Covid in Scotland: Review after row over 1m rule on cross-border trains

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-57893582

The Poison Dwarf must be loving this!

On Mon, 19 Jul 2021 22:10:34 +0100, MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:

>Covid in Scotland: Review after row over 1m rule on cross-border trains
>
>https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-57893582
>
>
>The Poison Dwarf must be loving this!
>
What has Hatie Kopkins got to do with it?

"MB" <MB@nospam.net> wrote in message news:sd4pn3$ipj$1@dont-email.me...
> Covid in Scotland: Review after row over 1m rule on cross-border trains
>
> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-57893582
>
>
> The Poison Dwarf must be loving this!

"The firm has encouraged passengers to travel at quieter times"

surely people are already motivated to travel at quieter times due to the
huge difference in fares

I can't see any press announcement makings that more likely

tim... <timsnews99@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> "MB" <MB@nospam.net> wrote in message news:sd4pn3$ipj$1@dont-email.me...
>> Covid in Scotland: Review after row over 1m rule on cross-border trains
>>
>> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-57893582
>>
>>
>> The Poison Dwarf must be loving this!
>
> "The firm has encouraged passengers to travel at quieter times"
>
> surely people are already motivated to travel at quieter times due to the
> huge difference in fares
>
> I can't see any press announcement makings that more likely
>

IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of commuters)
than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route to route
and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

On 20/07/2021 10:45, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
> tim... <timsnews99@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> "MB" <MB@nospam.net> wrote in message news:sd4pn3$ipj$1@dont-email.me...
>>> Covid in Scotland: Review after row over 1m rule on cross-border trains
>>>
>>> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-57893582
>>>
>>>
>>> The Poison Dwarf must be loving this!
>>
>> "The firm has encouraged passengers to travel at quieter times"
>>
>> surely people are already motivated to travel at quieter times due to the
>> huge difference in fares
>>
>> I can't see any press announcement makings that more likely
>>
>
> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of commuters)
> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route to route
> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>

Chatting to a SWR guard on my way to Southampton recently, apparently
only the Bournemouth services are crowded. Everyone going to the beach
presumably.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>tim... <timsnews99@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> "MB" <MB@nospam.net> wrote in message news:sd4pn3$ipj$1@dont-email.me...
>>> Covid in Scotland: Review after row over 1m rule on cross-border trains
>>>
>>> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-57893582
>>>
>>>
>>> The Poison Dwarf must be loving this!
>>
>> "The firm has encouraged passengers to travel at quieter times"
>>
>> surely people are already motivated to travel at quieter times due to the
>> huge difference in fares
>>
>> I can't see any press announcement makings that more likely
>>
>
>IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of commuters)
>than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route to route
>and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.

You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
route.

XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>> tim... <timsnews99@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> "MB" <MB@nospam.net> wrote in message news:sd4pn3$ipj$1@dont-email.me...
>>>> Covid in Scotland: Review after row over 1m rule on cross-border trains
>>>>
>>>> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-57893582
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The Poison Dwarf must be loving this!
>>>
>>> "The firm has encouraged passengers to travel at quieter times"
>>>
>>> surely people are already motivated to travel at quieter times due to the
>>> huge difference in fares
>>>
>>> I can't see any press announcement makings that more likely
>>>
>>
>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of commuters)
>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route to route
>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>
> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
> route.
>
> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).

Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston, Weymouth,
Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>> tim... <timsnews99@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "MB" <MB@nospam.net> wrote in message news:sd4pn3$ipj$1@dont-email.me...
>>>>> Covid in Scotland: Review after row over 1m rule on cross-border trains
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-57893582
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The Poison Dwarf must be loving this!
>>>>
>>>> "The firm has encouraged passengers to travel at quieter times"
>>>>
>>>> surely people are already motivated to travel at quieter times due to the
>>>> huge difference in fares
>>>>
>>>> I can't see any press announcement makings that more likely
>>>>
>>>
>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of commuters)
>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route to route
>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>
>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
>> route.
>>
>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>
>Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston, Weymouth,
>Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.

If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially significantly
reduce the fare.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>
>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of commuters)
>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route to route
>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>
>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
>>> route.
>>>
>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>
>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston, Weymouth,
>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>
> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially significantly
> reduce the fare.

Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to Scotland, the
entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
trains crowded by leisure travellers.

I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at the beach,
they have closer beaches.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>
>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of commuters)
>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route to route
>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>>
>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
>>>> route.
>>>>
>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>
>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston, Weymouth,
>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>
>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially significantly
>> reduce the fare.
>
>Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to Scotland, the
>entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>
>I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at the beach,
>they have closer beaches.

If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to travel
on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative is compulsory
reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday trains from
Paddington to the West Country).
--
Roland Perry

On 20/07/2021 16:22, Roland Perry wrote:
> In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of
>>>>>> commuters)
>>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route
>>>>>> to route
>>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>>>
>>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
>>>>> route.
>>>>>
>>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
>>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>>
>>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston,
>>>> Weymouth,
>>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>>
>>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially significantly
>>> reduce the fare.
>>
>> Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to
>> Scotland, the
>> entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>> trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>>
>> I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at the
>> beach,
>> they have closer beaches.
>
> If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to travel
> on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative is compulsory
> reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday trains from
> Paddington to the West Country).

A rather silly idea. Crowds of occasional passengers, not knowing about
the compulsory reservations, would cause chaos at stations.

And next time, they would travel by car, creating traffic jams, and
increasing CO2 emissions into the atmosphere.

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of commuters)
>>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route to route
>>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>>>
>>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
>>>>> route.
>>>>>
>>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
>>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>>
>>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston, Weymouth,
>>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>>
>>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially significantly
>>> reduce the fare.
>>
>> Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to Scotland, the
>> entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>> trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>>
>> I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at the beach,
>> they have closer beaches.
>
> If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to travel
> on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative is compulsory
> reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday trains from
> Paddington to the West Country).

That'll go down well on an all-stops service which also serves other
traffic.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

In message <sd6qi5$5ls$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:36:39 on Tue, 20 Jul
2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>On 20/07/2021 16:22, Roland Perry wrote:
>> In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of
>>>>>>>commuters)
>>>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>>>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route
>>>>>>>to route
>>>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
>>>>>> route.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
>>>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>>>
>>>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston,
>>>>>Weymouth,
>>>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>>>
>>>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially significantly
>>>> reduce the fare.
>>>
>>> Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to
>>>Scotland, the
>>> entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>>> trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>>>
>>> I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at the
>>>beach,
>>> they have closer beaches.

>> If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to
>>travel on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative is
>>compulsory reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday trains
>>from Paddington to the West Country).
>
>A rather silly idea. Crowds of occasional passengers, not knowing about
>the compulsory reservations, would cause chaos at stations.

Happy to hear better ideas (fwiw I agree that as a surprise at the
station it might not be wildly popular, but LNER has had compulsory
reservations for months now, and presumably the word has spread
sufficiently).

>And next time, they would travel by car, creating traffic jams, and
>increasing CO2 emissions into the atmosphere.

But not caching Covid from fellow passengers.
--
Roland Perry

On 20/07/2021 17:33, Roland Perry wrote:
> In message <sd6qi5$5ls$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:36:39 on Tue, 20 Jul
> 2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>> On 20/07/2021 16:22, Roland Perry wrote:
>>> In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of
>>>>>>>> commuters)
>>>>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with
>>>>>>>> leisure
>>>>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route
>>>>>>>> to route
>>>>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>> route.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely
>>>>>>> prejudiced if
>>>>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston,
>>>>>> Weymouth,
>>>>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>>>>
>>>>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially
>>>>> significantly
>>>>> reduce the fare.
>>>>
>>>> Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to
>>>> Scotland, the
>>>> entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>>>> trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>>>>
>>>> I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at the
>>>> beach,
>>>> they have closer beaches.
>
>>>  If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to
>>> travel  on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative is
>>> compulsory  reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday trains
>>> from  Paddington to the West Country).
>>
>> A rather silly idea. Crowds of occasional passengers, not knowing
>> about the compulsory reservations, would cause chaos at stations.
>
> Happy to hear better ideas (fwiw I agree that as a surprise at the
> station it might not be wildly popular, but LNER has had compulsory
> reservations for months now, and presumably the word has spread
> sufficiently).
>

But LNER is not the principal operator to any of the major seaside resorts.

Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 20/07/2021 17:33, Roland Perry wrote:
>> In message <sd6qi5$5ls$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:36:39 on Tue, 20 Jul
>> 2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> On 20/07/2021 16:22, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>> In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of
>>>>>>>>> commuters)
>>>>>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with
>>>>>>>>> leisure
>>>>>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route
>>>>>>>>> to route
>>>>>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> route.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>>>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely
>>>>>>>> prejudiced if
>>>>>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston,
>>>>>>> Weymouth,
>>>>>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially
>>>>>> significantly
>>>>>> reduce the fare.
>>>>>
>>>>> Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to
>>>>> Scotland, the
>>>>> entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>>>>> trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>>>>>
>>>>> I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at the
>>>>> beach,
>>>>> they have closer beaches.
>>
>>>>  If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to
>>>> travel  on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative is
>>>> compulsory  reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday trains
>>>> from  Paddington to the West Country).
>>>
>>> A rather silly idea. Crowds of occasional passengers, not knowing
>>> about the compulsory reservations, would cause chaos at stations.
>>
>> Happy to hear better ideas (fwiw I agree that as a surprise at the
>> station it might not be wildly popular, but LNER has had compulsory
>> reservations for months now, and presumably the word has spread
>> sufficiently).
>>
>
> But LNER is not the principal operator to any of the major seaside resorts.

Nor does it run the sort of stopping services that are likely to attract
hordes of turn up and go passengers.

Sam

--
The entity formerly known as Sam.Wilson@ed.ac.uk
Spit the dummy to reply

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <sd6qi5$5ls$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:36:39 on Tue, 20 Jul
> 2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>> On 20/07/2021 16:22, Roland Perry wrote:
>>> In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of
>>>>>>>> commuters)
>>>>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>>>>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route
>>>>>>>> to route
>>>>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
>>>>>>> route.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
>>>>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston,
>>>>>> Weymouth,
>>>>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>>>>
>>>>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially significantly
>>>>> reduce the fare.
>>>>
>>>> Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to
>>>> Scotland, the
>>>> entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>>>> trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>>>>
>>>> I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at the
>>>> beach,
>>>> they have closer beaches.
>
>>> If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to
>>> travel on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative is
>>> compulsory reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday trains
>>> from Paddington to the West Country).
>>
>> A rather silly idea. Crowds of occasional passengers, not knowing about
>> the compulsory reservations, would cause chaos at stations.
>
> Happy to hear better ideas (fwiw I agree that as a surprise at the
> station it might not be wildly popular, but LNER has had compulsory
> reservations for months now, and presumably the word has spread
> sufficiently).
>

But they don't operate all-stops services to popular seaside destinations.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <sd6qi5$5ls$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:36:39 on Tue, 20 Jul
> 2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>> On 20/07/2021 16:22, Roland Perry wrote:
>>> In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of
>>>>>>>> commuters)
>>>>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>>>>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route
>>>>>>>> to route
>>>>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
>>>>>>> route.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
>>>>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston,
>>>>>> Weymouth,
>>>>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>>>>
>>>>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially significantly
>>>>> reduce the fare.
>>>>
>>>> Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to
>>>> Scotland, the
>>>> entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>>>> trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>>>>
>>>> I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at the
>>>> beach,
>>>> they have closer beaches.
>
>>> If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to
>>> travel on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative is
>>> compulsory reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday trains
>>> from Paddington to the West Country).
>>
>> A rather silly idea. Crowds of occasional passengers, not knowing about
>> the compulsory reservations, would cause chaos at stations.
>
> Happy to hear better ideas (fwiw I agree that as a surprise at the
> station it might not be wildly popular, but LNER has had compulsory
> reservations for months now, and presumably the word has spread
> sufficiently).

Personally, I had no idea that LNER has compulsory reservations, and it is
my standard way of getting to London. Although having said that, I’ve only
travelled on KWVR, Northern and TransPennine since the lockdown, and you
can travel on all of these without reservations now.

What happens if someone has an Anytime ticket and boards a compulsory
reservations train without a reservation? I’ve never tried in the UK, but
I’ve travelled without a reservation on Thalys (reservations compulsory)
from Aachen to Brussels after the previous DB train failed, but no-one came
round checking tickets, so I didn’t find out what would happen in that
case.
--
Jeremy Double

In message <sd77rf$cnn$1@dont-email.me>, at 20:23:26 on Tue, 20 Jul
2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>On 20/07/2021 17:33, Roland Perry wrote:
>> In message <sd6qi5$5ls$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:36:39 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> On 20/07/2021 16:22, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>> In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of
>>>>>>>>>commuters)
>>>>>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from
>>>>>>>>>route to route
>>>>>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of
>>>>>>>>day and
>>>>>>>> route.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>>>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely
>>>>>>>>prejudiced if
>>>>>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston,
>>>>>>>Weymouth,
>>>>>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially
>>>>>>significantly
>>>>>> reduce the fare.
>>>>>
>>>>> Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to
>>>>>Scotland, the
>>>>> entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>>>>> trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>>>>>
>>>>> I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at
>>>>>the beach,
>>>>> they have closer beaches.
>>
>>>>  If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to
>>>>travel  on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative is
>>>>compulsory  reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday
>>>>trains from  Paddington to the West Country).
>>>
>>> A rather silly idea. Crowds of occasional passengers, not knowing
>>>about the compulsory reservations, would cause chaos at stations.
>> Happy to hear better ideas (fwiw I agree that as a surprise at the
>>station it might not be wildly popular, but LNER has had compulsory
>>reservations for months now, and presumably the word has spread
>>sufficiently).
>
>But LNER is not the principal operator to any of the major seaside resorts.

But their scheme is in effect a pilot study for other operators. It
appears to be successful, as I've heard very little adverse comment.

Especially now all the operators are Shapps-in-drag, they could follow
LNER's example.

--
Roland Perry

Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <sd6qi5$5ls$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:36:39 on Tue, 20 Jul
>> 2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> On 20/07/2021 16:22, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>> In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of
>>>>>>>>> commuters)
>>>>>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>>>>>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route
>>>>>>>>> to route
>>>>>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
>>>>>>>> route.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>>>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
>>>>>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston,
>>>>>>> Weymouth,
>>>>>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially significantly
>>>>>> reduce the fare.
>>>>>
>>>>> Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to
>>>>> Scotland, the
>>>>> entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>>>>> trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>>>>>
>>>>> I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at the
>>>>> beach,
>>>>> they have closer beaches.
>>
>>>> If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to
>>>> travel on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative is
>>>> compulsory reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday trains
>>>> from Paddington to the West Country).
>>>
>>> A rather silly idea. Crowds of occasional passengers, not knowing about
>>> the compulsory reservations, would cause chaos at stations.
>>
>> Happy to hear better ideas (fwiw I agree that as a surprise at the
>> station it might not be wildly popular, but LNER has had compulsory
>> reservations for months now, and presumably the word has spread
>> sufficiently).
>
> Personally, I had no idea that LNER has compulsory reservations, and it is
> my standard way of getting to London. Although having said that, I’ve only
> travelled on KWVR, Northern and TransPennine since the lockdown, and you
> can travel on all of these without reservations now.
>
> What happens if someone has an Anytime ticket and boards a compulsory
> reservations train without a reservation? I’ve never tried in the UK, but
> I’ve travelled without a reservation on Thalys (reservations compulsory)
> from Aachen to Brussels after the previous DB train failed, but no-one came
> round checking tickets, so I didn’t find out what would happen in that
> case.

The idea was that there was a coach reserved for people without
reservations. If the gripper came across someone without a reservation
they would be given an instant reservation in that coach and be asked to
move there. I have no idea how well it worked.

Sam

--
The entity formerly known as Sam.Wilson@ed.ac.uk
Spit the dummy to reply

On 21/07/2021 07:37, Roland Perry wrote:
> In message <sd77rf$cnn$1@dont-email.me>, at 20:23:26 on Tue, 20 Jul
> 2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>> On 20/07/2021 17:33, Roland Perry wrote:
>>> In message <sd6qi5$5ls$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:36:39 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>> 2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> On 20/07/2021 16:22, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>>> In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20
>>>>>>>>> Jul
>>>>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of
>>>>>>>>>> commuters)
>>>>>>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with
>>>>>>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from
>>>>>>>>>> route  to route
>>>>>>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with
>>>>>>>>>> fares.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of
>>>>>>>>> day  and
>>>>>>>>> route.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>>>>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely
>>>>>>>>> prejudiced if
>>>>>>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston,
>>>>>>>> Weymouth,
>>>>>>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially
>>>>>>> significantly
>>>>>>> reduce the fare.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to
>>>>>> Scotland, the
>>>>>> entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>>>>>> trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at
>>>>>> the  beach,
>>>>>> they have closer beaches.
>>>
>>>>>  If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to
>>>>> travel  on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative
>>>>> is compulsory  reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday
>>>>> trains  from  Paddington to the West Country).
>>>>
>>>> A rather silly idea. Crowds of occasional passengers, not knowing
>>>> about the compulsory reservations, would cause chaos at stations.
>>>  Happy to hear better ideas (fwiw I agree that as a surprise at the
>>> station it might not be wildly popular, but LNER has had compulsory
>>> reservations for months now, and presumably the word has spread
>>> sufficiently).
>>
>> But LNER is not the principal operator to any of the major seaside
>> resorts.
>
> But their scheme is in effect a pilot study for other operators. It
> appears to be successful, as I've heard very little adverse comment.
>
> Especially now all the operators are Shapps-in-drag, they could follow
> LNER's example.
>

Not sure of the accuracy, but reports elsewhere suggest that LNER
abandoned compulsory reservations from 19 July. Instead, there would be
"reservations recommended".

Compulsory reservations were never a good idea where LNER was the sole
(or principal) provider for "short hop" journeys (e.g. Retford to
Doncaster, etc.)

In message
<91995002.648507790.156088.jmd.nospam-btinternet.com@news.individual.net>
, at 21:10:39 on Tue, 20 Jul 2021, Jeremy Double
<jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <sd6qi5$5ls$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:36:39 on Tue, 20 Jul
>> 2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> On 20/07/2021 16:22, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>> In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of
>>>>>>>>> commuters)
>>>>>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>>>>>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route
>>>>>>>>> to route
>>>>>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
>>>>>>>> route.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>>>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
>>>>>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston,
>>>>>>> Weymouth,
>>>>>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially significantly
>>>>>> reduce the fare.
>>>>>
>>>>> Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to
>>>>> Scotland, the
>>>>> entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>>>>> trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>>>>>
>>>>> I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at the
>>>>> beach,
>>>>> they have closer beaches.
>>
>>>> If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to
>>>> travel on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative is
>>>> compulsory reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday trains
>>>> from Paddington to the West Country).
>>>
>>> A rather silly idea. Crowds of occasional passengers, not knowing about
>>> the compulsory reservations, would cause chaos at stations.
>>
>> Happy to hear better ideas (fwiw I agree that as a surprise at the
>> station it might not be wildly popular, but LNER has had compulsory
>> reservations for months now, and presumably the word has spread
>> sufficiently).
>
>Personally, I had no idea that LNER has compulsory reservations, and it is
>my standard way of getting to London. Although having said that, I’ve only
>travelled on KWVR, Northern and TransPennine since the lockdown, and you
>can travel on all of these without reservations now.
>
>What happens if someone has an Anytime ticket and boards a compulsory
>reservations train without a reservation?

I've not travelled on such a train myself (but know people who have, and
they've not reported any issues). I did buy someone a ticket, and the
process involved making a reservation, but I could see how that might
not work at a TVM. I suspect there are station announcements and maybe
posters.

My recollection from when the scheme started was they said they'd
provide one coach of non-reserved seating and expect people who ended up
there to only occupy socially distanced seats, to try to make a seat
reservation elsewhere in the train by the next station, and the train
manager would assist.

>I’ve never tried in the UK, but
>I’ve travelled without a reservation on Thalys (reservations compulsory)
>from Aachen to Brussels after the previous DB train failed, but no-one came
>round checking tickets, so I didn’t find out what would happen in that
>case.

Mine's been checked every time on Thalys. Including the time a very
well-dressed/spoken woman on the next table, who I think had got on at
Schiphol, expressed shocked disbelief that it was her responsibility to
actually carry/present a ticket [she must have had an itinerary and seat
number though], and the gripper eventually located the booking via her
credit card (see discussions, passim, about always-on grippers).
--
Roland Perry

In message <sd91uh$ulh$1@dont-email.me>, at 12:54:58 on Wed, 21 Jul
2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:

>Not sure of the accuracy, but reports elsewhere suggest that LNER
>abandoned compulsory reservations from 19 July. Instead, there would be
>"reservations recommended".

They may have done that as a result of the Boris "Freedom Day", but
that doesn't invalidate the proposition that it's been proven to be a
workable way to reduce loadings.

--
Roland Perry

On Wed, 21 Jul 2021 10:23:12 -0000 (UTC), Sam Wilson
<ukr@dummy.wislons.fastmail.co.uk> wrote:

>Jeremy Double <jmd.nospam@btinternet.com> wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <sd6qi5$5ls$1@dont-email.me>, at 16:36:39 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>> 2021, Bevan Price <bevanprice666@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> On 20/07/2021 16:22, Roland Perry wrote:
>>>>> In message <sd6p5t$qam$1@dont-email.me>, at 15:13:01 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <sd6jb2$ep4$3@dont-email.me>, at 13:33:22 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> In message <sd660g$epa$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:45:52 on Tue, 20 Jul
>>>>>>>>> 2021, Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> IMX the peak-fare hours are currently quieter (due to lack of
>>>>>>>>>> commuters)
>>>>>>>>>> than the off-peak hours (particularly on routes popular with leisure
>>>>>>>>>> travellers). Given that the 'quieter times' will vary from route
>>>>>>>>>> to route
>>>>>>>>>> and day to day, I'm not sure how you could manage that with fares.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> You tweak the AP ticket quotas to take account of the time of day and
>>>>>>>>> route.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> XC were doing that for several years pre-Covid (to the point that
>>>>>>>>> getting an AP fare on a long distance trip was severely prejudiced if
>>>>>>>>> some sections co-incided with the local rush-hours).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Who mentioned AP? I doubt that many of those heading to Weston,
>>>>>>>> Weymouth,
>>>>>>>> Bournemouth, Paignton etc on packed trains will have booked ahead.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If they are travelling from Scotland, it would potentially significantly
>>>>>>> reduce the fare.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Although the original thread was about cross-border travel to
>>>>>> Scotland, the
>>>>>> entirety of the sub-thread quoted above has been more generally about
>>>>>> trains crowded by leisure travellers.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I doubt that anyone travels from Scotland to Weston for a day at the
>>>>>> beach,
>>>>>> they have closer beaches.
>>>
>>>>> If the problem is walk-up fares not being sufficient deterrent to
>>>>> travel on overcrowded off-peak trains, then the only alternative is
>>>>> compulsory reservations (as was once the case on busy holiday trains
>>>>> from Paddington to the West Country).
>>>>
>>>> A rather silly idea. Crowds of occasional passengers, not knowing about
>>>> the compulsory reservations, would cause chaos at stations.
>>>
>>> Happy to hear better ideas (fwiw I agree that as a surprise at the
>>> station it might not be wildly popular, but LNER has had compulsory
>>> reservations for months now, and presumably the word has spread
>>> sufficiently).
>>
>> Personally, I had no idea that LNER has compulsory reservations, and it is
>> my standard way of getting to London. Although having said that, I’ve only
>> travelled on KWVR, Northern and TransPennine since the lockdown, and you
>> can travel on all of these without reservations now.
>>
>> What happens if someone has an Anytime ticket and boards a compulsory
>> reservations train without a reservation? I’ve never tried in the UK, but
>> I’ve travelled without a reservation on Thalys (reservations compulsory)
>> from Aachen to Brussels after the previous DB train failed, but no-one came
>> round checking tickets, so I didn’t find out what would happen in that
>> case.
>
>The idea was that there was a coach reserved for people without
>reservations. If the gripper came across someone without a reservation
>they would be given an instant reservation in that coach and be asked to
>move there. I have no idea how well it worked.
>
>Sam

Then please trust said coach wouldn't be one of these in New Zealand a
few days ago!

<https://www.stuff.co.nz/auckland/local-news/125801369/services-cancelled-as-carriages-on-te-huia-train-separate-on-tracks>