On 25/06/2023 21:49, Sam Plusnet wrote:

> On motorway & dual cabbageway, I was tootling along using cruise control
> & then enabled "Lane Keeping assist"[1].
> It looks for the white lines ahead, & tries to keep you in your lane of
> the road. but...
>
> 1. The system doesn't trust the driver - since it demands that you keep
> your hands on the wheel and make adjustments (to show you haven't gone
> to sleep or practiceing yoga poses instead of steering).

Practising yoga poses, if only.
>
> 2. The driver doesn't trust the system - it can, and occasionally does,
> screw up, so you find yourself constantly nudging it to left or right.
>
> So... we have two agencies which are trying to steer the car, & neither
> one trusts the other.
>
> [1] Might not be the correct name but it's sommat like that.

I turn it off basically as soon as the 'infotainment'(horrible name)
system starts up.
It gives a "BEEP " if you cross the lines without indicating and if
you ignore that it steers you back into lane I HATE the feeling of the
car 'grabbing the wheel' and trying to turn the car (easily overrode but
I still hate the feeling).

I absolutely love the cruise control (adaptive) it keeps distance as
well as travels at the speed of the car in front up to the speed you
set. Great for slow(ish) traffic on Motorways and dual cabbageways.

ASIDE :- A pal of mine who is a driving instructor was telling me how he
set the ACC at 85MPH on motorways and left it there. If there was any
traffic ahead of him the car slowed to that speed and at 85MPH the
ecilop tended to not care (looking for nineties and up)

There is also a (setable[Wd?]) max speed to stop you speeding I have
not played with that much.

On 26/06/2023 12:02, soup wrote:
>   I absolutely love the cruise control (adaptive) it keeps distance as
> well as travels at the speed of the car in front up to the speed you
> set.  Great for slow(ish) traffic on Motorways and dual cabbageways.

But beware of the vehicle ahead that leaves the carriageway and then
stops abruptly with its rear hanging out. Adaptive cruise control would
have had me take off that hanging out bit if I hadn't been sharp on the
brakes! Never trusted it again.

HTH, Chris

On 26/06/2023 14:18, chrisnd@privacy.net wrote:
> On 26/06/2023 12:02, soup wrote:
>>    I absolutely love the cruise control (adaptive) it keeps distance
>> as well as travels at the speed of the car in front up to the speed
>> you set.  Great for slow(ish) traffic on Motorways and dual cabbageways.
>
> But beware of the vehicle ahead that leaves the carriageway and then
> stops abruptly with its rear hanging out.  Adaptive cruise control would
> have had me take off that hanging out bit if I hadn't been sharp on the
> brakes!   Never trusted it again.
>

Mine has created a panic when a car in front leaves the carriageway and
_doesn't_ hang out - yet it still contemplates initiating emergency
breaking.

On 26/06/2023 21:19, Sam Plusnet wrote:
> On 26/06/2023 14:18, chrisnd@privacy.net wrote:
>> On 26/06/2023 12:02, soup wrote:
>>>    I absolutely love the cruise control (adaptive) it keeps distance
>>> as well as travels at the speed of the car in front up to the speed
>>> you set.  Great for slow(ish) traffic on Motorways and dual cabbageways.
>>
>> But beware of the vehicle ahead that leaves the carriageway and then
>> stops abruptly with its rear hanging out.  Adaptive cruise control
>> would have had me take off that hanging out bit if I hadn't been sharp
>> on the brakes!   Never trusted it again.

I haven't had any scares yet . May well change my attitude then, but
until it happens ... .

> Mine has created a panic when a car in front leaves the carriageway and
> _doesn't_ hang out - yet it still contemplates initiating emergency
> breaking.

I have had a few false positives (usually when the road meanders causing
the car too 'think' that a car parked at the side of the road is in the
lane driving very slow or even stopped). This annoys me rather than
frightens me
However I have NO control over this 'crash mitigation system'.

The ACC does not affect the emergency braking. It will slow the car
but usually this is done by regenerative braking (it is a self charging
hybrid) but it (in-itself) does not initiate emergency braking this is
done by the 'crash mitigation system'.
>

On 27/06/2023 13:54, soup wrote:
> I have had a few false positives (usually when the road meanders causing
> the car too 'think' that a car parked at the side of the road is in the
> lane driving very slow or even stopped).  This annoys me rather than
> frightens me
>   However I have NO control over this 'crash mitigation system'.
>
>   The ACC does not affect the emergency braking. It will slow the car
> but usually this is done by regenerative braking (it is a self charging
> hybrid) but it (in-itself) does not initiate emergency braking this is
> done by the 'crash mitigation system'.

Everyone to his/her own of course, but I have never liked any driving
aids apart from synchromesh and power steering. I've enjoyed driving all
my life, but only if I'm in control, and at one time the heavier, wider,
higher and longer the bettererer. I was a low loader driver on and of
for 30 years carrying plant and machinery all over the country.

If cars are going to start steering themselves on cruise control,
rendering you a passenger, then you might as well flog it and get taxis.

It would probably be cheapererer too.

Tone

Tone <tone@email.com> wrote in news:u7eoh2$1ddc2$1@dont-email.me:

> On 27/06/2023 13:54, soup wrote:
>> I have had a few false positives (usually when the road meanders
>> causing the car too 'think' that a car parked at the side of the road
>> is in the lane driving very slow or even stopped).  This annoys me
>> rather than frightens me
>>   However I have NO control over this 'crash mitigation system'.
>>
>>   The ACC does not affect the emergency braking. It will slow the
>> car
>> but usually this is done by regenerative braking (it is a self
>> charging hybrid) but it (in-itself) does not initiate emergency
>> braking this is done by the 'crash mitigation system'.
>
> Everyone to his/her own of course, but I have never liked any driving
> aids apart from synchromesh and power steering. I've enjoyed driving
> all my life, but only if I'm in control, and at one time the heavier,
> wider, higher and longer the bettererer. I was a low loader driver on
> and of for 30 years carrying plant and machinery all over the country.
>
> If cars are going to start steering themselves on cruise control,
> rendering you a passenger, then you might as well flog it and get
> taxis.
>
> It would probably be cheapererer too.

You had synchromesh and power steering? good grief, don't know you're born.

More seriously, I dislike driving. I've been driving for over half a
century and never been comfortable, so the more driver-assist features the
better for me. I have for some time thought I would give up when I turn 80:
only 3 years away now. But in the meantime SWMBO needs me to drive, so I
do.

Excavated sheep, I was in a collision today. Trying to manouvre into a
space in an underground fishboat when a concrete pillar drove into me.
Definately the pillar's fault but it was uninsured and had no licence. A
few scratches, which the car can wear as a badge of hounour - I can't be
nefrd to get it fixed.

--
Peter
-----

On 27/06/2023 15:42, Peter wrote:
> You had synchromesh and power steering? good grief, don't know you're born.

Not when I first started on an old Atkinson. Crash box and a giant
steering wheel, that you couldn't turn in reverse!

Tone

On 27/06/2023 16:26, Tone wrote:
> On 27/06/2023 15:42, Peter wrote:
>> You had synchromesh and power steering? good grief, don't know you're
>> born.
>
> Not when I first started on an old Atkinson. Crash box and a giant
> steering wheel, that you couldn't turn in reverse!

At around 16 I was driving (on private property) a 2¼ ton Morris
Commercial Petrol-injuned dropside lorry. This had a crash gearbox, and
while it dd sport a self-starter, we always had to use the
2-broken-thumbs-if-you-don't'-know-how-to-hold-the-crank-handle-properly
method, because of vehicular intransigence.

When that failed, it took at least Arthur Duzzen Scouts to bump-start
the thing.

Power steering? That was way in the future when our lorry was chiselled
out of the virgin rock.

When we acquired it we needed to redecorate the exterior, but a) didn't
have and b) couldn't afford the paint to do a half-tidy wbo, so everyone
in the crew rummaged around and contributed what part tins etc of paint
we had, or could scrounge.

This was all mixed together regardless of type, and we ended up with a
104 Green khaki gunge - a mixture of oil-based and cellulose paints
which was remarkably tenacious in its clingability and protective
properties.

Double-declutching and matching revs without recourse to the clutch when
changing gear has always been a doddle when later needed as a fallback.

--
Rusty Hinge
To err is human. To really foul things up requires a computer and the BOFH.

On 27/06/2023 13:54, soup wrote:
> On 26/06/2023 21:19, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>> On 26/06/2023 14:18, chrisnd@privacy.net wrote:
>>> On 26/06/2023 12:02, soup wrote:
>>>>    I absolutely love the cruise control (adaptive) it keeps distance
>>>> as well as travels at the speed of the car in front up to the speed
>>>> you set.  Great for slow(ish) traffic on Motorways and dual
>>>> cabbageways.
>>>
>>> But beware of the vehicle ahead that leaves the carriageway and then
>>> stops abruptly with its rear hanging out.  Adaptive cruise control
>>> would have had me take off that hanging out bit if I hadn't been
>>> sharp on the brakes!   Never trusted it again.
>
> I haven't had any scares yet .  May well change my attitude then, but
> until it happens ... .
>
>> Mine has created a panic when a car in front leaves the carriageway
>> and _doesn't_ hang out - yet it still contemplates initiating
>> emergency breaking.
>
> I have had a few false positives (usually when the road meanders causing
> the car too 'think' that a car parked at the side of the road is in the
> lane driving very slow or even stopped).  This annoys me rather than
> frightens me

I meant the car seemed to panic - making lots of alarums and excursions.

T'was indeed the crash mitigation system rather than the lane following
stuff - but both use the same set of sensors.
Crash mitigation (not the correct name on my car) is a two stage thing.
1. Loud noises to warn driver.
2. Apply brakes (as hard as necessary), if driver still doesn't react.

>   However I have NO control over this 'crash mitigation system'.

Haven't checked lately, but I'm pretty sure I can switch that option off.
>
>   The ACC does not affect the emergency braking. It will slow the car
> but usually this is done by regenerative braking (it is a self charging
> hybrid) but it (in-itself) does not initiate emergency braking this is
> done by the 'crash mitigation system'.
>>
>

On 27/06/2023 19:49, RustyHinge wrote:

> At around 16 I was driving (on private property) a 2¼ ton Morris
> Commercial Petrol-injuned dropside lorry.

I probably wasn't even born then .
No shade RH, all meant in fun, would have put a smiley but I know
emoticons are frowned on in ye shedde

> This had a crash gearbox, and
> while it dd sport a self-starter, we always had to use the
> 2-broken-thumbs-if-you-don't'-know-how-to-hold-the-crank-handle-properly
> method, because of vehicular intransigence.
>
> When that failed, it took at least Arthur Duzzen Scouts to bump-start
> the thing.
>
> Power steering? That was way in the future when our lorry was chiselled
> out of the virgin rock.

> Double-declutching and matching revs without recourse to the clutch when
> changing gear  has always been a doddle when later needed as a fallback.

I am a mere stripling of 60 and only started driving about six years
ago. Had to learn as wife was becoming immobile and it would help
transporting my son about.

I live in a wee village(Balerno) on the outskirts of a city(Edinburgh)
with a fantastic bus service (lothian buses twenty minutes apart and a
SMT [first bus] every twenty minutes however these buses were staggered
so every ten minutes there was a bus into the city. So never felt the
need to drive untill buses became problematic

Apart from a couple of bangers for about a month each, I have always
had new self charging hybrids . Have never had to deal with crash
gearboxes or double de clutching or any of that stuff. I realise
driving in 'the olden days' required a different skill set which I
probably could learn after a while but I am glad I don't have too.
I prefer my speed limiter, my ACC and most other driving aids.
Lane keeping assist I hate, and any other system which takes control of
the steering

Sam Plusnet <not@home.com> wrote in
news:gsImM.245511$mzn5.97403@fx09.ams1:

>
> I meant the car seemed to panic - making lots of alarums and
> excursions.
>

Did it exit persued by a bear?

--
Peter
-----