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aus+uk / uk.railway / Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

SubjectAuthor
* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopmartin.coffee
+* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopArthur Figgis
|+- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopColinR
|`* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopmartin.coffee
| +- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopAnna Noyd-Dryver
| +* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopArthur Figgis
| |+* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
| ||`* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopArthur Figgis
| || `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
| ||  `- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCertes
| |`- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopMark Goodge
| `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopMark Goodge
|  `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCertes
|   `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
|    +- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
|    +- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopGraeme Wall
|    `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopmartin.coffee
|     +* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
|     |`* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
|     | `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopSam Wilson
|     |  `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
|     |   `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
|     |    `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
|     |     `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
|     |      `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
|     |       `- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
|     `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopGraeme Wall
|      `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
|       `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopGraeme Wall
|        `- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
+* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopAnna Noyd-Dryver
|`* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopPeter Able
| `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopTweed
|  +* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
|  |`* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
|  | `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopAnna Noyd-Dryver
|  |  `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
|  |   +* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
|  |   |`* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
|  |   | +* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
|  |   | |+* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopTweed
|  |   | ||`* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
|  |   | || `- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
|  |   | |`- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopAnna Noyd-Dryver
|  |   | `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopAnna Noyd-Dryver
|  |   |  `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
|  |   |   `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopKen
|  |   |    `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
|  |   |     `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
|  |   |      `- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
|  |   `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopAnna Noyd-Dryver
|  |    +* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
|  |    |`- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopAnna Noyd-Dryver
|  |    `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopGraeme Wall
|  |     +* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopColinR
|  |     |+- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopGraeme Wall
|  |     |`- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopAnna Noyd-Dryver
|  |     `- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopChristopher A. Lee
|  `- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
`* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
 +- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
 `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopJeremy Double
  `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
   `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
    `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
     `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
      `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRecliner
       `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
        `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
         `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
          `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCertes
           +- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
           `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
            `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
             +* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopTweed
             |`- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopSam Wilson
             +* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
             |`* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
             | `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
             |  `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
             |   `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
             |    +- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopnib
             |    `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
             |     `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
             |      `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
             |       +* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopColinR
             |       |+* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopGraeme Wall
             |       ||`- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopNigel Emery
             |       |+- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopGraeme Wall
             |       |`* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
             |       | `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopColinR
             |       |  +- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
             |       |  `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
             |       |   `- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
             |       `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
             |        `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
             |         `- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopGraeme Wall
             `* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopJeremy Double
              +- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopRoland Perry
              +- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopCharles Ellson
              +* Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopColinR
              `- Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stopNY

Pages:12345
Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<t3u78j$o6d$1@dont-email.me>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28560&group=uk.railway#28560

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From: ukr...@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk (Sam Wilson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Fri, 22 Apr 2022 12:32:19 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Sam Wilson - Fri, 22 Apr 2022 12:32 UTC

Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <n6j36hdjc8g0kh9i10dvct7u2kunk721eu@4ax.com>, at 23:04:47 on
>> Thu, 21 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>> remarked:
>>
>>>>>>> When I first joined uk.railway, which was perhaps 25yrs ago (now that
>>>>>>> Google has made the archive inaccessible, it's hard to fix an actual
>>>>>>> date). I recall when uk.transport.london was chartered, as a spin-off,
>>>>>>> and that was probably mid-90's.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lots of quibbling then about "what is London", though. At the time I was
>>>>>>> living in Surrey (not a London Borough), well inside the M25, but just
>>>>>>> inside the "01" [now "02"] phone area, and also inside the Met Police
>>>>>>> territory (which until 1999 went as far as Esher, but not as far as the
>>>>>>> M25). All of which were floated as possible definitions.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> What is wrong with the local government versions?
>>>>>
>>>>> You'd have to read the correspondence of the matter, from 25yrs ago.
>>>>> Does anyone care any more?
>>>>>
>>>>>> They are rather more definitive than telephone areas (which like
>>>>>> postal areas are more to do with the location or ex-location of the
>>>>>> main serving building)
>>>>>
>>>>> No-one cares about the occasional out-of area building,
>>>>
>>> I wasn't referring to out of area lines. The London Director Area
>>> (which later mutated into the area of the London Numbering Scheme,
>>> currently 020-land) and the exchanges within in it were never intended
>>> (and generally had no reason) to match any kind of administrative
>>> boundaries.
>>
>> Nobody said they were. But those of us discussing some sort of readily
>> accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>> much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>> 08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>
>> And whatever the "intentions" of people doing their own introspective
>> numbering schemes, they routinely get adopted by others for disjoint
>> purposes (some administrative, some tribal).
>>
>> There was an outcry when a village [with a railway station!] five miles
>> south of Cambridge was given a Stevenage (wrong county and twenty miles
>> distant) postcode. Not least because their houses were invisible (on
>> estate agent websites) to potential buyers looking for property near
>> Cambridge. And missed deliveries by couriers meant an unnecessary extra
>> 30 mile round trip to collect from their depot.
>>
> That’s nothing compared to the TD postcode that covers areas both in
> England and Scotland. Last bit of trouble were relatives in Berwick who had
> returned from abroad and filled in the passenger locator form. They had the
> Scottish test and trace mob phoning them up accusing them of not having
> complied with something or other.

My brother used to live near Chester. The Chester Sainsbury’s wouldn’t
deliver because he had a Crewe postcode; the Crewe Sainsbury’s wouldn’t
deliver because he lived too far away.

Sam

--
The entity formerly known as Sam.Wilson@ed.ac.uk
Spit the dummy to reply

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28575&group=uk.railway#28575

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From: charlese...@btinternet.com (Charles Ellson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 03:02:32 +0100
Lines: 83
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 by: Charles Ellson - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 02:02 UTC

On Fri, 22 Apr 2022 12:05:55 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
wrote:

>In message <n6j36hdjc8g0kh9i10dvct7u2kunk721eu@4ax.com>, at 23:04:47 on
>Thu, 21 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>remarked:
>
>>>>>> When I first joined uk.railway, which was perhaps 25yrs ago (now that
>>>>>> Google has made the archive inaccessible, it's hard to fix an actual
>>>>>> date). I recall when uk.transport.london was chartered, as a spin-off,
>>>>>> and that was probably mid-90's.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lots of quibbling then about "what is London", though. At the time I was
>>>>>> living in Surrey (not a London Borough), well inside the M25, but just
>>>>>> inside the "01" [now "02"] phone area, and also inside the Met Police
>>>>>> territory (which until 1999 went as far as Esher, but not as far as the
>>>>>> M25). All of which were floated as possible definitions.
>>>>>>
>>>>> What is wrong with the local government versions?
>>>>
>>>> You'd have to read the correspondence of the matter, from 25yrs ago.
>>>> Does anyone care any more?
>>>>
>>>>> They are rather more definitive than telephone areas (which like
>>>>> postal areas are more to do with the location or ex-location of the
>>>>> main serving building)
>>>>
>>>> No-one cares about the occasional out-of area building,
>>>
>>I wasn't referring to out of area lines. The London Director Area
>>(which later mutated into the area of the London Numbering Scheme,
>>currently 020-land) and the exchanges within in it were never intended
>>(and generally had no reason) to match any kind of administrative
>>boundaries.
>
>Nobody said they were. But those of us discussing some sort of readily
>accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>08) had significant tribal connotations.
>
071/0171 081/0181

>And whatever the "intentions" of people doing their own introspective
>numbering schemes, they routinely get adopted by others for disjoint
>purposes (some administrative, some tribal).
>
>There was an outcry when a village [with a railway station!] five miles
>south of Cambridge was given a Stevenage (wrong county and twenty miles
>distant) postcode. Not least because their houses were invisible (on
>estate agent websites) to potential buyers looking for property near
>Cambridge. And missed deliveries by couriers meant an unnecessary extra
>30 mile round trip to collect from their depot.
>
>>Telephone exchange areas were largely influenced by local geography
>>(natural or man-made).
>
>Yes, they were. Where I lived, on the fringes of 'London' the boundary
>was a railway line. The same sort of boundary was significant in
>Cambridge when ADSL was being rolled out: west of the fen line and you
>had a chance of getting it; east of the fen line and you had a long
>wait.
>
>But I had a red bus stop (K3 today) 300yds from my home.
>
>>>> it was about transport services, and producing an easy to
>>>>understand rule-of-thumb about which ones were reasonably on-topic
>>>>for the newsgroup.
>>>>
>>>>> or a police force which was then not associated with a county or
>>>>> counties.
>>>>
>>>> The Met's area was very well defined.
>>>
>>>...but, if we're being picky, excluded the City of London.
>>>
>>and certainly did not match any circles drawn around Charing Cross.
>
>None of the potential criteria were perfect circles, not even the M25.
>
>>There was no matching of the Met's boundaries to local government
>>areas until recent years.
>
>The exercise in question was 25yrs ago, not "in recent years".

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<j3ed7hgKS7YiFA1A@perry.uk>

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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
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 by: Roland Perry - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 08:10 UTC

In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at 03:02:32 on
Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
remarked:

>>those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>>much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>>08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>
>071/0171 081/0181

Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
fringes of the "8"s.

Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't think I
ever knew where their exchange was.

Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
station.
--
Roland Perry

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<328813124.672420718.481132.jmd.nospam-btinternet.com@news.individual.net>

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From: jmd.nos...@btinternet.com (Jeremy Double)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: 23 Apr 2022 15:41:16 GMT
Lines: 58
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 by: Jeremy Double - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 15:41 UTC

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <n6j36hdjc8g0kh9i10dvct7u2kunk721eu@4ax.com>, at 23:04:47 on
> Thu, 21 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
> remarked:
>
>>>>>> When I first joined uk.railway, which was perhaps 25yrs ago (now that
>>>>>> Google has made the archive inaccessible, it's hard to fix an actual
>>>>>> date). I recall when uk.transport.london was chartered, as a spin-off,
>>>>>> and that was probably mid-90's.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lots of quibbling then about "what is London", though. At the time I was
>>>>>> living in Surrey (not a London Borough), well inside the M25, but just
>>>>>> inside the "01" [now "02"] phone area, and also inside the Met Police
>>>>>> territory (which until 1999 went as far as Esher, but not as far as the
>>>>>> M25). All of which were floated as possible definitions.
>>>>>>
>>>>> What is wrong with the local government versions?
>>>>
>>>> You'd have to read the correspondence of the matter, from 25yrs ago.
>>>> Does anyone care any more?
>>>>
>>>>> They are rather more definitive than telephone areas (which like
>>>>> postal areas are more to do with the location or ex-location of the
>>>>> main serving building)
>>>>
>>>> No-one cares about the occasional out-of area building,
>>>
>> I wasn't referring to out of area lines. The London Director Area
>> (which later mutated into the area of the London Numbering Scheme,
>> currently 020-land) and the exchanges within in it were never intended
>> (and generally had no reason) to match any kind of administrative
>> boundaries.
>
> Nobody said they were. But those of us discussing some sort of readily
> accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
> much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
> 08) had significant tribal connotations.
>
> And whatever the "intentions" of people doing their own introspective
> numbering schemes, they routinely get adopted by others for disjoint
> purposes (some administrative, some tribal).
>
> There was an outcry when a village [with a railway station!] five miles
> south of Cambridge was given a Stevenage (wrong county and twenty miles
> distant) postcode. Not least because their houses were invisible (on
> estate agent websites) to potential buyers looking for property near
> Cambridge. And missed deliveries by couriers meant an unnecessary extra
> 30 mile round trip to collect from their depot.

Boston in Lincolnshire has a Peterborough (30 miles away in a different
county) postcode, and Sleaford has a Nottingham (30 miles away in a
different county) postcode. Horton in Ribblesdale has a Bradford postcode
(33 miles away in West, rather than North, Yorkshire).

It’s common for postcode areas to be large and cover areas in different
counties.
--
Jeremy Double

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

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From: charlese...@btinternet.com (Charles Ellson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 17:04:56 +0100
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 by: Charles Ellson - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 16:04 UTC

On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
wrote:

>In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at 03:02:32 on
>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>remarked:
>
>>>those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>>>much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>>>08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>
>>071/0171 081/0181
>
>Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
>fringes of the "8"s.
>
>Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't think I
>ever knew where their exchange was.
>
>Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
>signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>station.
>
Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly formatted)
and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
African, one Vietnamese).

As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
party line number ending in Y1.

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<Edg0Rqu3XCZiFAKB@perry.uk>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28614&group=uk.railway#28614

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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 17:14:47 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
Lines: 75
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 by: Roland Perry - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 16:14 UTC

In message
<328813124.672420718.481132.jmd.nospam-btinternet.com@news.individual.net
>, at 15:41:16 on Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Jeremy Double
<jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <n6j36hdjc8g0kh9i10dvct7u2kunk721eu@4ax.com>, at 23:04:47 on
>> Thu, 21 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>> remarked:
>>
>>>>>>> When I first joined uk.railway, which was perhaps 25yrs ago (now that
>>>>>>> Google has made the archive inaccessible, it's hard to fix an actual
>>>>>>> date). I recall when uk.transport.london was chartered, as a spin-off,
>>>>>>> and that was probably mid-90's.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lots of quibbling then about "what is London", though. At the time I was
>>>>>>> living in Surrey (not a London Borough), well inside the M25, but just
>>>>>>> inside the "01" [now "02"] phone area, and also inside the Met Police
>>>>>>> territory (which until 1999 went as far as Esher, but not as far as the
>>>>>>> M25). All of which were floated as possible definitions.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> What is wrong with the local government versions?
>>>>>
>>>>> You'd have to read the correspondence of the matter, from 25yrs ago.
>>>>> Does anyone care any more?
>>>>>
>>>>>> They are rather more definitive than telephone areas (which like
>>>>>> postal areas are more to do with the location or ex-location of the
>>>>>> main serving building)
>>>>>
>>>>> No-one cares about the occasional out-of area building,
>>>>
>>> I wasn't referring to out of area lines. The London Director Area
>>> (which later mutated into the area of the London Numbering Scheme,
>>> currently 020-land) and the exchanges within in it were never intended
>>> (and generally had no reason) to match any kind of administrative
>>> boundaries.
>>
>> Nobody said they were. But those of us discussing some sort of readily
>> accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>> much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>> 08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>
>> And whatever the "intentions" of people doing their own introspective
>> numbering schemes, they routinely get adopted by others for disjoint
>> purposes (some administrative, some tribal).
>>
>> There was an outcry when a village [with a railway station!] five miles
>> south of Cambridge was given a Stevenage (wrong county and twenty miles
>> distant) postcode. Not least because their houses were invisible (on
>> estate agent websites) to potential buyers looking for property near
>> Cambridge. And missed deliveries by couriers meant an unnecessary extra
>> 30 mile round trip to collect from their depot.
>
>Boston in Lincolnshire has a Peterborough (30 miles away in a different
>county) postcode, and Sleaford has a Nottingham (30 miles away in a
>different county) postcode. Horton in Ribblesdale has a Bradford postcode
>(33 miles away in West, rather than North, Yorkshire).
>
>It’s common for postcode areas to be large and cover areas in different
>counties.

I'm sure it is - Peterborough is an example I'm already aware of, with
quite large tracts of north Cambridgeshire included. [Whether
Peterborough is in Cambridgeshire or not is a matter of opinion. Is
Manchester in Lancashire?]

The issue with the villages in the south of Cambridgshire is that they
have no natural affinity with Hertfordshire, let alone Stevenage. They
are even known as part of Cambridge's "necklace villages".

The villagers in north Cambridgeshire will most likely go to
Peterborough to shop, or catch a train (and not to Cambridge).

--
Roland Perry

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<hj986hhbcgt49c9lthecn73k0copv5j77o@4ax.com>

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From: charlese...@btinternet.com (Charles Ellson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2022 17:30:42 +0100
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 by: Charles Ellson - Sat, 23 Apr 2022 16:30 UTC

On 23 Apr 2022 15:41:16 GMT, Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com>
wrote:

>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <n6j36hdjc8g0kh9i10dvct7u2kunk721eu@4ax.com>, at 23:04:47 on
>> Thu, 21 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>> remarked:
>>
>>>>>>> When I first joined uk.railway, which was perhaps 25yrs ago (now that
>>>>>>> Google has made the archive inaccessible, it's hard to fix an actual
>>>>>>> date). I recall when uk.transport.london was chartered, as a spin-off,
>>>>>>> and that was probably mid-90's.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lots of quibbling then about "what is London", though. At the time I was
>>>>>>> living in Surrey (not a London Borough), well inside the M25, but just
>>>>>>> inside the "01" [now "02"] phone area, and also inside the Met Police
>>>>>>> territory (which until 1999 went as far as Esher, but not as far as the
>>>>>>> M25). All of which were floated as possible definitions.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> What is wrong with the local government versions?
>>>>>
>>>>> You'd have to read the correspondence of the matter, from 25yrs ago.
>>>>> Does anyone care any more?
>>>>>
>>>>>> They are rather more definitive than telephone areas (which like
>>>>>> postal areas are more to do with the location or ex-location of the
>>>>>> main serving building)
>>>>>
>>>>> No-one cares about the occasional out-of area building,
>>>>
>>> I wasn't referring to out of area lines. The London Director Area
>>> (which later mutated into the area of the London Numbering Scheme,
>>> currently 020-land) and the exchanges within in it were never intended
>>> (and generally had no reason) to match any kind of administrative
>>> boundaries.
>>
>> Nobody said they were. But those of us discussing some sort of readily
>> accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>> much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>> 08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>
>> And whatever the "intentions" of people doing their own introspective
>> numbering schemes, they routinely get adopted by others for disjoint
>> purposes (some administrative, some tribal).
>>
>> There was an outcry when a village [with a railway station!] five miles
>> south of Cambridge was given a Stevenage (wrong county and twenty miles
>> distant) postcode. Not least because their houses were invisible (on
>> estate agent websites) to potential buyers looking for property near
>> Cambridge. And missed deliveries by couriers meant an unnecessary extra
>> 30 mile round trip to collect from their depot.
>
>Boston in Lincolnshire has a Peterborough (30 miles away in a different
>county) postcode, and Sleaford has a Nottingham (30 miles away in a
>different county) postcode. Horton in Ribblesdale has a Bradford postcode
>(33 miles away in West, rather than North, Yorkshire).
>
>It’s common for postcode areas to be large and cover areas in different
>counties.
>
Like postal addresses, they mostly work as a routing via areas of
narrowing precision rather than describing a place in actual local
terms. The "out" half mostly matches the areas of sorting offices as
they were around 60+ years ago; the delivery area being what was then
a matter of which office was the most convenient/efficient to serve an
address, in my local case probably not bearing any resemblance to
local parishes, habitations etc. since the 19th century, if ever. It
isn't just postcodes and addresses that do that - registration
districts in England were until more recent years mostly matched to
19th century Poor Law districts which often spanned parish or county
boundaries.

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<AUklTD4n5OZiFAKN@perry.uk>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28637&group=uk.railway#28637

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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
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 by: Roland Perry - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 06:29 UTC

In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at 17:04:56 on
Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
remarked:
>On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>wrote:
>
>>In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at 03:02:32 on
>>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>remarked:
>>
>>>>those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>>accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>>>>much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>>>>08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>>
>>>071/0171 081/0181
>>
>>Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
>>fringes of the "8"s.
>>
>>Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't think I
>>ever knew where their exchange was.
>>
>>Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
>>signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>station.
>>
>Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
>bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
>updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
>virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
>operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly formatted)
>and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>African, one Vietnamese).
>
>As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>party line number ending in Y1.

Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg

Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank alongside),
it was a driving school - that's still listed in some directories,
although the premises has been a money-shop since Streetview started.

https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.

In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
--
Roland Perry

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<t43hcn$gra$1@dont-email.me>

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Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: rai...@greystane.shetland.co.uk (ColinR)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 13:55:52 +0100
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: ColinR - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 12:55 UTC

On 23/04/2022 16:41, Jeremy Double wrote:
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <n6j36hdjc8g0kh9i10dvct7u2kunk721eu@4ax.com>, at 23:04:47 on
>> Thu, 21 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>> remarked:
>>
>>>>>>> When I first joined uk.railway, which was perhaps 25yrs ago (now that
>>>>>>> Google has made the archive inaccessible, it's hard to fix an actual
>>>>>>> date). I recall when uk.transport.london was chartered, as a spin-off,
>>>>>>> and that was probably mid-90's.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lots of quibbling then about "what is London", though. At the time I was
>>>>>>> living in Surrey (not a London Borough), well inside the M25, but just
>>>>>>> inside the "01" [now "02"] phone area, and also inside the Met Police
>>>>>>> territory (which until 1999 went as far as Esher, but not as far as the
>>>>>>> M25). All of which were floated as possible definitions.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> What is wrong with the local government versions?
>>>>>
>>>>> You'd have to read the correspondence of the matter, from 25yrs ago.
>>>>> Does anyone care any more?
>>>>>
>>>>>> They are rather more definitive than telephone areas (which like
>>>>>> postal areas are more to do with the location or ex-location of the
>>>>>> main serving building)
>>>>>
>>>>> No-one cares about the occasional out-of area building,
>>>>
>>> I wasn't referring to out of area lines. The London Director Area
>>> (which later mutated into the area of the London Numbering Scheme,
>>> currently 020-land) and the exchanges within in it were never intended
>>> (and generally had no reason) to match any kind of administrative
>>> boundaries.
>>
>> Nobody said they were. But those of us discussing some sort of readily
>> accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>> much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>> 08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>
>> And whatever the "intentions" of people doing their own introspective
>> numbering schemes, they routinely get adopted by others for disjoint
>> purposes (some administrative, some tribal).
>>
>> There was an outcry when a village [with a railway station!] five miles
>> south of Cambridge was given a Stevenage (wrong county and twenty miles
>> distant) postcode. Not least because their houses were invisible (on
>> estate agent websites) to potential buyers looking for property near
>> Cambridge. And missed deliveries by couriers meant an unnecessary extra
>> 30 mile round trip to collect from their depot.
>
> Boston in Lincolnshire has a Peterborough (30 miles away in a different
> county) postcode, and Sleaford has a Nottingham (30 miles away in a
> different county) postcode. Horton in Ribblesdale has a Bradford postcode
> (33 miles away in West, rather than North, Yorkshire).
>
> It’s common for postcode areas to be large and cover areas in different
> counties.

Whilst it has now changed*, for a long time many of the Western Isles
had a Paisley (PA) postcode. Even now Oban is a PA postcode, some 58
miles apart and Tiree is over 100 miles away (PA77).

*I believe that Stornoway used to come under Paisley, but not certain of
that. That is almost 200 miles!

--
Colin

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<t43n32$s32$1@dont-email.me>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28655&group=uk.railway#28655

 copy link   Newsgroups: uk.railway
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From: me...@privacy.invalid (NY)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 15:33:05 +0100
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 by: NY - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 14:33 UTC

"Jeremy Double" <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:328813124.672420718.481132.jmd.nospam-btinternet.com@news.individual.net...
> Boston in Lincolnshire has a Peterborough (30 miles away in a different
> county) postcode, and Sleaford has a Nottingham (30 miles away in a
> different county) postcode. Horton in Ribblesdale has a Bradford postcode
> (33 miles away in West, rather than North, Yorkshire).
>
> It’s common for postcode areas to be large and cover areas in different
> counties.

I remember there was a bit of fuss when the official postal address for The
[Yorkshire] Dalesman was "Clapham via Lancaster". Given the supposed
animosity between Yorkshire and "Lancashite" [sic], post to a magazine about
Yorkshire being routed via a Lancashire town didn't go down too well. I
think the official address continued beyond when postcodes were universally
introduced.

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<q31b6hlto4qq3vkmsttj3gporvlg19srsa@4ax.com>

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From: charlese...@btinternet.com (Charles Ellson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 18:10:46 +0100
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 by: Charles Ellson - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 17:10 UTC

On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
wrote:

>In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at 17:04:56 on
>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>remarked:
>>On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at 03:02:32 on
>>>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>remarked:
>>>
>>>>>those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>>>accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>>>>>much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>>>>>08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>>>
>>>>071/0171 081/0181
>>>
>>>Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>>personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
>>>fringes of the "8"s.
>>>
>>>Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>>boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't think I
>>>ever knew where their exchange was.
>>>
>>>Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
>>>signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>>station.
>>>
>>Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>>years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
>>bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
>>updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
>>virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
>>operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly formatted)
>>and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>>African, one Vietnamese).
>>
>>As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>>well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>>party line number ending in Y1.
>
>Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg
>
>Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank alongside),
>it was a driving school - that's still listed in some directories,
>although the premises has been a money-shop since Streetview started.
>
>https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.
>
>In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
>
Will you accept an A1 ? ;-)
https://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/15498385.talking-of-trains-launches-for-its-57th-year-on-wednesday-20th-september/

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<181b6h1skaa4pid6fduqnai9e85bfkunvc@4ax.com>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28676&group=uk.railway#28676

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From: charlese...@btinternet.com (Charles Ellson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 18:15:44 +0100
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 by: Charles Ellson - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 17:15 UTC

On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 13:55:52 +0100, ColinR
<rail@greystane.shetland.co.uk> wrote:

>On 23/04/2022 16:41, Jeremy Double wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <n6j36hdjc8g0kh9i10dvct7u2kunk721eu@4ax.com>, at 23:04:47 on
>>> Thu, 21 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>> remarked:
>>>
>>>>>>>> When I first joined uk.railway, which was perhaps 25yrs ago (now that
>>>>>>>> Google has made the archive inaccessible, it's hard to fix an actual
>>>>>>>> date). I recall when uk.transport.london was chartered, as a spin-off,
>>>>>>>> and that was probably mid-90's.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lots of quibbling then about "what is London", though. At the time I was
>>>>>>>> living in Surrey (not a London Borough), well inside the M25, but just
>>>>>>>> inside the "01" [now "02"] phone area, and also inside the Met Police
>>>>>>>> territory (which until 1999 went as far as Esher, but not as far as the
>>>>>>>> M25). All of which were floated as possible definitions.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What is wrong with the local government versions?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You'd have to read the correspondence of the matter, from 25yrs ago.
>>>>>> Does anyone care any more?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They are rather more definitive than telephone areas (which like
>>>>>>> postal areas are more to do with the location or ex-location of the
>>>>>>> main serving building)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No-one cares about the occasional out-of area building,
>>>>>
>>>> I wasn't referring to out of area lines. The London Director Area
>>>> (which later mutated into the area of the London Numbering Scheme,
>>>> currently 020-land) and the exchanges within in it were never intended
>>>> (and generally had no reason) to match any kind of administrative
>>>> boundaries.
>>>
>>> Nobody said they were. But those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>> accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>>> much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>>> 08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>
>>> And whatever the "intentions" of people doing their own introspective
>>> numbering schemes, they routinely get adopted by others for disjoint
>>> purposes (some administrative, some tribal).
>>>
>>> There was an outcry when a village [with a railway station!] five miles
>>> south of Cambridge was given a Stevenage (wrong county and twenty miles
>>> distant) postcode. Not least because their houses were invisible (on
>>> estate agent websites) to potential buyers looking for property near
>>> Cambridge. And missed deliveries by couriers meant an unnecessary extra
>>> 30 mile round trip to collect from their depot.
>>
>> Boston in Lincolnshire has a Peterborough (30 miles away in a different
>> county) postcode, and Sleaford has a Nottingham (30 miles away in a
>> different county) postcode. Horton in Ribblesdale has a Bradford postcode
>> (33 miles away in West, rather than North, Yorkshire).
>>
>> It’s common for postcode areas to be large and cover areas in different
>> counties.
>
>Whilst it has now changed*, for a long time many of the Western Isles
>had a Paisley (PA) postcode. Even now Oban is a PA postcode, some 58
>miles apart and Tiree is over 100 miles away (PA77).
>
>*I believe that Stornoway used to come under Paisley, but not certain of
>that. That is almost 200 miles!
>
Possibly the consequence of mail being routed via the Clyde Coast in
earlier times before the Erskine Bridge and upgrading of roads in the
West Highlands ?

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<t44989$rru$1@dont-email.me>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28679&group=uk.railway#28679

 copy link   Newsgroups: uk.railway
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: new...@ingram-bromley.co.uk (nib)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 19:43:05 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: nib - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 19:43 UTC

On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 18:10:46 +0100, Charles Ellson wrote:

> On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
>>In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at 17:04:56 on
>>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>remarked:
>>>On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at 03:02:32
>>>>on Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>remarked:
>>>>
>>>>>>those of us discussing some sort of readily accessible proxy for
>>>>>>"what is London in the context of utl" were very much aware that
>>>>>>having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than 08) had
>>>>>>significant tribal connotations.
>>>>>>
>>>>>071/0171 081/0181
>>>>
>>>>Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>>>personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
>>>>fringes of the "8"s.
>>>>
>>>>Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>>>boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't think I
>>>>ever knew where their exchange was.
>>>>
>>>>Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
>>>>signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>>>station.
>>>>
>>>Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>>>years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never bothered
>>>to have their signwriting above ground floor window level updated
>>>(Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a virtual tour
>>>of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an operational shop,
>>>otherwise current numbers (often wrongly formatted)
>>>and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>>>African, one Vietnamese).
>>>
>>>As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>>>well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>>>party line number ending in Y1.
>>
>>Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg
>>
>>Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank alongside),
>>it was a driving school - that's still listed in some directories,
>>although the premises has been a money-shop since Streetview started.
>>
>>https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>>small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.
>>
>>In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
>>
> Will you accept an A1 ? ;-)
> https://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/15498385.talking-of-trains-launches-
for-its-57th-year-on-wednesday-20th-september/

When I was at school, I certainly turned out early one morning to see an
A4 when it ran on Southern lines, but can't remember if I went to
Waterloo or Woking. It must have gone thro' Surbiton!

nib

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<iGINXYTUtmZiFAOk@perry.uk>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28684&group=uk.railway#28684

 copy link   Newsgroups: uk.railway
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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2022 10:35:16 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
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 by: Roland Perry - Mon, 25 Apr 2022 09:35 UTC

In message <q31b6hlto4qq3vkmsttj3gporvlg19srsa@4ax.com>, at 18:10:46 on
Sun, 24 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
remarked:
>On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>wrote:
>
>>In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at 17:04:56 on
>>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>remarked:
>>>On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at 03:02:32 on
>>>>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>remarked:
>>>>
>>>>>>those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>>>>accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>>>>>>much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>>>>>>08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>>>>
>>>>>071/0171 081/0181
>>>>
>>>>Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>>>personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
>>>>fringes of the "8"s.
>>>>
>>>>Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>>>boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't think I
>>>>ever knew where their exchange was.
>>>>
>>>>Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
>>>>signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>>>station.
>>>>
>>>Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>>>years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
>>>bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
>>>updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
>>>virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
>>>operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly formatted)
>>>and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>>>African, one Vietnamese).
>>>
>>>As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>>>well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>>>party line number ending in Y1.
>>
>>Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg
>>
>>Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank alongside),
>>it was a driving school - that's still listed in some directories,
>>although the premises has been a money-shop since Streetview started.
>>
>>https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>>small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.
>>
>>In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
>>
>Will you accept an A1 ? ;-)

Not really, the pub sign "Surbiton Flyer" has an A4.

>https://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/15498385.talking-of-trains-launches-f
>or-its-57th-year-on-wednesday-20th-september/

--
Roland Perry

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<cr9e6hpb0uiv6ofeh6r8rjbbiug28fvpnu@4ax.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28701&group=uk.railway#28701

 copy link   Newsgroups: uk.railway
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!news.szaf.org!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: charlese...@btinternet.com (Charles Ellson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2022 00:00:16 +0100
Lines: 72
Message-ID: <cr9e6hpb0uiv6ofeh6r8rjbbiug28fvpnu@4ax.com>
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 by: Charles Ellson - Mon, 25 Apr 2022 23:00 UTC

On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 10:35:16 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
wrote:

>In message <q31b6hlto4qq3vkmsttj3gporvlg19srsa@4ax.com>, at 18:10:46 on
>Sun, 24 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>remarked:
>>On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at 17:04:56 on
>>>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>remarked:
>>>>On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at 03:02:32 on
>>>>>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>remarked:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>>>>>accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>>>>>>>much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>>>>>>>08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>071/0171 081/0181
>>>>>
>>>>>Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>>>>personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
>>>>>fringes of the "8"s.
>>>>>
>>>>>Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>>>>boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't think I
>>>>>ever knew where their exchange was.
>>>>>
>>>>>Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
>>>>>signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>>>>station.
>>>>>
>>>>Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>>>>years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
>>>>bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
>>>>updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
>>>>virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
>>>>operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly formatted)
>>>>and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>>>>African, one Vietnamese).
>>>>
>>>>As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>>>>well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>>>>party line number ending in Y1.
>>>
>>>Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg
>>>
>>>Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank alongside),
>>>it was a driving school - that's still listed in some directories,
>>>although the premises has been a money-shop since Streetview started.
>>>
>>>https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>>>small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.
>>>
>>>In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
>>>
>>Will you accept an A1 ? ;-)
>
>Not really, the pub sign "Surbiton Flyer" has an A4.
>
>>https://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/15498385.talking-of-trains-launches-f
>>or-its-57th-year-on-wednesday-20th-september/
>
Ah, got the answer. :-)
24 Feb 1963
https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/630324lc.html

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<s0luL3ei43ZiFA9K@perry.uk>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28703&group=uk.railway#28703

 copy link   Newsgroups: uk.railway
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!news.szaf.org!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2022 06:07:46 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
Lines: 84
Message-ID: <s0luL3ei43ZiFA9K@perry.uk>
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 by: Roland Perry - Tue, 26 Apr 2022 05:07 UTC

In message <cr9e6hpb0uiv6ofeh6r8rjbbiug28fvpnu@4ax.com>, at 00:00:16 on
Tue, 26 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
remarked:
>On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 10:35:16 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>wrote:
>
>>In message <q31b6hlto4qq3vkmsttj3gporvlg19srsa@4ax.com>, at 18:10:46 on
>>Sun, 24 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>remarked:
>>>On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at 17:04:56 on
>>>>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>remarked:
>>>>>On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at 03:02:32 on
>>>>>>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>>remarked:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>>>>>>accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>>>>>>>>much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>>>>>>>>08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>071/0171 081/0181
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>>>>>personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
>>>>>>fringes of the "8"s.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>>>>>boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't think I
>>>>>>ever knew where their exchange was.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
>>>>>>signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>>>>>station.
>>>>>>
>>>>>Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>>>>>years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
>>>>>bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
>>>>>updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
>>>>>virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
>>>>>operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly formatted)
>>>>>and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>>>>>African, one Vietnamese).
>>>>>
>>>>>As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>>>>>well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>>>>>party line number ending in Y1.
>>>>
>>>>Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg
>>>>
>>>>Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank alongside),
>>>>it was a driving school - that's still listed in some directories,
>>>>although the premises has been a money-shop since Streetview started.
>>>>
>>>>https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>>>>small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.
>>>>
>>>>In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
>>>>
>>>Will you accept an A1 ? ;-)
>>
>>Not really, the pub sign "Surbiton Flyer" has an A4.
>>
>>>https://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/15498385.talking-of-trains-launches-f
>>>or-its-57th-year-on-wednesday-20th-september/
>>
>Ah, got the answer. :-)
>24 Feb 1963
>https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/630324lc.html

Is that sufficient justification for a pub sign, though. (The name of
the train is wrong, too).

Later this year there's a Scarborough Flyer, but they don't say which
kettle. But "End of Southern Steam" [55th Anniversary it says] in July
will be pulled by Clan Line.
--
Roland Perry

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<t48hep$enk$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28705&group=uk.railway#28705

 copy link   Newsgroups: uk.railway
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: rai...@greystane.shetland.co.uk (ColinR)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2022 11:27:38 +0100
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 97
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<QAih2Kl67NYiFAxn@perry.uk> <t3ri5h$9lg$2@dont-email.me>
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 by: ColinR - Tue, 26 Apr 2022 10:27 UTC

On 26/04/2022 06:07, Roland Perry wrote:
> In message <cr9e6hpb0uiv6ofeh6r8rjbbiug28fvpnu@4ax.com>, at 00:00:16 on
> Tue, 26 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com> remarked:
>> On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 10:35:16 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> In message <q31b6hlto4qq3vkmsttj3gporvlg19srsa@4ax.com>, at 18:10:46 on
>>> Sun, 24 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>> remarked:
>>>> On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at
>>>>> 17:04:56 on
>>>>> Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>> On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>>> 03:02:32 on
>>>>>>> Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>>>>>>> accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl"
>>>>>>>>> were very
>>>>>>>>> much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07
>>>>>>>>> rather than
>>>>>>>>> 08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 071/0171 081/0181
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>>>>>> personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
>>>>>>> fringes of the "8"s.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>>>>>> boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't think I
>>>>>>> ever knew where their exchange was.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
>>>>>>> signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>>>>>> station.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>>>>>> years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
>>>>>> bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
>>>>>> updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
>>>>>> virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
>>>>>> operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly formatted)
>>>>>> and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>>>>>> African, one Vietnamese).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>>>>>> well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>>>>>> party line number ending in Y1.
>>>>>
>>>>> Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg
>>>>>
>>>>> Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank
>>>>> alongside),
>>>>> it was a driving school - that's still listed in some directories,
>>>>> although the premises has been a money-shop since Streetview started.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>>>>> small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.
>>>>>
>>>>> In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
>>>>>
>>>> Will you accept an A1 ? ;-)
>>>
>>> Not really, the pub sign "Surbiton Flyer" has an A4.
>>>
>>>> https://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/15498385.talking-of-trains-launches-f
>>>>
>>>> or-its-57th-year-on-wednesday-20th-september/
>>>
>> Ah, got the answer. :-)
>> 24 Feb 1963
>> https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/630324lc.html
>
> Is that sufficient justification for a pub sign, though. (The name of
> the train is wrong, too).
>
> Later this year there's a Scarborough Flyer, but they don't say which
> kettle. But "End of Southern Steam" [55th Anniversary it says] in July
> will be pulled by Clan Line.

Depends upon what is meant by "visited Surbiton". If this means did an
A4 ever stop at Surbiton I cannot help. But if it means passing through
Surbiton then yes, two locos, Mallard and Seagull.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Locomotive_Exchange_Trials

--
Colin

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<t48idr$lga$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28706&group=uk.railway#28706

 copy link   Newsgroups: uk.railway
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: rai...@greywall.demon.co.uk (Graeme Wall)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2022 11:44:11 +0100
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 106
Message-ID: <t48idr$lga$1@dont-email.me>
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<6wFrKr+ap7XiFAuQ@perry.uk> <v0916hp98c71mjohkgeq2ntn3gipglrnu6@4ax.com>
<QAih2Kl67NYiFAxn@perry.uk> <t3ri5h$9lg$2@dont-email.me>
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<ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com> <j3ed7hgKS7YiFA1A@perry.uk>
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 by: Graeme Wall - Tue, 26 Apr 2022 10:44 UTC

On 26/04/2022 11:27, ColinR wrote:
> On 26/04/2022 06:07, Roland Perry wrote:
>> In message <cr9e6hpb0uiv6ofeh6r8rjbbiug28fvpnu@4ax.com>, at 00:00:16
>> on Tue, 26 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>> remarked:
>>> On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 10:35:16 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In message <q31b6hlto4qq3vkmsttj3gporvlg19srsa@4ax.com>, at 18:10:46 on
>>>> Sun, 24 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>> remarked:
>>>>> On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>> 17:04:56 on
>>>>>> Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry
>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>>>> 03:02:32 on
>>>>>>>> Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>>>>>>>> accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl"
>>>>>>>>>> were very
>>>>>>>>>> much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07
>>>>>>>>>> rather than
>>>>>>>>>> 08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 071/0171 081/0181
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>>>>>>> personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
>>>>>>>> fringes of the "8"s.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>>>>>>> boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't
>>>>>>>> think I
>>>>>>>> ever knew where their exchange was.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
>>>>>>>> signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>>>>>>> station.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>>>>>>> years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
>>>>>>> bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
>>>>>>> updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
>>>>>>> virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
>>>>>>> operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly
>>>>>>> formatted)
>>>>>>> and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>>>>>>> African, one Vietnamese).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>>>>>>> well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>>>>>>> party line number ending in Y1.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank
>>>>>> alongside),
>>>>>> it was a driving school - that's still listed in some directories,
>>>>>> although the premises has been a money-shop since Streetview started.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>>>>>> small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
>>>>>>
>>>>> Will you accept an A1 ? ;-)
>>>>
>>>> Not really, the pub sign "Surbiton Flyer" has an A4.
>>>>
>>>>> https://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/15498385.talking-of-trains-launches-f
>>>>>
>>>>> or-its-57th-year-on-wednesday-20th-september/
>>>>
>>> Ah, got the answer. :-)
>>> 24 Feb 1963
>>> https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/630324lc.html
>>
>> Is that sufficient justification for a pub sign, though. (The name of
>> the train is wrong, too).
>>
>> Later this year there's a Scarborough Flyer, but they don't say which
>> kettle. But "End of Southern Steam" [55th Anniversary it says] in July
>> will be pulled by Clan Line.
>
> Depends upon what is meant by "visited Surbiton". If this means did an
> A4 ever stop at Surbiton I cannot help. But if it means passing through
> Surbiton then yes, two locos, Mallard and Seagull.
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Locomotive_Exchange_Trials
>

According to a Mr Perrin, they were 11 minutes late at Surbiton.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<t48k3u$38n$3@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28707&group=uk.railway#28707

 copy link   Newsgroups: uk.railway
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: rai...@greywall.demon.co.uk (Graeme Wall)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2022 12:13:02 +0100
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 99
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 by: Graeme Wall - Tue, 26 Apr 2022 11:13 UTC

On 26/04/2022 11:27, ColinR wrote:
> On 26/04/2022 06:07, Roland Perry wrote:
>> In message <cr9e6hpb0uiv6ofeh6r8rjbbiug28fvpnu@4ax.com>, at 00:00:16
>> on Tue, 26 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>> remarked:
>>> On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 10:35:16 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In message <q31b6hlto4qq3vkmsttj3gporvlg19srsa@4ax.com>, at 18:10:46 on
>>>> Sun, 24 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>> remarked:
>>>>> On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>> 17:04:56 on
>>>>>> Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry
>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>>>> 03:02:32 on
>>>>>>>> Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>>>>>>>> accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl"
>>>>>>>>>> were very
>>>>>>>>>> much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07
>>>>>>>>>> rather than
>>>>>>>>>> 08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 071/0171 081/0181
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>>>>>>> personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
>>>>>>>> fringes of the "8"s.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>>>>>>> boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't
>>>>>>>> think I
>>>>>>>> ever knew where their exchange was.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
>>>>>>>> signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>>>>>>> station.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>>>>>>> years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
>>>>>>> bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
>>>>>>> updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
>>>>>>> virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
>>>>>>> operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly
>>>>>>> formatted)
>>>>>>> and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>>>>>>> African, one Vietnamese).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>>>>>>> well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>>>>>>> party line number ending in Y1.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank
>>>>>> alongside),
>>>>>> it was a driving school - that's still listed in some directories,
>>>>>> although the premises has been a money-shop since Streetview started.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>>>>>> small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
>>>>>>
>>>>> Will you accept an A1 ? ;-)
>>>>
>>>> Not really, the pub sign "Surbiton Flyer" has an A4.
>>>>
>>>>> https://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/15498385.talking-of-trains-launches-f
>>>>>
>>>>> or-its-57th-year-on-wednesday-20th-september/
>>>>
>>> Ah, got the answer. :-)
>>> 24 Feb 1963
>>> https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/630324lc.html
>>

Just realised that is the train I saw, just before the photo on that
page was taken. I was on a train up to Waterloo from either Raynes Park
or West Ewell and saw it pass in the opposite direction. Wasn't able to
get the number as I wasn't expecting it. Must dig out my old combine and
underline 60022!

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<fRTyiWp4z$ZiFAY1@perry.uk>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28709&group=uk.railway#28709

 copy link   Newsgroups: uk.railway
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!news.freedyn.de!newsreader4.netcologne.de!news.netcologne.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2022 15:08:56 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
Lines: 101
Message-ID: <fRTyiWp4z$ZiFAY1@perry.uk>
References: <gPpdFotpDwXiFAfG@perry.uk> <t3n1st$9i4$1@dont-email.me>
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 by: Roland Perry - Tue, 26 Apr 2022 14:08 UTC

In message <t48hep$enk$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:27:38 on Tue, 26 Apr
2022, ColinR <rail@greystane.shetland.co.uk> remarked:
>On 26/04/2022 06:07, Roland Perry wrote:
>> In message <cr9e6hpb0uiv6ofeh6r8rjbbiug28fvpnu@4ax.com>, at 00:00:16
>>on Tue, 26 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>remarked:
>>> On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 10:35:16 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In message <q31b6hlto4qq3vkmsttj3gporvlg19srsa@4ax.com>, at 18:10:46 on
>>>> Sun, 24 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>> remarked:
>>>>> On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>>17:04:56 on
>>>>>> Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>>>>03:02:32 on
>>>>>>>> Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>>>>>>>> accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl"
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07
>>>>>>>>>>rather than
>>>>>>>>>> 08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 071/0171 081/0181
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>>>>>>> personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
>>>>>>>> fringes of the "8"s.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>>>>>>> boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't think I
>>>>>>>> ever knew where their exchange was.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
>>>>>>>> signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>>>>>>> station.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>>>>>>> years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
>>>>>>> bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
>>>>>>> updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
>>>>>>> virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
>>>>>>> operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly formatted)
>>>>>>> and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>>>>>>> African, one Vietnamese).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>>>>>>> well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>>>>>>> party line number ending in Y1.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank
>>>>>>alongside), it was a driving school - that's still listed in some
>>>>>>directories, although the premises has been a money-shop since
>>>>>>Streetview started.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>>>>>> small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
>>>>>>
>>>>> Will you accept an A1 ? ;-)
>>>>
>>>> Not really, the pub sign "Surbiton Flyer" has an A4.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>https://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/15498385.talking-of-trains-launch>>>>>es-f
>>>>> or-its-57th-year-on-wednesday-20th-september/
>>>>
>>> Ah, got the answer. :-)
>>> 24 Feb 1963
>>> https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/630324lc.html

>> Is that sufficient justification for a pub sign, though. (The name
>>of the train is wrong, too).

>> Later this year there's a Scarborough Flyer, but they don't say
>>which kettle. But "End of Southern Steam" [55th Anniversary it says]
>>in July will be pulled by Clan Line.
>
>Depends upon what is meant by "visited Surbiton". If this means did an
>A4 ever stop at Surbiton I cannot help. But if it means passing through
>Surbiton then yes, two locos, Mallard and Seagull.
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Locomotive_Exchange_Trials

What is meant is "significantly enough for a pub sign to commemorate it"
(~70yrs later).
--
Roland Perry

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<t48vsi$3t9$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28710&group=uk.railway#28710

 copy link   Newsgroups: uk.railway
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: rai...@greystane.shetland.co.uk (ColinR)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2022 15:33:54 +0100
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 114
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In-Reply-To: <fRTyiWp4z$ZiFAY1@perry.uk>
 by: ColinR - Tue, 26 Apr 2022 14:33 UTC

On 26/04/2022 15:08, Roland Perry wrote:
> In message <t48hep$enk$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:27:38 on Tue, 26 Apr
> 2022, ColinR <rail@greystane.shetland.co.uk> remarked:
>> On 26/04/2022 06:07, Roland Perry wrote:
>>> In message <cr9e6hpb0uiv6ofeh6r8rjbbiug28fvpnu@4ax.com>, at 00:00:16
>>> on  Tue, 26 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>> remarked:
>>>> On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 10:35:16 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> In message <q31b6hlto4qq3vkmsttj3gporvlg19srsa@4ax.com>, at
>>>>> 18:10:46 on
>>>>> Sun, 24 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>> On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>>> 17:04:56 on
>>>>>>> Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry
>>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>>>>> 03:02:32 on
>>>>>>>>> Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>>>>>>>>> accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl"
>>>>>>>>>>> much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07
>>>>>>>>>>> rather than
>>>>>>>>>>> 08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 071/0171 081/0181
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>>>>>>>> personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the
>>>>>>>>> outer
>>>>>>>>> fringes of the "8"s.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>>>>>>>> boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't
>>>>>>>>> think I
>>>>>>>>> ever knew where their exchange was.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still
>>>>>>>>> had
>>>>>>>>> signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>>>>>>>> station.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>>>>>>>> years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
>>>>>>>> bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
>>>>>>>> updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
>>>>>>>> virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
>>>>>>>> operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly
>>>>>>>> formatted)
>>>>>>>> and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>>>>>>>> African, one Vietnamese).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>>>>>>>> well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>>>>>>>> party line number ending in Y1.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank
>>>>>>> alongside),  it was a driving school - that's still listed in
>>>>>>> some directories,  although the premises has been a money-shop
>>>>>>> since Streetview started.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>>>>>>> small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Will you accept an A1 ? ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>> Not really, the pub sign "Surbiton Flyer" has an A4.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/15498385.talking-of-trains-launch>>>>>es-f
>>>>>>
>>>>>> or-its-57th-year-on-wednesday-20th-september/
>>>>>
>>>> Ah, got the answer. :-)
>>>> 24 Feb 1963
>>>> https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/630324lc.html
>
>>>  Is that sufficient justification for a pub sign, though. (The name
>>> of  the train is wrong, too).
>
>>>  Later this year there's a Scarborough Flyer, but they don't say
>>> which  kettle. But "End of Southern Steam" [55th Anniversary it says]
>>> in July  will be pulled by Clan Line.
>>
>> Depends upon what is meant by "visited Surbiton". If this means did an
>> A4 ever stop at Surbiton I cannot help. But if it means passing
>> through Surbiton then yes, two locos, Mallard and Seagull.
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Locomotive_Exchange_Trials
>
> What is meant is "significantly enough for a pub sign to commemorate it"
> (~70yrs later).

Again I hear goalposts being moved by you! I was responding to a line in
your post on 24th at 0729 in which you said "In other news, did A4's
ever visit Surbiton?" Absolutely nothing about pub signs.

--
Colin

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<GuCE9OqwcAaiFAQ7@perry.uk>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28711&group=uk.railway#28711

 copy link   Newsgroups: uk.railway
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!news.uzoreto.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2022 15:52:32 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <GuCE9OqwcAaiFAQ7@perry.uk>
References: <gPpdFotpDwXiFAfG@perry.uk> <t3n1st$9i4$1@dont-email.me>
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 by: Roland Perry - Tue, 26 Apr 2022 14:52 UTC

In message <t48vsi$3t9$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:33:54 on Tue, 26 Apr
2022, ColinR <rail@greystane.shetland.co.uk> remarked:

>>>>>>>> https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>>>>>>>> small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.

A streetview with a pub sign in it.

>>>>>>>> In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?

>Again I hear goalposts being moved by you! I was responding to a line
>in your post on 24th at 0729 in which you said "In other news, did A4's
>ever visit Surbiton?" Absolutely nothing about pub signs.

Do keep up!
--
Roland Perry

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<dghg6hls1ed4og6ehsfdsu43ajv065hkkd@4ax.com>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28714&group=uk.railway#28714

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From: charlese...@btinternet.com (Charles Ellson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2022 20:23:19 +0100
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 by: Charles Ellson - Tue, 26 Apr 2022 19:23 UTC

On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 15:33:54 +0100, ColinR
<rail@greystane.shetland.co.uk> wrote:

>On 26/04/2022 15:08, Roland Perry wrote:
>> In message <t48hep$enk$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:27:38 on Tue, 26 Apr
>> 2022, ColinR <rail@greystane.shetland.co.uk> remarked:
>>> On 26/04/2022 06:07, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>> In message <cr9e6hpb0uiv6ofeh6r8rjbbiug28fvpnu@4ax.com>, at 00:00:16
>>>> on  Tue, 26 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>> remarked:
>>>>> On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 10:35:16 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> In message <q31b6hlto4qq3vkmsttj3gporvlg19srsa@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>> 18:10:46 on
>>>>>> Sun, 24 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>>> On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>>>> 17:04:56 on
>>>>>>>> Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry
>>>>>>>>> <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at
>>>>>>>>>> 03:02:32 on
>>>>>>>>>> Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>>>>>> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>>>>>>>>>> accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl"
>>>>>>>>>>>> much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07
>>>>>>>>>>>> rather than
>>>>>>>>>>>> 08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 071/0171 081/0181
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>>>>>>>>> personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the
>>>>>>>>>> outer
>>>>>>>>>> fringes of the "8"s.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>>>>>>>>> boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't
>>>>>>>>>> think I
>>>>>>>>>> ever knew where their exchange was.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still
>>>>>>>>>> had
>>>>>>>>>> signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>>>>>>>>> station.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>>>>>>>>> years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
>>>>>>>>> bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
>>>>>>>>> updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
>>>>>>>>> virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
>>>>>>>>> operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly
>>>>>>>>> formatted)
>>>>>>>>> and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>>>>>>>>> African, one Vietnamese).
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>>>>>>>>> well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>>>>>>>>> party line number ending in Y1.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank
>>>>>>>> alongside),  it was a driving school - that's still listed in
>>>>>>>> some directories,  although the premises has been a money-shop
>>>>>>>> since Streetview started.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>>>>>>>> small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Will you accept an A1 ? ;-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Not really, the pub sign "Surbiton Flyer" has an A4.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/15498385.talking-of-trains-launch>>>>>es-f
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> or-its-57th-year-on-wednesday-20th-september/
>>>>>>
>>>>> Ah, got the answer. :-)
>>>>> 24 Feb 1963
>>>>> https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/630324lc.html
>>
>>>>  Is that sufficient justification for a pub sign, though. (The name
>>>> of  the train is wrong, too).
>>
>>>>  Later this year there's a Scarborough Flyer, but they don't say
>>>> which  kettle. But "End of Southern Steam" [55th Anniversary it says]
>>>> in July  will be pulled by Clan Line.
>>>
>>> Depends upon what is meant by "visited Surbiton". If this means did an
>>> A4 ever stop at Surbiton I cannot help. But if it means passing
>>> through Surbiton then yes, two locos, Mallard and Seagull.
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Locomotive_Exchange_Trials
>>
>> What is meant is "significantly enough for a pub sign to commemorate it"
>> (~70yrs later).
>
>Again I hear goalposts being moved by you! I was responding to a line in
>your post on 24th at 0729 in which you said "In other news, did A4's
>ever visit Surbiton?" Absolutely nothing about pub signs.
>
It is also often a mistake to presume a pub sign is based on reality.

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<zzSZ6+uxlMaiFA3F@perry.uk>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28719&group=uk.railway#28719

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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2022 05:41:21 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
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 by: Roland Perry - Wed, 27 Apr 2022 04:41 UTC

In message <dghg6hls1ed4og6ehsfdsu43ajv065hkkd@4ax.com>, at 20:23:19 on
Tue, 26 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
remarked:
>>Again I hear goalposts being moved by you! I was responding to a line in
>>your post on 24th at 0729 in which you said "In other news, did A4's
>>ever visit Surbiton?" Absolutely nothing about pub signs.
>>
>It is also often a mistake to presume a pub sign is based on reality.

Sure, but there's a group of people whose toes curl when they see
a news story illustrated with a stock photo of the wrong class of
EMU, or overhear punters refer to the front carriage of and EMU
as a "locomotive".
--
Roland Perry

Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop

<lh3j6h90tnjqc6outcdlj41q4v68njk8ml@4ax.com>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28742&group=uk.railway#28742

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From: charlese...@btinternet.com (Charles Ellson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: Lumo train passengers' panic after emergency stop
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2022 19:46:39 +0100
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 by: Charles Ellson - Wed, 27 Apr 2022 18:46 UTC

On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 06:07:46 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
wrote:

>In message <cr9e6hpb0uiv6ofeh6r8rjbbiug28fvpnu@4ax.com>, at 00:00:16 on
>Tue, 26 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>remarked:
>>On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 10:35:16 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>In message <q31b6hlto4qq3vkmsttj3gporvlg19srsa@4ax.com>, at 18:10:46 on
>>>Sun, 24 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>remarked:
>>>>On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:29:59 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>In message <uc786h55p74731vnac93thl76tmb7nquj5@4ax.com>, at 17:04:56 on
>>>>>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>remarked:
>>>>>>On Sat, 23 Apr 2022 09:10:50 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
>>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>In message <ren66h9sfv0sag7pf9105eb7ggebujn26f@4ax.com>, at 03:02:32 on
>>>>>>>Sat, 23 Apr 2022, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>>>>>>>remarked:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>those of us discussing some sort of readily
>>>>>>>>>accessible proxy for "what is London in the context of utl" were very
>>>>>>>>>much aware that having an "01" number or not (and late 07 rather than
>>>>>>>>>08) had significant tribal connotations.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>071/0171 081/0181
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Yes, I was living in the area with diverse in/out of "London"
>>>>>>>personalities just after the 1995 number change. Right on the outer
>>>>>>>fringes of the "8"s.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Always the early adopter, I was with Nynex, and their numbering
>>>>>>>boundaries could have differed slightly from BT's. But don't think I
>>>>>>>ever knew where their exchange was.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Getting slightly back on topic, at least one local trader still had
>>>>>>>signage with the old ELMbridge number on: the taxi office at the
>>>>>>>station.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>Bearing in mind the first major dialling code change is now over 30
>>>>>>years ago, there are still quite a few places which have never
>>>>>>bothered to have their signwriting above ground floor window level
>>>>>>updated (Willesden High Road?). It seems to vary between places; a
>>>>>>virtual tour of Deptford High Street has just one "081" on an
>>>>>>operational shop, otherwise current numbers (often wrongly formatted)
>>>>>>and even a couple given in full international +44 etc. format (one
>>>>>>African, one Vietnamese).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>As for your Elmbridge example, ISTR one fairly definitely repro (or
>>>>>>well maintained?) sign somewhere a few years ago including a manual
>>>>>>party line number ending in Y1.
>>>>>
>>>>>Found my photo: http://perry.co.uk/images/Surbiton-July-1998.jpg
>>>>>
>>>>>Right location, wrong tradesman (although it has a taxi rank alongside),
>>>>>it was a driving school - that's still listed in some directories,
>>>>>although the premises has been a money-shop since Streetview started.
>>>>>
>>>>>https://goo.gl/maps/vu1tuPvnnACoTKjN6 the Deli the other end of that
>>>>>small parade has an 0181 number displayed today.
>>>>>
>>>>>In other news, did A4's ever visit Surbiton?
>>>>>
>>>>Will you accept an A1 ? ;-)
>>>
>>>Not really, the pub sign "Surbiton Flyer" has an A4.
>>>
>>>>https://www.surreycomet.co.uk/news/15498385.talking-of-trains-launches-f
>>>>or-its-57th-year-on-wednesday-20th-september/
>>>
>>Ah, got the answer. :-)
>>24 Feb 1963
>>https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/630324lc.html
>
>Is that sufficient justification for a pub sign, though. (The name of
>the train is wrong, too).
>
>Later this year there's a Scarborough Flyer, but they don't say which
>kettle. But "End of Southern Steam" [55th Anniversary it says] in July
>will be pulled by Clan Line.
>
Apparently the current "Surbiton Flyer" sign is somewhat off the
original topic anyway, being originally a local cyclist.
https://lynwoodf.wiki.zoho.com/localhistory/The-original-Surbiton-Flyer.html

My suspicion is that the current pub sign could be based on a
photograph taken anywhere within 0-400 miles from Surbiton rather than
any particular visit to the local railway.

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