My trusty "Faithful" volt stick has died* after many years. There are a
large number of devices available but I assume (always dangerous) that
they all use a field-effect transistor on the input so the differences
are branding and presentation of detection ... is it worth paying for a
name (e.g. the Fluke 1AC II) or are the cheapies just as good?

*An illustration of the need to always test against a known live circuit
before relying on it for an unknown circuit.

On Sun, 23 Jul 2023 13:28:06 +0100, nothanks@aolbin.com wrote:

>My trusty "Faithful" volt stick has died* after many years. There are a
>large number of devices available but I assume (always dangerous) that
>they all use a field-effect transistor on the input so the differences
>are branding and presentation of detection ... is it worth paying for a
>name (e.g. the Fluke 1AC II) or are the cheapies just as good?
>
>*An illustration of the need to always test against a known live circuit
>before relying on it for an unknown circuit.

I have a cheapie that beeps where the Fluke doesn't.

Can be very useful: Wedge in place, beeping. Go (within earshot, obv.) and
unscrew fuses/throw MCBs/switch switches until it stops, and there you have your
circuit.

I like that.

Thomas Prufer

How good are they at not indicating where long runs of cable induce a
voltage into an unconnected wire though? This was always the problem I had.
The old neon screwdrivers were rubbish at that one.
Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
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"Thomas Prufer" <prufer.public@mnet-online.de.invalid> wrote in message
news:mflqbi9ilf0h1s447furpmtggpvtnulc90@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 23 Jul 2023 13:28:06 +0100, nothanks@aolbin.com wrote:
>
>>My trusty "Faithful" volt stick has died* after many years. There are a
>>large number of devices available but I assume (always dangerous) that
>>they all use a field-effect transistor on the input so the differences
>>are branding and presentation of detection ... is it worth paying for a
>>name (e.g. the Fluke 1AC II) or are the cheapies just as good?
>>
>>*An illustration of the need to always test against a known live circuit
>>before relying on it for an unknown circuit.
>
> I have a cheapie that beeps where the Fluke doesn't.
>
> Can be very useful: Wedge in place, beeping. Go (within earshot, obv.) and
> unscrew fuses/throw MCBs/switch switches until it stops, and there you
> have your
> circuit.
>
> I like that.
>
>
> Thomas Prufer

On 23/07/2023 17:30, Brian Gaff wrote:
> How good are they at not indicating where long runs of cable induce a
> voltage into an unconnected wire though?

It sometimes happens but the effect can be reduced by placing your hand
over the insulated wire but without touching the tip of the detector. If
it continues to flash or beep then it's very likely a live wire, if it
stops it was just an induced voltage.

--
Mike Clarke

On Sun, 23 Jul 2023 13:28:06 +0100, nothanks wrote:

> My trusty "Faithful" volt stick has died* after many years. There are a
> large number of devices available but I assume (always dangerous) that
> they all use a field-effect transistor on the input so the differences
> are branding and presentation of detection ... is it worth paying for a
> name (e.g. the Fluke 1AC II) or are the cheapies just as good?
>
> *An illustration of the need to always test against a known live circuit
> before relying on it for an unknown circuit.

Just dug out my Volt sticks.
LAP MS8907 gave me false positives on dead cable (13A).
Fluke VoltAlert 1AC-E II was far more accurate.

Neither massively expensive.

HTH

Dave R

--
AMD FX-6300 in GA-990X-Gaming SLI-CF running Windows 10 x64

On 23/07/2023 17:35, Thomas Prufer wrote:
> On Sun, 23 Jul 2023 13:28:06 +0100, nothanks@aolbin.com wrote:
>
>> My trusty "Faithful" volt stick has died* after many years. There are a
>> large number of devices available but I assume (always dangerous) that
>> they all use a field-effect transistor on the input so the differences
>> are branding and presentation of detection ... is it worth paying for a
>> name (e.g. the Fluke 1AC II) or are the cheapies just as good?
>>
>> *An illustration of the need to always test against a known live circuit
>> before relying on it for an unknown circuit.
>
> I have a cheapie that beeps where the Fluke doesn't.

On my Fluke you can turn the beep on and off with a long press on the
power button.

--
Cheers,

John.

/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\=================================================================/

On 23/07/2023 13:28, nothanks@aolbin.com wrote:
> My trusty "Faithful" volt stick has died* after many years. There are a
> large number of devices available but I assume (always dangerous) that
> they all use a field-effect transistor on the input so the differences
> are branding and presentation of detection ... is it worth paying for a
> name (e.g. the Fluke 1AC II) or are the cheapies just as good?

I have not used enough different ones to give a comparative answer.
However I found with mine (Fluke Volt Alert) it is exceedingly difficult
to get it to give a "wrong" - even when trying[1].

I suspect that there is a moderate amount of processing done in the
devices - so the quality of the results may depend no software as much
or more than the basic hardware platform.

[1] https://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/Volt_stick_experiments

Given even the "high end" ones are still "cheap", I went with that!

--
Cheers,

John.

/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\=================================================================/

On 23/07/2023 in message <ki4kmlFjr0vU1@mid.individual.net>
nothanks@aolbin.com wrote:

>My trusty "Faithful" volt stick has died* after many years. There are a
>large number of devices available but I assume (always dangerous) that
>they all use a field-effect transistor on the input so the differences are
>branding and presentation of detection ... is it worth paying for a name
>(e.g. the Fluke 1AC II) or are the cheapies just as good?
>
>*An illustration of the need to always test against a known live circuit
>before relying on it for an unknown circuit.

I need to track some cables in the ceiling above the lounge and kitchen. I
have access upstairs which has a carpeted, wooden floor.

Will a "volt stick" or something similar help me track the cables? They
might be lying on the ceiling so could be several inches away through
wood/carpet. I have never had any success with things like stud/cable
finders which always seem to be either on all the time or off all the time.

Many thanks.

--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil but by those who
watch them without doing anything. (Albert Einstein)

On 25 Jul 2023 07:29:00 GMT, "Jeff Gaines" <jgnewsid@outlook.com> wrote:

>Will a "volt stick" or something similar help me track the cables? They
>might be lying on the ceiling so could be several inches away through
>wood/carpet. I have never had any success with things like stud/cable
>finders which always seem to be either on all the time or off all the time.

In my experience: no, absolutely not.

This (random first hit) rentable device says "up to 150mm" and may be better
than a diy stud finder.

Other systems work with a signal injector, so the cable radiates something more
easily tracked than 50 Hz, and unique to that cable.

See what's for hire?

On 23/07/2023 13:28, nothanks@aolbin.com wrote:
> My trusty "Faithful" volt stick has died* after many years. There are a
> large number of devices available but I assume (always dangerous) that
> they all use a field-effect transistor on the input so the differences
> are branding and presentation of detection ... is it worth paying for a
> name (e.g. the Fluke 1AC II) or are the cheapies just as good?
>
> *An illustration of the need to always test against a known live circuit
> before relying on it for an unknown circuit.

Thanks for the replies. FYI, based on the reviews, I went for a Hanmatek
AC1 ... first indications (ho ho) are good.
It claims 9 sensitivity levels and has a torch; detection is indicated
by flash and beep. In a few quick tests it has been 100% correct. It
seems to be able to trace (known) cables buried in plaster but once
triggered on a known cable it stays triggered until moved away from the
wall.
So far, so good.

On 25/07/2023 08:29, Jeff Gaines wrote:
> On 23/07/2023 in message <ki4kmlFjr0vU1@mid.individual.net>
> nothanks@aolbin.com wrote:
>
>> My trusty "Faithful" volt stick has died* after many years. There are
>> a large number of devices available but I assume (always dangerous)
>> that they all use a field-effect transistor on the input so the
>> differences are branding and presentation of detection ... is it worth
>> paying for a name (e.g. the Fluke 1AC II) or are the cheapies just as
>> good?
>>
>> *An illustration of the need to always test against a known live
>> circuit before relying on it for an unknown circuit.
>
> I need to track some cables in the ceiling above the lounge and kitchen.
> I have access upstairs which has a carpeted, wooden floor.
>
> Will a "volt stick" or something similar help me track the cables? They

Not so much no...

> might be lying on the ceiling so could be several inches away through
> wood/carpet. I have never had any success with things like stud/cable
> finders which always seem to be either on all the time or off all the time.

The volt detecting stud finder devices are somewhat better at that kind
of thing. You may also be able to use a tone injector / tracer of the
type used for datacomms testing - but those also need fairly close
proximity to work well IME.

--
Cheers,

John.

/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\=================================================================/

On Tuesday, 25 July 2023 at 18:53:29 UTC+1, John Rumm wrote:
> On 25/07/2023 08:29, Jeff Gaines wrote:
> > On 23/07/2023 in message <ki4kml...@mid.individual.net>
> > noth...@aolbin.com wrote:
> >
> >> My trusty "Faithful" volt stick has died* after many years. There are
> >> a large number of devices available but I assume (always dangerous)
> >> that they all use a field-effect transistor on the input so the
> >> differences are branding and presentation of detection ... is it worth
> >> paying for a name (e.g. the Fluke 1AC II) or are the cheapies just as
> >> good?
> >>
> >> *An illustration of the need to always test against a known live
> >> circuit before relying on it for an unknown circuit.
> >
> > I need to track some cables in the ceiling above the lounge and kitchen.
> > I have access upstairs which has a carpeted, wooden floor.
> >
> > Will a "volt stick" or something similar help me track the cables? They
> Not so much no...
> > might be lying on the ceiling so could be several inches away through
> > wood/carpet. I have never had any success with things like stud/cable
> > finders which always seem to be either on all the time or off all the time.
> The volt detecting stud finder devices are somewhat better at that kind
> of thing. You may also be able to use a tone injector / tracer of the
> type used for datacomms testing - but those also need fairly close
> proximity to work well IME.

How well they work at long range depends a lot on whether you inject the
signal differentially or as common mode. With one clip of the injector
connected to a conductor in the cable to be traced and the other
connected to mains earth my cheap tone tracer detects cables more
than a meter away. With both clips from the injector connected to
different conductors of the cable to be traced the range may only be
a few cm or even mm. Each mode has its uses.
(I have an Extech TG20)
John