Hogwarts Express steam train cancelled over safety issues

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-66271357

MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:
> Hogwarts Express steam train cancelled over safety issues
>
>
> https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-66271357
>

So just the usual issues with Mk 1 stock. I think the 'central locking' is
just manual door bolts that only stewards are supposed to operate, but
there's nothing to stop passengers doing so. And the doors will still have
drop lights, of course.

On 21/07/2023 20:15, Recliner wrote:
> MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:
>> Hogwarts Express steam train cancelled over safety issues
>>
>>
>> https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-66271357
>>
>
> So just the usual issues with Mk 1 stock. I think the 'central locking' is
> just manual door bolts that only stewards are supposed to operate, but
> there's nothing to stop passengers doing so. And the doors will still have
> drop lights, of course.
>

I have a horrible feeling this may affect some other Mk 1 charter stock
owners.

Coffee <martin.coffee@round-midnight.org.uk> wrote:
> On 21/07/2023 20:15, Recliner wrote:
>> MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:
>>> Hogwarts Express steam train cancelled over safety issues
>>>
>>>
>>> https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-66271357
>>>
>>
>> So just the usual issues with Mk 1 stock. I think the 'central locking' is
>> just manual door bolts that only stewards are supposed to operate, but
>> there's nothing to stop passengers doing so. And the doors will still have
>> drop lights, of course.
>>
>
> I have a horrible feeling this may affect some other Mk 1 charter stock
> owners.
>

Yes, quite likely.

On normal UK Mk 1 charter trains, strict instructions are given not to
stick any body parts out of drop lights when the train is moving, nor to
unlock doors. But those rules are apparently not rigorously followed on
the Jacobite, most of whose passengers won't be aware of these
requirements.

On Fri, 21 Jul 2023 19:15:03 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
<recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:

>MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:
>> Hogwarts Express steam train cancelled over safety issues
>>
>> https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-66271357
>
>So just the usual issues with Mk 1 stock. I think the 'central locking' is
>just manual door bolts that only stewards are supposed to operate, but
>there's nothing to stop passengers doing so. And the doors will still have
>drop lights, of course.

I *thought* I saw electric locking once, but I could be mistaken.
Maybe I am thinking about HSTs.

Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> On Fri, 21 Jul 2023 19:15:03 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:
>>> Hogwarts Express steam train cancelled over safety issues
>>>
>>> https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-66271357
>>
>> So just the usual issues with Mk 1 stock. I think the 'central locking' is
>> just manual door bolts that only stewards are supposed to operate, but
>> there's nothing to stop passengers doing so. And the doors will still have
>> drop lights, of course.
>
> I *thought* I saw electric locking once, but I could be mistaken.
> Maybe I am thinking about HSTs.

Yes, HSTs have genuine central locking. So do updated charter Mk 2 trains
(along with retention toilets). I suppose it would be possible for Mk 1s to
have electric central locking, but I don't think WCR has fitted it to its
Mk 1s.

On Sat, 22 Jul 2023 08:55:43 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
<recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:

>On normal UK Mk 1 charter trains, strict instructions are given not to
>stick any body parts out of drop lights when the train is moving, nor to
>unlock doors. But those rules are apparently not rigorously followed on
>the Jacobite, most of whose passengers won't be aware of these
>requirements.

There's been a bit about this in the monthly railway mags. The ORR has
goven the charter operators notice to fit central door locking to
Mk1s. Locomotive Services Ltd, Jeremy Hosking's company, has complied
but West Coast (Carnforth), which operates the Fort William steam
services, hasn't, and has so far obtained two three-months extentions
to comply.
Because it has spent, from memory, £600,000 to comply, Loco Services
has increased its charges to recoup it but is seeking a judicial
review claiming unfair trading by West Coast because West Coast's
charges haven't been increased, allowing it to undercut Loco Services.
That's my summary of the situation, made without reference to sources.

Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam> wrote:
> On Sat, 22 Jul 2023 08:55:43 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>> On normal UK Mk 1 charter trains, strict instructions are given not to
>> stick any body parts out of drop lights when the train is moving, nor to
>> unlock doors. But those rules are apparently not rigorously followed on
>> the Jacobite, most of whose passengers won't be aware of these
>> requirements.
>
> There's been a bit about this in the monthly railway mags. The ORR has
> goven the charter operators notice to fit central door locking to
> Mk1s. Locomotive Services Ltd, Jeremy Hosking's company, has complied
> but West Coast (Carnforth), which operates the Fort William steam
> services, hasn't, and has so far obtained two three-months extentions
> to comply.
> Because it has spent, from memory, £600,000 to comply, Loco Services
> has increased its charges to recoup it but is seeking a judicial
> review claiming unfair trading by West Coast because West Coast's
> charges haven't been increased, allowing it to undercut Loco Services.
> That's my summary of the situation, made without reference to sources.
>

Thanks for the details, which sound about right. Smithy only spends money
when he absolutely has to!

Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> On Fri, 21 Jul 2023 19:15:03 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:
>>> Hogwarts Express steam train cancelled over safety issues
>>>
>>> https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-66271357
>>
>> So just the usual issues with Mk 1 stock. I think the 'central locking' is
>> just manual door bolts that only stewards are supposed to operate, but
>> there's nothing to stop passengers doing so. And the doors will still have
>> drop lights, of course.
>
> I *thought* I saw electric locking once, but I could be mistaken.
> Maybe I am thinking about HSTs.
>

CDL on Mk1s: SWT's two slam door units which served the Lymington branch
for several years after the withdrawal of their classmates had magnetic
CDL, as did TfW and Chiltern's bubble car DMUs (and now Swanage's DMU). I
think that the same system is used on the Hastings DMU?

Perhaps this system could be extended to other mainline Mk1s (CDL for Mk2s
being a known quantity already). This does of course come with additional
operational requirements, such as not releasing unplatformed doors; again a
known thing (eg fGW slam-door HST CDL), but with restrictions - for example
you have a choice of releasing doors ahead or behind the control panel
being used (or all doors released), but not, for example, to open only
doors on certain coaches in the middle of the train.

Anna Noyd-Dryver

Anna Noyd-Dryver <anna@noyd-dryver.com> wrote:
> Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>> On Fri, 21 Jul 2023 19:15:03 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
>> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:
>>>> Hogwarts Express steam train cancelled over safety issues
>>>>

>> I *thought* I saw electric locking once, but I could be mistaken.
>> Maybe I am thinking about HSTs.
>>
>
> (and now Swanage's DMU).
>
Travelled on that a few weeks ago, the locking and unlocking of the doors
is accompanied by one of the most annoying alert sounds I have ever come
across ,a WW2 air raid siren* sounds more congenial . The buzzer and volume
used is more like a home made lash up I would expect on the desk
of a cheap tyre and exhaust fitters arranged so they can hear over the din
of the workshop.

* I once had the sound of the Carter hand version as a ringtone but it
caused an incident when it when of in an inappropriate place and a couple
of people exclaiming “ What flaming alert is that we haven’t heard before”.

GH

Peter Johnson <peter@parksidewood.nospam> wrote:
> On Sat, 22 Jul 2023 08:55:43 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
> <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>> On normal UK Mk 1 charter trains, strict instructions are given not to
>> stick any body parts out of drop lights when the train is moving, nor to
>> unlock doors. But those rules are apparently not rigorously followed on
>> the Jacobite, most of whose passengers won't be aware of these
>> requirements.
>
> There's been a bit about this in the monthly railway mags. The ORR has
> goven the charter operators notice to fit central door locking to
> Mk1s. Locomotive Services Ltd, Jeremy Hosking's company, has complied
> but West Coast (Carnforth), which operates the Fort William steam
> services, hasn't, and has so far obtained two three-months extentions
> to comply.
> Because it has spent, from memory, £600,000 to comply, Loco Services
> has increased its charges to recoup it but is seeking a judicial
> review claiming unfair trading by West Coast because West Coast's
> charges haven't been increased, allowing it to undercut Loco Services.
> That's my summary of the situation, made without reference to sources.
>

Apparently WCRC has received another three months exemption, so the
Jacobite can return for the rest of this season.

On 21/07/2023 18:51, MB wrote:
> Hogwarts Express steam train cancelled over safety issues
> https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-66271357

BBC News

Hogwarts Express steam train can return to service

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-66441796