Yesterday I came across a Landcruiser with lights on high beam and it
was blinding, like looking at an arc welder. This was in in broad
daylight in metro area. Like that Ned and his Neddy comic where the
truck has spotlights marked "stun roos" and "melt bitumen".
Looking on eBay, there are bulbs claimed to be up to 38,000 lumens. That
is insane. I know there are light bars that bright, but they are a metre
wide. Putting that in one bulb is asking for a burnt retina. ADR says
dipped-beam headlights and fog lights must be less than 2000 lumens.
Sadly nothing about high beam.

On 14/8/2023 4:52 pm, Ozix wrote:
> Yesterday I came across a Landcruiser with lights on high beam and it
> was blinding, like looking at an arc welder. This was in in broad
> daylight in metro area. Like that Ned and his Neddy comic where the
> truck has spotlights marked "stun roos" and "melt bitumen".
> Looking on eBay, there are bulbs claimed to be up to 38,000 lumens. That
> is insane. I know there are light bars that bright, but they are a metre
> wide. Putting that in one bulb is asking for a burnt retina. ADR says
> dipped-beam headlights and fog lights must be less than 2000 lumens.
> Sadly nothing about high beam.

Covered by this dot point in the Victorian rules for headlights;

lights must not be used in a way that they can dazzle
other road users (this includes other motor vehicles
drivers, bike riders and pedestrians).

According to the road rules, high beam must not be used when following
200 metres behind a car or less than 200 metres from an oncoming car.
So, if an oncoming car's headlights are causing discomfort beyond that
limit, there is a breach of the law. Getting the cops interested in
doing anything about it, well, that's another battle.

I seem to recall, way back in the dim past, that headlights were limited
to 55 Watts. In other words, it covered the *current* that the lamp drew
- and that worked ok until much more efficient lights, such as halogens,
were developed. I have seen mention of light output, ie. lumens that a
LED can pump out. Then again, there's *candela*, a measure which is a
much more relevant gauge of headlight output since it refers to the
output of a light in a particular direction. I have seen candela
mentioned but nothing in a legal sense of an upper limit.

--
Xeno

Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

On 14/08/2023 4:52 pm, Ozix wrote:
> Yesterday I came across a Landcruiser with lights on high beam and it
> was blinding, like looking at an arc welder. This was in in broad
> daylight in metro area. Like that Ned and his Neddy comic where the
> truck has spotlights marked "stun roos" and "melt bitumen".
> Looking on eBay, there are bulbs claimed to be up to 38,000 lumens. That
> is insane. I know there are light bars that bright, but they are a metre
> wide. Putting that in one bulb is asking for a burnt retina. ADR says
> dipped-beam headlights and fog lights must be less than 2000 lumens.
> Sadly nothing about high beam.

As a ford ranger owner, the high beam is shit, afaic. I promptly fitted
a Stedi st4k light bar,
https://www.stedi.com.au/st4k-28-inch-double-row-52-led-light-bar.html
which is wired legally. ie: flick the high beam on the indicator stalk,
and thats all that happens. High beam. Hardly dazzling. I need to push
another switch mounted in the console to get the light bar to work.

Claims of lumen output of lights and torches in the marketplace are more
often than not, well, hilarious. The light bar above claims 12,400, and
thats from 52 leds... a single light outputting 38,000 lumens? If round,
it'd be the size of a rubbish bin lid. And the rest of the bin as a heat
sink.

I use led lights and torches regularly, the Stedi on the ute, and 2
different O-Light handheld torches. The O-Light warrior-x and Javelot
Pro from memory both output 2500 lumens, as opposed to some of the wild
claims.

38,000 lumens is not happening...

eg: https://tinyurl.com/y3kkcabj (ebay link)

Led Type 42pcs High Intensity OSRAM LED per pair
Type Spotlight
Lumen Output 29800LM per pair

I'm sure Stedi and Osram would love to know how to extract nearly triple
the output they can get from 52 leds... and for $85 dollars? lol...

and this torch from ebay https://tinyurl.com/22283w3y
12 MILLION lumens... all this for $14.60 :-D

On 15/08/2023 9:12 am, lindsay wrote:
> On 14/08/2023 4:52 pm, Ozix wrote:
>> Yesterday I came across a Landcruiser with lights on high beam and it
>> was blinding, like looking at an arc welder. This was in in broad
>> daylight in metro area. Like that Ned and his Neddy comic where the
>> truck has spotlights marked "stun roos" and "melt bitumen".
>> Looking on eBay, there are bulbs claimed to be up to 38,000 lumens.
>> That is insane. I know there are light bars that bright, but they are
>> a metre wide. Putting that in one bulb is asking for a burnt retina.
>> ADR says dipped-beam headlights and fog lights must be less than 2000
>> lumens. Sadly nothing about high beam.
>
> As a ford ranger owner, the high beam is shit, afaic. I promptly fitted
> a Stedi st4k light bar,
> https://www.stedi.com.au/st4k-28-inch-double-row-52-led-light-bar.html
> which is wired legally. ie: flick the high beam on the indicator stalk,
> and thats all that happens. High beam. Hardly dazzling. I need to push
> another switch mounted in the console to get the light bar to work.
>
> Claims of lumen output of lights and torches in the marketplace are more
> often than not, well, hilarious. The light bar above claims 12,400, and
> thats from 52 leds... a single light outputting 38,000 lumens? If round,
> it'd be the size of a rubbish bin lid. And the rest of the bin as a heat
> sink.
>
> I use led lights and torches regularly, the Stedi on the ute, and 2
> different O-Light handheld torches. The O-Light warrior-x and Javelot
> Pro from memory both output 2500 lumens, as opposed to some of the wild
> claims.
>
> 38,000 lumens is not happening...
>
> eg: https://tinyurl.com/y3kkcabj  (ebay link)
>
> Led Type 42pcs High Intensity OSRAM LED per pair
> Type Spotlight
> Lumen Output 29800LM per pair
>
> I'm sure Stedi and Osram would love to know how to extract nearly triple
> the output they can get from 52 leds... and for $85 dollars? lol...
>
> and this torch from ebay  https://tinyurl.com/22283w3y
> 12 MILLION lumens... all this for $14.60 :-D
>

**Yep. I confess I didn't pay attention to the original post for a
variety of reasons. However, you are correct. The best light output we
can expect from a commercial (not a laboratory prototype) white LED is
around 125lm/W. Contrast that with a high quality halogen incandescent
which clocks in at around 20lm/W. Given the fact that most LED
headlights run at around 25 ~ 35 Watts, there is a LOT of light
available. FWIW: Old school HID (discharge) headlights, like those
fitted to many high end Euro cars (and my Nissan Stagea) back at the
turn of the century, deliver roughly similar levels of efficiency as LED
headlights.

So, yeah. 38,000 lumens is not happening. That would require AT LEAST
300 Watts of electrical power, half of which would be used to generate
heat.

--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.avast.com

On 15/08/2023 11:43 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
> On 15/08/2023 9:12 am, lindsay wrote:
>> On 14/08/2023 4:52 pm, Ozix wrote:
>>> Yesterday I came across a Landcruiser with lights on high beam and it
>>> was blinding, like looking at an arc welder. This was in in broad
>>> daylight in metro area. Like that Ned and his Neddy comic where the
>>> truck has spotlights marked "stun roos" and "melt bitumen".
>>> Looking on eBay, there are bulbs claimed to be up to 38,000 lumens.
>>> That is insane. I know there are light bars that bright, but they are
>>> a metre wide. Putting that in one bulb is asking for a burnt retina.
>>> ADR says dipped-beam headlights and fog lights must be less than 2000
>>> lumens. Sadly nothing about high beam.
>>
>> As a ford ranger owner, the high beam is shit, afaic. I promptly
>> fitted a Stedi st4k light bar,
>> https://www.stedi.com.au/st4k-28-inch-double-row-52-led-light-bar.html
>> which is wired legally. ie: flick the high beam on the indicator
>> stalk, and thats all that happens. High beam. Hardly dazzling. I need
>> to push another switch mounted in the console to get the light bar to
>> work.
>>
>> Claims of lumen output of lights and torches in the marketplace are
>> more often than not, well, hilarious. The light bar above claims
>> 12,400, and thats from 52 leds... a single light outputting 38,000
>> lumens? If round, it'd be the size of a rubbish bin lid. And the rest
>> of the bin as a heat sink.
>>
>> I use led lights and torches regularly, the Stedi on the ute, and 2
>> different O-Light handheld torches. The O-Light warrior-x and Javelot
>> Pro from memory both output 2500 lumens, as opposed to some of the
>> wild claims.
>>
>> 38,000 lumens is not happening...
>>
>> eg: https://tinyurl.com/y3kkcabj  (ebay link)
>>
>> Led Type 42pcs High Intensity OSRAM LED per pair
>> Type Spotlight
>> Lumen Output 29800LM per pair
>>
>> I'm sure Stedi and Osram would love to know how to extract nearly
>> triple the output they can get from 52 leds... and for $85 dollars?
>> lol...
>>
>> and this torch from ebay  https://tinyurl.com/22283w3y
>> 12 MILLION lumens... all this for $14.60 :-D
>>
>
> **Yep. I confess I didn't pay attention to the original post for a
> variety of reasons. However, you are correct. The best light output we
> can expect from a commercial (not a laboratory prototype) white LED is
> around 125lm/W. Contrast that with a high quality halogen incandescent
> which clocks in at around 20lm/W. Given the fact that most LED
> headlights run at around 25 ~ 35 Watts, there is a LOT of light
> available. FWIW: Old school HID (discharge) headlights, like those
> fitted to many high end Euro cars (and my Nissan Stagea) back at the
> turn of the century, deliver roughly similar levels of efficiency as LED
> headlights.
>
> So, yeah. 38,000 lumens is not happening. That would require AT LEAST
> 300 Watts of electrical power, half of which would be used to generate
> heat.
>
>

Special Chinese lumens... like special Chinese 18650 battery capacity -
all for vely row plice.

--
In thread "May need to buy petrol soon" Sept 23 2021 11:15:59am
Keithr0 wrote: "He made the assertion either he proves it or he is a
proven liar."

On Sept 23 2021 3:16:29pm Keithr0 wrote:
"He asserts that the claim is true, so, if it is unproven, he is lying."

Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>
>
> **Yep. I confess I didn't pay attention to the original post for a
> variety of reasons. However, you are correct. The best light output we
> can expect from a commercial (not a laboratory prototype) white LED is
> around 125lm/W. Contrast that with a high quality halogen incandescent
> which clocks in at around 20lm/W. Given the fact that most LED
> headlights run at around 25 ~ 35 Watts, there is a LOT of light
> available. FWIW: Old school HID (discharge) headlights, like those
> fitted to many high end Euro cars (and my Nissan Stagea) back at the
> turn of the century, deliver roughly similar levels of efficiency as LED
> headlights.
>
> So, yeah. 38,000 lumens is not happening. That would require AT LEAST
> 300 Watts of electrical power, half of which would be used to generate
> heat.
>
>

I saw another page that claims theoretical limit for white LEDs is 350
lumen/W, but anything over 250 hasn't been made yet. So that is still
150 Watts for 38,000.
I found an even worse example on Aliexpress: 100,000 lumens drawing 360
Watts! Well that is going to melt your headlight housing for sure.