All mine were so old they were inherited.

I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.

I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.

When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
The steel is rubbish".

But for £6 it seemed good value for money.
My dad wold have sniffed though. If it wasn't Sheffield Steel he
wouldn't have touched it.

Truthfully, I hate the throw awy culture. I try and fix everything.

--
Mint 20.3, kernel 5.4.0-124-generic, Cinnamon 5.2.7
running on an AMD Phenom II X4 Black edition processor with 16GB of
DRAM.

pinnerite <pinnerite@gmail.com> wrote:
> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>
> I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>
> I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>
> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
> The steel is rubbish".
>
> But for £6 it seemed good value for money.
> My dad wold have sniffed though. If it wasn't Sheffield Steel he
> wouldn't have touched it.
>
> Truthfully, I hate the throw awy culture. I try and fix everything.
>
>

Cheer yourself up by watching someone painstakingly restoring something
most would regard as “junk”. https://youtu.be/EVShbpzeh0E

To be honest, I think he only did it to show off. ;-)

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>
> I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>
> I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>
> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
> The steel is rubbish".

Would you know how to re-sharpen it if you wanted to? If not, why is
that a problem?

> But for £6 it seemed good value for money.
> My dad wold have sniffed though. If it wasn't Sheffield Steel he
> wouldn't have touched it.
>
> Truthfully, I hate the throw awy culture. I try and fix everything.
>
>

--
Colin Bignell

On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>
> I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>
> I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>
> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.

Possibly true but I bet your builder doesn't sharpen saws and uses the
same type.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 02/11/2022 22:53, alan_m wrote:
> On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
>> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>>
>> I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>>
>> I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
>> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>>
>> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
>> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
>
> Possibly true but I bet your builder doesn't sharpen saws and uses the
> same type.
>
>
All my builders bought cheap saws and threw them away after a couple of
weeks. Way cheaper than resharpening them.

Of course they can be resharpened, but they tend to me made of softer
steel with a hardened edge, and once that goes they don't last.

--
Climate Change: Socialism wearing a lab coat.

On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>
> I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>
> I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>
> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
> The steel is rubbish".
>
> But for £6 it seemed good value for money.
> My dad wold have sniffed though. If it wasn't Sheffield Steel he
> wouldn't have touched it.
>
> Truthfully, I hate the throw awy culture. I try and fix everything.
>
>

Probably a 'hard point' with induction hardened teeth.
Mine is probably 30 years old & still going strong.
I class it as a 'roughing' saw for cuts that don't have to be accurate
or might have nails in or to take to a job in the car.

--
Regards
wasbit

On 03/11/2022 09:46, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 02/11/2022 22:53, alan_m wrote:
>> On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
>>> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>>>
>>> I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>>>
>>> I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
>>> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>>>
>>> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
>>> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
>>
>> Possibly true but I bet your builder doesn't sharpen saws and uses the
>> same type.
>>
>>
> All my builders bought cheap saws and threw them away after a couple of
> weeks. Way cheaper than resharpening them.
>
> Of course they can be resharpened, but they tend to me made of softer
> steel with a hardened edge, and once that goes they don't last.
>

With many you can see the very narrow hardened edge as it is discoloured
- probably edge hardened using some very fast induction heating process.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

In message <jsganjF1kifU1@mid.individual.net>, alan_m
<junk@admac.myzen.co.uk> writes
>On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
>> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>> I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>> I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this
>>morning.
>> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
>> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
>
>Possibly true but I bet your builder doesn't sharpen saws and uses the
>same type.

And downgrades them for insulation cutting. I suspect modern saw steel
is too hard for conventional filing anyway.
>
>

--
Tim Lamb

On 03/11/2022 10:14, Tim Lamb wrote:
> In message <jsganjF1kifU1@mid.individual.net>, alan_m
> <junk@admac.myzen.co.uk> writes
>> On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
>>> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>>>  I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>>>  I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
>>> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>>>  When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
>>> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
>>
>> Possibly true but I bet your builder doesn't sharpen saws and uses the
>> same type.
>
> And downgrades them for insulation cutting. I suspect modern saw steel
> is too hard for conventional filing anyway.
>>
>>
>
I think its the other way around. The steel is soft with a hardened
edge. Once that has gone, the saw is effectively junk

--
It is the folly of too many to mistake the echo of a London coffee-house
for the voice of the kingdom.

Jonathan Swift

On 03/11/2022 09:58, alan_m wrote:
> On 03/11/2022 09:46, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 02/11/2022 22:53, alan_m wrote:
>>> On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
>>>> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>>>>
>>>> I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>>>>
>>>> I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
>>>> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>>>>
>>>> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
>>>> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
>>>
>>> Possibly true but I bet your builder doesn't sharpen saws and uses
>>> the same type.
>>>
>>>
>> All my builders bought cheap saws and threw them away after a couple
>> of weeks. Way cheaper than resharpening them.
>>
>> Of course they can be resharpened, but they tend to me made of softer
>> steel with a hardened edge, and once that goes they don't last.
>>
>
> With many you can see the very narrow hardened edge as it is discoloured
> - probably edge hardened using some very fast induction heating process.
>

I see them described as hardpoint saws.

In message <tk04f0$1e7sc$19@dont-email.me>, The Natural Philosopher
<tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
>On 03/11/2022 10:14, Tim Lamb wrote:
>> In message <jsganjF1kifU1@mid.individual.net>, alan_m
>><junk@admac.myzen.co.uk> writes
>>> On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
>>>> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>>>>  I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>>>>  I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
>>>> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>>>>  When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
>>>> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
>>>
>>> Possibly true but I bet your builder doesn't sharpen saws and uses
>>>the same type.
>> And downgrades them for insulation cutting. I suspect modern saw
>>steel is too hard for conventional filing anyway.
>>>
>>>
>>
>I think its the other way around. The steel is soft with a hardened
>edge. Once that has gone, the saw is effectively junk

Yes. However the steel must first be suitable for induction hardening. I
am not a metallurgist but you can't harden mild steel without adding
carbon in some form.
>

--
Tim Lamb

On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:

> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>
> I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>
> I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>
> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
> The steel is rubbish".

This is partly true. The teeth will be induction hardened and could not
easily be resharpened with a conventional file anyway. So when it blunts
it is in effect disposable.

However it will retain its edge for significantly longer than a
traditional saw. It will probably cut faster, and also not be instantly
blunted when cutting things like melamine faced board, chipboard, OSB etc.

> But for £6 it seemed good value for money.
> My dad wold have sniffed though. If it wasn't Sheffield Steel he
> wouldn't have touched it.
>
> Truthfully, I hate the throw awy culture. I try and fix everything.
Yup I sympathise, although doing a good job of sharpening a saw is a
fairly slow process, and time is now no longer cheap. So often it is
more cost effective and more productive, to buy a box of saws at the
start of a large project - and just swap to a sharp one as the existing
becomes too slow. The better "blunt" ones can serve as insulation saws etc.

--
Cheers,

John.

/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\=================================================================/

On 03/11/2022 10:14, Tim Lamb wrote:
> In message <jsganjF1kifU1@mid.individual.net>, alan_m
> <junk@admac.myzen.co.uk> writes
>> On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
>>> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>>>  I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>>>  I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
>>> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>>>  When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
>>> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
>>
>> Possibly true but I bet your builder doesn't sharpen saws and uses the
>> same type.
>
> And downgrades them for insulation cutting. I suspect modern saw steel
> is too hard for conventional filing anyway.

A triangular diamond faced needle file works on hardened teeth. The main
problem is that you can't reset the teeth after sharpening.

--
Colin Bignell

On 03/11/2022 10:44, Tim Lamb wrote:
> In message <tk04f0$1e7sc$19@dont-email.me>, The Natural Philosopher
> <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes
>> On 03/11/2022 10:14, Tim Lamb wrote:
>>> In message <jsganjF1kifU1@mid.individual.net>, alan_m
>>> <junk@admac.myzen.co.uk> writes
>>>> On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
>>>>> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>>>>>  I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>>>>>  I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
>>>>> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>>>>>  When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
>>>>> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen
>>>>> them.
>>>>
>>>> Possibly true but I bet your builder doesn't sharpen saws and uses
>>>> the  same type.
>>>  And downgrades them for insulation cutting. I suspect modern saw
>>> steel  is too hard for conventional filing anyway.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> I think its the other way around. The steel is soft with a hardened
>> edge. Once that has gone, the saw is effectively junk
>
> Yes. However the steel must first be suitable for induction hardening. I
> am not a metallurgist but you can't harden mild steel without adding
> carbon in some form.

Not very hard to do...

https://technologystudent.com/equip1/heat2.htm

>>
>

--
"Nature does not give up the winter because people dislike the cold."

― Confucius

On Thu, 3 Nov 2022 09:46:27 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> On 02/11/2022 22:53, alan_m wrote:
>> On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
>>> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>>>
>>> I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>>>
>>> I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
>>> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>>>
>>> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
>>> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
>>
>> Possibly true but I bet your builder doesn't sharpen saws and uses the
>> same type.
>>
> All my builders bought cheap saws and threw them away after a couple of
> weeks. Way cheaper than resharpening them.
>
> Of course they can be resharpened, but they tend to me made of softer
> steel with a hardened edge, and once that goes they don't last.

I have sharpened a hard-point saw but I didn't dare to try to re-set it in
case the points sanpped off.
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

On 03/11/2022 17:25, PeterC wrote:
> On Thu, 3 Nov 2022 09:46:27 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>> On 02/11/2022 22:53, alan_m wrote:
>>> On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
>>>> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>>>>
>>>> I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>>>>
>>>> I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
>>>> It cost under £6 and did the job perfectly.
>>>>
>>>> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
>>>> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
>>>
>>> Possibly true but I bet your builder doesn't sharpen saws and uses the
>>> same type.
>>>
>> All my builders bought cheap saws and threw them away after a couple of
>> weeks. Way cheaper than resharpening them.
>>
>> Of course they can be resharpened, but they tend to me made of softer
>> steel with a hardened edge, and once that goes they don't last.
>
> I have sharpened a hard-point saw but I didn't dare to try to re-set it in
> case the points sanpped off.

I found the resetting tool simply wouldn't do anything.

--
Colin Bignell

Another thing that sounded good was a Spear and Jackson tenon saw which was
Teflon coated.
However after a surprisingly short time the Teflon wore off in the area of
highest friction, leaving the blade to start to go rusty. Not a fan of the
plastic handle either.
Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"John Rumm" <see.my.signature@nowhere.null> wrote in message
news:tk08g5$1erln$1@dont-email.me...
> On 02/11/2022 21:28, pinnerite wrote:
>
>> All mine were so old they were inherited.
>>
>> I needed to cut several inches off a plywood box.
>>
>> I took a chance and bought a 15tpi 14" saw from Toolfix this morning.
>> It cost under �6 and did the job perfectly.
>>
>> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
>> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
>> The steel is rubbish".
>
> This is partly true. The teeth will be induction hardened and could not
> easily be resharpened with a conventional file anyway. So when it blunts
> it is in effect disposable.
>
> However it will retain its edge for significantly longer than a
> traditional saw. It will probably cut faster, and also not be instantly
> blunted when cutting things like melamine faced board, chipboard, OSB etc.
>
>> But for �6 it seemed good value for money.
>> My dad wold have sniffed though. If it wasn't Sheffield Steel he
>> wouldn't have touched it.
>>
>> Truthfully, I hate the throw awy culture. I try and fix everything.
> Yup I sympathise, although doing a good job of sharpening a saw is a
> fairly slow process, and time is now no longer cheap. So often it is more
> cost effective and more productive, to buy a box of saws at the start of a
> large project - and just swap to a sharp one as the existing becomes too
> slow. The better "blunt" ones can serve as insulation saws etc.
>
>
> --
> Cheers,
>
> John.
>
> /=================================================================\
> | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
> |-----------------------------------------------------------------|
> | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
> \=================================================================/
>

In article <20221102212809.f32c6302aa06461fb546e1c2@gmail.com>,
pinnerite <pinnerite@gmail.com> wrote:
> When I proudly showed my decorator/ builder currently transformng my
> cave, he laughed and said "They are cheap but you can't resharpen them.
> The steel is rubbish".

Likely because it has hardened teeth. So will stay sharp for a lot longer
than one designed to be re-sharpened. No matter how 'fine' that steel may
be.

--
*Why is it that to stop Windows 95, you have to click on "Start"?

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.