventor's decade-long engagement (and Las Vegas marriage) to model
> Angie Bowness, who he met at infamous gentlemen's entertainment venue
> Stringfellow's in the mid-1990s, prompted a round of Establishment
> pearl-clutching; at the time of their 2010 nuptials, Angie was 33 and
> Clive was a not-so-sprightly 69 years of age. They divorced seven years
> later.
>
> On the whole Sir Clive kickstarted the British tech scene as we know it
> today. Countless industry veterans owe their careers and their passions
> to playing with Spectrums in their formative years. The British home
> computing industry, indeed, owes its fortunes to Sinclair creating the
> market for affordable general-purpose home devices.
>
> Was he a man before his time? It is easy to think so. The C5, mocked and
> derided back in the 1980s, might have been a shoo-in these days, or at
> least the concept of it, as electric scooters whiz around British
> cities. Clive's later invention of a portable TV was also a flop, but
> today everyone carries a device capable of receiving, if not TV
> transmissions per se, live audio-visual broadcasts.
>
> Karlin, designer of the ill-fated Sinclair QL's electronics, observed:
> "It's tragic because I think we could have been the British Apple. Apple
> started out as a sort of similarly hobbyist kind of company, I think
> Steve Wozniak was an old tech head of the old school. Apple understood
> manufacturing and manufacturing quality in a way that Sinclair never did.
>
> "That's why we have Apple now and why Sinclair is a footnote."
>
> That 1958 bill of materials might have been prudent for one so young,
> but in its very far-sightedness it also foretold Clive's downfall.
>
> Sir Clive Marles Sinclair, 30 July 1940 – 16 September 2021
>

Max <max@val.morgan> wrote
> keithr0 wrote

>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the British
>> masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died at the age of
>> 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know it today.
>>
>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of Britain in
>> July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of British computing
>> through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and its iconic Spectrum product
>> line.
>>
>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour output, a
>> rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982. Launched in April that
>> year, just as another conflict (the Falklands) seared its way into the
>> British national consciousness, Sir Clive's crowning glory brought not
>> only the simple fun of gaming but coding, programming, and the building
>> blocks of computer science to thousands upon thousands of eager young
>> minds.
>>
>> The son of a mechanical engineer, Sir Clive's early days in computing
>> began with A levels in physics, pure maths, and applied maths at school
>> in Weybridge. A design for a programmable calculator that ran punch-card
>> programs led him, inexorably, to the mysteries of the electronic circuit.
>>
>> In 1958, a remarkably precocious young Sinclair had not only sketched out
>> a design for a personal radio receiver but had also drawn up a bill of
>> materials weighing in at 9s 11d, and he began submitting articles to
>> Practical Wireless magazine, helping him secure a job as the mag's
>> editorial assistant. A series of helpful coincidences (an editorial
>> retirement followed by the deputy editor's collapse from nervous strain)
>> meant 18-year-old Clive ended up running the title, leading to an early
>> career in electronics journalism.
>>
>> That early focus on costs of materials carried over from the Swinging
>> Sixties' Sinclair Radionics and its personal calculators to Clive's most
>> famous company, Sinclair Research Ltd. SRL's former chief design engineer
>> David Karlin told The Register: "The thing about Clive I remember really
>> clearly was this massive focus on component cost. He was able to just
>> make you do things you didn't think you would be able to do."
>>
>> Sinclair's vision was to get a computer into every home in the country, a
>> tall order in the early 1980s when computers were synonymous with
>> room-sized beasts in academic institutions. Taking bets on talented and
>> enthusiastic young hires was part of the culture at SRL; what we would
>> now call an agile scale-up.
>>
>> Karlin was hired by Clive himself after answering an ad for "a completely
>> different role" after which the recruiter said: "I think you should meet
>> Clive Sinclair." Following "a very quick interview," Clive appointed him
>> on the spot, Karlin recounting: "I discovered only later that he had
>> actually advertised for 'the best computer designer in the world' and
>> that this was the job he had just given me. A source of great hilarity to
>> many of my friends! I was 23 or something at the time."
>>
>> Rupert Goodwins, scribe of this parish, remembered:
>>
>> Clive Sinclair hired the 19-year-old me after a drunken Mensa dinner
>> party in Chiswick! I'd been on the Six O'Clock News in silhouette talking
>> about my part in the Prestel hack, and he recognised my voice. He didn't
>> say what he wanted me to do, just put me in a room in the London office,
>> which was just him and his secretary, gave me a One Per Desk and left me
>> to it.
>>
>> The palatial Sinclair residence at Stone House, Cambridge ("the nice bit
>> of West Cambridge," observed Karlin), became a locus for Clive's
>> parties – and his generosity, though that could on occasion be a little
>> too revealing. Goodwins recalled that Clive put him up in the loft of the
>> house while he found permanent digs in town; upon opening the room's
>> wardrobe, Goodwins found it "had been painted as a Garden of Eden
>> landscape, with large figures of Clive and his first wife eating apples.
>> Naked. What a way to get to know the boss."
>>
>> Chaos inevitably reigned as a result of the hiring policy, with Goodwins
>> recalling oddballs who wore fluorescent (and odd) socks, decisions being
>> made and remade "far too close to launch" and lots of "clever people
>> convinced of their own genius" pitching in willy-nilly.
>>
>> Pile 'em high, sell 'em cheap
>> At its launch the ZX Spectrum was keenly priced at £125, complete with
>> 16kB of RAM. The pricing was no accident. Long-time Sinclair admirer Paul
>> Andrews observed of Sinclair's early business practices: "The penny
>> dropped to them that the way for a company to expand is, if you can have
>> a computer in everyone's house, everyone's got one mass market. That's
>> the real profit margin, as opposed to just business."
>>
>> Clive Sinclair unveils 'X-1' battery pedalo bubble-bike
>> The Speccie sold far and wide, competing with the Commodore 64 and
>> bringing the magic of early home computing to the masses – and
>> profitably, too. Unfortunately, Clive's keen eye for the bill of
>> materials meant just a few too many corners were cut in production, with
>> Karlin remembering that the numbers of irate customers awaiting warranty
>> repairs eventually outweighed the number of happy consumers.
>>
>> Clive's next memorable venture, the C5 electric buggy, has been sliced
>> and diced elsewhere at great length. It was a flop; from a safety point
>> of view the go-kart-sized electric vehicle was simply too small in a
>> world of growing cars, while their lack of reliability became a national
>> joke.
>>
>> Ever the pragmatist, with the C5 trashing SRL's reputation and finances
>> alike, Clive sold the Sinclair brand name and product lines to Amstrad
>> (under Alan Sugar) in 1986, keeping SRL for himself as an R&D vehicle.
>>
>> Away from the relentless commercialism of the office, Clive's personal
>> life raised a few eyebrows. His early taste for partying continued into
>> adulthood ("phenomenal events," said Karlin), with detailed recollections
>> of those events discreetly muted by time.
>>
>> El Reg's Goodwins shed a little light, though, saying that by the mid
>> '80s "there were still funds to build an office bar and fit it out as a
>> pub [in R&D HQ at Milton Keynes], but in the finest Sinclair fashion
>> nobody had thought to apply for a licence, so the beer had to be given
>> away."
>>
>> He continued: "The company did like a drink, and there was a certain
>> truth in the myth that we had to close down because we'd run out of
>> Cambridge colleges to have our Christmas parties at – we were never
>> allowed back a second time."
>>
>> Clive's first marriage to Ann Trevor-Briscoe brought the birth of three
>> children, though the Daily Mail (who else?) published an eye-catching
>> article in 2017 naming one Elaine Millar as an "unofficial wife" of 25
>> years.
>>
>> The inventor's decade-long engagement (and Las Vegas marriage) to model
>> Angie Bowness, who he met at infamous gentlemen's entertainment venue
>> Stringfellow's in the mid-1990s, prompted a round of Establishment
>> pearl-clutching; at the time of their 2010 nuptials, Angie was 33 and
>> Clive was a not-so-sprightly 69 years of age. They divorced seven years
>> later.
>>
>> On the whole Sir Clive kickstarted the British tech scene as we know it
>> today. Countless industry veterans owe their careers and their passions
>> to playing with Spectrums in their formative years. The British home
>> computing industry, indeed, owes its fortunes to Sinclair creating the
>> market for affordable general-purpose home devices.
>>
>> Was he a man before his time? It is easy to think so. The C5, mocked and
>> derided back in the 1980s, might have been a shoo-in these days, or at
>> least the concept of it, as electric scooters whiz around British cities.
>> Clive's later invention of a portable TV was also a flop, but today
>> everyone carries a device capable of receiving, if not TV transmissions
>> per se, live audio-visual broadcasts.
>>
>> Karlin, designer of the ill-fated Sinclair QL's electronics, observed:
>> "It's tragic because I think we could have been the British Apple. Apple
>> started out as a sort of similarly hobbyist kind of company, I think
>> Steve Wozniak was an old tech head of the old school. Apple understood
>> manufacturing and manufacturing quality in a way that Sinclair never did.
>>
>> "That's why we have Apple now and why Sinclair is a footnote."
>>
>> That 1958 bill of materials might have been prudent for one so young, but
>> in its very far-sightedness it also foretold Clive's downfall.
>>
>> Sir Clive Marles Sinclair, 30 July 1940 – 16 September 2021
>>
>
> What did he die of ?

On 19/09/2021 4:52 am, Rod Speed wrote:
> Max <max@val.morgan> wrote
>> keithr0 wrote
>
>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died at
>>> the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know it today.
>>>
>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of British
>>> computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and its iconic
>>> Spectrum product line.
>>>
>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour output, a
>>> rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982. Launched in April that
>>> year, just as another conflict (the Falklands) seared its way into
>>> the British national consciousness, Sir Clive's crowning glory
>>> brought not only the simple fun of gaming but coding, programming,
>>> and the building blocks of computer science to thousands upon
>>> thousands of eager young minds.
>>>
>>> The son of a mechanical engineer, Sir Clive's early days in computing
>>> began with A levels in physics, pure maths, and applied maths at
>>> school in Weybridge. A design for a programmable calculator that ran
>>> punch-card programs led him, inexorably, to the mysteries of the
>>> electronic circuit.
>>>
>>> In 1958, a remarkably precocious young Sinclair had not only sketched
>>> out a design for a personal radio receiver but had also drawn up a
>>> bill of materials weighing in at 9s 11d, and he began submitting
>>> articles to Practical Wireless magazine, helping him secure a job as
>>> the mag's editorial assistant. A series of helpful coincidences (an
>>> editorial retirement followed by the deputy editor's collapse from
>>> nervous strain) meant 18-year-old Clive ended up running the title,
>>> leading to an early career in electronics journalism.
>>>
>>> That early focus on costs of materials carried over from the Swinging
>>> Sixties' Sinclair Radionics and its personal calculators to Clive's
>>> most famous company, Sinclair Research Ltd. SRL's former chief design
>>> engineer David Karlin told The Register: "The thing about Clive I
>>> remember really clearly was this massive focus on component cost. He
>>> was able to just make you do things you didn't think you would be
>>> able to do."
>>>
>>> Sinclair's vision was to get a computer into every home in the
>>> country, a tall order in the early 1980s when computers were
>>> synonymous with room-sized beasts in academic institutions. Taking
>>> bets on talented and enthusiastic young hires was part of the culture
>>> at SRL; what we would now call an agile scale-up.
>>>
>>> Karlin was hired by Clive himself after answering an ad for "a
>>> completely different role" after which the recruiter said: "I think
>>> you should meet Clive Sinclair." Following "a very quick interview,"
>>> Clive appointed him on the spot, Karlin recounting: "I discovered
>>> only later that he had actually advertised for 'the best computer
>>> designer in the world' and that this was the job he had just given
>>> me. A source of great hilarity to many of my friends! I was 23 or
>>> something at the time."
>>>
>>> Rupert Goodwins, scribe of this parish, remembered:
>>>
>>> Clive Sinclair hired the 19-year-old me after a drunken Mensa dinner
>>> party in Chiswick! I'd been on the Six O'Clock News in silhouette
>>> talking about my part in the Prestel hack, and he recognised my
>>> voice. He didn't say what he wanted me to do, just put me in a room
>>> in the London office, which was just him and his secretary, gave me a
>>> One Per Desk and left me to it.
>>>
>>> The palatial Sinclair residence at Stone House, Cambridge ("the nice
>>> bit of West Cambridge," observed Karlin), became a locus for Clive's
>>> parties – and his generosity, though that could on occasion be a
>>> little too revealing. Goodwins recalled that Clive put him up in the
>>> loft of the house while he found permanent digs in town; upon opening
>>> the room's wardrobe, Goodwins found it "had been painted as a Garden
>>> of Eden landscape, with large figures of Clive and his first wife
>>> eating apples. Naked. What a way to get to know the boss."
>>>
>>> Chaos inevitably reigned as a result of the hiring policy, with
>>> Goodwins recalling oddballs who wore fluorescent (and odd) socks,
>>> decisions being made and remade "far too close to launch" and lots of
>>> "clever people convinced of their own genius" pitching in willy-nilly.
>>>
>>> Pile 'em high, sell 'em cheap
>>> At its launch the ZX Spectrum was keenly priced at £125, complete
>>> with 16kB of RAM. The pricing was no accident. Long-time Sinclair
>>> admirer Paul Andrews observed of Sinclair's early business practices:
>>> "The penny dropped to them that the way for a company to expand is,
>>> if you can have a computer in everyone's house, everyone's got one
>>> mass market. That's the real profit margin, as opposed to just
>>> business."
>>>
>>> Clive Sinclair unveils 'X-1' battery pedalo bubble-bike
>>> The Speccie sold far and wide, competing with the Commodore 64 and
>>> bringing the magic of early home computing to the masses – and
>>> profitably, too. Unfortunately, Clive's keen eye for the bill of
>>> materials meant just a few too many corners were cut in production,
>>> with Karlin remembering that the numbers of irate customers awaiting
>>> warranty repairs eventually outweighed the number of happy consumers.
>>>
>>> Clive's next memorable venture, the C5 electric buggy, has been
>>> sliced and diced elsewhere at great length. It was a flop; from a
>>> safety point of view the go-kart-sized electric vehicle was simply
>>> too small in a world of growing cars, while their lack of reliability
>>> became a national joke.
>>>
>>> Ever the pragmatist, with the C5 trashing SRL's reputation and
>>> finances alike, Clive sold the Sinclair brand name and product lines
>>> to Amstrad (under Alan Sugar) in 1986, keeping SRL for himself as an
>>> R&D vehicle.
>>>
>>> Away from the relentless commercialism of the office, Clive's
>>> personal life raised a few eyebrows. His early taste for partying
>>> continued into adulthood ("phenomenal events," said Karlin), with
>>> detailed recollections of those events discreetly muted by time.
>>>
>>> El Reg's Goodwins shed a little light, though, saying that by the mid
>>> '80s "there were still funds to build an office bar and fit it out as
>>> a pub [in R&D HQ at Milton Keynes], but in the finest Sinclair
>>> fashion nobody had thought to apply for a licence, so the beer had to
>>> be given away."
>>>
>>> He continued: "The company did like a drink, and there was a certain
>>> truth in the myth that we had to close down because we'd run out of
>>> Cambridge colleges to have our Christmas parties at – we were never
>>> allowed back a second time."
>>>
>>> Clive's first marriage to Ann Trevor-Briscoe brought the birth of
>>> three children, though the Daily Mail (who else?) published an
>>> eye-catching article in 2017 naming one Elaine Millar as an
>>> "unofficial wife" of 25 years.
>>>
>>> The inventor's decade-long engagement (and Las Vegas marriage) to
>>> model Angie Bowness, who he met at infamous gentlemen's entertainment
>>> venue Stringfellow's in the mid-1990s, prompted a round of
>>> Establishment pearl-clutching; at the time of their 2010 nuptials,
>>> Angie was 33 and Clive was a not-so-sprightly 69 years of age. They
>>> divorced seven years later.
>>>
>>> On the whole Sir Clive kickstarted the British tech scene as we know
>>> it today. Countless industry veterans owe their careers and their
>>> passions to playing with Spectrums in their formative years. The
>>> British home computing industry, indeed, owes its fortunes to
>>> Sinclair creating the market for affordable general-purpose home
>>> devices.
>>>
>>> Was he a man before his time? It is easy to think so. The C5, mocked
>>> and derided back in the 1980s, might have been a shoo-in these days,
>>> or at least the concept of it, as electric scooters whiz around
>>> British cities. Clive's later invention of a portable TV was also a
>>> flop, but today everyone carries a device capable of receiving, if
>>> not TV transmissions per se, live audio-visual broadcasts.
>>>
>>> Karlin, designer of the ill-fated Sinclair QL's electronics,
>>> observed: "It's tragic because I think we could have been the British
>>> Apple. Apple started out as a sort of similarly hobbyist kind of
>>> company, I think Steve Wozniak was an old tech head of the old
>>> school. Apple understood manufacturing and manufacturing quality in a
>>> way that Sinclair never did.
>>>
>>> "That's why we have Apple now and why Sinclair is a footnote."
>>>
>>> That 1958 bill of materials might have been prudent for one so young,
>>> but in its very far-sightedness it also foretold Clive's downfall.
>>>
>>> Sir Clive Marles Sinclair, 30 July 1940 – 16 September 2021
>>>
>>
>> What did he die of ?
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clive_Sinclair#Personal_life
>
>    On 16 September 2021, Sinclair died in London following an illness
>    related to cancer that he had for over a decade. He was 81 years old.
>
> Even you should have been able to manage that.

On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the British
> masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died at the age of
> 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know it today.
>
> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of Britain
> in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of British computing
> through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and its iconic Spectrum
> product line.
>
> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour output, a
> rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.

The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum from a
very great height in every possible way.

On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the British
>> masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died at the age
>> of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know it today.
>>
>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of Britain
>> in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of British computing
>> through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and its iconic Spectrum
>> product line.
>>
>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour output, a
>> rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>
> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum from a
> very great height in every possible way.
>

What was better about it ?

On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the British
>> masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died at the age
>> of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know it today.
>>
>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of Britain
>> in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of British computing
>> through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and its iconic Spectrum
>> product line.
>>
>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour output, a
>> rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>
> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum from a
> very great height in every possible way.
>
It cost more than twice as much and the vast majority of users did
nothing more with it than plugging game cartridges in.

On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died at
>>> the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know it today.
>>>
>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of British
>>> computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and its iconic
>>> Spectrum product line.
>>>
>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour output, a
>>> rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>
>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum from
>> a very great height in every possible way.
>>
>
> What was better about it ?

Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better storage
(disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and software support.

The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as you only
got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when you bought a ZX.

On 25/09/2021 5:46 pm, Clocky wrote:
> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died at
>>>> the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know it
>>>> today.
>>>>
>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of British
>>>> computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and its iconic
>>>> Spectrum product line.
>>>>
>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>>>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour output,
>>>> a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>
>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum
>>> from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>
>>
>> What was better about it ?
>
>
> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better storage
> (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and software support.
>
> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as you only
> got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when you bought a ZX.

And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.

keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
> Clocky wrote
>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the British
>>>>> masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died at the age
>>>>> of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know it today.
>>>>>
>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of Britain
>>>>> in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of British computing
>>>>> through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and its iconic Spectrum
>>>>> product line.
>>>>>
>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>>>>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour output, a
>>>>> rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>
>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum from
>>>> a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>
>>>
>>> What was better about it ?
>>
>>
>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better storage
>> (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and software
>> support.
>>
>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as you only
>> got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when you bought a ZX.
>
> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
> launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.

The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the Amiga.

Nothing to move onto with the ZX

On 26/09/2021 2:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>> Clocky wrote
>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died
>>>>>> at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know
>>>>>> it today.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of
>>>>>> British computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and
>>>>>> its iconic Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>>>>>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour
>>>>>> output, a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>
>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum
>>>>> from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>
>>>
>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better
>>> storage (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and
>>> software support.
>>>
>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as you
>>> only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when you
>>> bought a ZX.
>>
>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
>> launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>
> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the Amiga.
>
> Nothing to move onto with the ZX

what was the one that Dick Smith sold called? I think it had some sort
of cat name, like cougar or something

--
"A mans got to know his limitations"
- clint Eastwood as Dirty Harry

Yosemite Sam <felix@invalid.com> wrote
> On 26/09/2021 2:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
>> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>>> Clocky wrote
>>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died
>>>>>>> at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know
>>>>>>> it today.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of
>>>>>>> British computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and
>>>>>>> its iconic Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>>>>>>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour
>>>>>>> output, a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum
>>>>>> from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better
>>>> storage (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and
>>>> software support.
>>>>
>>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as you
>>>> only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when you
>>>> bought a ZX.
>>>
>>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
>>> launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>>
>> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the Amiga.
>>
>> Nothing to move onto with the ZX

> what was the one that Dick Smith sold called?

System 80

> I think it had some sort of cat name, like cougar or something

Likely you are thinking about the Amiga, Dick Smith never sold that.

On 26/09/2021 9:14 am, Yosemite Sam wrote:
> On 26/09/2021 2:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
>> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>>> Clocky wrote
>>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died
>>>>>>> at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know
>>>>>>> it today.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of
>>>>>>> British computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and
>>>>>>> its iconic Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>>>>>>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour
>>>>>>> output, a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum
>>>>>> from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better
>>>> storage (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and
>>>> software support.
>>>>
>>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as you
>>>> only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when you
>>>> bought a ZX.
>>>
>>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
>>> launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>>
>> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the Amiga.
>>
>> Nothing to move onto with the ZX
>
>
> what was the one that Dick Smith sold called?

Sold a bunch of different computers. The Wizzard which was a rebadged
Creativision, 6502 based with a TMS9928 video chip. The VZ200 and VZ300
which were Z80 based with a MC6847 VDG, the CAT, Sorcerer, System 80
(TRS-80 clone, also Z80). Aquarius briefly.

I think it had some sort
> of cat name, like cougar or something
>
>

On 26/09/2021 12:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>> Clocky wrote
>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died
>>>>>> at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know
>>>>>> it today.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of
>>>>>> British computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and
>>>>>> its iconic Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>>>>>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour
>>>>>> output, a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>
>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum
>>>>> from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>
>>>
>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better storage
>>> (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and software
>>> support.
>>>
>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as you
>>> only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when you
>>> bought a ZX.
>>
>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
>> launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>
> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the Amiga.
>
> Nothing to move onto with the ZX

Yep.

Not only was the Spectrum a cheap toy with shit sound, with a horrible
unusable keyboard, poor display and with deadly slow BASIC performance
compared to the C64, and of course laughingly bad peripherals - it was
also a complete dead end.

Not so C= computers which indeed launched generations of programmers.

On 29/09/2021 3:54 pm, Clocky wrote:
> On 26/09/2021 12:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
>> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>>> Clocky wrote
>>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died
>>>>>>> at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know
>>>>>>> it today.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of
>>>>>>> British computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and
>>>>>>> its iconic Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>>>>>>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour
>>>>>>> output, a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum
>>>>>> from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better
>>>> storage (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and
>>>> software support.
>>>>
>>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as you
>>>> only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when you
>>>> bought a ZX.
>>>
>>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
>>> launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>>
>> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the Amiga.
>>
>> Nothing to move onto with the ZX

ROTFL the ZX had a Z80 CPU that is still used to this day in various
guises, the C64 had a 6510 which was a complete dead end.

> Yep.
>
> Not only was the Spectrum a cheap toy with shit sound, with a horrible
> unusable keyboard, poor display and with deadly slow BASIC performance
> compared to the C64, and of course laughingly bad peripherals - it was
> also a complete dead end.
>
> Not so C= computers which indeed launched generations of programmers.

I'll bet that more than 95% of C64 users never did more than plug in
game cartridges.

On 29/09/2021 3:35 pm, Clocky wrote:
> On 26/09/2021 9:14 am, Yosemite Sam wrote:
>> On 26/09/2021 2:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
>>> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>>>> Clocky wrote
>>>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has
>>>>>>>> died at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as
>>>>>>>> we know it today.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of
>>>>>>>> British computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and
>>>>>>>> its iconic Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech
>>>>>>>> and computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour
>>>>>>>> output, a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX
>>>>>>> Spectrum from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better
>>>>> storage (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and
>>>>> software support.
>>>>>
>>>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as
>>>>> you only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when
>>>>> you bought a ZX.
>>>>
>>>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
>>>> launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>>>
>>> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the
>>> Amiga.
>>>
>>> Nothing to move onto with the ZX
>>
>>
>> what was the one that Dick Smith sold called?
>
> Sold a bunch of different computers. The Wizzard which was a rebadged
> Creativision, 6502 based with a TMS9928 video chip. The VZ200 and
> VZ300 which were Z80 based with a MC6847 VDG, the CAT, Sorcerer,
> System 80 (TRS-80 clone, also Z80). Aquarius briefly.
>
>
> I think it had some sort
>> of cat name, like cougar or something
>>
>>
>

I guess it was the CAT I was thinking of

--
"A mans got to know his limitations"
- clint Eastwood as Dirty Harry

keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
> On 29/09/2021 3:54 pm, Clocky wrote:
>> On 26/09/2021 12:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
>>> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>>>> Clocky wrote
>>>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:

>>>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died
>>>>>>>> at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know
>>>>>>>> it today.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of British
>>>>>>>> computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and its iconic
>>>>>>>> Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>>>>>>>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour output,
>>>>>>>> a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum
>>>>>>> from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better storage
>>>>> (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and software
>>>>> support.
>>>>>
>>>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as you
>>>>> only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when you
>>>>> bought a ZX.
>>>>
>>>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
>>>> launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>>>
>>> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the Amiga.
>>>
>>> Nothing to move onto with the ZX
>
> ROTFL the ZX had a Z80 CPU that is still used to this day in various
> guises,

But fuck all are programmed with machine code anymore.

> the C64 had a 6510 which was a complete dead end.

But those who started programming on the C64 used
higher level languages later so the cpu is irrelevant.

>> Yep.
>>
>> Not only was the Spectrum a cheap toy with shit sound, with a horrible
>> unusable keyboard, poor display and with deadly slow BASIC performance
>> compared to the C64, and of course laughingly bad peripherals - it was
>> also a complete dead end.
>>
>> Not so C= computers which indeed launched generations of programmers.
>
> I'll bet that more than 95% of C64 users never did more than plug in game
> cartridges.

Irrelevant to the fact that it also launched plenty of programmers.

On 29/09/2021 5:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
> On 29/09/2021 3:54 pm, Clocky wrote:
>> On 26/09/2021 12:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
>>> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>>>> Clocky wrote
>>>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has
>>>>>>>> died at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as
>>>>>>>> we know it today.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of
>>>>>>>> British computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and
>>>>>>>> its iconic Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>>>>>>>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour
>>>>>>>> output, a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum
>>>>>>> from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better
>>>>> storage (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and
>>>>> software support.
>>>>>
>>>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as you
>>>>> only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when you
>>>>> bought a ZX.
>>>>
>>>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
>>>> launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>>>
>>> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the Amiga.
>>>
>>> Nothing to move onto with the ZX
>
> ROTFL the ZX had a Z80 CPU that is still used to this day in various
> guises,

I know, I bought some not long ago.

the C64 had a 6510 which was a complete dead end.
>

So why does Mouser stock current production 6502's and it's derivatives?
Your ignorance is showing again Keef.

>> Yep.
>>
>> Not only was the Spectrum a cheap toy with shit sound, with a horrible
>> unusable keyboard, poor display and with deadly slow BASIC performance
>> compared to the C64, and of course laughingly bad peripherals - it was
>> also a complete dead end.
>>
>> Not so C= computers which indeed launched generations of programmers.
>
> I'll bet that more than 95% of C64 users never did more than plug in
> game cartridges.
>

Unlikely given the massive amount of software, utilities and programming
tools compared to the ZX. Who do you think programmed all those ML
programs, games and demos back then and even now?

*Nobody* programmed on that horrible ZX keyboard, it was only ever a toy
for playing bad ports of games written for and on other computers that
had real keyboards, real viable storage solutions, real expansion
options and real users.

The ZX was cheap and nasty but if you were poor it was better than
nothing. That's it's only virtue.

On 30/09/2021 3:16 am, Rod Speed wrote:
> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>> On 29/09/2021 3:54 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>> On 26/09/2021 12:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
>>>> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>>>>> Clocky wrote
>>>>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>
>>>>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has
>>>>>>>>> died at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as
>>>>>>>>> we know it today.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of
>>>>>>>>> British computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd
>>>>>>>>> and its iconic Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech
>>>>>>>>> and computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its
>>>>>>>>> colour output, a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX
>>>>>>>> Spectrum from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better
>>>>>> storage (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and
>>>>>> software support.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as
>>>>>> you only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when
>>>>>> you bought a ZX.
>>>>>
>>>>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it
>>>>> also launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>>>>
>>>> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the
>>>> Amiga.
>>>>
>>>> Nothing to move onto with the ZX
>>
>> ROTFL the ZX had a Z80 CPU that is still used to this day in various
>> guises,
>
> But fuck all are programmed with machine code anymore.
>
>> the C64 had a 6510 which was a complete dead end.
>
> But those who started programming on the C64 used
> higher level languages later so the cpu is irrelevant.

that makes sense

>
>>> Yep.
>>>
>>> Not only was the Spectrum a cheap toy with shit sound, with a
>>> horrible unusable keyboard, poor display and with deadly slow BASIC
>>> performance compared to the C64, and of course laughingly bad
>>> peripherals - it was also a complete dead end.
>>>
>>> Not so C= computers which indeed launched generations of programmers.
>>
>> I'll bet that more than 95% of C64 users never did more than plug in
>> game cartridges.
>

au contraire, you could do quite a lot with it. I only had the Vic20,
but I wrote many programs for personal use including, household
financial management, some games, a program for client management, golf
course records, even Body Corporate software for a Unit block I was
living in at the time. It was surprising useful. I went from that to a
second hand Macintosh.

> Irrelevant to the fact that it also launched plenty of programmers.

yes

--
"A mans got to know his limitations"
- clint Eastwood as Dirty Harry

On 30/09/2021 10:41 am, Clocky wrote:
> On 29/09/2021 5:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>> On 29/09/2021 3:54 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>> On 26/09/2021 12:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
>>>> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>>>>> Clocky wrote
>>>>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has
>>>>>>>>> died at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as
>>>>>>>>> we know it today.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of
>>>>>>>>> British computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and
>>>>>>>>> its iconic Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech
>>>>>>>>> and computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour
>>>>>>>>> output, a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX
>>>>>>>> Spectrum from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better
>>>>>> storage (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and
>>>>>> software support.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as
>>>>>> you only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when
>>>>>> you bought a ZX.
>>>>>
>>>>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
>>>>> launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>>>>
>>>> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the
>>>> Amiga.
>>>>
>>>> Nothing to move onto with the ZX
>>
>> ROTFL the ZX had a Z80 CPU that is still used to this day in various
>> guises,
>
> I know, I bought some not long ago.
>
>  the C64 had a 6510 which was a complete dead end.
>>
>
>
> So why does Mouser stock current production 6502's and it's derivatives?
> Your ignorance is showing again Keef.
>
>>> Yep.
>>>
>>> Not only was the Spectrum a cheap toy with shit sound, with a
>>> horrible unusable keyboard, poor display and with deadly slow BASIC
>>> performance compared to the C64, and of course laughingly bad
>>> peripherals - it was also a complete dead end.
>>>
>>> Not so C= computers which indeed launched generations of programmers.
>>
>> I'll bet that more than 95% of C64 users never did more than plug in
>> game cartridges.
>>
>
> Unlikely given the massive amount of software, utilities and programming
> tools compared to the ZX. Who do you think programmed all those ML
> programs, games and demos back then and even now?

Mainly professional software companies. Most users used it as a games
console.

> *Nobody* programmed on that horrible ZX keyboard, it was only ever a toy
> for playing bad ports of games written for and on other computers that
> had real keyboards, real viable storage solutions, real expansion
> options and real users.

The comments on various forum where real programmers post, would argue
with that, it seems that a lot of IT professionals of a certain age got
their start with the ZX.

Very few C64s ever had expansions attached, most ended up in cupboards
when better machines came along.

> The ZX was cheap and nasty but if you were poor it was better than
> nothing. That's it's only virtue.

It certainly was cheap and nasty, but it enabled a lot of kids to buy on
out of they pocket money.

keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
> On 30/09/2021 10:41 am, Clocky wrote:
>> On 29/09/2021 5:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>> On 29/09/2021 3:54 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>> On 26/09/2021 12:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
>>>>> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>>>>>> Clocky wrote
>>>>>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has died
>>>>>>>>>> at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as we know
>>>>>>>>>> it today.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of
>>>>>>>>>> British computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and
>>>>>>>>>> its iconic Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech and
>>>>>>>>>> computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour
>>>>>>>>>> output, a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX Spectrum
>>>>>>>>> from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better
>>>>>>> storage (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and
>>>>>>> software support.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as you
>>>>>>> only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when you
>>>>>>> bought a ZX.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
>>>>>> launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>>>>>
>>>>> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the
>>>>> Amiga.
>>>>>
>>>>> Nothing to move onto with the ZX
>>>
>>> ROTFL the ZX had a Z80 CPU that is still used to this day in various
>>> guises,
>>
>> I know, I bought some not long ago.
>>
>> the C64 had a 6510 which was a complete dead end.
>>>
>>
>>
>> So why does Mouser stock current production 6502's and it's derivatives?
>> Your ignorance is showing again Keef.
>>
>>>> Yep.
>>>>
>>>> Not only was the Spectrum a cheap toy with shit sound, with a horrible
>>>> unusable keyboard, poor display and with deadly slow BASIC performance
>>>> compared to the C64, and of course laughingly bad peripherals - it was
>>>> also a complete dead end.
>>>>
>>>> Not so C= computers which indeed launched generations of programmers.
>>>
>>> I'll bet that more than 95% of C64 users never did more than plug in
>>> game cartridges.
>>>
>>
>> Unlikely given the massive amount of software, utilities and programming
>> tools compared to the ZX. Who do you think programmed all those ML
>> programs, games and demos back then and even now?
>
> Mainly professional software companies. Most users used it as a games
> console.
>
>> *Nobody* programmed on that horrible ZX keyboard, it was only ever a toy
>> for playing bad ports of games written for and on other computers that
>> had real keyboards, real viable storage solutions, real expansion options
>> and real users.
>
> The comments on various forum where real programmers post, would argue
> with that, it seems that a lot of IT professionals of a certain age got
> their start with the ZX.
>
> Very few C64s ever had expansions attached, most ended up in cupboards
> when better machines came along.

Just as true of the ZX and all other computers.

>> The ZX was cheap and nasty but if you were poor it was better than
>> nothing. That's it's only virtue.

> It certainly was cheap and nasty, but it enabled a lot of kids to buy on
> out of they pocket money.

So did the VIC20.

On 30/09/2021 9:59 am, keithr0 wrote:
> On 30/09/2021 10:41 am, Clocky wrote:
>> On 29/09/2021 5:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>> On 29/09/2021 3:54 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>> On 26/09/2021 12:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
>>>>> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>>>>>> Clocky wrote
>>>>>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has
>>>>>>>>>> died at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as
>>>>>>>>>> we know it today.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of
>>>>>>>>>> British computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd
>>>>>>>>>> and its iconic Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech
>>>>>>>>>> and computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its
>>>>>>>>>> colour output, a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX
>>>>>>>>> Spectrum from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better
>>>>>>> storage (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and
>>>>>>> software support.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as
>>>>>>> you only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when
>>>>>>> you bought a ZX.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it
>>>>>> also launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>>>>>
>>>>> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the
>>>>> Amiga.
>>>>>
>>>>> Nothing to move onto with the ZX
>>>
>>> ROTFL the ZX had a Z80 CPU that is still used to this day in various
>>> guises,
>>
>> I know, I bought some not long ago.
>>
>>   the C64 had a 6510 which was a complete dead end.
>>>
>>
>>
>> So why does Mouser stock current production 6502's and it's derivatives?
>> Your ignorance is showing again Keef.
>>
>>>> Yep.
>>>>
>>>> Not only was the Spectrum a cheap toy with shit sound, with a
>>>> horrible unusable keyboard, poor display and with deadly slow BASIC
>>>> performance compared to the C64, and of course laughingly bad
>>>> peripherals - it was also a complete dead end.
>>>>
>>>> Not so C= computers which indeed launched generations of programmers.
>>>
>>> I'll bet that more than 95% of C64 users never did more than plug in
>>> game cartridges.
>>>
>>
>> Unlikely given the massive amount of software, utilities and
>> programming tools compared to the ZX. Who do you think programmed all
>> those ML programs, games and demos back then and even now?
>
> Mainly professional software companies. Most users used it as a games
> console.
>
>> *Nobody* programmed on that horrible ZX keyboard, it was only ever a
>> toy for playing bad ports of games written for and on other computers
>> that had real keyboards, real viable storage solutions, real expansion
>> options and real users.
>
> The comments on various forum where real programmers post, would argue
> with that,

You clearly don't hang out in forums where "real" programmers post them
or you wouldn't be so pig ignorant.

it seems that a lot of IT professionals of a certain age got
> their start with the ZX.
>

And most didn't, with many more getting their start on a C= computer.

> Very few C64s ever had expansions attached,

There were and still are countless expansions still being developed and
produced. Again, your ignorance is on full display.

most ended up in cupboards
> when better machines came along.
>

ZX's went in the cupboard as soon as the C64 came along and if you
really wanted a Z80 you could buy a Commodore 128 with enhanced BASIC,
80 column display and with 128K but which also had a Z80, ran CP/M and
was also 100% C64 compatible.

>> The ZX was cheap and nasty but if you were poor it was better than
>> nothing. That's it's only virtue.
>
> It certainly was cheap and nasty, but it enabled a lot of kids to buy on
> out of they pocket money.
>

So did the VIC-20 and it would give them a better start.

On 29/9/21 9:02 pm, Yosemite Sam wrote:
> On 29/09/2021 3:35 pm, Clocky wrote:
>> On 26/09/2021 9:14 am, Yosemite Sam wrote:
>>> On 26/09/2021 2:12 am, Rod Speed wrote:
>>>> keithr0 <user@account.invalid> wrote
>>>>> Clocky wrote
>>>>>> On 24/09/2021 8:04 am, Max wrote:
>>>>>>> On 23/09/2021 9:48 pm, Clocky wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 18/09/2021 2:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Sir Clive Sinclair, the visionary pioneer of computing for the
>>>>>>>>> British masses and creator of the legendary ZX Spectrum, has
>>>>>>>>> died at the age of 81. His legacy is the British tech scene as
>>>>>>>>> we know it today.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Born in leafy Richmond, Surrey, at the height of the Battle of
>>>>>>>>> Britain in July 1940, he came to epitomise the early era of
>>>>>>>>> British computing through his company Sinclair Research Ltd and
>>>>>>>>> its iconic Spectrum product line.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Fondly remembered by a generation of modern-day British tech
>>>>>>>>> and computing leaders, the ZX Spectrum was named for its colour
>>>>>>>>> output, a rarity in the mostly monochrome days of 1982.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The Commodore 64 was released in 1982 and shat on the ZX
>>>>>>>> Spectrum from a very great height in every possible way.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What was better about it ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Better graphics, vastly better sound, a real keyboard, better
>>>>>> storage (disk drives) options, expansion options and hardware and
>>>>>> software support.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The only thing "better" about the ZX is cost, but not really as
>>>>>> you only got some half baked toy instead of a real computer when
>>>>>> you bought a ZX.
>>>>>
>>>>> And a better cpu, a Z80 rather than a cheap and nasty 6502, it also
>>>>> launched a bunch of programmers rather than a bunch of gamers.
>>>>
>>>> The C64 launched plenty of programmers who mostly moved on to the
>>>> Amiga.
>>>>
>>>> Nothing to move onto with the ZX
>>>
>>>
>>> what was the one that Dick Smith sold called?
>>
>> Sold a bunch of different computers. The Wizzard which was a rebadged
>> Creativision, 6502 based with a TMS9928 video chip. The VZ200 and
>> VZ300 which were Z80 based with a MC6847 VDG, the CAT, Sorcerer,
>> System 80 (TRS-80 clone, also Z80). Aquarius briefly.
>>
>>
>> I think it had some sort
>>> of cat name, like cougar or something
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> I guess it was the CAT I was thinking of
>
The only two in the above list I am not aware of was the CAT and the
Aquarius. Seems they were just badge engineered (read: inferior) clones
so no small wonder they didn't attract my attention. I was pretty firmly
entrenched into the Zilog space by 83-84 and, IIRC, running CP/M. By the
mid 80s I was running 4 MHz Ampro Littleboards with twin DSDD 800k
floppy drives and SCSI hard drives. The HDD interface on my first Ampro
Littleboard was actually SASI, predecessor to SCSI. The final HDD I used
on an Ampro was a Tandon 30 Meg Linear Voice coil Actuator drive, one of
the fastest steppers around in that era. CP/M 2.2 couldn't handle a
drive greater than 8 meg so I had to divide that 30 Meg drive up into 4
x 7.5Meg drives and allocate each partition to it's own *User Area*. The
Drive, a 5.25" Full Height, was encased in it's own enclosure with a
linear power supply, it weighed a ton. They called those old drives
*door stops* and for very good reason.

--

Xeno

Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

Clocky <notgonna@happen.com> wrote:
> On 29/09/2021 5:43 pm, keithr0 wrote:
[...]
> > I'll bet that more than 95% of C64 users never did more than plug in
> > game cartridges.
> >
>
> Unlikely given the massive amount of software, utilities and programming
> tools compared to the ZX. Who do you think programmed all those ML
> programs, games and demos back then and even now?

Anecdote: In The Netherlands - and possibly other countries - the
production line of the Philips shavers was controlled by C64 systems.
The programming was done in some superset of C.

I had to convert the functionality to our HP 9000 Series 300 HP-UX
(UNIX) systems and I had a very, very hard time offering a similar
functionality in our C language. I had to resort to some fancy footwork
with pointers to pointers and let the C-preprocessor (cpp) do some magic
to make it look as if our C language had similar functionality as the
one they had on the C64. It still makes my head spin! :-)