On Mon, 12 Jun 2023 17:22:29 +0100, Coffee <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:

>On 12/06/2023 10:31, Recliner wrote:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <u62a5r$2c1vg$1@dont-email.me>, at 17:59:38 on Sat, 10 Jun
>>> 2023, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>> On 10/06/2023 14:41, Coffee wrote:
>>>>> On 05/06/2023 10:02, Recliner wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> Virgin puts power of its brand to the test in High Court dispute
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/1cb4ae6e-02d4-11ee-9bf2-8ca4db35d92
>>>>>> 8?shareToken=50481fe4f4b965f8bc7b44a6657600b6
>>>
>>>>> In my view the Virgin brand has a negative value.
>>>>
>>>> You are in a minority
>>>
>>> Just so you know [tm] I'm not so sure. NTL was always a pretty terrible
>>> telco, and being rebranded Virgin didn't help much. They still keep
>>> mailing me saying if I swap to them I'll save about twice as much as I'm
>>> currently paying (how does that work?)
>>>
>>> Most of the former advantages of Virgin Mobile have now rotted away.
>>
>> Does it even exist any more? My Virgin Mobile account morphed into an O2
>> account. I didn't have to do anything, and the SIM is unchanged, but now
>> get twice as much data and free data roaming in several more countries.
>>
>>>
>>> Virgin Express was one of the worst airlines I've ever flown on, even
>>> managing to trump 'Such A Bad Experience, Never Again'.
>>
>> That dates you: those two Belgian airline brands disappeared in 2007 and
>> 2001, respectively. Don't you have any modern era airline reminiscences?
>>
>One bitten twice shy.
>
>It's a lot easier to lose a reputation than to gain it.
>
>I will only use easyjet again as a result of my experience a year ago.
>363 days to be precise.

Experience with whom? Presumably some other low cost airline? There's plenty to choose from, and most don't deliver a
particularly positive passenger experience.

I don't use any of them, but gather that Wizz Air is the bottom of the barrel, while Jet2 has fairly happy customers.

On 13/06/2023 12:13, Recliner wrote:
> On Mon, 12 Jun 2023 17:22:29 +0100, Coffee <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 12/06/2023 10:31, Recliner wrote:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <u62a5r$2c1vg$1@dont-email.me>, at 17:59:38 on Sat, 10 Jun
>>>> 2023, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>> On 10/06/2023 14:41, Coffee wrote:
>>>>>> On 05/06/2023 10:02, Recliner wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>> Virgin puts power of its brand to the test in High Court dispute
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/1cb4ae6e-02d4-11ee-9bf2-8ca4db35d92
>>>>>>> 8?shareToken=50481fe4f4b965f8bc7b44a6657600b6
>>>>
>>>>>> In my view the Virgin brand has a negative value.
>>>>>
>>>>> You are in a minority
>>>>
>>>> Just so you know [tm] I'm not so sure. NTL was always a pretty terrible
>>>> telco, and being rebranded Virgin didn't help much. They still keep
>>>> mailing me saying if I swap to them I'll save about twice as much as I'm
>>>> currently paying (how does that work?)
>>>>
>>>> Most of the former advantages of Virgin Mobile have now rotted away.
>>>
>>> Does it even exist any more? My Virgin Mobile account morphed into an O2
>>> account. I didn't have to do anything, and the SIM is unchanged, but now
>>> get twice as much data and free data roaming in several more countries.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Virgin Express was one of the worst airlines I've ever flown on, even
>>>> managing to trump 'Such A Bad Experience, Never Again'.
>>>
>>> That dates you: those two Belgian airline brands disappeared in 2007 and
>>> 2001, respectively. Don't you have any modern era airline reminiscences?
>>>
>> One bitten twice shy.
>>
>> It's a lot easier to lose a reputation than to gain it.
>>
>> I will only use easyjet again as a result of my experience a year ago.
>> 363 days to be precise.
>
> Experience with whom? Presumably some other low cost airline? There's plenty to choose from, and most don't deliver a
> particularly positive passenger experience.
>
> I don't use any of them, but gather that Wizz Air is the bottom of the barrel, while Jet2 has fairly happy customers.

I'm travelling from Gatwick (unfortunately) to Turkey again in
September. Outbound British Airways and inbound Avion Express who I've
not heard of but they cannot be worse than easyjet.

On Tue, 13 Jun 2023 13:29:31 +0100, Coffee <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:

>On 13/06/2023 12:13, Recliner wrote:
>> On Mon, 12 Jun 2023 17:22:29 +0100, Coffee <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> On 12/06/2023 10:31, Recliner wrote:
>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <u62a5r$2c1vg$1@dont-email.me>, at 17:59:38 on Sat, 10 Jun
>>>>> 2023, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>> On 10/06/2023 14:41, Coffee wrote:
>>>>>>> On 05/06/2023 10:02, Recliner wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Virgin puts power of its brand to the test in High Court dispute
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/1cb4ae6e-02d4-11ee-9bf2-8ca4db35d92
>>>>>>>> 8?shareToken=50481fe4f4b965f8bc7b44a6657600b6
>>>>>
>>>>>>> In my view the Virgin brand has a negative value.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You are in a minority
>>>>>
>>>>> Just so you know [tm] I'm not so sure. NTL was always a pretty terrible
>>>>> telco, and being rebranded Virgin didn't help much. They still keep
>>>>> mailing me saying if I swap to them I'll save about twice as much as I'm
>>>>> currently paying (how does that work?)
>>>>>
>>>>> Most of the former advantages of Virgin Mobile have now rotted away.
>>>>
>>>> Does it even exist any more? My Virgin Mobile account morphed into an O2
>>>> account. I didn't have to do anything, and the SIM is unchanged, but now
>>>> get twice as much data and free data roaming in several more countries.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Virgin Express was one of the worst airlines I've ever flown on, even
>>>>> managing to trump 'Such A Bad Experience, Never Again'.
>>>>
>>>> That dates you: those two Belgian airline brands disappeared in 2007 and
>>>> 2001, respectively. Don't you have any modern era airline reminiscences?
>>>>
>>> One bitten twice shy.
>>>
>>> It's a lot easier to lose a reputation than to gain it.
>>>
>>> I will only use easyjet again as a result of my experience a year ago.
>>> 363 days to be precise.
>>
>> Experience with whom? Presumably some other low cost airline? There's plenty to choose from, and most don't deliver a
>> particularly positive passenger experience.
>>
>> I don't use any of them, but gather that Wizz Air is the bottom of the barrel, while Jet2 has fairly happy customers.
>
>I'm travelling from Gatwick (unfortunately) to Turkey again in
>September. Outbound British Airways and inbound Avion Express who I've
>not heard of but they cannot be worse than easyjet.

I thought you said you strongly preferred easyJet ("I will only use easyjet again as a result of my experience")?

No, I'd not heard of Avion Express either. It seems it's Lithuanian. And, curiously, BA has leased two of its A320s for
the Gatwick operation this summer:
https://aviationsourcenews.com/airline/british-airways-outlines-leased-avion-express-a320-plans-for-summer-2023/

So, even your BA flight might be on one of those birds, but I don't suppose you'd notice (I certainly would).

Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 12 Jun 2023 17:22:29 +0100, Coffee <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 12/06/2023 10:31, Recliner wrote:
>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <u62a5r$2c1vg$1@dont-email.me>, at 17:59:38 on Sat, 10 Jun
>>>> 2023, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>> On 10/06/2023 14:41, Coffee wrote:
>>>>>> On 05/06/2023 10:02, Recliner wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>> Virgin puts power of its brand to the test in High Court dispute
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/1cb4ae6e-02d4-11ee-9bf2-8ca4db35d92
>>>>>>> 8?shareToken=50481fe4f4b965f8bc7b44a6657600b6
>>>>
>>>>>> In my view the Virgin brand has a negative value.
>>>>>
>>>>> You are in a minority
>>>>
>>>> Just so you know [tm] I'm not so sure. NTL was always a pretty terrible
>>>> telco, and being rebranded Virgin didn't help much. They still keep
>>>> mailing me saying if I swap to them I'll save about twice as much as I'm
>>>> currently paying (how does that work?)
>>>>
>>>> Most of the former advantages of Virgin Mobile have now rotted away.
>>>
>>> Does it even exist any more? My Virgin Mobile account morphed into an O2
>>> account. I didn't have to do anything, and the SIM is unchanged, but now
>>> get twice as much data and free data roaming in several more countries.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Virgin Express was one of the worst airlines I've ever flown on, even
>>>> managing to trump 'Such A Bad Experience, Never Again'.
>>>
>>> That dates you: those two Belgian airline brands disappeared in 2007 and
>>> 2001, respectively. Don't you have any modern era airline reminiscences?
>>>
>> One bitten twice shy.
>>
>> It's a lot easier to lose a reputation than to gain it.
>>
>> I will only use easyjet again as a result of my experience a year ago.
>> 363 days to be precise.
>
> Experience with whom? Presumably some other low cost airline? There's
> plenty to choose from, and most don't deliver a
> particularly positive passenger experience.
>
> I don't use any of them, but gather that Wizz Air is the bottom of the
> barrel, while Jet2 has fairly happy customers.
>

Oddly enough I’ve never had anything but excellent service from Wizz. Used
them to Budapest and Warsaw. I’ve no issue with EasyJet, who I use
reasonably regularly between Birmingham and Glasgow. The key to low cost
airlines is to pay extra for speedy boarding and a larger cabin bag. Jet2
are very good but their fares are higher. Part of their success is
employing their own ground handling staff in many locations. Jet2 excelled
when our flight to Madeira couldn’t land because of high winds. We diverted
to the Canaries and were bussed to hotels and fed and then picked up the
following day for another go. EasyJet apparently abandoned their passengers
to a night on the airport floor. I think many of the recent complaints
stemmed from the airlines being very foot dragging in refunding flights
cancelled because of covid. The key to that is to pay using Amex. They
refunded my cancelled EasyJet flight without a fuss, so no interaction with
EJ at all for the refund.