Nicholas D. Richards wrote:

> In article <khn1e1Fe50dU1@mid.individual.net>, Bob Henson
> <bob.henson@outlook.com> on Tue, 18 Jul 2023 at 09:39:30 awoke Nicholas
> from his slumbers and wrote
>>On 17.7.23 11:40 pm, Nicholas D. Richards wrote:
>>> In article <1qe19ii.1imhgrv3p2a6dN%snipeco.2@gmail.com>, Sn!pe
>>> <snipeco.2@gmail.com> on Mon, 17 Jul 2023 at 22:14:30 awoke Nicholas
>>> from his slumbers and wrote
>>>>Nicholas D. Richards <nicholas@salmiron.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> A lot of effective OTC drugs cannot be prescribed by doctors on the NHS
>>>>> because they are OTC. In other words the doctor is saving on his
>>>>> prescribing budget. Brian is wrong Imodium is OTC.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>The active ingredient in Immodium is Loperamide. A well known
>>>>nationwide chain of pharmacies whose name begins with 'B' do an
>>>>OTC own-brand Loperamide bum-blocker at a fraction of the cost.
>>>>
>>> This is true for many OTC drugs and at independent pharmacies, not just
>>> at my son's employers. I never ask for Immodium, I always ask for
>>> Loperamide, and if you ask nicely, you may find they have a large packet
>>> saving even more.
>>>
>>> Ask for Cetirizine rather than Piriton or Piriteze.
>>
>>I always offered them in the pharmacy. It was not surprising that when
>>you halved someone's expenses by telling them about generic equivalents
>>they continued to return to that pharmacy - so despite lower short term
>>takings it was good business as well as (I considered) the correct thing
>>to do ethically speaking.
>>
>>The thing that might surprise you is the number of people who insisted
>>on paying for Nurofen, for example, when generic ibuprofen was
>>considerably cheaper because it was advertised on TV and therefore must
>>work much better than the cheap one. The power of the Idiot's Lantern
>>(as our philosophy master used to call it) is immense.
>>
> Yes but .....
>
> The power of suggestion may make Nurofen work better ... for them. If
> they believed that a generic Ibuprofen was Nurofen it work just as well
> in relieving pain and inflammation.
>
> If I was still allowed to take Nurofen, sorry Ibuprofen, I would ask the
> pharmacy for Ibuprofen and would specifically ask for the generic if
> offered Nurofen (that has happened to me).
>
> If you pay more for a product you may believe, unconsciously, that you
> are getting a better product, just because you paid more. Of course it
> may be, objectively, a better product, but not because you paid more for
> it.

What occasionally is different is the tableting/packing standards of the
products. Some of the generic products that are now prescribed (as distinct
from "Over The Counter" products, which are usually nicely finished) may
well conform to all the standards for constituents etc. but the products
are poorly made and crumble when handled etc. Since retirement I have no
control over what I get any more and neither does the pharmacist who
dispenses them to me - they are sent whichever manufacturer's generic
products are cheapest and most profitable for the wholesalers.

I recently sent some naproxen tablets back to the manufacturer as they
broke almost every time I pressed them out of their foil with a tablet
extractor. They wrote back to say they conformed to all standards and
ignored my comment that all the other "brands" that I got were better than
theirs and did not break when so handled.

That's what you get for the NHS's policy of "cheapo, besto" as it used to
be called. A while back the NHS paid slightly less than the packaging costs
for aspirin 75mg dispersible, for example, (they may still do) so the
manufacturer lost money on every pack they made. Go private and the doc can
specify the original manufacturers brand (consistently the best) on your
prescription - but they will cost you as a patient - sometimes a huge
amount more.

--
Bob
Tetbury, Gloucestershire, England

Did you hear about the cow that liked jazz? It mooed indigo.

On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 09:12:00 +0100
Bob Henson <bob.henson@outlook.com> wrote:

> We separated them from the perfume and priced the brushes at £3.50 each
> and both the brushes and the perfume sold like ripe cherries. A strange
> variation on the "too cheap" theme.

Perhaps, but how many people bought both at the same time ?

I suspect the problem with sales wasn't "too cheap" but rather that
it was an odd combination that nobody normally bought together and few
would take the time to notice that the brush was free.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/
Host: Beautiful Theory meet Inconvenient Fact
Obit: Beautiful Theory died today of factual inconsistency

Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:

> On Wed, 19 Jul 2023 09:12:00 +0100
> Bob Henson <bob.henson@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>> We separated them from the perfume and priced the brushes at £3.50 each
>> and both the brushes and the perfume sold like ripe cherries. A strange
>> variation on the "too cheap" theme.
>
> Perhaps, but how many people bought both at the same time ?
>
> I suspect the problem with sales wasn't "too cheap" but rather that
> it was an odd combination that nobody normally bought together and few
> would take the time to notice that the brush was free.

It was clearly marked as free - but I think you are right about the reason.

If I were the sort of person to identify as a lady's perfume user I would
have bought the perfume and used the unwanted brush for dusting talc on
baby's bums, dusting my keyboard or some similar excercise.

--
Bob
Tetbury, Gloucestershire, England

Doctor: I don't like the looks of your wife at all.
Husband: Me neither doc, but she's a great cook and really good with the
kids.

On 18-Jul-23 19:28, Richard Robinson wrote:
> Sam Plusnet said:
>> On 18-Jul-23 9:39, Bob Henson wrote:
>>>
>>> The thing that might surprise you is the number of people who insisted
>>> on paying for Nurofen, for example, when generic ibuprofen was
>>> considerably cheaper because it was advertised on TV and therefore must
>>> work much better than the cheap one. The power of the Idiot's Lantern
>>> (as our philosophy master used to call it) is immense.
>>>
>> It's not just TV advertising, there are whole categories of 'products'
>> which would never sell if they were too cheap.
>> They have to be "Reassuringly Expensive".
>>
>> Perfumes, face creams, make-up etc. etc.
>
> I still catch myself doing it - I suspect the assumption is that the
> price reflects the care/work/thought/generalgoodness that went into
> making it.

Them Marketing people don't come cheap.

--
Sam Plusnet

On 18/07/2023 13:05, John Williamson wrote:
> On 18/07/2023 12:30, RustyHinge wrote:
>
>> POM? OTC?
>>
>> ITWSBT
>>
>>
> Prescription Only Medication and (Drugs available on request) Over The
> Counter.
>
> On a few occasions, before I started getting free prescriptions, I was
> told by the pharmacist that the drug I had been prescribed was cheaper
> to buy over the counter than the prescription charge. The NHS have now
> caught on to this and GPs no longer prescribe the cheaper OTC drugs.

They're no longer allowed to prescribe any OTC drugs. There are certain
exemptions from this:

https://www.england.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/1a-over-the-counter-leaflet-v1.pdf

although I don't understand the logic behind the second exemption:

You need treatment for more complex forms of minor illnesses, e.g.
migraines that are very bad and where over the counter medicines do not
work.

If OTC medicines don't work, why would you want them?

On 24/07/2023 15:54, Mike Fleming wrote:
> On 18/07/2023 13:05, John Williamson wrote:
>> On 18/07/2023 12:30, RustyHinge wrote:
>>
>>> POM? OTC?
>>>
>>> ITWSBT
>>>
>>>
>> Prescription Only Medication and (Drugs available on request) Over The
>> Counter.
>>
>> On a few occasions, before I started getting free prescriptions, I was
>> told by the pharmacist that the drug I had been prescribed was cheaper
>> to buy over the counter than the prescription charge. The NHS have now
>> caught on to this and GPs no longer prescribe the cheaper OTC drugs.
>
> They're no longer allowed to prescribe any OTC drugs. There are certain
> exemptions from this:
>
> https://www.england.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/1a-over-the-counter-leaflet-v1.pdf
>
>
> although I don't understand the logic behind the second exemption:
>
> You need treatment for more complex forms of minor illnesses, e.g.
> migraines that are very bad and where over the counter medicines do not
> work.
>
> If OTC medicines don't work, why would you want them?

Because in many cases, they are used in addition to prescription drugs.
Neither will do the job on their own, but in combination, they work for you.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On 24/07/2023 16:26, John Williamson wrote:
> On 24/07/2023 15:54, Mike Fleming wrote:
>>
>> They're no longer allowed to prescribe any OTC drugs. There are certain
>> exemptions from this:
>>
>> https://www.england.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/1a-over-the-counter-leaflet-v1.pdf
>>
>> although I don't understand the logic behind the second exemption:
>>
>> You need treatment for more complex forms of minor illnesses, e.g.
>> migraines that are very bad and where over the counter medicines do not
>> work.
>>
>> If OTC medicines don't work, why would you want them?
>
> Because in many cases, they are used in addition to prescription drugs.
> Neither will do the job on their own, but in combination, they work for
> you.

It doesn't say that, though.

On 25/07/2023 14:54, Mike Fleming wrote:
> On 24/07/2023 16:26, John Williamson wrote:
>> On 24/07/2023 15:54, Mike Fleming wrote:
>>> If OTC medicines don't work, why would you want them?
>>
>> Because in many cases, they are used in addition to prescription
>> drugs. Neither will do the job on their own, but in combination, they
>> work for you.
>
> It doesn't say that, though.

The link is to a pamphlet designed to be read by those who are not
medically trained, are whinging about having to pay for what used to be
free, and there is a limited amount of space in the booklet (Ref:-
"Earth - Harmless". The NHS guidelines are probably rather more than the
length of the leaflet.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On 25/07/2023 16:43, John Williamson wrote:
> On 25/07/2023 14:54, Mike Fleming wrote:
>> On 24/07/2023 16:26, John Williamson wrote:
>>> On 24/07/2023 15:54, Mike Fleming wrote:
>>>> If OTC medicines don't work, why would you want them?
>>>
>>> Because in many cases, they are used in addition to prescription
>>> drugs. Neither will do the job on their own, but in combination, they
>>> work for you.
>>
>> It doesn't say that, though.
>
> The link is to a pamphlet designed to be read  by those who are not
> medically trained, are whinging about having to pay for what used to be
> free, and there is a limited amount of space in the booklet (Ref:-
> "Earth - Harmless". The NHS guidelines are probably rather more than the
> length of the leaflet.

Appending the word "alone" would clarify the statement.