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aus+uk / uk.railway / Re: How to get to Hesthrow

SubjectAuthor
* How to get to HesthrowTweed
+- How to get to HesthrowRecliner
`* How to get to HesthrowNY
 `* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  +* How to get to HesthrowTweed
  |+* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||`* How to get to HeathrowJohn Levine
  || `* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||  `* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||   `* How to get to HeathrowTweed
  ||    +* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    |`* How to get to HeathrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||    | +* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | |+* How to get to HeathrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||    | ||`* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | || +* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | || |`* How to get to HeathrowBob
  ||    | || | `- How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | || `* How to get to HeathrowRoger Lynn
  ||    | ||  +* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  |`* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | ||  | `* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  |  `* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | ||  |   `* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  |    `* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | ||  |     `* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  |      `* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | ||  |       `* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  |        `* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | ||  |         `* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  |          `* How to get to HeathrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||    | ||  |           +- How to get to HeathrowTweed
  ||    | ||  |           `- How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  `* How to get to HeathrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||    | ||   `- How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | |`- How to get to HeathrowPeter Johnson
  ||    | `* How to get to Heathrowhounslow3@yahoo.co.uk
  ||    |  +- How to get to HeathrowCharles Ellson
  ||    |  +- How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    |  `- How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    `- How to get to HeathrowMarland
  |`* How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  | `* How to get to HesthrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  |  `- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  +- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  +* How to get to HesthrowNY
  |+* How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  ||`* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  || `* How to get to HesthrowMarland
  ||  +- How to get to HesthrowColinR
  ||  `- How to get to HesthrowGraeme Wall
  |+- How to get to HesthrowGraeme Wall
  |+* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||`* How to get to HesthrowTweed
  || +- How to get to HesthrowCharles Ellson
  || `* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||  +* How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  ||  |`* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||  | +* How to get to HesthrowTweed
  ||  | |`* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||  | | `- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  ||  | +- How to get to HesthrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||  | `- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  ||  `* How to get to HesthrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||   +* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||   |+- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  ||   |`* How to get to HesthrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||   | +* How to get to HesthrowSam Wilson
  ||   | |+* How to get to HesthrowTweed
  ||   | ||`* How to get to HesthrowGraeme Wall
  ||   | || +- How to get to HesthrowMarland
  ||   | || `- How to get to HesthrowCharles Ellson
  ||   | |+- How to get to HesthrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||   | |`- How to get to HesthrowCharles Ellson
  ||   | `* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||   |  `* How to get to HesthrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||   |   `- How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||   +- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  ||   `* How to get to HesthrowBob
  ||    `- How to get to Hesthrownib
  |`- How to get to HesthrowMarland
  `* How to get to HesthrowClive Page
   `* How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
    `* How to get to HesthrowTheo
     +- How to get to HesthrowRecliner
     +- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
     `* How to get to HesthrowGraeme Wall
      `* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
       +- How to get to HesthrowGraeme Wall
       `* How to get to HesthrowTheo
        `- How to get to HesthrowRecliner

Pages:1234
How to get to Hesthrow

<t3v0t2$eu7$1@dont-email.me>

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From: usenet.t...@gmail.com (Tweed)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2022 19:49:54 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Tweed - Fri, 22 Apr 2022 19:49 UTC

I’m due to fly out of Heathrow in June. Arrival in London will be at St
Pancras. Assuming the Elizabeth Line is running through the core, what’s
the best connection from StP? Trot downstairs and get a Thameslink heading
to Farringdon?

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t3v4dp$a7q$1@dont-email.me>

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2022 20:50:01 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Recliner - Fri, 22 Apr 2022 20:50 UTC

Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
> I’m due to fly out of Heathrow in June. Arrival in London will be at St
> Pancras. Assuming the Elizabeth Line is running through the core, what’s
> the best connection from StP? Trot downstairs and get a Thameslink heading
> to Farringdon?
>

Even if XR is open by then, you'd have to change at Paddington, and
possibly again at Heathrow Central, depending on your terminal. So that's
two or three changes. The easier, albeit probably slower, option is to get
a direct Piccadilly train to your terminal.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t3v4jd$bh0$1@dont-email.me>

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From: me...@privacy.invalid (NY)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2022 21:52:53 +0100
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: NY - Fri, 22 Apr 2022 20:52 UTC

"Tweed" <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:t3v0t2$eu7$1@dont-email.me...
> I’m due to fly out of Heathrow in June. Arrival in London will be at St
> Pancras. Assuming the Elizabeth Line is running through the core, what’s
> the best connection from StP? Trot downstairs and get a Thameslink heading
> to Farringdon?

That sounds a good way to do it. If the Liz Line isn't running, I suppose
it's Met/Circle Line round to Paddington and pick up the Heathrow Express
there.

Have they sorted out the godawful mess they made of the signage to the
Thameslink platforms at St Pancras. When it first opened, I went to
investigate while I was in London and all the signs said "Govia" instead of
"Thameslink". Whose brilliant idea was it to replace a well-known name
Thameslink with the here-today-gone-tomorrow name of the current company
that operated the service. I asked one of the railway staff "which way to
the Thameslink platforms" and he said in a weary "I'm fed up of having to
keep telling people" voice "Look for signs saying Govia".

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t3v5n9$ju7$1@dont-email.me>

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2022 21:12:09 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Recliner - Fri, 22 Apr 2022 21:12 UTC

NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
> "Tweed" <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:t3v0t2$eu7$1@dont-email.me...
>> I’m due to fly out of Heathrow in June. Arrival in London will be at St
>> Pancras. Assuming the Elizabeth Line is running through the core, what’s
>> the best connection from StP? Trot downstairs and get a Thameslink heading
>> to Farringdon?
>
> That sounds a good way to do it. If the Liz Line isn't running, I suppose
> it's Met/Circle Line round to Paddington and pick up the Heathrow Express
> there.

It's much easier, much cheaper, and probably no slower, to just take a
direct Piccadilly train to any Heathrow terminal. Step-free all the way,
and the seats are more comfortable.

>
> Have they sorted out the godawful mess they made of the signage to the
> Thameslink platforms at St Pancras. When it first opened, I went to
> investigate while I was in London and all the signs said "Govia" instead of
> "Thameslink".

Don't blame Govia, which was the company that promptly sorted out the
naming mess as soon as it took over, more than seven years ago. Blame
FirstGroup, which foisted the awful FCC name on Thameslink.

<https://flickr.com/photos/recliner/17087374661/in/album-72157651787464546/>

> Whose brilliant idea was it to replace a well-known name
> Thameslink with the here-today-gone-tomorrow name of the current company
> that operated the service.

FirstGroup
I asked one of the railway staff "which way to
> the Thameslink platforms" and he said in a weary "I'm fed up of having to
> keep telling people" voice "Look for signs saying Govia".

Definitely not.

Again, you are the one in the wrong. Govia is the company that fixed the
problem, and should be praised, not unfairly blamed. And it it's never used
Govia branding on any of its trains. Thameslink has never been called
Govia.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t404ao$hos$1@dont-email.me>

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From: usenet.t...@gmail.com (Tweed)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 05:54:32 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Tweed - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 05:54 UTC

Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>> "Tweed" <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:t3v0t2$eu7$1@dont-email.me...
>>> I’m due to fly out of Heathrow in June. Arrival in London will be at St
>>> Pancras. Assuming the Elizabeth Line is running through the core, what’s
>>> the best connection from StP? Trot downstairs and get a Thameslink heading
>>> to Farringdon?
>>
>> That sounds a good way to do it. If the Liz Line isn't running, I suppose
>> it's Met/Circle Line round to Paddington and pick up the Heathrow Express
>> there.
>
> It's much easier, much cheaper, and probably no slower, to just take a
> direct Piccadilly train to any Heathrow terminal. Step-free all the way,
> and the seats are more comfortable.
>
>>
>> Have they sorted out the godawful mess they made of the signage to the
>> Thameslink platforms at St Pancras. When it first opened, I went to
>> investigate while I was in London and all the signs said "Govia" instead of
>> "Thameslink".
>
> Don't blame Govia, which was the company that promptly sorted out the
> naming mess as soon as it took over, more than seven years ago. Blame
> FirstGroup, which foisted the awful FCC name on Thameslink.
>
> <https://flickr.com/photos/recliner/17087374661/in/album-72157651787464546/>
>
>> Whose brilliant idea was it to replace a well-known name
>> Thameslink with the here-today-gone-tomorrow name of the current company
>> that operated the service.
>
> FirstGroup
>
> I asked one of the railway staff "which way to
>> the Thameslink platforms" and he said in a weary "I'm fed up of having to
>> keep telling people" voice "Look for signs saying Govia".
>
> Definitely not.
>
> Again, you are the one in the wrong. Govia is the company that fixed the
> problem, and should be praised, not unfairly blamed. And it it's never used
> Govia branding on any of its trains. Thameslink has never been called
> Govia.
>
>
>
I hadn’t realised until just after my original post that EL/Crossrail was
going to initially open with an enforced change at Paddington.

In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly. The latter
is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.

Anyway, back to the original question, once EL is running as ultimately
intended I wonder what the intended routing is from StP to Heathrow.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t405j2$pef$1@dont-email.me>

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 06:16:02 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Recliner - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 06:16 UTC

Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>> "Tweed" <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:t3v0t2$eu7$1@dont-email.me...
>>>> I’m due to fly out of Heathrow in June. Arrival in London will be at St
>>>> Pancras. Assuming the Elizabeth Line is running through the core, what’s
>>>> the best connection from StP? Trot downstairs and get a Thameslink heading
>>>> to Farringdon?
>>>
>>> That sounds a good way to do it. If the Liz Line isn't running, I suppose
>>> it's Met/Circle Line round to Paddington and pick up the Heathrow Express
>>> there.
>>
>> It's much easier, much cheaper, and probably no slower, to just take a
>> direct Piccadilly train to any Heathrow terminal. Step-free all the way,
>> and the seats are more comfortable.
>>
>>>
>>> Have they sorted out the godawful mess they made of the signage to the
>>> Thameslink platforms at St Pancras. When it first opened, I went to
>>> investigate while I was in London and all the signs said "Govia" instead of
>>> "Thameslink".
>>
>> Don't blame Govia, which was the company that promptly sorted out the
>> naming mess as soon as it took over, more than seven years ago. Blame
>> FirstGroup, which foisted the awful FCC name on Thameslink.
>>
>> <https://flickr.com/photos/recliner/17087374661/in/album-72157651787464546/>
>>
>>> Whose brilliant idea was it to replace a well-known name
>>> Thameslink with the here-today-gone-tomorrow name of the current company
>>> that operated the service.
>>
>> FirstGroup
>>
>> I asked one of the railway staff "which way to
>>> the Thameslink platforms" and he said in a weary "I'm fed up of having to
>>> keep telling people" voice "Look for signs saying Govia".
>>
>> Definitely not.
>>
>> Again, you are the one in the wrong. Govia is the company that fixed the
>> problem, and should be praised, not unfairly blamed. And it it's never used
>> Govia branding on any of its trains. Thameslink has never been called
>> Govia.
>>
>>
>>
> I hadn’t realised until just after my original post that EL/Crossrail was
> going to initially open with an enforced change at Paddington.
>
> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly. The latter
> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.

But as the trains are more frequent, and go directly to all terminals, the
total journey time may not be much longer.

>
> Anyway, back to the original question, once EL is running as ultimately
> intended I wonder what the intended routing is from StP to Heathrow.

I'm not sure whether it would be better to go east and change at Farringon,
or west and change at Paddington. The time won't be much different.
Changing at Paddington also gives you the option of using either Hex or
Liz.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 07:10:28 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
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 by: Roland Perry - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 06:10 UTC

In message <t404ao$hos$1@dont-email.me>, at 05:54:32 on Sat, 23 Apr
2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:

>I hadn’t realised until just after my original post that EL/Crossrail was
>going to initially open with an enforced change at Paddington.
>
>In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly. The latter
>is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>
>Anyway, back to the original question, once EL is running as ultimately
>intended I wonder what the intended routing is from StP to Heathrow.

If it's StP Thameslink, I'd expect to stay on the train and change at
Farringdon. For StP MML, I think change to Thameslink. For Eurostar the
least walking is subsurface to Farringdon.

--
Roland Perry

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: ann...@noyd-dryver.com (Anna Noyd-Dryver)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 08:33:07 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Anna Noyd-Dryver - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 08:33 UTC

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <t404ao$hos$1@dont-email.me>, at 05:54:32 on Sat, 23 Apr
> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>
>> I hadn’t realised until just after my original post that EL/Crossrail was
>> going to initially open with an enforced change at Paddington.
>>
>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly. The latter
>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>>
>> Anyway, back to the original question, once EL is running as ultimately
>> intended I wonder what the intended routing is from StP to Heathrow.
>
> If it's StP Thameslink, I'd expect to stay on the train and change at
> Farringdon. For StP MML, I think change to Thameslink. For Eurostar the
> least walking is subsurface to Farringdon.
>

I know you have a thing about walking distances at StP/KX, but in this
instance does half the length of the station building (MML escalators to E*
exit, perhaps 100m) really make that much of a difference that you'd go a
completely different way?

Anna Noyd-Dryver

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 10:11:57 +0100
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 by: Roland Perry - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:11 UTC

In message <t3v5n9$ju7$1@dont-email.me>, at 21:12:09 on Fri, 22 Apr
2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:

>> Whose brilliant idea was it to replace a well-known name
>> Thameslink with the here-today-gone-tomorrow name of the current company
>> that operated the service.
>
>FirstGroup
>
>> I asked one of the railway staff "which way to
>> the Thameslink platforms" and he said in a weary "I'm fed up of having to
>> keep telling people" voice "Look for signs saying Govia".
>
>Definitely not.
>
>Again, you are the one in the wrong. Govia is the company that fixed the
>problem, and should be praised, not unfairly blamed. And it it's never used
>Govia branding on any of its trains. Thameslink has never been called
>Govia.

Google maps, however, never got the memo about the demise of FCC:

https://goo.gl/maps/xBmRv6j1Cdj4Mais5
--
Roland Perry

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 10:13:34 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
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 by: Roland Perry - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:13 UTC

In message <t40dk3$ch9$1@dont-email.me>, at 08:33:07 on Sat, 23 Apr
2022, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <t404ao$hos$1@dont-email.me>, at 05:54:32 on Sat, 23 Apr
>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>
>>> I hadn’t realised until just after my original post that EL/Crossrail was
>>> going to initially open with an enforced change at Paddington.
>>>
>>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly. The latter
>>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>>>
>>> Anyway, back to the original question, once EL is running as ultimately
>>> intended I wonder what the intended routing is from StP to Heathrow.
>>
>> If it's StP Thameslink, I'd expect to stay on the train and change at
>> Farringdon. For StP MML, I think change to Thameslink. For Eurostar the
>> least walking is subsurface to Farringdon.
>
>I know you have a thing about walking distances at StP/KX, but in this
>instance does half the length of the station building (MML escalators to E*
>exit, perhaps 100m)

It's 140m, but right order of magnitude.

>really make that much of a difference that you'd go a
>completely different way?

It's unfortunate they didn't implement a shorter route from the MML
platforms to the Thameslink ones, but it's also less congested to u-turn
towards the latter. There's often quite a scrum outside the E* arrivals
to negotiate, for example.
--
Roland Perry

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: me...@privacy.invalid (NY)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 11:45:50 +0100
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 by: NY - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 10:45 UTC

"Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:t3v5n9$ju7$1@dont-email.me...

>> Have they sorted out the godawful mess they made of the signage to the
>> Thameslink platforms at St Pancras. When it first opened, I went to
>> investigate while I was in London and all the signs said "Govia" instead
>> of
>> "Thameslink".
>
> Don't blame Govia, which was the company that promptly sorted out the
> naming mess as soon as it took over, more than seven years ago. Blame
> FirstGroup, which foisted the awful FCC name on Thameslink.
>
> <https://flickr.com/photos/recliner/17087374661/in/album-72157651787464546/>

Yes, it looks as if the name "Thameslink" is back again.

>> Whose brilliant idea was it to replace a well-known name
>> Thameslink with the here-today-gone-tomorrow name of the current company
>> that operated the service.
>
> FirstGroup
>
> I asked one of the railway staff "which way to
>> the Thameslink platforms" and he said in a weary "I'm fed up of having to
>> keep telling people" voice "Look for signs saying Govia".
>
> Definitely not.
>
> Again, you are the one in the wrong. Govia is the company that fixed the
> problem, and should be praised, not unfairly blamed. And it it's never
> used
> Govia branding on any of its trains. Thameslink has never been called
> Govia.

Ok. My mistake. I was getting my FCCs and Govias mixed up. But the point is
that a TOC (evidently FCC) decided that it was "better" to use their own TOC
name (which I imagine is not very well known by the public) in place of a
long-established name "Thameslink" which actually describes what it does. If
the signs had said "FCC Thameslink" (or preferably "Thameslink FCC", putting
the important name first) then it would have been better. But to remove the
"Thameslink" is lunacy. Network Rail or the Rail Regulator or the Mayor of
London should have intervened and overruled the change of signage.

The whole "First" branding was idiotic anyway because "first", in relation
to train travel, has always implied first class carriages on a train. It
also lays them open to a lot of negative publicity every time there is a
problem on one of their routes and another rival service is able to get
people to their destination sooner.

It's like all the football stadiums which decide to rebrand themselves with
the name of their owner/sponsor company instead of keeping the
long-established name. All for a bit of vanity and publicity of their name.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 12:22:22 +0100
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 by: Roland Perry - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 11:22 UTC

In message <t40lcs$43k$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:45:50 on Sat, 23 Apr
2022, NY <me@privacy.invalid> remarked:

>The whole "First" branding was idiotic anyway because "first", in
>relation to train travel, has always implied first class carriages on a
>train.

From time to time that confusion has raised is head. Of course FCC
wasn't the worst attempt at branding ever; I think that award must
go to "One". Although for a time the two brands co-existed at Cambridge
leading to lots of leg pulling about asking for the "first one" to
leave for London.
--
Roland Perry

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: rai...@greywall.demon.co.uk (Graeme Wall)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 12:34:50 +0100
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 by: Graeme Wall - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 11:34 UTC

On 23/04/2022 11:45, NY wrote:
> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:t3v5n9$ju7$1@dont-email.me...
>
>>> Have they sorted out the godawful mess they made of the signage to the
>>> Thameslink platforms at St Pancras. When it first opened, I went to
>>> investigate while I was in London and all the signs said "Govia"
>>> instead of
>>> "Thameslink".
>>
>> Don't blame Govia, which was the company that promptly sorted out the
>> naming mess as soon as it took over, more than seven years ago. Blame
>> FirstGroup, which foisted the awful FCC name on Thameslink.
>>
>> <https://flickr.com/photos/recliner/17087374661/in/album-72157651787464546/>
>>
>
> Yes, it looks as if the name "Thameslink" is back again.
>
>>> Whose brilliant idea was it to replace a well-known name
>>> Thameslink with the here-today-gone-tomorrow name of the current company
>>> that operated the service.
>>
>> FirstGroup
>>
>> I asked one of the railway staff "which way to
>>> the Thameslink platforms" and he said in a weary "I'm fed up of
>>> having to
>>> keep telling people" voice "Look for signs saying Govia".
>>
>> Definitely not.
>>
>> Again, you are the one in the wrong. Govia is the company that fixed the
>> problem, and should be praised, not unfairly blamed. And it it's never
>> used
>> Govia branding on any of its trains. Thameslink has never been called
>> Govia.
>
> Ok. My mistake. I was getting my FCCs and Govias mixed up. But the point
> is that a TOC (evidently FCC) decided that it was "better" to use their
> own TOC name (which I imagine is not very well known by the public) in
> place of a long-established name "Thameslink" which actually describes
> what it does. If the signs had said "FCC Thameslink" (or preferably
> "Thameslink FCC", putting the important name first) then it would have
> been better. But to remove the "Thameslink" is lunacy. Network Rail or
> the Rail Regulator or the Mayor of London should have intervened and
> overruled the change of signage.
>
> The whole "First" branding was idiotic anyway because "first", in
> relation to train travel, has always implied first class carriages on a
> train. It also lays them open to a lot of negative publicity every time
> there is a problem on one of their routes and another rival service is
> able to get people to their destination sooner.

First was actually a bus company when they adopted the name, still a
nonsense name but it was part of a trend at the time (see also One).

>
>
> It's like all the football stadiums which decide to rebrand themselves
> with the name of their owner/sponsor company instead of keeping the
> long-established name. All for a bit of vanity and publicity of their name.

Renaming the stadium is usually a precondition for the sponsorship. The
whole point of sponsorship is to advertise the sponsoring company.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 12:25:25 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Recliner - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 12:25 UTC

NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:t3v5n9$ju7$1@dont-email.me...
>
>>> Have they sorted out the godawful mess they made of the signage to the
>>> Thameslink platforms at St Pancras. When it first opened, I went to
>>> investigate while I was in London and all the signs said "Govia" instead
>>> of
>>> "Thameslink".
>>
>> Don't blame Govia, which was the company that promptly sorted out the
>> naming mess as soon as it took over, more than seven years ago. Blame
>> FirstGroup, which foisted the awful FCC name on Thameslink.
>>
>> <https://flickr.com/photos/recliner/17087374661/in/album-72157651787464546/>
>
> Yes, it looks as if the name "Thameslink" is back again.
>
>>> Whose brilliant idea was it to replace a well-known name
>>> Thameslink with the here-today-gone-tomorrow name of the current company
>>> that operated the service.
>>
>> FirstGroup
>>
>> I asked one of the railway staff "which way to
>>> the Thameslink platforms" and he said in a weary "I'm fed up of having to
>>> keep telling people" voice "Look for signs saying Govia".
>>
>> Definitely not.
>>
>> Again, you are the one in the wrong. Govia is the company that fixed the
>> problem, and should be praised, not unfairly blamed. And it it's never
>> used
>> Govia branding on any of its trains. Thameslink has never been called
>> Govia.
>
> Ok. My mistake. I was getting my FCCs and Govias mixed up. But the point is
> that a TOC (evidently FCC) decided that it was "better" to use their own TOC
> name (which I imagine is not very well known by the public) in place of a
> long-established name "Thameslink" which actually describes what it does. If
> the signs had said "FCC Thameslink" (or preferably "Thameslink FCC", putting
> the important name first) then it would have been better. But to remove the
> "Thameslink" is lunacy. Network Rail or the Rail Regulator or the Mayor of
> London should have intervened and overruled the change of signage.
>
> The whole "First" branding was idiotic anyway because "first", in relation
> to train travel, has always implied first class carriages on a train. It
> also lays them open to a lot of negative publicity every time there is a
> problem on one of their routes and another rival service is able to get
> people to their destination sooner.
>
>
> It's like all the football stadiums which decide to rebrand themselves with
> the name of their owner/sponsor company instead of keeping the
> long-established name. All for a bit of vanity and publicity of their name.
>

First went through a misguided marketing phase of inserting the company
brand in front of TOC names, but it has since been 'persuaded' not to do
so. So, it's now GWR not fGW, TPE not fTPE, SWR not fSW, and Avanti WC not
fWC.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.transport.london,uk.railway
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 12:35:02 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Recliner - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 12:35 UTC

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <t40lcs$43k$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:45:50 on Sat, 23 Apr
> 2022, NY <me@privacy.invalid> remarked:
>
>> The whole "First" branding was idiotic anyway because "first", in
>> relation to train travel, has always implied first class carriages on a
>> train.
>
> From time to time that confusion has raised is head. Of course FCC
> wasn't the worst attempt at branding ever; I think that award must
> go to "One". Although for a time the two brands co-existed at Cambridge
> leading to lots of leg pulling about asking for the "first one" to
> leave for London.

Yes, agreed, 'One' was the worst example, this time NatEx to blame. Another
of their silly ones was/is c2c. They also gave us the two Silverlink
branches.

In contrast, Govia has always had straightforward, geographic names with no
company branding, and reasonable liveries. So it seems particularly unfair
to blame it for the sins of the others.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: usenet.t...@gmail.com (Tweed)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 13:42:32 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Tweed - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 13:42 UTC

Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:t3v5n9$ju7$1@dont-email.me...
>>
>>>> Have they sorted out the godawful mess they made of the signage to the
>>>> Thameslink platforms at St Pancras. When it first opened, I went to
>>>> investigate while I was in London and all the signs said "Govia" instead
>>>> of
>>>> "Thameslink".
>>>
>>> Don't blame Govia, which was the company that promptly sorted out the
>>> naming mess as soon as it took over, more than seven years ago. Blame
>>> FirstGroup, which foisted the awful FCC name on Thameslink.
>>>
>>> <https://flickr.com/photos/recliner/17087374661/in/album-72157651787464546/>
>>
>> Yes, it looks as if the name "Thameslink" is back again.
>>
>>>> Whose brilliant idea was it to replace a well-known name
>>>> Thameslink with the here-today-gone-tomorrow name of the current company
>>>> that operated the service.
>>>
>>> FirstGroup
>>>
>>> I asked one of the railway staff "which way to
>>>> the Thameslink platforms" and he said in a weary "I'm fed up of having to
>>>> keep telling people" voice "Look for signs saying Govia".
>>>
>>> Definitely not.
>>>
>>> Again, you are the one in the wrong. Govia is the company that fixed the
>>> problem, and should be praised, not unfairly blamed. And it it's never
>>> used
>>> Govia branding on any of its trains. Thameslink has never been called
>>> Govia.
>>
>> Ok. My mistake. I was getting my FCCs and Govias mixed up. But the point is
>> that a TOC (evidently FCC) decided that it was "better" to use their own TOC
>> name (which I imagine is not very well known by the public) in place of a
>> long-established name "Thameslink" which actually describes what it does. If
>> the signs had said "FCC Thameslink" (or preferably "Thameslink FCC", putting
>> the important name first) then it would have been better. But to remove the
>> "Thameslink" is lunacy. Network Rail or the Rail Regulator or the Mayor of
>> London should have intervened and overruled the change of signage.
>>
>> The whole "First" branding was idiotic anyway because "first", in relation
>> to train travel, has always implied first class carriages on a train. It
>> also lays them open to a lot of negative publicity every time there is a
>> problem on one of their routes and another rival service is able to get
>> people to their destination sooner.
>>
>>
>> It's like all the football stadiums which decide to rebrand themselves with
>> the name of their owner/sponsor company instead of keeping the
>> long-established name. All for a bit of vanity and publicity of their name.
>>
>
> First went through a misguided marketing phase of inserting the company
> brand in front of TOC names, but it has since been 'persuaded' not to do
> so. So, it's now GWR not fGW, TPE not fTPE, SWR not fSW, and Avanti WC not
> fWC.
>

Hasn’t it been a requirement of recent franchise awards to have a TOC
independent name that can be bequeathed to a new encumbent without
extensive alterations?

Anyway, to reverse a bit, Thameslink is very obviously Thameslink these
days. Written on the side of the grey trains in big letters. I have to say
I like the run from StP south through London. Particularly the pause on
Blackfriars bridge with the view along the river.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: gemeha...@btinternet.co.uk (Marland)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: 23 Apr 2022 13:57:56 GMT
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 by: Marland - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 13:57 UTC

NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>
> It's like all the football stadiums which decide to rebrand themselves with
> the name of their owner/sponsor company instead of keeping the
> long-established name. All for a bit of vanity and publicity of their name.
>
For the football business masquerading as a “club” it earns them quite a
lot of money, though occasionally it causes image problems when the Sponsor
becomes the corporate equivalent of persona non grata .

GH

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: gemeha...@btinternet.co.uk (Marland)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
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 by: Marland - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 14:08 UTC

Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <t40lcs$43k$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:45:50 on Sat, 23 Apr
>> 2022, NY <me@privacy.invalid> remarked:
>>
>>> The whole "First" branding was idiotic anyway because "first", in
>>> relation to train travel, has always implied first class carriages on a
>>> train.
>>
>> From time to time that confusion has raised is head. Of course FCC
>> wasn't the worst attempt at branding ever; I think that award must
>> go to "One". Although for a time the two brands co-existed at Cambridge
>> leading to lots of leg pulling about asking for the "first one" to
>> leave for London.
>
> Yes, agreed, 'One' was the worst example, this time NatEx to blame. Another
> of their silly ones was/is c2c. They also gave us the two Silverlink
> branches.
>
Not the transport industry but perhaps Graeme has some insight as to why
the ITV contractor TVS
called its evening news programme Coast to Coast , would have been
understandable if it had been Television Southwest whose service area
incorporated Devon and Cornwall both of which have Coastlines North and
South but I always thought it a bit daft for the area it was applied to.

GH

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: rai...@greystane.shetland.co.uk (ColinR)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 15:15:25 +0100
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 by: ColinR - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 14:15 UTC

On 23/04/2022 15:08, Marland wrote:
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <t40lcs$43k$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:45:50 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>> 2022, NY <me@privacy.invalid> remarked:
>>>
>>>> The whole "First" branding was idiotic anyway because "first", in
>>>> relation to train travel, has always implied first class carriages on a
>>>> train.
>>>
>>> From time to time that confusion has raised is head. Of course FCC
>>> wasn't the worst attempt at branding ever; I think that award must
>>> go to "One". Although for a time the two brands co-existed at Cambridge
>>> leading to lots of leg pulling about asking for the "first one" to
>>> leave for London.
>>
>> Yes, agreed, 'One' was the worst example, this time NatEx to blame. Another
>> of their silly ones was/is c2c. They also gave us the two Silverlink
>> branches.
>>
> Not the transport industry but perhaps Graeme has some insight as to why
> the ITV contractor TVS
> called its evening news programme Coast to Coast , would have been
> understandable if it had been Television Southwest whose service area
> incorporated Devon and Cornwall both of which have Coastlines North and
> South but I always thought it a bit daft for the area it was applied to.
>
> GH
>

Maybe the Hampshire / Dorset coast as one and the Isle of Wight as the
other??

--
Colin

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: rai...@greywall.demon.co.uk (Graeme Wall)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 16:46:06 +0100
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 by: Graeme Wall - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 15:46 UTC

On 23/04/2022 15:08, Marland wrote:
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <t40lcs$43k$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:45:50 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>> 2022, NY <me@privacy.invalid> remarked:
>>>
>>>> The whole "First" branding was idiotic anyway because "first", in
>>>> relation to train travel, has always implied first class carriages on a
>>>> train.
>>>
>>> From time to time that confusion has raised is head. Of course FCC
>>> wasn't the worst attempt at branding ever; I think that award must
>>> go to "One". Although for a time the two brands co-existed at Cambridge
>>> leading to lots of leg pulling about asking for the "first one" to
>>> leave for London.
>>
>> Yes, agreed, 'One' was the worst example, this time NatEx to blame. Another
>> of their silly ones was/is c2c. They also gave us the two Silverlink
>> branches.
>>
> Not the transport industry but perhaps Graeme has some insight as to why
> the ITV contractor TVS
> called its evening news programme Coast to Coast , would have been
> understandable if it had been Television Southwest whose service area
> incorporated Devon and Cornwall both of which have Coastlines North and
> South but I always thought it a bit daft for the area it was applied to.
>

We thought it was daft as well, AIUI the logic was the service area was
bordered by the English Channel coast and the North Sea coast, which, of
course, meet at Dover.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: charlese...@btinternet.com (Charles Ellson)
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Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
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 by: Charles Ellson - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 16:14 UTC

On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 13:42:32 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
<usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:

>Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:t3v5n9$ju7$1@dont-email.me...
>>>
>>>>> Have they sorted out the godawful mess they made of the signage to the
>>>>> Thameslink platforms at St Pancras. When it first opened, I went to
>>>>> investigate while I was in London and all the signs said "Govia" instead
>>>>> of
>>>>> "Thameslink".
>>>>
>>>> Don't blame Govia, which was the company that promptly sorted out the
>>>> naming mess as soon as it took over, more than seven years ago. Blame
>>>> FirstGroup, which foisted the awful FCC name on Thameslink.
>>>>
>>>> <https://flickr.com/photos/recliner/17087374661/in/album-72157651787464546/>
>>>
>>> Yes, it looks as if the name "Thameslink" is back again.
>>>
>>>>> Whose brilliant idea was it to replace a well-known name
>>>>> Thameslink with the here-today-gone-tomorrow name of the current company
>>>>> that operated the service.
>>>>
>>>> FirstGroup
>>>>
>>>> I asked one of the railway staff "which way to
>>>>> the Thameslink platforms" and he said in a weary "I'm fed up of having to
>>>>> keep telling people" voice "Look for signs saying Govia".
>>>>
>>>> Definitely not.
>>>>
>>>> Again, you are the one in the wrong. Govia is the company that fixed the
>>>> problem, and should be praised, not unfairly blamed. And it it's never
>>>> used
>>>> Govia branding on any of its trains. Thameslink has never been called
>>>> Govia.
>>>
>>> Ok. My mistake. I was getting my FCCs and Govias mixed up. But the point is
>>> that a TOC (evidently FCC) decided that it was "better" to use their own TOC
>>> name (which I imagine is not very well known by the public) in place of a
>>> long-established name "Thameslink" which actually describes what it does. If
>>> the signs had said "FCC Thameslink" (or preferably "Thameslink FCC", putting
>>> the important name first) then it would have been better. But to remove the
>>> "Thameslink" is lunacy. Network Rail or the Rail Regulator or the Mayor of
>>> London should have intervened and overruled the change of signage.
>>>
>>> The whole "First" branding was idiotic anyway because "first", in relation
>>> to train travel, has always implied first class carriages on a train. It
>>> also lays them open to a lot of negative publicity every time there is a
>>> problem on one of their routes and another rival service is able to get
>>> people to their destination sooner.
>>>
>>>
>>> It's like all the football stadiums which decide to rebrand themselves with
>>> the name of their owner/sponsor company instead of keeping the
>>> long-established name. All for a bit of vanity and publicity of their name.
>>>
>>
>> First went through a misguided marketing phase of inserting the company
>> brand in front of TOC names, but it has since been 'persuaded' not to do
>> so. So, it's now GWR not fGW, TPE not fTPE, SWR not fSW, and Avanti WC not
>> fWC.
>>
>
>Hasn’t it been a requirement of recent franchise awards to have a TOC
>independent name that can be bequeathed to a new encumbent without
>extensive alterations?
>
As done a few years ago with ScotRail and London Buses, the operators'
names occupying relatively minor areas with the general livery and
branding set by the relevant government body.

>Anyway, to reverse a bit, Thameslink is very obviously Thameslink these
>days. Written on the side of the grey trains in big letters. I have to say
>I like the run from StP south through London. Particularly the pause on
>Blackfriars bridge with the view along the river.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t41b8b$hii$1@dont-email.me>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28617&group=uk.railway#28617

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 16:58:51 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Recliner - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 16:58 UTC

Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> NY <me@privacy.invalid> wrote:
>>> "Recliner" <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:t3v5n9$ju7$1@dont-email.me...
>>>
>>>>> Have they sorted out the godawful mess they made of the signage to the
>>>>> Thameslink platforms at St Pancras. When it first opened, I went to
>>>>> investigate while I was in London and all the signs said "Govia" instead
>>>>> of
>>>>> "Thameslink".
>>>>
>>>> Don't blame Govia, which was the company that promptly sorted out the
>>>> naming mess as soon as it took over, more than seven years ago. Blame
>>>> FirstGroup, which foisted the awful FCC name on Thameslink.
>>>>
>>>> <https://flickr.com/photos/recliner/17087374661/in/album-72157651787464546/>
>>>
>>> Yes, it looks as if the name "Thameslink" is back again.
>>>
>>>>> Whose brilliant idea was it to replace a well-known name
>>>>> Thameslink with the here-today-gone-tomorrow name of the current company
>>>>> that operated the service.
>>>>
>>>> FirstGroup
>>>>
>>>> I asked one of the railway staff "which way to
>>>>> the Thameslink platforms" and he said in a weary "I'm fed up of having to
>>>>> keep telling people" voice "Look for signs saying Govia".
>>>>
>>>> Definitely not.
>>>>
>>>> Again, you are the one in the wrong. Govia is the company that fixed the
>>>> problem, and should be praised, not unfairly blamed. And it it's never
>>>> used
>>>> Govia branding on any of its trains. Thameslink has never been called
>>>> Govia.
>>>
>>> Ok. My mistake. I was getting my FCCs and Govias mixed up. But the point is
>>> that a TOC (evidently FCC) decided that it was "better" to use their own TOC
>>> name (which I imagine is not very well known by the public) in place of a
>>> long-established name "Thameslink" which actually describes what it does. If
>>> the signs had said "FCC Thameslink" (or preferably "Thameslink FCC", putting
>>> the important name first) then it would have been better. But to remove the
>>> "Thameslink" is lunacy. Network Rail or the Rail Regulator or the Mayor of
>>> London should have intervened and overruled the change of signage.
>>>
>>> The whole "First" branding was idiotic anyway because "first", in relation
>>> to train travel, has always implied first class carriages on a train. It
>>> also lays them open to a lot of negative publicity every time there is a
>>> problem on one of their routes and another rival service is able to get
>>> people to their destination sooner.
>>>
>>>
>>> It's like all the football stadiums which decide to rebrand themselves with
>>> the name of their owner/sponsor company instead of keeping the
>>> long-established name. All for a bit of vanity and publicity of their name.
>>>
>>
>> First went through a misguided marketing phase of inserting the company
>> brand in front of TOC names, but it has since been 'persuaded' not to do
>> so. So, it's now GWR not fGW, TPE not fTPE, SWR not fSW, and Avanti WC not
>> fWC.
>>
>
> Hasn’t it been a requirement of recent franchise awards to have a TOC
> independent name that can be bequeathed to a new encumbent without
> extensive alterations?

Yes, but FirstGroup was persuaded/volunteered to start the ball rolling
first with its existing fGW—>GWR franchise. The silly brand names date from
quite a few years ago, when early franchises were given more freedom to
'innovate'.

>
> Anyway, to reverse a bit, Thameslink is very obviously Thameslink these
> days. Written on the side of the grey trains in big letters.

Yes, thanks to Govia. All four of its GTR sub-franchises have equally
clear, sensible branding, though trains do get swapped between them, as
passenger volumes fluctuate.

Re: How to get to Heathrow

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From: joh...@taugh.com (John Levine)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 18:46:51 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: John Levine - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 18:46 UTC

According to Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com>:
>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly. The latter
>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>
>But as the trains are more frequent, and go directly to all terminals, the
>total journey time may not be much longer.

So long as T4 remains closed, don't the Picc, HEx, and Liz all go to all open terminals?

I agree that the Picc feels like it takes forever but since you don't
have to change is usually just as fast.

--
Regards,
John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

Re: How to get to Heathrow

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
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Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 19:18:24 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Recliner - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 19:18 UTC

John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
> According to Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com>:
>>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly. The latter
>>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>>
>> But as the trains are more frequent, and go directly to all terminals, the
>> total journey time may not be much longer.
>
> So long as T4 remains closed, don't the Picc, HEx, and Liz all go to all open terminals?

Yes, that's true, but I was anticipating the reopening of T4, probably in a
couple of months.

>
> I agree that the Picc feels like it takes forever but since you don't
> have to change is usually just as fast.

No changes, and more frequent trains. And, of course, if your journey
starts in London, the Piccadilly is more likely to have a station nearby.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<rtV$NPxgBFZiFA9G@perry.uk>

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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 20:15:44 +0100
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 by: Roland Perry - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 19:15 UTC

In message <t41b8b$hii$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:58:51 on Sat, 23 Apr
2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:

>>Thameslink is very obviously Thameslink these
>> days. Written on the side of the grey trains in big letters.
>
>Yes, thanks to Govia. All four of its GTR sub-franchises have equally
>clear, sensible branding, though trains do get swapped between them, as
>passenger volumes fluctuate.

The bright red Gatwick Express Electrostars are now apparently a
permanent fixture on GN to Kings Lynn.
--
Roland Perry

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