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aus+uk / uk.railway / Re: How to get to Hesthrow

SubjectAuthor
* How to get to HesthrowTweed
+- How to get to HesthrowRecliner
`* How to get to HesthrowNY
 `* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  +* How to get to HesthrowTweed
  |+* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||`* How to get to HeathrowJohn Levine
  || `* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||  `* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||   `* How to get to HeathrowTweed
  ||    +* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    |`* How to get to HeathrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||    | +* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | |+* How to get to HeathrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||    | ||`* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | || +* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | || |`* How to get to HeathrowBob
  ||    | || | `- How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | || `* How to get to HeathrowRoger Lynn
  ||    | ||  +* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  |`* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | ||  | `* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  |  `* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | ||  |   `* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  |    `* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | ||  |     `* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  |      `* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | ||  |       `* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  |        `* How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    | ||  |         `* How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  |          `* How to get to HeathrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||    | ||  |           +- How to get to HeathrowTweed
  ||    | ||  |           `- How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | ||  `* How to get to HeathrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||    | ||   `- How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    | |`- How to get to HeathrowPeter Johnson
  ||    | `* How to get to Heathrowhounslow3@yahoo.co.uk
  ||    |  +- How to get to HeathrowCharles Ellson
  ||    |  +- How to get to HeathrowRecliner
  ||    |  `- How to get to HeathrowRoland Perry
  ||    `- How to get to HeathrowMarland
  |`* How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  | `* How to get to HesthrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  |  `- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  +- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  +* How to get to HesthrowNY
  |+* How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  ||`* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  || `* How to get to HesthrowMarland
  ||  +- How to get to HesthrowColinR
  ||  `- How to get to HesthrowGraeme Wall
  |+- How to get to HesthrowGraeme Wall
  |+* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||`* How to get to HesthrowTweed
  || +- How to get to HesthrowCharles Ellson
  || `* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||  +* How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  ||  |`* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||  | +* How to get to HesthrowTweed
  ||  | |`* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||  | | `- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  ||  | +- How to get to HesthrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||  | `- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  ||  `* How to get to HesthrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||   +* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||   |+- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  ||   |`* How to get to HesthrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||   | +* How to get to HesthrowSam Wilson
  ||   | |+* How to get to HesthrowTweed
  ||   | ||`* How to get to HesthrowGraeme Wall
  ||   | || +- How to get to HesthrowMarland
  ||   | || `- How to get to HesthrowCharles Ellson
  ||   | |+- How to get to HesthrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||   | |`- How to get to HesthrowCharles Ellson
  ||   | `* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||   |  `* How to get to HesthrowAnna Noyd-Dryver
  ||   |   `- How to get to HesthrowRecliner
  ||   +- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
  ||   `* How to get to HesthrowBob
  ||    `- How to get to Hesthrownib
  |`- How to get to HesthrowMarland
  `* How to get to HesthrowClive Page
   `* How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
    `* How to get to HesthrowTheo
     +- How to get to HesthrowRecliner
     +- How to get to HesthrowRoland Perry
     `* How to get to HesthrowGraeme Wall
      `* How to get to HesthrowRecliner
       +- How to get to HesthrowGraeme Wall
       `* How to get to HesthrowTheo
        `- How to get to HesthrowRecliner

Pages:1234
Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t43la5$er9$1@dont-email.me>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28652&group=uk.railway#28652

 copy link   Newsgroups: uk.railway uk.transport.london
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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 14:02:45 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Recliner - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 14:02 UTC

Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
> In uk.transport.london Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> If the Circle was still a Circle, it'd be possible to do a lot less
>> walking, and take three lifts (two very short) down to the Subsurface
>> platforms at the front of St Pancras, then same platform change to the
>> District somewhere like Bayswater, then cross platform to the Piccadilly
>> at Barons Court or Hammersmith.
>
> What's the interchange like at Hammersmith between Circle/H&C and
> Piccadilly? Looking at the journey planner it seems about evens using
> either to get from St Pancras. Possibly the Circle/H&C would be an option
> for those wanting an alternative route (with less tunnel)?

It's an OSI. Hammersmith H&C is at ground level, cross the road, go into
the shopping centre, one lift down to either platform.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<Bx01ajLkAXZiFA46@perry.uk>

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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 16:43:32 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
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 by: Roland Perry - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 15:43 UTC

In message <QJg*juvMy@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>, at 14:44:06 on Sun,
24 Apr 2022, Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> remarked:

>In uk.transport.london Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:

>> If the Circle was still a Circle, it'd be possible to do a lot less
>> walking, and take three lifts (two very short) down to the Subsurface
>> platforms at the front of St Pancras, then same platform change to the
>> District somewhere like Bayswater, then cross platform to the Piccadilly
>> at Barons Court or Hammersmith.
>
>What's the interchange like at Hammersmith between Circle/H&C and
>Piccadilly? Looking at the journey planner it seems about evens using
>either to get from St Pancras. Possibly the Circle/H&C would be an option
>for those wanting an alternative route (with less tunnel)?

iirc it's on the level coming out of the Circle/H&C station, but then
you have to cross the road and find the Piccadilly/District station,
which reportedly has lifts down to the platform level.
--
Roland Perry

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t43s22$3f2$1@dont-email.me>

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From: rai...@greywall.demon.co.uk (Graeme Wall)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 16:57:54 +0100
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Graeme Wall - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 15:57 UTC

On 24/04/2022 14:44, Theo wrote:
> In uk.transport.london Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> If the Circle was still a Circle, it'd be possible to do a lot less
>> walking, and take three lifts (two very short) down to the Subsurface
>> platforms at the front of St Pancras, then same platform change to the
>> District somewhere like Bayswater, then cross platform to the Piccadilly
>> at Barons Court or Hammersmith.
>
> What's the interchange like at Hammersmith between Circle/H&C and
> Piccadilly? Looking at the journey planner it seems about evens using
> either to get from St Pancras. Possibly the Circle/H&C would be an option
> for those wanting an alternative route (with less tunnel)?
>

Involves an underpass to get across Hammersmith Broadway.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t43spn$a9m$1@dont-email.me>

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 16:10:31 -0000 (UTC)
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Recliner - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 16:10 UTC

Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> On 24/04/2022 14:44, Theo wrote:
>> In uk.transport.london Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> If the Circle was still a Circle, it'd be possible to do a lot less
>>> walking, and take three lifts (two very short) down to the Subsurface
>>> platforms at the front of St Pancras, then same platform change to the
>>> District somewhere like Bayswater, then cross platform to the Piccadilly
>>> at Barons Court or Hammersmith.
>>
>> What's the interchange like at Hammersmith between Circle/H&C and
>> Piccadilly? Looking at the journey planner it seems about evens using
>> either to get from St Pancras. Possibly the Circle/H&C would be an option
>> for those wanting an alternative route (with less tunnel)?
>>
>
> Involves an underpass to get across Hammersmith Broadway.

That closed many years ago!

You just walk across the road when the little green man invites you to do
so. It's all on the level. The Piccadilly/District station is just inside
the shopping centre, and can't be missed. After the barriers, there are
lifts down to both island platforms. All very easy and straightforward, and
of course all westbound H&C/Circle trains at Kings X St P now go to
Hammersmith, so it's quite a frequent service.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t43t9k$dpc$1@dont-email.me>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28664&group=uk.railway#28664

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Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: rai...@greywall.demon.co.uk (Graeme Wall)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 17:19:00 +0100
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Graeme Wall - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 16:19 UTC

On 24/04/2022 17:10, Recliner wrote:
> Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 24/04/2022 14:44, Theo wrote:
>>> In uk.transport.london Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> If the Circle was still a Circle, it'd be possible to do a lot less
>>>> walking, and take three lifts (two very short) down to the Subsurface
>>>> platforms at the front of St Pancras, then same platform change to the
>>>> District somewhere like Bayswater, then cross platform to the Piccadilly
>>>> at Barons Court or Hammersmith.
>>>
>>> What's the interchange like at Hammersmith between Circle/H&C and
>>> Piccadilly? Looking at the journey planner it seems about evens using
>>> either to get from St Pancras. Possibly the Circle/H&C would be an option
>>> for those wanting an alternative route (with less tunnel)?
>>>
>>
>> Involves an underpass to get across Hammersmith Broadway.
>
> That closed many years ago!

Shows how long it is since I've been there!

>
> You just walk across the road when the little green man invites you to do
> so. It's all on the level. The Piccadilly/District station is just inside
> the shopping centre, and can't be missed. After the barriers, there are
> lifts down to both island platforms. All very easy and straightforward, and
> of course all westbound H&C/Circle trains at Kings X St P now go to
> Hammersmith, so it's quite a frequent service.
>

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t443d5$ms$1@dont-email.me>

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From: ann...@noyd-dryver.com (Anna Noyd-Dryver)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 18:03:17 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Anna Noyd-Dryver - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 18:03 UTC

Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> First went through a misguided marketing phase of inserting the company
>>>>>>> brand in front of TOC names, but it has since been 'persuaded' not to do
>>>>>>> so. So, it's now GWR not fGW, TPE not fTPE, SWR not fSW, and Avanti WC not
>>>>>>> fWC.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hasn’t it been a requirement of recent franchise awards to have a TOC
>>>>>> independent name that can be bequeathed to a new encumbent without
>>>>>> extensive alterations?
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, but FirstGroup was persuaded/volunteered to start the ball rolling
>>>>> first with its existing fGW—>GWR franchise. The silly brand names date from
>>>>> quite a few years ago, when early franchises were given more freedom to
>>>>> 'innovate'.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Most of the initial franchises (except Virgin) didn't have the franchisee
>>>> identity in the name, IIRC. Later takeovers or refranchising established
>>>> that habit.
>>>
>>> Yes, I think most of the first batch were MBOs, who had no interest in
>>> supposedly catchy branding. It was when they sold out to or were replaced
>>> by companies like First and NatEx, which acquired multiple TOCs, that some
>>> marketing genius decided that privatised train services were a classic
>>> consumer product, so lots more passengers would be attracted if only the
>>> branding was wackier. Mobile phone companies went through a similar phase
>>> in the same period, and some new banks have the same idea now.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Which ones other than c2c, One and FCC do you consider 'wacky'? Most were a
>> geographical name with the owning group appended, surely, or occasionally
>> just the name of that group (Connex).
>
> Silverlink with their purple and green trains? I liked the livery, which
> seemed to make me a bit unusual, but the name made no sense.
>
>

Good point!

Anna Noyd-Dryver

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: ann...@noyd-dryver.com (Anna Noyd-Dryver)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 18:03:17 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Anna Noyd-Dryver - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 18:03 UTC

Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>>
>> Which ones other than c2c, One and FCC do you consider 'wacky'? Most were a
>> geographical name with the owning group appended, surely, or occasionally
>> just the name of that group (Connex).
>
>
>
> Wessex is more whimsical than geographic.
>

Wessex came later, the original franchise was Wales and West.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

Re: How to get to Heathrow

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From: ann...@noyd-dryver.com (Anna Noyd-Dryver)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 18:03:18 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Anna Noyd-Dryver - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 18:03 UTC

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <t42r8q$m53$2@dont-email.me>, at 06:38:18 on Sun, 24 Apr
> 2022, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <t41nbh$jci$1@dont-email.me>, at 20:25:21 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <t41je0$kva$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:18:24 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> According to Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com>:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly.
>>>>>>>>> The latter
>>>>>>>>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But as the trains are more frequent, and go directly to all
>>>>>>>> terminals, the
>>>>>>>> total journey time may not be much longer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So long as T4 remains closed, don't the Picc, HEx, and Liz all go to
>>>>>>> all open terminals?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, that's true, but I was anticipating the reopening of T4,
>>>>>> probably in a
>>>>>> couple of months.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree that the Picc feels like it takes forever but since you don't
>>>>>>> have to change is usually just as fast.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No changes, and more frequent trains. And, of course, if your journey
>>>>>> starts in London, the Piccadilly is more likely to have a station nearby.
>>>>>
>>>>> And I don't understand why the alleged tedium of a little under an hour
>>>>> on the Piccadilly Line is significant compared to the ensuing two to
>>>>> three hours of tedium at Heathrow, the five to ten hours of tedium on
>>>>> the onward flight, and however many hours of tedium there are at the
>>>>> arrival airport.
>>>>
>>>> It’s utterly illogical, but I really don’t like the slow trio out to
>>>> Heathrow on the tube.
>>>
>>> It's the constant starting and stopping that's most wearing I think.
>>>
>>> I like people-watching, and how the crown thins out leaving mainly
>>> longhaul passengers, and wondering where they might be going, and why
>>> the are dressed like *that*.
>>>
>>> Touch wood, on the return trip it's also just as reliable (HEx is rather
>>> granular,
>>
>> I thought every 15 minutes was considered the general baseline for 'turn up
>> and go' operation?
>
> For heavy rail (and subsurface TfL) outside the North/South circulars,
> on a one-leg trip, perhaps. Yes, I know HEx is outside that perimeter,
> but it has competition if the destination is beyond Paddington.
>
> A change at somewhere like Paddington means concatenating the
> granularity of two different services.
>
>> Lizzie will eventually be every 10 mins, IIRC.
>>
>>> and connection to the subsurface trains at Paddington is a bit
>>> of a lottery)
>>
>> Every 5/6 minutes not good enough for you?
>
> HEx arrivals at Paddington intuitively head towards the Praed St
> station,

Declining to use HEx because some people haven't caught up with a network
change 13 years ago, is like telling people not to use Eurostar because
they no longer run to Waterloo!

> where the Circle Line has for a generation been the epitome of
> lateness/unreliability. Or get a District Line and change at Edgware
> Road, where the lack of a step-free transfer is an ongoing scandal.
>
> And now we have the "teacup", even Circle Line trains require such a
> change.
>

So go to the correct platform then. H&C, Circle and District frequencies
combine to provide a train every 5/6 minutes on each. They have to have
matching frequencies to make the service across Praed Street Junction and
into Edgware Road's four platforms, work.

> Alternatively, use the H&C station, which has always been a bit of an
> afterthought, and iirx after a rebuild is even further from the heavy
> rail platforms. And is that step-free from the main shed yet?
>

It's a wider route the whole way, far easier to navigate, and yes step-free
throughout. Though admittedly not directly from the HEx platforms to the
footbridge, you need to go via either platform 1 or 12 (or three steps only
via 8/9).

Anna Noyd-Dryver

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 18:11:53 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Recliner - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 18:11 UTC

Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Which ones other than c2c, One and FCC do you consider 'wacky'? Most were a
>>> geographical name with the owning group appended, surely, or occasionally
>>> just the name of that group (Connex).
>>
>>
>>
>> Wessex is more whimsical than geographic.
>>
>
> Wessex came later, the original franchise was Wales and West.
>

Yes, as we discussed earlier, the wacky names came a few years after
franchising began; the original franchies mostly had prosaic geographic
names. I think they were mainly the work of NatEx and First, who also
tended to go in for very colourful liveries.

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: charlese...@btinternet.com (Charles Ellson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
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 by: Charles Ellson - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 17:22 UTC

On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 07:38:37 -0000 (UTC), Sam Wilson
<ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:

>Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> First went through a misguided marketing phase of inserting the company
>>>>>>> brand in front of TOC names, but it has since been 'persuaded' not to do
>>>>>>> so. So, it's now GWR not fGW, TPE not fTPE, SWR not fSW, and Avanti WC not
>>>>>>> fWC.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hasn’t it been a requirement of recent franchise awards to have a TOC
>>>>>> independent name that can be bequeathed to a new encumbent without
>>>>>> extensive alterations?
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, but FirstGroup was persuaded/volunteered to start the ball rolling
>>>>> first with its existing fGW—>GWR franchise. The silly brand names date from
>>>>> quite a few years ago, when early franchises were given more freedom to
>>>>> 'innovate'.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Most of the initial franchises (except Virgin) didn't have the franchisee
>>>> identity in the name, IIRC. Later takeovers or refranchising established
>>>> that habit.
>>>
>>> Yes, I think most of the first batch were MBOs, who had no interest in
>>> supposedly catchy branding. It was when they sold out to or were replaced
>>> by companies like First and NatEx, which acquired multiple TOCs, that some
>>> marketing genius decided that privatised train services were a classic
>>> consumer product, so lots more passengers would be attracted if only the
>>> branding was wackier. Mobile phone companies went through a similar phase
>>> in the same period, and some new banks have the same idea now.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Which ones other than c2c, One and FCC do you consider 'wacky'? Most were a
>> geographical name with the owning group appended, surely, or occasionally
>> just the name of that group (Connex).
>
>Silverlink with their purple and green trains? I liked the livery, which
>seemed to make me a bit unusual, but the name made no sense.
>
aka "Vomitlink" because of that colour scheme. It didn't overcome the
description "DC line".

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: charlese...@btinternet.com (Charles Ellson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 2022 18:31:22 +0100
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 by: Charles Ellson - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 17:31 UTC

On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 10:30:57 +0100, Graeme Wall
<rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:

>On 24/04/2022 08:52, Tweed wrote:
>> Sam Wilson <ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:
>>> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> First went through a misguided marketing phase of inserting the company
>>>>>>>>> brand in front of TOC names, but it has since been 'persuaded' not to do
>>>>>>>>> so. So, it's now GWR not fGW, TPE not fTPE, SWR not fSW, and Avanti WC not
>>>>>>>>> fWC.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hasn’t it been a requirement of recent franchise awards to have a TOC
>>>>>>>> independent name that can be bequeathed to a new encumbent without
>>>>>>>> extensive alterations?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yes, but FirstGroup was persuaded/volunteered to start the ball rolling
>>>>>>> first with its existing fGW—>GWR franchise. The silly brand names date from
>>>>>>> quite a few years ago, when early franchises were given more freedom to
>>>>>>> 'innovate'.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Most of the initial franchises (except Virgin) didn't have the franchisee
>>>>>> identity in the name, IIRC. Later takeovers or refranchising established
>>>>>> that habit.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, I think most of the first batch were MBOs, who had no interest in
>>>>> supposedly catchy branding. It was when they sold out to or were replaced
>>>>> by companies like First and NatEx, which acquired multiple TOCs, that some
>>>>> marketing genius decided that privatised train services were a classic
>>>>> consumer product, so lots more passengers would be attracted if only the
>>>>> branding was wackier. Mobile phone companies went through a similar phase
>>>>> in the same period, and some new banks have the same idea now.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Which ones other than c2c, One and FCC do you consider 'wacky'? Most were a
>>>> geographical name with the owning group appended, surely, or occasionally
>>>> just the name of that group (Connex).
>>>
>>> Silverlink with their purple and green trains? I liked the livery, which
>>> seemed to make me a bit unusual, but the name made no sense.
>>>
>>> Sam
>>>
>>
>> Not just a railway thing. The whole country was in thrall to the branding
>> folk. Consignia anyone? Also remember when every brand name had to be
>> accompanied by a mission statement strapline, eg “Metropolitan Police -
>> working for a safer London” (or vacuous words to that effect). All a lot
>> easier than the hard work of actually achieving anything.
>>
>
>Taken from the Californian (?) police motto, to Protect and to Serve,
>allegedly a Hollywood invention. I came across a faux American police
>car in Southampton with the legend: To Protect and to Serve Beer,
>belonged to the landlord of a local pub.
>
Close, it is attributed as the LAPD's motto from 1955
https://www.culinaryepicenter.com/my-mom-wrote-the-motto-to-protect-and-to-serve/

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: theom+n...@chiark.greenend.org.uk (Theo)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: 24 Apr 2022 22:38:36 +0100 (BST)
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 by: Theo - Sun, 24 Apr 2022 21:38 UTC

In uk.railway Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> You just walk across the road when the little green man invites you to do
> so. It's all on the level. The Piccadilly/District station is just inside
> the shopping centre, and can't be missed. After the barriers, there are
> lifts down to both island platforms. All very easy and straightforward, and
> of course all westbound H&C/Circle trains at Kings X St P now go to
> Hammersmith, so it's quite a frequent service.

Thanks. So probably marginally more hassle than the twisty passages all
alike of KXSP, but possibly an option if you aren't in a hurry / want some
more variety / daylight / mobile signal / possibly quieter trains.

Might also be a more pleasant place to wait if you're wanting a tube to T4
or T5 and need to let the 'wrong' trains go past.

Also possibly a useful option if you're starting somewhere not on the
Piccadilly, like Euston.

Theo

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2022 07:12:24 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Recliner - Mon, 25 Apr 2022 07:12 UTC

Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
> In uk.railway Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> You just walk across the road when the little green man invites you to do
>> so. It's all on the level. The Piccadilly/District station is just inside
>> the shopping centre, and can't be missed. After the barriers, there are
>> lifts down to both island platforms. All very easy and straightforward, and
>> of course all westbound H&C/Circle trains at Kings X St P now go to
>> Hammersmith, so it's quite a frequent service.
>
> Thanks. So probably marginally more hassle than the twisty passages all
> alike of KXSP, but possibly an option if you aren't in a hurry / want some
> more variety / daylight / mobile signal / possibly quieter trains.
>
> Might also be a more pleasant place to wait if you're wanting a tube to T4
> or T5 and need to let the 'wrong' trains go past.
>
> Also possibly a useful option if you're starting somewhere not on the
> Piccadilly, like Euston.
>

Yes to all of those. Hammersmith Piccadilly is open air, but with covered
platforms and waiting rooms, so it's a nicer place to wait than most deep
Tube platforms. If not in a hurry, you could also pick up a snack in the
shops above, or change currency.

Re: How to get to Heathrow

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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2022 10:55:18 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
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 by: Roland Perry - Mon, 25 Apr 2022 09:55 UTC

In message <t443d6$ms$3@dont-email.me>, at 18:03:18 on Sun, 24 Apr 2022,
Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <t42r8q$m53$2@dont-email.me>, at 06:38:18 on Sun, 24 Apr
>> 2022, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <t41nbh$jci$1@dont-email.me>, at 20:25:21 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> In message <t41je0$kva$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:18:24 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> According to Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly.
>>>>>>>>>> The latter
>>>>>>>>>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But as the trains are more frequent, and go directly to all
>>>>>>>>> terminals, the
>>>>>>>>> total journey time may not be much longer.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So long as T4 remains closed, don't the Picc, HEx, and Liz all go to
>>>>>>>> all open terminals?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yes, that's true, but I was anticipating the reopening of T4,
>>>>>>> probably in a
>>>>>>> couple of months.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I agree that the Picc feels like it takes forever but since you don't
>>>>>>>> have to change is usually just as fast.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No changes, and more frequent trains. And, of course, if your journey
>>>>>>> starts in London, the Piccadilly is more likely to have a
>>>>>>>station nearby.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And I don't understand why the alleged tedium of a little under an hour
>>>>>> on the Piccadilly Line is significant compared to the ensuing two to
>>>>>> three hours of tedium at Heathrow, the five to ten hours of tedium on
>>>>>> the onward flight, and however many hours of tedium there are at the
>>>>>> arrival airport.
>>>>>
>>>>> It’s utterly illogical, but I really don’t like the slow trio out to
>>>>> Heathrow on the tube.
>>>>
>>>> It's the constant starting and stopping that's most wearing I think.
>>>>
>>>> I like people-watching, and how the crown thins out leaving mainly
>>>> longhaul passengers, and wondering where they might be going, and why
>>>> the are dressed like *that*.
>>>>
>>>> Touch wood, on the return trip it's also just as reliable (HEx is rather
>>>> granular,
>>>
>>> I thought every 15 minutes was considered the general baseline for 'turn up
>>> and go' operation?
>>
>> For heavy rail (and subsurface TfL) outside the North/South circulars,
>> on a one-leg trip, perhaps. Yes, I know HEx is outside that perimeter,
>> but it has competition if the destination is beyond Paddington.
>>
>> A change at somewhere like Paddington means concatenating the
>> granularity of two different services.
>>
>>> Lizzie will eventually be every 10 mins, IIRC.
>>>
>>>> and connection to the subsurface trains at Paddington is a bit
>>>> of a lottery)
>>>
>>> Every 5/6 minutes not good enough for you?
>>
>> HEx arrivals at Paddington intuitively head towards the Praed St
>> station,
>
>Declining to use HEx because some people haven't caught up with a network
>change 13 years ago, is like telling people not to use Eurostar because
>they no longer run to Waterloo!

We need to bear in mind the target audience for this kind of advice.
Almost by definition they aren't familiar with the routings available,
let alone the layout of individual London terminus station.

I'd be much happier, for example, to advise a virgin traveller to seek
out HEx from the H&C platforms, rather than the other way round.

Similarly the Piccadilly/District station at Hammersmith from the H&C
and not the other way around (especially if after dark and raining).

>> where the Circle Line has for a generation been the epitome of
>> lateness/unreliability. Or get a District Line and change at Edgware
>> Road, where the lack of a step-free transfer is an ongoing scandal.
>>
>> And now we have the "teacup", even Circle Line trains require such a
>> change.
>
>So go to the correct platform then.

There's a subtle difference between being told what the "correct"
platform is, versus finding it in the bowels of an unfamiliar station.

>H&C, Circle and District frequencies combine to provide a train every
>5/6 minutes on each. They have to have matching frequencies to make the
>service across Praed Street Junction and into Edgware Road's four
>platforms, work.
>
>> Alternatively, use the H&C station, which has always been a bit of an
>> afterthought, and iirx after a rebuild is even further from the heavy
>> rail platforms. And is that step-free from the main shed yet?
>
>It's a wider route the whole way, far easier to navigate, and yes step-free
>throughout. Though admittedly not directly from the HEx platforms to the
>footbridge,

Ah-ha!

>you need to go via either platform 1 or 12 (or three steps only
>via 8/9).

In other news, people could enquire from National Rail. This table is a
magnificent example, where they ran out of steam almost before they'd
begun:

<https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations_destinations/190874.aspx>

Not to mention someone expecting to do Kings Cross to Paddington on the
Met, is going to be disappointed.

--
Roland Perry

Re: How to get to Heathrow

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28692&group=uk.railway#28692

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2022 16:14:06 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Recliner - Mon, 25 Apr 2022 16:14 UTC

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <t443d6$ms$3@dont-email.me>, at 18:03:18 on Sun, 24 Apr 2022,
> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <t42r8q$m53$2@dont-email.me>, at 06:38:18 on Sun, 24 Apr
>>> 2022, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <t41nbh$jci$1@dont-email.me>, at 20:25:21 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <t41je0$kva$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:18:24 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> According to Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly.
>>>>>>>>>>> The latter
>>>>>>>>>>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> But as the trains are more frequent, and go directly to all
>>>>>>>>>> terminals, the
>>>>>>>>>> total journey time may not be much longer.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So long as T4 remains closed, don't the Picc, HEx, and Liz all go to
>>>>>>>>> all open terminals?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yes, that's true, but I was anticipating the reopening of T4,
>>>>>>>> probably in a
>>>>>>>> couple of months.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I agree that the Picc feels like it takes forever but since you don't
>>>>>>>>> have to change is usually just as fast.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> No changes, and more frequent trains. And, of course, if your journey
>>>>>>>> starts in London, the Piccadilly is more likely to have a
>>>>>>>> station nearby.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And I don't understand why the alleged tedium of a little under an hour
>>>>>>> on the Piccadilly Line is significant compared to the ensuing two to
>>>>>>> three hours of tedium at Heathrow, the five to ten hours of tedium on
>>>>>>> the onward flight, and however many hours of tedium there are at the
>>>>>>> arrival airport.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It’s utterly illogical, but I really don’t like the slow trio out to
>>>>>> Heathrow on the tube.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's the constant starting and stopping that's most wearing I think.
>>>>>
>>>>> I like people-watching, and how the crown thins out leaving mainly
>>>>> longhaul passengers, and wondering where they might be going, and why
>>>>> the are dressed like *that*.
>>>>>
>>>>> Touch wood, on the return trip it's also just as reliable (HEx is rather
>>>>> granular,
>>>>
>>>> I thought every 15 minutes was considered the general baseline for 'turn up
>>>> and go' operation?
>>>
>>> For heavy rail (and subsurface TfL) outside the North/South circulars,
>>> on a one-leg trip, perhaps. Yes, I know HEx is outside that perimeter,
>>> but it has competition if the destination is beyond Paddington.
>>>
>>> A change at somewhere like Paddington means concatenating the
>>> granularity of two different services.
>>>
>>>> Lizzie will eventually be every 10 mins, IIRC.
>>>>
>>>>> and connection to the subsurface trains at Paddington is a bit
>>>>> of a lottery)
>>>>
>>>> Every 5/6 minutes not good enough for you?
>>>
>>> HEx arrivals at Paddington intuitively head towards the Praed St
>>> station,
>>
>> Declining to use HEx because some people haven't caught up with a network
>> change 13 years ago, is like telling people not to use Eurostar because
>> they no longer run to Waterloo!
>
> We need to bear in mind the target audience for this kind of advice.
> Almost by definition they aren't familiar with the routings available,
> let alone the layout of individual London terminus station.
>
> I'd be much happier, for example, to advise a virgin traveller to seek
> out HEx from the H&C platforms, rather than the other way round.
>
> Similarly the Piccadilly/District station at Hammersmith from the H&C
> and not the other way around (especially if after dark and raining).
>
>>> where the Circle Line has for a generation been the epitome of
>>> lateness/unreliability. Or get a District Line and change at Edgware
>>> Road, where the lack of a step-free transfer is an ongoing scandal.
>>>
>>> And now we have the "teacup", even Circle Line trains require such a
>>> change.
>>
>> So go to the correct platform then.
>
> There's a subtle difference between being told what the "correct"
> platform is, versus finding it in the bowels of an unfamiliar station.
>
>> H&C, Circle and District frequencies combine to provide a train every
>> 5/6 minutes on each. They have to have matching frequencies to make the
>> service across Praed Street Junction and into Edgware Road's four
>> platforms, work.
>>
>>> Alternatively, use the H&C station, which has always been a bit of an
>>> afterthought, and iirx after a rebuild is even further from the heavy
>>> rail platforms. And is that step-free from the main shed yet?
>>
>> It's a wider route the whole way, far easier to navigate, and yes step-free
>> throughout. Though admittedly not directly from the HEx platforms to the
>> footbridge,
>
> Ah-ha!
>
>> you need to go via either platform 1 or 12 (or three steps only
>> via 8/9).
>
> In other news, people could enquire from National Rail. This table is a
> magnificent example, where they ran out of steam almost before they'd
> begun:
>
> <https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations_destinations/190874.aspx>
>
> Not to mention someone expecting to do Kings Cross to Paddington on the
> Met, is going to be disappointed.
>

Ouch! That's a real boo-boo. It's a very long time since Paddington was
served by the Met.

Re: How to get to Heathrow

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From: pet...@parksidewood.nospam (Peter Johnson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2022 18:18:32 +0100
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 by: Peter Johnson - Mon, 25 Apr 2022 17:18 UTC

On Sun, 24 Apr 2022 11:24:14 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk>
wrote:

>
>Alternatively, use the H&C station, which has always been a bit of an
>afterthought, and iirx after a rebuild is even further from the heavy
>rail platforms. And is that step-free from the main shed yet?

I made use of the Hammersmith interchange last Tuesday. If I'd known
you were going to raise it I would have paid more attention to it.

Re: How to get to Heathrow

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From: ema...@domain.com (Bob)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2022 19:26:20 +0200
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 by: Bob - Mon, 25 Apr 2022 17:26 UTC

On 2022-04-25 16:14:06 +0000, Recliner said:

> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <t443d6$ms$3@dont-email.me>, at 18:03:18 on Sun, 24 Apr 2022,
>> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <t42r8q$m53$2@dont-email.me>, at 06:38:18 on Sun, 24 Apr
>>>> 2022, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> In message <t41nbh$jci$1@dont-email.me>, at 20:25:21 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>> In message <t41je0$kva$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:18:24 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> According to Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly.
>>>>>>>>>>>> The latter
>>>>>>>>>>>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> But as the trains are more frequent, and go directly to all
>>>>>>>>>>> terminals, the
>>>>>>>>>>> total journey time may not be much longer.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> So long as T4 remains closed, don't the Picc, HEx, and Liz all go to
>>>>>>>>>> all open terminals?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Yes, that's true, but I was anticipating the reopening of T4,
>>>>>>>>> probably in a
>>>>>>>>> couple of months.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I agree that the Picc feels like it takes forever but since you don't
>>>>>>>>>> have to change is usually just as fast.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> No changes, and more frequent trains. And, of course, if your journey
>>>>>>>>> starts in London, the Piccadilly is more likely to have a
>>>>>>>>> station nearby.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And I don't understand why the alleged tedium of a little under an hour
>>>>>>>> on the Piccadilly Line is significant compared to the ensuing two to
>>>>>>>> three hours of tedium at Heathrow, the five to ten hours of tedium on
>>>>>>>> the onward flight, and however many hours of tedium there are at the
>>>>>>>> arrival airport.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It’s utterly illogical, but I really don’t like the slow trio out to
>>>>>>> Heathrow on the tube.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's the constant starting and stopping that's most wearing I think.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I like people-watching, and how the crown thins out leaving mainly
>>>>>> longhaul passengers, and wondering where they might be going, and why
>>>>>> the are dressed like *that*.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Touch wood, on the return trip it's also just as reliable (HEx is rather
>>>>>> granular,
>>>>>
>>>>> I thought every 15 minutes was considered the general baseline for 'turn up
>>>>> and go' operation?
>>>>
>>>> For heavy rail (and subsurface TfL) outside the North/South circulars,
>>>> on a one-leg trip, perhaps. Yes, I know HEx is outside that perimeter,
>>>> but it has competition if the destination is beyond Paddington.
>>>>
>>>> A change at somewhere like Paddington means concatenating the
>>>> granularity of two different services.
>>>>
>>>>> Lizzie will eventually be every 10 mins, IIRC.
>>>>>
>>>>>> and connection to the subsurface trains at Paddington is a bit
>>>>>> of a lottery)
>>>>>
>>>>> Every 5/6 minutes not good enough for you?
>>>>
>>>> HEx arrivals at Paddington intuitively head towards the Praed St
>>>> station,
>>>
>>> Declining to use HEx because some people haven't caught up with a network
>>> change 13 years ago, is like telling people not to use Eurostar because
>>> they no longer run to Waterloo!
>>
>> We need to bear in mind the target audience for this kind of advice.
>> Almost by definition they aren't familiar with the routings available,
>> let alone the layout of individual London terminus station.
>>
>> I'd be much happier, for example, to advise a virgin traveller to seek
>> out HEx from the H&C platforms, rather than the other way round.
>>
>> Similarly the Piccadilly/District station at Hammersmith from the H&C
>> and not the other way around (especially if after dark and raining).
>>
>>>> where the Circle Line has for a generation been the epitome of
>>>> lateness/unreliability. Or get a District Line and change at Edgware
>>>> Road, where the lack of a step-free transfer is an ongoing scandal.
>>>>
>>>> And now we have the "teacup", even Circle Line trains require such a
>>>> change.
>>>
>>> So go to the correct platform then.
>>
>> There's a subtle difference between being told what the "correct"
>> platform is, versus finding it in the bowels of an unfamiliar station.
>>
>>> H&C, Circle and District frequencies combine to provide a train every
>>> 5/6 minutes on each. They have to have matching frequencies to make the
>>> service across Praed Street Junction and into Edgware Road's four
>>> platforms, work.
>>>
>>>> Alternatively, use the H&C station, which has always been a bit of an
>>>> afterthought, and iirx after a rebuild is even further from the heavy
>>>> rail platforms. And is that step-free from the main shed yet?
>>>
>>> It's a wider route the whole way, far easier to navigate, and yes step-free
>>> throughout. Though admittedly not directly from the HEx platforms to the
>>> footbridge,
>>
>> Ah-ha!
>>
>>> you need to go via either platform 1 or 12 (or three steps only
>>> via 8/9).
>>
>> In other news, people could enquire from National Rail. This table is a
>> magnificent example, where they ran out of steam almost before they'd
>> begun:
>>
>> <https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations_destinations/190874.aspx>
>>
>> Not to mention someone expecting to do Kings Cross to Paddington on the
>> Met, is going to be disappointed.
>>
>
> Ouch! That's a real boo-boo. It's a very long time since Paddington was
> served by the Met.

The separate Hammersmith and City line identity was split off from the
Metropolitan line in 1991.

Robin

Re: How to get to Heathrow

<t46lue$m5m$1@dont-email.me>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28696&group=uk.railway#28696

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2022 17:31:58 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Recliner - Mon, 25 Apr 2022 17:31 UTC

Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
> On 2022-04-25 16:14:06 +0000, Recliner said:
>
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <t443d6$ms$3@dont-email.me>, at 18:03:18 on Sun, 24 Apr 2022,
>>> Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <t42r8q$m53$2@dont-email.me>, at 06:38:18 on Sun, 24 Apr
>>>>> 2022, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <t41nbh$jci$1@dont-email.me>, at 20:25:21 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>>>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> In message <t41je0$kva$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:18:24 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>>>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> According to Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The latter
>>>>>>>>>>>>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> But as the trains are more frequent, and go directly to all
>>>>>>>>>>>> terminals, the
>>>>>>>>>>>> total journey time may not be much longer.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> So long as T4 remains closed, don't the Picc, HEx, and Liz all go to
>>>>>>>>>>> all open terminals?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yes, that's true, but I was anticipating the reopening of T4,
>>>>>>>>>> probably in a
>>>>>>>>>> couple of months.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I agree that the Picc feels like it takes forever but since you don't
>>>>>>>>>>> have to change is usually just as fast.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> No changes, and more frequent trains. And, of course, if your journey
>>>>>>>>>> starts in London, the Piccadilly is more likely to have a
>>>>>>>>>> station nearby.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And I don't understand why the alleged tedium of a little under an hour
>>>>>>>>> on the Piccadilly Line is significant compared to the ensuing two to
>>>>>>>>> three hours of tedium at Heathrow, the five to ten hours of tedium on
>>>>>>>>> the onward flight, and however many hours of tedium there are at the
>>>>>>>>> arrival airport.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It’s utterly illogical, but I really don’t like the slow trio out to
>>>>>>>> Heathrow on the tube.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's the constant starting and stopping that's most wearing I think.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I like people-watching, and how the crown thins out leaving mainly
>>>>>>> longhaul passengers, and wondering where they might be going, and why
>>>>>>> the are dressed like *that*.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Touch wood, on the return trip it's also just as reliable (HEx is rather
>>>>>>> granular,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I thought every 15 minutes was considered the general baseline for 'turn up
>>>>>> and go' operation?
>>>>>
>>>>> For heavy rail (and subsurface TfL) outside the North/South circulars,
>>>>> on a one-leg trip, perhaps. Yes, I know HEx is outside that perimeter,
>>>>> but it has competition if the destination is beyond Paddington.
>>>>>
>>>>> A change at somewhere like Paddington means concatenating the
>>>>> granularity of two different services.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Lizzie will eventually be every 10 mins, IIRC.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> and connection to the subsurface trains at Paddington is a bit
>>>>>>> of a lottery)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Every 5/6 minutes not good enough for you?
>>>>>
>>>>> HEx arrivals at Paddington intuitively head towards the Praed St
>>>>> station,
>>>>
>>>> Declining to use HEx because some people haven't caught up with a network
>>>> change 13 years ago, is like telling people not to use Eurostar because
>>>> they no longer run to Waterloo!
>>>
>>> We need to bear in mind the target audience for this kind of advice.
>>> Almost by definition they aren't familiar with the routings available,
>>> let alone the layout of individual London terminus station.
>>>
>>> I'd be much happier, for example, to advise a virgin traveller to seek
>>> out HEx from the H&C platforms, rather than the other way round.
>>>
>>> Similarly the Piccadilly/District station at Hammersmith from the H&C
>>> and not the other way around (especially if after dark and raining).
>>>
>>>>> where the Circle Line has for a generation been the epitome of
>>>>> lateness/unreliability. Or get a District Line and change at Edgware
>>>>> Road, where the lack of a step-free transfer is an ongoing scandal.
>>>>>
>>>>> And now we have the "teacup", even Circle Line trains require such a
>>>>> change.
>>>>
>>>> So go to the correct platform then.
>>>
>>> There's a subtle difference between being told what the "correct"
>>> platform is, versus finding it in the bowels of an unfamiliar station.
>>>
>>>> H&C, Circle and District frequencies combine to provide a train every
>>>> 5/6 minutes on each. They have to have matching frequencies to make the
>>>> service across Praed Street Junction and into Edgware Road's four
>>>> platforms, work.
>>>>
>>>>> Alternatively, use the H&C station, which has always been a bit of an
>>>>> afterthought, and iirx after a rebuild is even further from the heavy
>>>>> rail platforms. And is that step-free from the main shed yet?
>>>>
>>>> It's a wider route the whole way, far easier to navigate, and yes step-free
>>>> throughout. Though admittedly not directly from the HEx platforms to the
>>>> footbridge,
>>>
>>> Ah-ha!
>>>
>>>> you need to go via either platform 1 or 12 (or three steps only
>>>> via 8/9).
>>>
>>> In other news, people could enquire from National Rail. This table is a
>>> magnificent example, where they ran out of steam almost before they'd
>>> begun:
>>>
>>> <https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations_destinations/190874.aspx>
>>>
>>> Not to mention someone expecting to do Kings Cross to Paddington on the
>>> Met, is going to be disappointed.
>>>
>>
>> Ouch! That's a real boo-boo. It's a very long time since Paddington was
>> served by the Met.
>
> The separate Hammersmith and City line identity was split off from the
> Metropolitan line in 1991.
>

Thanks, I couldn't remember that date. So, that advice is 30+ years out of
date!

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t46mvh$smo$1@dont-email.me>

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From: ema...@domain.com (Bob)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2022 19:49:34 +0200
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 by: Bob - Mon, 25 Apr 2022 17:49 UTC

On 2022-04-23 21:26:05 +0000, Anna Noyd-Dryver said:

> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> First went through a misguided marketing phase of inserting the company
>>>> brand in front of TOC names, but it has since been 'persuaded' not to do
>>>> so. So, it's now GWR not fGW, TPE not fTPE, SWR not fSW, and Avanti WC not
>>>> fWC.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Hasn’t it been a requirement of recent franchise awards to have a TOC
>>> independent name that can be bequeathed to a new encumbent without
>>> extensive alterations?
>>
>> Yes, but FirstGroup was persuaded/volunteered to start the ball rolling
>> first with its existing fGW—>GWR franchise. The silly brand names date from
>> quite a few years ago, when early franchises were given more freedom to
>> 'innovate'.
>>
>
> Most of the initial franchises (except Virgin) didn't have the franchisee
> identity in the name, IIRC. Later takeovers or refranchising established
> that habit.
>
> Northern Spirit was perhaps the 'silliest' of the initial franchise names?

I always thought "Silverlink" was rather silly.

Robin

Re: How to get to Hesthrow

<t46npn$o7v$1@dont-email.me>

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From: new...@ingram-bromley.co.uk (nib)
Newsgroups: uk.railway
Subject: Re: How to get to Hesthrow
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2022 18:03:35 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: nib - Mon, 25 Apr 2022 18:03 UTC

On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 19:49:34 +0200, Bob wrote:

> On 2022-04-23 21:26:05 +0000, Anna Noyd-Dryver said:
>
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> First went through a misguided marketing phase of inserting the
>>>>> company brand in front of TOC names, but it has since been
>>>>> 'persuaded' not to do so. So, it's now GWR not fGW, TPE not fTPE,
>>>>> SWR not fSW, and Avanti WC not fWC.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Hasn’t it been a requirement of recent franchise awards to have a TOC
>>>> independent name that can be bequeathed to a new encumbent without
>>>> extensive alterations?
>>>
>>> Yes, but FirstGroup was persuaded/volunteered to start the ball
>>> rolling first with its existing fGW—>GWR franchise. The silly brand
>>> names date from quite a few years ago, when early franchises were
>>> given more freedom to 'innovate'.
>>>
>>>
>> Most of the initial franchises (except Virgin) didn't have the
>> franchisee identity in the name, IIRC. Later takeovers or refranchising
>> established that habit.
>>
>> Northern Spirit was perhaps the 'silliest' of the initial franchise
>> names?
>
> I always thought "Silverlink" was rather silly.
>
> Robin

Although "Silver Link" has genuine railway connections!

(An A4)

nib

Re: How to get to Heathrow

<t49ujb$1hgv$1@gioia.aioe.org>

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From: hounsl...@yahoo.co.uk (hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2022 00:18:03 +0100
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 by: hounslow3@yahoo.co.u - Tue, 26 Apr 2022 23:18 UTC

On 24/04/2022 07:38, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <t41nbh$jci$1@dont-email.me>, at 20:25:21 on Sat, 23 Apr
>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <t41je0$kva$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:18:24 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
>>>>>> According to Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com>:
>>>>
>>>>>>>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly.
>>>>>>>> The latter
>>>>>>>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But as the trains are more frequent, and go directly to all terminals, the
>>>>>>> total journey time may not be much longer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So long as T4 remains closed, don't the Picc, HEx, and Liz all go to
>>>>>> all open terminals?
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, that's true, but I was anticipating the reopening of T4, probably in a
>>>>> couple of months.
>>>>>
>>>>>> I agree that the Picc feels like it takes forever but since you don't
>>>>>> have to change is usually just as fast.
>>>>>
>>>>> No changes, and more frequent trains. And, of course, if your journey
>>>>> starts in London, the Piccadilly is more likely to have a station nearby.
>>>>
>>>> And I don't understand why the alleged tedium of a little under an hour
>>>> on the Piccadilly Line is significant compared to the ensuing two to
>>>> three hours of tedium at Heathrow, the five to ten hours of tedium on
>>>> the onward flight, and however many hours of tedium there are at the
>>>> arrival airport.
>>>
>>> It’s utterly illogical, but I really don’t like the slow trio out to
>>> Heathrow on the tube.
>>
>> It's the constant starting and stopping that's most wearing I think.
>>
>> I like people-watching, and how the crown thins out leaving mainly
>> longhaul passengers, and wondering where they might be going, and why
>> the are dressed like *that*.
>>
>> Touch wood, on the return trip it's also just as reliable (HEx is rather
>> granular,
>
> I thought every 15 minutes was considered the general baseline for 'turn up
> and go' operation?
>

I recently had to travel to Metroland, also assuming that it would be
'turn up and go.'

It was about 30 minutes before the train that I needed actually arrived.

Re: How to get to Heathrow

<um9h6hp5rdhfke0p3epbpmr4dgeilbc3nc@4ax.com>

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From: charlese...@btinternet.com (Charles Ellson)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2022 03:23:50 +0100
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 by: Charles Ellson - Wed, 27 Apr 2022 02:23 UTC

On Wed, 27 Apr 2022 00:18:03 +0100, "hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk"
<hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

>On 24/04/2022 07:38, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <t41nbh$jci$1@dont-email.me>, at 20:25:21 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <t41je0$kva$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:18:24 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> According to Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com>:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly.
>>>>>>>>> The latter
>>>>>>>>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But as the trains are more frequent, and go directly to all terminals, the
>>>>>>>> total journey time may not be much longer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So long as T4 remains closed, don't the Picc, HEx, and Liz all go to
>>>>>>> all open terminals?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, that's true, but I was anticipating the reopening of T4, probably in a
>>>>>> couple of months.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree that the Picc feels like it takes forever but since you don't
>>>>>>> have to change is usually just as fast.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No changes, and more frequent trains. And, of course, if your journey
>>>>>> starts in London, the Piccadilly is more likely to have a station nearby.
>>>>>
>>>>> And I don't understand why the alleged tedium of a little under an hour
>>>>> on the Piccadilly Line is significant compared to the ensuing two to
>>>>> three hours of tedium at Heathrow, the five to ten hours of tedium on
>>>>> the onward flight, and however many hours of tedium there are at the
>>>>> arrival airport.
>>>>
>>>> It’s utterly illogical, but I really don’t like the slow trio out to
>>>> Heathrow on the tube.
>>>
>>> It's the constant starting and stopping that's most wearing I think.
>>>
>>> I like people-watching, and how the crown thins out leaving mainly
>>> longhaul passengers, and wondering where they might be going, and why
>>> the are dressed like *that*.
>>>
>>> Touch wood, on the return trip it's also just as reliable (HEx is rather
>>> granular,
>>
>> I thought every 15 minutes was considered the general baseline for 'turn up
>> and go' operation?
>>
>
>I recently had to travel to Metroland, also assuming that it would be
>'turn up and go.'
>
>It was about 30 minutes before the train that I needed actually arrived.
>
For some outer destinations you night need to take the first train to
Harrow and change there. Similarly, if you are east of Baker Street
you might need to change either at Finchley Road (everything going out
of London stops there at the same platform) or Harrow.

Re: How to get to Heathrow

<t4aesq$9s$1@dont-email.me>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28717&group=uk.railway#28717

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From: recliner...@gmail.com (Recliner)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2022 03:56:10 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Recliner - Wed, 27 Apr 2022 03:56 UTC

hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> On 24/04/2022 07:38, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <t41nbh$jci$1@dont-email.me>, at 20:25:21 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <t41je0$kva$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:18:24 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> According to Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com>:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly.
>>>>>>>>> The latter
>>>>>>>>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But as the trains are more frequent, and go directly to all terminals, the
>>>>>>>> total journey time may not be much longer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So long as T4 remains closed, don't the Picc, HEx, and Liz all go to
>>>>>>> all open terminals?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, that's true, but I was anticipating the reopening of T4, probably in a
>>>>>> couple of months.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree that the Picc feels like it takes forever but since you don't
>>>>>>> have to change is usually just as fast.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No changes, and more frequent trains. And, of course, if your journey
>>>>>> starts in London, the Piccadilly is more likely to have a station nearby.
>>>>>
>>>>> And I don't understand why the alleged tedium of a little under an hour
>>>>> on the Piccadilly Line is significant compared to the ensuing two to
>>>>> three hours of tedium at Heathrow, the five to ten hours of tedium on
>>>>> the onward flight, and however many hours of tedium there are at the
>>>>> arrival airport.
>>>>
>>>> It’s utterly illogical, but I really don’t like the slow trio out to
>>>> Heathrow on the tube.
>>>
>>> It's the constant starting and stopping that's most wearing I think.
>>>
>>> I like people-watching, and how the crown thins out leaving mainly
>>> longhaul passengers, and wondering where they might be going, and why
>>> the are dressed like *that*.
>>>
>>> Touch wood, on the return trip it's also just as reliable (HEx is rather
>>> granular,
>>
>> I thought every 15 minutes was considered the general baseline for 'turn up
>> and go' operation?
>>
>
> I recently had to travel to Metroland, also assuming that it would be
> 'turn up and go.'
>
> It was about 30 minutes before the train that I needed actually arrived.

Are you aware of the current (not-so) 'special service' on the Met?

Plus, Chesham never gets better than 2 tph, for obvious reasons.

Re: How to get to Heathrow

<+DCa2WuyiMaiFAV1@perry.uk>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=28718&group=uk.railway#28718

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From: rol...@perry.co.uk (Roland Perry)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2022 05:38:10 +0100
Organization: Roland Perry
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 by: Roland Perry - Wed, 27 Apr 2022 04:38 UTC

In message <t49ujb$1hgv$1@gioia.aioe.org>, at 00:18:03 on Wed, 27 Apr
2022, "hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk" <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> remarked:
>On 24/04/2022 07:38, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <t41nbh$jci$1@dont-email.me>, at 20:25:21 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>> 2022, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <t41je0$kva$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:18:24 on Sat, 23 Apr
>>>>> 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> According to Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com>:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> In the past I’ve tried HEx from Paddington and the Piccadilly.
>>>>>>>>> The latter
>>>>>>>>> is less trouble, and cheaper but is very tedious.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But as the trains are more frequent, and go directly to all
>>>>>>>>terminals, the
>>>>>>>> total journey time may not be much longer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So long as T4 remains closed, don't the Picc, HEx, and Liz all go to
>>>>>>> all open terminals?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, that's true, but I was anticipating the reopening of T4,
>>>>>>probably in a
>>>>>> couple of months.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree that the Picc feels like it takes forever but since you don't
>>>>>>> have to change is usually just as fast.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No changes, and more frequent trains. And, of course, if your journey
>>>>>> starts in London, the Piccadilly is more likely to have a station nearby.
>>>>>
>>>>> And I don't understand why the alleged tedium of a little under an hour
>>>>> on the Piccadilly Line is significant compared to the ensuing two to
>>>>> three hours of tedium at Heathrow, the five to ten hours of tedium on
>>>>> the onward flight, and however many hours of tedium there are at the
>>>>> arrival airport.
>>>>
>>>> It’s utterly illogical, but I really don’t like the slow trio out to
>>>> Heathrow on the tube.
>>>
>>> It's the constant starting and stopping that's most wearing I think.
>>>
>>> I like people-watching, and how the crown thins out leaving mainly
>>> longhaul passengers, and wondering where they might be going, and why
>>> the are dressed like *that*.
>>>
>>> Touch wood, on the return trip it's also just as reliable (HEx is rather
>>> granular,

>> I thought every 15 minutes was considered the general baseline for
>>'turn up and go' operation?
>
>I recently had to travel to Metroland, also assuming that it would be
>'turn up and go.'
>
>It was about 30 minutes before the train that I needed actually arrived.

As far as I'm concerned the Met to Uxbridge became "turn up and go" when
they increased the frequency from every 20 minutes to every 15 minutes.
Seems like a small change, but somehow it made all the difference.

Of course, that was quite a long time ago, but the comment is still
relevant.
--
Roland Perry

Re: How to get to Heathrow

<njsvki-oi8.ln1@castle.rilynn.me.uk>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=29377&group=uk.railway#29377

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Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: use...@rilynn.me.uk (Roger Lynn)
Newsgroups: uk.railway,uk.transport.london
Subject: Re: How to get to Heathrow
Date: Thu, 12 May 2022 18:26:46 +0100
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 by: Roger Lynn - Thu, 12 May 2022 17:26 UTC

On 25/04/2022 10:55, Roland Perry wrote:
> In other news, people could enquire from National Rail. This table is a
> magnificent example, where they ran out of steam almost before they'd
> begun:
>
> <https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations_destinations/190874.aspx>
>
> Not to mention someone expecting to do Kings Cross to Paddington on the
> Met, is going to be disappointed.

If only there was a way to terminate the District and Circle lines at Baker
Street instead of Edgware Road, you could catch the first train from King's
Cross wherever it was going to, and if necessary change at Baker Street. And
in the other direction if your train terminated at Baker Street you'd get a
better selection of trains to change onto than you do at Edgware Road.
There's a similar situation with Aldgate and Tower Hill. :-(

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