The recent mouse scare has made me wonder about backing up.

For a few minutes, before realising the mouse was at fault, I thought it
might be the desk top.

There is so much stored on it, radio-wise, I would be stuffed if it went
down. That includes the programme that allows me access to the station
play-list for uploading, masses of stored music, several past progs over
10 years and lots of personal stuff.

Okay, there are ways of configuring auto-back-up, but that is on the
same computer.

It does seem that flash-drive back-up is limited to flash-drive capacity
and takes forever.

So. is there a practical way of backing up the entire computer?

I am no IT expert, but I know there are a few here in ye shedd who are.

Any ideas?

Would I need a second desk top?

Tone

On Wed, 15 Nov 2023 01:14:32 +0000, Hymermut <tone@email.com> wrote:

>The recent mouse scare has made me wonder about backing up.
>
>For a few minutes, before realising the mouse was at fault, I thought it
>might be the desk top.
>
>There is so much stored on it, radio-wise, I would be stuffed if it went
>down. That includes the programme that allows me access to the station
>play-list for uploading, masses of stored music, several past progs over
>10 years and lots of personal stuff.
>
>Okay, there are ways of configuring auto-back-up, but that is on the
>same computer.
>
>It does seem that flash-drive back-up is limited to flash-drive capacity
>and takes forever.
>
>So. is there a practical way of backing up the entire computer?
>
>I am no IT expert, but I know there are a few here in ye shedd who are.
>
>Any ideas?
>
>Would I need a second desk top?
>
>Tone

On my last laptop, when I replaced the hard drive, with a SSD -
the SSD came with a "mirror" program that duplicated the
complete hard drive on the SSD. Operating system & everything.
It did take a while ... 30 - 45 minutes or so.
I've done numerous data-only manual back-ups, over the years,
to usb thumb drives and to my 1 terra byte drive
but it's a tedious affair to sift through folders searching for stuff
- too many folders & sub-folders and duplication.
... a proper incremental back-up program would really help.
John T.

On 15/11/2023 in message <uj161v$1ep12$2@dont-email.me> Hymermut wrote:

>I am no IT expert, but I know there are a few here in ye shedd who are.
>
>Any ideas?
>
>Would I need a second desk top?

I have 30 years of program code on my PC and would be devastated to lose
it, my backup regime (which runs on a schedule every night) is:

Everything in "My Documents" is backed up to a second SSD in the computer
- that covers a file becoming corrupt or the original disk failing.

That is then backed up to a QNAP NAS:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B088CZLVQB/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

That NAS is backed up to a second NAS.

Finally it is backed up to an external USB drive which, in theory, I can
grab and run in the event of a fire:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B01JTMNASS/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1

I have no off-site backup which I probably should.

You could as a start get something like the Transcend drive while thinking
about off-site storage.

--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
There is absolutely no substitute for a genuine lack of preparation

In article <ida8li53ej07ss7qbq43r8k14huhdc787h@4ax.com>,
hubops@ccanoemail.com on Tue, 14 Nov 2023 at 21:32:14 awoke Nicholas
from his slumbers and wrote
>On Wed, 15 Nov 2023 01:14:32 +0000, Hymermut <tone@email.com> wrote:
>
>>The recent mouse scare has made me wonder about backing up.
>>
>>For a few minutes, before realising the mouse was at fault, I thought it
>>might be the desk top.
>>
>>There is so much stored on it, radio-wise, I would be stuffed if it went
>>down. That includes the programme that allows me access to the station
>>play-list for uploading, masses of stored music, several past progs over
>>10 years and lots of personal stuff.
>>
>>Okay, there are ways of configuring auto-back-up, but that is on the
>>same computer.
>>
>>It does seem that flash-drive back-up is limited to flash-drive capacity
>>and takes forever.
>>
>>So. is there a practical way of backing up the entire computer?
>>
>>I am no IT expert, but I know there are a few here in ye shedd who are.
>>
>>Any ideas?
>>
>>Would I need a second desk top?
>>
>>Tone
>
>
>On my last laptop, when I replaced the hard drive, with a SSD -
>the SSD came with a "mirror" program that duplicated the
>complete hard drive on the SSD. Operating system & everything.
>It did take a while ... 30 - 45 minutes or so.
> I've done numerous data-only manual back-ups, over the years,
> to usb thumb drives and to my 1 terra byte drive
>but it's a tedious affair to sift through folders searching for stuff
>- too many folders & sub-folders and duplication.
>.. a proper incremental back-up program would really help.
> John T.

I use Acronis (other suppliers exist) to do an automatic incremental
backup every morning onto an internal drive and then a periodic copy of
the internal backup drive onto an external drive.

Large external drives are not phenomenally expensive, any more, and are
fast enough for backups connected through USB 3. If you are backing up
a flappot, the daily backup would have to be to a USB connected drive.

Incremental or differential backups enable you to restore, older
versions of or 'lost' (ie accidentally deleted) individual files. I have
found this quick and very convenient, when I have made 'mistakes'.

I have also successfully restored a whole system disk.

Life saver.
--
0sterc@tcher -

"Où sont les neiges d'antan?"

On 15/11/2023 12:32, Nicholas D. Richards wrote:
> I use Acronis

£59?

Is that a one off payment or an instalment?

cheers

Tone

On Wed, 15 Nov 2023 13:10:57 +0000
Hymermut <tone@email.com> wrote:

> On 15/11/2023 12:32, Nicholas D. Richards wrote:
> > I use Acronis
>
> £59?

Strange, €49 here.

> Is that a one off payment or an instalment?

Annual subscription.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/
Host: Beautiful Theory meet Inconvenient Fact
Obit: Beautiful Theory died today of factual inconsistency

In article <uj2g19$1of4k$1@dont-email.me>, Hymermut <tone@email.com> on
Wed, 15 Nov 2023 at 13:10:57 awoke Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote
>On 15/11/2023 12:32, Nicholas D. Richards wrote:
>> I use Acronis
>
>£59?
>
>Is that a one off payment or an instalment?
>
>cheers
>
>Tone

Not sure that I would recommend it any more. It seems that they have
gone down the subscription model for home users.

The 2020 version and previous versions for home were on a perpetual
licence.
--
0sterc@tcher -

"Où sont les neiges d'antan?"

On Wed, 15 Nov 2023 18:01:45 +0000
"Nicholas D. Richards" <nicholas@salmiron.com> wrote:

> Not sure that I would recommend it any more. It seems that they have
> gone down the subscription model for home users.

Sadly this is getting very common because investors like companies
with a big (and growing) ARRS[1.2]. It's much easier to show growth with a
subscription model because you only have to find enough new customers to
replace those who leave and a few more to create growth whereas with a
one-off sales model you have to match last year's sales and then add some.

This is also why Software as a Service has become popular with all
your data in "the cloud" so you have to keep paying.

Sooner or later companies will (I hope) catch on that while this is
popular with investors it is not popular with customers - that being said
it is popular with corporate customers, especially big companies.

[1.2] Annual Recurring Revenue Stream, not misspelled posterior.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/
Host: Beautiful Theory meet Inconvenient Fact
Obit: Beautiful Theory died today of factual inconsistency

On 15/11/2023 19:16, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
> On Wed, 15 Nov 2023 18:01:45 +0000
> "Nicholas D. Richards" <nicholas@salmiron.com> wrote:
>
>> Not sure that I would recommend it any more. It seems that they have
>> gone down the subscription model for home users.
>
> Sadly this is getting very common because investors like companies
> with a big (and growing) ARRS[1.2]. It's much easier to show growth with a
> subscription model because you only have to find enough new customers to
> replace those who leave and a few more to create growth whereas with a
> one-off sales model you have to match last year's sales and then add some.
>
> This is also why Software as a Service has become popular with all
> your data in "the cloud" so you have to keep paying.
>
> Sooner or later companies will (I hope) catch on that while this is
> popular with investors it is not popular with customers - that being said
> it is popular with corporate customers, especially big companies.
>
> [1.2] Annual Recurring Revenue Stream, not misspelled posterior.
>
Hate the subscription model and I refuse to play in that playground.

I backup data to an external drive, a 2TB Samsung SSD, 90quid from Amazon.

Backup with the Linux copy (cp) command from a terminal. It allows me to
copy a top level folder recursively and only copy newer files. Also used
rsync for scheduled stuff when I maintained a couple of file servers.

Windows has copy for files and xcopy for directories. I don´t think it´s
quite as flexible as Linux but it would probably work.

There´s also the file backup utility in Windows itself. Never used it
meself so if it borks your data, snot my fault ;)

On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 09:59:42 +0000
Awchy <awchy@proton.me> wrote:

> Hate the subscription model and I refuse to play in that playground.

Good move, vote with feet and all that.

Similarly I refuse to use "the cloud" I keep my data on my storage,
anything I want to share goes on the web server running in a jail on my
NAS. I know that's secure because it can only serve static content, no
server side processing supported at all - there's quite a number of
attempts to find well known PHP exploits and the like that all get
cheerfully rejected.

All important data lives on the NAS (ZFS mirrors on FreeBSD with a
weekly scrub to counter silent corruption) and is mounted to the
workstations, it gets backed up by zfs-autobackup to another box and I keep
snapshots for accident recovery.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/
Host: Beautiful Theory meet Inconvenient Fact
Obit: Beautiful Theory died today of factual inconsistency

On 16/11/2023 09:59, Awchy wrote:
> On 15/11/2023 19:16, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
>> On Wed, 15 Nov 2023 18:01:45 +0000
>> "Nicholas D. Richards" <nicholas@salmiron.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Not sure that I would recommend it any more. It seems that they have
>>> gone down the subscription model for home users.
>>
>> Sadly this is getting very common because investors like companies
>> with a big (and growing) ARRS[1.2]. It's much easier to show growth
>> with a
>> subscription model because you only have to find enough new customers to
>> replace those who leave and a few more to create growth whereas with a
>> one-off sales model you have to match last year's sales and then add
>> some.
>>
>> This is also why Software as a Service has become popular with all
>> your data in "the cloud" so you have to keep paying.
>>
>> Sooner or later companies will (I hope) catch on that while this is
>> popular with investors it is not popular with customers - that being said
>> it is popular with corporate customers, especially big companies.
>>
>> [1.2] Annual Recurring Revenue Stream, not misspelled posterior.
>>
> Hate the subscription model and I refuse to play in that playground.
>
> I backup data to an external drive, a 2TB Samsung SSD, 90quid from Amazon.
>
> Backup with the Linux copy (cp) command from a terminal. It allows me to
> copy a top level folder recursively and only copy newer files. Also used
> rsync for scheduled stuff when I maintained a couple of file servers.
>
> Windows has copy for files and xcopy for directories. I don´t think it´s
> quite as flexible as Linux but it would probably work.
>
> There´s also the file backup utility in Windows itself. Never used it
> meself so if it borks your data, snot my fault ;)
>
>

rsync for Linux, robocopy for Windows
Both only backup new/changed files - if you specify correctly
Both will delete non-existant targets if specified
Admittedly, both are a bit complicated at first

--
Chris Elvidge, England
BEANS ARE NEITHER FRUIT NOR MUSICAL

Chris Elvidge <chris@mshome.net> wrote in
news:uj4r0t$27kg0$1@dont-email.me:

> rsync for Linux, robocopy for Windows
> Both only backup new/changed files - if you specify correctly
> Both will delete non-existant targets if specified
> Admittedly, both are a bit complicated at first

I use Syncbak. I've gorn off it, it's become so complicated that I have to
re-learn it every time I want to use it.

--
Peter
-----

On 16/11/2023 11:48, Peter wrote:
> Chris Elvidge <chris@mshome.net> wrote in
> news:uj4r0t$27kg0$1@dont-email.me:
>
>> rsync for Linux, robocopy for Windows
>> Both only backup new/changed files - if you specify correctly
>> Both will delete non-existant targets if specified
>> Admittedly, both are a bit complicated at first
>
> I use Syncbak. I've gorn off it, it's become so complicated that I have to
> re-learn it every time I want to use it.
>
When I install Windows, I set up a system partition and a data
partition. The "My Documents" library points to a folder on the data
partition, and I use a now unsupported program called SynchronX to keep
that folder in sync with an external drive or other computer. I use the
same program to sync other folders, such as video, music amd pictures.
SynchronX can still be found on a few sites and when fed two folder
pointers, will transfer any files edited since the last sync in both
directions.

There is also a way to use rsync under Windows 10.

https://www.ubackup.com/windows-10/rsync-windows-10-1021.html

When I am happy with the way the system's working, I create a recovery
disk, and as and when ICBA, I update that. If the system gets corrupted,
I can nuke that partition without affecting the data.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 17:38:38 +0000
John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> wrote:

> On 16/11/2023 11:48, Peter wrote:
> > Chris Elvidge <chris@mshome.net> wrote in
> > news:uj4r0t$27kg0$1@dont-email.me:
> >
> >> rsync for Linux, robocopy for Windows
> >> Both only backup new/changed files - if you specify correctly
> >> Both will delete non-existant targets if specified
> >> Admittedly, both are a bit complicated at first
> >
> > I use Syncbak. I've gorn off it, it's become so complicated that I have to
> > re-learn it every time I want to use it.
> >
> When I install Windows, I set up a system partition and a data
> partition. The "My Documents" library points to a folder on the data
> partition, and I use a now unsupported program called SynchronX to keep

[]

I, as a True Sheddi (tm), have stuff all over the drive (which was
partitioned with some long lost fpurzr for what I thought I wanted to
put where), including things like MyOldPCsCDrive. This itself probably has
a directory (that's a 'folder' to you youngsters) with MyEvenOlderPCsDrive
on it.
When I go I doubt anyone will care what's on this machine.

--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

On 16/11/2023 18:30, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:

> I, as a True Sheddi (tm), have stuff all over the drive (which was
> partitioned with some long lost fpurzr for what I thought I wanted to
> put where), including things like MyOldPCsCDrive. This itself probably has
> a directory (that's a 'folder' to you youngsters) with MyEvenOlderPCsDrive
> on it.
> When I go I doubt anyone will care what's on this machine.
>
>
Having had to sort through two ex-people's computers, I agree with that
sentiment. All I needed was the banking data, and that was also
available on the banks' systems once I was allowed in. The rest was now
totally irrelevant, except family related e-mails, which are now in two
folders here.

When I get a new pooterator, I just copy everything across from the data
drive, and have not yet seen a need for directories dedicated to what
used to be there. I take the opportunity to get rid of the bloat in the
system. So far, drives have been getting bigger fast enough to cope. My
backup drive could hold two full copies.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 09:59:42 +0000, Awchy <awchy@proton.me> wrote:

>On 15/11/2023 19:16, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
>> On Wed, 15 Nov 2023 18:01:45 +0000
>> "Nicholas D. Richards" <nicholas@salmiron.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Not sure that I would recommend it any more. It seems that they have
>>> gone down the subscription model for home users.
>>
>> Sadly this is getting very common because investors like companies
>> with a big (and growing) ARRS[1.2]. It's much easier to show growth with a
>> subscription model because you only have to find enough new customers to
>> replace those who leave and a few more to create growth whereas with a
>> one-off sales model you have to match last year's sales and then add some.
>>
>> This is also why Software as a Service has become popular with all
>> your data in "the cloud" so you have to keep paying.
>>
>> Sooner or later companies will (I hope) catch on that while this is
>> popular with investors it is not popular with customers - that being said
>> it is popular with corporate customers, especially big companies.
>>
>> [1.2] Annual Recurring Revenue Stream, not misspelled posterior.
>>
>Hate the subscription model and I refuse to play in that playground.
>
>I backup data to an external drive, a 2TB Samsung SSD, 90quid from Amazon.
>
>Backup with the Linux copy (cp) command from a terminal. It allows me to
>copy a top level folder recursively and only copy newer files. Also used
>rsync for scheduled stuff when I maintained a couple of file servers.
>
>Windows has copy for files and xcopy for directories. I don´t think it´s
>quite as flexible as Linux but it would probably work.
>
>There´s also the file backup utility in Windows itself. Never used it
>meself so if it borks your data, snot my fault ;)
>

Macrium Reflect here. I quit Acronis once they became zabarlous and wanted to
sell subscriptions.

It is *much* faster than the Acronis version I had.

I back up to a NAS unit on a GBit connection.

It allows mounting old backups: click on a date, and a read-only backup as of
that date appears as an extra drive. Good for finding the previous version of
something, or that photo that I shouldn't have deleted last month.

Does all the bells and whistles: everything, changes only, "recreate from
scratch", consolidating X "change" backups into a "everything" backup, etc etc.
Steepish learning curve -- but it has reasonable presets.

Thomas Prufer

"Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> wrote in
news:20231116183037.c8905be11089ba8a2ca367d6@127.0.0.1:

> On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 17:38:38 +0000
> John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
>> On 16/11/2023 11:48, Peter wrote:
>> > Chris Elvidge <chris@mshome.net> wrote in
>> > news:uj4r0t$27kg0$1@dont-email.me:
>> >
>> >> rsync for Linux, robocopy for Windows
>> >> Both only backup new/changed files - if you specify correctly
>> >> Both will delete non-existant targets if specified
>> >> Admittedly, both are a bit complicated at first
>> >
>> > I use Syncbak. I've gorn off it, it's become so complicated that I
>> > have to re-learn it every time I want to use it.
>> >
>> When I install Windows, I set up a system partition and a data
>> partition. The "My Documents" library points to a folder on the data
>> partition, and I use a now unsupported program called SynchronX to
>> keep
>
> []
>
>
> I, as a True Sheddi (tm), have stuff all over the drive (which was
> partitioned with some long lost fpurzr for what I thought I wanted to
> put where), including things like MyOldPCsCDrive. This itself probably
> has a directory (that's a 'folder' to you youngsters) with
> MyEvenOlderPCsDrive on it.
> When I go I doubt anyone will care what's on this machine.

Yup, I have two folders called Old Drive C Backup and Old Drive Data
Backup. Both created a few years ago but not accessed since. Still, peace
(not piece) of mind, don't ya kno.

Reading this fred has stimulated me to order an external 4TB SSD for
backing up. Should arrive this morning.

--
Peter
-----

Thomas Prufer <prufer.public@mnet-online.de.invalid> wrote in
news:e05eli97s94golp9tud225mnbjjaklltfm@4ax.com:

>
> Macrium Reflect here. I quit Acronis once they became zabarlous and
> wanted to sell subscriptions.

That reminds me that I used Macrium Relect for a while. Really not sure why
I no longer have it.

--
Peter
-----

On 17-Nov-23 7:27, Thomas Prufer wrote:
> On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 09:59:42 +0000, Awchy <awchy@proton.me> wrote:
>
>> On 15/11/2023 19:16, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
>>> On Wed, 15 Nov 2023 18:01:45 +0000
>>> "Nicholas D. Richards" <nicholas@salmiron.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Not sure that I would recommend it any more. It seems that they have
>>>> gone down the subscription model for home users.
>>>
>>> Sadly this is getting very common because investors like companies
>>> with a big (and growing) ARRS[1.2]. It's much easier to show growth with a
>>> subscription model because you only have to find enough new customers to
>>> replace those who leave and a few more to create growth whereas with a
>>> one-off sales model you have to match last year's sales and then add some.
>>>
>>> This is also why Software as a Service has become popular with all
>>> your data in "the cloud" so you have to keep paying.
>>>
>>> Sooner or later companies will (I hope) catch on that while this is
>>> popular with investors it is not popular with customers - that being said
>>> it is popular with corporate customers, especially big companies.
>>>
>>> [1.2] Annual Recurring Revenue Stream, not misspelled posterior.
>>>
>> Hate the subscription model and I refuse to play in that playground.
>>
>> I backup data to an external drive, a 2TB Samsung SSD, 90quid from Amazon.
>>
>> Backup with the Linux copy (cp) command from a terminal. It allows me to
>> copy a top level folder recursively and only copy newer files. Also used
>> rsync for scheduled stuff when I maintained a couple of file servers.
>>
>> Windows has copy for files and xcopy for directories. I don´t think it´s
>> quite as flexible as Linux but it would probably work.
>>
>> There´s also the file backup utility in Windows itself. Never used it
>> meself so if it borks your data, snot my fault ;)
>>
>
> Macrium Reflect here. I quit Acronis once they became zabarlous and wanted to
> sell subscriptions.
>
> It is *much* faster than the Acronis version I had.
>
> I back up to a NAS unit on a GBit connection.
>
> It allows mounting old backups: click on a date, and a read-only backup as of
> that date appears as an extra drive. Good for finding the previous version of
> something, or that photo that I shouldn't have deleted last month.
>
> Does all the bells and whistles: everything, changes only, "recreate from
> scratch", consolidating X "change" backups into a "everything" backup, etc etc.
> Steepish learning curve -- but it has reasonable presets.

I (when I think about it - not often) do C: drive backups using Reflect
to a spare drive connected via USB.

I have now purr-chased a NAS.

The obvious thing to do now, is to put those backups onto the NAS.

Getting backups _onto_ the NAS seems pretty straightforward.

However, how the £$%^&* do I recover using those backups?
i.e. How do I manage to talk to the NAS, if my Windows machine has blown
a gasket?

It _seems_ to me that I need a jbexing machine to access the NAS - and
a backup from the NAS to get the machine jbexing again.

--
Sam Plusnet

On 17/11/2023 18:23, Sam Plusnet wrote:
> On 17-Nov-23 7:27, Thomas Prufer wrote:
>> On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 09:59:42 +0000, Awchy <awchy@proton.me> wrote:
>>
>>> On 15/11/2023 19:16, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 15 Nov 2023 18:01:45 +0000
>>>> "Nicholas D. Richards" <nicholas@salmiron.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Not sure that I would recommend it any more. It seems that they have
>>>>> gone down the subscription model for home users.
>>>>
>>>> Sadly this is getting very common because investors like companies
>>>> with a big (and growing) ARRS[1.2]. It's much easier to show growth
>>>> with a
>>>> subscription model because you only have to find enough new
>>>> customers to
>>>> replace those who leave and a few more to create growth whereas with a
>>>> one-off sales model you have to match last year's sales and then add
>>>> some.
>>>>
>>>> This is also why Software as a Service has become popular with all
>>>> your data in "the cloud" so you have to keep paying.
>>>>
>>>> Sooner or later companies will (I hope) catch on that while this is
>>>> popular with investors it is not popular with customers - that being
>>>> said
>>>> it is popular with corporate customers, especially big companies.
>>>>
>>>> [1.2] Annual Recurring Revenue Stream, not misspelled posterior.
>>>>
>>> Hate the subscription model and I refuse to play in that playground.
>>>
>>> I backup data to an external drive, a 2TB Samsung SSD, 90quid from
>>> Amazon.
>>>
>>> Backup with the Linux copy (cp) command from a terminal. It allows me to
>>> copy a top level folder recursively and only copy newer files. Also used
>>> rsync for scheduled stuff when I maintained a couple of file servers.
>>>
>>> Windows has copy for files and xcopy for directories. I don´t think it´s
>>> quite as flexible as Linux but it would probably work.
>>>
>>> There´s also the file backup utility in Windows itself. Never used it
>>> meself so if it borks your data, snot my fault ;)
>>>
>>
>> Macrium Reflect here. I quit Acronis once they became zabarlous and
>> wanted to
>> sell subscriptions.
>>
>> It is *much* faster than the Acronis version I had.
>>
>> I back up to a NAS unit on a GBit connection.
>>
>> It allows mounting old backups: click on a date, and a read-only
>> backup as of
>> that date appears as an extra drive. Good for finding the previous
>> version of
>> something, or that photo that I shouldn't have deleted last month.
>>
>> Does all the bells and whistles: everything, changes only, "recreate from
>> scratch", consolidating X "change" backups into a "everything" backup,
>> etc etc.
>> Steepish learning curve -- but it has reasonable presets.
>
> I (when I think about it - not often) do C: drive backups using Reflect
> to a spare drive connected via USB.
>
> I have now purr-chased a NAS.
>
> The obvious thing to do now, is to put those backups onto the NAS.
>
> Getting backups _onto_ the NAS seems pretty straightforward.
>
> However, how the £$%^&* do I recover using those backups?
> i.e. How do I manage to talk to the NAS, if my Windows machine has blown
> a gasket?
>
> It _seems_ to me that I need a jbexing machine to access the NAS - and
> a backup from the NAS to get the machine jbexing again.
>
>
For 'Doze and *nix, put a basic recovery environment or make a recovery
drive on a USB stick. If it all goes mammaries skywards, boot from USB
and restore the system. If you have a recovery or drive image on the
NAS, all you need is a basic OS that can talk to it.

Personally, I have the settings and keys for commonly used programs
saved, and use the failure as an opportunity to get rid of the cruft, so
use an install device then rebuild the system as I need stuff again.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

In article <krpqgrFdkq3U1@mid.individual.net>, John Williamson
<johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> on Fri, 17 Nov 2023 at 18:42:34 awoke
Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote
>On 17/11/2023 18:23, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>> On 17-Nov-23 7:27, Thomas Prufer wrote:
>>> On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 09:59:42 +0000, Awchy <awchy@proton.me> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 15/11/2023 19:16, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
>>>>> On Wed, 15 Nov 2023 18:01:45 +0000
>>>>> "Nicholas D. Richards" <nicholas@salmiron.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Not sure that I would recommend it any more. It seems that they have
>>>>>> gone down the subscription model for home users.
>>>>>
>>>>> Sadly this is getting very common because investors like companies
>>>>> with a big (and growing) ARRS[1.2]. It's much easier to show growth
>>>>> with a
>>>>> subscription model because you only have to find enough new
>>>>> customers to
>>>>> replace those who leave and a few more to create growth whereas with a
>>>>> one-off sales model you have to match last year's sales and then add
>>>>> some.
>>>>>
>>>>> This is also why Software as a Service has become popular with all
>>>>> your data in "the cloud" so you have to keep paying.
>>>>>
>>>>> Sooner or later companies will (I hope) catch on that while this is
>>>>> popular with investors it is not popular with customers - that being
>>>>> said
>>>>> it is popular with corporate customers, especially big companies.
>>>>>
>>>>> [1.2] Annual Recurring Revenue Stream, not misspelled posterior.
>>>>>
>>>> Hate the subscription model and I refuse to play in that playground.
>>>>
>>>> I backup data to an external drive, a 2TB Samsung SSD, 90quid from
>>>> Amazon.
>>>>
>>>> Backup with the Linux copy (cp) command from a terminal. It allows me to
>>>> copy a top level folder recursively and only copy newer files. Also used
>>>> rsync for scheduled stuff when I maintained a couple of file servers.
>>>>
>>>> Windows has copy for files and xcopy for directories. I don´t think it´s
>>>> quite as flexible as Linux but it would probably work.
>>>>
>>>> There´s also the file backup utility in Windows itself. Never used it
>>>> meself so if it borks your data, snot my fault ;)
>>>>
>>>
>>> Macrium Reflect here. I quit Acronis once they became zabarlous and
>>> wanted to
>>> sell subscriptions.
>>>
>>> It is *much* faster than the Acronis version I had.
>>>
>>> I back up to a NAS unit on a GBit connection.
>>>
>>> It allows mounting old backups: click on a date, and a read-only
>>> backup as of
>>> that date appears as an extra drive. Good for finding the previous
>>> version of
>>> something, or that photo that I shouldn't have deleted last month.
>>>
>>> Does all the bells and whistles: everything, changes only, "recreate from
>>> scratch", consolidating X "change" backups into a "everything" backup,
>>> etc etc.
>>> Steepish learning curve -- but it has reasonable presets.
>>
>> I (when I think about it - not often) do C: drive backups using Reflect
>> to a spare drive connected via USB.
>>
>> I have now purr-chased a NAS.
>>
>> The obvious thing to do now, is to put those backups onto the NAS.
>>
>> Getting backups _onto_ the NAS seems pretty straightforward.
>>
>> However, how the £$%^&* do I recover using those backups?
>> i.e. How do I manage to talk to the NAS, if my Windows machine has blown
>> a gasket?
>>
>> It _seems_ to me that I need a jbexing machine to access the NAS - and
>> a backup from the NAS to get the machine jbexing again.
>>
>>
>For 'Doze and *nix, put a basic recovery environment or make a recovery
>drive on a USB stick. If it all goes mammaries skywards, boot from USB
>and restore the system. If you have a recovery or drive image on the
>NAS, all you need is a basic OS that can talk to it.
>
>Personally, I have the settings and keys for commonly used programs
>saved, and use the failure as an opportunity to get rid of the cruft, so
>use an install device then rebuild the system as I need stuff again.
>
With Acronis after installing (and after any updates) you have an option
to create a recovery disk (on CD or DVD) that will run Windoze (if the
OS still exists on the C: driver) or Acronis standalone. Acronis will
then allow a restore from your backup. I have recovered my C: drive via
this route.

It is sensible to have a backup disc (not the same spinning rust that
you are backing up) permanently connected so that an automatic backup
can run hands off, without having to be arsed to do it. From time to
time the backup disk should be backed up onto another disk which is not
permanently connected to your machine. This provides protection against
malevolent software.
--
0sterc@tcher -

"Où sont les neiges d'antan?"

On 2023-11-17, Nicholas D. Richards <nicholas@salmiron.com> wrote:
> In article <krpqgrFdkq3U1@mid.individual.net>, John Williamson
><johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> on Fri, 17 Nov 2023 at 18:42:34 awoke
> Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote
>>On 17/11/2023 18:23, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>>> On 17-Nov-23 7:27, Thomas Prufer wrote:

>>
> With Acronis after installing (and after any updates) you have an option
> to create a recovery disk (on CD or DVD) that will run Windoze (if the
> OS still exists on the C: driver) or Acronis standalone. Acronis will
> then allow a restore from your backup. I have recovered my C: drive via
> this route.
>
> It is sensible to have a backup disc (not the same spinning rust that
> you are backing up) permanently connected so that an automatic backup
> can run hands off, without having to be arsed to do it. From time to
> time the backup disk should be backed up onto another disk which is not
> permanently connected to your machine. This provides protection against
> malevolent software.

Back when my wbo included being keeper of the corporate paranoia the rule of
thumb was that data was only reasonably safe if it was on at least three
different spindles and at least one of those is off site.

I was running a disaster-recovery workshop on the day the 7/7 bombs went
off. Discovered a new failure mode that day. One of our clients was the
Royal College of Surgeons. Their systems were all up but the feds wouldn't
let anyone in the building to change the backup tape.

Here this machine makes twice daily backups to a second disk in this box.
Once a day it's backed up to two disks in an HP microserver and an attached
NAS and then to a big disk in a different microserver. Every few months I
take a backup to a fiend's place and put my disk into a spare slot on his
microserver.

I'm fettling another NAS that will keep a copy of all my video and sound
recordings. It will live behind the TV.

I use the Linux copy command with the option to create sequentially numbered
backups of any changed files. Once a year or so I clean those off

--
Bernard Peek
bap@shrdlu.com Wigan

On 17 Nov 2023 20:59:11 GMT, Bernard Peek <bap@shrdlu.com> wrote:

>Back when my wbo included being keeper of the corporate paranoia the rule of
>thumb was that data was only reasonably safe if it was on at least three
>different spindles and at least one of those is off site.

http://www.taobackup.com/coverage.html

(which is advertising, but good advice as to good backup practices nonetheless).

Thomas Prufer

On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 18:23:01 +0000, Sam Plusnet <not@home.com> wrote:

>I (when I think about it - not often) do C: drive backups using Reflect
>to a spare drive connected via USB.
>
>I have now purr-chased a NAS.
>
>The obvious thing to do now, is to put those backups onto the NAS.
>
>Getting backups _onto_ the NAS seems pretty straightforward.
>
>However, how the £$%^&* do I recover using those backups?
>i.e. How do I manage to talk to the NAS, if my Windows machine has blown
>a gasket?
>
>It _seems_ to me that I need a jbexing machine to access the NAS - and
>a backup from the NAS to get the machine jbexing again.

Naaah. If you use Reflect, there's a "make bootable CD" option that makes a
bootable CD that restores the backup. It just needs to boot -- and find a backup
that contains a system.

(Now if you restore to a different/new machine with different hardware requiring
different drivers, you may run into trouble. But your photos, document files
etc. will be safe...)

Thomas Prufer

On 15/11/2023 01:14, Hymermut wrote:
> The recent mouse scare has made me wonder about backing up.
>
> For a few minutes, before realising the mouse was at fault, I thought it
> might be the desk top.
>
> There is so much stored on it, radio-wise, I would be stuffed if it went
> down. That includes the programme that allows me access to the station
> play-list for uploading, masses of stored music, several past progs over
> 10 years and lots of personal stuff.
>
> Okay, there are ways of configuring auto-back-up, but that is on the
> same computer.

After reading this thread I too realised that I needed to reappraise my
'backup strategy'. In other words I needed to do something new as my old
backup drives have been full for some time and...

Anyway, my son spotted a new external 8TB drive on the Big River in
Black Friday sale for (just) under 130squids (half price). It is still
cheap incidentally at (currently) 160squid:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Seagate-Desktop-External-Drive-STGY8000400/dp/B07CQJBSQL/ref=sr_1_5?crid=CKAV2KI01KG1

So then I did a quick appraisal of the backup software suggested here.
It all seemed messy in its different ways - well at least the linux
stuff is. My son however suggested the following which is absolutely
magnificent and available for windoze, MacOS and linux. Probably among
my favourite software of all time for ease, straigtforwardness and
intuitive use. All options are there, simply put:

https://freefilesync.org

HTH, Enjoy,

Chris