There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for instance the
16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening, and the
peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
being left on the platform at Leeds.

--
Jeremy Double

Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for instance the
> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening, and the
> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>

Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?

In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar 2022,
Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:

>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for instance the
>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening, and the
>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>
>Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?

Places round here are.

The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).

The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".

A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
have stayed at home too.

A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps a
fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
staff shortage.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar 2022,
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for instance the
>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening, and the
>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>
>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>
> Places round here are.
>
> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>
> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>
> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
> have stayed at home too.
>
> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps a
> fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
> staff shortage.

There’s other bugs around at the moment. My wife and I have both had a
fairly bad dose of something. Seemingly not covid as it won’t trip the
lateral flow tests. If employers and employees are taking the exhortations
to stay at home when ill seriously this will lead to staff shortages.

In message <t0cbq8$e1r$1@dont-email.me>, at 08:10:48 on Thu, 10 Mar
2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar 2022,
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for instance the
>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening, and the
>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>
>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>
>> Places round here are.
>>
>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>
>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>
>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>> have stayed at home too.
>>
>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps a
>> fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>> staff shortage.
>
>There’s other bugs around at the moment. My wife and I have both had a
>fairly bad dose of something. Seemingly not covid as it won’t trip the
>lateral flow tests. If employers and employees are taking the exhortations
>to stay at home when ill seriously this will lead to staff shortages.

Yes, my wife has had a bug recently, but not Covid (according to lateral
flow tests anyway) despite some overlapping symptoms.

However, there's been a rash of my sixty-something Facebook friends the
last couple of weeks reporting positive lateral flow tests, and not a
little frustration that they've either had Covid before (in the original
surge), or are fully jabbed, or both. I even know someone [younger] who
is fully jabbed from the outset, and had Covid three times now.
--
Roland Perry

On 10/03/2022 11:01, Roland Perry wrote:
> In message <t0cbq8$e1r$1@dont-email.me>, at 08:10:48 on Thu, 10 Mar
> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar 2022,
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>> instance the
>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>> and the
>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>> causing
>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>
>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>
>>> Places round here are.
>>>
>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>
>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>
>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>
>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps a
>>> fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>> staff shortage.
>>
>> There’s other bugs around at the moment. My wife and I have both had a
>> fairly bad dose of something. Seemingly not covid as it won’t trip the
>> lateral flow tests. If employers and employees are taking the
>> exhortations
>> to stay at home when ill seriously this will lead to staff shortages.
>
> Yes, my wife has had a bug recently, but not Covid (according to lateral
> flow tests anyway) despite some overlapping symptoms.
>
> However, there's been a rash of my sixty-something Facebook friends the
> last couple of weeks reporting positive lateral flow tests, and not a
> little frustration that they've either had Covid before (in the original
> surge), or are fully jabbed, or both. I even know someone [younger] who
> is fully jabbed from the outset, and had Covid three times now.

Had it three times or just tested positive three times? The tests aren't
foolproof.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On 10/03/2022 08:10, Tweed wrote:
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar 2022,
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for instance the
>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening, and the
>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>
>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>
>> Places round here are.
>>
>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>
>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".

Indirectly, yes, because so few people are travelling abroad that it's
more more profitable to leave the zero-hours staff at home.

Our local Morrisons had only one checkout open at peak shopping time on
Saturday. As I drove away to spend my money elsewhere, I wondered
whether it was "due to Covid" or simply an attempt to force us into the
barely functional self-service tills.

In message <t0cnc6$aqb$2@dont-email.me>, at 11:28:06 on Thu, 10 Mar
2022, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:

>>> There’s other bugs around at the moment. My wife and I have both
>>>had a fairly bad dose of something. Seemingly not covid as it
>>>won’t trip the lateral flow tests. If employers and employees are
>>>taking the exhortations to stay at home when ill seriously this will
>>>lead to staff shortages.

>> Yes, my wife has had a bug recently, but not Covid (according to
>>lateral flow tests anyway) despite some overlapping symptoms.

>> However, there's been a rash of my sixty-something Facebook friends
>>the last couple of weeks reporting positive lateral flow tests, and
>>not a little frustration that they've either had Covid before (in the
>>original surge), or are fully jabbed, or both. I even know someone
>>[younger] who is fully jabbed from the outset, and had Covid three times now.
>
>Had it three times or just tested positive three times? The tests
>aren't foolproof.

Had it bad enough to be bedridden for days. Not feeling well enough to
go back to work for over a week. And after the first infection showing
several persistent symptoms of "Long Covid".

And of course it's not just people *with* Covid who are causing staff
shortages.

Many hospitals are still requiring that people going for a routine
procedure take a day off to have a test, then self-isolate the remainder
of that day, and the following two, and all of the final day up until
their appointment. So which might previously have been a half day (or
less) out of circulation, it's now four days.

And being banned from using public transport too, there might be a
relative having to take two half-days off to act as a chauffeur.

I have no idea what the current regime is for people claiming special
sick pay for such periods. (Whether patient or chauffeur).

Extrapolating the system I know pertains in some office buildings, while
no doubt train crew rest facilities have the same rules about maximum
occupancy and social distancing as other industries... If one crew
member tests positive, do they quarantine the room and disinfect it, and
notify all the crew who might have been in contact to take time off
until they've had <<whatever number>> of daily negative lateral flow
tests?

That's all very well for offices where home-working methods are in place
(ie work from home for ?three? days rather than come into the office)
you can't really drive/guard a train from home.
--
Roland Perry

In message <t0cq8j$a28$1@dont-email.me>, at 12:17:22 on Thu, 10 Mar
2022, Certes <none@nowhere.net> remarked:
>On 10/03/2022 08:10, Tweed wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar 2022,
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>instance the
>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this
>>>>>evening, and the
>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>
>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>
>>> Places round here are.
>>>
>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>
>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>
>Indirectly, yes, because so few people are travelling abroad that it's
>more more profitable to leave the zero-hours staff at home.

The staff presumably work for Tesco Bank, and I don't know what kind of
contracts they have. But only opening for say three days a week (like
the Deli counters) for reasons of lack-of-business, isn't really
"because of Covid" which on signs like that imply that the staff are
having to self-isolate (and there's no cover staff available - that
latter not something I'm particularly surprised about).

>Our local Morrisons had only one checkout open at peak shopping time on
>Saturday. As I drove away to spend my money elsewhere, I wondered
>whether it was "due to Covid" or simply an attempt to force us into the
>barely functional self-service tills.

Oddly enough that ~20 till Tesco of mine only had two open, when
normally it would be at least four or five. So I used the self-checkout
for the first time in perhaps a year, also because I was only doing a
top-up shop.

Imagine my surprise, not to have to wait for an assistant to tear
themselves away from chatting to a colleague to validate the purchase of
a bottle of wine. It just went straight through.

Sainsburys are worse. If only they had some flashing lights above each
till when the customer required such assistance, to avoid them having to
wave their arms in the air or call out. Oh wait...
--
Roland Perry

On 10/03/2022 12:23, Roland Perry wrote:
> In message <t0cnc6$aqb$2@dont-email.me>, at 11:28:06 on Thu, 10 Mar
> 2022, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>
>>>> There’s other bugs around at the moment. My wife and I have both had
>>>> a  fairly bad dose of something. Seemingly not covid as it won’t
>>>> trip the  lateral flow tests. If employers and employees are taking
>>>> the exhortations  to stay at home when ill seriously this will lead
>>>> to staff shortages.
>
>>>  Yes, my wife has had a bug recently, but not Covid (according to
>>> lateral  flow tests anyway) despite some overlapping symptoms.
>
>>>  However, there's been a rash of my sixty-something Facebook friends
>>> the  last couple of weeks reporting positive lateral flow tests, and
>>> not a  little frustration that they've either had Covid before (in
>>> the original  surge), or are fully jabbed, or both. I even know
>>> someone [younger] who  is fully jabbed from the outset, and had Covid
>>> three times now.
>>
>> Had it three times or just tested positive three times? The tests
>> aren't foolproof.
>
> Had it bad enough to be bedridden for days. Not feeling well enough to
> go back to work for over a week. And after the first infection showing
> several persistent symptoms of "Long Covid".
>
> And of course it's not just people *with* Covid who are causing staff
> shortages.
>
> Many hospitals are still requiring that people going for a routine
> procedure take a day off to have a test, then self-isolate the remainder
> of that day, and the following two, and all of the final day up until
> their appointment. So which might previously have been a half day (or
> less) out of circulation, it's now four days.

Yup, just done that!

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On 10/03/2022 12:31, Roland Perry wrote:
> In message <t0cq8j$a28$1@dont-email.me>, at 12:17:22 on Thu, 10 Mar
> 2022, Certes <none@nowhere.net> remarked:
>> On 10/03/2022 08:10, Tweed wrote:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>> 2022,
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this
>>>>>> evening, and the
>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>> causing
>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with
>>>>>> passengers
>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>
>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>
>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>
>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>
>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>
>> Indirectly, yes, because so few people are travelling abroad that it's
>> more more profitable to leave the zero-hours staff at home.
>
> The staff presumably work for Tesco Bank, and I don't know what kind of
> contracts they have. But only opening for say three days a week (like
> the Deli counters) for reasons of lack-of-business, isn't really
> "because of Covid" which on signs like that imply that the staff are
> having to self-isolate (and there's no cover staff available - that
> latter not something I'm particularly surprised about).
>
>> Our local Morrisons had only one checkout open at peak shopping time on
>> Saturday.  As I drove away to spend my money elsewhere, I wondered
>> whether it was "due to Covid" or simply an attempt to force us into the
>> barely functional self-service tills.
>
> Oddly enough that ~20 till Tesco of mine only had two open, when
> normally it would be at least four or five. So I used the self-checkout
> for the first time in perhaps a year, also because I was only doing a
> top-up shop.
>
> Imagine my surprise, not to have to wait for an assistant to tear
> themselves away from chatting to a colleague to validate the purchase of
> a bottle of wine. It just went straight through.
>
> Sainsburys are worse. If only they had some flashing lights above each
> till when the customer required such assistance, to avoid them having to
> wave their arms in the air or call out. Oh wait...

I've walked out of both Morrisons and Tesco when they've not responded
quickly enough to my request assistance. An operative for the former
chased me out of the store thinking I'd forgotten my stuff!

In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for instance the
>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening, and the
>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>
>>Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>
>Places round here are.
>
>The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).

And another year group added just now (for Friday's lessons).
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <t0cq8j$a28$1@dont-email.me>, at 12:17:22 on Thu, 10 Mar
> 2022, Certes <none@nowhere.net> remarked:
>> On 10/03/2022 08:10, Tweed wrote:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar 2022,
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this
>>>>>> evening, and the
>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>
>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>
>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>
>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>
>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>
>> Indirectly, yes, because so few people are travelling abroad that it's
>> more more profitable to leave the zero-hours staff at home.
>
> The staff presumably work for Tesco Bank, and I don't know what kind of
> contracts they have. But only opening for say three days a week (like
> the Deli counters) for reasons of lack-of-business, isn't really
> "because of Covid" which on signs like that imply that the staff are
> having to self-isolate (and there's no cover staff available - that
> latter not something I'm particularly surprised about).
>
>> Our local Morrisons had only one checkout open at peak shopping time on
>> Saturday. As I drove away to spend my money elsewhere, I wondered
>> whether it was "due to Covid" or simply an attempt to force us into the
>> barely functional self-service tills.
>
> Oddly enough that ~20 till Tesco of mine only had two open, when
> normally it would be at least four or five. So I used the self-checkout
> for the first time in perhaps a year, also because I was only doing a
> top-up shop.
>
> Imagine my surprise, not to have to wait for an assistant to tear
> themselves away from chatting to a colleague to validate the purchase of
> a bottle of wine. It just went straight through.

My local co-op can remotely ‘ok’ such issues from the staffed till, which
overlooks the self service tills. They have a screen that flags up any
issues on the self service tills and allows them to deal with them, even
while they’re serving other customers. Something like taking a glance to
ensure the user is over 18 is an easy confirmation. It gives the impression
that the check hasn’t been done, but it has.

Sainsburys on the other hand, seems to require an overly-stressed staff
member to enter a ridiculous number of screen-taps at the till itself even
for the simplest of issues.

Lidl seem to have a halfway house where the staff member needs to attend
the till, but has a key fob that they tap on the till which immediately
brings up the relevant issue and the options to resolve it.

I’ve always been interested in how the weigh-scales work, I gather
different supermarkets have different ‘rules’. A Sainsburys employee told
me that, past a certain point, the machine only waits for a change in
weight rather than actually checking the supposed weight of the item.

Lidl tills seem to be far more intolerant, and will throw a wobble if the
item does not weigh what it is expecting. (Can be an issue with magazines…)

Of course, Waitrose presumably trust their customers more and have
dispensed with the weighing part altogether.

Lew

Lew 1 wrote:

>I’ve always been interested in how the weigh-scales work, I gather
>different supermarkets have different ‘rules’. A Sainsburys employee told
>me that, past a certain point, the machine only waits for a change in
>weight rather than actually checking the supposed weight of the item.

I have an issue with Tesco self-checkout. I only pop in for a few
items I can't get elsewhere, so my shopping bag often has items
in it already. When I put it down as an "own bag" it is clearly
set up only to accept an empty bag, and it has therefore to be
authorised.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK
chris@cdixon.me.uk @ChrisJDixon1

Plant amazing Acers.

Chris J Dixon <chris@cdixon.me.uk> wrote:
> Lew 1 wrote:
>
>> I’ve always been interested in how the weigh-scales work, I gather
>> different supermarkets have different ‘rules’. A Sainsburys employee told
>> me that, past a certain point, the machine only waits for a change in
>> weight rather than actually checking the supposed weight of the item.
>
> I have an issue with Tesco self-checkout. I only pop in for a few
> items I can't get elsewhere, so my shopping bag often has items
> in it already. When I put it down as an "own bag" it is clearly
> set up only to accept an empty bag, and it has therefore to be
> authorised.
>
> Chris

In that situation I just put the items on the weigh platform without a bag,
and then move them to my bag at the end. Not a problem if just a few items.

In message <380938557.668676162.219967.email-nowhere.com@web.aioe.org>,
at 07:37:38 on Fri, 11 Mar 2022, Lew 1 <email@nowhere.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <t0cq8j$a28$1@dont-email.me>, at 12:17:22 on Thu, 10 Mar
>> 2022, Certes <none@nowhere.net> remarked:
>>> On 10/03/2022 08:10, Tweed wrote:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar 2022,
>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this
>>>>>>> evening, and the
>>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
>>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>>
>>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>>
>>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>>
>>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>
>>> Indirectly, yes, because so few people are travelling abroad that it's
>>> more more profitable to leave the zero-hours staff at home.
>>
>> The staff presumably work for Tesco Bank, and I don't know what kind of
>> contracts they have. But only opening for say three days a week (like
>> the Deli counters) for reasons of lack-of-business, isn't really
>> "because of Covid" which on signs like that imply that the staff are
>> having to self-isolate (and there's no cover staff available - that
>> latter not something I'm particularly surprised about).
>>
>>> Our local Morrisons had only one checkout open at peak shopping time on
>>> Saturday. As I drove away to spend my money elsewhere, I wondered
>>> whether it was "due to Covid" or simply an attempt to force us into the
>>> barely functional self-service tills.
>>
>> Oddly enough that ~20 till Tesco of mine only had two open, when
>> normally it would be at least four or five. So I used the self-checkout
>> for the first time in perhaps a year, also because I was only doing a
>> top-up shop.
>>
>> Imagine my surprise, not to have to wait for an assistant to tear
>> themselves away from chatting to a colleague to validate the purchase of
>> a bottle of wine. It just went straight through.
>
>My local co-op can remotely ‘ok’ such issues from the staffed till, which
>overlooks the self service tills. They have a screen that flags up any
>issues on the self service tills and allows them to deal with them, even
>while they’re serving other customers. Something like taking a glance to
>ensure the user is over 18 is an easy confirmation. It gives the impression
>that the check hasn’t been done, but it has.

Yes, they do that at a Co-op convenience store near me, but that's just
two manual tills (almost always only one manned, and even then they
disappear to do shelf-stacking from time to time) and two self-checkout
tills.

However, at the Tesco the self-checkout area and staffed tills are not
realistically close enough to do that (and even if they were, the
nearest manned till would get overwhelmed by the demand from a dozen
self-checkout tills). The roving staff also have to deal with issues a
the self-scanned (while shopping) checkouts.

--
Roland Perry

In message <1o1m2htfj2f55cnadb3b8u5g1b5m14jtbj@4ax.com>, at 08:27:05 on
Fri, 11 Mar 2022, Chris J Dixon <chris@cdixon.me.uk> remarked:
>Lew 1 wrote:
>
>>I’ve always been interested in how the weigh-scales work, I gather
>>different supermarkets have different ‘rules’. A Sainsburys employee told
>>me that, past a certain point, the machine only waits for a change in
>>weight rather than actually checking the supposed weight of the item.
>
>I have an issue with Tesco self-checkout. I only pop in for a few
>items I can't get elsewhere, so my shopping bag often has items
>in it already. When I put it down as an "own bag" it is clearly
>set up only to accept an empty bag, and it has therefore to be
>authorised.

AFAIK, they are all like that. It's an anti-theft thing of course. How
do they know the items in the bag aren't ones being shoplifted? It's
also often the case that a pair of *empty* bags weighs too much,
especially the "bag for life" style.
--
Roland Perry

On 11/03/2022 08:56, Roland Perry wrote:
> In message <1o1m2htfj2f55cnadb3b8u5g1b5m14jtbj@4ax.com>, at 08:27:05 on
> Fri, 11 Mar 2022, Chris J Dixon <chris@cdixon.me.uk> remarked:
>> Lew 1 wrote:
>>
>>> I’ve always been interested in how the weigh-scales work, I gather
>>> different supermarkets have different ‘rules’. A Sainsburys employee
>>> told
>>> me that, past a certain point, the  machine only waits for a change in
>>> weight rather than actually checking the supposed weight of the item.
>>
>> I have an issue with Tesco self-checkout. I only pop in for a few
>> items I can't get elsewhere, so my shopping bag often has items
>> in it already. When I put it down as an "own bag" it is clearly
>> set up only to accept an empty bag, and it has therefore to be
>> authorised.
>
> AFAIK, they are all like that. It's an anti-theft thing of course. How
> do they know the items in the bag aren't ones being shoplifted? It's
> also often the case that a pair of *empty* bags weighs too much,
> especially the "bag for life" style.

My old-fashioned canvas bag is too heavy for some of the tills but works
on others.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On 11/03/2022 09:01, Tweed wrote:
> Chris J Dixon <chris@cdixon.me.uk> wrote:
>> Lew 1 wrote:
>>
>>> I’ve always been interested in how the weigh-scales work, I gather
>>> different supermarkets have different ‘rules’. A Sainsburys employee told
>>> me that, past a certain point, the machine only waits for a change in
>>> weight rather than actually checking the supposed weight of the item.
>>
>> I have an issue with Tesco self-checkout. I only pop in for a few
>> items I can't get elsewhere, so my shopping bag often has items
>> in it already. When I put it down as an "own bag" it is clearly
>> set up only to accept an empty bag, and it has therefore to be
>> authorised.
>>
>> Chris
>
> In that situation I just put the items on the weigh platform without a bag,
> and then move them to my bag at the end. Not a problem if just a few items.

I've not tried it, but you should be able to put a purchase of very
variable weight such as a melon down inside the bag as the first item,
then be able to add other items to the bag as normal.

In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for instance the
>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening, and the
>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled, causing
>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>
>>Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>
>Places round here are.
>
>The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>
>The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>
>A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>have stayed at home too.
>
>A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps a
>fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>staff shortage.

Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
and going out partying?

Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
Wednesday.
--
Roland Perry

On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>> instance the
>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>> and the
>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>> causing
>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>
>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>
>> Places round here are.
>>
>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>
>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>
>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>> have stayed at home too.
>>
>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>> staff shortage.
>
> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
> and going out partying?
>
> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
> Wednesday.

I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
after a positive test?

<martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>> instance the
>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>> and the
>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>> causing
>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>
>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>
>>> Places round here are.
>>>
>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>
>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>
>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>
>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>> staff shortage.
>>
>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>> and going out partying?
>>
>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>> Wednesday.
>
> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
> after a positive test?
>

Correct: self-isolation is no longer a legal requirement. People may choose
to do it, as with flu, but in neither case does the government intervene.

Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>>> and the
>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>> causing
>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>
>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>
>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>
>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>
>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>>
>>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>>
>>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>>>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>>> staff shortage.
>>>
>>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>>> and going out partying?
>>>
>>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>> Wednesday.
>>
>> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>> after a positive test?
>>
>
> Correct: self-isolation is no longer a legal requirement. People may choose
> to do it, as with flu, but in neither case does the government intervene.
>
>

I’m up in Edinburgh. The place is already heaving with tourists. My hotel
was hosting two late “Christmas” parties. Although mask wearing indoors is
still compulsory for a few more weeks, observance is very patchy. Nobody
was wearing one on the LNER service post the Scottish border. The medical
event I attended yesterday was maskless once the ceremony got going. Nobody
is taking covid precautions seriously here.

On 12/03/2022 11:19, Tweed wrote:
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>>> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>>>> and the
>>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>>> causing
>>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>>
>>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>>
>>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>>
>>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>>>
>>>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>>>
>>>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>>>>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>>>> staff shortage.
>>>>
>>>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>>>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>>>> and going out partying?
>>>>
>>>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>>> Wednesday.
>>>
>>> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>>> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>>> after a positive test?
>>>
>>
>> Correct: self-isolation is no longer a legal requirement. People may choose
>> to do it, as with flu, but in neither case does the government intervene.
>>
>>
>
> I’m up in Edinburgh. The place is already heaving with tourists. My hotel
> was hosting two late “Christmas” parties. Although mask wearing indoors is
> still compulsory for a few more weeks, observance is very patchy. Nobody
> was wearing one on the LNER service post the Scottish border. The medical
> event I attended yesterday was maskless once the ceremony got going. Nobody
> is taking covid precautions seriously here.

Which partially explains why the Scottish covid rates are rising at such
a spectacularly high rate at the moment.

<martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
> On 12/03/2022 11:19, Tweed wrote:
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>>>> On 12/03/2022 10:12, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>>> In message <r6RPImT8raKiFAUC@perry.uk>, at 07:38:36 on Thu, 10 Mar 2022,
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>> In message <t0b96a$4hl$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:19:54 on Wed, 9 Mar
>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>> Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There seem to be issues with driver shortages on Northern, for
>>>>>>>> instance the
>>>>>>>> 16:35 Bradford train from Huddersfield was bustituted this evening,
>>>>>>>> and the
>>>>>>>> peak 17:18 Skipton train from Leeds (a 4 car EMU) was cancelled,
>>>>>>>> causing
>>>>>>>> the 2 car 17:26 Morecambe train to be completely full, with passengers
>>>>>>>> being left on the platform at Leeds.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Surely they're not still being affected by Covid self-isolation?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Places round here are.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The local secondary school has gone back to home-tutoring some
>>>>>> year-groups because of staff absences (not to stop spread amongst the
>>>>>> students, because apparently that's not something we do any more).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The Bureau-de-change at Tesco was shut yesterday "Because of Covid".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A friend went to a chiropractor at the start of last week, and got a
>>>>>> phone call the next day saying the chap had tested positive. I think
>>>>>> it's most unlikely he didn't cancel his appointments for at least a
>>>>>> week. The friend has done daily flow tests, and one PCR, and fingers
>>>>>> crossed is negative. Had they been in work, I suspect my friend would
>>>>>> have stayed at home too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A local restaurant hasn't had its big wheely bins emptied for perhaps
>>>>>> a fortnight, and they are now piled high with the lids open. Unless
>>>>>> they've failed to pay the bill, this must be due to Mr Biffa having a
>>>>>> staff shortage.
>>>>>
>>>>> Biffa still not been around, and national news yesterday was that
>>>>> infections up 20% in a week. 30-39 year olds most affected, maybe
>>>>> they are throwing caution to the winds, thrown their masks away,
>>>>> and going out partying?
>>>>>
>>>>> Ordered several things from Amazon Prime yesterday; would normally
>>>>> expect delivery today, but they were quoting some Tuesday, others
>>>>> Wednesday.
>>>>
>>>> I thought the English government has declared the Covid crisis over in
>>>> England and Englanders don't have to isolate in England any more even
>>>> after a positive test?
>>>>
>>>
>>> Correct: self-isolation is no longer a legal requirement. People may choose
>>> to do it, as with flu, but in neither case does the government intervene.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> I’m up in Edinburgh. The place is already heaving with tourists. My hotel
>> was hosting two late “Christmas” parties. Although mask wearing indoors is
>> still compulsory for a few more weeks, observance is very patchy. Nobody
>> was wearing one on the LNER service post the Scottish border. The medical
>> event I attended yesterday was maskless once the ceremony got going. Nobody
>> is taking covid precautions seriously here.
>
> Which partially explains why the Scottish covid rates are rising at such
> a spectacularly high rate at the moment.

The recent growth is with the new Omicron subvariant BA.2. It's spreading
rapidly across the whole of the UK, whether or not people still bother with
masks.

Omicron is everywhere, and mask wearing makes little difference to its
spread. We will all be repeatedly exposed to it, and will probably catch it
regularly, usually with few or no symptoms. Don't think you can hide from
it by wearing a mask.