Certainly gone for a younger squad, but even so, bad luck to Malan who
averaged 44 in the WC, Root etc are rested, Stokes at the surgeons, Topley
although fit for the T20, like Woakes not in odi, although hes been our most
effective bowler i think this year. Willeys retired [why did they have to
announce central contracts in the middle of a WC?]. Not sure why Livings
is still in the the odi, both he and Curran were rubbish in the WC and the
mysterious John Turner is also back in. Tongue and Pope fit again [but how long for? ;)] The other spin options look very inexperienced, but rashid will be
with them anyway.

mike

ODI squad: Jos Buttler (captain - Lancashire), Rehan Ahmed (Leicestershire), Gus Atkinson (Surrey), Harry Brook (Yorkshire), Brydon Carse (Durham), Zak Crawley (Kent), Sam Curran (Surrey), Ben Duckett (Nottinghamshire), Tom Hartley (Lancashire), Will Jacks (Surrey), Liam Livingstone (Lancashire), Ollie Pope (Surrey), Phil Salt (Lancashire), Josh Tongue (Nottinghamshire), John Turner (Hampshire)

T20 squad: Jos Buttler (captain - Lancashire), Rehan Ahmed (Leicestershire), Moeen Ali (Warwickshire), Gus Atkinson (Surrey), Harry Brook (Yorkshire), Sam Curran (Surrey), Ben Duckett (Nottinghamshire), Will Jacks (Surrey), Liam Livingstone (Lancashire), Tymal Mills (Sussex), Adil Rashid (Yorkshire), Phil Salt (Lancashire), Josh Tongue (Nottinghamshire), Reece Topley (Surrey), John Turner (Hampshire), Chris Woakes (Warwickshire)

In message <7ef6606f-69d1-45b5-80c0-0ff64f97226an@googlegroups.com>,
mike <dmike204@yahoo.co.uk> writes
>Certainly gone for a younger squad, but even so, bad luck to Malan who
>averaged 44 in the WC, Root etc are rested, Stokes at the surgeons, Topley
>although fit for the T20, like Woakes not in odi, although hes been our most
>effective bowler i think this year. Willeys retired [why did they have to
>announce central contracts in the middle of a WC?].

I wonder if Key was tempted to reconsider by the end of England's WC and
say to Willey: "OK, if you withdraw your retirement you can have a
central contract after all."

> Not sure why Livings
>is still in the the odi, both he and Curran were rubbish in the WC

Yes, they are obviously both highly talented, but as you say they were
rubbish. In spite of having been around for ages, Curran at least still
has youth on his side, but Livingstone is 30, so not one of the oldies
but no spring chicken..

> and the
>mysterious John Turner is also back in. Tongue and Pope fit again [but
>how long for? ;)]

Apparently Pope has had the same operation on his injured shoulder that
was a big success with his other shoulder. But I'm worried that he won't
have had any match practice since June, so it's asking a lot for him to
find form right away.

> The other spin options look very inexperienced, but rashid will be
>with them anyway.

Jacks has a fair bit of T20 experience with Surrey by now but little or
no 50-over experience.

<snip squads>
--
John Hall
"Acting is merely the art of keeping a large group of people
from coughing."
Sir Ralph Richardson (1902-83)

On Monday, November 13, 2023 at 4:51:45 PM UTC, John Hall wrote:
> In message <7ef6606f-69d1-45b5...@googlegroups.com>,
> mike <dmik...@yahoo.co.uk> writes
> >Certainly gone for a younger squad, but even so, bad luck to Malan who
> >averaged 44 in the WC, Root etc are rested, Stokes at the surgeons, Topley
> >although fit for the T20, like Woakes not in odi, although hes been our most
> >effective bowler i think this year. Willeys retired [why did they have to
> >announce central contracts in the middle of a WC?].
> I wonder if Key was tempted to reconsider by the end of England's WC and
> say to Willey: "OK, if you withdraw your retirement you can have a
> central contract after all."

Yes he was the only 1 of the WC squad not offered anything which seems
very badly timed, they surely could have waited just a few weeks longer
until now to announce things. Leaving out the 1 bowler who performed
consistantly well, looks bad judgment. I notice that stokes only accepted 1 yr contract,
which might backfire on him if his knee proves as recalcitrant as archers elbow.
I'm sure wood and archer were overjoyed to get new 3 and 2 yrs contracts.

> > Not sure why Livings
> >is still in the the odi, both he and Curran were rubbish in the WC
> Yes, they are obviously both highly talented, but as you say they were
> rubbish. In spite of having been around for ages, Curran at least still
> has youth on his side, but Livingstone is 30, so not one of the oldies
> but no spring chicken..

hes gonna have to start performing soon to justify his 2yr contract.
i heard him interviewed in the summer that his ankle was still impeding him,
but i wonder if thats just an excuse for his prolonged period of mediocre
form.

> > and the
> >mysterious John Turner is also back in. Tongue and Pope fit again [but
> >how long for? ;)]
> Apparently Pope has had the same operation on his injured shoulder that
> was a big success with his other shoulder. But I'm worried that he won't
> have had any match practice since June, so it's asking a lot for him to
> find form right away.
> > The other spin options look very inexperienced, but rashid will be
> >with them anyway.

i notice leach only got or chose to accept a 1 yr contract. although
i dont think he would have changed england s campaign in the WC, I
think leaving out Dawson whos the most succesful england spinner
in the CC for several years was a mistake even if he is a bit older. 33 is
not old for a spinner.

> Jacks has a fair bit of T20 experience with Surrey by now but little or
> no 50-over experience.

i think 1 of the probs with englands aproach was that they sort of view
odi as just a longer version of t20.

mike

In message <522fb986-040e-493d-a699-83a06787959dn@googlegroups.com>,
mike davis <dmike2004@gmail.com> writes
>i notice leach only got or chose to accept a 1 yr contract.

Probably because he's had so many problems with illness and injury. He
must be just about the unluckiest cricketer around as far as his health
and fitness are concerned.

> although i dont think he would have changed england s campaign in the
>WC, I think leaving out Dawson whos the most succesful england spinner
>in the CC for several years was a mistake even if he is a bit older. 33
>is not old for a spinner.

With the benefit of hindsight, he would probably have done better than
Livingstone with both bat and ball, though I can understand England
viewing L's ability to bowl both wrist and finger spin as potentially a
great asset.
--
John Hall
"Acting is merely the art of keeping a large group of people
from coughing."
Sir Ralph Richardson (1902-83)