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aus+uk / uk.rec.gardening / Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum

SubjectAuthor
* Acer Palmatum DissectumPrimrose
+* Re: Acer Palmatum DissectumPrimrose
|`* Re: Acer Palmatum DissectumJeff Layman
| `* Re: Acer Palmatum DissectumPrimrose
|  `* Re: Acer Palmatum DissectumMartin Brown
|   +- Re: Acer Palmatum DissectumPrimrose
|   `* Re: Acer Palmatum DissectumAndy Burns
|    `* Re: Acer Palmatum DissectumMartin Brown
|     `* Re: Acer Palmatum DissectumAndy Burns
|      `- Re: Acer Palmatum DissectumAndy Burns
`* Re: Acer Palmatum DissectumChris Hogg
 `- Re: Acer Palmatum DissectumPrimrose

1
Acer Palmatum Dissectum

<t3bpt6$cu3$1@gioia.aioe.org>

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From: me...@privacy.net.co.uk (Primrose)
Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening
Subject: Acer Palmatum Dissectum
Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2022 13:53:56 +0100
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 by: Primrose - Fri, 15 Apr 2022 12:53 UTC

Can anyone help. I tried taking photos but it's so sunny the problem
doesn't show up.

The tree was fine this morning but when I went out just now I noticed
that a lot of the leaves are glistening with what feels like something
sticky.

I can't see any aphids or any ants on the tree.

Could I wash the leaves with a fine rose?
--
I'm a sew and sow.

Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum

<t3bqh3$jj5$1@gioia.aioe.org>

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From: me...@privacy.net.co.uk (Primrose)
Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening
Subject: Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum
Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2022 14:04:34 +0100
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 by: Primrose - Fri, 15 Apr 2022 13:04 UTC

On 15/04/2022 13:53, Primrose wrote:
> Can anyone help.  I tried taking photos but it's so sunny the problem
> doesn't show up.
>
> The tree was fine this morning but when I went out just now I noticed
> that a lot of the leaves are glistening with what feels like something
> sticky.
>
> I can't see any aphids or any ants on the tree.
>
> Could I wash the leaves with a fine rose?

I have just re-checked the tree with me specs on and there are some
minute soft bodied insects on the undersides of the leaves, a reddish
colour same as the Acer leaves.

Would a spray of soapy water do the trick please?
--
I'm a sew and sow.

Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum

<t3bsnt$7j5$1@dont-email.me>

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From: jmlay...@invalid.invalid (Jeff Layman)
Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening
Subject: Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum
Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2022 14:42:21 +0100
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 by: Jeff Layman - Fri, 15 Apr 2022 13:42 UTC

On 15/04/2022 14:04, Primrose wrote:
> On 15/04/2022 13:53, Primrose wrote:
>> Can anyone help.  I tried taking photos but it's so sunny the problem
>> doesn't show up.
>>
>> The tree was fine this morning but when I went out just now I noticed
>> that a lot of the leaves are glistening with what feels like something
>> sticky.
>>
>> I can't see any aphids or any ants on the tree.
>>
>> Could I wash the leaves with a fine rose?
>
> I have just re-checked the tree with me specs on and there are some
> minute soft bodied insects on the undersides of the leaves, a reddish
> colour same as the Acer leaves.
>
> Would a spray of soapy water do the trick please?

Sounds like red spider mite. It's somewhat unusual to find them outside
at this time of year, as they are usually greenhouse dwellers. The soapy
water won't hurt, but whether or not it will be effective you'll have to
wait and see. Hopefully the insect-eating birds will soon discover
there's something good to eat on your acer. I doubt the insects will do
much harm anyway.

--

Jeff

Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum

<t3bupl$nh4$1@gioia.aioe.org>

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From: me...@privacy.net.co.uk (Primrose)
Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening
Subject: Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum
Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2022 15:17:24 +0100
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <t3bupl$nh4$1@gioia.aioe.org>
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 by: Primrose - Fri, 15 Apr 2022 14:17 UTC

On 15/04/2022 14:42, Jeff Layman wrote:
> On 15/04/2022 14:04, Primrose wrote:
>> On 15/04/2022 13:53, Primrose wrote:
>>> Can anyone help.  I tried taking photos but it's so sunny the problem
>>> doesn't show up.
>>>
>>> The tree was fine this morning but when I went out just now I noticed
>>> that a lot of the leaves are glistening with what feels like something
>>> sticky.
>>>
>>> I can't see any aphids or any ants on the tree.
>>>
>>> Could I wash the leaves with a fine rose?
>>
>> I have just re-checked the tree with me specs on and there are some
>> minute soft bodied insects on the undersides of the leaves, a reddish
>> colour same as the Acer leaves.
>>
>> Would a spray of soapy water do the trick please?
>
> Sounds like red spider mite. It's somewhat unusual to find them outside
> at this time of year, as they are usually greenhouse dwellers. The soapy
> water won't hurt, but whether or not it will be effective you'll have to
> wait and see. Hopefully the insect-eating birds will soon discover
> there's something good to eat on your acer. I doubt the insects will do
> much harm anyway.
>

Thanks for your reply. I did go out and pick some of the bugs off by
hand and there are quite a few black coloured ones as well. Maybe it is
aphids after all. Never had this problem so early in the year if it is.
I usually see ants *milking* them first but no ants at the moment.

--
I'm a sew and sow.

Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum

<rb2j5h98ms9t0a9bg5jrdg1pmbj8ha9ql7@4ax.com>

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From: me...@privacy.net (Chris Hogg)
Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening
Subject: Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum
Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2022 16:07:37 +0100
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 by: Chris Hogg - Fri, 15 Apr 2022 15:07 UTC

On Fri, 15 Apr 2022 13:53:56 +0100, Primrose <me@privacy.net.co.uk>
wrote:

>Can anyone help. I tried taking photos but it's so sunny the problem
>doesn't show up.
>
>The tree was fine this morning but when I went out just now I noticed
>that a lot of the leaves are glistening with what feels like something
>sticky.
>
>I can't see any aphids or any ants on the tree.
>
>Could I wash the leaves with a fine rose?

As an alternative suggestion to Jeff's, are there any overhanging
branches from a nearby tree that might be drizzling nectar or have
aphids on it doing same?

--
Chris

Gardening in West Cornwall, very mild, sheltered
from the West, but open to the North and East.

Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum

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From: me...@privacy.net.co.uk (Primrose)
Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening
Subject: Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum
Date: Sat, 16 Apr 2022 08:43:54 +0100
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
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 by: Primrose - Sat, 16 Apr 2022 07:43 UTC

On 15/04/2022 16:07, Chris Hogg wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Apr 2022 13:53:56 +0100, Primrose <me@privacy.net.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
>> Can anyone help. I tried taking photos but it's so sunny the problem
>> doesn't show up.
>>
>> The tree was fine this morning but when I went out just now I noticed
>> that a lot of the leaves are glistening with what feels like something
>> sticky.
>>
>> I can't see any aphids or any ants on the tree.
>>
>> Could I wash the leaves with a fine rose?
>
> As an alternative suggestion to Jeff's, are there any overhanging
> branches from a nearby tree that might be drizzling nectar or have
> aphids on it doing same?
>

No, the tree has nothing overhead. I went out again to squash a few
more and ended up with sticky fingers, so it must be aphids. I should
have been more vigilant.

--
I'm a sew and sow.

Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum

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From: '''newsp...@nonad.co.uk (Martin Brown)
Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening
Subject: Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum
Date: Sat, 16 Apr 2022 09:14:32 +0100
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
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 by: Martin Brown - Sat, 16 Apr 2022 08:14 UTC

On 15/04/2022 15:17, Primrose wrote:
> On 15/04/2022 14:42, Jeff Layman wrote:
>> On 15/04/2022 14:04, Primrose wrote:
>>> On 15/04/2022 13:53, Primrose wrote:
>>>> Can anyone help.  I tried taking photos but it's so sunny the problem
>>>> doesn't show up.
>>>>
>>>> The tree was fine this morning but when I went out just now I noticed
>>>> that a lot of the leaves are glistening with what feels like something
>>>> sticky.
>>>>
>>>> I can't see any aphids or any ants on the tree.
>>>>
>>>> Could I wash the leaves with a fine rose?
>>>
>>> I have just re-checked the tree with me specs on and there are some
>>> minute soft bodied insects on the undersides of the leaves, a reddish
>>> colour same as the Acer leaves.
>>>
>>> Would a spray of soapy water do the trick please?
>>
>> Sounds like red spider mite. It's somewhat unusual to find them
>> outside at this time of year, as they are usually greenhouse dwellers.

There are a few outdoor sap sucking mites around at this time of year.

I have ones that go after my snowdrops and turn the foliage silver grey.
I was told that the only hope of a confirmed ID was electron microscopy
of the mouth parts. They are bigger than red spider but small enough to
need a loupe to see well. Slow moving dots to the naked eye. Leaf damage
is easily visible. No honeydew - that requires a lot of sap uptake.
(usually a symptom of aphid, mealy bug or scale)

My acers are yet to open their leaves. I have never seen any significant
sap sucking infestation on them. Beech hedge gets white fly almost every
year now. This year is a bit odd some pests have overwintered in number.
(as have the ladybirds)

It could be a year of plague levels of aphids and ladybirds like 1976?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-35603972

And in 1978 the aphids revenge

<https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=3ieCKl4BTZgC&pg=PA440&lpg=PA440&dq=1978+aphid+plague&source=bl&ots=jw0SOLtrvJ&sig=ACfU3U2zmc5bt5_-_bh9BFs_xMQljALupA&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiNmOe7-pb3AhXCmFwKHcHXCgoQ6AF6BAgoEAM#v=onepage&q=1978%20aphid%20plague&f=false>

Google aphid plague 1978 since the chances of that URL working are low.

>> The soapy water won't hurt, but whether or not it will be effective
>> you'll have to wait and see. Hopefully the insect-eating birds will
>> soon discover there's something good to eat on your acer. I doubt the
>> insects will do much harm anyway.
>
> Thanks for your reply.  I did go out and pick some of the bugs off by
> hand and there are quite a few black coloured ones as well.  Maybe it is
> aphids after all.  Never had this problem so early in the year if it is.
>  I usually see ants *milking* them first but no ants at the moment.

If they are big enough to see without a magnifying glass then they are
definitely *not* red spider mite. Some sort of aphid or scale would be
my guess. I once defoliated an acer using soft soap so on an ornamental
plant rather than a food crop I would probably be more inclined to use a
powerful systemic to see them off. YMMV

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum

<t3gihj$1tu$1@gioia.aioe.org>

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From: me...@privacy.net.co.uk (Primrose)
Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening
Subject: Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum
Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2022 09:18:59 +0100
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
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 by: Primrose - Sun, 17 Apr 2022 08:18 UTC

On 16/04/2022 09:14, Martin Brown wrote:
<Snipped>
>>>>
>>>> Would a spray of soapy water do the trick please?
>>>
>>> Sounds like red spider mite. It's somewhat unusual to find them
>>> outside at this time of year, as they are usually greenhouse dwellers.
>
> There are a few outdoor sap sucking mites around at this time of year.
>
> I have ones that go after my snowdrops and turn the foliage silver grey.
> I was told that the only hope of a confirmed ID was electron microscopy
> of the mouth parts. They are bigger than red spider but small enough to
> need a loupe to see well. Slow moving dots to the naked eye. Leaf damage
> is easily visible. No honeydew - that requires a lot of sap uptake.
> (usually a symptom of aphid, mealy bug or scale)
>
> My acers are yet to open their leaves. I have never seen any significant
> sap sucking infestation on them. Beech hedge gets white fly almost every
> year now. This year is a bit odd some pests have overwintered in number.
> (as have the ladybirds)
>
> It could be a year of plague levels of aphids and ladybirds like 1976?
>
> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-35603972

I remember that well, having to get a friend to pick off the ladybirds
out of my hair.

>
> And in 1978  the aphids revenge
>
> <https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=3ieCKl4BTZgC&pg=PA440&lpg=PA440&dq=1978+aphid+plague&source=bl&ots=jw0SOLtrvJ&sig=ACfU3U2zmc5bt5_-_bh9BFs_xMQljALupA&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiNmOe7-pb3AhXCmFwKHcHXCgoQ6AF6BAgoEAM#v=onepage&q=1978%20aphid%20plague&f=false>
>
>
> Google aphid plague 1978 since the chances of that URL working are low.
>
>>> The soapy water won't hurt, but whether or not it will be effective
>>> you'll have to wait and see. Hopefully the insect-eating birds will
>>> soon discover there's something good to eat on your acer. I doubt the
>>> insects will do much harm anyway.

It did give it spray of soapy suds.
>>
>> Thanks for your reply.  I did go out and pick some of the bugs off by
>> hand and there are quite a few black coloured ones as well.  Maybe it
>> is aphids after all.  Never had this problem so early in the year if
>> it is.   I usually see ants *milking* them first but no ants at the
>> moment.
>
> If they are big enough to see without a magnifying glass then they are
> definitely *not* red spider mite. Some sort of aphid or scale would be
> my guess. I once defoliated an acer using soft soap so on an ornamental
> plant rather than a food crop I would probably be more inclined to use a
> powerful systemic to see them off. YMMV

I can see them, some are black and others are the same colour as the
Acer leaves.

Thanks for the info.
>

--
I'm a sew and sow.

Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum

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From: use...@andyburns.uk (Andy Burns)
Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening
Subject: Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum
Date: Wed, 4 May 2022 20:06:08 +0100
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 by: Andy Burns - Wed, 4 May 2022 19:06 UTC

Martin Brown wrote:

> There are a few outdoor sap sucking mites around at this time of year.

Went down to my plot at the weekend, most of the trees have the newest inch or
two of growth covered in tiny black bugs ... must go spray them this weekend,

Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum

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From: '''newsp...@nonad.co.uk (Martin Brown)
Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening
Subject: Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum
Date: Fri, 6 May 2022 09:07:46 +0100
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 by: Martin Brown - Fri, 6 May 2022 08:07 UTC

On 04/05/2022 20:06, Andy Burns wrote:
> Martin Brown wrote:
>
>> There are a few outdoor sap sucking mites around at this time of year.
>
> Went down to my plot at the weekend, most of the trees have the newest
> inch or two of growth covered in tiny black bugs ... must go spray them
> this weekend,

What sort of trees? Most trees are plenty vigorous enough to support sap
sucking pests and the ladybirds and blue tits will take care of them.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum

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From: use...@andyburns.uk (Andy Burns)
Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening
Subject: Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum
Date: Fri, 6 May 2022 18:53:58 +0100
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 by: Andy Burns - Fri, 6 May 2022 17:53 UTC

Martin Brown wrote:

> Andy Burns wrote:
>
>> Martin Brown wrote:
>>
>>> There are a few outdoor sap sucking mites around at this time of year.
>>
>> Went down to my plot at the weekend, most of the trees have the newest inch or
>> two of growth covered in tiny black bugs ... must go spray them this weekend,
>
> What sort of trees? Most trees are plenty vigorous enough to support sap sucking
> pests and the ladybirds and blue tits will take care of them.

Spindles and sweet gum, the former seem to be most affected, they're also
looking thirstiest, running repairs to irrigation timer now completed ...

There are other, more established, trees around not looked at those ...

Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum

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From: use...@andyburns.uk (Andy Burns)
Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening
Subject: Re: Acer Palmatum Dissectum
Date: Sat, 7 May 2022 16:09:18 +0100
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 by: Andy Burns - Sat, 7 May 2022 15:09 UTC

Andy Burns wrote:

> Martin Brown wrote:
>
>> What sort of trees? Most trees are plenty vigorous enough to support sap
>> sucking pests and the ladybirds and blue tits will take care of them.

Went down today, most of the aphidthings have left or been picked off, but the
spindles are *really* dry, this years leaves drop if you brush past them.

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