The EL core has four doubled-ended stations, made possible because of its long platforms and deep escalators, which can
cover some horizontal distance on their way to the surface, meaning exits can be up to about 250m apart. But,
interestingly, each has a different relationship with adjacent LU stations.

1. Both ends fully linked

Only Liverpool Street/Moorgate has this. Both the ends are fully integrated into the LU stations. This is expensive, and
might seem unjustified, considering that both surface stations are adjacent on the Circle line. But the big advantage is
that both stations have other LU and mainline connections, so the EL gets key connectivity at both ends.

2. One end fully, the other end partially linked to another station

This is Farringdon, where the stations are integrated (though the signposted route between LU and the EL is an
across-street OSI), but there's also an eastern exit at Barbican. The station street entrance is a two-minute walk from
Barbican LU station, but there's also the 'secret' direct lift link between them. Interestingly, the EL station is very
close to Smithfield, which might have been a more appropriate name for the exit, but 'Barbican' was obviously chosen to
indicate the proximity of the station entrances. Had there not been a need to preserve the CWL trackbed for future rail
use, the EL Barbican exit could have been directly linked to the LU station exit, by running the escalator bank up
through the old trackbed, rather than turning right towards Long Lane. But as this wouldn't provide any additional
connectivity, it made sense to instead have an exit close to Smithfield.

3. One end linked, the other close to the same LU station

Tottenham Court Road EL station is fully integrated into the existing LU station, and the Dean Street entrance is about
250m (3-4 minutes walk) from an entrance to the same station. I think only the latter has an EL roundel. The Dean Street
exit is about a third of the distance from Oxford Circus, so it shares some of the same catchment area. For example,
Poland St, Wardour St and Berwick St are nearer to Dean St than Oxford Circus, and M&S is about equidistant.

4. One end linked, the other close to a different LU station

Bond Street EL and LU stations are integrated, but the eastern entrance in Hanover Square is about four minutes walk
from Oxford Circus station (including crossing Regent's Street). There's no (known) physical link between the stations,
but it's an OSI interchange, useful for changing from the EL to the Victoria and Bakerloo lines. For many Regent's
Street locations, Hanover Square will be closer than Oxford Circus station, so this entrance may prove very popular.

So, although Oxford Circus doesn't have a direct connection to the EL, it shares catchment areas with two EL stations,
which will significantly reduce the load on it that very overcrowded LU station.

On 21/06/2022 12:07, Recliner wrote:
>
> 3. One end linked, the other close to the same LU station
>
> Tottenham Court Road EL station is fully integrated into the existing LU station, and the Dean Street entrance is about
> 250m (3-4 minutes walk) from an entrance to the same station. I think only the latter has an EL roundel. The Dean Street
> exit is about a third of the distance from Oxford Circus, so it shares some of the same catchment area. For example,
> Poland St, Wardour St and Berwick St are nearer to Dean St than Oxford Circus, and M&S is about equidistant.

Disagree with your claim of 'linked': at Tottenham Court Road to change from Eliz line to any tube line you have to go up to the ticket hall and through two successive gate lines. You don't have to do that at Farringdon if you choose the right route (though I doubt if it's signposted).

--
Clive Page

Clive Page <usenet@page2.eu> wrote:

> Disagree with your claim of 'linked': at Tottenham Court Road to change
> from Eliz line to any tube line you have to go up to the ticket hall and
> through two successive gate lines.
>

This is not correct.

On 21/06/2022 20:23, Tweed wrote:
> Clive Page <usenet@page2.eu> wrote:
>
>> Disagree with your claim of 'linked': at Tottenham Court Road to change
>> from Eliz line to any tube line you have to go up to the ticket hall and
>> through two successive gate lines.
>>
>
> This is not correct.
>

I'm glad to have your correction - but that's what I did when following the signposted route.
Next time I'll try harder to stay underground.

--
Clive Page

I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.

Clive Page <usenet@page2.eu> wrote:
> On 21/06/2022 20:23, Tweed wrote:
>> Clive Page <usenet@page2.eu> wrote:
>>
>>> Disagree with your claim of 'linked': at Tottenham Court Road to change
>>> from Eliz line to any tube line you have to go up to the ticket hall and
>>> through two successive gate lines.
>>>
>>
>> This is not correct.
>>
>
> I'm glad to have your correction - but that's what I did when following
> the signposted route.
> Next time I'll try harder to stay underground.
>

At TCR I wonder if you followed the Way Out signs at the EL platform? If I
remember correctly, the signs to the Northern Line point in the opposite
direction. I seem to remember walking the length of the platform as we were
towards the front of the train.

Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
> Clive Page <usenet@page2.eu> wrote:
>> On 21/06/2022 20:23, Tweed wrote:
>>> Clive Page <usenet@page2.eu> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Disagree with your claim of 'linked': at Tottenham Court Road to change
>>>> from Eliz line to any tube line you have to go up to the ticket hall and
>>>> through two successive gate lines.
>>>>
>>>
>>> This is not correct.
>>>
>>
>> I'm glad to have your correction - but that's what I did when following
>> the signposted route.
>> Next time I'll try harder to stay underground.
>>
>
> At TCR I wonder if you followed the Way Out signs at the EL platform? If I
> remember correctly, the signs to the Northern Line point in the opposite
> direction. I seem to remember walking the length of the platform as we were
> towards the front of the train.
>

I plan to explore TCR today and will report back. From the 3D map, all the
connections are at the eastern end of platforms. The western end leads only
to the Dean St exit.

hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.
>

Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:

IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations, most
commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each end of the
train, but occasionally on deeper lines where the cross-passage at 90° to
the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for example, Baixa-Chiado station
in Lisbon, where the four escalators one after another actually form a
convenient transport system of their own from one entrance to the other!).
Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!

There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect to two
different other stations on different lines, the difference perhaps being
only whether or not the stations share the same name?

Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named separately (or
the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B"); others have the two
ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b and A-c"); others still have
exits lettered or numbered (very helpfully shown on Google maps too in some
locations!).

Anyone who's changed from Circle/Met/H&C to mainline at Euston will wish
that Euston Square was a double-ended station!!

Anna Noyd-Dryver

On 22/06/2022 10:58, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.
>>
>
> Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>
> IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations, most
> commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each end of the
> train, but occasionally on deeper lines where the cross-passage at 90° to
> the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for example, Baixa-Chiado station
> in Lisbon, where the four escalators one after another actually form a
> convenient transport system of their own from one entrance to the other!).
> Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
> shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
> lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
> possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!
>
> There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect to two
> different other stations on different lines, the difference perhaps being
> only whether or not the stations share the same name?
>
> Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named separately (or
> the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B"); others have the two
> ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b and A-c"); others still have
> exits lettered or numbered (very helpfully shown on Google maps too in some
> locations!).
>
> Anyone who's changed from Circle/Met/H&C to mainline at Euston will wish
> that Euston Square was a double-ended station!!

HS2 will link directly to Euston Square, unless it's been quietly axed.

On 22/06/2022 11:20, Certes wrote:
>On 22/06/2022 10:58, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.
>>>
>>
>> Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>>
>> IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations, most
>> commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each end of the
>> train, but occasionally on deeper lines where the cross-passage at 90° to
>> the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for example, Baixa-Chiado station
>> in Lisbon, where the four escalators one after another actually form a
>> convenient transport system of their own from one entrance to the other!).
>> Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
>> shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
>> lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
>> possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!
>>
>> There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect to two
>> different other stations on different lines, the difference perhaps being
>> only whether or not the stations share the same name?
>>
>> Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named separately (or
>> the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B"); others have the two
>> ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b and A-c"); others still have
>> exits lettered or numbered (very helpfully shown on Google maps too in some
>> locations!).
>>
>> Anyone who's changed from Circle/Met/H&C to mainline at Euston will wish
>> that Euston Square was a double-ended station!!
>
>HS2 will link directly to Euston Square, unless it's been quietly axed.

I believe that's still the plan.

In message <t8uqd6$oui$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:20:21 on Wed, 22 Jun
2022, Certes <none@nowhere.net> remarked:
>On 22/06/2022 10:58, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.
>>>
>> Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>>IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations,
>>most commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each
>>end of the train, but occasionally on deeper lines where the
>>cross-passage at 90° to the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for
>>example, Baixa-Chiado station in Lisbon, where the four escalators
>>one after another actually form a convenient transport system of
>>their own from one entrance to the other!).

>> Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
>> shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
>> lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
>> possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!

>> There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect
>>to two different other stations on different lines, the difference
>>perhaps being only whether or not the stations share the same name?

>> Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named
>>separately (or the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B");
>>others have the two ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b
>>and A-c"); others still have exits lettered or numbered (very
>>helpfully shown on Google maps too in some locations!).

>> Anyone who's changed from Circle/Met/H&C to mainline at Euston will
>>wish that Euston Square was a double-ended station!!
>
>HS2 will link directly to Euston Square, unless it's been quietly axed.

I remember that being part of the original plan, although I filed it
under "StP Thameslink is connected to the Victoria Line, but only if 10
minute walk is OK".
--
Roland Perry

On Wed, 22 Jun 2022 12:30:35 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:

>In message <t8uqd6$oui$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:20:21 on Wed, 22 Jun
>2022, Certes <none@nowhere.net> remarked:
>>On 22/06/2022 10:58, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.
>>>>
>>> Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>>>IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations,
>>>most commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each
>>>end of the train, but occasionally on deeper lines where the
>>>cross-passage at 90° to the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for
>>>example, Baixa-Chiado station in Lisbon, where the four escalators
>>>one after another actually form a convenient transport system of
>>>their own from one entrance to the other!).
>
>>> Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
>>> shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
>>> lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
>>> possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!
>
>>> There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect
>>>to two different other stations on different lines, the difference
>>>perhaps being only whether or not the stations share the same name?
>
>>> Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named
>>>separately (or the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B");
>>>others have the two ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b
>>>and A-c"); others still have exits lettered or numbered (very
>>>helpfully shown on Google maps too in some locations!).
>
>>> Anyone who's changed from Circle/Met/H&C to mainline at Euston will
>>>wish that Euston Square was a double-ended station!!
>>
>>HS2 will link directly to Euston Square, unless it's been quietly axed.
>
>I remember that being part of the original plan, although I filed it
>under "StP Thameslink is connected to the Victoria Line, but only if 10
>minute walk is OK".

The HS2 station will be very close to Euston Square station, and there's a commitment to connect them. What's more, in
the absence of XR2, that connectivity will be very much needed.

On Wed, 22 Jun 2022 09:58:37 -0000 (UTC), Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:

>hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.
>>
>
>Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>
>IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations, most
>commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each end of the
>train, but occasionally on deeper lines where the cross-passage at 90° to
>the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for example, Baixa-Chiado station
>in Lisbon, where the four escalators one after another actually form a
>convenient transport system of their own from one entrance to the other!).
>Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
>shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
>lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
>possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!
>
>There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect to two
>different other stations on different lines, the difference perhaps being
>only whether or not the stations share the same name?
>
>Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named separately (or
>the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B"); others have the two
>ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b and A-c"); others still have
>exits lettered or numbered (very helpfully shown on Google maps too in some
>locations!).
>
>Anyone who's changed from Circle/Met/H&C to mainline at Euston will wish
>that Euston Square was a double-ended station!!

Or, just single-ended, but at the eastern end of the platforms.

In message <sj16bhdp5bvv2rjsnn94121qocom2o8daj@4ax.com>, at 13:10:50 on
Wed, 22 Jun 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>On Wed, 22 Jun 2022 12:30:35 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>In message <t8uqd6$oui$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:20:21 on Wed, 22 Jun
>>2022, Certes <none@nowhere.net> remarked:
>>>On 22/06/2022 10:58, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
>>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around
>>>>>the world.
>>>>>
>>>> Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>>>>IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations,
>>>>most commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each
>>>>end of the train, but occasionally on deeper lines where the
>>>>cross-passage at 90° to the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for
>>>>example, Baixa-Chiado station in Lisbon, where the four escalators
>>>>one after another actually form a convenient transport system of
>>>>their own from one entrance to the other!).
>>
>>>> Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
>>>> shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
>>>> lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
>>>> possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!
>>
>>>> There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect
>>>>to two different other stations on different lines, the difference
>>>>perhaps being only whether or not the stations share the same name?
>>
>>>> Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named
>>>>separately (or the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B");
>>>>others have the two ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b
>>>>and A-c"); others still have exits lettered or numbered (very
>>>>helpfully shown on Google maps too in some locations!).
>>
>>>> Anyone who's changed from Circle/Met/H&C to mainline at Euston will
>>>>wish that Euston Square was a double-ended station!!
>>>
>>>HS2 will link directly to Euston Square, unless it's been quietly axed.
>>
>>I remember that being part of the original plan, although I filed it
>>under "StP Thameslink is connected to the Victoria Line, but only if 10
>>minute walk is OK".
>
>The HS2 station will be very close to Euston Square station, and
>there's a commitment to connect them. What's more, in the absence of
>XR2, that connectivity will be very much needed.

The 3D maps I saw some time ago didn't bode well for the connection
being other than a very long walk.
--
Roland Perry

In message <tm16bhhhgas7q9ulm644r91tfjlfe43f3a@4ax.com>, at 13:11:33 on
Wed, 22 Jun 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>On Wed, 22 Jun 2022 09:58:37 -0000 (UTC), Anna Noyd-Dryver
><anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>
>>hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.
>>>
>>
>>Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>>
>>IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations, most
>>commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each end of the
>>train, but occasionally on deeper lines where the cross-passage at 90° to
>>the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for example, Baixa-Chiado station
>>in Lisbon, where the four escalators one after another actually form a
>>convenient transport system of their own from one entrance to the other!).
>>Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
>>shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
>>lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
>>possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!
>>
>>There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect to two
>>different other stations on different lines, the difference perhaps being
>>only whether or not the stations share the same name?
>>
>>Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named separately (or
>>the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B"); others have the two
>>ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b and A-c"); others still have
>>exits lettered or numbered (very helpfully shown on Google maps too in some
>>locations!).
>>
>>Anyone who's changed from Circle/Met/H&C to mainline at Euston will wish
>>that Euston Square was a double-ended station!!
>
>Or, just single-ended, but at the eastern end of the platforms.

How does that help people whose destination is actually Euston Square,
and non-rail destinations at the western end of the station?

University College Hospital, for example.
--
Roland Perry

Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Jun 2022 09:58:37 -0000 (UTC), Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>
>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.
>>>
>>
>> Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>>
>> IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations, most
>> commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each end of the
>> train, but occasionally on deeper lines where the cross-passage at 90° to
>> the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for example, Baixa-Chiado station
>> in Lisbon, where the four escalators one after another actually form a
>> convenient transport system of their own from one entrance to the other!).
>> Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
>> shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
>> lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
>> possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!
>>
>> There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect to two
>> different other stations on different lines, the difference perhaps being
>> only whether or not the stations share the same name?
>>
>> Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named separately (or
>> the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B"); others have the two
>> ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b and A-c"); others still have
>> exits lettered or numbered (very helpfully shown on Google maps too in some
>> locations!).
>>
>> Anyone who's changed from Circle/Met/H&C to mainline at Euston will wish
>> that Euston Square was a double-ended station!!
>
> Or, just single-ended, but at the eastern end of the platforms.
>

That'd be less convenient for connections via Warren Street, though I guess
any connection there could equally be made at Euston. Presumably there's a
reason they built the station the way they did!

Anna Noyd-Dryver

On Wed, 22 Jun 2022 13:45:28 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:

>In message <sj16bhdp5bvv2rjsnn94121qocom2o8daj@4ax.com>, at 13:10:50 on
>Wed, 22 Jun 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>On Wed, 22 Jun 2022 12:30:35 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>In message <t8uqd6$oui$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:20:21 on Wed, 22 Jun
>>>2022, Certes <none@nowhere.net> remarked:
>>>>On 22/06/2022 10:58, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
>>>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around
>>>>>>the world.
>>>>>>
>>>>> Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>>>>>IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations,
>>>>>most commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each
>>>>>end of the train, but occasionally on deeper lines where the
>>>>>cross-passage at 90° to the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for
>>>>>example, Baixa-Chiado station in Lisbon, where the four escalators
>>>>>one after another actually form a convenient transport system of
>>>>>their own from one entrance to the other!).
>>>
>>>>> Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
>>>>> shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
>>>>> lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
>>>>> possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!
>>>
>>>>> There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect
>>>>>to two different other stations on different lines, the difference
>>>>>perhaps being only whether or not the stations share the same name?
>>>
>>>>> Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named
>>>>>separately (or the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B");
>>>>>others have the two ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b
>>>>>and A-c"); others still have exits lettered or numbered (very
>>>>>helpfully shown on Google maps too in some locations!).
>>>
>>>>> Anyone who's changed from Circle/Met/H&C to mainline at Euston will
>>>>>wish that Euston Square was a double-ended station!!
>>>>
>>>>HS2 will link directly to Euston Square, unless it's been quietly axed.
>>>
>>>I remember that being part of the original plan, although I filed it
>>>under "StP Thameslink is connected to the Victoria Line, but only if 10
>>>minute walk is OK".
>>
>>The HS2 station will be very close to Euston Square station, and
>>there's a commitment to connect them. What's more, in the absence of
>>XR2, that connectivity will be very much needed.
>
>The 3D maps I saw some time ago didn't bode well for the connection
>being other than a very long walk.

That's not what I saw.

On Wed, 22 Jun 2022 13:55:58 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:

>In message <tm16bhhhgas7q9ulm644r91tfjlfe43f3a@4ax.com>, at 13:11:33 on
>Wed, 22 Jun 2022, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>On Wed, 22 Jun 2022 09:58:37 -0000 (UTC), Anna Noyd-Dryver
>><anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>>
>>>hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>>>
>>>IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations, most
>>>commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each end of the
>>>train, but occasionally on deeper lines where the cross-passage at 90° to
>>>the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for example, Baixa-Chiado station
>>>in Lisbon, where the four escalators one after another actually form a
>>>convenient transport system of their own from one entrance to the other!).
>>>Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
>>>shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
>>>lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
>>>possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!
>>>
>>>There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect to two
>>>different other stations on different lines, the difference perhaps being
>>>only whether or not the stations share the same name?
>>>
>>>Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named separately (or
>>>the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B"); others have the two
>>>ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b and A-c"); others still have
>>>exits lettered or numbered (very helpfully shown on Google maps too in some
>>>locations!).
>>>
>>>Anyone who's changed from Circle/Met/H&C to mainline at Euston will wish
>>>that Euston Square was a double-ended station!!
>>
>>Or, just single-ended, but at the eastern end of the platforms.
>
>How does that help people whose destination is actually Euston Square,

It would obviously be an improvement for them.

>and non-rail destinations at the western end of the station?
>
>University College Hospital, for example.

They're less likely to be carrying luggage or rushing for a train. A slightly longer walk will be less hassle for them.

On Wed, 22 Jun 2022 13:09:20 -0000 (UTC), Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:

>Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Wed, 22 Jun 2022 09:58:37 -0000 (UTC), Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
>>
>>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>>>
>>> IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations, most
>>> commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each end of the
>>> train, but occasionally on deeper lines where the cross-passage at 90° to
>>> the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for example, Baixa-Chiado station
>>> in Lisbon, where the four escalators one after another actually form a
>>> convenient transport system of their own from one entrance to the other!).
>>> Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
>>> shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
>>> lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
>>> possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!
>>>
>>> There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect to two
>>> different other stations on different lines, the difference perhaps being
>>> only whether or not the stations share the same name?
>>>
>>> Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named separately (or
>>> the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B"); others have the two
>>> ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b and A-c"); others still have
>>> exits lettered or numbered (very helpfully shown on Google maps too in some
>>> locations!).
>>>
>>> Anyone who's changed from Circle/Met/H&C to mainline at Euston will wish
>>> that Euston Square was a double-ended station!!
>>
>> Or, just single-ended, but at the eastern end of the platforms.
>>
>
>That'd be less convenient for connections via Warren Street, though I guess
>any connection there could equally be made at Euston. Presumably there's a
>reason they built the station the way they did!

I suppose rail connections were less of an issue in 1863, and maybe an exit near Gower Street was more prestigious than
one near Eversholt Street? Also, didn't the Met have a relationship with the GWR? Perhaps good links with the LNWR
terminus weren't a high priority.

On Wed, 22 Jun 2022 09:58:37 -0000 (UTC), Anna Noyd-Dryver
<anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:

>hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.
>>
>
>Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>
>IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations,

The original Expo line terminus at Waterfront in Downtown Vancouver
feeds either east up onto the concourse/street level of the converted
Canadian Pacific Railway Station with feeders down to the heavy-rail
commuter line and out to SeaBus, the ferry to the North Shore, within
the gateline... and west with splits into a small shopping precinct
under an office building, or up into the olde Federal Building, or a
street entrance close to the Convention Centre.

The Canada Line's Waterfront terminus exits south directly up onto a
main shopping street and north in a passageway which leads up to the
CP concourse. Transferring between the two lines requires tapping out
and back in at separate gates.

The high elevated station on the Expo Line at Metrotown in suburban
Burnaby was substantially re-built several years ago with the island
platform lengthened and quadruple escalators installed at both ends.
The west corresponds to the main unloading stop for multiple bus
routes... and the east to the crosswalk into the departures' bus loop
and the major shopping mall. The mid-level covered walkway above the
street and into the second floor of the mall was never re-connected,
though the structure's still in place with no alignment possible to
the station's re-vamped mezzanine level, served by mid-platform stairs
and three elevators/lifts down to street level.

On 22 Jun 2022 at 11:58:37 AM CEST, "Anna Noyd-Dryver" <anna@noyd-dryver.com>
wrote:

> <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> <hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> I wonder if there are many more examples of such stations around the world.
>>
>
> Some unsnipped context from the previous message might help; but:
>
> IMX many metro systems around the world have double-ended stations, most
> commonly on shallow cut-and-cover lines with an entrance at each end of the
> train,

Plenty of double-ended stations on the Bucharest metro, indeed I'd go so far
as to say it's probably the most common configuration. Exits are typically
signposted for the street they exit onto (or if both are on the same street,
for the nearest cross-street.)

> but occasionally on deeper lines where the cross-passage at 90° to
> the tracks has two widely-spaced exits (for example, Baixa-Chiado station
> in Lisbon, where the four escalators one after another actually form a
> convenient transport system of their own from one entrance to the other!).
> Particularly Asian underground systems may be integrated into the extensive
> shopping centre at one level below the street that they often have multiple
> lettered exits along the length of the station, and in some cases it's
> possible to walk underground between several stations and several lines!

Unirii station is effectively two double-ended stations, one above the other,
connected by an underground passageway. Unirii 1 runs east/west on lines M1
and M3, while Unirii 2 runs north/south on line M2.

Interestingly (for certain values thereof), because Unirii is quite close to
the exact centre of the city (the official centre for all distances -
equivalent of Charing X I guess - being the nearby church at Sfantul
Gheorghe,) and given the way Sectors (the equivalent of London Boroughs) are
arranged radially like a Trivial Pursuit pie, the result is that Unirii
station has exits in each of 4 different sectors.

Are there any LU stations with entrances in 4 different Boroughs, I wonder?
:). I guess there must be examples where there are entrances in at least 2?

> There surely are locations where the two ends of one station connect to two
> different other stations on different lines, the difference perhaps being
> only whether or not the stations share the same name?

The westernmost entrance to Gara de Nord metro M1 is, I suspect, actually
closer to Gara Basarab than it is GdN. The easternmost entrance is most
assuredly in GdN.

(Although in general if you don't want GdN, Basarab itself is a more useful
station, having cross-platform interchange between M1/M4 - GdN is actually two
disconnected stations, one on each line - it would be an "OSI" if such things
existed on Metrorex (in practice they don't, so changing lines at GdN metro
entails paying twice.))

> Regarding naming, some stations IIRC have the two ends named separately (or
> the station as a whole being named "A/B" or "A-B"); others have the two
> ends diminutively named ("station A, exits A-b and A-c"); others still have
> exits lettered or numbered (very helpfully shown on Google maps too in some
> locations!).

I'm now thoroughly confused, so I suspect not the same situation you describe
but since I'm rambling anyway - might as well add that typical practice on
Bucharest is the station as a whole has a name (like "Eroilor"), and then the
'sub stations' are numbered - Eroilor 1 and Eroilor 2, for example - when it
is useful to distinguish. (Eroilor is effectively two double-ended stations
ane above the other, although they form a triangle, so both have one end in
the south east, but the other end of Eroilor 1 (lines M1/M3) is at the
northern corner of the triangle, and the other end of Eroilor 2 (line M5) is
at the south-western corner.)

Dristor is another confusing station, again effectively two stations one above
the other, with one station on lines M1 and M3 and the other one only on line
M1. The difference is one of them (Dristor 2) is the terminus of M1, while
Dristor 1 is through-platform on M1 - it's basically the same logically as the
current configuration of the Circle line at Edgware Road, except the terminal
platforms are underneath the through platforms.

On 2022-06-21 14:20:24 +0000, Clive Page said:

> On 21/06/2022 12:07, Recliner wrote:
>>
>> 3. One end linked, the other close to the same LU station
>>
>> Tottenham Court Road EL station is fully integrated into the existing
>> LU station, and the Dean Street entrance is about
>> 250m (3-4 minutes walk) from an entrance to the same station. I think
>> only the latter has an EL roundel. The Dean Street
>> exit is about a third of the distance from Oxford Circus, so it shares
>> some of the same catchment area. For example,
>> Poland St, Wardour St and Berwick St are nearer to Dean St than Oxford
>> Circus, and M&S is about equidistant.
>
> Disagree with your claim of 'linked': at Tottenham Court Road to change
> from Eliz line to any tube line you have to go up to the ticket hall
> and through two successive gate lines. You don't have to do that at
> Farringdon if you choose the right route (though I doubt if it's
> signposted).

The first journey I made on EL involved changing at TCR to Northern. I
followed the signs that I saw an made the connection without going up
to ticket hall level and encountered no gate lines.

Robin

In message <t9153k$evs$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:35:14 on Thu, 23 Jun
2022, Bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>On 2022-06-21 14:20:24 +0000, Clive Page said:
>
>> On 21/06/2022 12:07, Recliner wrote:
>>> 3. One end linked, the other close to the same LU station
>>> Tottenham Court Road EL station is fully integrated into the
>>>existing LU station, and the Dean Street entrance is about
>>> 250m (3-4 minutes walk) from an entrance to the same station. I
>>>think only the latter has an EL roundel. The Dean Street
>>> exit is about a third of the distance from Oxford Circus, so it
>>>shares some of the same catchment area. For example,
>>> Poland St, Wardour St and Berwick St are nearer to Dean St than
>>>Oxford Circus, and M&S is about equidistant.
>> Disagree with your claim of 'linked': at Tottenham Court Road to
>>change from Eliz line to any tube line you have to go up to the
>>ticket hall and through two successive gate lines. You don't have
>>to do that at Farringdon if you choose the right route (though I
>>doubt if it's signposted).
>
>The first journey I made on EL involved changing at TCR to Northern. I
>followed the signs that I saw an made the connection without going up
>to ticket hall level and encountered no gate lines.

I don't know if it matters, but which end of the train did you get off?
Victoria Line at Kings Cross has long had different signage depending on
how far you are along the platform, to get to the outside world.
--
Roland Perry

Bob <email@domain.com> wrote:
> On 2022-06-21 14:20:24 +0000, Clive Page said:
>
>> On 21/06/2022 12:07, Recliner wrote:
>>>
>>> 3. One end linked, the other close to the same LU station
>>>
>>> Tottenham Court Road EL station is fully integrated into the existing
>>> LU station, and the Dean Street entrance is about
>>> 250m (3-4 minutes walk) from an entrance to the same station. I think
>>> only the latter has an EL roundel. The Dean Street
>>> exit is about a third of the distance from Oxford Circus, so it shares
>>> some of the same catchment area. For example,
>>> Poland St, Wardour St and Berwick St are nearer to Dean St than Oxford
>>> Circus, and M&S is about equidistant.
>>
>> Disagree with your claim of 'linked': at Tottenham Court Road to change
>> from Eliz line to any tube line you have to go up to the ticket hall
>> and through two successive gate lines. You don't have to do that at
>> Farringdon if you choose the right route (though I doubt if it's
>> signposted).
>
> The first journey I made on EL involved changing at TCR to Northern. I
> followed the signs that I saw an made the connection without going up
> to ticket hall level and encountered no gate lines.

Yes, it's an easy, direct link from the EL to the Northern Line. But I
guess that someone looking for the Central Line connection might not notice
the divergence of the signposted routes to the two LU lines, after the
initial signs show the same route to the Way Out and both LU lines, but
then you get a split:
<https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/52165606325/in/album-72177720299998834/>

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <t9153k$evs$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:35:14 on Thu, 23 Jun
> 2022, Bob <email@domain.com> remarked:
>> On 2022-06-21 14:20:24 +0000, Clive Page said:
>>
>>> On 21/06/2022 12:07, Recliner wrote:
>>>> 3. One end linked, the other close to the same LU station
>>>> Tottenham Court Road EL station is fully integrated into the
>>>> existing LU station, and the Dean Street entrance is about
>>>> 250m (3-4 minutes walk) from an entrance to the same station. I
>>>> think only the latter has an EL roundel. The Dean Street
>>>> exit is about a third of the distance from Oxford Circus, so it
>>>> shares some of the same catchment area. For example,
>>>> Poland St, Wardour St and Berwick St are nearer to Dean St than
>>>> Oxford Circus, and M&S is about equidistant.
>>> Disagree with your claim of 'linked': at Tottenham Court Road to
>>> change from Eliz line to any tube line you have to go up to the
>>> ticket hall and through two successive gate lines. You don't have
>>> to do that at Farringdon if you choose the right route (though I
>>> doubt if it's signposted).
>>
>> The first journey I made on EL involved changing at TCR to Northern. I
>> followed the signs that I saw an made the connection without going up
>> to ticket hall level and encountered no gate lines.
>
> I don't know if it matters, but which end of the train did you get off?
> Victoria Line at Kings Cross has long had different signage depending on
> how far you are along the platform, to get to the outside world.

No, in this case, it doesn't matter where on the train you were located. If
you want to change to either of the LU lines, you will first be directed
towards the eastern exit, but then there's a right turn for the Northern
Line. You might easily miss it if you're intent on changing to the Central
line.