"If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it
make a sound?"

If there is no one around to see it, did it fall.

Did it exist if there was no one around to see it?
--
0sterc@tcher -

"Où sont les neiges d'antan?"

Ah yes, and the whole universe is just one particle zipping around between
the frames of our perceived time and so in effect nothing truly exists at
all.
Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Nicholas D. Richards" <nicholas@salmiron.com> wrote in message
news:se6kviAwhWvjFA7S@salmiron.com...
> "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it
> make a sound?"
>
> If there is no one around to see it, did it fall.
>
> Did it exist if there was no one around to see it?
> --
> 0sterc@tcher -
>
> "O� sont les neiges d'antan?"

Nicholas D. Richards said:
> "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it
> make a sound?"
>
> If there is no one around to see it, did it fall.
>
> Did it exist if there was no one around to see it?

Yes.

What's the argument that it didn't ? Are we really that arrogant, to
think that nothing happens unless a member of this species happens to
notice it ?

Or if "no one" includes all other beings that might be affected, how
would there not be some one ? Trees In Outer Space ?

--
Richard Robinson
"The whole plan hinged upon the natural curiosity of potatoes" - S. Lem

My email address is at http://qualmograph.org.uk/contact.html

On 10/01/2023 13:55, Richard Robinson wrote:
> Nicholas D. Richards said:
>> "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it
>> make a sound?"
>>
>> If there is no one around to see it, did it fall.
>>
>> Did it exist if there was no one around to see it?
>
> Yes.
>
> What's the argument that it didn't ? Are we really that arrogant, to
> think that nothing happens unless a member of this species happens to
> notice it ?
>
> Or if "no one" includes all other beings that might be affected, how
> would there not be some one ? Trees In Outer Space ?
>

Does anything exist at all, beyond our own perception?

Is it all an illusion?

Do WE exist at all, or is something else imagining us?

Are there crumpets for tea?

Tone

On 2023-01-10, Nicholas D. Richards <nicholas@salmiron.com> wrote:
> "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it
> make a sound?"
>
> If there is no one around to see it, did it fall.
>
> Did it exist if there was no one around to see it?

What happens if you are under the tree when it Fall?. Are you dead?

On 2023-01-10, Tone <tone@email.com> wrote:
> On 10/01/2023 13:55, Richard Robinson wrote:
>> Nicholas D. Richards said:
>>> "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it
>>> make a sound?"
>>>
>>> If there is no one around to see it, did it fall.
>>>
>>> Did it exist if there was no one around to see it?
>>
>> Yes.
>>
>> What's the argument that it didn't ? Are we really that arrogant, to
>> think that nothing happens unless a member of this species happens to
>> notice it ?
>>
>> Or if "no one" includes all other beings that might be affected, how
>> would there not be some one ? Trees In Outer Space ?
>>
>
> Does anything exist at all, beyond our own perception?
>
> Is it all an illusion?
>
> Do WE exist at all, or is something else imagining us?
>
> Are there crumpets for tea?
>
> Tone

Plato's cave, and there was a Bishop of Cork that wrote on that, but
probably only about Cork, and we know what Cork is like.

--
greymausg@mail.com

Fe, Fi, Fo, Fum, I smell the stench of an Influencer.
Where is our money gone, Dude?

On 10/01/2023 15:10, greymaus wrote:
> On 2023-01-10, Tone <tone@email.com> wrote:
>> On 10/01/2023 13:55, Richard Robinson wrote:
>>> Nicholas D. Richards said:
>>>> "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it
>>>> make a sound?"
>>>>
>>>> If there is no one around to see it, did it fall.
>>>>
>>>> Did it exist if there was no one around to see it?
>>>
>>> Yes.
>>>
>>> What's the argument that it didn't ? Are we really that arrogant, to
>>> think that nothing happens unless a member of this species happens to
>>> notice it ?
>>>
>>> Or if "no one" includes all other beings that might be affected, how
>>> would there not be some one ? Trees In Outer Space ?
>>>
>>
>> Does anything exist at all, beyond our own perception?
>>
>> Is it all an illusion?
>>
>> Do WE exist at all, or is something else imagining us?
>>
>> Are there crumpets for tea?
>>
>> Tone
>
>
> Plato's cave, and there was a Bishop of Cork that wrote on that, but
> probably only about Cork, and we know what Cork is like.
>
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ye_Antient_Order_of_Noble_Corks

Coincidentally, I recently found out that one of my great grandfathers
was master of a local lodge...

Chris

On 10/01/2023 13:30, Nicholas D. Richards wrote:
> "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it
> make a sound?"
>
> If there is no one around to see it, did it fall.
>
> Did it exist if there was no one around to see it?

"Dear Sir: Your astonishment's odd,
"I am always about in the quad."
And that's why the tree.
Will continue to be,
Since observed by, Yours faithfully, God.”.

--
Rusty Hinge
To err is human. To really foul things up requires a computer and the BOFH.

On 10-Jan-23 13:30, Nicholas D. Richards wrote:
> "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it
> make a sound?"
>
> If there is no one around to see it, did it fall.
>
> Did it exist if there was no one around to see it?

Certainly.
Your accountant will reduce the ledger value of that parcel of land,
since the standing timber has been reduced.
HTH.

--
Sam Plusnet

On 10/01/2023 17:57, RustyHinge wrote:

> So was one of mine, and I inherited all of his regalia, which I gave to
> his erstwhile lodge - now, seeing the price these things fetch, I'm
> wondering if I did the right thing...
>
There is the right thing, and there is the Right Thing. Most such
organisations say that they are the owners and that the regalia are only
lent/ hired to the member, even if made to order by a third party.
--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On Tue, 10 Jan 2023 13:53:40 -0000
"Brian Gaff" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:

> Ah yes, and the whole universe is just one particle zipping around
> between the frames of our perceived time and so in effect nothing truly
> exists at all.

Going forwards in time it's a particle, going backwards it's an
anti-particle, there's only one and it cancels itself out at both ends of
time. The technical term is "vacuum diagram".

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/

I guess its all how you perceive reality in the first place.
Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Ahem A Rivet's Shot" <steveo@eircom.net> wrote in message
news:20230110185627.36b6bd28ce4b9e7086f65abd@eircom.net...
> On Tue, 10 Jan 2023 13:53:40 -0000
> "Brian Gaff" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Ah yes, and the whole universe is just one particle zipping around
>> between the frames of our perceived time and so in effect nothing truly
>> exists at all.
>
> Going forwards in time it's a particle, going backwards it's an
> anti-particle, there's only one and it cancels itself out at both ends of
> time. The technical term is "vacuum diagram".
>
> --
> Steve O'Hara-Smith
> Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/

Yes so three hi res Sats in orbit will see all trees fall, but then if no
human is watching the monitors....
I think this one has been put to bed long ago.
The bigger question is what is reeality in the first place.
Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Richard Robinson" <richard@qualmograph.org.uk> wrote in message
news:tpjqp6$i7kr$1@dont-email.me...
> Nicholas D. Richards said:
>> "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it
>> make a sound?"
>>
>> If there is no one around to see it, did it fall.
>>
>> Did it exist if there was no one around to see it?
>
> Yes.
>
> What's the argument that it didn't ? Are we really that arrogant, to
> think that nothing happens unless a member of this species happens to
> notice it ?
>
> Or if "no one" includes all other beings that might be affected, how
> would there not be some one ? Trees In Outer Space ?
>
> --
> Richard Robinson
> "The whole plan hinged upon the natural curiosity of potatoes" - S. Lem
>
> My email address is at http://qualmograph.org.uk/contact.html

On Wed, 11 Jan 2023 11:07:39 -0000, Brian Gaff <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:
> Yes so three hi res Sats in orbit will see all trees fall, but then if no
> human is watching the monitors....
> I think this one has been put to bed long ago.
>
> The bigger question is what is reeality in the first place.

The answer is easy. Reality is for people who can't
handle drugs.

--
Don't be impressed by money, followers, degrees, and titles. Be
impressed by kindness, integrity, humility, and generosity. Richard Feynman

On Wed, 11 Jan 2023 11:07:39 -0000
"Brian Gaff" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:

> The bigger question is what is reeality in the first place.

Reality is that which does not go away when you stop believing in
it.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/

On 11/01/2023 11:27, Julian Macassey wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Jan 2023 11:07:39 -0000, Brian Gaff <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Yes so three hi res Sats in orbit will see all trees fall, but then if no
>> human is watching the monitors....
>> I think this one has been put to bed long ago.
>>
>> The bigger question is what is reeality in the first place.
>
> The answer is easy. Reality is for people who can't
> handle drugs.

Or won't.

--
Rusty Hinge
To err is human. To really foul things up requires a computer and the BOFH.

In article <tpjtpk$ih0e$1@dont-email.me>, Tone <tone@email.com> on
Tue, 10 Jan 2023 at 14:47:12 awoke Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote
>
>Does anything exist at all, beyond our own perception?
>
>Is it all an illusion?
>
>Do WE exist at all, or is something else imagining us?
>
>Are there crumpets for tea?
>
No, I ate the illusory crumpets for breakfast.

Mmmm
--
0sterc@tcher -

"Où sont les neiges d'antan?"

Nicholas D. Richards said:
> In article <tpjtpk$ih0e$1@dont-email.me>, Tone <tone@email.com> on
> Tue, 10 Jan 2023 at 14:47:12 awoke Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote
>>
>>Does anything exist at all, beyond our own perception?
>>
>>Is it all an illusion?
>>
>>Do WE exist at all, or is something else imagining us?
>>
>>Are there crumpets for tea?
>>
> No, I ate the illusory crumpets for breakfast.
>
> Mmmm

But if you're an illusion, perhaps the crumpets didn't get eaten ?
I can't see them, though.

If all the universities shut down their philosophy courses, would fewer
trees get blown down ? Was a fallen sapling observed by a student, but
it takes a Professor to observe the collapse of a big old one ? Could a
Doctor of Philosophy make it better ?

It can't be a very nice wbo, having to go out and hang about in the
forestry plantations whenever there's a storm.

--
Richard Robinson
"The whole plan hinged upon the natural curiosity of potatoes" - S. Lem

My email address is at http://qualmograph.org.uk/contact.html

On 2023-01-11, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Jan 2023 11:07:39 -0000
> "Brian Gaff" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> The bigger question is what is reeality in the first place.
>
> Reality is that which does not go away when you stop believing in
> it.
>
=+

On 11/01/2023 14:33, Richard Robinson wrote:
> It can't be a very nice wbo, having to go out and hang about in the
> forestry plantations whenever there's a storm.

Ah but I'm a lumberjack and I'm okay.......

Tone

In article <tpmhb5$tutt$1@dont-email.me>, Richard Robinson
<richard@qualmograph.org.uk> on Wed, 11 Jan 2023 at 14:33:09 awoke
Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote
>Nicholas D. Richards said:
>> In article <tpjtpk$ih0e$1@dont-email.me>, Tone <tone@email.com> on
>> Tue, 10 Jan 2023 at 14:47:12 awoke Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote
>>>
>>>Does anything exist at all, beyond our own perception?
>>>
>>>Is it all an illusion?
>>>
>>>Do WE exist at all, or is something else imagining us?
>>>
>>>Are there crumpets for tea?
>>>
>> No, I ate the illusory crumpets for breakfast.
>>
>> Mmmm
>
>But if you're an illusion, perhaps the crumpets didn't get eaten ?
>I can't see them, though.
>
>
>If all the universities shut down their philosophy courses, would fewer
>trees get blown down ?

Similarly, if all the universities shut down their Theoretical Physics
Departments would all cats be safe if they jumped into a box?

--
0sterc@tcher -

"Où sont les neiges d'antan?"

On 11-Jan-23 11:05, Brian Gaff wrote:

> I guess its all how you perceive reality in the first place.

I don't so much 'perceive' reality as hide from it.

--
Sam Plusnet

Tone <tone@email.com> writes:

> On 11/01/2023 14:33, Richard Robinson wrote:
>
>> It can't be a very nice wbo, having to go out and hang about in the
>> forestry plantations whenever there's a storm.
>
> Ah but I'm a lumberjack and I'm okay.......

I see you are a logger
And not just a common bum
For nobody but a logger
Stirs his coffee with his thumb.

Er, um, is there a different inference if it's tea with milk?

--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada

Nicholas D. Richards said:
> In article <tpmhb5$tutt$1@dont-email.me>, Richard Robinson
>>
>>If all the universities shut down their philosophy courses, would fewer
>>trees get blown down ?
>
> Similarly, if all the universities shut down their Theoretical Physics
> Departments would all cats be safe if they jumped into a box?

Is it a carpetted box ? Has some hooter smeared their back with butter ?

--
Richard Robinson
"The whole plan hinged upon the natural curiosity of potatoes" - S. Lem

My email address is at http://qualmograph.org.uk/contact.html

On 11/01/2023 11:32, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Jan 2023 11:07:39 -0000
> "Brian Gaff" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> The bigger question is what is reeality in the first place.
>
> Reality is that which does not go away when you stop believing in
> it.
>
but what about those things I don't believe in that won't go away?

--
Nev
It causes me a great deal of regret and remorse
that so many people are unable to understand what I write.