Went to put my stuff in my Kappa top box after work yesterday and was
rather alarmed to find it came off the top plate as I locked it.
Thinking I'd just clumsily pressed the release button by accident I
reseated and relocked it. I could still pull it off without much effort.
That made for a rather stressfull ride home, constantly checking my
mirrors to see if it was still there.
Examining it in daylight today I was rather puzzled by what the problem
might be - lock and latch were all working as expected.
After some back-and-forth wobbling of the box I realised what the cause
is: the two locking pegs/slots at the other end of the box have worn
enough to allow the box to pop off. What's odd is that I seldom take the
box off, only for MoTs and repairs, so it's not like I've worn the
mountings out. The box is 18 years old so I can only presume that all
those years of slight shaking on the road have worn away the slots in
the base of the box.
I'm now wondering how to repair this. As the box is polypropylene (or
something similar) any filling is going to be a challenge. Obviously I
could just drill a couple of holes through the base of the box and bolt
it to the mounting plate but I'd welcome any other suggestions.
The box is a K960 I think and the mounting plate has the same
arrangement as this:
https://www.sportsbikeshop.co.uk/motorcycle_parts/content_prod/238711
--
Sig's sig

sig <sig@sig.com> wrote in news:0NydnT4IApzZabz_nZ2dnUU7-
KnNnZ2d@brightview.co.uk:

> The box is 18 years old so I can only presume that all

buy a new one you tight git!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360984552611

On Friday, 4 March 2022 at 14:45:00 UTC, wessie wrote:
> sig <s...@sig.com> wrote in news:0NydnT4IApzZabz_nZ2dnUU7-
> KnN...@brightview.co.uk:
> > The box is 18 years old so I can only presume that all
> buy a new one you tight git!
>
> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360984552611

I'm in favour of the 'make do and mend' approach increasingly and
it isn't (necessarily) about being tight fisted. Not sure if black plastic
top boxes can be easily recycled.

Suspect I'd just bolt the fucker down to the rack. I don't think I have
ever removed the top box from a bike for any reason (apart from
to fit another one).

Stephen Packer <stephen.packer@gmail.com> wrote in
news:a9ff7795-9c13-4c7c-9110-9d4ab9292de1n@googlegroups.com:

> On Friday, 4 March 2022 at 14:45:00 UTC, wessie wrote:
>> sig <s...@sig.com> wrote in news:0NydnT4IApzZabz_nZ2dnUU7-
>> KnN...@brightview.co.uk:
>> > The box is 18 years old so I can only presume that all
>> buy a new one you tight git!
>>
>> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360984552611
>
> I'm in favour of the 'make do and mend' approach increasingly and
> it isn't (necessarily) about being tight fisted. Not sure if black
> plastic top boxes can be easily recycled.
>

They are quite useful, under bed, storage boxes. I have an old E35 box that
is a bit small for general use as it does not take my helmet. It is now my
map library. [1]

> Suspect I'd just bolt the fucker down to the rack. I don't think I
> have ever removed the top box from a bike for any reason (apart from
> to fit another one).
>

I just removed my Givi E45 from the RS to wash it, as it had developed
quite a crust of crud from riding past quarries on the road to Stow on the
Wold. I think my bike might be a few kilos lighter after its bath this
afternoon.

[1] I still use maps, especially the 1:200000 Michelin jobs. They are still
the best way to plan daytrips from a holiday base in France or Spain prior
to banging the route into the Garmin.

On 04/03/2022 23:06 Stephen Packer penned these words:
> On Friday, 4 March 2022 at 14:45:00 UTC, wessie wrote:
>> sig <s...@sig.com> wrote in news:0NydnT4IApzZabz_nZ2dnUU7-
>> KnN...@brightview.co.uk:
>>> The box is 18 years old so I can only presume that all
>> buy a new one you tight git!
>>
>> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360984552611
>
> I'm in favour of the 'make do and mend' approach increasingly and
> it isn't (necessarily) about being tight fisted. Not sure if black plastic
> top boxes can be easily recycled.
>
> Suspect I'd just bolt the fucker down to the rack. I don't think I have
> ever removed the top box from a bike for any reason (apart from
> to fit another one).

Yeah. The PO of my bike stuck silicon under the top box because it rattled, it
still rattles on speed bumps/rough surfaces, might rattle on the highway too but
then I'll have a full face on and ear plugs in.

--
Ian

"Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of
the last priest"

On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:48:04 -0000 (UTC), wessie
<willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:

>[1] I still use maps, especially the 1:200000 Michelin jobs. They are still
>the best way to plan daytrips from a holiday base in France or Spain prior
>to banging the route into the Garmin.

I approve this message
--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old

Boots wrote:

> On 04/03/2022 23:06 Stephen Packer penned these words:
> > On Friday, 4 March 2022 at 14:45:00 UTC, wessie wrote:
> >> sig <s...@sig.com> wrote in news:0NydnT4IApzZabz_nZ2dnUU7-
> >> KnN...@brightview.co.uk:
> >>> The box is 18 years old so I can only presume that all
> >> buy a new one you tight git!
> > >
> >> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360984552611
> >
> > I'm in favour of the 'make do and mend' approach increasingly and
> > it isn't (necessarily) about being tight fisted. Not sure if black
> > plastic top boxes can be easily recycled.
> >
> > Suspect I'd just bolt the fucker down to the rack. I don't think I
> > have ever removed the top box from a bike for any reason (apart from
> > to fit another one).
>
> Yeah. The PO of my bike stuck silicon under the top box because it
> rattled, it still rattles on speed bumps/rough surfaces, might rattle
> on the highway too but then I'll have a full face on and ear plugs in.

Never under estimate the ability of a rattling object to saw its way
through its nearest neighbour and for some obscure reason it is usually
the softer item which saws through the harder one.
I think "bolt the fucker down" would be the only realistic way to keep
using this topbox. Any other 'fixing' of the latches etc is going to
end in you being overtaken by said box when braking enthusiastically
for a roundabout or somesuch.
OTOH I just bought a nice GIVI E300 for about €70 including base plate
and fittings.It opens and shuts much better than the chinese copy it
replaced and doesn't leak or rattle.

--
Geoff
Honda NTV650

On Sat, 05 Mar 2022 10:28:29 +0000, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:

>On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:48:04 -0000 (UTC), wessie
><willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:
>
>>[1] I still use maps, especially the 1:200000 Michelin jobs. They are still
>>the best way to plan daytrips from a holiday base in France or Spain prior
>>to banging the route into the Garmin.
>
>I approve this message

For proper old school though, it's best without any GPS. Memorise the
shape of the map, where you want to get to and a preferred route, then
take any accidental detours as part of the adventure.

--
Ace
http://www.chaletbeauroc.com/

Ace <Ace@ch.com> wrote in
news:g6v62h9qm8nsc0d1v08j74k8qmaiqr78k2@4ax.com:

> On Sat, 05 Mar 2022 10:28:29 +0000, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:48:04 -0000 (UTC), wessie
>><willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:
>>
>>>[1] I still use maps, especially the 1:200000 Michelin jobs. They are
>>>still the best way to plan daytrips from a holiday base in France or
>>>Spain prior to banging the route into the Garmin.
>>
>>I approve this message
>
> For proper old school though, it's best without any GPS. Memorise the
> shape of the map, where you want to get to and a preferred route, then
> take any accidental detours as part of the adventure.
>
>

I still do that. Especially on said daytrips from a base. I very rarely use
a satnav in the UK. My detours aren't always accidental, often impulsive
based on a road sign or sight of something across the other side of a
valley.

When touring, the Garmin will be on the bike but I don't always have a
route on the display, just the map showing the road name, local speed limit
and what Garmin calls "dangerous road" meaning speed camera in France. The
satnav is handy if you find a place worth visiting again as you can just
press the WTF am I button and save it to favourites. They are incredibly
useful if used as a tool rather than a deity to be followed religiously.

On Sat, 05 Mar 2022 16:09:18 +0100, Ace <Ace@ch.com> wrote:

>On Sat, 05 Mar 2022 10:28:29 +0000, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:48:04 -0000 (UTC), wessie
>><willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:
>>
>>>[1] I still use maps, especially the 1:200000 Michelin jobs. They are still
>>>the best way to plan daytrips from a holiday base in France or Spain prior
>>>to banging the route into the Garmin.

>>I approve this message

>For proper old school though, it's best without any GPS. Memorise the
>shape of the map, where you want to get to and a preferred route, then
>take any accidental detours as part of the adventure.

Quite so. I skipped over the last clause in Wessie's post

I don't even own a dedicated satnav, FFS
--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old

On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 11:13:15 AM UTC, sig wrote:
>
> The box is a K960 I think and the mounting plate has the same
> arrangement as this:
> https://www.sportsbikeshop.co.uk/motorcycle_parts/content_prod/238711
> --
OK

If you look at the mounting plate there are 4 rubber "bungs" that the box sits on. With time they age and wear and allow the box to move etc.

In the past I have managed to pop them out by pushing from below, put a suitably sized washer from my pop rivet collection in to the hole and then get them back in . The increase in size has been enough. It is a high risk strategy because the bungs are old and may just fall apart when you try and push them out, pulling them out makes them snap - DAMHIKIJD OK.

I recently bought a Trekker Outback top box and that came with thicker rubber bungs. I have no idea if these are available as a spare from Givi / Kappa.

Alternatively I have a SW - Motech base plate that could be made to fit and a similar top box and matching panniers for sale - much cheapness. - reasonable condition.
<Nominates self for Spamming Cnut of the year award!>

Just repairing the top box will not last long because it will still move about, you have to stop the movement as well.

Or just drill some F OFF big holes and stick some bolts in.

Oh and another big vote for old fashioned maps from me. Am I the only one who finds the yellow Michelin maps a thing of beauty?

Boxer Boy

Boxerboy <ianphinks@hotmail.co.uk> wrote in
news:6e7411bb-cba0-44d8-8026-e9e38da1003an@googlegroups.com:

> Oh and another big vote for old fashioned maps from me. Am I the only
> one who finds the yellow Michelin maps a thing of beauty?
>

I have some yellow ones but for about 10+ years they have an orange cover
that is card not paper. Often printed on both sides now. Map detail just as
good but not so nice to use. The card makes them more difficult to fold to
fit a tank bag and sometimes the area of interest is split across the front
& back sheets.

On 3/5/2022 7:09 AM, Ace wrote:
> On Sat, 05 Mar 2022 10:28:29 +0000, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:48:04 -0000 (UTC), wessie
>> <willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:
>>
>>> [1] I still use maps, especially the 1:200000 Michelin jobs. They are still
>>> the best way to plan daytrips from a holiday base in France or Spain prior
>>> to banging the route into the Garmin.
>>
>> I approve this message
>
> For proper old school though, it's best without any GPS. Memorise the
> shape of the map, where you want to get to and a preferred route, then
> take any accidental detours as part of the adventure.
>
>
There are the not-so-rare times when the map is wrong. Then it's handy
to have a GPS. BTDT, more than once.

--
The erstwhile Thomas
FJR1300, R1200GS, ST1100 (in memoriam)

On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 16:59:23 -0800, Turby <xsurf@xmail.com> wrote:

>On 3/5/2022 7:09 AM, Ace wrote:
>> On Sat, 05 Mar 2022 10:28:29 +0000, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:48:04 -0000 (UTC), wessie
>>> <willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> [1] I still use maps, especially the 1:200000 Michelin jobs. They are still
>>>> the best way to plan daytrips from a holiday base in France or Spain prior
>>>> to banging the route into the Garmin.
>>>
>>> I approve this message
>>
>> For proper old school though, it's best without any GPS. Memorise the
>> shape of the map, where you want to get to and a preferred route, then
>> take any accidental detours as part of the adventure.
>>
>>
>There are the not-so-rare times when the map is wrong. Then it's handy
>to have a GPS. BTDT, more than once.

You need a better map, is all.

Sat-Navs being 'wrong' used to be common, sometimes missing roads
entirely or putting them tens of metres from their actual position,
much more often failing to correctly note one-way roads, no-entries,
unsuitable for traffic and similar deignations. They're mostly much
better these days, but it's still wise to treat with caution.

Maps, however, IME are almost never 'wrong'. Out-of-date, sure, but
that's easily rectified.
--
Ace
http://www.chaletbeauroc.com/

On 05/03/2022 15:09, Ace wrote:
> On Sat, 05 Mar 2022 10:28:29 +0000, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:48:04 -0000 (UTC), wessie
>> <willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:
>>
>>> [1] I still use maps, especially the 1:200000 Michelin jobs. They are still
>>> the best way to plan daytrips from a holiday base in France or Spain prior
>>> to banging the route into the Garmin.
>>
>> I approve this message
>
> For proper old school though, it's best without any GPS. Memorise the
> shape of the map, where you want to get to and a preferred route, then
> take any accidental detours as part of the adventure.
>
>

I kept that way for a long time, but have succumbd[sp?] to using my
phone as a GPS/route finder.

I still memorise a lot of what I want to do, and check if needed as I go
along. On last years little jaunt to Spain I used it loads on the way
home through the lesser known roads, but over ruled it when I fancied a
slightly different road.

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

On 06/03/2022 09:28, Ace wrote:
> On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 16:59:23 -0800, Turby <xsurf@xmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 3/5/2022 7:09 AM, Ace wrote:
>>> On Sat, 05 Mar 2022 10:28:29 +0000, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:48:04 -0000 (UTC), wessie
>>>> <willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> [1] I still use maps, especially the 1:200000 Michelin jobs. They are still
>>>>> the best way to plan daytrips from a holiday base in France or Spain prior
>>>>> to banging the route into the Garmin.
>>>>
>>>> I approve this message
>>>
>>> For proper old school though, it's best without any GPS. Memorise the
>>> shape of the map, where you want to get to and a preferred route, then
>>> take any accidental detours as part of the adventure.
>>>
>>>
>> There are the not-so-rare times when the map is wrong. Then it's handy
>> to have a GPS. BTDT, more than once.
>
> You need a better map, is all.
>
> Sat-Navs being 'wrong' used to be common, sometimes missing roads
> entirely or putting them tens of metres from their actual position,
> much more often failing to correctly note one-way roads, no-entries,
> unsuitable for traffic and similar deignations. They're mostly much
> better these days, but it's still wise to treat with caution.
>
> Maps, however, IME are almost never 'wrong'. Out-of-date, sure, but
> that's easily rectified.

This do vary in accuracy from country to country, and getting decent
upto date ones in some coutries is next to impossible. Buying before
going is OK, but they take up space.

On our 1st trip to South America we cut them down to the bits we
expected to have to use, just to save space.

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

Boxerboy wrote:

>
> I recently bought a Trekker Outback top box and that came with
> thicker rubber bungs. I have no idea if these are available as a
> spare from Givi / Kappa.
>
Yep,thick and thin ones, google 'Kappa & Givi Rubber Bungs'
>
> Or just drill some F OFF big holes and stick some bolts in.
>
Preferred method IMO.

--
Geoff
Honda NTV650

On 3/6/2022 1:28 AM, Ace wrote:
> On Sat, 5 Mar 2022 16:59:23 -0800, Turby <xsurf@xmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 3/5/2022 7:09 AM, Ace wrote:
>>> On Sat, 05 Mar 2022 10:28:29 +0000, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:48:04 -0000 (UTC), wessie
>>>> <willnotwork@tesco.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> [1] I still use maps, especially the 1:200000 Michelin jobs. They are still
>>>>> the best way to plan daytrips from a holiday base in France or Spain prior
>>>>> to banging the route into the Garmin.
>>>>
>>>> I approve this message
>>>
>>> For proper old school though, it's best without any GPS. Memorise the
>>> shape of the map, where you want to get to and a preferred route, then
>>> take any accidental detours as part of the adventure.
>>>
>>>
>> There are the not-so-rare times when the map is wrong. Then it's handy
>> to have a GPS. BTDT, more than once.
>
> You need a better map, is all.
>
> Sat-Navs being 'wrong' used to be common, sometimes missing roads
> entirely or putting them tens of metres from their actual position,
> much more often failing to correctly note one-way roads, no-entries,
> unsuitable for traffic and similar deignations. They're mostly much
> better these days, but it's still wise to treat with caution.
>
> Maps, however, IME are almost never 'wrong'. Out-of-date, sure, but
> that's easily rectified.

I've been collecting and using maps all my life. I've got Michelin and
ADAC maps, which are two of the most respectable cartographic companies
in the world, that disagree. There are places where good maps are almost
impossible to find, so you have to rely on local brands. For years,
Russia intentionally made incorrect maps to distract invaders. (They may
still do.)

--
The erstwhile Thomas
FJR1300, R1200GS, ST1100 (in memoriam)

On 05/03/2022 19:07, Boxerboy wrote:
> On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 11:13:15 AM UTC, sig wrote:
>>
>> The box is a K960 I think and the mounting plate has the same
>> arrangement as this:
>> https://www.sportsbikeshop.co.uk/motorcycle_parts/content_prod/238711
>> --
> OK
>
> If you look at the mounting plate there are 4 rubber "bungs" that the box sits on. With time they age and wear and allow the box to move etc.
>
> In the past I have managed to pop them out by pushing from below, put a suitably sized washer from my pop rivet collection in to the hole and then get them back in . The increase in size has been enough. It is a high risk strategy because the bungs are old and may just fall apart when you try and push them out, pulling them out makes them snap - DAMHIKIJD OK.
>
> I recently bought a Trekker Outback top box and that came with thicker rubber bungs. I have no idea if these are available as a spare from Givi / Kappa.

They're not cheap. Had to get some for one of my racks a little while
ago. Apparently people nick them (if the topbox isn't on).

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2047675.m570.l1313&_nkw=givi+%28mushroom%2Crubber%29&_sacat=0

On 05/03/2022 19:07, Boxerboy wrote:
> On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 11:13:15 AM UTC, sig wrote:
>>
>> The box is a K960 I think and the mounting plate has the same
>> arrangement as this:
>> https://www.sportsbikeshop.co.uk/motorcycle_parts/content_prod/238711
>> --
> OK
>
> If you look at the mounting plate there are 4 rubber "bungs" that the box sits on. With time they age and wear and allow the box to move etc.
>
> In the past I have managed to pop them out by pushing from below, put a suitably sized washer from my pop rivet collection in to the hole and then get them back in . The increase in size has been enough. It is a high risk strategy because the bungs are old and may just fall apart when you try and push them out, pulling them out makes them snap - DAMHIKIJD OK.
>
> I recently bought a Trekker Outback top box and that came with thicker rubber bungs. I have no idea if these are available as a spare from Givi / Kappa.
>
> Alternatively I have a SW - Motech base plate that could be made to fit and a similar top box and matching panniers for sale - much cheapness. - reasonable condition.
> <Nominates self for Spamming Cnut of the year award!>
>
> Just repairing the top box will not last long because it will still move about, you have to stop the movement as well.
>
> Or just drill some F OFF big holes and stick some bolts in.
>
> Oh and another big vote for old fashioned maps from me. Am I the only one who finds the yellow Michelin maps a thing of beauty?
>
> Boxer Boy

That's interesting, I'll investigate.

What I'm thinking of now, before I go down the irreversible route of
drilling holes for permanent fixing, is to bolt an L-shaped bracket to
the front edge (i.e. nearst the rider) of the mounting plate to stop the
box sliding backwards.

On Saturday, March 5, 2022 at 5:28:32 AM UTC-5, Champ wrote:
> On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 16:48:04 -0000 (UTC), wessie
> <willn...@tesco.net> wrote:
>
> >[1] I still use maps, especially the 1:200000 Michelin jobs. They are still
> >the best way to plan daytrips from a holiday base in France or Spain prior
> >to banging the route into the Garmin.
> I approve this message

I had a year out between my second year of university and my third. During that time, I got got my HGV class 1 licence, and worked a a truck driver running to Italy and back. It was a fabulous year.

When I went back to college, I took with me my Trucker's Map of Britain (which has all all low bridges marked, and roads restricted by vehicle weight) and a very comprehensive Italian road map (including details of many "centro" areas). I spent many happy moments looking through those books, particularly the Italy one, reminiscing.

I thought I'd kept the Italian map book, but I can't seem to see it. Though I do see the OGC publication "Managing Projects with PRINCE2", which makes me realize that on one particular day, I threw out one and kept the other - and it's clear to me that my priorities were all wrong on that day.

On Tue, 8 Mar 2022 07:47:29 -0800 (PST), Ben Blaney
<benblaney@gmail.com> wrote:

>I thought I'd kept the Italian map book, but I can't seem to see it. Though I do see
>the OGC publication "Managing Projects with PRINCE2", which makes me realize that on
>one particular day, I threw out one and kept the other -
>and it's clear to me that my priorities were all wrong on that day.

Good god, man, what were you thinking?

--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old