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aus+uk / uk.sport.cricket / Re: Essex fined 50000stg

SubjectAuthor
* Essex fined 50000stgmax.it
`* Re: Essex fined 50000stgRH
 +* Re: Essex fined 50000stgjack fredricks
 |`* Re: Essex fined 50000stgJohn Hall
 | +* Re: Essex fined 50000stgRH
 | |`* Re: Essex fined 50000stgjack fredricks
 | | `* Re: Essex fined 50000stgRH
 | |  `* Re: Essex fined 50000stgjack fredricks
 | |   `- Re: Essex fined 50000stgRH
 | +* Re: Essex fined 50000stgHVS
 | |`- Re: Essex fined 50000stgMike Holmans
 | `- Re: Essex fined 50000stgjack fredricks
 `* Re: Essex fined 50000stgjack fredricks
  `* Re: Essex fined 50000stgRH
   `- Re: Essex fined 50000stgjack fredricks

1
Essex fined 50000stg

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Subject: Essex fined 50000stg
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 by: max.it - Thu, 5 May 2022 15:18 UTC

https://resources.ecb.co.uk/ecb/document/2022/05/05/6164e901-ef8e-423d-9bbe-f559aecb7ca4/CDC-Disciplinary-hearing-Essex-CCC.pdf

max.it

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Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
From: anywhere...@gmail.com (RH)
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 by: RH - Thu, 5 May 2022 16:47 UTC

On Thursday, May 5, 2022 at 4:18:51 PM UTC+1, max.it wrote:
> https://resources.ecb.co.uk/ecb/document/2022/05/05/6164e901-ef8e-423d-9bbe-f559aecb7ca4/CDC-Disciplinary-hearing-Essex-CCC.pdf
>
>
> max.it

Note: Yet another squeezing free expression... RH

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/essex-fined-50-000-after-accepting-historic-racism-charges-1313656
Essex have been fined £50,000 and warned as to the club's future conduct after accepting two charges relating to a historic racist comment.

The club pleaded guilty to the charge that John Faragher, the former chair, used the offensive term "n***** in the woodpile" during a board meeting in February 2017, and also acknowledged that it had failed to conduct a timely investigation into the matter.

Faragher, who resigned last November, continues to deny the allegation, having insisted in a social media post in February that the process had been "entirely reactive and fundamentally unfair", and driven to a large extent by Essex's and the ECB's desire to avoid the mistakes made by Yorkshire in their handling of Azeem Rafiq's allegations of institutional racism.

To that end, the written findings of the CDC panel commend John Stephenson, Essex's chief executive and interim chair, for doing "all within his power" to take internal action on the matter, but noted that "he has been thwarted by the ECCC board, which has been paralysed by division". This includes last week's resignation of Wasim Haq, the board member who blew the whistle on Faragher's comments, alongside fellow board member Paul Harvey.

"The use of racist and discriminatory language such as this is plainly unacceptable: it's utterance by a club chair is all the more deplorable," the summary continued.

"It is clear that the club has failed to uphold the standards expected of it, not only in respect of the conduct of its former chair but also as regards its failure to act appropriately or at all thereafter.

"It is also clear that the impact of this breach has had a negative effect both upon the game of cricket and upon the ECB."

Nevertheless, the panel - chaired by Ricky Needham, alongside Amrisha Parathalingam and Mark Milliken-Smith QC - also concluded that a points deduction would be inappropriate given that the comments had been made by a non-player away from the field, and allowed for £15,000 of the fine to be suspended for two years.

The club was also credited for its "significant motivation" to tackle racism and to "re-energise" its "historically positive approach to its EDI obligations", both within the club and the wider community.

Responding to the CDC findings, Essex said in a statement: "The club has a zero-tolerance policy towards racism and any form of discrimination. We continue to work with the ECB to eradicate discrimination from the game, which includes implementing their 12-point action plan and the club's further commitment to equality, diversity and inclusion policies and processes."

Read more at https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/essex-fined-50-000-after-accepting-historic-racism-charges-1313656

RH

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
From: jzfredri...@gmail.com (jack fredricks)
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 by: jack fredricks - Fri, 6 May 2022 00:31 UTC

On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 2:47:23 AM UTC+10, RH wrote:
> The club pleaded guilty to the charge that John Faragher, the former chair, used the offensive term "n***** in the woodpile" during a board meeting in February 2017, and also acknowledged that it had failed to conduct a timely investigation into the matter.

And this racist John Faragher still denies it?

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
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 by: jack fredricks - Fri, 6 May 2022 00:32 UTC

On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 2:47:23 AM UTC+10, RH wrote:
> Note: Yet another squeezing free expression... RH

Yay! Bring it on!
There's no future in the corporate world for racists like him.

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
From: anywhere...@gmail.com (RH)
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 by: RH - Fri, 6 May 2022 08:19 UTC

On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 1:32:39 AM UTC+1, jzfre...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 2:47:23 AM UTC+10, RH wrote:
> > Note: Yet another squeezing free expression... RH
> Yay! Bring it on!
> There's no future in the corporate world for racists like him.

Thank you for outing yourself as an unambiguous enemy of free expression... RH

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
From: jzfredri...@gmail.com (jack fredricks)
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 by: jack fredricks - Fri, 6 May 2022 09:32 UTC

On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 6:19:11 PM UTC+10, RH wrote:
> On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 1:32:39 AM UTC+1, jzfre...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 2:47:23 AM UTC+10, RH wrote:
> > > Note: Yet another squeezing free expression... RH
> > Yay! Bring it on!
> > There's no future in the corporate world for racists like him.
> Thank you for outing yourself as an unambiguous enemy of free expression... RH

Just telling how it is. Racists like this will get shown the door.

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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From: john_nos...@jhall.co.uk (John Hall)
Newsgroups: uk.sport.cricket
Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
Date: Fri, 6 May 2022 16:36:26 +0100
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 by: John Hall - Fri, 6 May 2022 15:36 UTC

In message <954e8ab2-2ade-41bc-8f36-c6ddd63c5dccn@googlegroups.com>,
jack fredricks <jzfredricks@gmail.com> writes
>On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 2:47:23 AM UTC+10, RH wrote:
>> The club pleaded guilty to the charge that John Faragher, the former
>>chair, used the offensive term "n***** in the woodpile" during a board
>>meeting in February 2017, and also acknowledged that it had failed to
>>conduct a timely investigation into the matter.
>
>And this racist John Faragher still denies it?

It was obviously a very bad thing to say, but I imagine he said it
without thinking and bitterly regretted it afterwards. Sixty or so years
ago, when he (and I) were growing up, it was a very common metaphor.
--
John Hall
"Home is heaven and orgies are vile,
But you *need* an orgy, once in a while."
Ogden Nash (1902-1971)

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
From: anywhere...@gmail.com (RH)
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 by: RH - Fri, 6 May 2022 16:17 UTC

On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 4:44:51 PM UTC+1, John Hall wrote:
> In message <954e8ab2-2ade-41bc...@googlegroups.com>,
> jack fredricks <jzfre...@gmail.com> writes
> >On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 2:47:23 AM UTC+10, RH wrote:
> >> The club pleaded guilty to the charge that John Faragher, the former
> >>chair, used the offensive term "n***** in the woodpile" during a board
> >>meeting in February 2017, and also acknowledged that it had failed to
> >>conduct a timely investigation into the matter.
> >
> >And this racist John Faragher still denies it?
> It was obviously a very bad thing to say, but I imagine he said it
> without thinking and bitterly regretted it afterwards. Sixty or so years
> ago, when he (and I) were growing up, it was a very common metaphor.
> --
> John Hall
> "Home is heaven and orgies are vile,
> But you *need* an orgy, once in a while."
> Ogden Nash (1902-1971)

The investigatory procedures in both Yorkshire and Essex 's cases are laughable in terms of being innocent till proven guilty. The whole of the proceedings, both legal and in the media , comes across as a show trial with a predetermined outcome. Moreover, the civil law test of on balance of probabilities appears to being used rather than the beyond a reasonable doubt. In view of the serious consequences for those found "guilty" they should at least have the benefit of the criminal law Test. RH

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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From: off...@REMOVETHISwhhvs.co.uk (HVS)
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Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
Date: Fri, 06 May 2022 17:53:26 +0100
Organization: I'd rather have more
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 by: HVS - Fri, 6 May 2022 16:53 UTC

On 06 May 2022, John Hall wrote

> In message
> <954e8ab2-2ade-41bc-8f36-c6ddd63c5dccn@googlegroups.com>, jack
> fredricks <jzfredricks@gmail.com> writes
>> On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 2:47:23 AM UTC+10, RH wrote:
>>> The club pleaded guilty to the charge that John Faragher, the
>>> former chair, used the offensive term "n***** in the woodpile"
>>> during a board meeting in February 2017, and also acknowledged
>>> that it had failed to conduct a timely investigation into the
>>> matter.
>>
>> And this racist John Faragher still denies it?
>
> It was obviously a very bad thing to say, but I imagine he said it
> without thinking and bitterly regretted it afterwards. Sixty or so
> years ago, when he (and I) were growing up, it was a very common
> metaphor.

I'd not cut him that amount of slack on it.

I'll shortly turn 70, and while I agree that it was a common metaphor
WIWAL, I don't see how anybody who hasn't been living in a cave
hasn't realised that it's been an unacceptable usage for at least the
past 30 or 40 years.

--
Cheers, Harvey

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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From: spa...@jackalope.uk (Mike Holmans)
Newsgroups: uk.sport.cricket
Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
Date: Fri, 06 May 2022 20:03:49 +0100
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 by: Mike Holmans - Fri, 6 May 2022 19:03 UTC

On Fri, 06 May 2022 17:53:26 +0100, HVS <office@REMOVETHISwhhvs.co.uk>
wrote:

>On 06 May 2022, John Hall wrote
>
>> In message
>> <954e8ab2-2ade-41bc-8f36-c6ddd63c5dccn@googlegroups.com>, jack
>> fredricks <jzfredricks@gmail.com> writes
>>> On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 2:47:23 AM UTC+10, RH wrote:
>>>> The club pleaded guilty to the charge that John Faragher, the
>>>> former chair, used the offensive term "n***** in the woodpile"
>>>> during a board meeting in February 2017, and also acknowledged
>>>> that it had failed to conduct a timely investigation into the
>>>> matter.
>>>
>>> And this racist John Faragher still denies it?
>>
>> It was obviously a very bad thing to say, but I imagine he said it
>> without thinking and bitterly regretted it afterwards. Sixty or so
>> years ago, when he (and I) were growing up, it was a very common
>> metaphor.
>
>I'd not cut him that amount of slack on it.
>
>I'll shortly turn 70, and while I agree that it was a common metaphor
>WIWAL, I don't see how anybody who hasn't been living in a cave
>hasn't realised that it's been an unacceptable usage for at least the
>past 30 or 40 years.

I could just about take it if he'd said it and apologised immediately:
for those of us of a certain age, the phrase might well pop into one's
head and come out before one could stop oneself, but an "...in the
woodpile - oh, er, um, sorry, no, I didn't, um, er, well anyway, not
that..." as the immediate consequence would have dealt with it.

Cheers,

Mike

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
From: jzfredri...@gmail.com (jack fredricks)
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 by: jack fredricks - Fri, 6 May 2022 21:24 UTC

On Saturday, May 7, 2022 at 1:44:51 AM UTC+10, John Hall wrote:
> >And this racist John Faragher still denies it?
> It was obviously a very bad thing to say, but I imagine he said it
> without thinking and bitterly regretted it afterwards. Sixty or so years
> ago, when he (and I) were growing up, it was a very common metaphor.

I think most things (especially if first time offending) are forgivable, if the apology is sincere enough.

Now imagine if he did say it, and everyone else on today's Essex board *knows* he said and that his denial is a sham.

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
From: jzfredri...@gmail.com (jack fredricks)
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 by: jack fredricks - Fri, 6 May 2022 21:26 UTC

On Saturday, May 7, 2022 at 2:17:29 AM UTC+10, RH wrote:
> The investigatory procedures in both Yorkshire and Essex 's cases are laughable in terms of being innocent till proven guilty. The whole of the proceedings, both legal and in the media , comes across as a show trial with a predetermined outcome. Moreover, the civil law test of on balance of probabilities appears to being used rather than the beyond a reasonable doubt. In view of the serious consequences for those found "guilty" they should at least have the benefit of the criminal law Test. RH

Yep. Find those racists and metaphorically exterminate them.

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
From: anywhere...@gmail.com (RH)
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 by: RH - Sat, 7 May 2022 10:15 UTC

On Friday, May 6, 2022 at 10:26:18 PM UTC+1, jzfre...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Saturday, May 7, 2022 at 2:17:29 AM UTC+10, RH wrote:
> > The investigatory procedures in both Yorkshire and Essex 's cases are laughable in terms of being innocent till proven guilty. The whole of the proceedings, both legal and in the media , comes across as a show trial with a predetermined outcome. Moreover, the civil law test of on balance of probabilities appears to being used rather than the beyond a reasonable doubt. In view of the serious consequences for those found "guilty" they should at least have the benefit of the criminal law Test. RH
> Yep. Find those racists and metaphorically exterminate them.

I can imagine you in East Germany under the Stasi... RH

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
From: jzfredri...@gmail.com (jack fredricks)
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 by: jack fredricks - Sat, 7 May 2022 10:33 UTC

On Saturday, May 7, 2022 at 8:15:39 PM UTC+10, RH wrote:
> I can imagine you in East Germany under the Stasi... RH

I can imagine you dreaming of East Germany.

Re: Essex fined 50000stg

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Subject: Re: Essex fined 50000stg
From: anywhere...@gmail.com (RH)
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 by: RH - Sat, 7 May 2022 14:58 UTC

On Saturday, May 7, 2022 at 11:33:33 AM UTC+1, jzfre...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Saturday, May 7, 2022 at 8:15:39 PM UTC+10, RH wrote:
> > I can imagine you in East Germany under the Stasi... RH
> I can imagine you dreaming of East Germany.

.......informing away...RH

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