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aus+uk / uk.d-i-y / Re: Electric Fire Fault

SubjectAuthor
* Electric Fire FaultRJH
+* Re: Electric Fire FaultAnimal
|`* Re: Electric Fire FaultRod Speed
| `* Re: Electric Fire FaultFredxx
|  +* Re: Electric Fire FaultJohn Walliker
|  |+* Re: Electric Fire FaultFredxx
|  ||`* Re: Electric Fire Faultcharles
|  || `- Re: Electric Fire FaultFredxx
|  |`- Re: Electric Fire FaultPaul
|  `* Re: Electric Fire FaultRod Speed
|   `* Re: Electric Fire FaultFredxx
|    `* Re: Electric Fire FaultRod Speed
|     `* Re: Electric Fire FaultFredxx
|      `* Re: Electric Fire FaultRod Speed
|       `* Re: Electric Fire FaultFredxx
|        `- Re: Electric Fire FaultRod Speed
+* Re: Electric Fire FaultPaul
|`* Re: Electric Fire FaultAnimal
| +* Re: Electric Fire FaultPaul
| |`* Re: Electric Fire FaultAnimal
| | `- Re: Electric Fire FaultJohn J
| +- Re: Electric Fire FaultRJH
| `- Re: Electric Fire Faultalan_m
`* Re: Electric Fire FaultThe Natural Philosopher
 `* Re: Electric Fire FaultRJH
  +- Re: Electric Fire FaultThe Natural Philosopher
  +- Re: Electric Fire FaultPamela
  `- Re: Electric Fire FaultAnimal

Pages:12
Re: Electric Fire Fault

<t49vs8$5po$1@dont-email.me>

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https://www.novabbs.com/aus+uk/article-flat.php?id=50285&group=uk.d-i-y#50285

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Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: fre...@spam.uk (Fredxx)
Newsgroups: uk.d-i-y
Subject: Re: Electric Fire Fault
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2022 00:39:52 +0100
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 by: Fredxx - Tue, 26 Apr 2022 23:39 UTC

On 27/04/2022 00:07, Rod Speed wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Apr 2022 08:53:28 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 26/04/2022 22:48, Rod Speed wrote:
>>> On Wed, 27 Apr 2022 07:14:01 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 26/04/2022 18:18, Rod Speed wrote:
>>>>> On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 20:03:59 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 26/04/2022 03:42, Rod Speed wrote:
>>>>>>> On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 12:08:36 +1000, Animal <tabbypurr@gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Monday, 25 April 2022 at 23:24:48 UTC+1, RJH wrote:
>>>>>>>>> I've an old school (but fairly new and lightly used, maybe 50
>>>>>>>>> hours) 2 bar
>>>>>>>>> electric fire. One of the bars failed to come on a few months
>>>>>>>>> back, and
>>>>>>>>> recently started playing up, with half a bar lit, and then
>>>>>>>>> switching off.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Anyway, the problem appears to be a loose connection - both
>>>>>>>>> bars' securing
>>>>>>>>> bolt had come loose at the same end of the element. The one
>>>>>>>>> with the
>>>>>>>>> intermittent fault unwound a good few turns. I'd assume that's
>>>>>>>>> a case of
>>>>>>>>> cleaning up the connecting pins and retightening the nuts?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I also noticed, at the other end of the elements, both holders
>>>>>>>>> have corroded
>>>>>>>>> nuts/bolts. It seems a bit odd to me that it's only at one end,
>>>>>>>>> but is this
>>>>>>>>> cause for further concern?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Pics at:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> https://www.icloud.com/sharedalbum/#B0zJRveFpJIHZzz
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hot metals are bound to oxidise.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>  Stainless steel and nichrome doesn't.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Something an ignorant art student would say.
>>>>>  We'll see...
>>>>>
>>>>>> They oxidise very quickly in air to provide an insulating layer of
>>>>>> oxide that prevents any further corrosion.
>>>>>  Mindless hair splitting.
>>>>>
>>>>>> I can assure you very few metals don't oxidise in oxygen.
>>>>>  That isn't CORROSION, fuckwit.
>>>>
>>>> Quite, and I said they didn't corrode any further.
>>>>
>>>>>> Gold is the only one I can think of.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Any schoolboy chemist would know this.
>>>>>  Only a terminal fuckwit would try claiming that
>>>>> what we see with stainless steel and nichrome
>>>>> wire is CORROSION.
>>>>
>>>> Only an idiot would read that from my post.
>>>  Your post is irrelevant and so is your mindless bullshit.
>>>
>>>> I said quite the opposite that a literate schoolboy chemist would
>>>> have known. That stainless steel and nichrome oxidise very quickly
>>>> in air to provide an insulating layer of oxide that prevents any
>>>> further corrosion.
>>>  Pity what was being discussed was the VISIBLE CORROSION
>>> in that electric fire.
>>>
>>>>> And that initial protective oxidisation doesnt require heat anyway,
>>>>> fuckwit.
>>>>
>>>> Only an illiterate would read from my post
>>>  Your post is irrelevant and so is your mindless bullshit.
>>
>> Then why reply to it?
>
> To rub your nose in that fact.
>
>> Nothing better to do?
>
> Some of us can managed to do more than one thing for hours.
>
>>>> that you have to apply heat for a metal to oxidise.
>>>  We aren't discussing oxidisation, we were discussing
>>> the VISIBLE CORROSION before you showed up and
>>> made a complete fool of yourself, as always.
>
>> Let us remind ourselves,
>
> Just how many of you are there between those ears ?
>
>> Animal said, "Hot metals are bound to oxidise"
>
> When what was being discussed was visible
> corrosion at one end of an electric fire element.
>
> <reams of your stupid shit flushed where it belongs>

Once again you've lost the argument by snipping the most important part
of my post and resorting to abuse.

>> You might not be discussing oxidation but everyone else is.
>
> Obvious lie with that last.

Re: Electric Fire Fault

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From: rod.spee...@gmail.com (Rod Speed)
Newsgroups: uk.d-i-y
Subject: Re: Electric Fire Fault
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2022 09:57:59 +1000
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 by: Rod Speed - Tue, 26 Apr 2022 23:57 UTC

On Wed, 27 Apr 2022 09:39:52 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:

> On 27/04/2022 00:07, Rod Speed wrote:
>> On Wed, 27 Apr 2022 08:53:28 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> On 26/04/2022 22:48, Rod Speed wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 27 Apr 2022 07:14:01 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 26/04/2022 18:18, Rod Speed wrote:
>>>>>> On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 20:03:59 +1000, Fredxx <fredxx@spam.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 26/04/2022 03:42, Rod Speed wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 12:08:36 +1000, Animal <tabbypurr@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Monday, 25 April 2022 at 23:24:48 UTC+1, RJH wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> I've an old school (but fairly new and lightly used, maybe 50
>>>>>>>>>> hours) 2 bar
>>>>>>>>>> electric fire. One of the bars failed to come on a few months
>>>>>>>>>> back, and
>>>>>>>>>> recently started playing up, with half a bar lit, and then
>>>>>>>>>> switching off.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Anyway, the problem appears to be a loose connection - both
>>>>>>>>>> bars' securing
>>>>>>>>>> bolt had come loose at the same end of the element. The one
>>>>>>>>>> with the
>>>>>>>>>> intermittent fault unwound a good few turns. I'd assume that's
>>>>>>>>>> a case of
>>>>>>>>>> cleaning up the connecting pins and retightening the nuts?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I also noticed, at the other end of the elements, both holders
>>>>>>>>>> have corroded
>>>>>>>>>> nuts/bolts. It seems a bit odd to me that it's only at one end,
>>>>>>>>>> but is this
>>>>>>>>>> cause for further concern?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Pics at:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> https://www.icloud.com/sharedalbum/#B0zJRveFpJIHZzz
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hot metals are bound to oxidise.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Stainless steel and nichrome doesn't.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Something an ignorant art student would say.
>>>>>> We'll see...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They oxidise very quickly in air to provide an insulating layer of
>>>>>>> oxide that prevents any further corrosion.
>>>>>> Mindless hair splitting.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I can assure you very few metals don't oxidise in oxygen.
>>>>>> That isn't CORROSION, fuckwit.
>>>>>
>>>>> Quite, and I said they didn't corrode any further.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Gold is the only one I can think of.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Any schoolboy chemist would know this.
>>>>>> Only a terminal fuckwit would try claiming that
>>>>>> what we see with stainless steel and nichrome
>>>>>> wire is CORROSION.
>>>>>
>>>>> Only an idiot would read that from my post.
>>>> Your post is irrelevant and so is your mindless bullshit.
>>>>
>>>>> I said quite the opposite that a literate schoolboy chemist would
>>>>> have known. That stainless steel and nichrome oxidise very quickly
>>>>> in air to provide an insulating layer of oxide that prevents any
>>>>> further corrosion.
>>>> Pity what was being discussed was the VISIBLE CORROSION
>>>> in that electric fire.
>>>>
>>>>>> And that initial protective oxidisation doesnt require heat anyway,
>>>>>> fuckwit.
>>>>>
>>>>> Only an illiterate would read from my post
>>>> Your post is irrelevant and so is your mindless bullshit.
>>>
>>> Then why reply to it?
>> To rub your nose in that fact.
>>
>>> Nothing better to do?
>> Some of us can managed to do more than one thing for hours.
>>
>>>>> that you have to apply heat for a metal to oxidise.
>>>> We aren't discussing oxidisation, we were discussing
>>>> the VISIBLE CORROSION before you showed up and
>>>> made a complete fool of yourself, as always.
>>
>>> Let us remind ourselves,
>> Just how many of you are there between those ears ?
>>
>>> Animal said, "Hot metals are bound to oxidise"
>> When what was being discussed was visible
>> corrosion at one end of an electric fire element.
>> <reams of your stupid shit flushed where it belongs>
>
> Once again you've lost the argument by snipping the most important part
> of my post and resorting to abuse.

Just more of your mindless bullshit and it was you that
resorted to abused right from the start, you pathetic
excuse for a bullshit artist.

What was clearly being discussed before you made a complete
fool of yourself, as you always do, was VISIBLE OXIDATION.

>>> You might not be discussing oxidation but everyone else is.
>> Obvious lie with that last.
>

Re: Electric Fire Fault

<t4amcd$9h1$1@gioia.aioe.org>

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From: nos...@needed.invalid (Paul)
Newsgroups: uk.d-i-y
Subject: Re: Electric Fire Fault
Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2022 02:03:58 -0400
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 by: Paul - Wed, 27 Apr 2022 06:03 UTC

On 4/26/2022 6:40 AM, John Walliker wrote:
> On Tuesday, 26 April 2022 at 11:04:02 UTC+1, Fredxx wrote:
>
>>>> Hot metals are bound to oxidise.
>>>
>>> Stainless steel and nichrome doesn't.
>> Something an ignorant art student would say.
>>
>> They oxidise very quickly in air to provide an insulating layer of oxide
>> that prevents any further corrosion.
>>
>> I can assure you very few metals don't oxidise in oxygen. Gold is the
>> only one I can think of.
>>
> Even gold has an oxide which is stable at room temperature but which
> decomposes at higher temperatures.
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold(III)_oxide
> John
>

https://www.quora.com/Why-doesnt-gold-corrode-How-is-it-possible-to-synthesize-gold-oxide

"Combination of both half-reactions is what is termed as a Redox
reaction, an electron transfer from a chemical species to another.

Gold “does not oxidise” according to our experience because it ranks
very high in the so-called electrochemical series (Standard electrode
potential), a list of how easy it is to oxidise chemical species.

There is a trick, though: gold can be oxidised with a common lab reagent
(Aqua regia), a 1 : 3 mixture of concentrated nitric and hydrochloric acids,
HNO₃ and HCl, respectively). The simultaneous presence of two strong oxidisers
in the mixture (nitric acid and elemental chlorine coming from HCl being
oxidised by the first one), as well as the presence of plenty of
chloride ions (Cl¯) that can keep the as-oxidised gold ions (Au³⁺) dissolved
in solution, favours the actual oxidation [in the Redox sense] of gold:

Au + HNO₃ + 4HCl ⟶ [AuCl₄]¯ + [H₃O]⁺ + NO + H₂O

What happens, practically, is the formation of Chloroauric acid
HAuCl₄ in solution."

"The gold does not go willingly"

This does not happen to gold in benign conditions.
To abuse the gold, your finger would probably
fall off before the gold would react.

I've worked with aqua regia, and you do that in a fume
hood. I was making chloroplatinic acid at the time,
which is similar to the reaction described above.
It takes two hours of boiling in aqua regia, to dissolve
a tiny piece of platinum wire.

Precious metals do react, but it takes time, and
who knows how extreme the conditions might need to be,
to make the reaction go forward.

Paul

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